TSMC Hikes Chip Prices Up To 20% Amid Supply Shortage (nikkei.com) 55
Contract chipmaking giant Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing told has told that it plans to raise prices on products by as much as 20%, in what would be the company's steepest single increase. From a report: The price increases and the time frames for the hikes differ depending on the client, according to reports by Taiwan's Liberty Times newspaper and other media outlets. For some companies that received TSMC's notice, the hikes took effect immediately. TSMC and other Taiwanese semiconductor companies raised chip prices by more than 10% between last fall and this spring. But with strong demand continuing to outstrip supply, TSMC decided to sharply increase prices again. The increased costs tied to ramping up production are being passed downstream, with the company enjoying better bargaining power amid the global chip crunch as well. This move likely will impact the sticker prices of end products. A TSMC spokesperson declined to comment to Nikkei about the higher chip prices. Concerns over lower profitability are another reason behind the price hikes. The company has said it will make $100 billion in capital investments over three years through 2023. That commitment has fueled qualms about a potential decline in profits as TSMC prepares to boost its overseas expansion.
This isn't really suprising (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:This isn't really suprising (Score:4, Insightful)
I don't believe any of those firms actualy do chip manufacturing. Maybe some design, but they contract out for actual production. TSMC does the actual physical production.
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Still, the same applies. With prices high enough, competition will move into the market.
Some monopolies are held mostly because the profit margins are kept just high enough that it's not profitable for anyone else to warrant the up front cost the monopolist already paid. That way you have a lot of leeway to keep your costs low because, hey, where would a potential customer go? If they have a choice, it's harder to get away with cost cutting practices.
Re:This isn't really suprising (Score:4, Insightful)
With prices high enough, competition will move into the market.
1. The barriers to entry are enormous. No new entrant has the expertise and lead times to build a fab are measured in decades.
2. The existing competitors (Samsung and Intel) are already producing as much as they can.
This price hike is a good thing. Nothing allocates scarce resources more efficiently than good ole' capitalism. The extra cash will pay for TSMC's new fabs, including the fab in Arizona.
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No, the lead time to a new fab isn't decades. It's around 5 years or so. Many of the machines are built by companies who only make 1, maybe 2 of them of a year, and that's full production capacity.
Second, the barrier to entry is capital - a new fab costs 10s of billions of dollars - the equipment alone is around $1b each for things like light sources, step imagers and all that. In an industry where a chip tape out starts at $2M because each mask is around $100k each (and you need 10 or more masks per chip).
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A third barrier is competence. The number of people who truly understand semiconductor manufacturing and are able to build a recipe for a fab is not huge. Even with all the right equipment your fabs performance can be niserable if you are not able to tune the process right.
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Capitalism doesn't allocate resources efficiently. In this case it means we will have more useless iPhones and other high-margin-crap-functionality stuff getting made, at the expense of commodity items we actually need.
Basically the more over-priced the product is due to marketing hype the more margin there is to pay for higher chip prices.
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And I suppose your preferred solution would be to give chip manufacturers no financial incentive to invest in new fabs? Instead, you could use legislation to demand that chip manufacturers prioritize commodity items over iPhones?
What's the point in making some pious statement about economics when it's clear that you don't have any alternative solution of your own to offer?
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The issue is reliance on this one company for high end fabrication. My solution is for government to prioritize developing more capacity.
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What could a government's role in "prioritizing developing more capacity" possibly be? Several billion dollars of subsidies for existing chip manufacturers like TSMC? Already happened:
Two weeks earlier, on June 8, the Senate finally passed a bill including $52 billion in subsidies for the semiconductor industry, with initiatives like the TSMC fab in mind.
https://asia.nikkei.com/Busine... [nikkei.com]
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Subsidies are one way, yes. There is a large start-up cost to building a fab and it's risky because to compete with TSMC it needs to be cutting edge. Maybe partnering with TSMC is the best option.
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Yeah I really doubt any of the cloud guys will be building their own foundaries anytime soon. Especially considering the high costs involved and the difficulties in getting into better nodes over time (just look at Intel).
At most they may jump to Samsung or Intel if it finally gets it shit together. GF is probably out as they are not producing anything at 7nm or even 10nm.
There is a very slim chance that some foundry guys may get enough captial to start their own, but it's a very long shot considering the a
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I don't believe any of those firms actualy do chip manufacturing. Maybe some design, but they contract out for actual production. TSMC does the actual physical production.
This.
NVIDIA gets TSMC (or whomever) to make their chips, then sells them to whomever makes the actual graphics card, so it's here the extra cost will be going.
It does not automatically equate to 10% at retail because of the price gouging that is already going on, due to the elasticity of demand they're already pricing these things at retail for as much as they can go for (Still over £420 for the cheapest 3060), it's just going to end up taking some of the profit from the retail and wholesale pro
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What specifically would Don do different? I'm open to alternatives, but I never get details, just vague slogans.
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It's hard to screw it up worse than it has been, although I'm not sure much of it was preventable. Since when has surrendering been smooth in history? Going too slowly or too quickly both have perils. We can't see God's Sims instances.
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Trump lost. Time to get over it you sensitive little child.
Inflation Is Coming (Score:2, Insightful)
Special shout-out to all of those on Slashdot insisting there's hardly any inflation, with everything up by double percentages across the board...
All of these increases in costs will be hitting consumers in the next year or two, and heading up from there.
Good luck everyone!
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Yep.... a good friend of mine warned of this a couple months ago. He unfortunately passed away of complications from COVID so he didn't live to see the accuracy of his predictions. But as a long time small business owner (had at least 6 or 7 different computer stores, comic book and game shops), he kept telling us that "now is the time to buy whatever things you need, if you can afford to do it". There were a few outliers where it probably was best to hold off a bit, like buying another car or big projec
Yes exactly (Score:1)
"now is the time to buy whatever things you need, if you can afford to do it"
This is key. Start making a list of things that would really suck to be without, buy things to mitigate potential problems.
The biggest thing I have my eye on, is a modern portable solar panel large battery combo, enough to run a refrigerator for a few days, or maybe even indefinitely if you get enough panels. I just don't see things like water delivery failing in a way that huge water filters are super important, but I do see our
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"now is the time to buy whatever things you need, if you can afford to do it"
This is key. Start making a list of things that would really suck to be without, buy things to mitigate potential problems.
*writes down*
Blow...up...dolls.
Hey you have your crisis, I'll have mine.
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Blow...up...dolls.
Hey you have your crisis, I'll have mine.
Depending on how the future goes you may well be able to rent that pout for quite a profit!
Maybe keep one just reserved for your own use though.
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Re: Inflation Is Coming (Score:2)
How is this shortage terrible when more people than ever are getting to own laptops? That is a hell of a thing. We have a situation where more people than ever can own a new laptop, and yet it is a big problem? Sure, a shortage is a problem but in this case it does not mean gloom. They have to increase prices to justify the gamble of building new factories.
ARMageddon and X86ageddon [re inflation] (Score:2)
Almost everything got more expensive because supply chains and labor supply world-wide are scrambled, locked down, and/or confused due to the pandemic. Stasis is broken. What are you proposing to stop inflation, slow the economy? Then we'll have a pandemic and mass riots (worse than Jan. 6)
Are you proposing to make it worse? (Score:1)
What are you proposing to stop inflation, slow the economy?
It's really simple. You raise interest rates just like Volker did back to break the inflation of the 70s.
Now that would utterly destroy the stock market. But it will fall anyway of its own accord, eventually.
Let me put your question another way - Do you want a horrible crash now, or a much worse one later? Because the longer we delay allowing the market to fix things without constant life support from the fed, the worse the eventual reckoning wil
Re: Are you proposing to make it worse? (Score:2)
What life support? Demand increased, and so prices went up in order to raise capital that can be spent on new factories. End result, more consumer needs are met. Compare that to previously when people wouldnâ(TM)t even buy laptops as much. Now more people than ever are getting to own new laptops.
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What life support? Demand increased, and so prices went up
You don't understand the root cause of inflation - money added to the system at enormous volumes (the literal definition of monetary inflation), and on top of that demand did not increase - supply has diminished, as costs to produce rise and shipping systems everywhere start to fail.
Re: Are you proposing to make it worse? (Score:2)
Ok, you are lying about demand not having increased, thereby eliminating the premise of your argument. I mean either that you lied deliberately to bolster your failed argument or you do not bother to fact-check anything before stating it like a fool. Here are some references: https://www.statista.com/stati... [statista.com]
https://www.statista.com/stati... [statista.com]
I demand you apologize either for lying or for not fact-checking.
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Giving us the nasty recession of the early 80's. Plus, the causes may be different
In the past an expanding GDP "shrank" most debt, including war debt. Although, we don't know if such will happen again.
And, try to sell the voters on taking big spanking now to avoid a bigger spanking in the future. Logical or not, it won't fly p
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Giving us the nasty recession of the early 80's.
Now imagine that x10, because that is what is coming, all because we have refused to fix what has been broken for decades now.
The cure is often painful, but always better than delaying treatment.
You just do not understand what a powerful healing force the recession was for correcting problems in the market at large,
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There are different expert opinions on that such that a given politician is less likely to go with the painful "bleed it better" theory.
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The biggest driver of inflation in America is the cost of cars, both new and used.
New cars are expensive because the availability of semiconductors constrains production.
Used cars are expensive because people hold on to them because they can't buy new cars.
So most of the inflation is due, either directly or indirectly, to semiconductors.
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But of course, the cost to defend against Chinese aggression will need to be passed along. Rooftop missile batteries aren't cheap.
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That was exactly wrong (Score:1)
How do you pay that off? Some inflation is a reasonable part of the answer.
No, inflation was exactly the wrong thing to do, it made everything worse and prevented a real recovery.
Now the economy is in shambles, it's desiccated husk stood up and pantomiming life only through grim manipulation by the federal reserve.
If you haven't been paying attention, they entire banking system was screwed back in 2008 and basically been propped up ever since then, but the limits of the ability to continue the charade is ve
Supply and Demand (Score:1)
Screw your entire JIT demand.
If you "outsource" your builds, you can suck it;
Re:Supply and Demand (Score:4, Insightful)
Question: Are there alternatives to ASML? (Score:1)
I mean actual alternatives?
Because to me they look like a de-facto monopoly and hence the key bottleneck in all this.
E.g. who else offers EUV lithography machines?
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Re: Question: Are there alternatives to ASML? (Score:2)
Probably nobody, because very few people know how to build them. To build and train a competitor would be like going to Vegas hoping to make money by hitting it big at the slot machines. I mean most people will not even spend one dollar on a lottery ticket, why would anyone invest millions on something with only slightly better odds of return? Many companies tried to compete with ASML and failed. When it comes to chips everyone wants the best and second place engineers would mean lower yield rates and highe
Cost of manufacture (Score:2)
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If you're gonna confuse chips and ships you should probably wait for a Samsung article.
Welcome to Step 3 (Score:2)
My Post from 2008 [slashdot.org]
My Post from July 2021 [slashdot.org] and FollowUp [slashdot.org]
1) AMD Spins of fabs. ...
2) Intel/VIA/TSMC/IBM buys AMD Fabs.
3) Intel/VIA/TSMC/IBM Fabs charges huge price to manufacture AMD CPU's.
4) AMD CPU Prices skyrocket. Unable to find a cheap reliable FAB, AMD loses price competitive edge.
5) AMD Stock tanks.
6)
7) LOSS.
Welcome to Step 3.
Although the scenario today is different than what was forecast in 2008, it's still viable. TSMC only has so much fab capacity. While they are planning to expand it's not going to ha
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This is pretty hilarious, but my AMD stock is doing f-in' awesome.
Approved (Score:2)
Approved, as long as they drop the price once the shortage goes away.