First PCIe 5.0 M.2 SSDs Are Now Available, Predictably Expensive (tomshardware.com) 50
The first PCIe 5.0 SSDs are slated to ship this year with massive heatsinks and predictably high prices. Tom's Hardware reports: There are multiple M.2 PCIe 5.0 SSDs slated to ship this year, and the first model looks to be the Gigabyte Aorus Gen5 10000, which as the name inventively implies can deliver up to 10,000 MB/s. Earlier rumors suggested the drive would be able to hit 12,000 MB/s reads and 10,000 MB/s writes, so performance was apparently reigned in while getting the product ready for retail. The Gigabyte Aorus SSD uses the Phison E26 controller, which will be common on a lot of the upcoming models. Silicon Motion is working on its new SM2508 controller that may offer higher overall performance, but it's a bit further out and may not ship this year. The other thing to note with the Aorus is the massive heatsink that comes with the drive, which seems to be the case with all the other Gen5 SSD prototypes we've seen as well. Clearly, these new drives are going to get just a little bit warm.
The Gigabyte drive is currently listed on Amazon and Newegg, though the latter is currently sold out while the former is only available via a third-party marketplace seller -- at a whopping $679.89 for the 2TB model. That's almost certainly not the MSRP or a reflection of what MSRP might end up being once the drive becomes more widely available, which should happen in the coming month or two.
The other PCIe 5.0 M.2 SSD that's now available is the Inland TD510 2TB, available at Microcenter for just $349.99 -- assuming you have a Microcenter within driving distance. Inland is Microcenter's own brand of drive, and while the cooler that comes with the SSD isn't quite as large as the Aorus, it does feature a small fan for active cooling. Word is that the fan can be quite loud for something this small, so not a great feature in other words. Like the Aorus 10000, the Inland TD510 uses the Phison E26 controller and has the same 10,000 MB/s reads and 9,500 MB/s writes specification. Where Gigabyte doesn't currently list random read/write speeds, the Microcenter page lists up to 1.5 million IOPS read and 1.25 million IOPS write for the Inland drive. Both drives also have an endurance rating of 1,400 TBW, with read/write power use of around 11W.
The Gigabyte drive is currently listed on Amazon and Newegg, though the latter is currently sold out while the former is only available via a third-party marketplace seller -- at a whopping $679.89 for the 2TB model. That's almost certainly not the MSRP or a reflection of what MSRP might end up being once the drive becomes more widely available, which should happen in the coming month or two.
The other PCIe 5.0 M.2 SSD that's now available is the Inland TD510 2TB, available at Microcenter for just $349.99 -- assuming you have a Microcenter within driving distance. Inland is Microcenter's own brand of drive, and while the cooler that comes with the SSD isn't quite as large as the Aorus, it does feature a small fan for active cooling. Word is that the fan can be quite loud for something this small, so not a great feature in other words. Like the Aorus 10000, the Inland TD510 uses the Phison E26 controller and has the same 10,000 MB/s reads and 9,500 MB/s writes specification. Where Gigabyte doesn't currently list random read/write speeds, the Microcenter page lists up to 1.5 million IOPS read and 1.25 million IOPS write for the Inland drive. Both drives also have an endurance rating of 1,400 TBW, with read/write power use of around 11W.
More PCI lanes please (Score:3)
I'd love to see an increase of PCI lanes in the consumer level. Current Ryzen 9 have 20 usable PCI lanes, so one is limited to 1 graphics card (16 PCI lanes) and 1 of such SSDs (4 PCI lanes). And that's for AMD, because Intel i9-10000 range offers only 16 PCI lanes. That means some component will lose speed when both are used (e.g. video edition, reading from SSD and using hardware encoders). Motherboards come with 2 M.2 slots so it would be nice to be able to populate them both with state-of-the-art SSDs without compromising graphic card performance.
Re:More PCI lanes please (Score:4, Interesting)
That is actually incorrect. At least for newer generation processors.
Take the recent i9-13900k:
https://www.intel.com/content/... [intel.com]
It has 20 pci-e lanes (16x 5.0 + 4x 4.0) on the processor. But, also has X8 DMI 4.0 connectors for the chipset, which are expanded there.
For example the Z790 chipset itself provides additional 20 lanes (some of which are used for internal devices). And 8 more older PCIe 3.0.
All and all, that is 48 lanes, minus those used by the motherboard itself.
Re: (Score:2)
That's why I went with a Z790 on my latest i9 build, I have two 2tb PCIe 4 M.2 cards and the performance is great. I do wish that higher density M.2 cards were available, say 8tb. There are 4tb cards but similar to the PCIe 5.0 cards aren't that compelling price-wise vs. a SATA SSD.
Re: More PCI lanes please (Score:2)
Threadripper non-pro chips are 64 pcie lanes, and the pro versions are 128 lanes.
Not cheap tho. I see the low end 16 core pro+motherboard for $1760 on Newegg .
https://www.newegg.com/gigabyt... [newegg.com]
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Laptops badly need more PCIe lanes too. They don't have enough to have 2x Thunderbolt ports, discrete graphics, 2x NVMe etc.
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I've a Framework laptop with 4 Thunderbolt 4 ports....
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I looked at their website and they only offer Intel models, so running very hot... But yes, you can configure 4x USB4 ports. It doesn't actually say in the description that they support Thunderbolt, but that seems to be a certification issue. Impressive, 4x40 gigabit/sec interfaces. Just a shame the CPU is a mini furnace.
It looks like they sacrificed discrete graphics and a second NVMe slot to get that. The Iris Xe graphics are pretty weak, and I'd much rather prefer something like a Radeon 680 over an exte
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Laptops badly need more PCIe lanes too. They don't have enough to have 2x Thunderbolt ports, discrete graphics, 2x NVMe etc.
My two year old Precision 5550 [delltechnologies.com] has a pair of Thunderbolt 3 ports, discrete graphics, and a pair of NVMe slots.
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Thanks. It's a shame they only seem to offer Intel ones in the UK, because the current Intel parts are not very good. Still, it does offer most of what I want on paper. Socketed RAM too, so I think I'll buy my own rather than paying Dell 900 bucks for 64GB.
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Only intel ones in the US, too. I talked to my account rep, and despite having a great line of AMD servers, and some shitty consumer grade stuff with AMD, there is no current plan for them to offer AMD on the Latitude, Precision, or Optiplex lines. I'd absolutely love to push intel out of my clients, but no dice so far. At least I talked my bosses into replacing Intel in the server room, with great effect so far.
With that said, it's my 5550 is a decent device, though it eats battery like a sonofabitch.
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That's good to know about Dell pricing.
I'm thinking about upgrading a home server. There are a lot of used Xeon machines on the market now, so as much as I would prefer to go Ryzen...
Ideally for my workstation I want a laptop that can be a desktop replacement, so I can reduce the number of computers require.
Re:More PCI lanes please (Score:4, Insightful)
You're wrong (outdated info). AM5 (the AMD systems which support PCIe 5.0 have 28x lanes. 16 for GPU, 8x for 2x NVME drivers, and 4x for downlink to a PCIe chipset. In addition to that they offer 4x PCIe 4.0 for outdated chipsets, but these can't be used in parallel with the 4x PCIe 5.0 lanes for it. It's one or the other.
it would be nice to be able to populate them both with state-of-the-art SSDs without compromising graphic card performance.
You are absolutely in luck there is no compromise of GPU performance (or hardware encoders). Current state of the art graphics cards are completely unable to saturate the 16x PCIe 5.0 lanes. Heck they barely are able to saturate the 16x PCIe 4.0 lanes so even on your more outdated Ryzen example it's not a tradeoff.
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I just hope we see some decent workstation grade machines taking advantage of it. They should be able to offer 2x USB4/Thunderbolt ports, 2x NVMe, and a half decent GPU. Ideally more than 2 USB/TB ports, because you lose big chunks of bandwidth to DisplayPort if you want monitors on them.
There are some Intel ones that offer that much, but Intel chips run very hot.
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Workstations typically do not run cutting edge. They run high-end and that's not the same thing.
If you're building a high-end workstation now you'd be looking at a Threadripper Pro. They only offer PCIe 4.0 but do have 128 lanes of it.
Expect future workstation CPUs to continue to offer many lanes, but the technology development always lags behind high end gaming machines.
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Sorry, I should have specified laptops. There are Xeon laptops, but I've never seen Threadripper ones.
A decent Ryzen 7000 one would do me. Just needs to have the right combination of features. With USB4/Thunderbolt I can have enough ports and 2.5Gb or better ethernet.
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Ahhh yes. You're right on the money there. But that's not even a Threadripper or not problem. AMD makes specific "workstation class" laptop chips in the form of a Ryzen Pro Mobile (architecturally ahead of their desktop counterparts at the moment) and they still only have 20 PCIe lanes. AMD seems to be ignoring this market a bit.
Same! (Score:3)
I'd love to see an increase of PCI lanes in the consumer level.
Same.
I've managed to amass a collection of 256GB SSDs. Now, in the SATA days, it wasn't too hard to get a host-bus adapter and some power splitters and plug a bunch of drives in. No one drive was massive, of course, but either through creative organization or partition spanning, it was still possible to get some use out of the drives.
Now, that's not possible. At least personally, I don't care if they get clocked down to PCIe x1 and write somewhat slower, I'd just like to connect them all simultaneously. I w
Discretion (Score:2)
Also, I'm glad companies like Phision exist, do the absolute best on earth and don't behave publicly like the invented sliced bread. Though they actually invented pen drives, and even qualify for the finals of best inventions since sliced bread.
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There are a few companies which claim to have inventer the pen/flash/thumb drives.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
No doubt Phison is an early innovator when it comes to such devices, but it's not the only one which claims to have invented it.
Context. (Score:2)
Yeah, and a 5 MB ST506 cost 7 times that (in modern dollars).
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Yeah, and the first Chevrolet car in 1912 cost $2,250 ($69,390 adjusted for inflation). First editions of any new technology will always be high until they can benefit from the economics of scale.
In 1908 the Model T cost $850, or around $24,835 in today’s dollars when adjusted for inflation. In 1916, the prices had dropped to only $360 for the most basic Model T, or around $9,059 in today’s dollars. Of course, it only had a 20hp engine and none of the safety features that are required today.
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Though to be fair, at a top speed of about 40-45 mph, and a more typical speed of 20-25 mph, how much safety equipment do you need? Any roll cages or air bags on dirt bikes [maybe there ought to be] ?
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Huh.. Yeah, I looked it up - and it was a dangerous as heck time - in the 1920s! Nice all Joey.
"By the 1920s, accidents were frequent and many people were killed or injured every year on the roads and highways. In 1924, there were 23,600 deaths due to auto accidents, 700,000 injuries, and more than $1 billion in property damage."
And that's with a fraction of the population having cars, a fraction of traffic density we have now, on a fraction of the number of roads.
Great! (Score:2)
apple wants $400 to go from 1 TB to 2 TB so this i (Score:2)
apple wants $400 to go from 1 TB to 2 TB so this is priced very good.
Re: (Score:2)
Is this priced "very good" or is Apple just milking their customers for everything they are worth?
Spelling (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
We're living in the days of Idiocracy.
I'm not saying that all people are idiots, or that a firm grasp of one's own written language correlates perfectly to intelligence. In fact it correlates far more closely with socioeconomic status.
Nonetheless, it can at times be a useful and even necessary skill to be able to communicate as correctly and unambiguously as one can, and that is a skill that is not necessarily a priority in today's schools.
Semi-useless (Score:2)
How many PCIe lanes in the drives (Score:2)
The objective of moving NVMe drives to PCIe5 was to reduce the number of PCIe lanes in the drive from the current 4 to 2, simplifying mobo design, lowering the price of fabing the controller (but since the controller is more sophisticated, it evens out), and freeing PCIe lanes for other applications like graphics or higher speed networking...
Yet these drives are 4 Lanes (for compatibility with older borads), not two lanes (as god intended)
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That's only an objective if you want speeds to stay the same. If you want more PCIe lanes look to the CPU. AM5 already addressed this by adding 8x PCIe 5.0 lanes dedicated to NVMe. You don't need to free up anything for graphics.
Re: (Score:2)
That's only an objective if you want speeds to stay the same. If you want more PCIe lanes look to the CPU. AM5 already addressed this by adding 8x PCIe 5.0 lanes dedicated to NVMe. You don't need to free up anything for graphics.
Current Flash dies and controllers can not top 4 PCIe4 lanes, let alone 4 PCIe5 Lanes.
Maybe future technology (like FeRAM, or PCRAM, optane or mermistors) could change that, but in the short and medium term, 2xPCIe5 lanes are more than enough.
Can I fit these under my MB plate? (Score:3)
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Cool I guess.. (Score:2)
Why do consumer products have PCIe 5? (Score:2)
PCIe seems to be moving further away from consumers with each generation. I understand why data centers and HPC are clamoring for PCIe 6, but from the reviews I've read, it seems like there's little difference in real-world GPU and SSD tests when downgrading to a PCIe 3 link compared to PCIe 4. Given that there's more cost with each generation, why does everyone keep marching onward in the consumer space?
Re: (Score:2)
I just learned that the XBox Series X and Series S have a Gen4x2 PCIe link for the SSD rather than Gen4x4 as is common in most PCs now. I guess since they plan to sell millions of units, the savings are significant and the performance degradation is negligible.
Need A Larger Form-Factor, Too (Score:3)
Perhaps a a good drive form-factor: double the width of a current NVMe drive made in such a way that you could still use either drive in the slot.
[Yes, my laptop and desktop both have 3 NVMe slots, each. According to Open-Hardware-Monitor I have over 33TB of writes on my desktop drive; my old laptop drive was likely double of that. Even most MLC drives are only rated for 150TB endurance.]
10,000 (Score:2)
It's over 9000!
What? 9000! There's no way that could be right! Can it?
[ref [youtube.com]]
what for? (Score:2)
How much speed do the mayority of users really need?
Obviously, the change to SSDs was awesome, but at some point, I don't really see the benefit of even more GB/s outside of datacenter and niche applications?
Same for internet speed, actually. I have something like 100MB/s which is way more than enough for anything I can really think of. So what's the benefot of e.g. Gigabit internet?
might not last long (Score:2)
1400 Terabytes written (TBW), at 10,000 MB/s (= 10 GB/s) means you could wear it out in 140,000 seconds, or about 39 hours.