HDMI 2.0 Officially Announced 293
jones_supa writes with news that HDMI 2.0 is out. From Engadget "The folks at HDMI Licensing are announcing HDMI 2.0 officially. Arriving just in time for the wide rollout of a new generation of Ultra HDTVs, it adds a few key capabilities to the standard. With a bandwidth capacity of up to 18Gbps, HDMI 2.0 has the ability to carry 3,840 x 2,160 resolution video at 60fps. It also has support for up to 32 audio channels, 'dynamic auto lipsync' and additional CEC extensions. The physical cables and connectors remain unchanged."
Just like HDMI 1.4, the specification is only available to HDMI Forum members.
Physical cables the same? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Physical cables the same? (Score:5, Funny)
Start the presses! Time to print the "HDMI 2.0 Ready!" stickers!
Just putting it on the package is good enough for a 50% price hike AT LEAST!
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Something something "Ready" usually isn't. Not going to pay a premium to be a beta test. Let the sheep work out the bugs first.
Start saving money now for the properly released product when the prices start dropping.
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No Mention (Score:3, Insightful)
The summary doesn't say...
Does HDMI 2.0 support new, improved, and even more delicious Digitally Restricted Media? Seems that it must.
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my blu rays play just fine on my TV. what exactly am i missing?
Re:No Mention (Score:4, Insightful)
The opportunity to buy a whole new TV which runs at a higher resolution.
Think of it as the companies who make a/v equipment trying to make sure you replace all of your stuff every 2 years to keep up with the latest market trends.
But, I'm with you, I don't see myself needing to get even higher resolution any time soon.
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I'm the age where declining eye site trumps more pixels. No upgrade for me!
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Sight, unless this is a symptom of your Alzheimer's, then please accept my apologies.
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This is totally unacceptable , you just know that the 1.3 /1.4 is passe and you can't possibly be seen as someone that lives in the dark ages. .. throw away what works perfectly fine and get on the bandwagon. .. ( end clownish secti
Imagine the humiliation of having a friend come by and seeing you still use old 1.3/1.4 HDMI connections ! The idea is unbearable. !
And of course you cannot live without the benefits of the new bandwidth limits . So yes
How long do you think you could get away with it anyways ?
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I appreciate your vintage gear, but really: there have been a few technological advances since 1967 that are worth upgrading to; not just "novel". Please don't argue that your CRT and VCR are just as good as a Blu-ray player and LCD.
DVI had these things sorted out before HDM became popular when Vista came out 5 years ago. It infuriating many users who have spent thousands upgrading only to not be able to watch blurays?!
Also many conference rooms and expensive projects at work have digital conections that work fine without HDMI and replacing these will be very expensive for no benefit other than forced obscelence.
Since HDMI is still evolving it means a sunken investment to upgrade as HDMI 2.1 will replace obsoluting the same gear that w
Re:No Mention (Score:4, Interesting)
Color my cynical but I see all this hype with 3D TV and movies and cable companies looking at these silly things as a way to extort money from $50 a month to $199 for HD. WIth 4K HD here comes $499 a month, now add conference rooms and TV makers, ... oh I guess greenRay DVDs are needed so now Sony can make even MORE $$$ for these etc. Sadly idiots wil pay for these too and then wonder how they are just barely making it with their middle class salaries and how they could have bought a brand new car for the monthly bills they keep paying for such garbage with minor improvements of what they had.
Just because they make it, doesn't mean wel'll buy it.
3DTV is probably here to stay, but not a lot of people are upgrading TVs just to get 3D. And 3D media is fairly scarce and largely irrelevant. Even the TV salesmen will admit that 3D is a flop. Nobody with a 60" edge lit LCD from 3 years ago is even slightly interested in upgrading to 3D. The only people buying them are people upgrading from CRT, upgrading from a smaller TV, or who have a older LCDs/Plasmas/DLPs that are dying. And they are buying them because it doesn't cost any more than a TV without 3D.
4K HD... I'm looking forward to that one with respect to computer displays etc, but I doubt a lot of people care for TV. I doubt it'll gain traction as a must have upgrade, and will instead become like 3DTV... where everyone buying a new TV will end up with it once its no more expensive than buying a TV without it. And half or more of them will never be used with any 4K content anyway for years to come.
oh I guess greenRay DVDs are needed
Blu ray launched just in time for the disc market to collapse as people switched to streaming. I doubt a greenRay tech will ever see the light of day as consumer disc media for movies. Most people are satisfied with streaming stuff at lower quality than DVD, nevermind bluray... the content market for 4HD just doesn't exist no matter how badly the gear industry wants one. Meanwhile the broadcasters don't have the bandwidth for it. The movie rental places have nearly disappeared. The movie stores are struggling and diversifying away from movies.
We'll get 4HD gear sooner than later, and 4HD content eventually, I'm sure, but its going to take some amazing marketing to convince us we need it enough to upgrade.
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You forgot to tell us to get off your lawn.
I'm sure your parents thought color was a novelty too.
What You're Missing (Score:3, Informative)
my blu rays play just fine on my TV. what exactly am i missing?
You're missing the ability to access the HDMI channel, more specifically the HDCP channel, that your Blu-Ray disc is playing across. Many would use this access to record/copy the video stream, possibly for piracy which is what the DRM is designed to prevent. But, many others would like to be able to access the video stream to do things like:
* Add our own news crawler, or pop-up alerts from our home automation systems.
* We'd like to pop-up caller ID from our PBX while the video is playing.
* Allow the home au
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mostly 4k video. And audio with more than 7.1 discrete channels.
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No the definition of insanity is to do the same thing and expect different results, like protesting DRM.
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Is there something about the geek's brain that demands such precision in language and dismisses flights of fancy as SYNTAX ERROR. RESUBMIT JOB OR ABORT?
In this particular case, though, the aphorism appears to be the invention of Narcotics Anonymous, and was subsequently attributed to various figures who could be plausibly imagined to have said it. source [wikiquote.org]
Be nice (Score:2)
The poor sap is probably chomping at the bit to buy all of his media again when a new format comes out.
Oh, to be a "consumer" instead of a...person.
Attention Cinephiles (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Attention Cinephiles (Score:5, Funny)
Do your cables use oxygen-free copper, though? I'm sick of oxygen messing my pixels up!
Also, can I give you more money for some gold-colored connectors??? I don't mind throwing all of my money at you and your cables if you add useful features like these.
Re:Attention Cinephiles (Score:5, Funny)
Do your cables use oxygen-free copper, though? I'm sick of oxygen messing my pixels up!.
Fool. You don't want that cheap-ass copper. What you need is oxygen-free silver. The following is a quote from a silver speaker wire company. With results like these for a simple speaker wire, just think what silver will do for HDMI:
When you replace your copper speaker cables (even more expensive copper cables) with our Teflon-insulated, 99.999% solid silver conductor speaker cables, you may think you have just installed expensive new electronics, because of the across-the-board sonic improvements you should experience-
The highs sounding less harsh and more delicately musical. The bass, less "bloated" and more revealing of instrumental textures and specific notes. The all-important mid-range (where most of the music resides) should sound more natural and warm, with human voices sounding more like real people, and musical instruments more convincingly "live."
A new, "liquid" and flowing quality should reveal more of the intrinsic beauty of the original musical event.
The stereo sound stage becomes more specific, with instruments and voices each appearing from a smaller localized area in the stereo image. There is a more distinct "layering" of the sound, with the ability to retrieve the original recorded "depth of field" to a greater extent.
With results like this applied to an HDMI cable, you will feel like you have been "sucked into" another world, rather than just viewing it on television. In fact, I bet you will be able to interact with the characters in the movie. You may even be able to stop that jedi from saving Jar-Jar. Or smack the shit out of Bill Paxton and tell him to grow a pair in Aliens. And of course there's the porn.
Did I mention the need for teflon insulation?
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Teflon? No, you didn't... but when your house burns, you won't be poisoned by smoke from the Teflon-insulated cables, just from the components connected by it.
Not having seen the maximum resolution supported by HDMI 2.0 anywhere outside of an IMAX theatre, I have to say that I only want that when my telescreen, er, TV is 10' wide.
FCC never had any business approving the use of a "standard" whose specs were not freely available to everyone (and yes I know they did it multiple times in their existence). Of co
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Never understood how they didn't go down the "Now available in oxygen-free gold contacts!" route.
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But they attract alligators. Not crocodiles, for some reason, but they do seem to attract alligators. My sister's head-dresser's cousin's dog-walker's boyfriend's chaffeur said he heard someone say this was true.
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Wow, really undercutting Monster by a good margin there! Can I order a palette now and beat the rush?
Oh... Hey, waitasec... I see your game now, Mr. Scam Artist! You didn't mention "low oxygen"! Fraud! Charlatan! Senator! Cad!
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[...] Can I order a palette now and beat the rush?
You could, but we have so many more colours nowadays.
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Fraud! Charlatan! Senator! Cad!
Senator? Really? That's uncalled for.
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Yah, the root word for Senator is senile.
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I am selling platinum-tipped, lead-shielded, kevlar-reinforced Ultra Mega HDMI 2.0 cables for the low, low price of $200/ft.
Fool! I am selling $1 store HDMI cables painted bright green with gold painted connectors for $200/ft.
The green stabalises electrons so my cables have 25% more clarity. Electrons moving is what makes the picture fuzzy.
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Can we please stop with this tired old joke? It's never been funny.
Nope. The jokes stop when fools quit falling for high-end cables. You have the right to throw away money on platinum cables with insulation made from unicorn horn that have been bathed in the tears of angels to break them in and I have the right to laugh at you.
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And how many new restrictions? (Score:3)
Given that HDMI is all about DRM, how many new ways have they come up to limit what we're 'allowed' to do?
And as far as yet another HD 'standard', I can't say I'm in a big rush to get this. The media companies seem to think we'll replace all of our equipment every 2 years or so when they come out with the new hotness.
But replacing my TV, my Amp, my DVD player ... well, I'll get around to it eventually. Since my current stuff is only about 2 years old, I don't see caring about this new spec for some time.
Though, for a computer monitor, those resolutions sound pretty awesome.
Re:And how many new restrictions? (Score:5, Informative)
No, HDMI is all about audio and video on the same cable. HDCP is the DRM you are talking about.
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But isn't HDCP a mandatory part of HDMI?
In which case there's not a lot of difference between the one and the other as far as DRM is concerned.
Re:And how many new restrictions? (Score:4, Informative)
No it is not manditory.
However, operating systems like Windows 7 will degrade video quality if they detect a non HDMI cable for blue-Ray content in the RC releases so this way MPAA can make people think DRM HDMI is better.
I use HDMI on my machine due to convenience of less cables and I hate the sound on my mobo. Not because I believe it is better video quality.
But it is just a cable and nothing else. The DRM HDCP is dependent on OS support.
That's not correct (Score:3)
Windows 7 does nothing at all with Blu-ray content. It doesn't understand how to play it. All it does in relation to any of this is provide a method for programs to inquire to drivers if everything is (supposedly) secure. A Blu-ray player can inquire as to the encryption status of the links and make sure things aren't being captured and so on. For that matter, so can other programs. It isn't Blu-ray specific, however only the media companies give a shit so that's all that really does it. Games don't mind at
Re:And how many new restrictions? (Score:5, Informative)
digital signal all the way to the monitor means better audio quality (speakers are in monitor).
Seriously bro? Any miniature benefit that digital audio signals would have given you is completely blown away by using speakers that are integrated into your monitor. Integrated speakers are just universally bad, full stop. I'm not talking about an audiophile's definition of bad, either; I bet my grandma could hear the difference.
I'd wager that given the same sound source, a stereo analog signal going into standard desktop computer speakers will sound better than your pure digital setup through your computer monitor.
If this was a troll, well, you deserve a beer, cause you got me.
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Lots of monitors support DisplayPort. Maybe you mean Thunderbolt?
DVI is a dead/dying format so don't worry about that one.
Personally I agree with you as far as cables go.
If nothing else because DisplayPort already did it and because I think it's ridicilous with lots of ports on everything (especially if the purpose in some cases may have been to make a new one to not have to pay license fees ..) I'd rather see this new standard never released and everyone using DisplayPort.
But I guess there will be camps fo
Closed Captioning (Score:3)
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HDMI is meant for end-user equipment, not transport. Whatever is your "tuner" (CATV STB, Satellite STB, DVD, Bluray, etc) that you are using to generate your picture is the one will melt in the closed captioning. HDMI only supports MPEG audio and MPEG video steams, and does not support text/data streams.
Why and how would HDMI do CC? (Score:3, Informative)
HDMI is video and audio transport. Closed captioning works fine over it, since it comes from the video source. Be it your cable, DVD, Blu-ray, whatever, the CC information is processed on the relevant device, and then sent out as part of the video.
Asking HDMI to do closed captioning is like asking Ethernet to do packet filtering: You are looking at the wrong area.
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texttv closed captioning was with anything anywhere... sure, most shows in for example Finland had subtitles burned in but the tv companies had the option for the text tv style route - and some shows used it for swedish text for example. I don't think vhs saved that part of the signal though.
now in practice, the captioning for tv shows comes in with the digital signal and you can show it in as big letters as you(device provider) want and you can shovel in as many languages as you want and even multiple audi
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HDMI supports FULL closed captioning, It has supported it since it supported video.
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HDMI supports FULL closed captioning, It has supported it since it supported video.
HDMI supports NO closed captioning, and it hasn't supported it since ever.
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Yes it does. I suggest you learn something about HDMI and digital video in general.
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Yes it does. I suggest you learn something about HDMI and digital video in general.
And yet, for years I'm unable to get closed captioning to work across an HDMI cable between various tv's, cable boxes, and DVD players.
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Are you saying HDMI actively strips the closed captioning from the video feed? That is evil.
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http://www.hdmi.org/learningcenter/faq.aspx#117 [hdmi.org]
Officially HDMI supports closed captioning by deferring it to the set to box creating the HDMI signal. So HDMI supports it by not supporting it.
Still limited to 60Hz? (Score:4, Insightful)
Still limited to 60Hz? Disappointing and annoying.
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Yes, but I'd like it to 3,840 x 2,160 resolution video at 120 or 240fps.
I imagine that technology adhering to this 2.0 standard will be obsolete by the time it hits the shelves. Maybe that's the plan. I'll hold out for 3,840 x 2,160 resolution video at 120/240fps, thank you.
And you think it is magic? (Score:2)
How, precisely, would you propose to build something backward compatible with the current spec that can push that kind of bandwidth, and be built for a reasonable cost?
The reason for these limits aren't arbitrary. It gets rather difficult and expensive to generate these real high bandwidth signals. Same reason why 10 gig ethernet costs so much more than gigE and needs better cabling to boot.
It isn't magic, as technology advances (particularly smaller lithography) it becomes possible to do higher clock rates
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Yes, but I'd like it to 3,840 x 2,160 resolution video at 120 or 240fps.
You realize that's 24 gigabits/second *minimum* just for 4K 120fps raw video, right? (With 4K's better color, it might be 32 Gbps, I'm not sure.) That is not a trivial challenge.
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You'll want want one of these ... nice and bright, and goes all the way up to 144 Hz.
ASUS VG248QE Black 24" 144Hz 1ms (GTG) HDMI
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824236313 [newegg.com]
Please for the love of God get rid of the... (Score:2)
...downstream device limits.
It's not a bad idea until some as*holes like Comcast limit the number to 2 instead of 8 or 16 like most other cable boxes.
This, of course, means Comcast thinks I'm stealing my own cable when it goes to my receiver (1 device) then my wireless HDMI transmitter (1 device) into my projector (1 device.) Bang, green "you're stealing this signal" screen.
Jerks...
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HDFury solves this problem completely. no home should be without one.
What about HDCP? (Score:2)
Hopefully they dont change that so it stays broken.
Will my components work right together finally? (Score:2)
When I replaced my TV with an HDMI-capable model I moved all my components that supported HDMI to HDMI, and have HDMI links between my TV (Sharp), Tivo, Receiver (Pioneer) and BluRay player (Panasonic) and AppleTV.
If I leave on the HDMI communication option on my components, turning on the TV is supposed to turn on the receiver. In theory without a smart remote, I turn on my TV and I'm watching TV with audio through my stereo.
But it doesn't work like this. Invariably when the TV comes fully on, it switch
Copper, silver, pfffft! (Score:2)
DOES IT HAVE MEANINGFUL ERROR-CHECKING? (Score:4, Interesting)
HDMI is a pure digital signal, with error checking. But since there's no means of retransmitting a broken packet (and thus no valid reason for buffering) in actual practice it's less capable of error checking and bit regeneration [wikipedia.org] than methods used by scribes in the ninth century [wikipedia.org]. You can know you lost more bits than you can regenerate, but you can't do anything about it.
I think this is because HDMI is not really a method for clean digital signal transmission, but rather a way to stealthily carry HDCP into the consumer mainstream. The feature set is primarily aimed at preventing users from doing things (like making backups) rather than providing the maximum benefit to end users.
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The chances of a bad packet with HDMI are extremely slim(not to mention be nearly unnoticeable).
Further more, any serious error checking will lag the display.
Comment removed (Score:4, Funny)
I'd Buy It IF (Score:2)
It came with a reliable screw or clip on connector for the ends.
The current situation with the slide in connectors doesn't work worth shee-it.
Why? (Score:3)
Re:The real question (Score:5, Funny)
See this is the sort of thing you see from laymen all the time. Listen to the GeekSquad expert next time. The gold connectors round out the 0s and sharpen up the 1s. This is really simple, come on.
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Not only that, it will teleport the *FCC* into your house to make sure all your bittorrent transfers are actually legal!
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Wrong, Nickle does a better job, the hair thin Gold plating is marketing only.
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Gold terminals are nothing but bling (Score:2)
Gold connectors do in fact do provide benefits of low resistance connections without corrosion problems because of golds properties.
Gold plating is utterly pointless in 99.99% of applications. There really are only two circumstances where gold has any advantage. One is that it provides a lubrication advantages for mating of terminal. The other is that in some cases it can provide modest corrosion resistance in particularly harsh environments. They do not provide a meaningful benefit in reducing resistance as the terminal they plate is made of tin, brass or bronze phosphor. In typical household or business office use gold terminals
Re:The real question (Score:4, Insightful)
Of course i don't buy the expensive cables either. But we are not talking about "warm sound from correctly polarized oxygen free isotopically pure" monster cables.
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Have you seen the price of gold recently?
We're talking microns of gold plating on the surface of another metal. If you're paying more than a few dollars extra for that, it's not the gold that's driving up the price.
That being said, I agree that digital signals and error correction along with electrical and mechanical standards make cable quality almost irrelevant.
Re:THROW AWAY YOUR OLD AND BUY THE NEW !! (Score:5, Informative)
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HTPC + VGA/DVI compatible TV* + BD-ROM drive + AnyDVD driver
*Because HDMI sucks at displaying text. Unless they finlly fixed that in HDMI2 (which I doubt)
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How does HDMI suck at text? Other than the DRM crap, HDMI moves the exact same RGB TDMS signal (though with the potential for YCbCr signals) that DVI uses.
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That's nothing to do with HDMI. That's Cleartype [wikipedia.org] at work. It's supposed to make text more readable under normal circumstances by boosting the luminance at the cost of colour accuracy, despite looking weird up close.
It's on by default in Windows Vista and later, but it can be disabled.
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Two solutions suggest themselves. /DVI connection is active.
Your O/S may be using a subpixel antialiasing scheme that's only active when the HDMI
Your monitor may be using different default display settings for the VGA and HDMI connections. In particular, Sharpness may be the culprit.
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It is not a problem with HDMI. Apparently the author doesn't like cleartype. Just disable it if you don't like it. The fonts will come in razor sharp, unlike the pictures of how it looks over VGA, which is just blurry.
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http://www.hdfury.com/ [hdfury.com] Makes any DVD player 100% compatible with any TV. And it removes ALL of the useless encryption and DRM.
Re:New feature (Score:4, Insightful)
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It also wouldn't be backwards compatible, either, unless it c.
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How soon will I have to buy a new TV and stereo because my new Blu ray player, or tablet only supports HDMI 2.0
I don't know how long you can wait at most, but I can say how long you can wait at least: until you buy a new cutting edge Blu Ray player or a tablet...
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"So, the whole reason for going with faux 4K (3820 x 2160 or just 2160p as it should be called) in the first place, was because existing HDMI couldn't quite hit 4096 to do the real thing."
No, that's not the "whole reason" or even part of the reason. The remaining question is uninteresting.
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or just 2160p as it should be called
Movies come in different aspect ratios. At 1.78:1 you get 1080p or 2160p. At the also popular 2.35:1 you get ~817p. 720p likewise becomes ~544p. Those aren't really helpful for comparison since 817p isn't lower resolution than 1080p. Only the horizontal resolution is constant, so it actually makes sense to use it. The use of vertical resolution comes from the days of analog TV when only horizontal resolution was continuous, not discrete.
(I'm sure the marketing folks were salivating over it anyway.)
Also, whi
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1920 multiplied by 2 is 3820.
3820x2160 is merely Quad-1080p - which at least is sane.
4096x2160 is 17:9 (ish) - I don't see the point in this resolution.
I await the pointless 5040x2160 monitors (21:9, the "new shiny standard" for widescreen monitors).
You think BestBuy was greedy?
Just watch as Hollywood and TV producers try to shovel this crap on next! The 3D TVs, TVs with apps, and all sorts of ugly non sense to charge for premiums. Cox and Time Warner would love to charge $499 a month for TV with all sooo brilliant 5k!
You know there will be suckers lining for this too as always.
$199 a month per TV in addition to the $499 a month. At $700 a month you can fucking trade that in for a car! But consumers will of course pay for it with their 30% interest cre
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Movies aren't 16:9. (1:1,77...) The two most often used aspect ratios are 1:1.85 and 1:2,39.
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And display port exists specifically so they don't have to pay the royalties for HDMI,
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Zits too.
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> TV shows are shot at 24 or 30 frames per second? i'm confused. lol
Movies are shot at 24 fps. NTSC is at 29.97 Hz. The Hobbit was shot at 48 fps.
> not sure why anyone would need 60 FPS.
Because anything less then 100 Hz looks stuttery as hell. Caveat: I suspect the minimum is around 96 Hz.
To use a poor analogy: 24 fps is like the flickering of fluorescent lights at 60 Hz. Most people won't get a head-ache but some do. The solution is to raise the minimum range so that no one gets headaches.