Raspberry Pi 5 Announced (raspberrypi.com) 204
jizmonkey writes: The new version of Raspberry Pi is priced at $60 for the 4GB variant, and $80 for its 8GB sibling, and virtually every aspect of the platform has been upgraded. The new CPU is twice as fast and new features include simultaneous 5.0 Gbps USB 3.0 ports and a PCIe 2.0 x1 interface which can be used for an m.2 storage. Priority will be given to individual buyers through the end of the year.
Open Datasheets When? (Score:2, Interesting)
Open datasheets when?
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Screw datasheets.
Availability from non-scalpers when???
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The Pi was never about being open source. The Pi was designed to be built as cheaply as possible and be open with the schematics. It was designed as a tool for children to use and experiment with.
If you want fully open source silicon then you should be looking at RISC-V.
it's USB C dude (Score:4, Insightful)
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A USB-C charger is no more "high-tech" than a 12 volt power supply (and it's a lot easier to find a USB-C power supply than a 12 volt brick... every mini mart has USB-C chargers).
Re:it's USB C dude (Score:4, Informative)
>>12V, e.g. a car cigarette lighter, SLA battery, whatever, with a 2.1/2.5mm barrel jack is about the most generic power supply you can get.
The barrel jack you are probably describing is actually outside diameter 5.5 mm, inside diameter 2.1 mm, usually called DC5521 (a barrel connector with 0.2mm thick wall collapse under the lightest touch). DC5521 is common but hardly generic. There is also no guarantee that it will be 12V as those barrel jacks are also used for 15V and 18V, sometimes with center positive and sometimes with center negative. Picking the wrong one will end your fun quickly. Also common are DC5525 (5.5mm OD, 2.5mm ID) which look like they should work and plug into the socket but don't actual make a solid connection.
With USB-C PD you don't need to guess, it just works. Although most modern cars have USB-C sockets already you can get a USB-C/cigarette lighter adapter (which can also be hooked up to your SLA battery fairly easily).
Re: it's USB C dude (Score:2)
Dipshit, if your remote location has access to a Raspberry Pi, it has access to a usb dongle.
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Technically the 12V solar cells charging the 12V SLA battery packs did come from rocks.
Still no idea how that's supposed to get turned into USB-C, no matter what I buy from a store beforehand. All of these responses presuppose there's a standard 110/220V wall socket magically available anywhere you go to plug your USB-C power adapter into. This is rarely the case, which is why approximately-12V power is so universal ("approximately" meaning more like 9-18V via the DC/DC converter, so the system isn't pic
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I mean, DC - > USB-C adapters exist.
Here's one:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09H... [amazon.com]
And a lot of them will conveniently fit in most pockets.
I don't know what connector you've got out there connecting to those spontaneously evolved solar cells, but I'm sure there's a solution and that you're not the first person to have this issue since people have been standardizing on USB-C power delivery for a number of years now. I dunno, I'm pretty sure we have the same Google that can help turn this mountain you're maki
Re: it's USB C dude (Score:3)
PD doesn't just run at 5v. In fact, I have a little board that requests 12v out of a standard USBC PD plug. Put a couple resistors on the data lines and go to town with your car battery. Or maybe use something else vs complaining that a product that's not made for whatever your incredibly niche use isn't an exact fit for your super special needs.
Re:it's USB C dude (Score:4, Informative)
Raspberry Pi runs on 5V. If you can convert the voltage to 5V, you can connect it to the GPIO connector. I power a few RPis like that. As much as I dislike USB-C for its complexity, at least RPi has an alternate way of power it.
There is really no reason for them to make RPi run on 12V just to convert the 12V to 5V.
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It uses a USB-C connector which is way closer to a common standard than the dozens of barrel connectors out there. 27+ watt USB-C AC adapters are common and cheap. Hell, you can even order one straight from the manufacturer.
If you're using an underpowered cellphone charger to power a miniature computer, you're the one who screwed up.
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From TFA:
Gigabit Ethernet, with PoE+ support (requires separate PoE+ HAT, coming soon)
Not mini-pc class, more embedded class (Score:2)
... they're at their fifth generation and still trying to run a power-hungry mini PC ...
The Raspberry Pi is not really a mini-pc. Its roots are more from the embedded realm.
Who cares? Everything is OUT OF STOCK (Score:2)
Still even the old pi's are out of stock everywhere... Or you can pay a scalper 150 dollars for a pi3. No, this reached stupid... Pi is done for, as far as I care. What good is a product you can't buy?
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Still even the old pi's are out of stock everywhere... Or you can pay a scalper 150 dollars for a pi3. No, this reached stupid... Pi is done for, as far as I care. What good is a product you can't buy?
When I couldn't buy one some months back, they were unobtanium, and they had some whiny screed about how they simply had to serve the commercial people.
Funny how the Pi foundation, which had as it's mission to encourage people to learn about computers, abandoned those same people.
I can find other devices, so sorry Pi - looks like you need to just sell to commercial outfits - just take the no longer accurate learning to code and learning computers BS off your website, and figure out your new customer d
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Funny how the Pi foundation, which had as it's mission to encourage people to learn about computers, abandoned those same people..
Let me see if I understand you. The Raspberry Pi foundation designs SBCs and makes a limited number of them for educational purposes for young people. The foundation does not manufacture the vast amount of them for retail sales. You are not a young person who could not get one of these units in the retail market (that they did not manufacture). And you feel the foundation has abandoned their mission. Did I frame your grievance correctly?
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Funny how the Pi foundation, which had as it's mission to encourage people to learn about computers, abandoned those same people..
Let me see if I understand you. The Raspberry Pi foundation designs SBCs and makes a limited number of them for educational purposes for young people. The foundation does not manufacture the vast amount of them for retail sales. You are not a young person who could not get one of these units in the retail market (that they did not manufacture). And you feel the foundation has abandoned their mission. Did I frame your grievance correctly?
No, you did not. Have you ever bought one? At one time, they were to be purchased in many places. Young people bought them. Despite your ageist statement, old people bought them, the bastards! Hobbyists. Even people like me, that piss you off because I am alive.
I mean, since you made an entire story up out of whole cloth, I figure I can make up shit about you as well.
So really, knock it off, it makes you sound like a person just looking for something to get pissed off about, and the weirdest whatabouti
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How can I interface an ultrasonic sensor and H bridger driver to that?
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I've got 5 Pi's myself - none of which are running desktops. A few are running 3d printers (either Octoprint or Klipper). Another unit is setup as a middle-ware unit I use for SSH tunneling from outside my network. Another runs Kodi connected to my TV. Now, some of those are Zero's, and some are compute modules (and I've even got a few more running offbrand compute modules) - during the shortage you take whatever you could find.
You'll find that most people running Raspberry Pi's are doing things like tha
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I use RPis to either control something or to monitor something using the GPIO pins. The reason I use a normal RPi instead of zero or the compute module is that I need the network connection (usually wired, but WiFi is sometimes useful).
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There are certainly scenarios where rpi make a lot of sense if you truly need something VERY small and next to zero power consumption. But I think for most of what the slashdot crowd does with them, like NAS, media consumption, etc. they would be better served with something like an m700 that is anywhere from four to 10 times (or more!) more powe
People are angry (Score:2)
I honestly can't blame them. Lower stock means lower sales and with the margins they operate under that could just as easily put them out of business. They could continue to cater to the hobbyist market and jack up prices to match what they made o
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Sure, you can buy them from a scalper at 50% over MSRP... just like you could buy a high-end graphics card in a similar manner during the crypto mining boom on Amazon as well.
That doesn't make it ideal. though.... unless you're the scalper who's making the extra profit.
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Have you looked lately? Digikey literally has thousands of Raspberry Pi 4Bs in stock. The days of being backordered are long gone.
The ones most people want are the cheap 2 GB model, and there are 0 in stock. But yes, they finally did get some 4 GB and 8 GB units in stock, and now that they've announced the Pi 5, demand will dry up somewhat.
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I just looked at the price history and realized that I was remembering wrong. The $35 price was originally for the 1 GB model, and the 2 GB model was $45. At some point, the price of RAM dropped, and they dropped the 1 GB model and started selling the 2 GB model at that price. Unfortunately, because of the severe shortages, they raised the MSRP for the 2 GB model back up to $45.
That means two things. First, that $50 price is really only about $5 more than the current MSRP. Second, at $50, you might as
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https://chicagodist.com/collec... [chicagodist.com]
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...but for how much longer? As word continues to get out that you can find RPi hardware at MSRP, who in his right mind would pay what the scalpers are still trying to charge?
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Too little, too late (Score:2)
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Competitors have caught them and then surpassed specs/prices of the 5 as well.
I tried out the Le Potato for 35 or so dollars. Works fine, and I got it in two days. Pi abandoned us for commercial interests. Their path forward is now upping their prices to whatever point the business interests will support. We don't need them any more.
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Can you recommend one that can run Linux? I've got a Raspberry Pi 1b for robotics projects, and I've been planning to upgrade. I see the Pi 5 has a fan though, which is a problem for me since it has to operate in a closed environment with little airflow.
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The fan is optional. In general, the newer device runs cooler than the previous device. Unless you're crunching heavy loads, the heat sink of all Pis is just fine. As the fine article states, even the Debian (linux) OS is being updated for this hardware.
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You're right, that ship has sailed.
We've moved to the new PINE64 variants and the Orange Pi line.
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Sort of. You can find cheaper than the Pi yes, but not usually at similar specs. You can also find faster than the Pi, but its usually going to be more expensive or much larger/bulkier. A lot of them also just don't have the software support that the Pi does.
Particularly when factoring in the Pi Zero devices, Pi is a very good balance of performance, price, size, and efficiency.
And yes I've had to try some alternatives during the shortage too. For several 3d printer projects I used the BTT CB1 instead o
The race for specs (Score:2)
This is great, an outstanding achievement that will make the RPI far more usable as a PC. But I can't help but think the RPI has lost its soul a little.
I would have liked to see something more experimenter friendly - eg. Add a in-house developed FPGA with an open source toolchain, or some of the interesting features from the pico like the IO processor, or even an AI-related core.
I think the platform was intended to fuel education and it seems that ground has been ceded to lower end devices now, like the mic
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I would have liked to see something more experimenter friendly - eg. Add a in-house developed FPGA with an open source toolchain, or some of the interesting features from the pico like the IO processor, or even an AI-related core.
Or even analogue audio out which is actually really handy for experimenter stuff. Nope. They caught the Apple disease.
They've got other models (Score:2)
Aren't FPGA's still really pricey? I don't really pay much attention to them to be fair. I know the ones used for the Mister project are an arm and a leg ($300+) but I think those are overkill for regular hobby projects.
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Aren't FPGA's still really pricey?
No. The biggest FPGAs are and always have been expensive, but these days you can pack a hell of a lot of logic in a "small" one.
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For me, the new RPis are too powerful. I o not use a Rpi to play 4K videos or video games, I also do not use it as a proper server.
My uses for RPis are for their GPIO pins (controlling a relay or reading some input over the network with simple bash scripts) or as a simple low power PC/switch to sniff packets to figure out why part of a network is not working and which packets do not go all the way to/from the router.
RPi3 is enough for this, RPi2 may also be enough. Of course, they are not made anymore and i
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Mostly good (Score:2)
The price too. I think a 16GB version plus an M2 hat will take us closer to $150 or more.
I'm glad it uses less power or otherwise covers the overheating issues of version 4.
I personally use it for lower level code and hardware integrations and would have loved an embedded FPGA, M4 core or even the PIO from the pico against its GPIO. Give us a bunch more connectors in front of PIO/FPGA modules that sit in front of the GPIO to open up
Another failed "Desktop Replacement" (Score:2, Funny)
RPI should stop trying to be a desktop and focus on what it was always supposed to be: an embedded platform.
GbE, a bunch of USBs, and multiple 4K HDMI... all a colossal waste of time and money. It doesn't have enough performance to be a desktop, and it doesn't have the I/O or peripherals to be an embedded system (they expect you to buy a hat for that).
In short: it is a useless waste of $80.
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Sadly that's what the customers are asking for.
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Re:Another failed "Desktop Replacement" (Score:5, Informative)
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focus on what it was always supposed to be: an embedded platform
It's made by the Brits, who brought you ARM and Archimedes and RISC OS and BBC Basic, and contains elements of all...how in the hell do you even think "embedded platform" when you see all that?
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On that topic, this is the first Pi that can't run RISC OS. Hang onto your Pi 4 if you use it!
Re: Another failed "Desktop Replacement" (Score:2)
Embedded is what the Pico and Compute Module versions are for.
RISC-V (Score:2)
I've already moved on to RISC-V.
The lack of open specs has been a constant struggle on RPi. Just one example is finding a consistently working ffmpeg because the GPU is "secret".
Add in the lack of supply chain for small accounts and low spec per dollar and it was easy.
RPi courted the alpha nerds early on to great success.
The only downside now is waiting for Alibaba shipping but, having some spares is a good idea anyway.
Even Xen dom0 is basically working.
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Are there non-secret GPUs for RISC-V?
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Are there non-secret GPUs for RISC-V?
There is if you make one. FPGAs are cheap these days.
Wrong direction? (Score:3)
I'm probably talking out my ass here - not uncommon - but I always viewed the Raspberry-pi as a device where raw computing power was secondary.
Yet here we are with another set of stats about the cpu and gpu power being x times better than the last iteration.
The problem? as I see it, is people trying to use the Pi for things it wasn't ever capable of doing with performance.
Computing that didn't suit the form factor nor spec.
Are the creators chasing that market? I don't know. I guess they are simply utilising compute power for each iteration in terms of cost - the same price point x years later takes advantage of what's available at the time.
But still, the idea persists that the raspberry pi is capable of all tasks at a low price point - sure, it is, but not at speed.
I kinda wish the direction was more attuned to the original excitement.
Expand on the versatility, rather than focussing on raw gpu/cpu power. Focus on what makes it great - low power, portability, small form factor, edge cases, iot etc.
We see people trying to use the pi for compute power that really doesn't add up at all.
Heck, at that point, a slightly bigger form factor - just get an intel NUC or something.
If you aren't into the maker game, using the Pi as a low power useful device for robotics or home automation etc. - you soon realise that for maybe $50 more you can get 10x the performance.
You no longer get blinded by the low price point and realise the Pi isn't actually for _you_
Yet here we are, the focus is just faster cpu and gpu, rather than on what the original intent was.
They've maintained their best selling point (Score:2)
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The Pi isn't meant for saturating network bandwidth. Why do you think it has GPIO pins?
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I would tend to agree with ArchieBunker's statement that the Raspberry Pi isn't aimed at saturating network links. On the other hand, the NanoPC also has GPIO pins just like the Raspberry Pi, and I think you are saying that it perfectly capable of saturating both of its 2.5x link. That is really interesting.
For my needs (a home server that sips power but can still run the usual home services (Plex, file-serving, home security and automation)), the NanoPC T6 seems like a better fit than the Raspberry Pi. B
"UK" means Britain not Ukraine (Score:2)
Why would Hunter Biden's laptop allow this to happen?
I know, right? Hunter and his dad were corruptly raking in millions in bribes without any exposure and then that darn laptop screwed it all up!
When they say the Raspberry Pi comes from the "UK". They mean Britain not Ukraine where the Biden's are part of the oligarch ecosystem.
Re:Trash (Score:5, Informative)
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RPi has the stability and ecosystem (openness questionable)
Allwinner has the price and availability (stability and documentation are horrid, unless you can read Chinese and are located there)
NXP/SAM/Ti have kickass documentation and drivers relatively speaking, don't expect it to be cheap and always available.
They may all be Cortex-Ax, but their market usecases are mostly different.
Re: Trash (Score:2)
Why are you such an unlikable sack of trash? I didnâ(TM)t have an opinion before this discussion, but Iâ(TM)m now decidedly against anything someone like you is for.
Re:Trash (Score:4, Informative)
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Theoretically, but not really. I've never heard of Raspberry Pis used for education, and I work in High School education. In a world where every student has a PC, it doesn't really make sense (yes of course there are things a Pi can be used for that a Chromebook can't, but still).
Surely 99% of Raspberry Pis, from day 1, have been used by adult nerds. And after more than 10 years and the 5th generation, of course they know who actually buys this stuff.
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Theoretically, but not really. I've never heard of Raspberry Pis used for education, and I work in High School education. In a world where every student has a PC, it doesn't really make sense (yes of course there are things a Pi can be used for that a Chromebook can't, but still).
Surely 99% of Raspberry Pis, from day 1, have been used by adult nerds. And after more than 10 years and the 5th generation, of course they know who actually buys this stuff.
It was meant to teach students about programming and making a computer do something. Like read a temperature sensor and display the results. They weren't meant to replace typical PC. Here's the initial announcement from their site: https://web.archive.org/web/20... [archive.org]
We plan to develop, manufacture and distribute an ultra-low-cost computer, for use in teaching computer programming to children. We expect this computer to have many other applications both in the developed and the developing world.
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I've never heard of Raspberry Pis used for education, and I work in High School education.
Does your experience represent the entire world? How about in the UK where the Raspberry Pi organization is based?
In a world where every student has a PC,
Not every student has or can afford a PC. Not every school can afford a PC per student costing hundreds of dollars minimum per unit. That is your first incorrect assumption.
it doesn't really make sense (yes of course there are things a Pi can be used for that a Chromebook can't, but still).
So you build and assemble a Chromebook for teaching purposes? What about wiring a Chromebook's pin header for different purposes? Does it make sense now?
Surely 99% of Raspberry Pis, from day 1, have been used by adult nerds. And after more than 10 years and the 5th generation, of course they know who actually buys this stuff.
Do you know how many Pi’s are used by schools? If you do not, then
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Not every student has or can afford a PC. Not every school can afford a PC per student costing hundreds of dollars minimum per unit. That is your first incorrect assumption.
Oh get off it. A Chromebook is $200. A Raspberry Pi with a monitor and keyboard and mouse is the same or even more, and less convenient for schools and students. Sure, you probably have extra desktop hardware lying around, but you're an old hobbyist with a history of buying desktop computers, not a student.
Do you know how many Pi
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AP computer science has been a joke ever since they canceled AB in 2009, therefore it is not an appropriate benchmark for what a meaningful high school computer science experience is
Of course it is. AP Computer Science A is the upper bound of what a High School will teach. They might also teach things somewhat adjacent, like computer graphics or computer design or AP Computer Principles, but they're not going to teach AP CS A to juniors and then have an even more difficult class for seniors.
In an educatio
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Re: Trash (Score:2)
According to Tom's Hardware it still struggles to even play YouTube videos.
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It still has USB ports. If you don't care about audio quality, USB->3.5" jacks are literally $5 on Amazon.
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Yeah, you can work around deficiencies, by adding stuff. This is another step away from something that's cheap and good for hacking towards a pseudo-premium PC replacement job.
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Either it's you adding a $5 DAC or they're adding a $5 DAC and increasing the BOM and final cost. The majority of people really doesn't care about analog audio, there is an HDMI port that carries digital audio for most applications.
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Fucking why?
Because the goal of the Raspberry Pi project is to produce a cost effective computer that would make computer science accessible to the masses. They aren't catering to your niche application. The vast majority of people will get audio via the HDMI output. That headphone jack had a non-zero cost. That probably means nothing to you, child of the First World, but there are people on this planet that make less in a month than you do in a day. They're the target audience. Not you. Not me. Not the Slashdo
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Because the goal of the Raspberry Pi project is to produce a cost effective computer that would make computer science accessible to the masses. They aren't catering to your niche application.
They're choosing to cater to different niche applications.
That headphone jack had a non-zero cost. ?
It has external PCI express, two 4k capable HDMI ports and can drive both a camera and a MIPI screen. You think all that shit is more cheaply available than a pair of headphones?
One of the few places you can even reasonab
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I'll take your childish insults as confirmation that I'm right.
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You opened with a post dripping with condescension. Your inability to take it after you've dished it is not the same as you being right.
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Here you go boss [raspberrypi.org], "The Raspberry Pi Foundation is a UK-based charity with the mission to enable young people to realise their full potential through the power of computing and digital technologies."
You aren't the target audience. Neither am I. That's why they're limiting sales to keep units available for the target audience. The supply chain sucks right now.
Regardless, the headphone jack is not required for their mission, is rarely used, and costs more than zero. You have cheap workarounds if it matt
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The only condescension I sent your way before you called me a twat was a gentle reminder to check your First World privilege.
Right so you were being a condescending twat. Free clue: neither PCIe interconnect isn't free either. They subbed one for the other. I see you ignored that since you know I'm right about it.
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And yet, newer RPis are more powerful and more expensive. $60 is not cheap. So, I kind-of doubt that those people could afford it if that is how much they make in a month. Similar with HDMI - an amplifier with a HDMI input is surely more expensive than just plugging in headphones directly to the RPi.Similarly, old, analog-only TV is cheaper than a newer TV with HDMI input (at least in my country, I could probably get a CRT TV for free or for a few Euros, but a used LCD TV would cost more).
So yeah, to me, it
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but a used LCD TV would cost more
Amazingly, LCD monitors seem to bottom out then keep their value really solidly. Unless you know where to find them for free, they're about a hundred quid. I guess they stay useful so once they lose the new shine, they keep going forever in the consumer world.
The new one still does composite by the way, but you need to solder.
Re:What is with the anti analogue disease? (Score:4, Interesting)
I agree... that 3.5mm jack was useful. Even if they had to remove the jack it would have been good to leave the audio output availabl;e via some solder-pads, that would have cost nothing. Not having looked at the full specs yet, am I correct in assuming that the VID pads are for composite video output -- or have we lost that too?
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Still has composite video output.
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Go buy something from Hard Kernel then.
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Yes... If you add a 'HAT' to interpose, and then you get to consume the only PCIe lane on the board...
Then you can enjoy a 4Gbps connection, which isn't too shabby, but is technically less bandwidth than even SATA can push.