More Cooling/Overclocking Fun 69
heretic writes "Here's another construction article on cooling components down to -40. While not quite as insane as the mineral oil solution (heh), it's still quite extreme. For only $600, it's pretty neat that he can nearly double his processor speed. I guess these sorts of techniques will remain viable until we have massive N-way SMP. "
I hate to kill the fun but... (Score:1)
Slashdot never seems to bring this up, and yet cooling systems that rival refridgerators pop up every other day. Sigh.
Re:SMP (Score:1)
Re:Only if it leaks out. (Score:1)
Re:This guy has a screw loose (Score:1)
Hmm.
Re:145Watts (Score:1)
Or a Linux-box?
They render at approximately the same speed, with all other factors being equal.
IS Linux faster rendering than NT?
No.
I would assume (yeah, dangerous I know) that he would
be able to get the same savings and speed by running
Linux as his rendering box. Not to mention how much more
he would be able to take on after overclocking it at that point.
That assumption is incorrect. Switching from NT to Linux would have almost no effect on the rendering speed. It would certainly not double it.
Re:I still have R-12 (Score:1)
Umm, not it's not. Even in Phoenix, it's a luxury. Many hundreds of millions of people live in hotter locales and do not have air conditioning.
SMP (Score:1)
SMP has limitations. Once you get to a certian point you eat all your memory bus and can't expand any further. Dual Alphas is probably optimal. But to get the performance you want go to a multi *computer* architecture. I am investigating switching to a backplane system because I am sick of swaping out motherboards. Especially with intel's planned obsolessence. =( Concievably you could design processor cards that would have say 256 megs, and dual celeries that would be slaved off of your bus and you could run all your daemons and RC-5 off of them... =) It would probably use something similar to Beowolf.
Re:Deja Who? (Score:1)
Also, the version I saw was vastly cleaned up compared to this. I wonder if this is just a ripoff of that page...
2 x K6-2 450, 128MB $600 (Score:1)
This setup will free you modeling station for creative work.
But of course this will take the handyman do-it-yourself fun out of the equation.
______________________________________
Rendering speed (Score:1)
Re:Electricity (Score:1)
Deja Who? (Score:1)
Re:SMP (Score:1)
Compaq are also working on even bigger 64+ CPU Alpha machines with by interconnecting EV6 buses with a switching fabric, ie sets of 8 CPU's interconnected via EV6. And 4/8/16 sets of EV6 busses interconnected...
Switching fabrics are the way forward. Can't wait till technology from OC48 class routers get's used in PC chipsets!
Re:Electricity (Score:1)
Or for the price of an AMD K6-3 you can buy an 21164A 533MHz and clock it to 600MHz...
Re:Electricity (Score:1)
re: your question, some of us aren't
So 533MHz + UX = £600 -> $970. same price as a P-3 and cheap motherboard.
600MHz + UX = about £200 more than a P-3 and expensive board.
Prices in the US should be better than in the UK, check out www.alphalinux.org for links to dealers there. Or have a look on Ebay, there's people selling Alpha components there regularly.
-paul.
Re:145Watts (Score:1)
Anyway, I don't think that the OS will have any significant effect on the machine's rendering capabilities, since the OS isn't used much for that. But even if it does, that has nothing to do with what we're talking about.
---
Columbus was a lying bastard (Score:1)
No one with half a brain thought the world was flat in 1492. However, Columbus did fudge the numbers quite a bit to get Earth's circumference small enough to make a westward route to the East plausible. If the Americas hadn't gotten in his way, his voyage would have ended at the bottom of the ocean.
On the other hand, Eratosthenes measured the circumference of the Earth to pretty amazing accuracy about 1,500 years earlier.
600 bucks? (Score:1)
Sure it might be amusing to get a dual PII/620 machine going but I'm sure intel will be there soon anyway with room temperature processors and they'd probably cost $600 anyway..
Still, that said
Liquid Nitrogen (Score:1)
AC can be a necessity.. (Score:1)
Now, (and to bring it back around to on topic) you wanted to say that CPU super-cooling was not a necessity or that R12 Freon was not a necessity, you'd probably be correct.
I do wonder, though, whether or not hotter climates make computer operation impossible... in which case A/C would become a necessity - for productivity, thought not for survival.
Re:Only if it leaks out. (Score:1)
I was a dry heat though...
Re:I hate to kill the fun but... (Score:1)
Agreed on the energy thing though. The refridgerator is the most energy-intensive device in most homes. While computers have resulted in a drop in energy consumption as a whole (instant communications vs. snail mail/fax/delivery) they still have a long way to go before becoming true environmentally correct devices.
The six computers at home running 24/7 is evidence of my hypocrisy.
Re:This guy has a screw loose (Score:1)
::runs off, mumbling about "fucking morons"::
Re:Freon? (Score:1)
You can use butane or amonia instead....but it's illeagal to use them in Canada & the US....the ammounts needed were hazzardous 40 years ago...refrigeration technology has improved, but the laws haven't caught up yet.....
(where have I heard THAT before....)
This person is clearly extremely talented, (Score:1)
Re:Deja Who? (Score:1)
--neil
(ObContent: that was another zany cooling scheme. a considerably more zany one.)
Electricity (Score:1)
Freon? (Score:1)
Old. (Score:1)
Re:I still have R-12 (Score:1)
climate control ! (Score:1)
I'd settle for under 100F (Score:1)
How about temperature tolerant computer gear?
Re:It's not about cost. (Score:1)
Uhhh.... No
Then what will you want to do with those Alphas? (Score:1)
Re:I still have R-12 (Score:1)
Re:Beyond 620Mhz -Apha - HHAAA! (Score:1)
Re:Beyond 620Mhz -Apha - HHAAA! (Score:1)
If I never touch an Alpha again it'll be too soon.
Re:Cooling at a cost (Score:1)
Re:"hole in the ozon layer" ring a bell? (Score:1)
I'm fairly positive this is what was said but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.(I was over seven years ago when I read this.)
Re:I still have R-12 (Score:1)
R-12 isn't illegal at all... You have to be licensed to get it is all. The reasoning behind that, is to educate all the mechanics on proper handling, and to keep the "Shade Tree" mechanics from letting it out into the atmosphere.
Another thing, all they really did was stop producing R-12, but you can still get it in most all of your local parts stores. As a matter of fact, the demand has apparently dropped, since the price has dropped also. I have seen prices around $40 a can, and you can get it for about half now if you are certified.
And why would the Govt do this to us? Well, it sounds like something to boost the economy to me (or at least that is what they would have you believe). Look at all the expensive new parts and tools being manufactured!!
Re:Freon? (Score:1)
One thing is for sure, you would DEFINATELY know if there was a leak!!!
Re:Only if it leaks out. (Score:1)
Tomorrow? Its 1Ghz today (Score:1)
Steve 'Supercoolin' Foster
The peep who built the damn thing.
Beyond 620Mhz -Apha - HHAAA! (Score:1)
Conventional thinking is buy only whats out there. Real minds are never satisfied. Just think if Columbus had accepted that the world was flat, kinda like Intel wants you to believe they control how fast your computer will run.
And for you Alpha freaks, mainstream program for program, perforance v $$, not even close, and never will be. Support is crap fo Aplha software and hardware.
Supercoolin
Re:Electricity (Score:1)
Only if it leaks out. (Score:1)
In some places, A/C is a necessity, especially in areas of the world that experience hi summertime temps.
In a matter of fact, thanks to en nino and la nina, the tropics aren't the only areas that have to worry about heat waves. The temperature outside my apartment right now is about 110F degrees, which is above normal where I live(normal hi temps are in the mid-upper 80's, sometimes lower 90's, in the summer). Even with two fans, and the A/C, It's hovering around 82-84 degrees inside. Uncomfortable, but it's better than what's outside.
FYI, the only way that the refrigerant used will get anywhere near the ozone layer is if it leaks out of the unit. If your A/C is leaking, you better have a technician fix it. The refrigerants that are used have a nasty habit of being toxic in large enough quianties...
BTW, some time ago, I heard something about experiments in developing a cooling system that uses high frequency sound waves as the coolant, instead of the chemical coolants used today(I don't rember where I heard of it
AC isn't a necessity.. (Score:1)
Re:This guy has a screw loose (Score:1)
Sterling Engine? (Score:1)
cool a CPU? I know sufficiently powerful sterling
engines can liquefy helium (~4 degress Kelvin I think?)
discovered in the 50's (Score:2)
And of course, these are all ignored by those rabbidly eager to ban freon, and taken as proof that there's no problem (rather than an unknown answer) by those against the ban.
It's not about cost. (Score:2)
I mean, for all of you saying "he should've spent his money on an alpha", would you had rather loaded up a fairly boring page with pictures of an alpha box?
Sure, the costs and time involved in putting together a system as he did are fairly high. So is buying one alpha or xeon processor. Plus you wouldn't get the fun factor and enjoyment from tinkering around when you just slap down a few thousand on a typical high end system. At the cheapest, overclocking means taking some $50 celeron processor and juicing it up (usually with a few fans and a peltier unit) so that it runs faster than a $400 processor. The -40 C goal is to take advantage of properties of CMOS components when they get that cold (there's a graph of potential speed vs temperature at the hardocp [hardocp.com]). Once you hit low enough temperatures, you have the possibility of doubling the clock speed.
It's not going to be the same as spending $3000 on a high end xeon processor, but it's a lot more fun, something a lot of you are forgetting in the name of price.
Re:145Watts (Score:2)
Being able to take on more rendering projects would increase his pay... however...
What renders faster? an Empty-box (NT)
Or a Linux-box?
IS Linux faster rendering than NT?
I've never done any myself. (nor have I used NT)
Does only M$ stuff run the rendering software He uses?
I would be most curious to find out.
I would assume (yeah, dangerous I know) that he would
be able to get the same savings and speed by running
Linux as his rendering box. Not to mention how much more
he would be able to take on after overclocking it at that point.
Just curious
620 With 333s....what about tommarow? (Score:2)
145Watts (Score:2)
Figurative, not literal, freon :) (Score:3)
We now get R134a, which transfers substantially less heat. Don't convert your old R-12 a/c units unless you have to; post-conversion, they don't cool as much. You need a heat exchanger about 50% larger to get the same amount of cooling, and there just isn't room for this in your car. Mercedes switched early, and the result (at least if you lived in the desert) was a $60k car that couldn't cool itself down to comfortable temps . . .
Also, R134a has a nasty tendency that R12 didn't--under the right conditions, it can explode. Some time back, i read a snide op-ed piece suggesting an exploding refridgerator as the new symbol for the extreme-fringe of the environmentalists
Comment removed (Score:4)