The Challenge of Getting a Usable QWERTY Keyboard Onto a Dime-sized Screen 144
An anonymous reader writes: Researchers from Spain and Germany are building on Carnegie Mellon's work to attempt to create workable text-input interfaces for wearables, smartwatches and a new breed of IoT devices too small to accomodate even the truncated soft keyboards familiar to phone users. In certain cases, the screen area in which the keyboard must be made usable is no bigger than a dime. Of all the commercial input systems I've used, Graffiti seems like it might be the most suited to such tiny surfaces.
let me weigh in on this (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
(*) once it has become muscle memory
Re:let me weigh in on this (Score:4, Insightful)
I think it's a stupid idea. The "smart watch" technology is great for ALERTS and maybe simple push button replies and can integrate fine with a phone or tablet. But trying to use it as a "phone" or a "computer" is silly.
Voice-to-text input is an option and Siri/Cortana or whatever your flavor does a decent job but the function would be a battery hog.
Just let the watch be like an "extra" display and stop trying to make it in to a Dick Tracy watch/video-phone.
Re: (Score:2)
Also, it's a bit creepy if your watch is listening to everything you and everyone around you says and sends all that to Apple/Google/Microsoft's central servers to process to see if there's a command that should be fun.
Then there's the background noise factor. Talking to your computer/phone when you're in the car and there's minimal noise is one thing. What's going to happen
Re: (Score:1)
Also, it's a bit creepy if your watch is listening to everything you and everyone around you says and sends all that to Apple/Google/Microsoft's central servers to process to see if there's a command that should be fun.
So don't press the push-to-siri button :P
Seriously though, we pretty much already have that situation over a large swath of US homes - anyone owning an Xbox One for example, or a PS4 with an Eye camera and left powered on.
The Kinect has been proven to be always listening, even in "off" standby mode, so long as the device is connected power.
The PS4 eye does the same when powered up and in use, although it doesn't seem to transmit any data back to Sony while in standby.
Now granted, the Kinect voice recognitio
Re: (Score:2)
I have a friend who is big on using the google voice search, regardless of location, decorum, or social cues. Random conversation over dinner at a fairly empty restaurant, he goes to look up a quick fact, and rather than type it in on his phone, he loudly and clearly enunciates his question. A future where this becomes the normal behavior, really fucking irritates me.
"ALL CONVERSATION MUST STOP WHILE I LOOK UP THIS INANE DETAIL VIA VOICE SEARCH!" :(
Re: (Score:3)
Whereupon the pissed-off guy next to him yells "ISIS METH SWITZERLAND GOLD BARELY-LEGAL OVERTHROW WASHINGTON!" and Mr. Google Voice fanboy is never seen again.
Re: (Score:2)
just wait until the sensors are strong enough to pick up brainwaves. pretend to read a sentence and bam, the NSA can finally get inside that square foot or so grey matter they so desperately want.
Thoughts of sedition will finally be curtailed before they can blossom into heresy. Winston will be saved after all.
Re: (Score:2)
My fingertip is the size of a dime. It can't be done. Stop trying to do it, it's not going to happen.
Seriously. The concept that is out dated is the watch. I want one of these: http://games.softpedia.com/scr... [softpedia.com]
Re: (Score:2)
It's only outdated if you don't want a dedicated device for time. Some of us do want or need such a device, preferably one that doesn't need to be recharged every 24 hours, do a bunch of shit we don't care about, and occupy half of our lower arms. A nice looking watch is also a fashion statement; I'm not talking Rolex level (although you can certainly do that), just something that looks halfway decent and goes with most of your wardrobe.
There's still a market for dedicated devices. What does a smartwatc
Re: (Score:2)
It's only outdated if you don't want a dedicated device for time. Some of us do want or need such a device, preferably one that doesn't need to be recharged every 24 hours, do a bunch of shit we don't care about, and occupy half of our lower arms. A nice looking watch is also a fashion statement; I'm not talking Rolex level (although you can certainly do that), just something that looks halfway decent and goes with most of your wardrobe.
The reality is that people expect you to have a cellphone these days. It has replaced the home phone in many respects. So, given that reality you always have a device on you that can tell time. If you choose to get one that needs to be recharged every 24 hours and does a bunch of shit you don't care about that's a choice. I chose to get a smart phone that sure, can do a bunch of shit I don't care about, but I got one that lasts for 6 days typically and that has a keyboard for my big thumbs. It's not ne
Re: (Score:2)
My watch is lots cheaper and lots faster than my cheap phone, and I've never changed the battery in 2+ years.
I still use my casio which came with a ten year warranty on the battery. I bought it 11 years ago.
Re: (Score:2)
I've been thinking about getting a normal watch - funnily, perhaps because a video streaming shat an Apple watch on me, but just because I'd like to tell the time easily and tell myself "okay, time to stop reading slashdot and do groceries/mopping/anything that is useful in real life and will improve my well being and those of others".
I would like dirt cheap (as in 10 euros), and LCD based (monochrome unlit) and think it would be nifty if it drew pixelated handles! a few options maybe : pixelated handles, p
Re: (Score:2)
When I was young, I desired one computery toy above all else: General Jumbo's wrist-worn remote control.
http://www.generaljumbo.co.uk/... [generaljumbo.co.uk]
The details of the controls are never explained, but he uses it to issue orders to his personal army of remote-controlled miniaturized military robots.
Re: (Score:2)
When you call watches outdated, you miss one segment of the population that is small (but probably disproportionately represented here). Yes, most people have replaced watches with phones, but there are some jobs and areas where phones are either heavily frown on or outright banned. This is a niche that still needs to be filled.
Re: (Score:2)
You aren't allowed to have cell phones, so instead you will use a watch that's designed to operate through your cell phone?
He said "watch", not "smartwatch". Why would a regular wristwatch be banned?
Re: (Score:2)
Re:let me weigh in on this (Score:4, Informative)
Yeah, no kidding. You'd be using a tiny little stylus to hit a square less than about 0.5mm or so (yes, that number came out of thin air).
If you're trying to cram a keyboard on a display that small .. you're probably doing it wrong.
Of course, if you're involved in the "IoT" you probably need to be smacked about the head with a tuna, as you're an annoying prat dedicated to making pointlessly connected devices with no security.
So, in that regards, I won't ever need to care about your keyboard. Because I think the IoT is a purely marketing term for crappy products.
Re: (Score:3)
http://www.bbc.com/news/techno... [bbc.com]
Re: (Score:2)
More broadly, I have no interest in some dorky gimmick which will have incompetent security, and which mistakenly thinks that my life will be some how improved by an internet enabled soap dish. It's technology for the sake of technology.
Honestly, it's a solution in search of a problem, and something for the marketing wankers to latch onto an say "now with more internet security holes".
Until corporations carry a penalty for being lazy/incompetent with security, you should assume these products are terribly
Re: (Score:3)
The current fascination with smart watches reminds me when I was in high school in the 80s and there was a brief fad of full feature electronic watches. Calculator watches were in the geek must have list, but there were also kids with watches featuring radios or mini-LCD screen games. There was even a rumour of a someone in school with a tv watch, which as it turns out wasn't so far from the truth.
None of these watches were very successful, for the simple reason that the watch as a form factor was never wel
Re: (Score:2)
The problem is 'QWERTY' not bloody size. Sure after much experience you get to know where the keys are but how many know the full QWERTY alphabet 'QWERTYUIOPASDFGHJKLZXCVBNM' so that you can tab through to get to the letter group you want (reduced number of keys, say 6 or 12 ie next key, 6 ABCDE next FGHIJ next). So you drop QWERTY and go back to your ABCs, so that a reduced key set works . This creates other problems for multiple devices so it makes sense to start pushing ABCs as a option on devices where
Re: (Score:2)
I agree. We've lost our focus if this is what the next important thing is.
Voice recognition is what comes to mind but some will say it's not private enough and they are right.
Holograms appear to be something coming down (although I'm not clear how) but is that going to be input friendly since there will be no feedback while typing mid air?
The there's those slim LCDs that can be rolled out, maybe a few years down the road we can make it work reliably.
So why are we building devices that aren't
Re:let me weigh in on this (Score:5, Interesting)
Dude, I'll tell you straight up .. if people start having voice controlled wearable devices, someone's gonna get hurt, and have their device stuffed into an orifice which wasn't intended to receive it.
Because it you thought people talking loudly into Bluetooth ear pieces was annoying, wait until some ass in the checkout line is trying to compose an email or bring up his calendar.
Now picture an office full of people trying to use this kind of thing.
No. Just no.
Re: (Score:2)
I didn't suggest it was an ideal solution but it does solve the input issue. The fact that it isn't ideal makes it that it won't happen. Fact is the technology is not useless but it's miss placed. Time will sort this out.
Re: (Score:2)
We haven't achieved total unemployment yet, but wait till the next downturn.
Then use only your finger tip. (Score:4, Insightful)
Might I suggest Morse code. Fast people with Morse can exceed the fastest texters. Seems extremely plausible.
Re: (Score:2)
voice is simply the best for a device that size, and its getting good enough
Morse Code (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Morse Code (Score:5, Interesting)
About 10 years ago they used to have speed texting contests. Kids would text as fast as they could using only the keypads of their feature-phones.
I believe it was Letterman who invited on the winner and an old guy who used to work as a telegraph operator.
The old man finished the test text 3 times before the world champion texter finished once.
Re: (Score:2)
And the texter wasn't "the world champion" just some dude who won some local texting contest. Still fast, but lets not go nuts.
Oh, and it was Leno not Letterman.
There was simililar race in Australia at the time and the morse guy won there too.
10 years ago the phones they were using had those press 1 once for A, 1 twice for B, 1 three times for C, 1 for times for 1, 1 five times for !. press 2 once time for D, press 2 twice for E.... systems.
It wasn't a competition between morse and a smartphone with swyft
Re: (Score:2)
I have a smartphone now with Google's Swype knockoff and I love it. But sometimes I wonder how fast I could type with T9 on a large screen...
Re: (Score:2)
Yeah, T9 and iTap etc should have been available; so not quite as bad as I made it out to be... but still texting was very different then. (i guess its still that way on dumb/feature phones... but i haven't used one since the Motorola Razr 2.)
Re: (Score:2)
Here is the video.
https://www.schooltube.com/vid... [schooltube.com]
Re: (Score:2)
I think Apple patented input by means of varying durations of keypresses. It was in here a few years back.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
I think Morse needs to come back for data entry. Only one button needed.
Morse code would be one solution, and isn't that hard to learn. Voice input would be another. A small camera that can read sign language might work, but ASL requires two hands and would be hard to read from the wrist of one of the hands. Another solution would be to project a keyboard onto a surface, and then use a camera to read the taps. The watch could detect the wrist movement, and the tension in the tendons, to detect keys as the user typed on an "air" keyboard. But perhaps the best solution would
Re:Morse Code (Score:4, Interesting)
No you don't! You can do it with just one. That's how it was done originally and many Hams stil do it that way. It's called a straight key. You just hold your finger down longer for a dah, shorter for a dit.
There are apps already out there for this using either one or two buttons. Some can even work both ways based on preference. They just need to be ported to the watch.
I've never seen a break key. Interesting idea. I'm not sure why/how you would use it. Instead of pressing a break key just spend that same time pressing nothing.
Then again I am thinking more of actually sending morse such as a ham sending CW. If you had a break key then a short press would mean you could immediately go to the next dit or dah. The keyer would still have to wait to send that dit or dah so you would need a buffer. That would be kind of weird to use since usually when sending morse one listens while sending.
I suppose that for this applicaiton a break key could work and would allow faster 'typing'. Just don't actually sound out the code and do display the characters as they are typed. It is hardly necessary though, two or one button would work just fine.
Re: (Score:2)
Pressing a key is faster than pressing nothing. Sorta like when people set their double click time to large values so its not accidental, and then wonder why it takes over a second to recognize a single click. A button saying done is better than waiting.
Doing nothing is always faster than doing something, unless you've discovered tachyons and enjoy breaking causality.
There is no "word break" in morse code. The proposed button would do NOTHING but insert a delay of nothing. That's how morse code works.
A "word break" key would ONLY be "useful" if you were entering morse code into a non-live system to be sent later. If you have this luxury, why not use a regular keyboard and have the system translate the keys into morse? because the system is already tran
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Why not send short push-to-talk audio messages, walkie-talkie style. Why are we insisting on text?
Re: (Score:2)
Because there are times when you need to send a message but you can not be talking aloud.
"Open browser."
*ding*
"Go to..."
"Enter address please."
"DOUBLEYOU DOUBLEYOU DOUBLEYOU DOT PEE OH ARE ENN..."
The challenge of common sense... (Score:4, Insightful)
...would dictate we look to other methods of input rather than re-engineering the wheel to fit inside a thimble.
Care to tell me why my IoT device wouldn't simply report into a web server, where another device would serve as the input mechanism?
Frankly I find it laughable that we assume any IoT device would not be reporting all of it's data to a central server. It's kind of the whole point of IoT, for vendors to sell you back your own data and tie it to online alerting systems that can easily be interfaced through a browser or phone app.
Re: (Score:2)
Like you know, talking into it. Or using a mental interface.
I'm not opposed to a hologram keyboard, either.
Re: (Score:2)
Just remember to think "Close all browser tabs. Clear browser history" every 7 seconds or so.
Re: (Score:2)
How do you get it on the network if you can't input the WPA key?
Re: (Score:2)
Simple, the idiots who produce IoT products will simply suggest you have an open wifi so they don't have to solve the problem.
Mark my words.
Exactly like how web sites give you instructions to enable javascript, cookies, and turn off your Windows firewall.
They don't give a crap about security, so they'll just write it such that you can't have any if you want your IoT buttplug to be able to send tweets.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
You can transfer the connection information from another device. The Withings scale does this. You connect to it via Bluetooth and it sends the Wi-Fi credentials over after asking for your permission.
Re: (Score:2)
...would dictate we look to other methods of input rather than re-engineering the wheel to fit inside a thimble.
I agree completely. And why does it even need to be QWERTY??
Graffiti, which was suggested by the submitter, doesn't satisfy the QWERTY condition. And for good reasons, all the design constraints that were there when the QWERTY keyboard was created, are no longer there when changing to that much smaller form factor.
Morse... (Score:2)
Gesture Mosaic - best small input I've ever used.. (Score:1)
I really hope gesture mosaic comes back. I could keep up with touch typists using that input method.
http://www.pitecan.com/presentations/PenInput/gesturemosaic.html
Voice? (Score:2)
Graffiti is a good idea, and I think I could knock the rust off those skills in a short time, but aren't we at the point now where voice recognition is practical?
Re: (Score:2)
It was not until my latest phone that voice to text was more accurate than trying to type on that little keyboard, it's also much faster. My wife has had the same experience she has an android and I have a company provided iphone {because it was free}.
Re: (Score:2)
Yes, voice might work, but it can't be the only method of text entry. Could you imagine trying to do voice recognition on the bus? When everybody else on the bus is trying to do the same thing? There still has to be an keyboard for the times when voice recognition just doesn't make sense.
Re: (Score:2)
{because it was free}
Thank you for the gratuitous explanation. Without it, we wouldn't know you're a pretentious fuck-wit.
Re: (Score:2)
I don't know if that makes me pretentious but I am absolutely a cheap bastard.
Re: (Score:2)
I didn't really understand his response. I carry a low end Android phone that I'm not happy with at all [1], precisely because that's what my company issues. I don't see how this makes anyone a fuck-wit. Maybe because you carry an i-phone and aren't an Apple fanatic?
[1] Not because it's an Android phone, but because it's a considerable downgrade from my previous company issued Android phone.
why did "spiral gestures" never catch on? (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
I liked it a lot. I don't use a screen protector sheet as that increases the friction. I would guess that is why you felt it was uncomfortable, but I could be wrong. I like the smooth glass as your finger can slide much easier that way, and dirt and crap does not accumulate around the edges of those films. The thing that made me give up on the 8-pen was having to switch to a number pad for numeric entry. When you are writing an address or a sentence with mixed numbers and letters it gets old very quickly.
La
Re: (Score:2)
I want to try this! Where did it go?!
Re: (Score:2)
It's available on Amazon's App store for 99 cents! I'll give it a shot. I have a few thousand coins to cash in.
Just implant it already... (Score:2)
Typing is so 20th century. Though voice-commands may be an interim method, the ultimate solution will involve implanting the thing into the user's body. Not necessarily the brain, but somewhere, where a nerve can affect it — and be affected by it.
Re: (Score:2)
Until security is in a less sorry state I doubt too many people will stand in line to have the Internet wired into their nervous system.
Re: (Score:1)
Wrong keyboard (Score:1)
Should use Dvorak instead. I hear it better at everything!
The best workable text-input for wearables: (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
Take out your smartphone and type it there. If you're trying to do something that takes more than a couple clicks on a smartwatch, you're doing it wrong.
Exactly! I was an early adopter of the Pebble. Now people are asking me when I'm getting an Apple Watch. Why should I replace my Pebble when it already does everything I need? It provides me notifications. If I want to do anything more complicated, I'll take my phone out of my pocket.
xstroke gesture recognition (Score:1)
Projected keyboard (Score:1)
I saw one mock-up where a phone-type screen was projected onto the wrist of the wearer. That might be a bit much, but perhaps something like this [waycoolgadgets.com] with a basic keyboard - projected onto the wrist/arm - might be doable.
Not sure how well it will work for us guys with hairy arms though.
Sounds like a job for 8pen (Score:1)
This was already solved. (Score:1)
It's called the 8pen.
Microsoft Research is trying a thing (Score:2)
Of all the commercial input systems I've used, Graffiti [wikipedia.org] seems like it might be the most suited to such tiny surfaces.
I do believe Microsoft Research [microsoft.com] is attempting to do something very Graffiti-like with Android wear. I don't know how useful it is.
So..... (Score:2)
They're taking a keyboard paradigm, which is inherently designed to be operated with two hands and they're trying to put it in a device that's attached to the wrist above one of your hands in a way that makes it impossible for you to use one of your two hands to operate it..
Does anyone else besides me see the problem here?
Why stand alone small devices? (Score:2)
I've through for a long time we only need two computing devices, one high performance but too big to be portable, one as fast as possible while still pocket size and long battery life. Then have a bunch of wireless interface devices. Your smartphone, tablet, keyboard or anything that is vaguely portable can just talk with your pocket computer. Then when you get home they can talk to your faster, non portable device to increase performance.
Air Typing (Score:2)
I predict that non-contact hand motion detection will be made practical soon. 3D cameras will "read" hand gestures so that you are essentially typing in the air. Everyone will look like magicians, waving gestures at their watch or gizmo.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:1)
People with bluetooth earbuds are already walking around like schizophrenia patients talking to themselves.
Compare fingerspelling (Score:2)
Does a deaf person signing to another deaf person look "like and idiot or an insane person"?
Hello Computer (Score:2)
It's called voice to text. No thumbs required.
OLD hat. (Score:2)
http://citeseer.uark.edu:8080/... [uark.edu]
They already have options that they worked on back in 1993.
putting QWERTY on the screen is stupid, you have to use a different input method, the clock face is the one that makes a lot of sense.
Hey, how about... (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
https://www.gmail.com/mail/hel... [gmail.com]
Re: (Score:2)
That's... actually kinda cool.
laser keyboard (Score:2)
it was just a grab http://gizmodo.com/5943266/thi... [gizmodo.com] while they call it a waste of time it sure meets the needs of small devices
A usable QWERTY keyboard? (Score:2)
Keyboard accessory watch for the other arm.... (Score:2)
Simply wear the smart watch on one wrist and a Bluetooth Blueberry keyboard watch on the other. After all, why should one of your wrists go naked....
The challenge is wrong (Score:2)
Voice, patterns, signs... anything but a keyboard. The input area is just too small.
Even if someone do manage to invent something clever, it's not going to be anywhere near the usability of a full-sized keyboard. There's a reason Apple won't make smaller laptops: they know a usable keyboard needs to be a minimum size.
MessagEase keyboard (Score:2)
I use the MessagEase keyboard on a few devices, and I can't imagine a better input system for small screens. It is unconventional, and it takes a bit of learning. Small enough to fit on a dime? Probably not. But for a watch, absolutely.
http://www.exideas.com/ME/inde... [exideas.com]
Make wearables bigger? (Score:2)
Does a dime-sized wearable require that much interaction? It seems like the display would be so small that it wouldn't have very many use cases. If you want a lot of interaction, you probably also want a bigger screen. Why not something forearm-sized?
Look into my eyes (Score:2)
How small can we make an accurate gaze detector? When you need to type the watch, it would display the tiny keyboard while looking into your dominant eye and by way of feedback displays a little spot where it sees your point of regard as being. To "commit" a virtual keystroke you would tap a side button on the device. It may sound clumsy but I think a trained user could achieve better speed of entry this way than any other physical way of hitting eensy keys.
This would be especially powerful if voice were t
Graffiti is patent encumbered (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Something like Steam's daisy wheel [squarespace.com] perhaps? It wouldn't be perfect since the only inputs would be cardinal directions instead of two separate input surfaces, but probably at least as fast as graffiti and probably more accurate.
Re: (Score:2)
I use 8pen on my android phones and it works great--it could scale down pretty small.
Re: (Score:2)
Looks interesting. However, I wonder how I might be able to use this, since I can barely write with a pen anymore. I much prefer Swype these days, and can swipe whole words very quickly.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Instead of adhering to the qwerty paradigm that has its roots in mechanical typewriters, why no used a different layout? Or even get away from the whole keyboard mindset?
ok, come up with a new keyboard layout and see how long it will get accepted. I haven't done any research why the qwerty keyboard is layed out that way. I was talking with an old guy who learned to type using a typewriter with blank keys (I learned typing on mechanical typewriter but not with blank keys). Objective is so you don't have to look at the keyboard while you type. Start position is left fingers on "asdf" right fingers on "jkl;" as supposably those are most used letters, and fingers can easily rea
Re: (Score:1)
Instead of adhering to the qwerty paradigm that has its roots in mechanical typewriters, why no used a different layout? Or even get away from the whole keyboard mindset?
ok, come up with a new keyboard layout and see how long it will get accepted........
I have re-created an alternative keyboard to QWERTY - it is based on the Qunikey chording input system devised originally by Doug Engelbart. I call it SiWriter. It runs on the iPad and can be downloaded from the Appstore. See siwriter.co.uk for full info. The App is frankly not selling - people are so heavily wedded to Qwerty. I'm continually developing it - when I'm not looking for or doing paid work and its utility is increasing with each update. The faster the iPad the better too !
Re: (Score:2)
Why would they do that? Buckboards, stagecoaches and Surreys (with or without fringes on top) had bench seats.