Raspberry Pi 3 Rolls Out With Faster CPU, On-Board Wi-Fi, and Bluetooth 203
An anonymous reader writes: The original Raspberry Pi went on sale four years ago, and more than 8,000,000 units have shipped since then. Raspberry Pi computers are used in schools and universities, in factories and other industrial applications, in home automation and hobby projects, and much more. Today the Raspberry Pi 3 was announced, featuring a 64-bit quad-core ARMv8 CPU clocked at 1.2GHz, making it roughly 10x the speed of the original Pi 1. Many people will be pleased to hear that the Raspberry Pi 3 also features on-board Wi-Fi and Bluetooth, greatly improving the device's connectivity. The new device goes on sale today at the usual price of US $35. (Here's the official announcement itself.)
Awesome (Score:3)
Re:Awesome (Score:4, Funny)
Also, I still cant get my hands on a pi zero.
Try Coke Zero. Available at any grocery store.
Re:Awesome (Score:5, Informative)
Try an ESP 8266 for interfacing a garage door you need what a few inputs and a handful of outputs?
Re:Awesome (Score:5, Funny)
comma (noun)
1. a punctuation mark (,) indicating a pause between parts of a sentence or separating items in a list.
Re:Awesome (Score:4, Interesting)
For a basic door opener yes but maybe they want it to include a BLE interface to the cell phone or even using the camera and Open CV to have it identify the car and automatically close the door.
It really depends on the feature set you want but the ESP 8266 could do a simple open the door when you use an app on your smartphone.
Re:Awesome (Score:4, Informative)
The ESP 8266 is more than capable of integrating with higher level controllers. BTLE is not realy in it's bag of tricks, wifi obviously is. In my case higher level app is tracking phones to open up when I am about to pull into the driveway. Though I use a off the shelf bit to interface with the garage door (myq gateway) to keep my insurance guy happy.
Re:Awesome (Score:4, Informative)
Anyone have a pointer to a device... (Score:2)
I'm looking for something like the pi, basically a fully populated board requiring power supply, but with a real ethernet subsystem (not a USB-hub mediated mechanism) and a SATA (III, II, I in that order of preference) interface. I've seen multiple failures with the little memory cards, and would like to use actual drives instead from boot on up - without USB or memory cards being involved.
Faster, more cores, and more RAM is better, and price anywhere up to $100 would be fine. I do need the HDMI, USB for ke
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for $100 that's not easy. less than $200 and it starts to be reasonable. Logicsupply.com has some compact boards that are inexpensive and capable.
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okay, I'll take a look over there. Thank you.
Re:Anyone have a pointer to a device... (Score:4, Informative)
This particular NUC
http://www.amazon.com/Intel-NU... [amazon.com]
is the dividing line between x86-64 and ARM at the low power end. Compared to the Pi, its expensive, but its robust feature set makes up for it. I use and recommend both NUCs and Pis. The NUC5 series even has GPIO.
http://www.intel.com/content/w... [intel.com]
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Just what I was looking for. Thank you. Nice little computers! There are i5 and even i7 versions; lots and lots of horsepower (for a small system.)
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Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
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There are a lot of breakouts for the chip, Something like an adafruit hazzah gets you 9 gpio's, flexible power input (though not like a usb wall wart is hard). As to positioning standard security system magnetic reeds for garage doors work well.
If you have a chamberlain or any of the the other brand names that uses the same kit the myq gateway gets you all that and integrates well with full home automation bits has a stand alone phone app as well. For me that coupled with openhab got me what I wanted.
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The ESP-01 board does. It's mostly intended as a wireless extension board for devices which talk serial protocols so GPIO's aren't really a big deal.
The ESP-12, on the other hand, has a whole lot more. I think the ESP-201 has a few extras.
ESP8266 = NodeMCU (Score:2)
They have more than one I/O (you might be thinking of the real cheap version of the ESP8266 that is billed as a serial Wi-Fi adapter). You can pickup a NodeMCU board for under $10, and if you are really smart buy a copy of Neil Kolban's eBook on the ESP8266 - includes helpful hints on getting it up and running with the Arduino IDE.
Much cheaper than getting a Pi Zero and the
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Will it to https or some other secure type of encryption over the Internet? I mean we all been talking about how IoT stuff is insecure.
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Depending on the firmware used it will do SSL/TLS. Would suggest never having something like this accessable from the internet directly.
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It will do ssl just fine. I'll take an embedded micro over a rpi running linux for security for the simple fact that it's running one bit of firmware not a multitasking OS. Mind you would not connect it to the internet either.
Re:Awesome (Score:5, Funny)
Also, I still cant get my hands on a pi zero.
Check your retailer. You can get a zero for every two PI.
R.
Re:Awesome (Score:5, Funny)
Check your retailer. You can get a zero for every two PI.
YMMV - for two Pi I get 6.283185307179586476925286766559
Re:Awesome (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Awesome (Score:5, Funny)
What's your angle, buddy?
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Re: Awesome (Score:5, Informative)
Specifically the GL-inet 6416 has dual ethernet, 2.4GHz wifi, one USB socket, a MIPS processor (Atheros AR9330) with 64 megabytes of RAM and 16 megabytes of flash, and 5 easily accessible GPIOs. It's not much, but it's good cheap fun.
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You don't need a computer at all for garage doors. And technically you don't even need electricity either, although I do admit that automatic garage door openers do make life easier.
As an added bonus, if you have a manual garage door, you don't have weird failure modes or resetting the manual release if there is a power outage.
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Really you put your garage door on the internet, well it is now open, better check it and shut it.
Why price? (Score:2)
You don't need dual Ethernet for garage doors. Will your better board take less than 20 minutes extra time to program for than the raspi? Or even read watch pre purchase? Unless your time has no value the cost is not an issue. But if in 2 years there's no support for the drivers or other software you use your better board isn't. Yet you'll almost certainly be able to port anything from your raspi 3 to the new raspi 5.
Re:Awesome (Score:4, Informative)
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The price is right. Its game over now to get literally anything online. I'm building an interface for my garage doors. Also, I still cant get my hands on a pi zero.
Sparkfun has it for pre-order ($39.95) and says they'll have 1800 units for sale on March 15th. Though they don't say how many pre-orders they already have.
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If you have a Chamberlain or Liftmaster garage door opener, you can buy this gateway for $37 which tells if the door is open or closed and can move the door plus other functions on Android and iPhone... probably easier than DIY (unless you like tinkering).
http://www.amazon.com/Chamberl... [amazon.com]
Ethernet (Score:5, Interesting)
But still the same ethernet that goes over the USB bus?
Re:Ethernet (Score:5, Insightful)
But still the same ethernet that goes over the USB bus?
And? A 100Mbps ethernet interface is fine over the 480 Mbps USB2 bus. You're not going to be running an enterprise NAS on this thing now, are you?
The original USB ethernet had problems with the poly-fuses blowing out under load. That's not a problem now with later Pis.
Re:Ethernet (Score:4, Informative)
The original USB ethernet had problems with the poly-fuses blowing out under load. That's not a problem now with later Pis.
Different problem. That was about the raspi resetting.
The throughput is still shit, a theoretical maximum of 480Mbps notwithstanding.
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I just clarified that the GP was conflating two distinct problems.
However, since you asked, you need to take into account that the NIC might not even have the entire USB for itself. For instance, I use one raspi as a wifi access point (hostapd on NetBSD), bridged to my wired network. So everything going through it effectively visits the USB twice. I don't think I have ever seen higher throughputs than around 5Mbps for any traffic going through it.
But even if the USB is passed only once, as in the followi
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Thanks, that's some useful data.
Re:Ethernet (Score:4, Insightful)
rsync rather than scp to avoid CPU load due to compression/encryption
Unless you're using a customized ssh server and client with a "null" cipher, rsync will run over an encrypted ssh connection. If you want to see raw network throughput, you should use netcat:
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Ouch, of course you're right, I forgot rsync goes via ssh by default.
With no encryption, I get around 60 Mbps, so that's not all too bad after all. :)
I guess i'll switch it to rsh
of=/dev/stdout
huh?
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True, and I do rsync via rsyncd to increase speeds, but getting data from the network and then back onto a USB drive(or two) results in double dipping of that USB pool. And 100mbs has been slow for LAN since 2000. USB Gig will exceed that with out double dipping.
Which is why many was really hoping to that limitation address, by USB 3 or other means. I don't know anyone needing the wifi or bluetooth to be onboard. But I know plenty of people that hit limits of CPU, RAM, or the single USB 2 hub. (oh and qu
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A 100Mbps ethernet interface is fine over the 480 Mbps USB2 bus.
Only if you don't use the CPU for anything else. The problem with the Pi as it is, is that using the CPU severely limits the network throughput and especially latency, and using the network limits the CPU.
Using an encrypted VPN connection or doing stateful packet inspection or running https based services from a Pi is downright painful, and it isn't because the CPU is slow, but because CPU and USB competes, for everything. I'd much rather not have built-in WiFi and bluetooth, but instead get a real ethern
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Not sure why you'd bring Enterprise into it.
Because the amount of shit that impacts the fan when your NAS stops working in an enterprise environment is much higher than when you can't get to your anime collection until you reboot the rpi.
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The Linux based SoCs that cost < $5 (which you find in just about everything) already have 1gbps and USB3.
Sure. And that just adds a few dollars to the overall price. But since you're going with 1Gbps Ethernet, and USB3, you'll want SATA support to take advantage of it. That's a couple of more bucks. And with all that extra stuff, now you're definitely gonna want more than 1GB of RAM ('cause that's just not enough to run that new ethernet at full speeds). Sure, RAM's cheap, only a couple of extra dollars for that. Of course, now you need a bigger board, which is a few more bucks (and no backwards compatibility,
So? (Score:5, Insightful)
But still the same ethernet that goes over the USB bus?
You complain about this like it's a show stopping defect. For the few people who care about this, then there's alternatives to rasp PI. But for the vast majority of people, empirically, this is not a problem. Given the Raspi only has a gigbyte of memory or half that, where the heck are you going to put your data after 10 seconds at a gigabit?
Next you will complain your toaster having only 10Mb/set wifi is a major lifestyle issue.
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Hey when the whole family is watching the toaster from their phones to see who is first to get the eggo waffle, 10Mb/sec is just to slow. I could completely miss the eggo popping up and my kids get it first.
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And still no moon-on-a-stick, either!
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I'm thinking the same. If all they had changed was USB 3 and Gig Ethernet I would be buying to replace the old. Even with it still being limited to 1 root USB port would be 10x improvement. (480MPs vs 640MBbs)
Even better would have been Ethernet not going through the usb, more multiple usb root ports. (or the ability to add on higher speed devices like SATA/eSATA/Firewire/More USB 3.x ports )
*sigh* Maybe there will be another revision with it, or next release . . . .
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I'm thinking the same. If all they had changed was USB 3 and Gig Ethernet I would be buying to replace the old. Even with it still being limited to 1 root USB port would be 10x improvement. (480MPs vs 640MBbs)
Even better would have been Ethernet not going through the usb, more multiple usb root ports. (or the ability to add on higher speed devices like SATA/eSATA/Firewire/More USB 3.x ports )
*sigh* Maybe there will be another revision with it, or next release . . . .
The SoC used pretty much outputs only USB, HDMI and GPIO. There is no PCIe controller built in, the memory accesses (used for CPU and GPU) go straight to memory mounted on the SoC. The SoC is just not designed for other IO options, and why should it? It's basically a set top box SoC by design, and that's pretty much how most people use it.
Moving to another fundamentally different SoC would probably have compatibility issues.
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It was on the first two. And while those models had multiple USB connectors, internally there was a USB hub so everything was running off a single shared port.
Re: Ethernet (Score:2)
Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:in bed with satan (Score:5, Informative)
Intel already tried build a Pi type board, it doesn't have anywhere near the amount of applications the Pi does so why bother using it?
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To the Pi team: Why god why couldnt you have chosen something like an Intel or atheros?
Cost, and extra work to integrate with the Broadcom SoC they use. Broadcom give you everything you need to plug their chips together for free, where as if you want to mix and match you are on your own design wide. If you look at the RPi schematic it's basically the Broadcom minimal example from the datasheet, with a voltage regulator and some ports.
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When the Raspberry Pi first rolled out the processor was about $5, that left $30 for everything else.
At that time Intel SOC were going for $35 in bulk, which would have made the Raspberry Pi at least $65. The original Intel chips used during development would have been even more expensive.
Other people have pointed out that the founder worked at Broadcom.
I can't comment
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You make compromises when you make a device like this. The Pi is great for a lot of projects, but it won't be great for everybody. I might care about networking performance for other devices, but for my Pis (I normally tend to buy about 10-20), I won't care one bit about this unless it can't even effectively do 10 megabit.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it (Score:2, Insightful)
Glad to hear that the RasPi Zero wasn't the only product on development from Rasp Foundation.
I had a lot of fun with tinkering with the Raspberry Pi 2 so far and that new Raspberry Pi 3 seem to be a step in the good direction.
More power and, finally, integrated Wifi and bluetooth. Something that seem more important and cheaper than many other hardware.
Still, there still a lot to be desired, both hardware and software. Analog IO, more power (USB 3.0?), better Python development tool and IDE (yeah, idle or id
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IDE?
Even the last couple of desktop motherboards I've bought don't do IDE anymore. Strictly SATA.
Realistically, the Pi is OK for casual computing and as a mount-anywhere smart controller/interface, but if you need serious storage, network that sucker into a SAN.
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IDE?
Even the last couple of desktop motherboards I've bought don't do IDE anymore. Strictly SATA.
Realistically, the Pi is OK for casual computing and as a mount-anywhere smart controller/interface, but if you need serious storage, network that sucker into a SAN.
For 21th century people, IDE mean "Integrated development environment" : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
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Don't blame me. Parent shouldn't be mixing hardware whinges with software whinges in the same paragraph. The hardware is what the manufacturer made it to be. software can come from anywhere.
For me, a software development IDE is either a specific product or plural. Lots of IDEs work just fine on the Pi. I've used IDEs on machines a lot feebler than even the most basic Raspberry Pi, especially if you include Emacs and Vim with plugins. Re-reading carefully, I'm thinking the parent complaint was about a suppos
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No, he's talking about an Integrated Development Environment for Python.
How is this related to the Pi? Well, it's not... it's a confused post made to hype Windows 10.
So I mention Win10 IoT and I'm immediately flagged as a Win10 fanboy? And are you seriously asking me how the OS is related to the product? Errr, maybe because it's part of the product even if Raspberry Pi Foundation doesn't develop the OS?
While the RaspPi have been one of the most pleasant embedded experience so far (I've learned Python and I'm impressed how well it work), it's not perfect. First of all, unlike many 6 digit of /., I've nearly no experience with linux mostly because I've a short temper for
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Yes, because the concepts do not got together so it takes a special motive to cram them together with brute force.
Hardware requirements and license costs render Win10 and IoT in completely different realms. Your fifty little hardware widgets not doing much individually and requiring very little in terms of cpu now suddenly need a few hundred dollars worth of hardware and software each instead of tens of dollars.
Who would consider that at
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Go away to kindergarten, it is there you can play with Fisher Price...
Typical Linux fanboy attitude. No patience with people that like things simple.
About time you understand that it's one of the main reason Linux never reached the Personal Computer market (that was voluntary to put the emphasis on "Personal" here).
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Analog I/O might be nice but it's not something that generally comes with an ARM SoC designed for mobile phones. Besides you can get analog I/O with the simple addition of a 10 cent chip.
Well, you can say the same for many feature of the Raspberry Pi. Analog IO are needed for a lot of project and it would be nice to have then build in. Furthermore, as you said it yourself, those chip are cheap so why not adding them to the RaspPi?
Why anyone needs an IDE for Python is beyond me. Even vim has syntax highlighting for Python. What else do you need ?
As someone that made a lot of VB.NET project on VBA for one of my job, I can tell you that a IDE for a scripted language can help drastically. Autocorrection, debugging (hell, while you are debugging, you write the code in the watch and look if the result is what y
Banana Pi or Raspberry Pi? (Score:2)
With the new Raspberry Pi out, what are the benefits of going with the Raspberry Pi over the Banana Pi and vice Vesra?
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Banana Pi has SATA built in, and is faster.
Though, it is a bit trickier to code for.
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Banana Pi has SATA built in, and is faster.
Though, it is a bit trickier to code for.
In what way is it trickier to code for?
Please give us 64-bit OS, too (Score:4, Interesting)
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^ exactly this.
Where isn't there a 4 GB RAM or 8 GB RAM option ??
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^ exactly this.
Where isn't there a 4 GB RAM or 8 GB RAM option ??
One of the RasPi Foundation staff on the official website comments said that there is some sort of architectural limitation with Videocore 4 which Broadcom builds into the SoC that prevents them from moving past 1GB. They can't get around that without swapping SoC supplier, which they seem very reluctant to do.
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So why can't Broadcom release a VideoCore 5 that doesn't suck but is driver compatible with version 4? :)
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Yes, there's probably a small market for a $75 ARM PC.
I have a NUC and think I'd hit the rPi's 1GB ceiling running Firefox/Chrome pretty quickly.
Re:Please give us 64-bit OS, too (Score:5, Informative)
VideoCore4 cannot access more than 1Gb of RAM
And on the RPi, VC4 acts like a Northbridge - the ARM cores will do all RAM and IO access trough the VC4.
So unless Boradcom updates VideoCore with more address lines, All RPis will have max 1Gb or RAM.
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That's exactly what SGI used to recommended on IRIX (SGI Hardware (MIPS) and OS (IRIX, a real UNIX) was 64-bit back in the 90s, but they told people to compile everything 32-bit unless they had an actual need to be 64-bit).
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> and the PS3 were 64-bit chips run in 32-bit mode (they only had 512MB of RAM).
That's incorrect for the PS3. Rockstar bitched at SCEA for years about why the PS3 is running in 64-bit mod -- which I agree is absolutely idiotic. Compiling in pure 32-bit mode showed a performance increase between ~5% .. ~10% due to not needing all the unnecessary sign extensions for pointer addressing.
> No, 64-bit really doesn't make sense until you have > 4GB of RAM,
Mostly that's true, however there is an additiona
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It makes a big difference on x86 to amd64 because x86 is pretty register starved (and half of your registers aren't truly general purpose). The amd64 architecture we've moved to on a PC adds 8 more general purpose registers and also changes the ABI. On 32 bit function call parameters are passed by pushing the values onto the stack, the ABI on amd64 now passes parameters in registers instead so it makes things like function calls significantly more efficient.
ARM however was never register starved and its ABI
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Yeah it seems like they've made the architectural leap to ARMv8, which offers performance benefits over Cortex A7.
But I would expect them to 'downgrade' to the Cortex A32 when it is available. It's basically the same as the A53 but without the 64bit capability - smaller, cheaper and more power efficient perhaps.
Under new management, dupes don't change... (Score:2)
http://hardware.slashdot.org/s... [slashdot.org]
Posted last Saturday by....Timothy...Huzza!
I've nothing against the Pi but this relentless boosting of it is getting tedious.
Sold Out Already (Score:2)
Once again demand outstrips supply.
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Still plenty here: https://shop.pimoroni.com/prod... [pimoroni.com]
I had no problems ordering my Zero from them on release day too.
Palm Treo (Score:2)
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Don't hurry now; some tech matures with age! B^>
Maybe I could swap it for a Pilot I may stil have lurking...
Running a JVM on a Pilot was a challenge, on an RPI rather less so.
Rgds
Damon
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http://www.ebay.com/itm/261834... [ebay.com]
took about 4 days to get here and have been having a blast with it. So yah it was worth the extra 2.99.
Re:Hype? (Score:5, Insightful)
These two sentences alone make me chose any of the innumerable competitor products, rather than R-Pi.
It's funny how people go on about "competitor products" but never bother naming them.
Probably because whenever they do, it turns out that they're either not comparable on price or on specs.
Actually there are many Chinese ARM-based development boards and "mini PCs" with much, much better specs. The problem is that they tend to use SoCs designed by some mainland Chinese semiconductor company which refuse, or at least ignore requests, to release even the GPL'ed kernel sources for the chip. Compared to these companies, Broadcom is almost saintly.
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Actually Allwinner, the Chinese supplier of many of those low cost SoCs, is pretty good with open source support. Their hardware needs minimal binary blobs and they do publish GPL code where required. Allwinner parts are well supported by open source operating systems because of this.
The reason why they are not more popular is support. With a RPi there is a huge amount of support material, pre-made SD card images and active forums to help you out. Like Arduino, there are more powerful and cheaper alternativ
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Re: Hype? (Score:2)
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Not really, it's not even available yet.
The 4GB of memory is storage while the Pi just used an SD card. The Chip only has 512MB of RAM.
It's a 1Ghz, single core processor, no on board Ethernet. Video out is composite with adapters for VGA and HDMI. But the HDMI adapter doesn't include audio output.
I'm sure there are some uses for this, but the RPi3 does a lot more.
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I got two of the regular production models shipped to me months ago. (BTW, can you actually buy a Pi Zero anywhere today?)
4GB on board memory is better than an empty memory slot.
Pi doesn't do composite VGA at all.
It's comparable, not exactly the same as the Pi range. Better in some ways. Costs less.
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So... the two regular production Chip computers I have sitting here on my desk don't exist?
BTW, when do you think you will actually be able to buy the new Pi model? Can you even buy the Pi Zero which was announced months ago?
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Is this likely to be lower in power demand than the USB equivalent connected to a Pi 2?
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With the Raspberry Pi 3 and Windows 10, you can play all Windows games in full HD for only $35!
Feeding the troll: theoretically this will only work for Windows games that have been ported to the ARM architecture. So in theory you could play some WinPhone apps.
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Probably, I think the GPU part of the SOC is running at a higher clock now.
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Why? If you don't want it, don't buy one, or simply don't use it. It's not like you're being forced into anything.