Cummins Unveils Electric Semi Truck Before Tesla (autoblog.com) 264
Cummins has beat Tesla to the punch by unveiling its own electric semi truck. According to Forbes, the fully electric, class 7 day-cab urban hauler, called Aeos, gets 100 miles of range from its 140-kWh battery pack and can haul a 22-ton trailer. While the company does offer the options of additional battery packs to triple the range or a range-extending engine generator, the Aeos is better suited for city use rather than long-haul trucking. Autoblog reports: While this electric truck is a concept, it's a working demonstration of a product Cummins plans to start producing in 2019. At the unveiling in Columbus, Ind., Cummins also revealed its latest near-zero-emissions natural gas engines, as well as the X15 and lightweight X12 clean diesel engines. The company said it is embracing new technologies that allow its customers to contribute to a sustainable future.
it's just another prototype. (Score:5, Interesting)
we've seen hundreds of Tesla-killer prototypes and promises. What we haven't seen to date, though, is a company other than Tesla who can actually deliver a production electric vehicle that people really want to drive.
disclosure: i'm a Tesla owner (and it's by far the best vehicle i've ever owned by an extremely wide margin)
Other company (Score:3, Interesting)
What we haven't seen to date, though, is a company other than Tesla who can actually deliver a production electric vehicle that people really want to drive.
Like Renault ? Who's been putting electric vehicles on the market for quite some time (cooperating with Nissan) (Covering a whole range of uses cases: Twizzy, Zoe, Megan, Kangoo)
Like Citroen ? Whose electric truck have been used by French postal services since the 90s ? (who needs extreme range when 20km is about as far as a your regular delivery route goes ?)
On the other hand: all of the above are European manufacturer, and Europe's densely populated cities are just ripe for EV (even back when these used t
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You forgot the Nissan Leaf, it's been the #1 seller for electric car here in Norway for some time. Though it's definitively been a #2 car for most families, it's not exactly made for road trips. Or any long trip really, it's a commuter car to do you daily chores around town. It works for some as long as you got a family car for the other trips.
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Re: it's just another prototype. (Score:2)
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Re:it's just another prototype. (Score:5, Interesting)
Given that the person's Tesla will have a 8 year / unlimited mileage warranty on the battery pack and drive unit....
No, those aren't the only things that can break in a vehicle (the rest is 4 years / 50k miles), but just pointing out, Tesla's warranty coverage on the S and X is superb. And it didn't come with the 8 year / unlimited mileage warranty on the drive unit - they added that in for free to all owners when the early drive units started having bearing issues. I mean, what sort of company does that? And they generally go ahead and replace any early drive units if they make any sound at all, just as a precaution to avoid any problems down the road that might be past the warranty period.
In case you're curious, the battery packs have held up amazingly well - even in heavy service like taxi duty in harsh climates. The relatively small number of battery replacements have been almost exclusively nothing to do with the packs themselves, but a switch / connector on them. As mentioned further down in the thread (with a link to data), typical degradation for a Tesla pack is about 4% in the first year of ownership, and then it slows down greatly, with typical 5-year degradation at around 6-7%. Which is pretty much the sort of "range degradation" you'll see in a gasoline vehicle as well, since gas engines become less efficient with age and thus you don't go as far on a fixed-size tank. The primary difference being that gasoline vehicle tanks are primarily sized to minimize how infrequently you have to through the inconvenience of detouring from your daily life to go to a gas station, while EVs start each day with a full charge and the concept of "range" doesn't even come into play unless you go on a road trip - wherein a Tesla, that means "several hours of driving, then a lunch break, then back on the road for several hours more driving..." etc. Depending on the model, a 10 minute bathroom/stretch break when stopped at a supercharger means another hour or so of range. A half-hour stop to eat means about 2 1/2 hours more range. In short, it's only a minor, leaves-you-properly-rested-like-you're-supposed-to-be slowdown on long trips, while in your everyday life it means you never even have to think about whether you have to detour from your schedule to go stand outside at a place full of carcinogenic evaporating gas drips and exhaust fumes while paying out the nose for fuel.
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No, those aren't the only things that can break in a vehicle (the rest is 4 years / 50k miles), but just pointing out, Tesla's warranty coverage on the S and X is superb.
Hyundai's warranty absolutely destroys Tesla. Not only do they have a ten year powertrain warranty, but they also have a lifetime battery warranty. Tesla's warranty coverage is merely aligned with the rest of the industry... except the Koreans.
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Hey, I'm not saying anything bad abut Hyundai. Of the non-Tesla companies who I feel "get" the market, Hyundai would be at the top. The Ioniq is a great vehicle for its price point (although their inability to deliver in significant quantities is concerning, and makes me worry that they may be loss leaders).
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How sumptuously vague. It could mean that it lasts as long as it lasts or that if your battery fails they have you assassinated.
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How sumptuously vague. It could mean that it lasts as long as it lasts or that if your battery fails they have you assassinated.
The 2012 Hyundai Sonata Hybrid’s new battery warranty will reportedly last for the life of the car. “If the battery fails, the company will replace it and take care of any recycling costs,” Cars.com reports." More here. [usnews.com]
If the word "reportedly" makes you queasy, there's this, straight from Hyundai [hyundaiusa.com]: The Lifetime Hybrid Battery Warranty applies to all U.S. 2012-2016 model-year Sonata Hybrids. The Lifetime Hybrid Battery Warranty ensures that if the lithium polymer battery fails, Hyundai will
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So please excuse us for believing caveat emptor for anything a corporation says.
You're free to believe anything you want, regardless of whether it's true, and you don't need to be excused for doing that. Where you'll run into criticism is where you start stating your beliefs as facts.
I don't know what your specific gripe is with Tivo. As far as I can tell, they've never offered a "lifetime warranty" on their hardware. They offer a "Lifetime Subscription" that is tied to a specific piece of hardware, but it's non-transferrable and isn't a hardware warranty.
Some companies offer a "limite
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Given that the person's Tesla will have a 8 year / unlimited mileage warranty on the battery pack and drive unit....
[...]
In case you're curious, the battery packs have held up amazingly well - even in heavy service like taxi duty in harsh climates.
Wow, there are Teslas doing taxi duty in harsh climates? Can I request a Tesla for my next Uber ride? ... Yes, the Bay Area counts as a harsh climate. :)
Re: it's just another prototype. (Score:2)
Hahahahahahahahaha!
- former BMW owner
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You may have had bad experiences, but that is apparently relatively uncommon. You're much more likely to have trouble with a Ford, Opel, Mazda, Volvo or Toyota.
Total cost of ownership is what defines the "ultimate" price of a BMW.
By comparison, I can probably afford to repair damn near all of the other makes you've listed at the same time.
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This.
I've got a BMW motorcycle. If I do an oil change myself using "official" BMW oil it runs me $150 bucks. $200 if I take it to a dealer. I assume BMW adds unobtainium to their oil or something, cuz god only know why it costs so much.
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This.
I've got a BMW motorcycle. If I do an oil change myself using "official" BMW oil it runs me $150 bucks. $200 if I take it to a dealer. I assume BMW adds unobtainium to their oil or something, cuz god only know why it costs so much.
I don't know whether to thank you for this information, or offer emotional support for your pain. $150 bucks for a fucking oil change? Even if I was charging consulting rates for my time and effort, it would not cost me that much for my full-synthetic DIY maintenance.
BMW, I would ask you how you sleep at night, but the answer is clear; on a mattress stuffed full of customer money.
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Check out the oil change cost of a quatraport. Friend has one. They definitely use unobtainium.
Re: it's just another prototype. (Score:2)
BMWs have been rather reliable for over a decade now.
Your ignorance betrays you; regardless of whether you believe more recent BMW's to be reliable, if you weren't a moron, you'd know they used to be a whole hell of lot more reliable.
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Substitute "want to drive" for "meets owner's needs."
I would think that since Cummins isn't as wed to electric they could do some more interesting things with range extender engines than Tesla, but ultimately it will be interesting to see where things go. Logically, pure electric makes sense for local delivery vehicles and maybe port shuttles. Short-haul is an interesting challenge though; I would expect most semis in the US need to go at least 200 miles per day with a maximum trailer weight of 30T (chass
Re: it's just another prototype. (Score:5, Interesting)
No, the "fuel" that Tesla runs on is the fact that the market thinks it has massive profit potential, and has consequently pumped capital into it valuing the company as one of the world's largest automakers based on said profit potential.
But then again, random Slashdotters living in their moms' basements disagree, so clearly major capital funds and their due diligence analysis of the company's financials are wrong.
Note: there is a wide spread on the value guidance from different investors on Tesla - it's one of the curious market stories of our time. These figures generally range from bulls who think it should be around $200 to bears who think it should be around $450. But even with TSLA at $200, it would still be a massive company.
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But then again, random Slashdotters living in their moms' basements disagree, so clearly major capital funds and their due diligence analysis of the company's financials are wrong.
Anyone who has lived through the dotcom bubble in 2000 and then the housing bubble up to 2009 knows, not believes, not thinks, but actually knows that all capital funds and their managers have shit for brains and don't even know what due diligence is.
What is the current capitalization of Uber again? At least Tesla is actually shipping products. That's a unicorn company right there.
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What is the current capitalization of Uber again? At least Tesla is actually shipping products. That's a unicorn company right there.
Agree, I can not see any paths to profitability for Uber. Tesla has a chance, albeit with a lot of risk. I've never seen a company the size of Telsa with so much short interest, and I've learned to never ignore short interest.
Tesla's overvalued stock (Score:2)
I've never seen a company the size of Telsa with so much short interest, and I've learned to never ignore short interest.
Plenty of companies the size of Tesla have copious short interest and I've seen several who were larger than Tesla over the years. The reason for the short interest obviously is that Tesla's market cap is wildly out of line with the underlying fundamentals of the company. The company simple does not kick off enough profits or free cash flow to justify the current valuation and has no reasonably short term prospects of that happening. There is simply a lot of irrationally enthusiastic speculation going on
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Plenty of companies the size of Tesla have copious short interest and I've seen several who were larger than Tesla over the years.
30% of float is unusually high for a company of this 'weight' (considering market cap and actual size). In fact, its more common but still fairly unusual when you see more than 30% of float for small tech stocks except maybe right when something really bad is expected to happen or clear super high risk plays where the product is still vapor.
And of course its high because Tesla is overvalued. That's a reason why people short. Risk is another. In my experience, heavy short interest has proven to be an imp
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Re: it's just another prototype. (Score:4, Interesting)
You will far more likely find those employed by the fossil fuel industry targeting Tesla and any other electric vehicle manufacturer, with propaganda. People seem to forget, electric vehicles will bankrupt large portions of the fossil fuel industry. As more electric vehicles and renewables to power them, so demand for fossil fuel drops and with it drops the price and all the more expensive sources of fossil fuel, where producing the fuel, costs more than the fuel, then that company goes bankrupt, hundreds of billions will simply go belly up, floating in a sea of oil, no one wants. So not in mom's basement (which is a pretty nasty slander for children living with their parents) but trolls living in Public Relations Firms, paid to troll the internet, and more often than not, first posters, actively full time monitoring target forums with their lame targeted messages.
I am surprised they were no jumping all over the trucks limited range but of course trailers with batteries, will fix that and you can simply drop off the trailer with the load and pick up another fully charged empty trailer or a loaded one going some where else. Cummins also launched, near-zero-emissions natural gas engines, "X15 and lightweight X12 clean diesel engines". Tesla likely forced their hand with their electric semi and they added to the launch for those other fossil fuellers, sort of the last hurrah of the infernal combustion engine, the old and new at the one opening.
GOOD! (Score:5, Insightful)
While people may think this is trying to steal Tesla's thunder, you should remember that Tesla Motors wasn't started to make a buck, it was started to prove the viability and promotion of electric vehicles. The fact that other companies want to jump on the bandwagon isn't a bad thing, it's a good thing because it means that the plan behind Tesla is working. If you only like Telsa for the money aspect, you can suck it. ;)
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While people may think this is trying to steal Tesla's thunder, you should remember that Tesla Motors wasn't started to make a buck
Tell that to the investors that Musk is promising returns to.
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Telsa was started to capitalize on the ZEV (zero emissions vehicle) mandate the California Air Resources Board (CARB) implemented in 2015. Beginning in 2015, ZEVs had to account for a certain percentage of each automaker's annual sales (percentage increasing each year - currently 4.5% for 2018). If they failed to meet that percentage, they would have to buy sufficient credits from a compan
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Tesla was not started to "capitalize on the ZEV ... mandate", nor was it started in 2015. Tesla was started in 2003 because Eberhard (and subsequently Musk) fell in love with the AC Propulsion tzero, but couldn't convince AC Propulsion to build more for them to buy.
And I'm totally sure institutional investors doing their due diligence on Tesla totally forgot to check how much of the company's money comes from ZEV credits when making their valuations. The simple facts are that Tesla has a ~25% gross profit
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Tesla Motors wasn't started to make a buck
Going public with their stock proves this is a lie.
Near zero emissions natural gas? (Score:3)
Presumably only if they're not counting CO2, unless somehow they've changed the laws of physics. More half truth marketing which makes me suspicious of all their claims.
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Yes, they are discounting the CO2 emissions. When it comes to trucks operating in ports, or local delivery service, the main gripe is that they exhaust all kinds of nasty crap - fine particulates, NOx, CO, etc. - that is seriously detrimental to human health. As a for instance - have a look at the asthma rates for communities that surround large ports, then compare them to communities several miles away. (Ye
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Re:Near zero emissions natural gas? (Score:5, Informative)
Fixed that for you.
Incorrect [rsc.org], unless your definition of "significant" is different from mine. Said graph is from:
J. B. Dunn *a, L. Gaines a, J. C. Kelly a, C. James b and K. G. Gallagher (2015) "The significance of Li-ion batteries in electric vehicle life-cycle energy and emissions and recycling's role in its reduction" DOI: 10.1039/C4EE03029J (Analysis) Energy Environ. Sci., 2015, 8, 158-168 (The significance of Li-ion batteries in electric vehicle life-cycle energy and emissions and recycling's role in its reduction - Energy & Environmental Science (RSC Publishing) DOI:10.1039/C4EE03029J
Blue + red is energy burned in operation. Green plus purple plus light blue is energy used in manufacture, with no mass production in the EV case. Green plus purple (without light blue) is energy used in manufacture, with mass production in the EV case. To make the results of the above study even more extreme, a lot of EV manufacturers don't plan to power their production with grid power at all; Tesla, for example, plans to power the gigafactory almost exclusively with solar.
Really, it should be obvious that vehicle operation causes much more emissions than vehicle production. An average gasoline car burns its own weight in fuel every year. And beyond that, a sizeable chunk of the energy of its manufacture is recovered at the end of life via recycling.
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Easy problem to fix already - buy a diesel ;)
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Really, it should be obvious that vehicle operation causes much more emissions than vehicle production.
It is actually not "that obvious". The production of a simple car, like a Golf costs energy equivalent to about 30.000km driving that car. The millage varies on type of car and fuel consumption, obviously.
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Is that meant to be a lot? In the US, the average driver drives that in a year and a half [dot.gov]. The average car on US roads is nearly a decade old, meaning an average lifespan of nearly two decades.
For those of us not in the US (Score:2)
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What is a semi truck? Half truck, half... what?
It's a lorry that is only half aroused.
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Depends on where you are. What word works for you? Lorry? Vörubíll? ;)
My understanding of the US term is that it's because they haul semi-trailers. "Semi-trailers" because they don't have front wheels, and are thus not complete trailers.
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What is a semi truck? Half truck, half... what?
Half a van
Not surprised (Score:2)
Seems to me that these days there's a bigger learning curve required to design, build, and sell semi trucks than there is to design and build electric power trains. Also, I suspect it will be both easier and more cost-effective to retro-fit an electric truck for extra range than it would be for a car. If I'm right, truckers will be able to start saving money on fuel immediately, and invest in greater range later on without having to trade in / trade up.
If Musk was less of an ego-maniac, he might see the sen
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The very reason that we know that Tesla is targeting 200-300 miles range is because they're partnering with fleet operators. Specifically, it was someone from Ryder who leaked the information. They're not just off doing this isolated on some volcanic island deep in the South Pacific.
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(The volcanic island is, of course, Musk's personal lair and only open to his top henchmen)
100mi ...22tons... at the same time? (Score:2)
Government-sponsored (Score:2)
For those wondering, the research is sponsored by tax-dollars [energy.gov].
Such control of private enterprises by government officials is Crony Capitalism [economist.com] if one wishes to be charitable, and Fascism [townhall.com] in other cases.
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No such thing occurred, but I guess that's more creative than "fr1st p05t!"
Don't explain the joke. (Score:2)
Hint: check the literal meaning of "ballistic".
(here's another hint: SpaceX)
Re:Musk reportedly went BALISTIC! (Score:5, Funny)
Recursion (n): See 'Recursion'.
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Loop (n): See 'stuck in'.
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He could have gone ORBITAL, but he didn't. So maybe he's not *that* worried after all.
I think you are talking about Bezos.
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While this post is funny, I actually kind of think that Musk probably is a little bit tickled by this. Remember that this is the guy that gave away a bunch of patents related to charging and what-not... and I've never seen Tesla themselves do "head to head" competitive events to prove how the Tesla is better than ... he usually leaves it to the magazines and pundits to do that for him. I think the reason is that he wants to make a better world(s) more than he wants to make money. Therefore electric semi
Re:"Better For City Use" (Score:5, Informative)
Wear down? You mean degrade? If so, no, that's not "the way it is in electric cars".
Driving on modern EVs is much less stressful than charging. A 300 mile Tesla driving at 70 mph discharges fully in 4,3 hours. It can then fill up half its pack in 20 minutes. The rate of putting energy into packs is much higher than the rate of taking them out, unless you're driving full out on the track.
Secondly, supercharging has little to no impact on a Tesla pack's life, as confirmed by numerous comparisons. Nor is degradation even much of an issue at all, period. Here [google.com] is collected data on Tesla vehicles. Click on "charts". You'll see that typical degradation is about 4% in the first year of ownership, and then it strongly declines; after five years, the average total degradation is about 6-7%. Roadster owners (aka much older vehicles) usually report about 10% degradation. Tesla warranties their packs for 8 years (with unlimited miles on the S and X). And 8 year battery warranties are actually pretty much the industry standard these days.
That of course doesn't mean that you can't make a bad battery pack; it's actually easy. Early Leafs had bad problems with degradation in hot climates, for example, because their packs are only passively cooled rather than climate controlled (they still suffer worse degradation than Teslas, but they're not as bad as they used to be). It all comes down to what type of cells you use (because chemistry / design greatly affects properties; all li-ions are most definitely not equal) and how much you baby them.
You are however correct that freeway driving on EVs is much less energy (not power) efficient than in the city. EV ranges, however (at least for passenger vehicles - I've never looked into semis) are rated on the EPA 5-cycle or an equivalency metric (such as US-06 times a downward adjustment factor of 0.7). They're for "normal" highway driving, supposed to be an average of how people drive. That said, if you drive faster than average, you'll get significantly poorer performance. On the flipside, if you're a slowpoke, you'll significantly exceed the range.
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Re:"Better For City Use" (Score:4, Funny)
A 300 mile Tesla driving at 70 mph discharges fully in 4,3 hours. It can then fill up half its pack in 20 minutes.
Wow, it must be a lot of fun driving across the country driving 2 hours at a time and having to wait 20 minutes between each leg.
Why are you driving 150MPH?
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You can't win this argument. There seems to be a set of people that are convinced that unless you can do these marathon drives...by which I define it as driving until your tank gets to zero, filling up while you use the restroom and grab a package of beef jerky and a soda and then jumping back in to drive another 400 miles...if you can't do that in your car it's not "practical."
The folks who require this are certainly not a non-zero number. As evidenced by the folks who make this argument. Alternatively, th
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Waits are generally nonexistent at superchargers. It actually made the news when there were lines at some in northern California and a few other places during the eclipse, because waits are such an unusual thing. But I guess if having to wait half an hour at a gas station even on trips is what you enjoy - let alone how you have to use gas stations in your normal life rather than starting out every day with a full "tank" - then power to you.
A typical gas station costs about a million dollars to build, give
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Most long-haul trips I’ve made in my life have been with multiple drivers in the vehicle. Taking a pee break and switching takes 10 minutes, if there’s a line for a urinal.
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Most of that million dollars for a gas station goes into the retail establishment that sells coffee and hot dogs. The actual fuel dispensing portion isn't the bulk of the expense mainly because the bulk of profit for the stations doesn't come from gasoline sales.
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From this [profitableventure.com]:
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BEVs work fine for a lot of use cases. The present offerings don't work for me quite yet, in large part because I often drive cross state for work on short notice, and in large part because the financial ca
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The OP said "Wow, it must be a lot of fun driving across the country driving 2 hours at a time and having to wait 20 minutes." He definitely did use the phrase "across the country."
My mistake. I looked for that but missed it. Thanks.
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But I would argue that we are getting to a point where most two (or more) vehicle families would probably be better off if one of them were a BEV.
You'll have to demonstrate that with actual dollar analysis to convince me. How much money will they save for the lifecycle (purchase, fuel/charge, maintain, resale)? for an equivalent size, economically priced ICE. But at least you understand that a second ICE vehicle is pretty much still needed to make it work, I agree that's pretty much a given.
Personally, I buy used vehicles, like a lot of families do, the BEV case can't compete yet in that realm.
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The 'you can get one cheap' part is only the beginning. I don't stop there when I do my calculations.
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I've never understood this anti-EV argument of driving across the country.
The problem with the anti crows is very simple. They are super dumb.
If they would be smart, they would introduce every sentence with: "In my life situation" or with "in my country" or "in my daily use" or what ever.
They simply don't grasp: the USA is not like the rest of the world looks. Consider Europe:
The trip from Luxembourg via Brussels to Amsterdam is like 420km/260miles, and you have visited 3 european capitals.
From Paris to Lon
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Actually at 140kWh using a 600V 300A charger (I've seen 676A chargers), it would take 45 minutes to recharge.
For distribution centers, the truck is about 150 miles from the DC. Generally, at a Best Buy or WalMart, there's a full bay or two with empty trailers. It takes us 1-2 hours to unload a truck; the trucks grab the other trailer and leave. Given a L3 charger on a ChargePoint cube with 2 outlets at 676A, we could have two trailers charging simultaneously and have a full 140kWh battery in 45 minute
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In Germany we have an experimental highway (actually an ordinary highway, but equipped accordingly) with over the roof electric power lines, just like for trains, but for trucks. It is a highway connecting a cargo center with the airport in Frankfurt. Not very long, just a few km.
With all the various remote charging techniques etc. I expect future (new build) highways to either have electricity for trucks or beamed power for ordinary cars.
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And since the tank hasn't changed size, lower mpg = lower range.
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Cummins will not have built their own battery pack, so the difficulty of making a pack is irrelevant. But the point about this just being a demonstrator is completely valid. Let us know when they have something on the road.
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They are probably realizing that they need to do something fast, because Chinese companies already have mass production and highly successful electric busses with 450kWh batteries. With them on one side, Tesla on the other, and self-driving tech looking at their industry as the first one to conquer, this is the best they could come up with.
It even looks stupid. Why build it in the shape of a classic US style "big rig" (I don't know the proper name), it's not like you need room for a huge motor under that fr
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Indeed. Sadly, "making vehicles look like ICEs because that's what consumers will expect and they'll call anything that doesn't look like that 'ugly' " is probably going to be with us for quite a while. Want better aerodynamics and an unobstructed view of the road ahead of you, with the frontmost point only dictated by crash
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It even looks stupid. Why build it in the shape of a classic US style "big rig" (I don't know the proper name), it's not like you need room for a huge motor under that front protrusion.
Without a bunk it's all meant for local hauling. Thing is, with the range in North America, no one would buy it. 2x800km trips in the same day is considered normal for "local" hauling. My neighbor works for a local company that hauls between Woodstock, Ontario and Lansing, Michigan twice per day(around 1600km per day), even with nexus and pre-pass clearences for the trucks she's normally on the road 14-15hrs, which is legal as long as the breaks are observed properly -- or the company has paid the gover
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2x800km trips in a day would be illegal in the EU. It's not safe to do 16+ hours of driving in a day.
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13hrs is standard, 14hrs happens, same with 16hrs. You can do more, if the company pays for it. This is the law here in Ontario. [gov.on.ca] Something to keep in mind, that the distances that are traveled are vastly different between the EU and Canada/US. The busiest truck crossing in north america is detroit/windsor bridge(there's 2 others in the area not counting barge transit for hazardous goods) and another bridge system in Niagara Falls. The busiest highway system in the world is between Detroit, Michigan(Win
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It does not "happen" in the EU (the place that the person mentioned) without you losing your license. Trucks have a "black box" that logs your hours.
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The busiest highway system in the world is between Detroit, Michigan(Windsor, Ont is right across the bridge) and Hull, Quebec, right through Southwestern Ontario.
Extremely unlikely.
The busiest high way system is in my opinion around Paris. One truck after the other for 20h each day.
At night you drive 100km far and you see trucks after trucks in 50m distance to each other in that time on the opposing road side coming towards Paris.
And I guess if you go to a country like India, Indonesia or China or even Rus
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In Europe basically all trucks have a flat front.
The idea that it makes overseeing pedestrians easier/more likely is absurd.
And the driving hours you bring up here would put people in jail in Europe. 14-15h in a single 24h period, in Canada? And even more in the US? Sorry ... another reason to avoid visiting America and riding on the roads.
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"Clean diesel" is a marketing term. While the origin is earlier, they really began plugging the term about 15-20 years ago to try to take the thunder first off of HEVs, then PHEVs and BEVs. They had a big marketing campaign about how diesel now is so clean that it's emissions are like gasoline, except with a lower CO2 footprint. And they sold quite a lot. And then it was discovered that almost the entire industry was rigging their diesel emissions scores by detecting when the vehicle was being tested and pu
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It's important to note that so far the only manufacturer to be proven to cheat on emissions is Volkswagen. There are allegations against other manufacturers, but so far they haven't been proven. Although, the fact Chrysler recalled their vehicles [nytimes.com]doesn't look good for them.
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proven to cheat on emissions is Volkswagen.
That is wrong. All german manufacturers cheated and that is long known. And I doubt there is anyone who did not (that includes the americans)
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Link [bbc.com]:
Once manufacturers deployed their "fixes" to current vehicles on the road, the result was a significant loss of power and worse fuel consumption [theguardian.com].
As for their ad campaign, I'm surpris
Re:Electric trucks a joke here (Score:5, Informative)
Actually, EVs tend to go further in low-speed stop-and-go conditions than they do at high speeds. EV range is strongly correlated to velocity. Gasoline engines cancel out the increased aero losses at speed by the increased efficiency they gain from being in a higher torque regime. Gasoline vehicles (excepting hybrids) also do not regen, and they idle at stops.
What hat are you pulling that "eight plus hours" from? I have no clue what Cummins' plans are (presumption: "not much"), but long charge times has never been part of Tesla's game plan. Tesla battery packs are generally designed to fill approximately 50% in ~20 minutes, to 80% in ~40, and then taper down from there. Semi's launch will correspond with the rollout of Supercharger V3. All that we know about V3 is that it will be battery buffered (so the grid doesn't limit how fast it can discharge), and that it will make 350kW look like "a childrens' toy". Current superchargers are 145kW / max 120kW per stall (2 stalls per charger).
So if you were driving, say, 70mph (go ahead and fill in the details yourself), that would be 5,7h, meaning somewhere on the ballpark of one hour of charging spread out over the course of your day of Tesla goes with fast charging for semi, even less if they go for battery swap (some people think they will; I do not). Whoop-di-doo. Fuel costs generally are double driver salaries anyway for a fleet operator. Also worth noting that in the EU, a driver isn't even allowed to drive more than 4,5 hours without 45 minutes of total breaks.
Again, this article is about Cummins, but anyway, EPA ranges are based on the 5-cycle or an equivalence factor thereof. It's actually quite realistic. If you want a cycle to complain about, it's Europe's reliance on the ridiculous NEDC (it inflates EV ranges by 15-20%).
Grades are big loss factors for ICE vehicles, but not for EVs. An EV that rolls down the opposite side without regen loses almost nothing at all. If it has to regen, losses of the energy spent in climbing are generally only 25-50%, depending on the efficiency of the motor and battery. In the real world, the vast majority of climbing energy is recovered via rolldown rather than regen, and hence practical losses are very minimal.
Which is why cutting fuel costs in half in the US, and by 60-85% in Europe, is a Big Freaking Deal.
Are you trying to hit all of the selling points? The fact that it's leased makes it much easier because even if you have to pay a higher lease payment each month, you're saving much more than that in fuel payments each month, so it makes it a no brainer.
Tesla's Model 3 comes in at pretty much the same weight as other competitors in its class (BMW 3-Series, Audi A-4, Mercedes C350, etc). Semi will be no different. The packs on Semi will probably come in around 2 tonnes, give or take (it'll be easier to say once we're given exact specs). The drive units will add another 0,5 tonne or so. Compared to the weight of the engine and transmission they're replacing, that's not that much.
It will also almost certainly be the most powerful diesel truck ever. Expect
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Ed: I should be saying "diesel" rather than "gasoline" since we're comparing to semis. I wish there was a less awkward generic term for ICEs than "ICE"; I hate having to specify specific fuels when the conversation applies to them all.
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Ed2: "most powerful class 8 truck", not "most powerful diesel truck".
Ned too porffraed beter. :P
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Ned too porffraed beter. :D it helps to be a "full word reader" and having no need to parse a sentence letter by letter.
Not for me, that was easy to read