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Hardware Technology

Like Smartphone Vendors, Laptop OEMs Are Increasingly Moving To Near Bezel-Less Displays (theverge.com) 137

An anonymous reader shares a report: In the past few years, IFA has become a laptop show. It may not be the place where companies like Apple or Microsoft show off their flashiest hardware, but when it comes to the midrange, workhorse laptops that dominate the shelves at Best Buy and desks at schools, IFA is where you'll find them. That's why it's so interesting that there's been what feels like an overnight revolution in laptop screens at this year's show: bezels are dead, and IFA killed them. [...] Now, that wave is coming to laptops: Acer's Swift 7 and Swift 5, Asus' new ZenBook line, Lenovo's updated Yoga laptops, and even Dell's midrange Inspiron computers are all getting their screen borders whittled down. These new laptops are pushing the screen-to-body ratio higher than ever: the Swift 5 is 87.6 percent screen, while the newly teased Swift 7 checks in at 92 percent. And Asus' ZenBooks feature a new ErgoLift hinge design, which is (in theory) to improve typing, but it also cleverly hides the lower bezel so that Asus can claim it's up to 95 percent screen.
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Like Smartphone Vendors, Laptop OEMs Are Increasingly Moving To Near Bezel-Less Displays

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  • by dgatwood ( 11270 ) on Monday September 03, 2018 @11:11AM (#57246336) Homepage Journal

    It drives me absolutely nuts that Apple is reportedly implementing bezel-less displays on every device BUT the one they should have done it on FIRST.

    • I don't want a bezel-less cell phone, because that makes it hard to hold without covering part of the screen and accidentally triggering things.
    • I don't want a bezel-less tablet, because that makes it hard to hold without covering part of the screen and accidentally triggering things.
    • I DO want a bezel-less tablet, because I hold it by the keyboard part, so a bezel-less design could improve the screen size without reducing usability even slightly.
    • by Z00L00K ( 682162 )

      I have a CAT S60 and that is fulfilling all my needs and it do have a bezel that actually protects the display. Now there's the S61.

    • Re: (Score:2, Redundant)

      by fisted ( 2295862 )

      So you both do and do not want a bezel-less tablet?

    • by raymorris ( 2726007 ) on Monday September 03, 2018 @01:01PM (#57246832) Journal

      I just HAVE to buy a new $800 phone so it'll get rid of the 2mm bezel. Can't have 2mm around the screen before I put it in the big ass OtterBox case.

    • by Anonymous Coward

      I don't want a bezel-less anything except stand-alone monitors.

      Phones need to have at least a 3mm bezel or you will always trigger the screen. More to the point phones will get all scratched up. Especially if they come in contact with your keys or coins.

      A stand-alone monitor can be bezel-less because it allows you to use identical monitors side-by-side, above and below to form larger desktops without distractions. In practice however this just leads to the edges of the monitors becoming dog-eared since the

      • by jbengt ( 874751 )

        I don't want a bezel-less anything except stand-alone monitors.

        Bezels set off the screen from the real-world background, and therefore are useful for stand-alone monitors.

    • by mikael ( 484 )

      You can get smartphone wallets which add a bezel as well as block the cameras if necessary. They have saved my smartphones from damage on more than one occasion. As an added bonus, they block the screen from triggering things while in a pocket.

    • I don't want a bezel-less cell phone, because that makes it hard to hold without covering part of the screen and accidentally triggering things.
      I don't want a bezel-less tablet, because that makes it hard to hold without covering part of the screen and accidentally triggering things.
      I DO want a bezel-less tablet, because I hold it by the keyboard part, so a bezel-less design could improve the screen size without reducing usability even slightly.

      ^^^^^^^^ THIS, times a million billion.

      Stop with the bezel-less bullshit. Pretty soon they'll have to ship their new shiny shit with a handle on the back because you won't be able to hold the fucking thing any other way.

      • by Agripa ( 139780 )

        ^^^^^^^^ THIS, times a million billion.

        Stop with the bezel-less bullshit. Pretty soon they'll have to ship their new shiny shit with a handle on the back because you won't be able to hold the fucking thing any other way.

        You are holding it wrong.

    • I don't even want a bezel-less laptop screen because when I'm opening it then it means I'm going to get some fingerprints onto the visible area instead of the bezel.

      It's time to stop making everything thinner, lighter, with less of this, with more of that just because it's possible. The whole fab of making phones, laptops, and tablets as thin as possible has to stop. Go back a couple of years in thickness and give us the extra space in battery. We'll more than be able to manage in coping with the extra gram

      • It's time to stop making everything thinner, lighter, with less of this, with more of that just because it's possible. The whole fab of making phones, laptops, and tablets as thin as possible has to stop. Go back a couple of years in thickness and give us the extra space in battery. We'll more than be able to manage in coping with the extra grams it'll add to the phone. And maybe you won't have to need the camera sticking out of the phone.

        Also give us the extra space for cooling so we can up the performance now that we can have more battery.

      • I don't even want a bezel-less laptop screen because when I'm opening it then it means I'm going to get some fingerprints onto the visible area instead of the bezel.

        It's time to stop making everything thinner, lighter, with less of this, with more of that just because it's possible. The whole fab of making phones, laptops, and tablets as thin as possible has to stop. Go back a couple of years in thickness and give us the extra space in battery. We'll more than be able to manage in coping with the extra grams it'll add to the phone. And maybe you won't have to need the camera sticking out of the phone.

        It is a ridiculous trend in the industry- they're going for fashion and appearance rather than form and functionality. I've never heard anyone say "I wish my phone were thinner" or "I wish my device had a thinner bezel". This whole- thin and bezelless direction is driven by manufacturers who are working based purely on fashion rather than common sense.

      • Learn to open your laptop properly. Problem solved. Next ...
      • by dgatwood ( 11270 )

        I don't even want a bezel-less laptop screen because when I'm opening it then it means I'm going to get some fingerprints onto the visible area instead of the bezel.

        Just make the panel light enough that the hinge doesn't have to be stiff. Then, you can open it by the edge (the metal part that you can't possibly avoid) and maybe a millimeter or two. Either way, the bezels could easily be a quarter their current size without that being a problem.

  • news that matters? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by iggymanz ( 596061 ) on Monday September 03, 2018 @11:11AM (#57246340)

    *yawn* this is the kind of crap I'd expect to see on typical consumer electronics fanboy site

    for something the size of a laptop screen there comes the point where the exact thinness of the bezel really doesn't matter; we've past that point in a prior year

    • Well, that can depend.

      I work remotely. When I started a few years back, the company sent me a couple of Dell displays. Nothing too fancy, they do the job fine. No big deal. I was recently at the company offices (which they just recently redesigned) and they have brand new bezel-less Dell displays on the desks.

      I really liked it when working with external displays. And I'd imagine I'd like it even more if my laptop were bezel-less to go along with those displays.

      No, I don't think it makes any difference

      • Comment removed based on user account deletion
      • Well, that can depend.

        I work remotely. When I started a few years back, the company sent me a couple of Dell displays. Nothing too fancy, they do the job fine. No big deal. I was recently at the company offices (which they just recently redesigned) and they have brand new bezel-less Dell displays on the desks.

        I really liked it when working with external displays. And I'd imagine I'd like it even more if my laptop were bezel-less to go along with those displays.

        No, I don't think it makes any difference in a measurable way--it just looks better.

        But would you rather a display that is bezelless, or a display that will have truer colours- more black blacks, etc... has an image that stays crisper longer for a longer life, etc. Nothing is free in life- and presumably the technology to go bezelless is more expensive or monitor manufacturers would have offered it a long time ago.

        Assuming you have a specific budget for monitor purchases; $X will get you so far- you can spend it on a bezel free monitor- or a monitor that is better in some other way. To m

    • by tepples ( 727027 ) <tepplesNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Monday September 03, 2018 @11:25AM (#57246408) Homepage Journal

      A smaller bezel means the laptop is physically less bulky for a given screen size. This means you can carry a 11.6" laptop as easily as an older 10.1" laptop, or carry a 13" laptop as easily as an older 11.6" laptop. (Granted, it also means less space for rechargeable batteries.) Conversely, it increases the screen size of a laptop that fits in a given bag.

      • but we already past that point long ago, we're talking about a mm or two now

        • The bezels on a the current generation MacBook Pro 13 are 1.3 inches on a 13.3 inch display. By reducing the bezel sizes to that of the current generation Dell XPS 13, one could fit a 14.1 inch display in the same external housing dimensions. Yes, it is mere millimeters, but they do add up.
          • Yeah, the bezel on my 11" Air is huge. On such a small screen, cutting down the bezel would increase screen real estate by a significant percentage.
            • The bezel on the 11" Air is so large because the cover has to be large in order to protect the keyboard and track pad. Unless you want to shrink those in order to make the bezel smaller. If you are going to keep the screen size at 11" then changing the bezel size won't do anything to how much screen you will see. Taking the bezel away will just show you the how the screen is fitted into the laptop cover.

        • by dgatwood ( 11270 )

          You're kidding, right? My year-old 15" MacBook Pro has a roughly 1 cm bezel on the left and right, and a roughly 2 cm bezel on the top and bottom. To be fair, having a screen that goes out into the rounded corners wouldn't be of much utility, nor would going down to the bottom (because part of it would be hidden behind the bottom part), but it could still become almost a 16" flat panel without changing the size of the laptop.

    • we've past that point in a prior year

      No, we won't have passed that point until our electronics become either holograms without screens or just sheets of glass that are 100% screen like the utopian vision of the future that sci-fi writers drool over.

      It will never be too thin or too light. It may be too fragile, but then people are just going to start complaining about material science rather than electronic miniaturization.

      • too thin is unpleasant to hold, a plate of glass is unpleasant too. the point is screens already take up most the surface area, another mm or two does't matter. this article doesn't need to exist.

        • You only say that due to a lack of understanding of people and the romance that is sci-fi.

          Also bezelless and thin are two different things. Another mm or two may not make the difference, but that's not what is being discussed. Looking at my current laptop moving to a bezelless laptop gives me nearly an extra 2" of screen space for the same laptop size, a laptop which has reached the limits of my bag size. Also the thickness of the screen is completely wasted. It's not used for battery, it's not used for ele

          • but the laptops in this article haven't achieved any kind of breakthrough at all, it's pointless.

            I understand adult mindset very well, you're talking about kid's and other immature people's eye-candy fad fascination, function is more important for normal adults.

            • but the laptops in this article haven't achieved any kind of breakthrough at all, it's pointless.

              *Looks at current laptop....
              *Looks at laptop in the article....

              I think you need to upgrade your braille display.

              • looking at the macbook pro my employer provided.... yup, nothing of note at this article's show

                • Except the additional inch of screen space compared to the 2018 macbook pro.

                  Seriously I assume since you got a Macbook from your employer you also have medical insurance, go book an appointment with an optometrist.

    • by Megol ( 3135005 )

      Sure there is a point but we haven't passed that yet. Wouldn't it be nice to have a 15" screen in a traditionally 14" sized chassis? Or a 18" screen in a 17" chassis?

  • One side effect (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward

    We all look forward to the camera that looks up your nose. So keep it clean!

    • For the number of times I need a webcam, I'd rather just clip one on.

      • For the number of times I need a webcam, I'd rather just clip one on.

        Apple will simply hide the camera inside the display, and you can have a telescreen [gizmodo.com] to go with your shiny shiny. And you will never ever know whether you are being recorded.

  • such a shame... (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward

    What a nice new laptop and now even more fragile device you got there.

    Such a shame if it were to get so easily damaged and you didn't purchase our extended expensive warranty from one of our inconvenient authorized repair shops.

    So frustrating would that be, so frustrating would that be.

  • ... but will make a lot of users without tiny hands have to lug around larger external keyboards. I cannot work on a late model Mac without my typos keeping the spell checker working overtime or the shell giving me countless FNF errors. (Damned muscle memory.)

  • by xlyz ( 695304 ) on Monday September 03, 2018 @11:30AM (#57246440) Journal

    while it's nice that thin bezels help to keep the size down having a 4:3 or at least a 16:10 screen ratio would be a much better improvement

    • And would also get rid of the bezel as 16:9 laptops for some reason have the same dimensions as 16:10 laptops just with more bezel

      • by Agripa ( 139780 )

        And would also get rid of the bezel as 16:9 laptops for some reason have the same dimensions as 16:10 laptops just with more bezel

        Soon 16:10 laptops will have negative bezel.

    • by jmccue ( 834797 )

      Wish I had mod points. But I take the change to mean they will make the screen size 16/8. Somewhere along the line we all should stop buying any laptops or screens that have a size less then 16/10

      BTW, I never buy brand new and never will until I see a screen size I want. Buying overpriced devices that do not meet my needs is a waste, at least I can find similar laptops at a fraction of the cost that comes close

    • Definitely prefer a 16:10 aspect ratio to 16:9.

      And instead of shrinking the body of laptops down to match the size of the new bezel-less display, I'd prefer that they keep the body size from the previous bezeled display model and just give us a larger bezel-less display because when they shrink the body size, we end up getting less of other things too: less battery life, less ports, smaller cramped keyboards, etc.

    • If you have bezels, 16:9 to 16:10 ends up being the best ratio. If you look at a page of a paperback book, the area of the printed text is about 16:9 (portrait) or even 2:1. The surrounding margins bump it up to about a 3:2 ratio. Same for a printed page. The printed area of A4 ends up about 16:10, while the printed area of a letter-sized page is about 3:2. These are the aspect ratios the publishing industry has settled on as optimal for reading and viewing after hundreds of years of trial and error. I
      • No, most books are using one of the two optimial ratios. Either square-root 2, or the golden ratio. So do the chassis of most laptops because it looks good, which is why the bezels are not uniform since 16:9 is nowhere close to optimal anything.

  • by QuietLagoon ( 813062 ) on Monday September 03, 2018 @11:33AM (#57246466)
    What is so great about bezel-less? What is the functional improvement?
    • Screen realestate per unit measurement of bag size. My current laptop only just fits in my bag and I want a larger display. I don't want to carry a larger bag. The only option left is to reduce the size of the bezel.

      Think about it. When have you ever thought "damn I wish this screen was smaller" without the context of the size or weight of the laptop, or having to hold it in the palm of your hand.

      • You size your bags to a millimeter threshold? What bag maker does that? I hate when people say first world problems, but talk about a first world problem. What kind of snowflake are you?
        • You size your bags to a millimeter threshold? What bag maker does that?

          I'm not sure where you get the millimeter idea from. My current laptop would have a full 2" extra screen space if it were bezelless.

          but talk about a first world problem

          Well since I don't live in the 3rd world I don't have 3rd world problems.

          What kind of snowflake are you?

          Someone who has solved all my other problems. You should aspire to be in my position rather than ridicule me for it.

      • Re:Why? (Score:4, Insightful)

        by QuietLagoon ( 813062 ) on Monday September 03, 2018 @12:25PM (#57246710)

        ... Think about it. "damn I wish this screen was smaller" ...

        I have thought about it. For me a slightly larger bag is far less expensive than the purchase of a new shiny object. The "I don't want a larger bag" seems to me more like you're trying to find a justification, any justification, to buy a new shiny object. :) But that's just me.

        • by tepples ( 727027 )

          A larger bag is more likely to be seen as a laptop bag even when closed. This makes it a more attractive target for thieves.

          • Which is why you don't leave it unattended if it's visible from outside the car etc. A smaller bag can still have a tablet, money or cigarettes and it could just as likely be stolen.

        • For me a slightly larger bag is far less expensive than the purchase of a new shiny object.

          That's a silly argument. It's not either or. It's a one or both case. You don't need to buy a new bag if you don't get a new laptop.

          The "I don't want a larger bag" seems to me more like you're trying to find a justification, any justification, to buy a new shiny object. :) But that's just me.

          Depends on the case. My bag also perfectly fits into the basket on my bicycle so getting a larger bag will cause problems for my commute. A larger bag is also heavier. Also I'm a bag snob and I went through a lot to find a comfortable bag with just the right compartments in it.

          Also also: unrelated to me, but not unrelated to this post: My girlfriend's bag is a $500 thing made o

      • Never when it involved something like 1% of the size. I also would rather have a sturdy device than one that is 490mm wide rather than 500mm. I would use the same bag for either and neither would fit in my pocket.

  • Another side benefit of these new displays is that you can't just get the LCD panel anymore for $50-100 when they break. Instead, you can only get the entire assembly which I've seen cost anywhere from $300 to $600+ if it's a touch-enabled display.

    This is not consumer friendly. Manufacturers are watching how Apple rapes their customer base and desensitizes them to it, then the other manufacturers follow suit.

    • by Agripa ( 139780 )

      Another side benefit of these new displays is that you can't just get the LCD panel anymore for $50-100 when they break. Instead, you can only get the entire assembly which I've seen cost anywhere from $300 to $600+ if it's a touch-enabled display.

      This is not consumer friendly. Manufacturers are watching how Apple rapes their customer base and desensitizes them to it, then the other manufacturers follow suit.

      As a manufacturer of entire assemblies, I fail to see a problem.

  • by Rick Schumann ( 4662797 ) on Monday September 03, 2018 @11:59AM (#57246582) Journal
    We seem to be moving inexorably towards devices that are just solid bricks that you toss in the trash when they stop working, and away from things that are serviceable. If we had Federation-style replicators that can recycle them as energy and make you a new one, great, but we don't, it's wasteful, and it's stupid.
    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      Lenovo makes ultra thin and light but also very easy to service ThinkPads. So do NEC and Panasonic.

      Being impossible to service is a design choice.

      • Re: (Score:2, Redundant)

        by Junta ( 36770 )

        I second this. Have an X1 tablet, normal screwdriver to open up, no heatgun to melt glue, no jewelers tool to pry open impossible plastic latches.. Of course most parts are soldered to board, but the disk is a removable m.2 and the battery could be replaced. Anything else goes on that... Well at least I can salvage the M.2.

        T480s has that and also two more serviceable pci slots (one for wlan, and one that can be wwan or a short m.2 drive) and a serviceable memory slot, and they are not particulary big eit

  • Personally, I would love a bezel-less laptop but I can't tell you how many technically astute people I see picking up and carrying laptops by the screen bezel. Along with this, you have a lot less material to handle bending forces when the laptop is opened or closed. So, how are OEMs keeping the screens from being damaged through what has been up to now normal usage? I'm not sure if this problem gets worse if you take touch screens into account.

    As for the camera issue, maybe now would be the time to see

  • If they are going with smaller bezels, it would be nice if they reduced the touch sensitivity of the outer 50 pixels or so. A semi-circle on the edge that is 10 pixels deep and 20 pixels high should NOT register as a touch.
  • What a silly statement - IFA had no role in this *at all*. If laptops are going bezel-less, whether or not IFA even exists wouldn’t impact the timeline of the shift one iota.

    Regarding the design shift itself... can’t say that I care. The bezels on my current laptop (2015 MacBook Pro) are small enough; eliminating them would only increase the screen size a small amount. And going truly bezel-less has some obvious downsides:

    - Where do you put the camera? Keyboard pop ups are bad placement, and mov

  • Dell started this trend in 2015.
  • if they get rid of the bezel then where am i going to put my sticky notes???
  • hahaha the majority jumped off a bridge. Thats progress! (2)

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