Microsoft Stops Selling Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 To Computer Makers (venturebeat.com) 275
An anonymous reader shares a report on VentureBeat: Out with the old, and in with the new. Microsoft yesterday stopped providing Windows 7 Professional and Windows 8.1 licenses to original equipment manufacturers (OEMs), including its PC partners and systems builders. This means that, as of today, the only way you can buy a computer running Windows 7 or Windows 8.1 is if you can still find one in stock. Two years ago, Microsoft stopped selling Windows 7 Home Basic, Windows 7 Home Premium, and Windows 7 Ultimate licenses to OEMs. Now Windows 7 Professional and Windows 8.1 are also out of the picture, leaving Windows 10 as the only remaining option, assuming you want a PC with a Microsoft operating system. This is Microsoft's way of slowly phasing out old operating systems.
Pushback (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Pushback (Score:4, Insightful)
I can't imagine a lot of businesses using Windows 10. That interface is pretty silly.
If by pretty silly you mean square edges and otherwise for common use cases identical to previous versions of windows then yes I would agree with you, though I'm not sure silly is the right word.
For those of us who use our computers rather than play with the OS, there's little to no practical difference in the interface between Windows 7 and 10 with the exception of that slide out side bar, and the colour shading behind windows. The ribbon in explorer is a natural extension of the interface most Windows users are already used to in their applications and the tiles can be completely ignored making Windows 10's menu look like a dark version of Windows 7's with more blank space.
In terms of business users I can't imagine businesses giving a crap. I mean these are businesses who happily moved from Windows XP to 7 and by comparison this move is far less jarring.
Re:Pushback (Score:5, Insightful)
As someone with small businesses dealing with sensitive commercial and personal data, not only do we give a crap, so do our lawyers. YMMV, but the telemetry and automatic updates are not a non-issue for those too small to be using the enterprise-level tools.
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What does your sensitive commercial data have to do with a silly interface again?
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When that silly interface talks to a remote service to do whatever it does and transfers our data to that remote service in the process, quite a lot.
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As someone with small businesses dealing with sensitive commercial and personal data, not only do we give a crap, so do our lawyers. YMMV, but the telemetry and automatic updates are not a non-issue for those too small to be using the enterprise-level tools.
Then there's the updates breaking systems debacle. I support Windows computers, and its an unholy mess as every update breaks big stuff. You can leave in the evening with everything working, and come back in again with the computer in endless reboot mode. Or the sound card not working. Or the camera not working. Or an ethernet device not working, or after delayin updates as long as allowed, it updates and changes all of the privacy settings to express.
Granted - that's a secure setup! 8^)
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Are there lawyers really telling their clients that using Windows 10 may open them to liability simply because of Win 10 telemetry?
I'd be curious what the civil case law is on this. There may not be much, but I'd be surprised if there wasn't some precedent of some kind on application phone home capabilities exposing (or being claimed to expose) sensitive data.
IMHO, if there was a compelling legal reason that Win10 telemetry actually exposed business users to serious liability, MS wouldn't have put that fea
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Lawyer's job is to be conservative.
Telemetry is new.
Telemetry may be exploitable.
Telemetry can't be turned off.
Result: Do not use.
Simple really.
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Telemetry isn't new. Telemetry has been around for 30+ years. It's new in Windows, but then again, so is that version of IE you are running. Did you vet that version of IE through your lawyers as well? It just got updated with security patches, it could be exploitable. You should turn your IE off until your lawyers vet it.
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IMHO, if there was a compelling legal reason that Win10 telemetry actually exposed business users to serious liability, MS wouldn't have put that feature in. If considered legal opinion is in the majority that does expose users to liability, I wonder if MS will backtrack somewhat and add in features that severely restrict telemetry
Why would they, when you can already avoid telemetry by getting an enterprise license? That has long been available with as little as five seats, and I think you can actually get just one now but don't quote me on that. (Unless it's actually possible and you're a reseller, in which case I'm curious, and could you give me a quote on that?)
Re:Pushback (Score:4, Insightful)
Are there lawyers really telling their clients that using Windows 10 may open them to liability simply because of Win 10 telemetry?
There isn't really any question about whether it could open us to liability in principle. Have you ever seen any provision in your country's data protection/privacy laws, or any commercial confidentiality or non-disclosure agreement, or any industry regulations like PCI DSS, or any statutory regulations like those protecting personal health data, that contains any sort of exemption or exclusion for data provided to a third party as a result of software running on local equipment transferring data to remote services for processing? I haven't, and neither has any lawyer I've talked to about this.
The more practical questions are about the risk of a real world breach, the likely consequences if anything did happen, and whether adopting Windows 10 under the current circumstances could be considered negligent. No-one seriously thinks Microsoft is going to deliberately search through telemetry data they acquired after something crashed and exploit any personal data they incidentally collected. The concerns expressed were more around potential future directions with functionality like Cortana, where data very much is deliberately transferred to Microsoft for searching and analysis purposes, and with the fact that the way automatic updates work in Windows 10 potentially leads to a choice between leaving a system unpatched against known security issues or introducing additional functionality that would transfer data out of our organisation, as well as being able to reset existing privacy-related configuration to less secure settings or remove them at any time. With the current direction Microsoft have been taking, little transparency from them about what is really collected or how it is used, and few if any actionable guarantees under their privacy policies or EULAs regarding their future conduct in these areas to provide reassurance, our conclusion was that there are legitimate concerns here.
IMHO, if there was a compelling legal reason that Win10 telemetry actually exposed business users to serious liability, MS wouldn't have put that feature in.
Right. so let's consider the editions of Windows 10 that will typically be used by larger organisations. How much control over software updates do they have? Lots. How much mandatory telemetry do they include? None. Do they use Cortana and remote services for routine searching? No.
I'm not saying (and neither did anyone else in any conversation I've been in) that there is some sky-is-falling threat here or that Microsoft is likely to be actively malicious in exploiting data it gains access to because of Windows 10. But if you handle sensitive data, there is a level of risk with any software features that can transfer data to another system outside your control, and there is a level of risk with any software features that involve automatic updates, and depending on how serious the consequences of a breach could be, some organisations won't be happy with the potential liability that results.
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Hey FUD monster, haven't seen you around in a while, how have you been?
As someone who actually deals with PCI and HIPAA compliance, I can tell you there is no conflicts with Windows 10, and never has been. That's just FUD.
With the current direction Microsoft have been taking, little transparency from them about what is really collected or how it is used
Really? There is an entire microsite on microsoft.com that details what they collect, and how it is used, and it specifically tells you no personal information is collected at any time (name, address, credit card information, blah blah blah). It's all about the OS and statistical data on
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You know what I find works really well when I'm running multiple businesses? Listening to random people on the Internet instead of real lawyers. Particularly ones who claim to be experts on compliance issues, but who immediately confuse the general issue of uploading data with one specific instance in the form of Windows telemetry, even in response to a whole post about how that telemetry isn't really the big concern here.
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Actually I work for a multi-national company in the Fortune 50 list currently looking at wide scale deployment of Windows 10 across the world. We also have internally approved the use of Office365 and Onedrive to store commercially sensitive and confidential documents.
We're clever enough to realise that we're less likely to be compromised thanks to the shitload of security advances that are included in Windows 10 which basically makes whole categories of previous attacks impossible.
Lawnmowing has no future
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Do you like beer and pizza?
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Actually I work for a multi-national company in the Fortune 50 list currently looking at wide scale deployment of Windows 10 across the world. We also have internally approved the use of Office365 and Onedrive to store commercially sensitive and confidential documents.
We're clever enough to realise that we're less likely to be compromised thanks to the shitload of security advances that are included in Windows 10 which basically makes whole categories of previous attacks impossible.
Lawnmowing has no future here.
What is their position on the telemetry holes? Or do your lawyers tell you that they are impossible to exploit?
You know, if you are not a shill, you should be. Impossible is not a word that anyone who knows what they are doing would ever utter. It's one of those words that actually encourages the bad guys.
By the way. have you ever noticed that there are lawyers on both sides of every case?
Alll of them having given their employers advice.
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What's pretty silly is that your lawyers obviously have not informed you about the legal implications of allowing your customers' private data to be accessed by a Windows 10 machine. Either the lawyers should be fired, or you should.
Re:Pushback (Score:5, Insightful)
It's amazing that a change to an interface somehow makes customer data flow out somewhere. I'm going to assume you can't follow a conversation and just froth at the mouth at the opportunity to mention telemetry every chance you get.
Amazing isn't the word I would chose to describe it. Quite mundane and easy to understand is more appropriate.
Step 1.
Develop single search UI that blends everything and does not provide any obvious indication or option to limit searches and obviously resulting data leakages. The point of this is maximizing intentional leakage of data by intentional malicious UX design.
Step 2.
Lawyer working a case types "Rob's rap sheet" into the search box on their computer intending to bring up file for case they are working. This data is sent to a public search engine with no expectation of privacy.
Doctor types "Gloria's Gonorrhea" into the search box on their computer intending to bring up file for patient they are working. This data is also sent to a search engine.
Windows 10 is intentionally ENGINEERED to leak information and invade privacy and confidentiality of information at every opportunity.
Also worth remembering Windows 10 is distributed with a fully functional RAT (Remote Access Trojan) installed and ENABLED by DEFAULT granting Microsoft the ability to exfiltrate data without either your explicit consent or knowledge.
https://web.archive.org/web/20... [archive.org]
https://web.archive.org/web/20... [archive.org]
Re:Pushback (Score:4, Informative)
It's amazing that a change to an interface somehow makes customer data flow out somewhere. I'm going to assume you can't follow a conversation and just froth at the mouth at the opportunity to mention telemetry every chance you get.
Go do a little research. The put Wireshark on a Windows 10 computer, and sit back and enjoy the show. Then enable all of the security features.
Then spend some more time with wireshark and lecture us on telemetry.
Because you are either ignorant, or lying. Let's give you the benefit of the doubt, and we'll just say you don't know what you are talking about.
Re:Pushback (Score:4, Interesting)
Nobody likes the ribbons. Microsoft is oblivious to customer concerns because their goals are to add features and maybe fix them later. Customer desires to not fit into their business plans, they treat Windows users like an annoyance (the real customers are the OEMs). No customers ever asked for a touch screen interface, no customers ever asked that the desktop be deprecated in Windows 8, no customers ever asked for a broken implementation of a phone applet store, no customers ever asked for Microsoft to reboot their computers to apply updates when they were in the middle of a game or skype call.
Windows 8.1 was mostly an apology, Windows VP was fired, we were allowed to boot to desktop again, etc. Then Windows 10 reversed course and doubled down; the store centric model was still front and center, the start menu was just the metro start page but not full screen, the update policy was just insane, etc.
The whole attitude from Microsoft is a dramatic shift from how they behaved during XP/7 time frames. Maybe it's the new CEO, maybe they're feeling more and more irrelevant and are panicking because desktops are not the big thing they once were, but something has changed in Redmond behavior.
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No customers ever asked for a touch screen interface
And yet, touch is the most common way we interact with computers today. Wow.
no customers ever asked that the desktop be deprecated in Windows 8
No, customers asked that they be able to use the software they have no matter what windows device it was running on. The desktop isn't "depreciated", but it does allow a new type of application that is portable to be run on the desktop.
no customers ever asked for a broken implementation of a phone applet store
Really, because users have been begging for it for ~15 years now. What rock do you live under?
no customers ever asked for Microsoft to reboot their computers to apply updates
I did. Reboot your ass right in the middle of whatever the *&^^&* you are doing if you purpose
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We use phones with touch. We don't use desktop computers with touch very often. It's not at all comfortable to reach out at arm's length to touch a screen all day. They should have at least had the foresight to default to touch on devices where touch made sense and default to standard interface on devices where the standard interface was the norm.
Windows 8 did put the desktop in the background. They make it hard to find, and made it nearly impossible to boot up to the desktop by default. In fact when p
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I can't imagine a lot of businesses using Windows 10
I work for a pretty large company (about 40,000 computers) and we are in the process of testing Win10, in fact my company laptop has it installed.
I believe the plan is to go all out on Win 10 next year.
We make some odd decisions though, when I started here a few years ago I had to eliminate the last of the Vista machines on the network.
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What about professionals who are bound by disclosure laws?
In particular, I'm thinking HIPAA. Given the telemetry in Win10 that cannot be disabled (except in Enterprise, and no small office will buy that), they legally can NOT use Windows 10.
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Those of us who are using older Windows versions and concerned about data security and privacy issues did actively prevent the back-ported telemetry updates from installing.
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You need a third party program just to get a normal start button back. The one that is default (I don't know if it came with 10, or that upgrade to 10 they released a while back that added the "Linux shell") is CLOSE and much better than the Windows 8 bullshit, but the search (Win+R and type program name, how I open most of my programs) is ridiculously slow. The third party option - Classic Shell - is way better, but it's still a third party app that I doubt most businesses are going to roll out for their e
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Having never tried Windows 10, is there not a "classical" theme for it?
Search for "Classic Shell" and it will do a lot of stuff you want. Windows update keeps uninstalling and complaining about it, but it works.
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Having never tried Windows 10, is there not a "classical" theme for it?
Search for "Classic Shell" and it will do a lot of stuff you want. Windows update keeps uninstalling and complaining about it, but it works.
Yeah, because It's a great thing to have to ret your OS provider like your enemy. Stockholm syndrome I guess.
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Yeah, it's fine. There's no advantage to it though, other than a slightly different interface to learn. And the drawback of invasive anti-privacy options - which are fairly easily disabled.
Do you have the telemetry that Windows collects on you after you've disabled everything they tell you about turned off?
Re:Pushback (Score:5, Insightful)
You can use it 99%+ like you use Windows 7.
Like without telemetry and automated updates?
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You can use it 99%+ like you use Windows 7.
Like without telemetry and automated updates?
Nope. Those are for the other 1% - in more ways than one...
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You sound like a Microsoft employee. If there's no reason to upgrade then why upgrade? It is not a better OS, there are no new must have features (voice search for a desktop, that's just absurd). Windows 8.1 is much better, though it's slowly being eroded by adding Windows 10 malfunctions (all Windows updates are starting to require that you have all previous updates). Windows 7 is good too, but I think Windows 8 saved a bunch of memory, whereas Windows 10 hasn't really added anything except for a new b
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> You can use it 99%+ like you use Windows 7. The backlash on here is extremely overrated.
Unless you happen to like having a DVR capable of recording DRM'ed content flagged as COPY_ONCE by the cable company using a DVR you own & don't have to pay additional monthly subscription fees to enjoy.
As of today, there are EXACTLY TWO ways to record and view COPY_ONCE-flagged content with a DVR not owned by the cable company:
* A TiVo... with a monthly service fee that, surprise surprise, is probably as much (
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Classical as in It's all Greek to me.
Re:Pushback (Score:5, Insightful)
This happens every new generation of OS - some noob comes by to tell us that people won't upgrade and they are always wrong.
Right. I mean, everyone jumped from XP to Vista, except for almost everyone. And Windows 7 eventually lost so much market share to Windows 8/8.1 that it was only a few times bigger when Windows 10 came out.
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This is what I call a monopoly. They have 120% of the OS market share!!
Re:Pushback (Score:4, Funny)
Looks like it really is true that 119.24% of statistics are made up on the spot...
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This difference is huge, in that W7 was actually pretty good. The early resistance was as you say, resistance to change itself, but once people started using it and found it to be stable and straight forward, the quirks (Network and Sharing Centre, for example, is a bit of a mess) weren't show stoppers and they eventually upgraded.
W10 is fundamentally different in that the OS contains elements that many users DO NOT WANT or are no longer fit for purpose. I have also had many conversations with active W10 us
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Did they upgrade or did they just get new computers that came with Windows 7 by default? How many actually went out and purchased a box full of Windows 7? I personally only purchased three copies of windows in my life, the rest of the time it was what I got with the machine. The latest purchase was Windows 8, and *only* because it was the Pro version for $15.
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The list is never going to lose Linux. It's a perfectly viable alternative.
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Re: Pushback (Score:5, Insightful)
Tell me, what professional level photo editing software runs natively on Linux? Photoshop? Capture One? DxO Optics?
Adobe itself has said they don't make Photoshop for Linux because the market isn't there. People who run Linux don't, and won't, pay for software. Therefore, they don't make a native Linux version. The same can easily be said of any software company.
Further, which version of Linux? There are what, 20 different flavors, potentially running several different kernels on top of numerous configurations? How is a software company supposed to make software to run under those conditions? Simply saying, "Compile your own" doesn't cut it when your job is to produce photos people want to buy.
I'm only using that one example because as a W7 user I will eventually have to move on from Windows, most likely to Apple, since they are the sole remaining company for which such software is available. This will do nothing to move the Linux needle off the staggering 2% threshold it is clinging to.
Re: Pushback (Score:4, Insightful)
Adobe itself has said they don't make Photoshop for Linux because the market isn't there. People who run Linux don't, and won't, pay for software. Therefore, they don't make a native Linux version. The same can easily be said of any software company.
Adobe will flip on this just as soon as someone wants a massive crapload of seats for Photoshop for Linux and is willing to pay for them. The same can easily be said of any software company.
Further, which version of Linux? There are what, 20 different flavors, potentially running several different kernels on top of numerous configurations? How is a software company supposed to make software to run under those conditions? Simply saying, "Compile your own" doesn't cut it when your job is to produce photos people want to buy.
It's pretty obvious, I should think. You support Ubuntu and Redhat. That will get you the vast majority of the market because that is the vast majority of the market, plus if it will run on both of those it will probably be relatively easy to get it to run more or less everywhere else as well.
I'm only using that one example because as a W7 user I will eventually have to move on from Windows, most likely to Apple, since they are the sole remaining company for which such software is available. This will do nothing to move the Linux needle off the staggering 2% threshold it is clinging to.
But what percentage of users are expecting the same software library that you are? I think the real sticking point for mass adoption continues to be games, since there are perfectly good apps available to do most of the things you do on other operating systems.
Incidentally, if you really want to know how to manage photos on Linux, I propose that the place to start is darktable [darktable.org]. But as you well know, there is nothing which does everything Photoshop does.
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Adobe will flip on this just as soon as someone wants a massive crapload of seats for Photoshop for Linux and is willing to pay for them. The same can easily be said of any software company.
Isn't that a catch 22 though? Why would someone (a business?) imagine a 'crapload of seats for {software} for {OS not supported by software}'? Even if they were willing to pay for it to be developed, I would imagine a port would take a considerable amount of time. So that's extra money AND time spent, when they could just be running Windows or macOS.
enterprise versions / downgrade rights are still o (Score:3)
enterprise versions / downgrade rights are still out there right?
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It depends on your agreement with Microsoft. A large company I worked for had "n-1" version regression rights in their EA. So if they are buying systems stickered with Windows 8, they can legally install Windows 7 on it.
As with all things Microsoft, it's a matter of how much you pay them.
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Depending on your vendor's/manufacturer's willingness to play along, you can still buy machines with 10 preinstalled and downgrade to an older version for another year or so.
Enterprise agreements are a different world entirely.
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Can anyone elaborate on this some more?
Each year we ship about a dozen PCs that control research instruments and W10 is not suitable for running them*. While we have started migrating to Linux we will need a stop-gap solution until the end of next year. W7 should fill that gap, but if our supplier suddenly cuts us off we'll be stuck.
Are there restrictions on the physical location of PCs running Enterprise Windows? Can I, for example, buy 10 Enterprise licenses and then install them on PCs and then ship thos
The Linux world stops distros without systemd (Score:5, Funny)
Windows 10 or SystemD, or a $2000 macbook pro with crippled ports. These are your choices in 2016.
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Windows 10 or SystemD, or a $2000 macbook pro with crippled ports. These are your choices in 2016.
I've been using a Manjaro-OpenRC instead of my W10 and loving every minute of it.
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> These are your choices in 2016.
That, and Trump and Hillary.
FUCK. The Mayans were 4 years off.
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Saw it coming; surprised with outcome (Score:5, Interesting)
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Re: Saw it coming; surprised with outcome (Score:2)
Up next: In-OS purchases (Score:3)
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More crap (Score:3)
Re:More crap (Score:4, Insightful)
Why are they going to change when your company bought their software and made changes on your side to accommodate them? If you want them the change then a whole lot of people are going to have to stop buying their software.
Comment removed (Score:3)
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I had to go outside and do chores because my new install of Windows 7 is still updating.
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Use an Offline Update Downloader [wsusoffline.net] to create an ISO. Run the ISO's installer to update Windows 7. Do this as frequently as you feel is necessary. Turn Windows Update completely off in the Windows 7 Control Panel.
The nice thing is, you archive your updates this way. I ran the Offline Update Downloader the day they turned off Windows XP updates and made a final update set for XP. Any time I see the need to build an XP system, pull out the ISO and run it on the new XP install.
Let the hoarding commence! (Score:2)
Well, if Microsoft wanted to boost computer sales, this is a fantastic way to do it. People are now going to be scrambling to grab computers that still have Windows 7 before they're all gone.
7 years is old! (Score:2, Funny)
Look, Windows 7 is old. It has old technology from 7 years ago. There is no way anyone could want a computer with something so obsolete.
Sure, Linux and FreeBSD are over 20 years old and slowly increases in users every year. But their excuse is that their software is good, while Windows has a shelf life barely better than an egg salad sandwich.
Microsoft's distopian visions (Score:3)
Sorry this is all a bridge too far. I neither seek nor have a place in any "future" that disrespects people to such an extent.
Tech industry used to be cool. It used to be companies cared at least somewhat about competing on merit providing useful new capabilities and better tools to get the job done. Now seems all anyone wants to do is fall over themselves to manipulate and stalk their customers with business models previously exclusive province of malware vendors.
Incremental improvements to W10 are NOT worth tolerating or wasting time bypassing intentional baked in evil nor am I willing to reward Microsoft by supporting what I believe to be unacceptable and unethical behavior.
Every intentional UX trick designed to covertly leak information, provide false assurances with clever language or cow people into submission reflects poorly not only on Microsoft but the industry as a whole.
It is NOT ok to profit from ignorance of YOUR customers anymore than you would deem it acceptable for a doctor or mechanic to profit from YOUR ignorance.
The cesspool of "me too" followers who use what everyone else is doing as cover for their increasingly valueless schemes does not speak to anything I would recognize as the "future" rather just another lame example of "market failure".
Thank goodness I just built a new PC (Score:2)
It's not a screamer (it's just an 8-core AMD chip) but at least it's fully modern I/O wise (USB 3.1 and Type C) and I bought it a nice clean Windows 7 license. Just enough time to take up a hobby to replace new games. I can only play so many retrogames. Maybe I'll go outside
The sheer size of updates is a problem (Score:3)
Windows 10 other than Enterprise has no UI for disabling updates, nor for setting an Ethernet connection as "metered". When someone connects a desktop computer to a satellite modem, it's through an Ethernet cable. But it's still metered, on the order of $5 to $10 per gigabyte. Or when someone tethers a laptop computer to a smartphone through a USB cable, the phone appears to the computer as an Ethernet adapter. But it's still metered, with pricing at a similar order of magnitude.
Unlike service packs to Windows 10, service packs and update rollups to Windows XP and Windows 7 weren't multiple gigabytes.
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I wouldn't be surprised if we get Windows "obsidian" some time in the future. It's not "black" right?
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Thinking it won't be the color per se, but an enforced OS 'rental' that we should be on the lookout for... on the plus side they won't charge you for upgrades. :/
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Thinking it won't be the color per se, but an enforced OS 'rental' that we should be on the lookout for... on the plus side they won't charge you for upgrades. :/
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Thinking it won't be the color per se, but an enforced OS 'rental' that we should be on the lookout for...
How have people like you not moved to Linux, BSD or OSX yet? If you're that paranoid about Microsoft doing what you say (and frankly we've been hearing the same thing for the past decade anyway) then the fact that you are still using Windows indicates you will probably just do whatever they say anyway.
The thing is though, if they were to have Windows on a subscription basis people would probably pay and it's because MS would offer some additional value that people would be fine paying for. Like what they di
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Careful..that sounds almost suspiciously racist!!
Remember, Black OSes matter!!
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Re:New world, new business model. Out with the old (Score:4, Funny)
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Unless the customers actively hate it.
In the data by netmarketshare.com, the market share for Windows 10 on the desktop has not increased since August. That is untypical, usually a new Microsoft OS would rise in percentage until a successor is released.
At the same time, the market share for Windows 8.1 is pretty stable since June. Similar for Windows 7, it seems people REALLY dislike the idea of switching to Win10.
Now the question is, where will those people go when Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 go out of suppo
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At the same time, the market share for Windows 8.1 is pretty stable since June.
Yes, it has stabilized to a point under those running Windows XP. There will always be a portion of the population no matter what version of an OS it is, just doesn't want to upgrade. New desktop OS's just don't matter to the vast majority of people that just use it to browse the web. The same thing was said of every version of Windows ever released, and Windows 10 is no different.
Re:More like... (Score:5, Insightful)
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Doubtful, The parent company of the place I work demands all PCs worldwide to be Windows 7 only and they aren't the only corporation that has this policy.
Doesn't matter too much - EA licensees will still have access, but no one who isn't paying $$$$$($!) to Microsoft will.
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Doesn't matter too much - EA licensees will still have access, but no one who isn't paying $$$$$($!) to Microsoft will.
OEMs are exactly the ones that pay $$$$$ to Microsoft and they're the ones that they will no longer sell them to.
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More likely MS is embarrassed by the consumer dislike of windows 10.
I'm far from a MS apologist (typing this on a Mac; doing my development on Linux) but I think a simpler explanation is that they don't want to support a 7 year old OS. You can only keep backporting features and fixes that are developed on a new platform for so long. Once the platforms diverge sufficient, it becomes prohibitively expensive to maintain that compatibility.
Think of it this way: would you want to port Chrome to Windows 95? Of course not: it doesn't have half the APIs you'd want to use. You could
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More likely MS is embarrassed by the consumer dislike of windows 10.
I'm far from a MS apologist (typing this on a Mac; doing my development on Linux) but I think a simpler explanation is that they don't want to support a 7 year old OS.
The fly in that ointment is that it takes a stretch to say that Windows 10 works.
If Microsoft were to enable turning off updates, it would go a long way toward fixing the problem. There is still the telemetry issue, but most users don't know and don't care.
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At the end of the day ROI is all the bean counters give two shits about.
Well, right. ROI also includes things like making your customers happy so that they buy more stuff, and apparently someone at MS ran the numbers and still decided this was a better long-term strategy.
It is possible to run Linux binaries compiled 20 years ago on modern Linux distros.
LOL yeah. That works great for the handful of statically linked binaries on your system, but good luck running something from '96 against a modern /lib.
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Sounds like your company bought some crappy software. I'd suggest talking to the company that made it, and then the person who authorized it's purchase.
Re:More like... (Score:5, Funny)
We still have software that doesn't run on windows 8/10
Maybe you ought to be working on a fix instead of /.-ing?
Like porting to Linux? :)
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Tell that to certified software.
You know, the kind of software where the results are certified to stand up as legal evidence in court, provided the OS is a set version?
The kind of software used in mission-critical laboratory work around the globe?
The kind of software that in order to be re-certified (if the OS should change, for one example) takes years and costs many hundreds of thousands of dollars?
That kind of software that only runs under Win7.
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Actually, yes they are, at least in this case... after all, how else are they going to shove their userbase into something that they have a more direct sphere of control over?
Not too many people are going to be clinging to their old install CDs/DVDs over time, and forcing OEMs to 'update' their UEFI firmware to disallow the older OS versions isn't too far-fetched ("This computer does not support outdated operating systems. Please press Enter to restore from the backup partition, or contact your computer man
Re:More like... (Score:5, Insightful)
More like the market stopped buying it...
If that were really true, why were all the serious business PC suppliers still offering Windows 7 Pro preinstalled right up until yesterday, in many cases as the default option when you ordered online ahead of Windows 10? Why did several of them have detailed explanations ready today for how to use downgrade rights to get back to the Windows 7 you actually wanted instead of the Windows 10 that Microsoft now forces them to supply? And why is Windows 7 still by far the largest OS in the marketplace well over a year after 10 was out, despite Microsoft literally giving the latter away and aggressively promoting it to the extent that many people wound up switching to it and then vocally complaining that they hadn't wanted to?
at least to the point where it isn't worth supporting it.
Now we're getting somewhere. Older Windows operating systems do not fit with Microsoft's vision of a service-based, always-online future. Since Nadella is basically betting his business on making that happen (and, to be fair, so far what they're making in other areas seems to outweigh what they're losing in OS revenue) this seems unlikely to change unless and until there is a change in senior management.
I still find it an odd strategy. They're basically playing to the non-geek home users ("Free upgrades! New shinies!") and the enterprise market (Win 10 Enterprise is practically a different OS to the other editions) at the expense of the whole small business, power user and geek level in between. I can see them possibly making a lot of money doing that in the short to medium term. But in the longer term, that middle group is the one that often sets the direction of the industry, and sooner or later a competitor or two will surely exploit that.
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And why is Windows 7 still by far the largest OS in the marketplace well over a year after 10 was out
You know what was the largest OS in the marketplace well over a year after windows 7 was out? Windows XP by a HUGE margin (60%). Windows 7 barely hit 15% it's first year. Windows 10 is at 22% in it's first year.
It really is hard to argue facts when the numbers don't back you up.
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Re:Correction (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Correction (Score:5, Insightful)
No no, they are phasing out customers...
Cause win 10 can go f itself.
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Apple sucks ass.
Get a Linux laptop. Or a Windows one and install Linux.