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Android Companies Keep Pretending That Android Doesn't Exist (theverge.com) 168

Posted by msmash from the android-problems dept.
Europe's biggest tech show IFA is underway in Berlin currently. Companies from around the world are showcasing their new smartphones at the event, chearleading the advancements they have made on the hardware side. Pretty much all these devices are running Android, but the way they are presented, you wouldn't be able to tell if that really is the case. The Verge's Vlad Savov writes: Sony would have us believe that buying an Xperia phone grants us a pass into the exclusive Xperia experience. The stuff actually differentiating the Xperia brand is junk and bloatware: the Xperia assistance software is a mobile version of Microsoft's Clippy. Huawei is even worse in its Android omerta, deathly afraid to utter the green giant's name. I understand that hardware companies want to spend more time talking about their hardware, but all these launches feel lobotomized without a proper discussion of the software driving their devices. Tell me about your implementation of Android. Tell me why you think it's okay to launch a phone without the latest software. Reassure me that I won't be left behind the way that many 2014 Android flagships already have been, and explain to your users why they don't need smarter multitasking, improved notifications, and baked-in VR support. Yes, those are harder issues to discuss, but dodging them is what makes customers untrusting of Android manufacturers.
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Android Companies Keep Pretending That Android Doesn't Exist More

Android Companies Keep Pretending That Android Doesn't Exist

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  • This is why I buy LG. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Kludge ( 13653 ) on Friday September 02, 2016 @12:24PM (#52815647)

    LG devices have standard connectors, microSD cards, removable batteries, and best of all: they are well supported by Cyanogenmod. My devices are always up-to-date and functional the way I want them.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by dargaud ( 518470 )
      Well, I did too. Except that it always performed as shit: 15 to 45s to switch app on a G3. SD card that kept unmounting, etc... Then when I finally got it checked: "The mobo is fried, you need to change it. Ooops, sorry, just out of warranty".

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by jez9999 ( 618189 )

        Sounds like you shouldn't have kept dropping the phone in the fire. I have a G3 with CyanogenMod and it works great.

      • Then when I finally got it checked: "The mobo is fried, you need to change it. Ooops, sorry, just out of warranty".

        So, you not taking your malfunctioning phone into the supplier's for repair is someone else's fault? That is what warranties are for - persuading people to get their devices (which presumably have fallen on the unhelpful side of th bathtub failure rate curve) off the street and fixed, instead of floating around pissing off their users and damaging the brand's reputation.

        I note there are no cla

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by dargaud ( 518470 )
          Yup, it's partly my fault, but the device was progressively acting up worse and worse, while at the same time it was hard to pinpoint exactly what was wrong with it.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by krelvin ( 771644 )

      Hmmm... my LG built Nexus 5X doesn't have a removable battery, uses a USB-C connector, no removable MicroSD card.

      • Well, it's a Nexus, they are made according to Google's specs, and Google seems to dislike microSD.

        • Google seems to dislike microSD.

          I wonder how much of this dislike comes from the SD Card Association's having made a Microsoft patented file system a requirement for the microSDXC logo. I forget where I read it, but Microsoft reportedly made more money licensing patents to Android device makers than it ever made on Windows Phone 7 and later.

    • Cyanogen is to much microsoft

    • Re:This is why I buy LG. (Score:5, Funny)

      by JoeyRox ( 2711699 ) on Friday September 02, 2016 @01:26PM (#52816153)
      LG's have one more advantage - an automatic, involuntary continuous reboot feature.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by msk ( 6205 )

      Not as well-supported as they should be. My Optimus V still runs Gingerbread.

    • LG devices have standard connectors, microSD cards, removable batteries, and best of all: they are well supported by Cyanogenmod. My devices are always up-to-date and functional the way I want them.

      So what you are saying is that you don't even EXPECT the phone's OEM to support their POS phone; bug rather have to depend on the largesse of coders working for a company who has absolutely NO accountability if something goes wrong with an update.

      Are you insane?

      • LG devices have standard connectors, microSD cards, removable batteries, and best of all: they are well supported by Cyanogenmod. My devices are always up-to-date and functional the way I want them.

        So what you are saying is that you don't even EXPECT the phone's OEM to support their POS phone; bug rather have to depend on the largesse of coders working for a company who has absolutely NO accountability if something goes wrong with an update.

        Are you insane?

        I expect the phone's OEM to support their hardware, to make it standards-compliant, well-documented, and compatible with the most common phone operating system(s), one of which should come pre-installed. I expect them to leave the software to the experts in that field who are developing usable mobile operating system software suitable for all phones, and not try to force users to deal with their own idiosyncratic, buggy, advertisement-laden Android offshoot. Let the best smartphone and the best mobile opera

        • LG devices have standard connectors, microSD cards, removable batteries, and best of all: they are well supported by Cyanogenmod. My devices are always up-to-date and functional the way I want them.

          So what you are saying is that you don't even EXPECT the phone's OEM to support their POS phone; bug rather have to depend on the largesse of coders working for a company who has absolutely NO accountability if something goes wrong with an update.

          Are you insane?

          I expect the phone's OEM to support their hardware, to make it standards-compliant, well-documented, and compatible with the most common phone operating system(s), one of which should come pre-installed. I expect them to leave the software to the experts in that field who are developing usable mobile operating system software suitable for all phones, and not try to force users to deal with their own idiosyncratic, buggy, advertisement-laden Android offshoot. Let the best smartphone and the best mobile operating system win—separately!

          The OEM should be accountable only for the hardware and whatever OS they choose to pre-install. You should be able to install AOSP with full hardware support through open-source drivers. If you prefer to have someone to hold accountable for software updates and support, you should be able to select the most suitable hardware for your needs and an operating system (perhaps based on AOSP) with a paid service contract designed to run on any smartphone, just like you can buy a commercially-supported operating system like RHEL or Windows and run it on any standards-compliant PC.

          It's a fucking PHONE, get over it!

          It's a Goddamn APPLIANCE, an EMBEDDED DEVICE!!! It may ACT a little like a computer; but it is not. It is a tightly-integrated system between software and hardware, with precious few resources and even less energy to wasted on software designed by those who don't know ALL of the tricks that can be leveraged by those who designed that particular assemblage of hardware.

          What you propose would do nothing but make software that would have to be designed around the lowest com

  • You can't lock people in "hardware specs" the way Apple locks people to its IOS platform

  • Average Person (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward

    The average consumer doesn't care about the operating system of their phone. They probably don't even know what Android is in detail and they wouldn't care or notice that they are running an out of date OS or that there are different skins of Android. They just install and use the apps they want and then if the phone is slow they just buy a new phone.

  • They are telling you (Score:5, Insightful)

    by SuperKendall ( 25149 ) on Friday September 02, 2016 @12:31PM (#52815699)

    Reassure me that I won't be left behind the way that many 2014 Android flagships already have been

    The are telling you what they plan to do; which is exactly the same as they have been doing. There will be no updates.

    Just because you don't like the message doesn't mean they are not being clear.

  • Why would they talk about Android? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by nine-times ( 778537 ) <nine.times@gmail.com> on Friday September 02, 2016 @12:35PM (#52815737) Homepage

    Why would Sony want to market their phone by talking about how awesome Android is? Any smartphone you get (that's not an iPhone, obviously) will be running Android. If Sony's sales pitch is, "You should buy an Android phone!" it doesn't differentiate them from other phone manufacturers. It doesn't tell you why you should buy an Xperia phone.

    So every phone manufacturer is trying to differentiate itself. They want to make their phone different from the other Android phones, and then their sales pitch is going to focus on those differences. For some manufacturers, those differences might be good, and for some they'll be bad, but there is a need to be different. Even Google's Nexus devices are, to some extent, marketing themselves on the premise that they're the reference design. You're getting the true, pure Android experience without all that pesky manufacturer interference.

    • Kind of like the market for Windows PCs. Again they all 'differentiate' their products with piles of crapware. This is 'business school' thinking, and the evidence of the crapware mess on both Windows and Android ought to be evidence enough that, in the case of computer equipment, this 'market differentiation' mindset just plain does not fucking work. What we need is stuff that is as uncluttered as possible and just works. Apple used to do that very well with macs mid last decade, then got carried away with

      • in the case of computer equipment, this 'market differentiation' mindset just plain does not fucking work. What we need is stuff that is as uncluttered as possible and just works.

        I'd look at it a different way: If you can genuinely add something of value, then you can differentiate your product from the competitors. However, if all your competitors are trying to do that and failing miserably, then there's an opportunity to differentiate yourself by *not* installing crapware.

        On the other hand, the reality is that part of the reasons these businesses do these things is that it works. They say, "Buy my product because I've added value by installing our custom 'CoolStuff' interface.

  • Does this behavior have anything to do with the ongoing legal battle between Google and oracle over the API's?

  • It's a commodity (Score:3)

    by PPH ( 736903 ) on Friday September 02, 2016 @12:44PM (#52815791)

    Why advertise that which your product shares with your competition? You emphasize it's advantages. Simple marketing.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Karlt1 ( 231423 )

      That's a good question. Let me think about it as I type on my laptop with an "Intel Inside" sticker with a Windows logo......

    • Why advertise that which your product shares with your competition? You emphasize it's advantages.

      Being loaded with crapware and nonstandard UI is hardly an advantage, at least for the consumer. What you're seeing is a desperate attempt to fight against smartphones becoming mass-market products with low brand loyalty and thus low profit margins.

  • Seems logical enough. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by fuzzyfuzzyfungus ( 1223518 ) on Friday September 02, 2016 @12:47PM (#52815825) Journal
    Many of the handset OEMs have direct experience with being box-stuffers for Wintel PCs; and the ones that don't have had plenty of time to observe the ones that do.

    Moral of the story, you are a low-margin, interchangeable, and largely expendable partner if you don't provide either the OS or the high-value components; with conditions moderately better for companies that can at least make money on SoCs or screens or batteries.

    Plus, some vendors still cherish the delusion(despite 'smartphone' having been a thing for some years now) that phones are just 'consumer electronics' and so consumers will dutifully consume them based on the 'features' the vendor shoves in to differentiate the product, rather than just loading the applications that provide the features they want, as with a real computer.

    Now, while I can't exactly blame the handset OEMs for wanting to avoid being just board stuffers who basically exist just to install Google's OS on Qualcomm's hardware; they have the crippling little problem that you can't put yourself in the position of being a value-added software contributor just by wanting to, or just by shipping software. You have to not suck at it. And that...hasn't exactly happened. Even after years of trying, OEM bloatware is considered to be doing atypically well when reviews describe it as 'subtle' or 'inoffensive' compared to stock Android.

    • Comment removed (Score:4, Interesting)

      by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Friday September 02, 2016 @12:50PM (#52815855)
      Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Mandrel ( 765308 )

      Many of the handset OEMs have direct experience with being box-stuffers for Wintel PCs; and the ones that don't have had plenty of time to observe the ones that do.

      Moral of the story, you are a low-margin, interchangeable, and largely expendable partner if you don't provide either the OS or the high-value components; with conditions moderately better for companies that can at least make money on SoCs or screens or batteries.

      A smartphone, even one running stock Android, has many more points of meaningful differentiation than a typical desktop PC, such as

      • Timely software updates over a long period (the software supplier, Google, doesn't provide them, unlike Microsoft on desktops),
      • A good battery life,
      • A good touchscreen,
      • A quality build that has a lower chance of developing faults, and more robust against damage,
      • Good display, cameras, and sensors, and
      • An ergonomic form-factor.

      I for one would love to be able to buy suc

      • I agree with you on the list of desireable phone traits; I'd also like to buy such a device; but the Android market appears to be suffering much the same effect that the Wintel laptop market did(and still does to a lesser degree; though vendors have been forced to clean up their act a bit lately):

        When it is very hard to distinguish your product, except on price, corners tend to be cut on everything that isn't easily visible on the spec sheet or the showroom floor. With laptops prices stayed low and CPU s

  • But they're not Android companies (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward

    They're phone companies. They're going to want to talk about phones. Samsung has been meddling with forking/making a new phone ecosystem to get away from Google.

    Google is the Android company. Don't conflate.

  • I've used a lot of Android devices, and still use them with my current Galaxy S5 running CM13. It's obvious that despite all Apple's shortcomings in its walled garden approach, their ecosystem is a lot more unified and provides a consistent user experience compared to Android-based phone manufacturers. Among Android devices, I have to say Samsung's blend of Android is definitely one of the worst. The UI is broken, inconsistent garbage and it takes a very long time to turn off all the on-by-default annoyance

    • What are you trying to compare here? One moment it's OSes, the next it's hardware manufacturers.

      There's iOS vs Android, and then there's Apple vs Samsung vs Huawei vs LG vs Moto. It's that iOS is limited to a single manufacturer, that's why it's all the same.

      • There's also ecosystem vs. ecosystem, and Android-based phone manufacturers obviously differentiate their products' Android installations and thus provide differing user experiences.

  • Its marketing 101. Even if its true, admitting that its Android-based is the same as telling you that their product is just like everyone else's.

  • First thing I do before buying an Android phone is make sure there's a root method and supporting decent mod. First thing I do after buying an Android phone is root it, remove the crap the manufacturer put on there, and install decent mod.

  • I recently switched from Android to iPhone, i always had Android devices, but the poor quality devices, the non-working custom UIs and having my LG G3 stuck on Android 5 while on some parts of the world LG released Android 6 made me switch, and i'm not looking back

    • Well, iPhone is certainly a lot more brain dead easy.

      You can find quality Android devices, but it is harder and you have to do considerably more research.

      With an iPhone, you know what you are getting. IMO that is the main reason people stick with iPhones.

      There is too much choice in the world these days. If you don't have any choice, then the decision is easy.

      • Well, iPhone is certainly a lot more brain dead easy.

        You can find quality Android devices, but it is harder and you have to do considerably more research.

        With an iPhone, you know what you are getting. IMO that is the main reason people stick with iPhones.

        There is too much choice in the world these days. If you don't have any choice, then the decision is easy.

        Well, i got disappointed at SAMSUNG, LG, Motorola devices multiple times, i really didn't want to any more research with Android, which would have meant spending even more money, and went actually for a good quality phone. I'm not saying that Android phones are all bad, there's one Android phone that i actually quite liked, but my Galaxy S2 died on a toilet accident. I was actually interested on getting a Huawei phone before the iPhone, but people that owned it told me it wasn't good.

  • It should be LAW that if you BUY a phone then you should be able to Root the phone and do want with the software that does not mess with the actual phone software (which should be a separate downloadable ap package).

    (oh and "design decisions" that make it hard to get Root should require that OEM to provide at no cost the needed materials to bypass)

    • Disagree. There should be no law that dictates what you can do with something, as such a law is often impossible to comply with.

      What should go is that horrible US law DMCA, which makes reverse engineering illegal and which in turn encourages making root access hard - results of which are felt all over the world.

  • I have got my smartphones from small, relatively unknown companies. Why? First, because they do most, and have most of the capabilities, of what big brand, snazzy phones do, at a small fraction of the price. Two, because they tend to keep customizations and bloatware down to a minimum. The price to pay is less frequent OS updates - but, then again, they are such good value, that buying a new one every so often is not a big deal. The likes of Samsung, Sony, etc. won't get a single cent from me any time soon,

    • This.
      Very happy with my latest generic Chinese phone, which has nice features like dual sim and minimal bloatware, (that is easy to desactivate)

  • After the latest update, my Samsung Galaxy S5 has so much bloatware that I almost can't use it anymore. The camera app refuses to take pictures unless I have an external SD card installed, and some apps refuse to download from the app store. 16GB RAM - 5.46GB OS - 7.11GB apps = 3.4GB left. After you include the Google Maps cache and voice mail cache and a few other things I have 1.1GB free. You can't move the built-in apps to the external SD card. My wife has the same phone, with no apps installed, and

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