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Microsoft Xbox Project Scorpio Puts Out 6 TFLOPs On Par With Current Gaming PCs (hothardware.com) 162

Posted by BeauHD from the frozen-in-time dept.
MojoKid quotes a report form HotHardware: Microsoft is hoping to usher in a new era in console gaming just over a year from now. While the company is just a month away from launching the Xbox One S refresh in the U.S., Project Scorpio is the console that really has gamers talking. During E3, Microsoft provided scant details on the console, only cluing us in to the fact that it would support virtual reality, 4K gaming, and push 6 TFLOPs of computing power. Mateusz Tomaszkiewicz, CD Projekt Red's Principal Narrative Designer, had a few things to say about that last bullet point regarding compute performance. If you recall, AMD's newly introduced Radeon RX 480 offers peak performance of 5.8 TFLOPs, which puts it in close proximity of Microsoft's Project Scorpio. But of course, trying to compare consoles to PCs using this stat alone isn't exactly apples to oranges, though Tomaszkiewicz explains, "For sure [Scorpio] will have better looking games," Tomaszkiewicz said. "If this was available when we were working on Wild Hunt, I would expect similar quality that we have on PC right now or even better maybe." HotHardware's report goes on to mention that once new console hardware is introduced, it's frozen for years at a time without any updates. Therefore, it would only be a short while before PCs would completely outcompete it in terms of performance. Also, given the fact that Project Scorpio is not arriving until late 2017 at the earliest, the 6 TFLOPs of power won't seem like much when compared to the new cycle of high-end GPUs with far superior performance. Tomaszkiewicz agrees, adding, "New graphic cards are being released very often and more often than the new consoles being released. So I think it will put Scorpio on par with the PC is that we have at that point. But I think PC is growing so fast that it'll outpace [Scorpio]."
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Microsoft Xbox Project Scorpio Puts Out 6 TFLOPs On Par With Current Gaming PCs More

Microsoft Xbox Project Scorpio Puts Out 6 TFLOPs On Par With Current Gaming PCs

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  • Re: (Score:1, Troll)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 )
    Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • The current XBox One uses an AMD processor and the next one probably will as well. That performance level might mean that they're planning to use the RX 480 as the GPU, which would be consistent with buying AMD. Or perhaps AMD will be making an APU for them that integrates an RX 480-class GPU with the CPU, though I think that level of integration is beyond what AMD can produce for now - even if they could get all those transistors on the chip, getting the heat out would be a problem.

      Scorpio is also going to

  • sorry, but no (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward

    project scorpio is not the console that "really has gamers talking". microsoft has lost this console cycle, and is not going to catch up with a new half-cycle-release. it's still an xbox (or an "xbone", as the more pornographically inclined would say), and not going to lose it's bad reputation as easy.

    • wait i thought xbox was just that Windows 10 program that i can't figure out how to uninstall?

      these kids and their apps tell ya what

      • In mid-September, about a dozen Xbox one games will support Xbox Play Anywhere [theverge.com]. This feature adds a copy of select games to your Windows Store purchases when you buy them on Xbox One or vice versa. So you're right only in the sense that Windows 10 Anniversary Update is a dependency for Xbox Play Anywhere. It's not clear to what extent other existing and future Xbox One games will come to support Xbox Play Anywhere.

  • Console hardware stays the same, so although it may theoretically not perform as well as the top tier hardware available, it can often have better looking games...
    A console game does not need to cater to lower spec hardware, nor does it need to deal with disparate configurations or other background software impeding the game, nor is your memory wasted by os features that are unrelated to gaming.
    You can even program the hardware directly, bypassing the overhead caused by the various abstraction layers.

    • Re:Abstraction (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Opportunist ( 166417 ) on Tuesday July 05, 2016 @03:38AM (#52446653)

      Erh... no.

      Console hardware stays the same, so although it may theoretically not perform as well as the top tier hardware available, it can often have better looking games...

      How? If anything, the reason this seemed true in the past was that TVs were blurry enough that you couldn't tell the pixels apart, which worked as a kinda-sorta el cheapo anti aliasing effect. This isn't quite true anymore with HDTV.

      A console game does not need to cater to lower spec hardware, nor does it need to deal with disparate configurations or other background software impeding the game, nor is your memory wasted by os features that are unrelated to gaming.

      You'd have a point here, if it mattered. Few current games give half a shit about low-spec hardware ("if you can't run it, you just need a better rig") and ram is by some margin and then some the cheapest bottleneck to get rid of. On top of that, current consoles don't even have that advantage anymore that there is no OS to get in the way, they ALL do have an OS by now. And usually one that sucks donkey balls at being an OS.

      You can even program the hardware directly, bypassing the overhead caused by the various abstraction layers.

      Sorry, nope again. That USED to be the case with old school consoles where the cartridge was actually part of the machine to the point where code execution was partly done on the cartridge, i.e. you had nearly TOTAL control over the CPU in such a console. That hasn't been the case for well over a decade now. No console maker would be "stupid" enough to allow you to run arbitrary code on its machine, how long do you think any kind of DRM would hold in such an environment?

      • On top of that, current consoles don't even have that advantage anymore that there is no OS to get in the way, they ALL do have an OS by now. And usually one that sucks donkey balls at being an OS.

        FreeBSD laughs at your PUNY Windows.

        you had nearly TOTAL control over the CPU in such a console. That hasn't been the case for well over a decade now.

        While that is true, console centric developers do usually program closer to the metal than PC centric devs do.

        • While that is true, console centric developers do usually program closer to the metal than PC centric devs do.

          That was true before consoles adopted high-level 3D APIs. Now the only benefit to consoles is that they can target a single platform. Microsoft wants to eliminate that benefit, because they don't understand the console market.

          • That was true before consoles adopted high-level 3D APIs. Now the only benefit to consoles is that they can target a single platform. Microsoft wants to eliminate that benefit, because they don't understand the console market.

            Good, I hope Microsoft successfully kills the console market so that games are fully brought back to PCs again. I'm tired of crappy ports.

            • Good, I hope Microsoft successfully kills the console market so that games are fully brought back to PCs again. I'm tired of crappy ports.

              That might actually be their goal, kind of. I think the end goal is to find a new home for Windows when nobody is buying desktops any more because the world has moved on to something else. That day is not particularly close, but it is on the horizon.

              • Re: (Score:2)

                by tepples ( 727027 )

                I think the end goal is to find a new home for Windows when nobody is buying desktops any more

                "Nobody"? Without desktops, on what machines will people develop applications for tablets, phones, and servers?

                • "Nobody"? Without desktops, on what machines will people develop applications for tablets, phones, and servers?

                  Nobody worth spending the money to develop an OS for, because those people have moved on to something else. VS is getting a little long in the tooth. I've got fully 3d games that start up in less time.

                  • What systems and dev tools will be used instead to maintain and develop ASP.NET applications, SharePoint apps, Dynamics CRM extensions, Xamarin cross platform mobile apps or any of the Azure services?

          • Consoles didn't adopt high-level 3D APIs. Desktop PCs adopted low level ones.

            Yes, you can in theory use OpenGL on a PS4 (or a variant of it), no, no game author actually does. What they actually use is GNM, Sony's proprietry low level 3D API. Similarly, on the XBox, yes, you can in theory use earlier versions of DX. In practice, everyone uses DX11, which is pretty low level. DX12 is even lower level (on a par with GNM).

            Every single vendor with any interest at all in 3D is adopting these lower level API

          • That and I'm pretty sure console games can store textures pre-swizzled for a particular GPU's cache architecture, or shaders pre-compiled for a particular shader ISA.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by mwvdlee ( 775178 )

      The enemy is complexity of modern games code and graphics hardware, or rather the ability for a human to comprehend the whole.
      Bypassing abstraction layers isn't a realistic possibility these days for the vast majority of game studios.
      At best they'll optimize the rendering engine for the specific graphics hardware, but that is hardly on the same level of performance.
      Ofcourse, using a rendering engine at all is in itself yet another layer of abstraction.

    • A console game does not need to cater to lower spec hardware

      Yes it does. A lot of Game Boy Color games, especially earlier ones, included a backward compatibility mode for 4-gray systems (Game Boy, Super Game Boy, and Game Boy Pocket). Compromises in gray mode often involved lower frame rate and less graphical detail, due to a slower CPU, less VRAM, lack of hardware-assisted copying of data to VRAM, and the dramatically slower green LCD of the original Game Boy. Later GBC games on monochrome systems would allow playing only the first chapter (Conker's Pocket Tales)

  • Price is everything. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Que_Ball ( 44131 ) on Tuesday July 05, 2016 @02:23AM (#52446485)
    So yes, sounds pretty much as you would expect.  The hardware in the console doesn't change but it also needs to hit a certain price point at launch.  Usually the hardware of a console is sold at about a break even price point right when launched and profits come from game licensing and eventual production cost improvements. Given that the typical price of a new console these days is around $400 or $500 you would never expect the state of the art GPU to be included as those parts alone are going to exceed that price point.  So yes, this years new crop of GPU designs is likely a safe bet for this mass market device launch next year.  Remember for the $400 price you still have to include storage, processor, power supply, enclosure, packaging and all the other bits and pieces.

    So sure, a current gaming PC costing 3x or more of a console is more powerful and will continue to outpace the console performance as time marches on.  Apples and oranges.  For pure gaming performance the consoles usually do pretty good on bang for the buck.

    • Except building a pc for the same money always nets you a system at least ~30% more powerful. And this number only go up with time...

      • I keep on hearing this, but I haven't seen any really good examples. Buy the time you buy a case, a power supply, motherboard, ram, graphics card, hard disk, and possibly operating system, you are usually quite a bit above the cost of a console. Don't forget in most cases you'll probably want to be running Windows on a gaming machine, so you have to count the Windows license as well. You could run Linux, and there are a lot of games that run on Linux, but you are still limiting yourself quite a bit. Most o

        • It's a long term savings. The case, power supply, hard disk, operating system, controller etc can be re-used from one generation to the next. Once you already have these, the upgrades become just the motherboard and everything directly attached (including GPU). The peripherals are cheaper and so are the games if you wait for sales.

          • The case, power supply, hard disk, operating system, controller etc can be re-used from one generation to the next.

            As new games become bigger from one generation to the next, it becomes harder to reuse the hard disk. Games got bigger from the PS1 generation (CD, with games only rarely multi-disc) to the PS2 generation (DVD, with dual layer common later) to the PS3 generation (usually single layer BD on PS3 or usually one or two DVDs on Xbox 360) to the PS4 generation (2-layer BD on both PS4 and Xbox One).

        • I decent PC costs more than a console but not the 2k$ many people led you to believe. You can get a very decent gaming PC for less than 1000$.
          Also, you can upgrade the parts as they break. A good case can last for many years. Likewise for a good PSU a good keyboard, etc.

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by drinkypoo ( 153816 )

      Every so often a Slashdotter decides that their text would look cool in monospace, because they think they are old school. Well, you're just a fucking hipster. Stop fucking with other people's eyes, all you're doing is driving home the point that you're a wanker.

      I didn't read your comment, in fact. Don't be that guy. Nobody wants to read his comments.

      • they think they are old school

        A five digit UID qualifies as old school. I think this poster's case is more of not giving a shit about how easy to read their text is, because they can read it fine.

        But yes, you're correct. There is a time and place for monospace (posting code), but the rest of the time, it is an eyefuck.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      Microsoft will likely take a big hit on this machine for quite some time. They are losing the current generation and desperately want to get ahead again.

      Having said that, expect this GPU to be cut down and thus cheaper than PC GPUs. They will tune it for VR, so high resolutions and frame rates but less effort put into physics and computation performance. That might mean lower precision maths, for example, which gives you a high number of FLOPS but doesn't actually perform better than a GPU capable of higher

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by mjwx ( 966435 )

      Usually the hardware of a console is sold at about a break even price point right when launched

      Actually, console hardware is sold at a loss at launch and usually for several years afterwards. Only after years of manufacturing the same hardware, which is usually out of date by the launch date, do the costs of manuacturing actually reach break even... let alone repay the costs of R&D. This is why they're referred to "loss leaders"

      profits come from game licensing

      As well as peripheral services, extra hardw

  • Here is why scorpio won't look good (Score:5, Insightful)

    by aepervius ( 535155 ) on Tuesday July 05, 2016 @02:28AM (#52446495)
    When you develop for console you develop for the lowest common denominator. This IS the advantage you have. Now you have two console with the same targeted environment, one slightly better at throughput than the other, and initially with lower numbers. Would you target that, add millions of dollars worth of development in bell and whistle , only to have barely a better sales, and risk the ire or their "lower" console brethen because the screenshot presented were only for scorpio ? And if you develop *for* scorpio you will miss on xbox one 1.0 player.

    I know that some hold that console generation should be shorter or whatnot (e.g. totalbuiscuit on youtube argue that that the last generation was too long) but the splitting ehre will make it so probably nobody with a sane mind will invest into getting more power out of scorpio and having different config and development on an already expansive console development without real benefit sales wise (at least initially). And if nobody is adding bell and whistle, why should people buy the new one when the old one less expansive does as well ? Remember console fit one niche : the one where you get a hardware with known spec and develop for it. Scorpio break that. It will add confusion on buyer, reviewer, developper side.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Kjella ( 173770 )

      Ever since the consoles switched to AMD and basically became PCs in drag you've seen the number of exclusives (single console exclusive, console-only exclusive) go drastically down. If you look at some big name games:

      The Witcher 3 - PC, XBone and PS4
      Fallout 4 - PC, XBone and PS4
      Dark Souls 3 - PC, XBone and PS4
      Overwatch - PC, XBone and PS4

      Are there exceptions? Sure:
      Uncharted 4: A Thief's End - PS4
      Halo 5: Guardians - XBone

      But I'd say most of them use some kind of scalable engine in the bottom, XBone or Scorpi

      • But I'd say most of them use some kind of scalable engine in the bottom

        The engine may be scalable, but they're still going to tweak and tune for the hardware.

      • This can be a texture problem, models detailing problems, lighting problems, and even physic problem. All of that cost money to configure, develop, and test. If the money is justified , people will do it. If there is not many scorpio at the start , forget it, unless microsoft PAY them to do it.

    • When you develop for console you develop for the lowest common denominator. This IS the advantage you have. Now you have two console with the same targeted environment, one slightly better at throughput than the other, and initially with lower numbers. Would you target that, add millions of dollars worth of development in bell and whistle , only to have barely a better sales, and risk the ire or their "lower" console brethen because the screenshot presented were only for scorpio ? And if you develop *for* scorpio you will miss on xbox one 1.0 player.

      Every AAA game already is developed for multiple consoles and PC. Realistically up until very recently nearly every game got a PS3, Xbox 360, PS4 and Xbox One version as a given (unless it was first party in which case the economics are about selling hardware anyway and you can throw "economic considerations" out the window). Almost every game will also see a PC release. A few games will also get a WiiU release as well. Realistically all that it means is that you create an OpenGL and a DirectX render p

    • What are you talking about?

      Xbox One/PS4 1.0 : you can play 960p upscaled to 1080p at 30 fps

      Scorpio/the PS4 one : you can play 1080p at 60 fps OR VR OR 4k at about 30 fps.

      That's the plan. This new generation of consoles is supposed to take advantage of the fact that there's now a heterogenous set of targets, one where the GPU horsepower requirements are radically different. It'll be the same game engine and the same game assets, just different targets. Using high level APIs the code would be almost the sa

  • SteamBox it is, then

    At least I get to choose the hardware, upgrade when I like, and not be stuck in low-end performance by the time I build one.

    • given latest sales figures I doubt their will be such a thing as a steambox for sale by the end of the year. I suppose you can build a PC still though and call it a steambox.

    • At least I get to choose the hardware, upgrade when I like, and not be stuck in low-end performance by the time I build one.

      You also get to play only a handful of AAA titles, because most of them still aren't being ported to Linux. Compared to my Windows Steam library, my Linux Steam library is depressingly pathetic. I was happy to see Civ in there, but it seems like most game devs are still on Windows, poor bastards.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by ledow ( 319597 )

        Steam machines are also available with Windows - you don't have to run SteamOS itself - you can just use your existing Windows PC in Big Picture Mode with contorllers, bam Steam machine.

        And out of 1000 games, 1/3rd of mine are available on Linux versions of Steam. Even Mac has a decent 1/4 showing.

        How many titles will the XBox have by the time it comes out to compete with something I can do this instant?

        • Steam machines are also available with Windows - you don't have to run SteamOS itself - you can just use your existing Windows PC in Big Picture Mode with contorllers, bam Steam machine.

          So wait, I get all the fun of an unexpandable PC, plus all the fun of an OS which will spy on me? WHERE DO I SIGN?!?!?!?!??! Also, while I am not an expert on Steam Machines, I just looked at several of them and they are offered only with SteamOS, and not Windows.

          Your existing PC in big picture mode with controllers is not repeat not a steam machine.

          How many titles will the XBox have by the time it comes out to compete with something I can do this instant?

          It's going to run all the existing XBone titles, so... lots

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by tepples ( 727027 )

            So wait, I get all the fun of an unexpandable PC, plus all the fun of an OS which will spy on me? WHERE DO I SIGN?!?!?!?!??!

            What makes you think your Xbox One console isn't spying on you just as much?

            Also, while I am not an expert on Steam Machines, I just looked at several of them and they are offered only with SteamOS, and not Windows.

            True, the big-M "Steam Machine" brand is used for devices that ship with SteamOS. But a small form factor PC running the Steam client, which you might colloquially call a small-m Steam machine, can also be a Mac mini or a Windows PC. And as I understand it, a lot of manufacturers of Steam Machines offer identical hardware configurations with Windows.

            • What makes you think your Xbox One console isn't spying on you just as much?

              Oh, don't get me wrong, I got off the Microsoft train at the 360 station, before it headed off to Kinect. My point is that it's still not a feature.

              My 360 isn't spying on me because it's in a crate.

              True, the big-M "Steam Machine" brand is used for devices that ship with SteamOS. But a small form factor PC running the Steam client, which you might colloquially call a small-m Steam machine, can also be a Mac mini or a Windows PC.

              See, there's the problem right there. What's a Steam Machine? What isn't? Which games will it run? Only calling a SteamOS machine a Steam Machine is important to reducing confusion, but it's also restrictive in terms of what is in the library. Problem is, in order to be sure a game will run on a "Steam Machine",

              • What makes you think your Xbox One console isn't spying on you just as much?

                Oh, don't get me wrong, I got off the Microsoft train at the 360 station

                What makes you think your PlayStation 3, Wii U, or PlayStation 4 console isn't spying on you just as much?

                Problem is, in order to be sure a game will run on a "Steam Machine", you have to restrict your list to the titles that run on Linux

                I concede that the existence of titles not ported to Linux and games' varying minimum CPU/GPU/RAM requirements could cause consumer confusion. But because a Steam Machine can act as a Steam Link endpoint, you can run a game on a compatible Windows PC elsewhere on your home LAN and display it on your Steam Machine's monitor.

                if you start calling Windows-based machines Steam Machines, you also have to look out for what small percentage of titles don't run on Windows.

                There are four possibilities for a Steam game: Windows-only; Windows and Linux; W

                • What makes you think your PlayStation 3, Wii U, or PlayStation 4 console isn't spying on you just as much?

                  Because if the PlayStation-foo's are, Sony isn't taking very good advantage of it.

                  I have a PS3, PS4, and Vita. I used to get MORE marketing from SCEA back in the PSone/PS2 days. Nowadays the only e-mail I get from SCEA are the notifications one gets when one buys something from PSN.

                  Heck, Blizzard sends me more marketing than Sony does.

                  I

                • What makes you think your PlayStation 3, Wii U, or PlayStation 4 console isn't spying on you just as much?

                  Microsoft has been proven to be spying. Show me some evidence that Nintendo or Sony is doing the same thing, and we'll talk about that.

                  I concede that the existence of titles not ported to Linux and games' varying minimum CPU/GPU/RAM requirements could cause consumer confusion. But because a Steam Machine can act as a Steam Link endpoint, you can run a game on a compatible Windows PC elsewhere on your home LAN

                  So can any decent Android STB, using Moonlight. And it's a lot better value, too. Also, that's not what we're talking about. We're talking about people buying Steam Machines right now.

  • Also Tflops are very useless as a measure of anything performance related.
    It's entirely possible to get some FPGAs and make a machine that does a lot TFLOPs by shoving several useless floating point negate circuits that keep processing a register.
    And while it's not as drastic on the case of the Xbone, it's quite possible they use the same architecture as on the Xbox one to keep backward compatibility, and this means the "6Tflops" it will offer are slower than the "6Tflops" you find on a modern videocard.

    • It's likely using the RX 480's architecture (which will maybe receive slight tweaks)
      Saying that because it's actually quite close to that of Xbox One and PS4, and going all the way back to the Radeon 7970. Same overall design with different configurations, bandwith saving improvements etc.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Z80a ( 971949 )

        The problem with some of those optimizations is that they make the "regular xbox one mode" be different in timming, sometimes enough to break some games, and this is a big no-no.

  • So the end of the perfectly optimised console game (Score:5, Insightful)

    by thegarbz ( 1787294 ) on Tuesday July 05, 2016 @03:53AM (#52446679)

    One of the great parts of the console world was standard performance. We were all on the same level. Our games looked and ran equally good. Most importantly they ran as well as the developer could make them run with exactly our hardware. Now we not only have cross platform games losing the ability to squeeze the last performance out of platforms with some games running horribly on one platform but not the other, now we also have multiple consoles in a single release cycle to play with?

    So consoles are going to lose the "it just works" benefit over the TV. Computers now can work with most console hardware, games are rarely console exclusives these days, and Microsoft is trying to unify the platforms.

    What is the purpose of the console?

    • Comment removed based on user account deletion

      • So nothing that can't be done with a PC now then.

      • Social gaming around a centralized monitor (TV) with plug-in-play functionality.

        Now that TVs are thin and affordable, I was under the impression that families had become willing to buy one TV and console per person rather than one TV and console per household. A LAN game from one bedroom to the other, combined with the runtime performance cost of calculating PVS and environment mapping for each split window, makes same-screen slightly less of a selling point now than it used to be. Plus online gaming supports play with friends who have moved away or with friends you met online.

        And if y

        • Comment removed based on user account deletion

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by tepples ( 727027 )

            Console gaming typically implies a level playing field were all gamers (local or online) have the same controller, same platform/specs, and the same resolution.

            And the same vanilla game, without user-created mods. Without mods for Half-Life, there wouldn't be a Team Fortress Classic or Counter-Strike.

      • If the guaranteed ability to put in a disc and play the game all the way to the end the first day you buy it is gone, then so is the advantage of a console. On the PC there are many times a game is released and isn't playable on a large portion of systems and needs to be patched, and these gamers have to wait an indeterminate amount of time to play the game they bought. Sure, you can return games on steam, but that doesn't solve the problem. You wanted to play that game at that moment for whatever reason.

        Or

    • What is the purpose of the console?

      A fool is easily separated from his/her money. The I need the newest shiny has been beaten into a new generation and they have no issues spending $500+ on new phones every new model, so upgrading to a new console will be no issue.

    • What is the purpose of the console?

      People have this amazingly misguided idea consoles were 'intended' to offer platform stability. That was NEVER the case. Instead it was an artifact of the development cycle: hardware costs money to develop, and that money has to be recovered. Only when sales slow down do console manufacturers invest in a new generation.

      Now it is different: AMD is designing the hardware, so instead of investing, Sony and Microsoft can do simple periodic refreshes at negligible cost. And since not doing so will cause one or t

      • Not "intended" but rather that has been the last major benefit and drawing card for them.

        PCs have been able to do anything a console does until now. After this there will be no reason left to buy a console.

        • PCs have been able to do anything a console does until now.

          Except run console specific games, and be truly affordable. Oh sure, you can buy a cheap PC, but the Master Race types on Steam would laugh at you if you called some $500 PC from a big box store a gaming rig. They'd be saying "Spend 1500 on a real rig n00b or j00 will get p@wn3d in LoL and TF2"

          After this there will be no reason left to buy a console.

          Plenty of reasons, games and game genres that don't appear on PC, preference for console controls that aren't the 360/Xbox one game pad, preference against using Windows, preference for not having to worry about sy

          • PCs have been able to do anything a console does until now.

            Except run console specific games, and be truly affordable. Oh sure, you can buy a cheap PC, but the Master Race types on Steam would laugh at you if you called some $500 PC from a big box store a gaming rig. They'd be saying "Spend 1500 on a real rig n00b or j00 will get p@wn3d in LoL and TF2"

            Cost is a matter of perspective. I'm gaming on a 6-year old PC now, with the only upgrade during that period being a new GPU. And I expect this machine to last me quite a few more years. I had it before the XBox One and PS4 came out, and I will still be playing on it by the time the Neo and Scorpio come out.

            Prices for games are lower on PC as well, especially now that we live in the era of the Steam Sale.

            As for what other people are saying... How exactly is their opinion relevant?

            After this there will be no reason left to buy a console.

            Plenty of reasons, games and game genres that don't appear on PC, preference for console controls that aren't the 360/Xbox one game pad, preference against using Windows, preference for not having to worry about system requirements/tweaking, one-button-it-just-works-easy-everything, and price.

            You can use a PS4 controlle

          • Oh sure, you can buy a cheap PC, but the Master Race types on Steam would laugh at you

            You're being laughed at anyway. There's nothing new there and on inherent real benefit to going console over PC in this case.

            Plenty of reasons, games and game genres that don't appear on PC

            I think you may have forgotten what else Microsoft is doing, Unified Windows Platform. The idea that there are magic console exclusive games is firstly very rare already and secondly about to disappear completely as the xbox and Windows 10 merge into one beast.

    • One of the advantages of consoles is that MS et al take a hand in what is allowed on the system. While it's true that some games on the XBox|PS are crap, in general you have more quality game releases on the consoles. The amount of utter-garbage that you have to wade through on Steam is becoming a disadvantage at this point -- with so many fricking mobile-ports and complete turd-like console ports with devs that barely even give an afterthought to KB+Mouse control scheme.

      • more quality game releases on the consoles.

        You mean like with the concept that every Xbox game will also be playable on the computer with the unified environment?

        The number of quality games is the same. AAA titles appear on all platforms. The percentage may be different, but then that all depends on what you define quality, and that answer is not budget or marketing.

    • "Why isn't the game properly optimized for the high end console? The low end is holding us back!"

      "Why isn't the game optimized for the low end? I'm getting frame rate drops and the high end are kicking our asses online, ever since they launched the new consoles they don't give a crap how it runs on the existing user base's console, they just want to upsell us!"

      The users will just be yelling at each other, at the devs, and at the console manufacturers. There's going to be even more crap than usual on forums

  • In the end it's going to be a just another console that studios dumb down game user interfaces for and make textures blurry for.

  • The GTX 1080 is nvidia's top of the line card. It's at 9 TFLOPS. It's out today- not in months, when something better will be available. And of course, you can link up two cards together, if you wanna go full retard.

    Anyway, obviously a lot more power in a console is nice. But I suspect there's a lot of marketing spin here, and the slashdot summary also helpfully points out that by 2017 the state of PC cards will be better.

    • It's also $700. You can buy both current consoles for that, and most likely a year or 2 after release, these new consoles will be $350 or so on sale.

      In addition, if you buy a console, there will be a ton of games available that efficiently utilize 100% of it's processing power. If you buy a 1080, this is far from the case. You will have to wait years until commonly available, well optimized games exist that efficient use the full power of a 1080.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by cfalcon ( 779563 )

        At this point, you are on to the fundamental differences between consoles and PCs. You could also bring up that the console games often become impossible to play online (and usually will), that the console will advertise to you endlessly, that the PC games will be supported or playable for decades instead of years, that way less games will be available for the console than the PC, etc.

        The core point is that talking about power and carefully choosing which bargain PC card you compare yourself to is just gar

  • The XBox and Playstation are canned PC's. There is no reason they couldn't have 1.5/2 year refreshes. The reason we have to wait until 2017 is that both consoles are AMD. And AMD's new processors won't be out until later this year and they need so many months in order to develop enough stock that the console kids aren't crying they can't get a hold of one.

    Quite frankly they need to be done with it and just put out their own proprietary x16 slot in the box. The next AMD processor will be a big deal but after

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