Microsoft-Built Smartphone Could Irritate Hardware Partners, Harm Nokia 100
Nerval's Lobster writes "Rumors have circulated for weeks that Microsoft intends to release a smartphone of its own design and manufacture, embracing the strategy that drove Apple's iPhone to such enormous success over the past few years. While releasing a branded smartphone offers several potential benefits—look at the revenue and brand recognition Apple's earned as a result of the iPhone—such a strategy also carries significant risks for Microsoft. First, it could alienate smartphone partners such as Nokia, which would find itself competing against a high-end device backed by Microsoft's sizable marketing dollars. (Given the Finnish phone-maker's already perilous situation, that could prove ruinous.) But a branded smartphone could also convince hardware manufacturers that Microsoft really is 'all in' on building its own devices, which could lead to all sorts of drama."
I can see it now ... (Score:5, Funny)
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Of course the Zune was really a pretty decent piece of hardware...
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Perhaps but the software SUCKED. God forbid you throw on a song with metadata containing a forward-slash / .
Go ahead, try, I dare you.
What's that? You can't read your tags for shit now?
Nope, that's what I thought.Try it with a whole host of other non alpha/numeric characters common to the English language, you'll find that the software BLOWS.
Re:I can see it now ... (Score:4, Insightful)
that virtually nobody bought because it was years late to the party.
Hmm, are there any parallels to the current situation?
Re:I can see it now ... (Score:5, Funny)
So... just like Google? (Score:3)
Last I checked you could buy an Android phone from Google (i.e. the Nexus phones) or from a 3rd party company.
How is this any different?
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Because Google just sets a standard for what should be called a Nexus device and just endorses it. Nothing more, the OEM does most of the work. Microsoft seems to want to completely design and build the device themselves.
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The Nexus Phones are made by someone else which is different. (Different one each time).
Seems less necessary for Microsoft though as they don't let OEM's break the OS completely.
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Microsoft does not build hardware itself. It subcontracts them to different producers.
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Re:So... just like Google? (Score:5, Informative)
Nexus One smartphone, manufactured by HTC, released January 2010
Nexus S smartphone, manufactured by Samsung, released December 2010
Galaxy Nexus smartphone, manufactured by Samsung, released in November 2011
Nexus 7 tablet, manufactured by Asus, released July 2012
Nexus Q, a media-streaming entertainment device, released June 2012
Nexus 4 smartphone, manufactured by LG, released November 2012
Nexus 10 tablet, manufactured by Samsung, released November 2012
that different
Re:So... just like Google? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:So... just like Google? (Score:5, Interesting)
Yeah, it's kind of funny that Nokia didn't want to be just another Android phone manufacturer, but now they've become just another Microsoft phone manufacturer.
Still, I'm sure Elop is just the man to get Nokia out of this sticky situation. Perhaps Microsoft will give him his old job back, once the job's been done....sorry, I mean once Nokia is beyond economic repair.
Re:So... just like Google? (Score:5, Insightful)
This is not even a joke. Have you seen the new (cough) clone (cough) from HTC. If I were Nokia I would be furious. And there is Microsof thinking, "oh gee lets help HTC because Nokia is effing this up." No Nokia is not effing this up! Nokia is building kick ass phones. It is Microsoft that is screwing things up. The upgrade path from Windows Phone 7 and Windows 8 was pure and unadulterated Microsoft eff up! When I heard about this I thought, "wow and we thought Android vendors had a sucky upgrade path."
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Yeah, it's kind of funny that Nokia didn't want to be just another Android phone manufacturer, but now they've become just another Microsoft phone manufacturer.
I don't get that either. Nokia has always prided itself on delivering an experience of software AND hardware. By sucking Microsoft's cock, they lost total control of the software and were severely constrained with their hardware too. Look at Nokia's new Windows phones vs HTCs new Windows phones. Practically indistinguishable. Nokia still have a few value ads like offline maps but it's not much.
It wouldn't have been plain sailing with Android either but they could have skinned Android six ways to Sunday i
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Nokia has always prided itself on delivering an experience of software AND hardware.
I don't know what software you are talking about, but the software I've seen before Elop started shaking things over wasn't something to be much proud of. This is perhaps the biggest reason why did they end up in their current position.
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Difference is that Android phones can actually differentiate themselves. Microsoft phones have very little latitude in hardware design, so there is next to no difference between phone A and phone B.
A Lumia 920 says "bullshit" to that.
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What does that have to do with hardware differentiation?
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Please elaborate. What Windows 8 phones does Lumia 920 differentiate itself from?
Any that don't have optical image stabilization in the camera, the touchscreen usable with gloves on, decent screen visibility in direct sunlight, sub-10ms screen reaction times, wireless charging, ability to withstand accidental drops from human-sized heights without a case, and Nokia exclusive apps. It's actually differentiation overkill: Lumia 920 has distinct features over any smartphone available on the market, no matter what the OS.
Re:So... just like Google? (Score:4, Interesting)
Microsoft phones have very little latitude in hardware design, so there is next to no difference between phone A and phone B. So an Android phone Google is not going to be much like a Samsung Galaxy Note III, but a Microsoft phone will be a lot like a Nokia.
Actually Windows Phones have very little lattitude in minimum and maximum tech specs of screens, no variation on number of hard buttons, nor processors. There are minimum memory requirements as well. Hardware in terms of style, is purely up to the manufacturer.
However, I think that the fear is that Microsoft will put out a phone with a *more powerful* processor and/or a *higher resolution* display than they allow the other Windows Phone licensees to, thus ensuring that no OEM can match Microsoft's top-of-the-line phone.
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However, I think that the fear is that Microsoft will put out a phone with a *more powerful* processor and/or a *higher resolution* display than they allow the other Windows Phone licensees to, thus ensuring that no OEM can match Microsoft's top-of-the-line phone.
Moar, highar. Meh.
I don't think Nokia is that into spec chasers' stupid money. They seem to differentiate on style, build quality, camera, and exclusive apps, none of which is impossible with the specs they can get now. The screen on the Lumia 920 is more than adequate, and I haven't heard complaints about the speed, either.
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I guess you could try reading the article for their reasons and how most of them don't apply to Google. But that would be effort.
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I would expect Microsoft to partner with Nokia on making the device (i.e. how Google partnered with Asus for the Nexus 7). It will be Microsoft designed and branded with Nokia doing the manufacturing. Nokia gets a cut of the Nokia branded devices as well as the MS branded ones. Won't hurt the partnership and still lets MS have their own phone.
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Indeed, how is one company designing, making, and selling a phone, different from another company co-designing, subcontracting the manufacture, and selling another phone ? How ?
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Microsoft would have great economies... (Score:5, Funny)
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Well, no, they'd need red too as of several years ago. ;)
Suck to be Nokia but good for rest of us (Score:1)
While it may be a net loss for Nokia (they have no one but themselves to blame), it will be good for consumers. Consumers need a third ecosystem, especially since WebOS is dead and BB10 looks uncertain. From what I have read, it seems like Microsoft might try out Chinese market first before launching in USA
BB10 looks uncertain (Score:3, Insightful)
No, it looks quite certain... to fail.
Re:Suck to be Nokia but good for rest of us - NOT (Score:1)
> While it may be a net loss for Nokia (they have no one but themselves to blame), it will be good for consumers. Consumers need a third ecosystem, especially since WebOS is dead and BB10 looks uncertain. From what I have read, it seems like Microsoft might try out Chinese market first before launching in USA
It does not work out like that... read about "Embrace, Extend, Extinguish". If History is any good as reference, M$ promotes a certain kind of consolidation that leaves markets with less choice -- us
Re:Suck to be Nokia but good for rest of us (Score:4, Insightful)
While it may be a net loss for Nokia (they have no one but themselves to blame), it will be good for consumers. Consumers need a third ecosystem, especially since WebOS is dead and BB10 looks uncertain. From what I have read, it seems like Microsoft might try out Chinese market first before launching in USA
That is the bingo word of the month "Ecosystem"; Windows do not have an ecosystem, and customers do not need one. They need compatibility and standards so their devices work with each other, but not an ecosystem. Ecosystem is just a bullshit word introduced by Microsoft shills because of the massive failure of Microsoft mobile, and are trying to utilise their desktop monopoly where it is of no value.
Oh and FYI Windows Phone still is fifth https://www.idc.com/getdoc.jsp?containerId=prUS23771812 [idc.com] behind Symbian and RIM. With no indication that the market wants of desires a player outside iOS and Android. The sad fact is Microsoft is a failure in Chinese market, as well as everywhere else. The figures are in Nokia's quarterly reports, but an overall market share of 2% says it all.
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Ecosystems... there's the people who are looking for distributed computing (apps, clouds, integration, media, etc.)
Then there's people who basically want a gadget that takes photos, does Facebook, and a few games.
Both types of customers seem to do well with Apple, so it is hard to say which is biggest. Apple has an ecosystem, but does it matter in the long run? The Apple Store is just too packed for me to believe they are all computing heads wanting to sync their calendars and note collections.
Android I dar
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Consumers need a third ecosystem
Why?
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for same reason we need a third party and third major desktop OS. a duopoly of control of anything is bad it encourages non conformance to standards and is bad for consumers. a third option alway insures that two "competitors" cant simply collude to screw the consumers because they will simply flee to the third option, also it breaks strong partisan ship that we can see in American politics where nothing changes because we only have two options that refuse to compromise and have extreme NIH syndrome.
that al
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Windows Phone is still way behind BlackBerry in market share, which is saying something. If you want to back an "I'm not dead yet" tech giant, you might as well back RIM as much as you'd back MS. I wouldn't put smart money on either of them myself though.
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Apple's strategy (Score:1)
Was/is to make good products. So microsoft is going to do a 180 now?
Re:Apple's strategy (Score:5, Insightful)
Was/is to make good products. So microsoft is going to do a 180 now?
No its really not. Apples [during Jobs] greatest success comes from getting users to spent money on high margin electronics; by being seen as first to market; with a compelling product, and marketing the hell out of it. Following apple into a mature market with a me too product is well the what Apple [post jobs] did with the iPad mini, only Microsoft doesn't have the same set of devoted followers, and those it neglected in the pursuit of being an electronics company.
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Yes, of course, because nobody used mobile phones before 2007. When iPhone was launched there were literally no other mobile phones in the world.
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There was no phone that even came close to the capabilities of the iPhone. Having said that, I am moving over to Android as Apple is losing its innovation edge. I really dislike the closed eco system. Works for a lot of people but not for me. Not anymore.
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This is blatantly wrong. iPhone was the device that lacked a lot of HW capabilities compared to other manufacturers. The brilliance of iPhone was in the fact that these HW capabilities stopped mattering. Why? Because everyone could build a mobile phone with a camera, GPS, fm radio, wifi, mobile hotspot, etc... Apple focused on software. They got it right with a lot easier to use touchscreen. Their APIs were also miles ahead of the competitors offerings in the ease of use apartment. You propably don't know h
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Without wishing to offend anybody, specifically Apple fans, I suspect this was due to the non replaceable battery failing quite early on. The short life cycle of each iteration meant that it was easier and more desirable to upgrade to the newest version rather than pay quite a lot to Apple to replace the battery.
Quite a shrewd business model provided that the user base is prepared to wear it.
The N95 was a truly poor phone. Not particularly well made and buggy as hell. I would rather have had the iPho
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The iPhone definitely led the way by a considerable margin. The fact that everyone has pretty much caught up is great for consumers.
Which company will be next to make the next large jump in innovation? Apple again? Or someone else?
The closed system of Apple leads to innovation as the hardware and software are designed together. Android is not hardware dependent and whilst there is close work with manufacturers there is no exclusivity in the same way as Apple. However, Android and Android phones have
I understand! (Score:2)
I finally figured out what's happening with these slashwhatever articles.
They've realized that since nobody reads TFA anyway, they can just post them and use the comments section to convince advertisers that slashwhatever is a worthwhile investment!
I can't believe I didn't see this before.
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Also:
Conclusion: Building its own Windows Phone smartphone might prove beneficial for Microsoft’s bottom line and prestige, but it could negatively affect its current partnerships.
Gee, nobody has said anything like that before - some truly original stuff here!
Nokia has been bled dry (Score:4, Insightful)
Microsoft have already walked away from Nokia, and threw them under the bus with Windows 8, they are making no pretence that Nokia are old news, and if anything are flirtying with HTC. The fact that they will abandon both [I don't think Samsung will lose any sleep] is sadly predictable. LG is profitable again after dumping windows and moving to Android exclusively, maybe they learnt something :).
What is terrifying is Nokia ignoring the original stupidity of choosing windows...exclusively seem to have no back up plan, and are acting like they have no option. They have cut too many people, and moved manufacturing to china, and seem to be moving into the Patent trolling with Microsoft...but nothing else.
Looks like Android is going to grab even more market share before this sorry tale is over.
Really Anger Partners? :) (Score:2)
I understand the Surface, as many manufacturers had that dream of making The Next iPad Killer(tm) (which, incidentally, never seemed to materialized, until Amazon and Google stepped up, and even then, it's still all wobbly and transparent around the edges) but phones?
As of right now, the amount of handsets Windows Phone platform sends is small. So, while losing that tiny percentage might be irritating, I don't see how it would really anger partners. Aside from Nokia that was being systematically destroyed e
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I understand the Surface, as many manufacturers had that dream of making The Next iPad Killer(tm)
I'm not disagreeing with you. I just find the term "iPad killer"(sic) outdated https://www.idc.com/getdoc.jsp?containerId=prUS23772412 [idc.com] Apples tablet market share dropped to a new low of 50.4%.
Starcraft anyone? (Score:3)
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I can't imagine anyone bragging about having a Microsoft branded phone.
They're just not cool.
It is nothing to do with being cool...although cool goes a long way. Microsoft always sold more on the desktop, even today Microsoft machines outnumber Apple machines 20:1. Its simply not a good OS, Android is only just 5 years old and has 75% of the market...Microsoft has 2%. The carriers don't like it...The customers don't want it.
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Microsoft always sold more on the desktop, even today Microsoft machines outnumber Apple machines 20:1
I daresay Apple machines outnumber Microsoft machines by a factor closer to infinity because there's no such thing as a Microsoft machine. Microsoft isn't - yet - a hardware manufacturer. If you're talking about operating-system-software licences then Microsoft peaked in 2004 with a Windows:Mac ratio of about 56:1. Now, if you include iOS as an operating system, the ratio has dropped to about 2:1.
See:
http:/ [asymco.com]
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if you include iOS as an operating system, the ratio has dropped to about 2:1.
No not even close the number of Desktop PC's in the world is about 1.6Billion http://www.c-i-a.com/pr02012012.htm [c-i-a.com] to pit that figure into some kind of perspective Apple only sold 26.9Million iPhones last quarter https://www.idc.com/getdoc.jsp?containerId=prUS23771812 [idc.com]. Even Android which sells 5 times as many phones as the iphone is only expected to overtake PC's in 2016.
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only expected to overtake PC's in 2016.
You say it takes 9 years of tablet sales to overtake 30 years of PC sales? You misuse the word "only".
To Late for Street Cred (Score:1)
I think Microsoft is just too little, too late, too lazy to keep up and they won't have more than a minor impact. App developers would have to be working overtime to support it and I don't hear anything about that occurring.
Other Manufacturers Can't Complain (Score:1)
The other device makers really can't complain here from what I see. MS is starting to make their own products because quite frankly, the products made by others have been mediocre at best. They have had many years to pick up their game but none of them have. MS really does owe them nothing and if MS can make a better device themselves then they most definitely should because the others quite clearly can't.
I find it very interesting that Software companies (Apple, Google, MS, Amazon) have all taken to har
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"MS is starting to make their own products because quite frankly, the products made by others have been mediocre at best."
What bullshit. The Lumia range had the looks, but where limited by Microsofts control over hardware...yes you read that right. It was a recipe for disaster. Single core in 2012 for WTF, but it wasn't the hardware that stopped users buying the range as the success of the N9 shows, or that hybrid symbian Chinese device shows, people just didn't want windows. I would have bought one at its
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Well I was talking generally not absolutely. But either way. MS must believe they can do a fair bit better if they are deciding to go it themselves. They seem to have done not too badly with the Surface so I'm actually keen to see what they pull off with a phone.
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MS must believe they can do a fair bit better if they are deciding to go it themselves.
You mean like they did with ZUNE???
TOTAL FAIL
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At the moment I would say that point is quite valid. How long that holds could be an interesting question however. I think Ballmer is going nowhere but Sinofsky is different. I think his style and approach have real potential and he's starting to find his stride. Give it a few years and I think he is going to be responsible for some big turn arounds in terms of what MS produces and we are just starting to see the inflection point.
Now I'm actually a Linux and Apple fan myself and normally don't think muc
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Ok, I'll accept I was wrong there, but they are definitely in the software business and I believe they have applied a lot of what they learnt there to their hardware side of things and it is part of the reason their hardware is top notch.
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because quite frankly, the products made by others have been mediocre at best.
WHAT A LAUGH! What Microsoft hardware has EVER been better than "mediocre"??? Keyboards and mice made by other companies? Overheating Xboxes??? Zunes that crash???
I find it very interesting that Software companies (Apple
APPLE is a software company??? They make telephones and MP3 players and media centers! Oh and computers too!
Google
GOOGLE is manufacturing hardware??? SINCE WHEN???
This is a perfect example of skills learnt in one area translating very elegantly into another.
Your comment is a perfect example of COMPLETE IGNORANCE.
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GOOGLE is manufacturing hardware??? SINCE WHEN???
They own Motorola Mobility, who does make Hardware.
APPLE is a software company???
"The big secret about Apple is that Apple views itself as a Software Company"-Steve Jobs
(See: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEeyaAUCyZs [youtube.com])
Your comment is a perfect example of COMPLETE IGNORANCE
4/10. See me after class.
Hard rice (Score:5, Insightful)
Interesting comment from Taiwan maker Acer about Microsoft's going into hardware competition:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-10805_3-57545024-75/acer-warns-microsoft-that-hardware-is-like-hard-rice/ [cnet.com]
I like the phrase they used: "like eating hard rice"
Clearly, the hardware manufacturers who have been subservient to Microsoft are looking at a new reality and will have to decide what to support.
This may give them the motivation to move to Android for phones and tablets and ignore Microsoft's offerings.
Except for the X Box (Score:3)
what other hardware has MS been successful with. None that I know off. They came in with XBox just in time to catch the Dreamcasts death now the the iPhone and Android juggernauts its not going to happen. Plus MS hardware seems to have the mom and dad in sweat pants image instead of the cool kid on the block.
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Microsoft: king of the rodents.
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Exactly what I came to say. I still use on a daily basis the original Microsoft IntelliMouse on my Windows gaming machine. I have a couple of other Microsoft mice, also. I think I paid $95 for the IntelliMouse - this is when LED mice first came out. It was/is worth every penny.
Will they re-use the Kin brand? (Score:5, Informative)
There is probably a lot of "slack" in the Windows 8 phone pricing as well - if the Windows RT "OEM license fee" is 80-95$ [extremetech.com], the Phone OS OEM price can't be far off. I'm sure Nokia, HTC and Samsung won't mind if they've got to add an extra 80$ in cost for each phone they produce which Microsoft doesn't have to worry about..
From handgun to shotgun (Score:1)
Rectangular, with ... (Score:2, Funny)
Apple will sue!
If not for Nokia I would say do it! (Score:1)
History Repeats (Score:3)
It's not like they have not done it before. They built OS2 for IBM then did a 180 and made a competing product in parallel called windows. The then turned their back on IBM when they where in a position to do so. OS2 was reduced to a cult following.
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Simple solution: MS buy Nokia (Score:2)
Nokia can probably be had for relative peanuts now that their trojan Elop has done his best to [strike]wreck[/strike] stabilize the company, and that will also give them access to all the cross licensing agreements that are present in the telecoms market. As a bonus, I don't think Nokia have got into many lawsuits...
Seriously? (Score:4, Interesting)
Microsoft fucks over partner. News at... Seriously? If this comes unexpected to you, you must have joined /. - or, indeed, this plant - very recently. If I recall correctly, ever since Nokia got put in chains, the question asked here was not if, but when this would happen.
Lesson: If you get in bed with Microsoft, you are a whore. And whores get screwed.
Re:Seriously? (Score:4, Insightful)
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Pete Peterson, former WordPerfect executive
Soon to be Nokia's Quote (Score:2)
- Pete Peterson, former WordPerfect executive