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Handhelds Hardware

Palm Pilots: Tools or Toys? 171

Posted by Hemos from the but-i-really-like-kyle's-quest dept.
dittrich writes "Found this at CNN this morning. It's an interesting point of view, the meat of whicht is that Palm Pilots don't really make us more productive, they are just cool toys that people want, not need. " That's been one of the those ongoing arguements about computers in general-do they really increase our productivity? I say yes, but every year or so, someone produces a study saying that they don't.
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Palm Pilots: Tools or Toys? More

Palm Pilots: Tools or Toys?

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  • This is one of the worst thought-out "articles" I've ever read on CNN. I'll present a few of my complaints:

    Now try thinking about IT managers that typically have little to do with procuring Palms but often end up managing them. How much fun is it to keep track of these devices? Lost. Stolen. Broken. Frozen.

    This is pointless. Just because there is an occasional overhead period when you break it, does that make it a useless tool? Just because yr car breaks down once or twice does that make it not worth it to drive anywhere? My mechanic has to work all day to fix my car, so it's just a toy?

    Are they accomplishing anything with it that they wouldn't with a notebook computer and daytimer?

    How many notebook computers can you fit in your back pocket? How many notebook computers can run off of two AAA batteries for as long as a month? How many notebook computers boot up immediately and cost only $450? That's the purpose of the Palm Pilot. The size of a daytimer and some of the functionality of a notebook.

    But what I want to know is, do you really need it? Write to me and prove that your Palm is worth the hassles it causes the IT department.

    Do you need your underwear? Do you need your watch? Do you need your New York Times subscription? Do you need your second phone line? There are lots of things that you could just say "Do you need this?" about and the answer would be no. Does that mean it isn't useful? Does that mean it's just a toy?

    Not in my book.

    Log

  • My company computer is a Thinkpad 760XL, which weighs more than I care to think about. I certainly wasn't interested in transferring notes from paper to keyboard or printing a new contact list every day, so I would bring my laptop to meetings, which sucked. Nothing like having the overheat fan come on when your computer is sitting next to the speakerphone, huh? I also need an electronic calendar which beeps at me. When I'm overworked (always) some of the calendar items just disappear from my memory until days after I was supposed to do whatever.

    My Palm III fits in my pocket, does everything I was carrying the TP for (phone numbers, calendar, notes, and quick emails), and weighs practically nothing. Now that the sexy new models are out, it costs $170 on the web. I now carry a cell phone and a Palm into meetings, nothing else.
  • > And yes, porting Linux to it would be a fun thing to do.

    be sure to check out www.linuxce.org

    --
    G.
  • Seems like you use it as a $450 replacement for a $1500 notebook, which makes a lot of sense.
  • Not discounting the inventive humor of this post, I had to add: I'm a lawyer. I've used one PalmPilot or another for close to three years. Not only have I never been this organized, and not only did I write most of my upcoming book Clicking Through: A Survival Guide for Bringing Your Company Online [amazon.com] (Bloomberg Press; expected Oct. 1999) directly on my PalmPilot, but I haven't picked up a legal pad since I got my first Pilot 1000. More productive? Damned straight!

  • His comment that computers don't seem to result in producivity gains doesn't hold a lot of water. Some sensationalized studies have claimed that, but I don't think there's a lot of truth to the matter.

    In their 28 Sep 1996 issue, The Economist [economist.com] has an extensive discussion of this topic. There are a number of reasons why those studies are probably giving the wrong answer. The most interesting, though, is that productivity measures are pretty crude.

    Consider, for example, the field of publishing. When you compare magazines now with magazines from a few decades ago, modern magazines are generally slicker, and a lot of that is due to the use of desktop publishing systems. For the same amount of effort, you can get a much better result. From the productivity measure point of view, though, the quality improvement is invisible; that's because magazines still use about the same number of people to produce the same number of magazines.

    They also mention some interesting examples in other areas:

    In areas such as finance health care and education government statisticians typically assume that output rises in line with the number of hours worked. The bizarre effect is that measured productivity growth is zero by definition. Likewise telecommunications output is measured in minutes of calls leaving out the huge increase in information transmitted via faxes or faster modems. Or suppose a road-haulage firm introduces a computer system which helps drivers to pick the quickest route and thus provide a better service for its customers. If mileage drops as a consequence the official statistics will show a fall in real output.

    The basic upshot of this that traditional producivity measures were great for the industrial revolution, but don't mean as much today.

    For more information, check out The Economist [economist.com]; it's a lot more than just a financial magazine. I've been reading it for years, and I think it's one of the best general newsweeklies in existence. It's certainly a lot more substantial and thoughtful than Time or Newsweek.

    William
    email: dubl-u (at) pota.to (no foolin!)

  • ...it makes me MONEY.

    Huh ?

    I've attached it to a special printer...

    Seriously...I have several hats I wear. One is as a hockey instructor. I have to be at my appointments not on time, but early. Ice time is expensive an my clients have already paid for it. Normally I am late for everything...my Palm beeps so that I know to stop reading /. and go to the rink. It even reminds me which rink to go to.

    Once I get to the rink I have to remember my lesson plan. Sometimes I have to draw a little picture to remind myself where everybody goes in my drills. Guess where I store that info. Handmemo for the Palm.

    Sometimes I don't have a plan ready. So I search through all my old plans and pick one that fits the current situation. Try that with a daytimer.

    This thing helps me make sure my clients keep putting $40/hr in my pocket...I am certain I would have pissed off several people by now otherwise.

    Not good enough for you ?

    Recently I had an appointment while wearing my technical hat. During the meeting I was asked a question. I didn't have the answer in mind, but I knew I had info about it. That info was on my Palm. I got the data (a bug report from bugtraq) told the client. The client was impressed, by the fact I could answer the question and by my "facility" with this cool little computer. I got the contract.

    Between these two crucial uses I have "paid" for my Palm about...315 times!!!

    And it is cool to ahve something to do at my girlfriends figure skating lessons and dance shows. (Asteroids)

  • That should be...

    "...I have "paid" for my Palm about 31.5 times."

    At this point it is worth noting I have only had my Palm IIIx for 34 days.

    That means it almost "pays" for itself daily.

    I don't even use it as much as I think I can...wait'll I get the GPS and the modem!!!

  • I challenge anyone out there to prove to me that employees are more productive with a PalmPilot than without one. Be honest. Are they accomplishing anything with it that they wouldn't with a notebook computer and daytimer?

    There's a revolution in the medical world going on. Hospitals have so much timely medical information floating around that pda devices like the palm logged in to a wireless network allow medical staff to review, annotate and share data instantly.

    there's medical website devoted for palm users (forget the url) but the above statement fails in this context. laptops are too big and clumsy, paper information drowns.
  • I don't know if I really need my pilot? But now I don't have all those yellow postits all over the place and I can actually find and update info much quicker. Gee, maybe I really do need my Pilot!
  • For me, the Palm Pilot has several advantages over a daytimer: it's smaller and lighter, it can be backed up, I didn't need to learn a "system" for what I enter where and when, and it's much easier to maintain long lists (telephone numbers, todo lists) when inserting and deleting items.

    On the other hand, I don't think IT managers should "maintain" Palm Pilots. The company might pay for it, but that should be the extent of it. If you use your Palm Pilot for both business and personal work (as I do) I think it's a good idea to pay for it yourself no matter what.

  • But notice the focus of the article was on the IT manager's perspective: the costs of support may outweigh the usefulness to the company of having them around, and that, I suspect, is likely true

    If IT departments feel overwhelmed with support issues for small, simple devices then they're doing things th wrong way. Except for applications unique to the business the IT department should just forward the user to the normal support channels. IT departments always try to do everything themselves, often to the detriment of their users.

    I think a lot of IT departments forget they are their to support their users, not dictate how to be productive. Often they are tied together - if something is a support burden it may be making everybody less productive.

    But even if a palm-sized gizmo make you less productive, the entertainment value increases productivity through reduced stress. It all balances out.
  • I don't think it is your job. It's like any other tool.

    For instance. The guy in the next room and I have the exact same PII 350 running Windows 95.

    His has the essentials for what we do.
    I have my hard drive loaded up with, let's face it, crap.

    Does that make my computer a toy? No, I still do all my essetial work from it. But it is also a source of entertainment.

    So I would say, yes, thay are toys, but they're also great boots of productivity. It's all in how you use it.
  • The logical premise of this article is utterly silly. He finds one kid playing breakout on his dad's Pilot, therefore it solidifies his theory that "the Palm Pilot is the candy of computers."

    If that same kid called him an idiot, would it make him one? Maybe not. But the fallacy of his argument doesn't speak very well for him.

  • Thing is, this isn't the first time that a recently new technological gizmo is questioned in regards to usefulness.

    Well, alright, computers were hailed as useful from the start; but sound cards? VGA monitors? Back in the old days, having more than two colours on your monitor was strictly for fun. What about faster CPU's? Why need anything above a 33 MHz when you have WordPerfect 5.1? To play games, of course!

    Same goes for laptops. What's the use of having a computer you carry around? I mean, you have a computer on your desk, and that's where you work, right?

    I'm not surprised at this article, but it shows a lack of vision on the part of the journalist that wrote it. It's not because it doesn't improve productivity now (and I'm one of those who disagree on that idea) that it doesn't have the potential to improve productivity.

    "There is no surer way to ruin a good discussion than to contaminate it with the facts."

  • yes, I want one too :)

    they're from landware, and available around for ~$70. no batteries, folds up small, and there's a carrying case (although I would just make my own) for it and the pilot...

    I'll trade you a custom-made carrying case for one of those :) (custom-made in the sense of "I'll make one" -- and yes, I can sew)

    Lea
  • One thing I've seen in most of the responses come from the point of view of the user. This story, or rather what I got out of it, wasn't about the users, but the organization as a whole. Sure, Palms are cool, fun and useful (I assume, I don't have one) but this was more about how people abuse the system, and then expect the IT department to make up for it. Imagine if you, as a network admin, had to support this whiz piece of hardware that you hadn't trained for, didn't expect to be supporting and had all this new software that integrated (oddly) with existing software? Not fun. Point of the piece isn't that it can't be useful, but that it eats more time supporting it with clueless middle management types than it gives them back. And those clueless PHB types are the loudest whiners and are the most annoying if they don't get what they want. And if they can't figure it out, they bother other employees for help. Since some of those people could concievably be doing work, any time they take to tutor the Palm user is lost money. This fact also drags down productivity as a whole, with less skilled users using more skilled users to compensate.
  • Just before going to ISPCON [ispcon.com] last April, I purchased a new PalmIIIx and gave myself a crash course in Graffiti. I'm sure many of you have been to large trade shows before -- you realize how much crap you end up with. The Palm let me keep a schedule of lectures and panels, a list of the vendor booths I needed to visit, notes from conferences with several other engineers about their products, notes on restaurants, a list of post-show parties each day (btw, thanks to 3Com for the ball game), and even a map of the exhibit floor. Whenever I found another person with a Pilot, we could exchange business cards over the IR port. When I got back to the office, this synced with my Outlook contacts (yes, Outlook--not my idea), thus saving me the trouble of typing the data in myself. All of that in my shirt pocket, without ever having to rummage through my Official ISPCON Satchel (tm) for the myriad sheets of paper in which that information would have been concealed otherwise.

    It also let me play Xiang-Qi, Kyle's Quest, and yes, even Hardball on the flights there and back.

    Yes, you can play games on a PalmPilot. I play games on my PalmPilot. But I have also found it to be an invaluable tool for dealing with the business (yuck) side of my job.

    Now if only the IR had better range so I could use it as a TV remote... :)
    -------
    Losing your faith is a lot like losing your virginity
  • The author claims that Palms are hazardous to companies' IT departments. What?! Does he expect us to believe that if one person uses a notebook to jot down notes, and another person uses a Palm, that somehow that second person is annoying the other techies?
  • Not even close. I use it to keep my time records and appointments, and it syncs into my time-and-billing application every day. When I used to use paper (DayTimers), I had hours of manual entry every month, and once I "misplaced" my DayTimers for a few days. Lost appointments and total paranoia about lost billable time. With my Pilot, I sync to my laptop daily, backup tot the network nightly, and never sweat a lost minute. The two times I've had to replace the unit (I wear out the writing area quite frequently plus they're not the most robust critters on the planet), I lost 0 time as 3com swapped the unit in an even exchange.

    Plus I can search the phone book when I'm paged - can't do that with a paper phone book.

    Plus alarms go off to remind me to do things. Can't do that with paper, and programming a watch alarm with reminders that make sense is impossible unless you have one of those Timexes that reads the computer's screen.....
  • I can't count the number of appointments I would have missed had I not externalized my brain into this hunk of plastic.

    Okay, and there's admittedly PocketChess too. But as far as I'm concerned, the productivity boosts more than excuse the "toy" aspects.
  • I think I'd like a palm pilot (and could call it a serious tool) as long as I have a real keyboard connected to it. (That can mean a Twiddler, which I do have, or one of the tiny add-ons, or anything besides the pen input.)

    timothy
  • By synchronizing my Palm III with my linux machine I've been able to passively extend my ldap [openldap.org] contact database in several directions. I had already set up a small app that let my friends use my website [bnf.net] to keep their own information up to date, or for long lost friends who find me out there to send me their info. Now this all gets synchronised with the palm (thanks to pilot-ldif [uchicago.edu]) where I can access, edit, delete to my hearts content. All using open source tools that extend my overall information management to embrace the palm. (no pun intended)

    My next goal is to get the Palm calendar to synch cleanly with KOrganizer and then either find or build some CGI's to take the vcal file that KOrganizer uses and present it as HTML.

    Why should you care? Well my point is this: The real value of a tool is not measured in any one device (Palm, my.personal.machine, mywebsite.at-my-isp.com) but in how that tool can be used in conjunction to form larger more useful constructs.

    bnf

  • Yes (Score:1)

    by Enry ( 630 )
    Having had a Palm III for about 9 months now, it's very convenient for jotting notes at meetings, scheduling appointments, remembering things (cos I wrote it down) and doing a quick doodle for someone when you don't have a pen and paper handy.

    I carry my III around with me everywhere (fits in my pocket) and it's great for all those reasons.

    The other side is the amusement level. It's rather convenient while sitting on the T or waiting in line for something to break out the III and catch up on news (check out sitescooper from freshmeat) or just play a quick game of PalmWar.
  • symbol technology's myakes a palm clone ppt something or other with an wireless lan connection

    www.symbol.com
  • I think computers increase our productivity. But as they do so we up our work load. We're destined to work our asses off just doing more work as the tasks we currently do get easier.
  • I'm terrible about taking notes on anything handy and then loosing them just as quickly.

    The pilot gave me someplace to consistently put my notes, kept me on my schedules, and also gave me something to do while waiting in lines, on buses, etc.

    My productivity went up immensely after I got a pilot, and dropped again when I had to give it back to the company when I left.

    And yes, I suppose I could have used a paper and pencil dayrunner, but I loose those a few days after getting them. The palmIII was the right size to fit in a pocket, expensive enough that I paid attention to what I did with it, and had enough productivity uses, and toy uses that I always wanted it around.

    So, it helps some people. If they really use it.
    If not, man kick it over here!
  • yeah! they do look exactly like gameboys. i'd love to have an empty newton case to throw in my bag occasionally - just to make people wonder why the hell i'm carting one around.

    thinking more about it (seconds at least) - why not just make a gameboy with an os cartridge and removeable memory cards. that way you could look like a dork and still keep track of whatever it is that palm pilots are keeping track of.

  • Wether computers (or Palmpilots) makes us more effective or not depends on who you are talking about.


    I'd say that I'm pretty savvy when it comes to personal copmuters. Heck, I've had them for as long as I can remember. So, computers make _me_ much more effective. On the other hand, some people at my school should stick to pen and paper, they spend more time trying to make the computer work *with* them, instead of against them. I don't know how many girls close both the Windows help screen, as well as the IE4 welcome screen, every single time they log in. I tell them that you actually can click that tiny checkbox down in the corner, and they are usually like "What?! Serious? THANKS!!" ...


    The same thing goes for Palmpilots. One of the bosses where I work (BTW, a woman...) has a PalmV. I am the lucky owner of an upgraded PalmPersonal (to III), and I can only drool over the PalmV, being a poor student. And what does she do with her PalmV? Nothing! It just sits there in her cradle all day long, I don't even know if she knows it's there.


    I'd say my PalmPilot makes me much more productive. If I get an idea on the bus or train to school or work, I just pick it up and write it down. Also it's great for keeping track of tests and assignments. So when the teacher gives us the worlds longest homework and the other students complain it won't fit the page of their Filofaxes, I just write / (Graffiti for enter).



    My point is that people who are good at computers become more productive with them, people who neither can use them, nor want to become less productive.




  • Handheld PCs aren't toys for people who already live by their day planner. They're pretty much toys for everybody else.

    You know what? That's okay. We're allowed to have fun. It seems like everything is becoming about utilizing every spare second of every single day.

    I've got my Casio E-100 [casio.com] on order for delivery on Friday. Yes, it's a CAN$700 toy, and that's what I told my wife when decided to buy it. It's just a bonus if it ever saves me time balancing my cheque book.

    And yes, porting Linux to it would be a fun thing to do.
  • I can't agree with that.
    As I type this mine has just beeped to remind me that it's binday at work. The todo list has the programs I have to work on today. The memo pad has 30-40 tech support notes that cover 40% of what I do (and growing) and when our NT server goes down it contains all my company's phone numbers.
    Then I have AvantGo installed so I have something to read when I'm on the bus in the morning. I also download etext from Project Gutenberg and read those as well. I could buy a newspaper but AvantGo is free and some of the etexts are expensive to buy in hardcopy.
    Sure I have a few games on it but I also have games on my desktop. Overall a very useful tool. I used to own a Psion 5 but after 2 years it died and while I will get another (probably the large clamshell design supposed to be released later this year) the Pilot 3x has found a permanent spot in my bag.
  • They are toys.
    There is nothing that they can do that you can't do with those day planners (addressbook/calendar)

    Can you enter a name and search your daytimer for every occurance of it? Suppose you met with someone several month ago and you want to quickly find your notes for the meeting (but you don't recall the exact day, or maybe even month). I put the names of the people I meet with in my Pilot so a quick search turns up a list of every meeting I've been to with that person.

    The same goes for phone numbers. Every get a partial and/or garbled number on your pager? It happens to me alot when I'm visiting a plant and I have to go out onto the plant floor. I can search my pilot for number fragments and often find the correct number that way.

    What if you lose your daytimer? Do you keep a xeroxed backup?

    Can you schedule alarms in a daytimer to alert you a minute/hour/day before an appointment?

    And best of all let me see you fit your damn daytimer in your pocket.

  • Try before you buy. I had a GoType from Landware and while it was well engineered in every other respect, the dinky keyboard made a notebook's look expansive.

  • Having worked in endless big offices filled with computers, I can confidently say that computers do not automatically increase productivity. In fact, untrained users are bound to reduce their productivity as their try to figure out how to make columns in Word, or whatev.

    On the other hand, my Pilot Pro has allowed me to pack more stuff into my day, keep a real to-do list for the first time in my life, take notes in the field on something other than ATM receipts, etc. And I would hardly count a half hour of graffiti as "training." Thanks to the interface and general simplicity of the device, I have actually been able to make it DO something for me. This is in sharp contrast to users of desktop computers, who are forced to jump through all kinds of bizarre hoops in order to make simple stuff happen. For untrained users, give 'em a typewriter. Or a Palm Pilot.
  • I agree that it is for the most part a Toy. Even for the people here who love it as a tool, it's not much more than an electronic quo vadis. I don't own or use one but I would in a heartbeat if the following were to happen:

    1. Easily available, highspeed wireless network so I could use my Palm Pilot ( I would prefer the E-100, nicer screen) to send and recieve e-mail and browse the web as if I were at my workstation (none of these text only things you get with certain PCS phones). This could mean I could also log into my LAN or WAN in the same way to upload or download information.

    2. With the networking in place and very reliable, have an open api for creating very thin client applications to extend the useability into fields we haven't thought of. For instance, I have just completed a project for an Ontario Government Ministry where we created an application for Meat Inspectors. The inspectors have to use clients on a laptop ($2500 Can + for each one X 150 ), record their information and then upload it and download it at different times.
    This can cause a great deal of problems with data integrity and synchronization. Everyone on our project has dreamt of being able to just give them E-100s ($700 Can) with our client app and a wireless network so they could login to the Oracle DB live while they are doing their work. They would be smaller and much easier to use in the field than laptops. This isn't possible yet due to the lack of high-speed wireless infrastructure and decent graphical API for regualar people (WinCE? Blah! Java? Maybe someday, but not yet. Linux with mini X? Hmmm....)

    3. Have a wide variety of peripherals available such as wireless printer adaptors, wireless keyboard wedge or PCI scanners ( our inspectors have to scan tags in too) and hands free PCS attachments, possibly voice command/recognition interface (stop me now I'm really dreaming).

    All this boils down to having very high quaility hand held devices as clients in a wireless, distibuted computing environment where using applications is transparent - the UI and functionality is identical on the Palm as it is on the laptop as it is on the desktop. Then we will really have a tool (especially if it converges with voice/picture communications).

    All this technology exist, we just need to sew it together.

    Sounds like a tricorder, doesn't it?

  • TLA (Score:1)

    by sbeitzel ( 33479 )

    I was walking down the street with my girlfriend a few years ago, and I reached out and took her hand in mine. "I thought you didn't like PDAs," she said.

    "Oh, I think they're great," I responded, "but the technology isn't really mature yet. My Newton is still kinda bulky and slow..."

    The Palm is small enough that I can fit it in my pocket, and Graffiti is easy enough to do the kind of data entry I do (names and notes). An added bonus of Graffiti is that other people don't try to write on my Pilot. My organizer used to hold my calendar, a notepad, my addresses, and it served as a wallet, holding checkbook, bills, and coins. My Pilot is small enough that I can fit it in my clutch along with my wallet & checkbook. The technology is getting more mature.

  • Productivity?
    I work at a small industrial-maintenance consulting company. Our job is basically to keep track of *every* time anyone does anything to a machine, every machine which needs to be lubricated, every expendable part which regularly needs replacing.
    We also have extrapolate from previous data so as to guesstimate future maintenance expenditure.
    Now, we've got over dozens of clients, in 12 different industries, with different setups in each one.
    We only have about 15 engineers....
    Try to use pen and paper on THAT job, go on. I want to see you try...
    Anyone who still insists computers don't help is either fooling himself or hasn't thought about this for 5 minutes!

    Gus.
  • My Palm III is literally my 'brain annex' - or as my wife has it - the only brain I've got. It gives me the ability to plan, schedule and most of all "remember" important stuff that can easily slip by unnoticed.

    Also, when you're as old as I am, anything you can do to recall things is a help.
  • How else would I remember to call my daughter at 9pm every night, no matter where I am in the world, and tell her that Scooby Doo is on.

    At tradeshows everyone is walking around with a huge binder of meeting info while I have my Palm V. I get a lot of "I've got to get one of those" comments.
  • Palm War! Yeah baby! I love that game. I should probably go register it.
  • anyone who ever questions whether computers have made our society more productive should drag their head out of the sand (if it hasn't popped out in china yet). i shouldn't have to support this point but i will. the us's economy and japan's economy are the largest in the world. why? computers. they run both economies, plain and simple. without them half the number of transactions (goods, money, services) could be conducted in the same amount of time, if that many. secondly, there is the e-commerce market. not only is it huge at the moment, it's still growing in its inflationary period (growth is increasing not steady or declining). if this isn't sufficient evidence that computers increase productivity more than they suck production away through games, fun, and diversion, then sufficient evidence doesn't exist.

    -soft error
  • How do you REALLY measure productivity when comes to computers? I mean in some areas it's easy, anyone who word processes you can measure the time it takes for them to finish something with a computer and a typewriter and see which takes longer. But many times it's difficult. Do you use quantity or quality as your yardstick and is quality due to the person's skill or due to the computer program? Take a publication program for example, it lets a relatively unskilled user make a professional looking document in a relatively short amount of time, but then a more adept publisher might be hampered by the ease of use of the publication program.
    It all depends on how the user adapts to the technology. Palm Pilots are no different. If I buy a Palm V and suddenly I'm never late for a meeting and I always remember my appointments where with a pen and paper dayplanner I was late and couldn't remember where I was supposed to be half the time, then yes I've become more productive and efficient. But lets say i bought my Palm and I had trouble using it right off the bat, it wouldn't make me more productive. I think this is really the question of technology making everything "more productive", is the technology easy for someone to incorporate.
    If you put a computer in front of someone and suddenly expect production to increase or your business to become more organized you're an idiot and deserve bankruptcy. Productivity tools need to be simple to incorporate into the users daily life. Thats what makes a tool more effective, when the rock was tied to a stick it had a handling surface and a utensil surface, making it more efficient and useful. The Palm has done well to add handles to make it more efficient. It's succeeded where the notebook computer failed, the notebook was meant for people to be able to be more organized and work everywhere but it's complexity and lack of useability features (short battery life, weight, difficulty to adapt to using due to a miniature keyboard) meant that it was mainly used for a portable office when you have time to sit down, or something to store your data on and take home where the Palm is a tool you can carry around with you and be more productive because of it's utility features. So the longwinded rambled answer is YES the Palm is a tool in the hands of someone who uses it as a tool.
  • It's not a MINI-computer - that name's been taken already. Since it's an order of magnitude smaller than our desktop microcomputers, I vote for calling it a NANO-computer.


    I became a Linux convert the day that NT crashed five times on me.
  • Say, that all fits into the 2MB of the PalmIII I was planning to do something similiar, but thougth the PalmIII (and the PalmV) might just have to little memory for that. What software are you using?
  • Palm IIIx = 8MB max. Nothing that fits in the palm of my hand should bother annoying me with a miniature keyboard -- graffiti is fast and intuitive. I have e-mail, spreadsheet, text-editing, and why would I surf the web on something that small. My IIIx is my portable Administrative Assistant. If I need more than it can do, I take my laptop.

    BTW -- it's not either or: a hedge trimmer and a chain saw are *both* tools. And clearly there are times when you would not use one in place of the other...
  • >> If you use your Palm Pilot for both business and personal work (as I do) I think it's a good idea to pay for it yourself no matter what.

    I concur... I'll go one further: if you're going to use it AT ALL, own it. Nothing will suck worse than becoming totally dependent on it, depending on it like brain cells, then having to surrender it when you change firms.

    my $0.02 worth...
  • >In my last year of high school my friends
    >all bought the most expensive graphing
    >calculators we could afford since we knew
    >we'd need them in college.

    I don't want to suggest that graphing calculators aren't both fun and useful, but did you actually find that you _needed_ them at college?

    I studied Engineering/Electrical and Information Sciences at Cambridge University in the UK, which is exactly the sort of subject for which a fancy calculator could be useful. In fact, the recommended calculator, and the only one that we were allowed to use in examinations, was a little non-programmable Casio (fx-115, I think). To my surprise I found that it did everything I ever needed of it.

    My mother is a physics teacher in the UK (A level, age 16-18ish) and she finds that she wastes a lot of time when students don't know how to use their graphing calculators properly. At the same time they struggle to grasp basic mathematical concepts, don't know how to sketch a graph, and of course, they tend to assume that the answer on the calculator display is never wrong.

    Calculators and computers have their place in education, but giving the kids too many tools may mean that they never get to learn the principles and basic mathematical skills that are most important.
  • Way back when this palm gig started, we heard a few things in the trade rags, and saw them start to become available on order. We decided as an EUS department to hold off until things settled in and we saw where the technology went (why buy the first one off the line, when it *might* not be that good..perish the thought :-) As we kept an eye on things, the end user community caught wind of them, bought into the hype, then bought into about a dozen of the little buggers (Palm IIIs). Then once they arrived, they called up asking for support (I believe the phrase I got from one user was "make it work!").

    In the right hands, it can be a useful device. My boss temporarily couldn't live without one. We've since ceased ordering (by way of amputation of the purchase order process at the knees) and are *now* evaluating the devices. From my eval of the items, I saw they had a few ok applications, were very finicky as to syncing up with email (we run GroupWise, which Palm's *really* don't like), and the Palm Desktop software wasn't the most stable in the world. Right now, we don't support *any* devices for the end users until we decided what is ok for our environment.. much to the wincing and grumbling of several vice presidents downstairs.

    Personally, I see it as a game machine, and electronic planner. The interface just isn't that good for any higher end applications that are being developed, such as a word processor, or spreadsheet. Even email seems to really not be it's thing. If it just had a notepad, calculator, and calendar/planner, it'd be complete (IMHO).. which amazingly we had in Windoze 3.x.
  • I am constantly buying books and CDs. Since I got my Palm III, I now have a list of all 13,000 books and 1000 CDs I own in my pocket, and never waste money on a duplicate.
  • I have big hands and you're right, the GoType is pretty small. But it gets the job done. My major complaint is that I can't simultaneously connect the GoType and a serial modem, so PilotIRC is pretty much useless... :-)
  • Most of what I use my palm v for I could very easily use a boring old pen and paper organizer for. I could write down my meetings and classes, friends' birthdays, and jot down notes faster than I can in graffiti. But I don't want to! I love technology and gadgets, and I like to use them as much as possible. Writing down homework assignments in a college-ruled notebook is a chore for me, but busting out my palm v and interacting with a tiny computer in the middle of class or in a meeting is fun. That is why my palm pilot is becoming indispensable to me.
    That and the fact that all my friends are jealous...
    oh, and the games :)
  • When someone begins selling a paper organizer that contains a scientific calculator, has a programmable alarm, can beam contact info to other organizers, contains a checkbook ledger that automatically tabulates totals and manages multiple accounts, and fits in my front pocket, then I might take this article seriously.

  • Cc: briody@infoworld.com

    In your article [cnn.com] which I read at CNNin, you claim that the Pilot is little more than a trendy, expensive day-planner. I respectfully disagree. While I cannot speak for all of the Pilots out there, I can certainly present my experiences.

    • The Palm V is smaller than any day-planner I've seen.
    • Having a current calendar, in sync with our corporate calendar (OnTime), is a life-saver. You can argue that the pen-and-paper route only takes a few seconds longer; I'd rather spend my time doing more important things.
    • Let us not forget the difficulty of "upgrading" a day-planner. Inserting the new calendar year, and rewriting many of my notes does not sound like fun.
    • What if the planner is lost? No backup. If my Pilot is lost - God forbid - I have all the data safe on my desktop PC.
    • I keep a current list of movie show times and locations on my Palm V for play. If I want to see a movie, I can figure out the where and when effortlessly. See Showtimes [visionart.com].
    • I keep current fishing reports on my Palm V. When I drive out of town over the weekends, it is a boon to have all of the info at my fingertips. If a lake is dry, we set our sights elsewhere. See AvantGo [avantgo.com].
    • Speaking of the outdoors, when camping last week, after our flashlights ran dry - oops - my Palm V's backlight allowed us to build a fire. Not exactly the typical use, but when in a pinch, we have to make do with the tools at hand. :-)
    • I am a Systems Analyst. I maintain 40+ accounts on 20+ machines. Each of those passwords, root or otherwise, changes once/month. To memorize that many passwords is impossible. Storing them in a day-planner is insecure. Storing them encrypted on a Pilot is a Good Thing.

    You argue that the company ends up paying for these devices. Not mine, I spent all $449 out of my pocket.

    You also argue that it is the IT dept. that gets saddled with supporting these devices. Not mine; if it breaks, I fix it. I have fixed it every time it's broken, and have had to restore from backups twice. There isn't much a hard reset and full restore won't cure.

    I hope I've convinced you that the Palm Pilot is not just a glorified day-planner, gameboy, or status-symbol.

    Yrs,
    Joshua

  • Computers enable someone to be more productive, but they also enable people to waste time on tasks that look like work, but do not add to the bottom line.

    At an assignment I once had, I was tasked to produce briefing slides weekly summarizing the maintenance complex work from the past week, and current status of equipment. Everything had to be letter perfect and in the approved format. Prior to computers, this task had been done in felt tip pen on an overhead projector slide. Which method was productive and which was eyewash?
  • I would advise you to hang onto your Palm. I've lost mine twice and had to buy a new one. Pain in
  • Handspring is a new, *more* simplified handheld coming from a company created by the original founders of Palm Computing before it was bought by USR which was later bought by 3Com.

    For more fluff, check here [handspring.com].


  • I got onto this thread a bit late, which has allowed me to browse and read a majority of the articles.

    It seems like the wisest message that comes through is that it all depends on the users. It really makes little sense for someone to declare the Palm Pilot a toy if it is a toy for them. Clearly, they are essential for some people, not so essential for others.

    I personally don't believe that anyone should be so wrapped up in slapping a label on it either way. It really serves no purpose in the end and it tends to cause arguments that really cannot be resolved because of their totally subjective nature.

    I have not bought a Palm Pilot yet because I don't feel I really need one. I am Master's student right now, and my lifestyle really doesn't call for strict time management (although mine could certain improve). Does this preclude the usefulness of PDAs? Obviously not. My room-mate has one and makes great use of it. Does this mean I will be a more productive person if I get one? No.

    Now, as far as the IS support entailed when a company encourages the use of PDAs goes, I think this is an example of how corporations in general jump on technological bandwaggons without critically evaluating the impacts their policies make. No doubt, encouraging Palm Pilots might result it the "waste" of resources if there is no money to provide the necessary support. However, this is a problem, as I mentioned, with corporate policy setting not with anything inherent in the device itself.
  • what's the checkbook app you use? i've been looking for a good one for ages :-(

    amit
  • well, I have tiny midget hands, so it was actually better for me than a normal keyboard. even though I type very fast, I still have to occasionally look at the keyboard, since my hands move more than people with normal hands have to... almost flunked typing class for that :)

    Leas
  • Two functions I do not think anyone has mentioned: the Palm III makes a wonderful ebook, and, with the proper cable, a serial terminal.

    So instead of carrying a pocket calculator, I have a Palm that is the same size and wieght as a calculator, an interactive ASCII chart, a serial terminal, and a collection of ebooks.

    And this is a toy?
  • That's why I sold my PalmPro about six months ago. I wanted one so bad and when I bought it, I carried it religiously for about a month, then I ended up letting it sit around on my desk. It's handy and all, but most of the time, I never used it.

    I can remember most of my important appointments, numbers, and email addresses. Phone numbers aren't a problem because I can store them on my cell phone. Email addresses are easy for me to remember, and if I forget an appointment or date, it probably wasn't all that important...hehe. Seriously though, maybe if I were in business or something, I'd find a better use for it. I guess the PalmPro doesn't fit my stereotypical University CS Majoring, part-time sysadmining, unorganized lifestyle.

    Frankly, I just don't like carrying organizers around with me all the time.

  • (Mildly off-topic) I had great fun with a Palm Pilot for several months, but I'm a clumsy person and I kept dropping it. USR and 3Com very graciously fixed it for free twice, but the third time I decided it was too annoying to deal with the down-time.

    More recently, I saw a velcro wrist-strap thing for the Pilot. Has anybody tried this? Does it work well in real life? The idea of strapping the thing to my wrist would be appealing.

  • Posted by The Devout Capitalist:

    You ask "why should management care"? Well, management cares because of the old fashioned values: money, money and money.

    While at a major Silicon Valley company, I set up dozens of PalmPilots for salespeople, various vice presidents, and such and got them to synchronize with the Solaris calendaring system. The IS departments wouldn't help, and I always help out a VP. The short version is that I spent about $10,000 of my time supporting those cheap devices.

    So the PalmPilot is an electronic tool. Like most electronic tools, it quickly requires instruction, infrastructure, experts, and time to keep running. It's worth evaluating these tools in terms of the productivity they bring.

    And don't underestimate HandSpring! Donna and Jeff made the first round of devices usable. If they can double the rate that a user can use them, and halve the amount of random hassle, then they will succeed again.
  • If someone started taking my computing devices away from me one at a time, the PalmPilot would absolutely be the last one remaining. Seriously, I'd give up e-mail and the web (at least in their rich forms) before the PalmPilot. It's that useful.

    Don't get me wrong, other computers are useful too, but in different ways - they serve very different purposes. The Palm(Pilot) is fundamentally different because it's form factor leads you to carry it with you pretty much everywhere, just because there's no downside to doing so. (My wife laughs at the boxy mark showing up on the front left pocket of all my jeans - it's kind of the 90's equivalent to the kickers' Skoal-can ring, I guess.) That fundamentally changes the way you'll start to use information. Graffiti isn't ideal, but it does a good job - I can Graffiti at a passable rate, esp. with the addition of extensions to customize the recog. engine.

    But really, it's incredibly valuable to have a decent amount of information (and in compressed ASCII, a few MB is a lot) with you at all times. It's reminder functions are great, too, especially with some choice replacements for some of the 3Com default apps. (ToDo+, RPN, Hacks, etc.) Those who think it's a toy have not really *used* it enough (or well enough, which does require addl. S/W) to see its value.

    Signed - Drooling while waiting for the Qualcomm PDQ from Sprint... (PDQ: PalmPilot and CDMA PCS phone in one!)
  • The author of the article says that he can't imagine people being more useful with a Palm than with a Daytimer and a laptop, which completely ignores the fact that laptops cost at least twice what even the Palm 5 and the modem cost. Daytimers are also expensive and bulky, and I know many people who have paid for (or had the company pay for) the really expensive classes on how to use their daytimer. Paying $450 ($350 at some websites) for a computer that fits in my pants pocket, does all the stuff the laptop and daytimer do plus some, and that I can also play games on, what more can I ask for? I can easily see within 10 years everyone having a handheld system that will put even today's desktop computers to shame and laptops happily relegated to our memories.
  • Do Palm Pilots make you more productive? In and of themselves" No. Not anymore than a dictionary makes you a better writer. (But at leest u cun spel. :-)

    Productivity is a hard one to measure anyway. Kust ask Alan Greenspan and the Fed. who are just beginning to realize that wealth is not only measured by the number of cars and refrigirators you own and the health of the economy is not measured by how many cars and refrigirators you make.

    The benefits of productivity don't begin until you use your Palm Pilot to save yourself some time with looking up data or to eliminate re-entering data.

    Then they save you something priceless. Something wich even Bill Gates can't afford to buy. They save you time.

    They may be great toys but their usefulness begins with, uh, their utility.

    -Charles-A.
  • The other day, I saw some young kids huddled over a legal notepad. They seemed very intent on what they were doing. It's summer vacation -- were they studying outside of school? Were they sharing profound insights on the nature of the universe?

    After further investigation, I found that they were playing an obsolete children's game, "Hangman."

    This incident solidifies the support for a theory I've long held: "Legal" notepads are nothing more than a way to carry your graffiti around with you.

    Let's face it, you see these things everywhere. Companies buy bazillions of them for their employees. Any lawyer found without at least three legal pads in their briefcase could be summarily disbarred. And yet, what benefit do they really provide? Do they really increase productivity? Answer honestly, now: how many of your most productive moments have even been near a legal pad, much less actually using one?

    Let's take a typical employee carrying a legal pad and follow him for one day to see if the pad makes him more productive. The first thing he does when he gets to work is check his email -- amazingly, leaving the pad sitting on the side of his desk all the while. After deleting the 37 spam emails, responding to the two critical ones from his boss, and filing the rest into neat electronic stacks, he moves on to ancient technology. He picks up his legal pad, and checks his voice mail. He scribbles a couple names and numbers down on the pad, and then calls those people right back to leave messages on their voice mail.

    Whoops! It's time for the morning meeting already! Grabbing the pad, he rushes to the conference room. He takes detailed notes as the supervisor presents the current project status for all projects ("avoid Bill this week"), the Quality Improvement Committees being set up ("GET MILK!"), and the company's business prospects ("update resume").

    Having committed these detailed notes to indelible storage, our hero returns and deposits the legal pad in its place of honor on his desk. Surrepetitiously, he checks out Slashdot, reads a couple topics, and posts a couple replies, all the while not touching his legal pad. After creating and printing a couple memos, he gets down to the real work at hand. Staring intently at his computer screen and moving his hands incessantly between the keyboard and the mouse, he occasionally stops, picks up his pencil, and jots little things down on his conveniently placed notepad. "12450385 - 32" "335 -> better" "BUT HOW?"

    Finally, it's time to go home. He picks up the pad and stares at the disconnected little phrases. He can't even remember what most of them mean, so he tears off the top sheet of his legal pad, wads it up, and tosses it into his wastebasket. (Of course, more slovenly employees often just wrap the sheet around to the back of the pad, but our hero is nothing if not conscientious.) Then he drives straight home, forgetting the milk that his wife told him to pick up.

    You may crave legal pads. You may even come to depend on them. But in the end, you're better off without them. They do nothing more productive than attracting graffiti. And I'll bet that your company is spending a lot of time and effort getting just the right legal pads -- think of the complexities! Should the company standardize on yellow (traditional) or white (progressive)? Is it acceptable to use an 11" legal pad for storage purposes, or must we remain with the 14"? What about the binding -- plastic-bound pages tend to fall of with extensive wear, but tear-off pages don't nicely fold to the back of the pad.

    As you can see, legal pads do not add to productivity in the workplace, and provide many opportunities to waste time and energy.

    If you are in the business of looking important, then by all means carry and use a legal pad. But if you are in the business of staying in business, then you might want to keep an eye on the glorified etch-a-sketches.

    Now, it is true that a vanishingly small group of people use legal pads to actually do work rather than just scribbling isolated snatches of useless information. But that usually occurs only when proper legal pad procudure is taught and strictly enforced by the company. Rarely will you see productive use of legal pads without this level of control.

    So I already know that you love your legal pad, and think that you could not do without it. But what I want to know is, do you really need it? Can you prove that it increases your productivity?

  • The ubiquitous Anonymous Coward asked me whether I meant something like the Landware keyboards, which I had in fact never heard of before.

    Actually, I'd prefer a turn-key solution with a Twiddler. (See the handykey site [handykey.com] for more details.

    There is a driver available for the Pilot, and wiring instructions on how to make a cable / power-supply for it. So far, both are out of my idiot's grasp of technology. If anyone wants to put together a cable adapter/ battery-power box for these and sell it (with the driver on disc included) for less than 25 bucks, I will take them up on it. One caveat: it should not involved cutting the original cables, because I want to be able to use the Twiddler in both environments.

    I don't even have a palm pilot yet, but I would if I could do that with it. I just went on a trip in fact where even my tiny NEC LT 120 laptop would have been too big for my economy-class seat on Delta.

    All that aside, these Landware keyboards are a very smart idea, though! I like the integrated cover / angled holder, integrated serial port etc. Only trouble is how small they look. I know some people like the little keyboard, but honestly I hate even the iMac keyboard I'm called upon to use at work, and it's not really *that* little.

    timothy

  • I just have to chime in here. My pilot has clearly boosted my productivity. I am a lawyer (boo, hiss) and a BIG part of my job is keeping track of my billable hours. Talk to most any lawyer in private practice and you will hear complaints about how inconvenient and time-consuming it is to keep track of billable hours.

    When I got a Pilot, I sat down and wrote a program for it that I could use to easily, and almost automaticlly, keep track of my billable hours as they happen. Because I wrote it, I was able to make it dovetail with my firm's (horribly inconvenient and poorly thought-out) time-tracking software.

    What used to take up a significant amount of time every day has been reduced to a minor task every few days. While my system is not yet fully automated, I enjoy being able to revise the program periodically to further reduce the burden of keeping track of my time. To me, that is the attraction of not only the Pilot, but all computing devices -- that I can write a program to alleviate the repetitive, boring tasks in my life.

    None of this even addresses the many times that the Pilot's built-in functionality has saved my butt by reminding me of an important meeting I had forgotten, allowed me access to information I would not have otherwise had handy, etc.

    Some people may not become more productive by getting a Pilot, but I definitely did.

    -Steve
  • The article's author presumes that just because one boy is playing games on his father's Palm V then all PDA users must be playing games with theirs. Interesting logic!

    He summarizes that that the good old Daytimer is all that anyone would ever need. That may have been true 20 years but in most large organizations, that no longer is true.

    My employer has used office automation technology for as long as I've worked for them, approaching 20 years. This goes beyond the typical word/document processing technology originally targetted towards secretaries. One of the most fundamental and difficult office automation tasks that is performed is keeping a calendar. It used to be just principals (executives and key managers) that concerned themselves with calendars and they had secretaries to manage those. The rest of us peons didn't worry about that. Over time, however, that changed. More meetings involving more people (remember matrix organizations?) required more individual calendars to be kept. More problems with keeping up with all of the meetings that got scheduled were generated. Just notifying potential attendees, without the benefit of email, became a daunting challenge. And, you want them all to show up, too?

    Office automation in the form of centrally accessed calendaring systems integrated with email became the hottest mainframe applications around. Office automation suite applications such as IBM's PROFS (or DEC's All-In-One) single-handedly justfied the acquisition of a very large number of computer systems.

    Today, my PalmPilot integrates with MS Exchange and MS Schedule+, my employers mandated email and calendaring system. Most employees are required to use MS Exchange to send/receive email and all employees are required to use MS Schedule+ for calendaring. Because of the software integration between my desktop system and my PalmPilot, I can quickly coordinate my MS Schedule+ calendar with my PalmPilot calendar, all without typing or writing anything in! If I do make an appointment outside of reach of MS Schedule+ by writing it into my PalmPilot, it automatically goes into my Ms Schedule+ calendar when I HotSync.

    It seems obvious to me that, by spending some of my own money and time to integrate the PalmPilot system into my office desktop system, I greatly increase my instant access to an accurate, up-to-date calendar at greatly reduced time and effort. Isn't that considered a productivity boost?
  • Some people say its a tool that just happens to also be a toy. I'll say the opposite.

    I wanted one because it looked like a neat toy, and the desire for the latest toy is why I got it. But its value as a tool has surprised me. I didn't think it would be THIS useful.

    Yes, I guess I *could* do stuff by hand. But I don't. I dunno why. Whenever I took paper & pen to a meeting, I would just doodle (I kinda miss that, actually). Now I can not only take notes, but I can keep them in electronic form, which means they can searched!

    I can be anal retentive, and paper just couldn't do it for me. I'm probably closer to having a paperless office than anyone. I *love* having stuff electronically. I've saved every email I've sent since 1994. Disk space is cheap and glimpse is fast. I couldn't imagine what my office would look like if I kept that kind of stuff on paper, but it would be useless anyways. How would I ever find anything? Electronic documents can be indexed, cross referenced and searched effortlessly.

    Day planners are great if you're the ONLY one who needs to know your schedule. Desktop calendars are great if you spend all your time at your desk (and if you do that, what are you putting on your calendar anyways). With a pilot and Ical, I can both share my schedule and take it with me. If I lose my pilot, at least I haven't lost my schedule forever.

    Admittedly not work related, but I also find it useful when shopping. Sure I *could* take a pad and pencil with me everytime I go to the mall, but I don't. Nor would I remember to bring every note I ever took with me. With the Pilot, it (and every note) is ALWAYS with me. If I'm in the mall buying new pants and I stumble on a sale for something I've been shopping for, I actually have my notes (prices) from the last time I looked.

    I use HandyShop for groceries. It lets me mark the aisle of a product. When I run out, I click out how many more I wanna buy and next time I'm at the store, I sort by aisle and do everything in one pass.

    When my wife drags me to the fabric store, I don't mind anymore. In fact, it seems like the only time I really get to play PocketChess or Tank anymore. But before I get to the games, I usually spend my idle time reading web sites via the plucker. The plucker also has the entire Prime Time TV schedule, as well as the shows *I* want to watch, all thanks to The Gist.

    At night, I've been reading myself to sleep with a good ole Sherlock Holmes novel. I don't even keep my wife awake with a light on thanks to the back light.
  • > If it just had a notepad, calculator, and calendar/planner, it'd be complete (IMHO)...

    Have you even used a Palm Pilot? I'm finding my Palm V very nice with its memo pad and calendar. I'm able to see my weekly schedule anywhere I go. Since the Plam also has an address book application, I was able replace by big bulky Day Runner with my Palm V.

    I have also installed a small database application and have put my N scale model railroad rolling stock inventory into it. Now when I go to the model train store I can check to see to make sure I don't buy any rolling stock with the same roadname and number.

    Yes the ability to play a few games like Chess or Mine Sweeper is rather nice while waiting for a doctor appointment or something like that. :)

  • This article is a pure opinion piece. No studies are cited, just the opinion of a tired journalist who needed to meet a deadline. He didn't even bother to describe what gives the PDA its value.

    The people who get the most value out of the PDA's are those who find a bulky paper calendar/phone book/memo pad (e.g. a daytimer) too cumbersome and inefficient to make a useful addition to their daily life and work.

    I suppose one might try putting a daytimer in one's pocket (though I'd like to see the pants that support a pocket of that magnitude). I also suppose one could technically do a global search for a word or name in a daytimer, but most people can't afford the 10-20 minutes it takes to complete this task (which I have seen attempted; it's not pretty).
  • Computers increase our productivity by exactly the amount of time it takes to produce studies saying they don't.

    I find my PalmPilot very useful for taking notes. It's not that it's more efficient than paper, but if I put something on paper, it will get lost. But a PalmPilot is too expensive to lose, so I never lose my notes any more.
  • I have to disagree. My wife currently carries a three pound hunk of paper, steel and canvas from Franklin-Quest that serves the same purpose as an eight ounce Palm Pilot but requires more work on the user's part (not to mention being a hazard to my kneecaps when we are walking side-by-side). While she may not become much more productive by switching to a Palm Pilot, she would surely look more professional for the lack of luggage.
  • I don't know about more productive than the alternative, but it certainly weighs less.

    Besides a day player, I would have to carry around a watch, calculator, tuning fork, a couple of books, and various reference sheets, to get close to what I have on my pilot, and I still would not have the audible reminders and games.

    And the search function is faster than flipping through pages in a daytimer.
  • The arguments made here are more or less the same as were made for personal computers 15 years ago. For some people, they are lifesavers, for others, toys, and to even more, both. Back then, pcs were for accounting, wordprocessing, games, and storing your recipes. That what makes computers great in the first place.

    ie. this is a moot argument.


    -S. Louie
  • Corporate America! Raise your hands and join me and my Company - Spunk-ko! We are going to revolutionize the way your emplyees work by creating a PDA that won't suffer from all that crap that your employees will stuff onto a stinkin' PalmPilot or WinCE machine.


    The amazing part of our revolutionary new product, entitled, the Spunk-o-nator, is that it is completely closed source. You want to make a program for the Spunk-o-nator 1000? Tough nookies! The source will only be available to a select few such as the holy RMS, Masta Malda and Bill Gates, the three of which are the only people on the earth capable of deciding what applications are needed for your upmost productivity.


    Excited? Interested? Intrigued? Disgusted? Don't worry, with only our idea and .30 cents in the bank, we will be going public soon! Look for us on the NYSE - ticker SPERM.


    For all the best, for the total control over those mindless zombies you call pets... oh we mean employees (wink, wink) Trust Spunk-O


    Corporate Home Page of Spunk-O Systems [nerdstuff.net]
  • I think that we can easily dispense of the notion that the article is directed at slashdot readers as a whole. I'd think that we (as a group) are much more technically oriented than the average corporate employee.

    Unfortunately, the average corporation is composed mostly of average corporate employees. The people that have trouble running win95. If you're in any large organization, half the staff won't have a clue, and the babysitting required to bring Palms (or any new hardware, or any new software) into widespread use really should give one pause.

    You know those checkboxes when you sign for free stuff, where you state your role in making a corporate decision? Being a real decision maker isn't just being the person who decides; it's being the person who has to live with the decision. I'd really have to think hard before bringing Palm Pilots into my organization. Hand them out to the technical staff - great idea. Other people? Ummm ... maybe not.
  • Well, I'm 6'3" with large hands and I have no troubles typing 60wpm+ on my gotype keyboard... (true, that's a 33% cut from my normal typing speed)

    Sure, it might not be for everyone, but it IS possible to achieve relatively speedy input on a gotype, and so, if you can, do try it. It's worth the money for most.

    -ehfisher

  • Re:Eh. (Score:1)

    by Hallow ( 2706 )
    go to http://wwww.landware.com [landware.com] - check out the GoType! keyboard.

    I have one. They ROCK. Instead of carrying around 5 different notebooks at school, I have 5 different categories in memopad. I can touch type on it. I can email my notes to friends, save them, print them out, back them up. Very nice.

  • bah- you're a notes user... what do you know about ease of use?
  • I, like many geeks, and chronically disorganized. I forget things I promised to do, forget appoints, forget shopping lists, forget little notes.

    I tried, dutifully, a little dayminder notebook for several years. It was an improvement. But I'd forget to look at it every day, it couldn't alert me that I had an appointment in 15 mintes, and when I took long notes in it that inevitably needed to be transcribed into a computer, I got irritated.

    Then Palms walk into my life. The Palm III changed my life. It beeps to remind me of appointments. I put digital things I want to read on it, and put notes I want on my computer on it. It's small convient and has made me much more organized.

    All in all, it's the right tool for me.

    But.

    To be far, I have yet to meet someone for whom their Palm was really useful in a business setting. I suspect there are people for whom it is useful, but amoung the roughly 15 Palm/Pilot owners I know, none really use it for anything work related. We use it to manage our personal lives.

    My point: First, the article may be right, for businesses, in many situations, Palms probably aren't terribly useful. Second, for a disorganized geek, I swear by mine, and strongly recommend it to others.

  • This was journalism?? The only "users" he referenced were people who used Pilots as toys, and from that infinitesimal sample population he deduces that NOONE who owns it uses it productively?? C'mon.

    To keep it brief: I used a Franklin Planner religiously, and this is what drove me to buy my first Palm III. As a Systems Administrator, I didn't just keep appointments and to-dos in it: I took lots of technical notes that I need to reference at a later date; sometimes more than half a year later (when those pages have been removed and filed away). The full search capabilities are what originally sold me on the Pilot: not games (I don't even play games on my REAL computer). The appointment reminders, and ability to sync up with my desktop were just icing on the cake.

    THEN I lost my Palm III. After two weeks I bought a new one, synched it with my desktop and voila: one and a half years of appointments, to-dos, contacts, notes -- all restored. Then last week, my hard drive died on my desktop!!! No worries, mate: after rebuilding my boot disk and reinstalling (ugh!) Outlook, I now synched from my Palm to my desktop. TA-DA!! Nearly 300 contacts, with addresses, e-mail addresses, names, businesses, phone numbers, notes, to-dos, recurring appointments -- all restored.

    I have a spreadsheet program (quicksheet) and project software (minimal, but effective) on my Palm. I BUILD the spreadsheets ON THE PALM, and upload them to the desktop for distribution. My hour-long commute is now the first hour of my workday as (thanx to public transportation), I can compose and review e-mail, create and fine-tune spreadsheets, map projects, outline long-term goals, review on-line documents (thanx to Teal Doc).... so, just a substitute for pencil and paper?? AS IF!!

    Perhaps this supposed writer ought to have interviewed some PRODUCTIVE PEOPLE, instead of slackers who play antiquated video games on a $300 dollar tool....
  • Is this a true judge of the worth of technology??

    Have computer designed vehicles saved lives while simultaneously reducing the cost of prototyping?? Have computerized farming techiques increased production? Yes!!

    Is the world better off for television, radio, portable CD players, video games, digital watches, automatic ice-makers, cruise control, premium ice cream?? I... don't think so; but I don't argue that they are useless.

    As well as avoiding "luddite v. hi-tech" arguments, let us also avoid arguing unrealistic extremes in an attempt to invalidate. Clearly the discussion of palmtop computing devices has no relevance to starving third world inhabitants: but neither does this Internet based electronic forum...
  • I think this guy real problem is organizational, as in the companies he's refering to. There's a little thing in the biz people call scope creep. i.e. If you company doesn't support Palm Pilots, it's out of the scope of the helpdesk. Deal with the vendor.

    Personally I live by my Palm. With all the Vendors and contacts I have to track. I laugh every time I get in a race with my manager to find a number. Him in his Franklin and me in my Palm. The fact is that he always looses.

    Like everything, the Palm is not for everyone. But after watching my girlfriend snatch mine out of my hand the moment I opened the box and proceed to enter her address, without my assistance, I was amazed. Now my girlfriend is a technophobe, so my only explination is that the fact that it looks like a toy helped it sneak under her panic radar. No wonder Apple wants to get it's hands on this this. (That and I've been in Newton vs Palm debates before.)

    Donncha love micro management?
  • I don't know whether they really help with productivity, but I bought
    mine to help me get on top of all the issues involved with starting a
    new job: buying a car (and dealing with all of the paperwork,
    inspections, insurance, testing, and other headaches), keeping track of
    my new colleagues' contact information (especially e-mail addresses and
    pager numbers), appointments to interview new staff members, and so
    forth. I would have been lost (and probably in trouble with the government!) without it.

    (I also loaded an application that allowed me to generate the
    necessary repsonses to skey challenges, needed to access the Linux box
    that controlled access to the network from outside, which meant that I didn't need to worry about whether the equivalent application was available on any random machine I had to use. Very handy.)

  • Heck, that guy should have thought a little more before writing a spacefiller like that.

    For one, the ability to upload your notes/accounts/data onto your PC is one productivity booster that just cannot be denied.

    Having used a Palm3 for a while now, and with a hand writing like mine (which under meeting pressure just degenerates), I can honestly say that pen and paper will never work for me again. And just about everyone I know who owns a PDA confirms this.

    Secondly, even if PDAs were used for amusement, remember that even the venerable PC is used by a large percentage of users for games. Does that make the PC a toy - because you play with it?

    If size does matter, maybe the author should have thought of "Walkman v/s Wall2Wall stereo" before jumping to conclusions that just because it is small and doesn't cost a bomb, it's usefulness is limited.

    I'd say that my Palm3 is a *TOOLtoy* - something that can entertain while being extremely useful too. And that's far better than some *TOYtools* I have come across.

    /toolz
  • I's prefer to think that computers improve productivity, but to be honets, I doubt it.

    I admit, computers make the life for the users easier (when they don't have to much problems or lack knowladge to use them).

    When you look at the investment of work that is needed to build and operate the computers, educate the users and admins, construct usefull setups and all the other related work, I suspect even a small drop in efficienty.

    But hey, I'm a sysadmin having fun playing with my toys, ranging from a simple PC to a nice RS6000 cluster. The best part is, I'm getting paid for having fun.

    Without computers I would have to do a 'real' job. Yuck. ;-)

  • Well, I don't have a Palm, but I have a Psion 5 instead. I prefer the Psion 5 because it has a real keyboard and can do a bit more stuff than the Palm, but both of them share more or less the same basic concepts so this message applies to all PDAs.

    These devices can do much more than a paper notebook. For example, I have yet to see a paper notebook that beeps (or plays a fancy tune) to remind me about an appointement. Or one that wakes me up in the morning. Thanks to its keyboard, the Psion 5 is also very useful for taking notes. Sure, I could take these notes on paper, but then I would have to re-type them later on my PC anyway, because very often I have to include these notes in a document or to send them by e-mail to some colleagues. Instead of doing this, I can simply connect the little machine to my PC, transfer the notes and edit them.

    I can also connect the machine (Psion or Palm) to a mobile phone and access some information remotely while I am on a business trip. I admit that it takes a while if the documents are big, but this is definitely faster than trying to find a way to get these documents faxed to you.

    Sure, the usefulness of these devices depends very much on what you do for a living. Maybe some people would be more efficient with a pencil and paper. But when used properly, these tools are invaluable.

  • Some people would get nothing out of a PDA. I stuck to the pen&paper method for a long time but it had problems: you can't erase/edit anything, pages fall out or get lost, it's bulky, if alarms are needed you have to use a watch or other device, etc.

    Moving to a pilot was a huge boon. Aside from the fact that I could install all sorts of other useful software on it that I then didn't need to duplicate with other devices (sci. calculator, etc.), what it came with out of the box was a small, editable, readable-in-the-dark, unified method to keep track of everything and then some.

    Paper methods never worked in my quest for some semblance of organization -- this has.

    Perhaps the author of the CNN article wouldn't benefit from a PDA, but I do. I could care less about the geek glamour associated with the thing.
  • It may be "Definitely a tool" but the article points out, quite correctly, that too many people are just, er... "playing with their palms" (now THERE'S a Freudian term!) rather than being productive with them.

    Note that the article did point out some legitimate uses; it wasn't a blanket indictment, which some articles would have descended into. Much good thinking here, especially if you are in middle- to upper-management.
    --
  • You know what? That's okay. We're allowed to have fun. It seems like everything is becoming about utilizing every spare second of every single day.

    Agreed, and g&*%amnit I wish more people did too.

    But notice the focus of the article was on the IT manager's perspective: the costs of support may outweigh the usefulness to the company of having them around, and that, I suspect, is likely true.

  • I'm a palm V user, and the son of a Palm Pilot Professional user. My palm V is quite new, only a week old or so, and so I haven't had time to get incredibly productive with it. Still, it has already reminded me to do a few things (I love the todo list!).

    My mother is lost without hers. It keeps all her appointments, her rolodex, and her todo list. If she forgets it at home she's likely to miss a meeting or two, and spend lots of extra time trying to remember or look up a phone number or address. Also, when she needs a break, she plays WordBox (boggle) for a few minutes.

    For me it will probably be a very even combination. As soon as the palm V gotype! keyboard comes out, I'm purchasing one. My handwriting is terrible (as is my mothers, which is why she often can't read appointments she wrote on paper an hour or two later), and I am notorious for not taking notes because of it. (I always lose the notes, get frustrated at how disorganized they are, and often can't read what I wrote).

    So in classes next fall it won't be a rare occurrence to see ol' gleam typing away taking notes on his palm V, and maybe playing a game or two during a study break.

    Also, the huge number of applications available for the palm make it much easier to get more work done. Actioneer is wonderful for things like a conference call, where you enter the conference call and it adds it to the todo list and links it to the address book so you know the numbers of who you're about to call. (someone correct me if i'm wrong about this).

    Indeed, the pda is the ideal tool for those of us who have bad handwriting and are very disorganized... it gets us in line, and it makes notes useful again!

    -ehfisher
  • Hey , anyone remeber long long ago ... before calculators ? There were room fulls of accountants and all they really did was fill in ledgers all day and cross check each others work. I know there are still rooms full of accountants but they generally serve a much larger function . Spreadsheets , if nothing else , have drasticalluy reduced the amount of work keeping track of large volumes of numbers . The volume of information that is kept in motion around a company like caterpillar could NOT have been handled by ANY large room full of people .
    NOw , of course , Kumatsu also has used computers . SO where is the advantage ? It get's passed stragiht onto the buyer ( slowly to be sure but it does get there ) The average home being lived in is nearly 1.23 times the size of the homes lived in not more than 30 years ago .
    Anyway th eincrease in efficency is well known . If these studies actually reflected the truth then any company could turn of their computers and stay competitive . Of course THEY realize thast they can't possibly do this , so oyu tell me : Hav ecomputers made them more productive . Big business says a resounding YES .
    I think it may still be a few years before the personal computer makes anyone significantly more productive . It takes time to learn how to make the most out what you have .
    Your Squire,
    squireson
  • > If it just had a notepad, calculator, and calendar/planner, it'd be complete (IMHO)..

    WTF? It does have a notepad, calculator, and calendar/planner. Maybe your users have been ordering GameBoys and calling them Palm Pilots...

    Jason Dufair
    "Those who know don't have the words to tell
  • So the writer sees a kid "playing games on his father's $449 Palm V" and uses that as the premise that Palm Pilots are toys? If the same kid was playing games on his father's PC would the logical conclusion be that it is just a toy also? How likely is it that the kid's father purchased a Palm V just so his kid could play games?

    He isn't addressing (no pun intended) the utility of the Palm Pilot at all. Sure, lots of people are buying them. They are great little devices that happen to be extremely flexible. Within a week of buying my first Palm Pilot I had unloaded all of the business cards from my wallet and entered the information into the Palm. All of my appointments were immediately entered into it as well.

    This thing has saved me a lot of grief. When going to remote sites to check on systems, I can look up the telephone extensions of various co-workers that I need to get in touch with. I take it to conferences and use it for notes, contact lists, schedule information, etc.

    If you own a Palm Pilot and are not any more productive than you were without it, then it's your own fault. This thing is a tool. If you choose to use it just for games, that's your choice. But it doesn't make it any less of a tool.

  • Tool for the absent-minded (Score:4)

    by Eric Green ( 627 ) on Wednesday June 30, 1999 @10:18AM (#1824861) Homepage
    My story:

    I resisted the Palm Pilot for literally years. "A waste of time", I said to myself. After all, in the past I've used Daytimers, rolodexes, and every other possible 'personal organization tool' and ended up leaving it at home because it was too bulky, too clumsy, and myself just too disorganized (grin). The only thing I really made use of was yellow post-it notes, which cluttered my office like multi-colored snowflakes, drifting hither and fro and eventually being thrown away when I got around to sifting through them and couldn't decode my cryptic notes on them.

    When a bunch of **** started happening and I was driving myself nuts trying to keep track of everything, I said "what the heck, let me try it". Well, I did. It does what it's supposed to do -- it sits on its little belt clip and works as an address book, postit-note tablet, to-do list, and calendar. There are Daytimers this compact, but they're clumsier to use -- e.g., you have to manually move your to-do list from day to day, and re-write it when you remove enough items from it to make it worthwhile, whereas the Palm does that automatically (if you so select!). Same deal with the address book.

    I also found an unexpected bonus: my checkbook is balanced now for the first time in literally years. I found a little program which solves the one big problem of Quicken and other such "personal finance" packages, which is -- you can't carry your computer with you to the store or ATM!

    I played a game or two on it once, but why? Usually it just sits there, waiting for when it's needed. Which is just what it's supposed to do. After all, as Monty Python said, "You never know when to expect the Spanish Inquisition!".

    And oh -- my office no longer is buried under drifts of yellow Post-It notes. Now, printouts are another matter (grin).

    -E
  • I just went on an 11-day trip with Pilot, Pilot modem, and GoKey. No laptop. I successfully stayed in touch with my email.

    Does it make me more productive? Maybe not. It lets me get away when I'd otherwise be tied to the office.

    Bruce

  • Counter-point. (Score:3)

    by Signal 11 ( 7608 ) on Wednesday June 30, 1999 @08:45AM (#1824890)
    : xyzzy
    Nothing happens.

    Seriously now, why is it that (some)managers maintain that by telling the worker both what to do and how to do it, they're making them more productive? That's what this article is saying.

    And it's an article without a point - why should management care? If they feel better using toys at work, great! I have a stuffed penguin sitting next to my computer. It makes me feel good. When I feel good, I do better at work. So if I need a $500 toy to feel good - what's it matter to you?

    The other possibility: it's a tool. Well, good for you if it is. I use a franklin planner, and it's cheaper than a palm pilot, and can do more. As an added bonus, my handwriting is encrypted so only I can decrypt it. :) But everybody has their own style of organization. Maybe a palm pilot fits their system better than more conventional stuff does.

    Bottom line: Some anal-retentive managers insist on micromanaging everything. This article is for them. For everybody else... just let us do our job.

    --

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