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Apple To Ditch Touch ID Altogether For All of Next Year's iPhones (macrumors.com) 137

Earlier this week, a report said that Apple is planning to equip next year's iPad Pro with the hardware necessary for Face ID. Now, according to KGI Securities analyst Ming-Chi Kuo, it appears the company is taking that one step further with its 2018 iPhones. All of the iPhones Apple plans to produce next year will reportedly abandon the Touch ID fingerprint sensor in favor of facial recognition. Mac Rumors reports: According to Kuo, Apple will embrace Face ID as its authentication method for a competitive advantage over Android smartphones. Kuo has previously said that it could take years for Android smartphone manufacturers to produce technology that can match the TrueDepth camera and the Face ID feature coming in the iPhone X. Face ID, says Kuo, will continue to be a major selling point of the new iPhone models in 2018, with Apple planning to capitalize on its lead in 3D sensing design and production. Kuo's prediction suggests that all upcoming 2018 iPhones will feature a full-screen design with minimal bezels like the iPhone X, meaning no additional models with the iPhone 8/iPhone 8 Plus design would be produced. That would spell the end of the line for Touch ID in the iPhone, which has been available as a biometric authentication option since 2013.
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Apple To Ditch Touch ID Altogether For All of Next Year's iPhones

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  • Nobody Cares (Score:1, Insightful)

    by sexconker ( 1179573 )

    Apple fans will buy anything, with or a headphone jack, with or without a fingerprint scanner, with or without whatever.

    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward

      The pixel has no headphone jack. Stupid google sheep.

      • by Anonymous Coward

        We have other options though. If you want iOS you have to eat what Apple feeds you.

      • I hate Google. Thanks.

      • "The pixel has no headphone jack. Stupid google sheep."

        Apple did it first, and there is the problem... Apple can make the most asinine changes and their fans will eat it up. Other manufacturers see the massive sales and interpret that as "people like what Apple did", when the correct interpretation is "Apple customers are so addicted to their iThing that they will accept anything".
        • by sodul ( 833177 )

          Google did it on the first Android: the G1 (aka HTC Dream). The plug was a non-standard mini USB style, and they did not provide an adapter for regular headphones. The headphone jack came back in the next version though.

          I do know that the hardware was done by HTC but considering it was the very first commercial Android phone, Google had a lot of input on these 'details', and they're buying the hardware side of HTC, so it might as well be a 100% Google phone retroactively.

          I do have an iPhone 7+, and I simply

          • It should be noted that at the time, it was not uncommon for phones to have proprietary connectors for charging, and also for headphones, if they supported headphones at all. The Sony Ericson I had ca. 2008, was advertised as a combo phone/MP3 player, yet it still required a dongle for headphones.

            Not that any of this excuses Apple from re-introducing the problem.
  • by labnet ( 457441 ) on Friday October 13, 2017 @07:11PM (#55365965)

    High Fives Everyone!

    • You think? Apple has a pretty good track record of understanding how to properly secure sensitive information in hardware. For instance, fingerprint data for their phones is hashed and stored locally in a secure enclave, where APIs have no access to the raw data. Face ID works the same way. This means that there's also no way for malware or software-level backdoors to bypass or extract this information from the phone, because the only hardware-enforced API to the secure enclave is essentially "are you a

  • Thanks, but I'll pass. This is just not a feature I want. Guess it's back to passcodes if I ever buy another iPhone. But to be completely honest, my 6 is fine for my needs, and to me the 7, 8, or X do nothing above and beyond the 6 that makes an upgrade compelling anyway.
  • by turkeydance ( 1266624 ) on Friday October 13, 2017 @07:16PM (#55365979)
    eyeballs were easier. whatever.
  • by Shepanator ( 4796689 ) on Friday October 13, 2017 @07:17PM (#55365987)
    I unlock my phone multiple times per day in situations where my face wouldn't be visible to the face id sensor. Not only that even in situations where face id WOULD work a fingerprint sensor is faster anyway, because your finger can have unlocked the phone before you've even bought it up to your face from your pocket. This is apple hurting usability to serve design once again. When the technology to have fingerprint scanners under the screen is finally ready they will look like fools.
    • What situations are you in that you need your phone unlocked and arenâ(TM)t looking at it? As long as the phone unlocks for your first interaction, isnâ(TM)t that fast enough? The scan is, supposedly, effectively instantaneous once the phone is woken up, and the system works in the dark.

      I donâ(TM)t necessarily believe faceid is a better solution than TouchID, but Iâ(TM)m not convinced this specific complaint is valid either. Weâ(TM)ll all have to see it working in real life first, I

      • by brix ( 27642 ) on Saturday October 14, 2017 @07:05PM (#55370511)

        What situations are you in that you need your phone unlocked and aren't looking at it?

        - Phone is sitting on my desk.
        - Phone is on a mount in my car
        - Phone is being used for Apple Pay

        In all of those situations, my finger is a far quicker method to unlock the phone.

        In the case of a car, it's even a safety issue, in my opinion.

        Me: "Hey Siri, Open Waze"
        SirI: "You'll need to unlock your phone first."

        Now: Reach up and touch the home button with my finger, then use Waze voice control.
        Then: Take the phone off the mount and point it at my face (while driving), both taking my hand off the wheel for longer and obstructing my view. Or I can unlock with passcode, which certainly takes longer, requires looking at the phone rather than the road, and may violate local laws.

        The current iPhone TouchID mechanism is one of the main reasons I use my iPhone more than my Nexus 6. It's simple; it's fast; it's safe. Getting rid of this, even as an option, and going 100% FaceID is a huge step backwards for my use cases.

        • According to Apple—though we'll only know this for sure once it comes out—you don't need to lift it and point it directly at your face, it works at a variety of angles. Assuming your face is even remotely in the field of view, you only need to wake the phone to do it. For Apple Pay, you need to press the side button to confirm the payment, so it's going to be exactly as cumbersome as TouchID. Tap your phone on your desk to wake it, it unlocks.

          Right now, we don't know enough about how it works in

  • by Teun ( 17872 ) on Friday October 13, 2017 @07:18PM (#55365995) Homepage
    This is discriminatory to all those without a face.
  • How much did the FBI pay for this feature?

    • How much did the FBI pay for this feature?

      Yeah, I was wondering; can you distort your face enough so that if someone holds your iphone up in front of you, it won't just unlock for them?

  • What is "a competitive advantage over Android smartphones" supposed to mean? Android was the first operating system to have a face unlock feature with Android 4, 6 YEARS ago, long before Apple blatantly copied it. Apple is as bad as Trump with the propaganda—they just change the narrative to be whatever they like and their idiot fans eat it all up without question. Absolutely shameful.

    • by Anonymous Coward

      Apple's uses a 3D scan of your face. The android one could be fooled with a photograph.

      • Apparently not just any 3D scan, but infrared, so it's a thermal image. Even with 2 photos (for the left and right cameras) and a double-sided mirror, you can't fake authentication because paper under infrared doesn't look like a person. Are there any infrared printers?

      • by stephanruby ( 542433 ) on Saturday October 14, 2017 @05:41AM (#55367381)

        Apple's uses a 3D scan of your face. The android one could be fooled with a photograph.

        The HTC phone couldn't be fooled by a photograph. It used the camera sensor and a laser depth sensor (at least two years ago). And the LG phone couldn't be fooled by a photograph, it used a normal camera sensor plus an infrared one, that's how it could determine the depth (and that was at least three years ago).

        And right now, Apple is paying $23 per iPhone to Sony for its two camera sensors: a normal low light one and an infrared one. And no, Sony didn't even give its best camera sensors to the iPhone. If you want the latest Sony camera, you'll have to purchase a Sony Xperia XZ phone which can shoot video at 960fps.

        Please bookmark this post, three years from now, the latest iPhone will eventually be able to shoot at 960 fps thanks to Sony (assuming Apples pays them enough licensing fees), and some people will be raving about how the iPhone is pioneering all this crazy advanced technology that Android can't even come close to.

        Also, don't believe every clickbait rumor you read. There is no way the iPhone will get rid of Touch ID. It may call it something else and it may improve on the technology by embedding into the glass itself. But there is no way it will get rid of it completely. Seriously, can you even imagine people unlocking their phone in a dark movie theater, or in a dark restroom? Or in a crowded subway? Or while driving? Even without Steve Jobs, Apple designers and Apple usability testers are not completely stupid.

  • When I go to the movie theater, as soon as the movie ends (and sometimes while the movie is playing Grrrrr) people are pulling out their cell phones. I can't wait till the darkened theater starts lighting up with the people's phones lighting up their face so they can log in.

    • by Anonymous Coward

      You ought to see a scientist so they can study your infravision.

    • I can't wait till the darkened theater starts lighting up with the people's phones lighting up their face so they can log in.

      Ummm.. isn't that happening anyway? No matter how you're unlocking your phone, it's lighting up in the dark. How else are you going to read the screen?

  • Even near-perfect facial recognition will fail with a large enough N and N(*(N-1) comparisons when you expect N (:-))
  • No thanks Apple (Score:4, Insightful)

    by the_skywise ( 189793 ) on Friday October 13, 2017 @08:24PM (#55366297)
    As a current owner of an iPhone 6, I have absolutely NO intention of ever upgrading to an iPhone X. I like the touchId but, more importantly, I like an actual physical BUTTON on the 6. I don't even like the recessed divot for the 7 or the 8 as there's no substitute for it when wearing gloves (and no, haptic feedback is NOT a substitute).

    I don't even understand how Tim thinks that Face ID is unique to the iPhone when Microsoft already offers it for their Surface Pros and, surely, Google can buy the tech if need be.

    This is nothing more than Tech CEO masturbation to keep the churn rate going. Cook is out of ideas and out of his depth. Apple is stagnating and no longer innovating while ignoring core infrastructure and support. For example I had to help out a friend do an upgrade from their iPhone 5 to iPhone 7 after iOS 11 came out. Guess what, iTunes backup will NOT let you update because the iOS' are different - but if you go through the iCloud update you can. Why? Because that's why. Why are the backup scenarios different between the iCloud and iTunes?

    But hey, Tim's brought us animoji, so uh, there's that.
    • I don't even understand how Tim thinks that Face ID is unique to the iPhone

      Apple has never claimed that, Not once. What they are claiming is that their implementation is superior, and it is.

  • I can't see this being a very positive thing, and being someone who's uncomfortable with the premise of FaceID, I guess I'll just stay with whatever platform offers me different options. When manufacturers stop caring about what the consumers need so that they can keep pushing exclusive features in order to beat the competition, (to me at least) something's clearly wrong; it also bears mentioning that there may well be a good number of us who won't want to be a part of this situation and will refuse to supp
  • by ad454 ( 325846 ) on Friday October 13, 2017 @08:29PM (#55366317) Journal

    Just place black electrical tape over the front camera.

    For those of us who are not into selfies or video chatting. The rear camera is still available for taking pictures/videos.

    I still do not understand why manufactures do not place physical shutters over camera, considering all of the 3 letter agencies and criminals that target our devices.

    • What about the microphone? There's nothing in physics that can stop a mic from eavesdropping on you.

      • by ad454 ( 325846 )

        What about the microphone? There's nothing in physics that can stop a mic from eavesdropping on you.

        Good point.

        At least with the older iPhones, one could insert a severed headphone plug into the jack.

        But the new iPhones don't even have any headphone jacks anymore, which is a dream for those pushing for the surveillance police state.

      • by Arab ( 466938 )

        You could keep your phone suspended in a vacuum? Arguably it's not practical, but it is within the realms of physics.

    • I still do not understand why manufactures do not place physical shutters over camera, considering all of the 3 letter agencies and criminals that target our devices

      What makes you think that manufacturers are interested in helping you protect your privacy?

  • According to Kuo, Apple will embrace Face ID as its authentication method for a competitive advantage over Android smartphones. Kuo has previously said that it could take years for Android smartphone manufacturers to produce technology that can match the TrueDepth camera and the Face ID feature coming in the iPhone X.

    That seems like wishful thinking. Android has had both face-based biometrics and depth cameras for a few years, they just haven't been very popular. In addition, Google probably has the best ma

  • I flat out DO NOT want my device watching my face all the time. More than anything else, the technology will be used to see if you are actually looking at an ad, or looking away and pause it. In the very near future you will HAVE to look at the ad, or you dont go forward. Did i mention they will be constantly analyzing the emotional state on your face too?
    • I flat out DO NOT want my device watching my face all the time.

      You're in luck then, because it doesn't do that.

  • I don't get why they won't just add Voice ID. You say your password clearly out loud, the phone does speech recognition and checks the password, you're in. Seems about as safe as using your face as a password.
  • I just got the iPhone 8 (my daughter is old enough to need a phone so she got my old phone).

    The touch ID on the 8 is finally good enough that it doesn't slow down usability.

    My hope is Apple perfects finger scanning off of the single piece of glass on the front of the phone and uses that as an option in future iPhones. Or, of course, continue the same style as the iPhone 8.

    • The touch ID on the 8 is finally good enough that it doesn't slow down usability.

      What if your hands are wet?

  • Apple will embrace Face ID as its authentication method for a competitive advantage over Android smartphones.

    We'll see how much of a competitive advantage that is. Certainly, it is an advantage -- but I suspect it's a pretty small one.

  • I'd say that Apple is laying the foundation for the next several years of smart phones. iPhone X will be the best smartphone ever. Certainly, the competition is now working to copy it. The only complaint I have is the overall price. This is just Apples way of nudging us toward the future.
  • So Apple has copied Windows Hello. Now that Microsoft is out of the phone business, I suspect they will be happy to license it to Android phone makers if the buyers want it.
  • This could be a problem in certain parts of the Arab world. It would mean women out in public, wearing a face covering, would be unable to unlock their Apple phone.

    Bit of a loss of market share there, you'd think.

    Of course this also applies to people wearing, say, motorcycle helmets. Definitely a crowd you don't want to annoy.

  • That is the correct question to ask....what do you think they are going to do with everyone's facial image?

    Identity Theft?
    NSA, CIA, FBI, Homeland Security, Law Enforcement
    Profiling (race, culture, color, religious preference, freckles)
    not pay us for the use of our likeness, i.e. Looker [imdb.com]
    . . .

    "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." ~ Benjamin Franklin

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