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Hardware Hacking Hardware

Cheap to Audiophile with Simple Hacks 348

petertrog writes "The IEEE has a story showing how you can turn a cheap DVD player into something that sounds a whole lot more exotic. All you need is a small budget, a soldering iron and a desire to void your warranty."
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Cheap to Audiophile with Simple Hacks

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  • by bigwavejas ( 678602 ) * on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:10PM (#12969360) Journal
    Build some cheap speakers to go along with the player http://members.aol.com/_ht_a/Debertin/spbuild.htm [aol.com]
    • by OverlordQ ( 264228 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:20PM (#12969413) Journal
      Even better [afrotechmods.com] speakers.
    • by MrHanky ( 141717 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:30PM (#12969459) Homepage Journal
      You can build OK speakers at low cost, but not really good ones. There's a reason why manufacturers like B&W use exotic materials like kevlar for their speaker membranes: It's light and very stiff. And good speaker membranes have to be just that, because they need to move easily without bending (which distorts the sound). There are some good paper drivers out there, but even those are rather expensive.

      On the other hand, good speaker design is quite difficult. It's both acoustic and electrical engineering, and a bit of black magic (or luck). Or you can buy a speaker kit, and build from other people's designs. I did that, and my $1000 speakers sound like $2000 speakers, and look like $20 home-made shit.
      • <pedantic>
        Kevlar isn't stiff, it's strong in tension. Carbon fiber is stiff.
        On the other hand, with the right weave and resin you can make a strong, stiff cone with kevlar.
        Carbon would be better though...
        • My bass drivers are actually made of magnesium. Of course, one problem with very hard materials is that they usually ring at specific frequencies. So they have to be dampened, making them even heavier, thus demanding more powerful amps -- if not, they just sound terrible.
          • While I know that speakers are an extremely personal thing....and I always say, "buy what you think sounds best"...

            I'd highly recommend the old horn loaded speakers by Klipsch like these klipschorns [klipsch.com] . They are so effecient. I don't want to start a flame war on tube vs. SS...pick what you want. Me? I fell in love with tube amps paired with horn speakers when I was twelve..

            I finally was able to get a pair of the 50th anniversary K-Horns a few years back...and run them off a Decware [decware.com] amp that is SET tube

      • I got a pair of B&W 604's. They're worth every penny, if you have the money to get the right electronics to drive them.

        On the other hand, might be a hell of a lot of fun to build your own speakers - but if it's $1000 for a $2000 sounding speaker (without support), then I might be tempted to still buy - ascetics can be important, and minor errors in building your speakers may result in getting $100 boom boxes instead of quality sound reproduction.
      • What kit did you use, btw? I'm going to put together a pair of Ellis 1801s this summer and am looking forward to listening to them.
        • I've got a pair called Eltek [dynabel.no] Exact (a Norwegian make). They use bass/mid drivers from the Seas Excel range, like the Ellis 1801, but probably not quite as good tweeters.

          Just be patient while building them, and you can make them look good as well. Mine don't really look cheap, but they do look homemade.
    • Build their own drivers too, not just stick a set in a homebuilt box.
  • Cables (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:12PM (#12969371)
    Nooo, you need MONSTER CABLES for the best quality! Aahhh, your signal!!
    • Re:Cables (Score:5, Funny)

      by qengho ( 54305 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:34PM (#12969473)


      Nooo, you need MONSTER CABLES for the best quality!

      Pfft. Monster Cables are useless--useless, I say--if you don't have a US$1500 power cord:

      Tweak the power supply all you want, but it's pointless without one of those.
      • Re:Cables (Score:4, Insightful)

        by RoundSparrow ( 341175 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:45PM (#12969511)
        You know... I really fear this isn't a joke, is it?

        $1500 power cord (The JBS review) the guy actually implies it is justified!

        Does he not know what crap is behind the walls you plug into? How can you think that just the last 10 foot of a power cord is going to make any sigificant difference given the other kilometers of wire involved?
        • Re:Cables (Score:4, Insightful)

          by warrax_666 ( 144623 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:51PM (#12969536)
          Does he not know what crap is behind the walls you plug into?

          You underestimate the power of suggestion (and ignorance).
        • Re:Cables (Score:3, Funny)

          by stienman ( 51024 )
          The wire in the cables is silver. While it's still a huge rip-off, at least you are getting silver instead of copper. You can recoup some of your investment by melting them down and selling them, but it's still not worth 1/10th what you're paying.

          -Adam
      • I think the Kaptovator is marketing Crap (with a capital 'C'). Nice packaging and assorted bullshit. And to top it off... kapton... oooooooo... it's used in high tech stuff like the aircraft industry. It looks like this might not be the case any more. From what I can tell from having read a number of articles, it's mainly because that's the stuff that once it gets old it gets brittle and catches fire very easily if there is any sort of short. In fact it seems somewhat explosive (see the Arc Tracking
    • by Grog6 ( 85859 )
      ...Gaurenteed oxygen free, is the only material to make speaker wires from; unless youre really high end, and buy the solid gold, 4AWG, rope lay, speaker wires. ...And if you have that kind of discerning ear, and money to back it, have I got a system to sell you... ..and some really good swamp, I mean, lakefront property to sell...

    • Re:Cables (Score:5, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:54PM (#12969552)
      How to become an audiophile with one easy hack:
      1. Open your skull and hack off your frontal lobe.
      If you've performed the hack successfully you'll believe that $3000/ft speaker cable is a good idea. Congratulations, you are now a fully qualified audiophile!
    • You need Monster's GOLD PLATED FIBRE OPTIC CABLES!

      The mind boggles.
    • Re:Cables (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Linker3000 ( 626634 )
      Don't you just need to stick a patch like this [tomshardware.com] on the unit?
    • Re:Cables (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Axe ( 11122 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @06:02PM (#12970879)
      Audiophiles are nuts.

      Reminds me of a different story about those fancy expensive wine glasses that supposedly improve wine tasting experience.

      They are still beeing hyped by some most prominent wine critics. In all professional reviews there was a clear improvement of wine score when tasted from those glasses.

      The problem was - after those experiments were properly repeated as a double blind study, any difference completely dissappeared.

      The lesson was - hype does affect your taste.

      Actually, I am not saying it is bad. If they enjoy the illusion - that's just fine.

  • by Lije Baley ( 88936 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:17PM (#12969395)
    Wow, an audiophile article from the IEEE. Next thing you know, we'll have witch doctors contributing to the Journal of the American Medical Association.
    • by GigsVT ( 208848 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:23PM (#12969429) Journal
      The article has a strong basis in real improvements. The slashdot title is an insult to it.

      The instructions involve things like replacing cheap caps with low-ESR versions, putting in better diodes in the bridge in the power supply, replacing cheap op-amps...

      All these things are legit improvements and are also where the corners are really cut in the cheaper players.

      So don't dismiss it because of the slashdot submitter/editor's ignorance.
      • Yeah, but... (Score:2, Insightful)

        by Gordonjcp ( 186804 )
        ... "vibration-induced clock jitter"? Get to fuck...
        • Re:Yeah, but... (Score:3, Insightful)

          by Jeffrey Baker ( 6191 )
          Do you feel that crystal oscillators are immune to vibration? That would seem to contradict the basic principle of quartz crystal operation (the piezoelectric effect). Indeed, the cheap low-grade ceramic bypass capacitors, of which there are probably dozens or hundreds in the average DVD player, demonstrate substantial piezoelectric behavior. You can tap a Y5V ceramic capacitor with the tip of a pencil and see the effects on your oscilloscope.

          These are the sorts of things that get you from 16-bit perfo

          • Re:Yeah, but... (Score:3, Insightful)

            by Gordonjcp ( 186804 )
            There is a *massive* difference between mechanical vibration of the package, and the modal vibration within the crystal itself.


            How about learning a wee bit about how these things work, first?

      • the power supply mods I can make sense of... but personally, I'd ignore the analogue side and just hook the digital sound output straight into the digital input of my system pre-amp... and I'd make sure I'd gotten a DVD player with a DVI output and not a crummy scart one...
    • The JAMA regularly prints articles about drugs ripped off ("extracted") from traditional witch doctor remedies. Electronic engineers (the "EE" in IEEE) design audiophile equipment. Your point?
    • by Grog6 ( 85859 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @01:01PM (#12969578)
      .. Of electronics I buy; the main amp in my car I bought for ~$150, put in ~$50 in better transistors, and a few critical resistors, and have a really nice amp, until it overheats. The watercooling project is next, I guess.

      The thing in the article that pegged my bullshit detector is the 'audible difference' in capacitors. I design high frequency pulse amplifiers, and at subnanosecond risetimes, capacitors act pretty awful. but in the audio range, there is no way to hear the difference in a good quality capacitor. Below 1MHz there isn't enough difference to measure. You might hear the difference between a low quality, floor swwepings quality z5u capacitor at 20kHz, an a high quality silver mica cap, but I seriously doubt it.

      P-channel mosfets are more expensive than N channel mosfets; If you look at the parts in any car amp, the P-channel parts are the lowest rated; replacing them is an easy way to improve the capabilities of an amp. but you have to upgrade the power supply as well, usually to take advantage of the improvement.

      And replacing the resistors in the signal path with metal film, if they're not already, is an audible improvement.

      Replacing the capacitors, with no design check, will result in shit blowing up, just as specified. Inrush current is a bitch. Replacing the output caps on a power supply board with larger ones is not a good idea; the lead inductance is a design constraint. The need to go in the same holes.

      Also, FRED diodes are soft recovery, with no ringing. Schottky diodes ring like a bitch, and are why fred's were developed.

      If you add capacitance to a switching power supply, do it at the circuit you want to help out, not at the power supply. The resistance of the wire going to the circuit board will damp the inrush current to the additional capacitance.
      1 ohm of wire makes a huge difference in the surge current when you turn it on.

      If I spent $10 on a capacitor, I guess I'd say I could hear it too...
      • Schottky diodes do not "ring". No single component can ring, you need a circuit, with more than one component, before you get ringing. A Schottky barrier diode has no stored charge, and therefore does not snap off like a normal juntion diode. FREDs and other controlled-recovery diodes do have stored charge, but their recovery condition is characterized and guaranteed by the manufacturer. Many FREDs will cause terrible ringing. You have to design around their recovery characteristic.

        Basically I wanted

  • Needs (Score:5, Funny)

    by XFilesFMDS1013 ( 830724 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:20PM (#12969412)
    All you need is a small budget, a soldering iron and a desire to void your warranty.

    Small budget - After getting a new computer, I have that

    A soldering iron - Oh yeah, I've got that

    And a desire to void your warranty - My desire to void my warranty has never been greater...
  • by ivan256 ( 17499 ) * on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:23PM (#12969426)
    I'd like to see him put this stuff on the scope before and after each of these changes. That way we could get an idea of what he means by a 'dramatic improvement'. I can see the op-amp changes and the power supply upgrades helping a lot... However I have a hard time believing that he would be able to demonstrate a difference in the analog output with some reference tones by, say, buffering the crystal from vibration on a standard scope. I'm sceptical he can hear the jitter too. Even cheap clocks these days are pretty damned good once everything warms up.
    • by Animats ( 122034 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:39PM (#12969490) Homepage
      Yeah.

      That article makes me embarassed to be an IEEE member.

      Those "special $50 capacitors" sound like a rip-off. There are grades of capacitors, but no small-value cap costs $50 from Digi-Key.

      Another amusing point is the mania for expensive RCA jacks in the audiophile world. Any BNC connector, which is what you see on pro audio gear (and most video gear), has better high-frequency response than the fanciest RCA jack. And BNC jacks latch, so they don't come loose. Yet the audiophile nuts are still equipping their overpriced amps with RCA jacks.

      Really, if you're going to do stuff like this, the first step is to put a scope on the power supply outputs and watch them under load. If you see noise or changes under load, it's time to do power supply work. You may need to juggle capacitors or add inductors, like ferrite beads. It's quite common to see some digital noise spikes getting into the power to the analog circuitry, and you've got to get rid of that. But there's nothing mysterious about how to do it. Without measurement tools, though, you don't get anywhere.

      • by Anonymous Coward
        Any BNC connector, which is what you see on pro audio gear

        i think you mean XLR's, ive worked in the PA biz for 15years and never seen a BNC for audio (video they use them though)

        XLR's are the standard for line input (preferabbly Neutrik(TM)) because its 3 core balanced wheras RCA connectors are not balanced which means interference and crosstalk

        Steve
        GeminiAudio

        • by Animats ( 122034 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @01:05PM (#12969601) Homepage
          BNC on audio gear is rare, but not unheard of. There's a trend away from it, though, because consumers are used to BNC for video and RCA for audio.

          If you have balanced output, XLRs are appropriate. But most consumer-grade (and even most audiophile gear) doesn't have balanced outputs. And, actually, BNC connectors have better frequency response; they're coaxial all the way through, and nearly flat to 50MHz at least. If you have access to a time-domain reflectometer, you can see the difference. Not that it really matters for audio.

          For a good laugh, see these RCA cables. [rscables.com] Palladium wires with solid silver RCA plugs. "You will enjoy a pitch black background, deep, yet lightning fast bass, smooth midrange, and most importantly, seemingly limitless top end extension. Though not at all bright or fatiguing in any manner, Pure Palladium's sparkling highs allow for the presence of the often coveted sense of air as well as glorious imaging and soundstage. This interconnect possesses the ability to untangle even the most complex pieces of music." $1,550.00 for a pair of 1.5 meter cables.

          Any common video cable with BNC connectors will do better than that.

          • Sorry about the moron-gram you got. I don't have mod points to squash him appropriately right now.

            Your comments are interesting. Do you know of any reliable resources where I can find out more about such things? I'm no audio nut by far, but I *am* interested in finding out what I can do to improve my audio gear without being hopelessly ripped off.
            • by Animats ( 122034 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @02:14PM (#12969893) Homepage
              I saw the moron gram too. Actually, BNC on audio gear is rare, but it does show up in broadcast equipment [harris.com] and ham gear. BNC audio interconnects were more common 20 years ago than they are now. Consumers have now been educated that BNC = video and RCA = audio, so if you violate that convention, you get phone support calls.

              There's a tendency in the RF world to run everything through BNC connectors, whether you need to or not. Signal generators and scopes usually come with BNC connectors, so if you have those, you tend to have lots of BNC-BNC cables around the bench. Plus the little drawer of T-connectors, angle connectors, and adapters. Hence its popularity in the ham, broadcast, and scientific instrument worlds.

              The main problem with RCA connectors is that they bend and become loose as they wear out. That's why they're avoided in PA gear. XLR connectors self-align better and latch into place.

              Actually, I do servomotor control [overbot.com], which has most of the problems of audio but with bigger currents. Keeping the huge chopped motor currents from inducing noise into nearby analog sensors is a major headache. But with extra capacitors and inductors, it's a solveable problem.

              In any case, without a scope you can't do anything but guess.

              The ARRL Handbook is a good source for info about power supply filtering.

        • I don't know how widespread they are, but they definitely crop up in the wild on audio gear. The (now aged) Cambridge Audio DACMagic II I'm listening to has BNC for inputs and digital pass-through, as well as XLR and RCA outputs. It was only a couple of hundred dollars a few years back.

          Of course the BNCs have little adapters hanging off them to RCA, because nothing else (audio) I own has BNC connections...

      • Certainly you aren't implying that improving the power supply is useless, right? Your average consumer equipment comes with a power supply that is regulated only at very low frequencies, whereas the electronics in such a device need clean operation often up to 1MHz or more to acheive their nominal goals (24-bit, 192KHz reproduction, for example).

        The $50 capacitors are contiuously-wound film-and-foil polypropylene capacitors. They are very expensive not because their margins are so high, but simply becau

    • by katharsis83 ( 581371 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @01:07PM (#12969612)
      A signal which comes out cleaner on the scope, up to a certain point, will also sound better to the human hear, but past that point, it just comes down to preference. This is why studio engineers often add "color" to a song, and why some audiophiles still swear by vaccum tubes. The vaccum tubes don't produce anywhere near a flat frequency response through the 20kHz range, but instead color it in a way that people describe as "warm."

      The point is, you can try and make changes to flatten the frequency response as much as possible, but it may NOT be the sound output you're looking for. The scope would, of course, be useful to track down problems with power supply noise, but when it comes down to swapping op-amps or other stuff, it's often times more subjective than not, which is what his article says. Here, seeing the scope output is useless, because the only important this is whether you like the resulting sound output.

      I'd like to agree with you on the part about the clock though, but I have never looked clock outputs when they get shaken/etc, so can't really comment.
      • Here, seeing the scope output is useless, because the only important this is whether you like the resulting sound output.

        The scope isn't just to ensure a flat response. It can also tell you if changing one capacitor, op-amp, etc. for another one had any effect at all, or if the difference is psychological.
    • I agree.

      The author provides no objective evidence of improvement. Instead, we get: "The tone had been slightly light(?). Modification increased the body(?) of the tone--for example, a guitar sound that previously was all string now includes the wood of the instrument. The stock unit had a bit of congestion(?) on dynamic passages, especially evident on massed strings. Not anymore; the top and bottom ends are detailed(?), extended, and inviting(?). The soundstage, that is, the virtual placements of the

      • Well then, in the interest of forcing audiophiles to make up some new words, let's come up with some concrete definitions for these. To start us off, here's how I would read some of these terms. I doubt any self-respecting audiophile would agree with me :-)

        soundstage is, as you suggested, stereo separation. I might also include the presence of very high-frequency response in it, since there's some evidence frequencies we don't perceive conciously still affect our ability to place the source.

        extended is ea
    • Or better yet do a double blind test with some volunteers. Part of the problem as I understand it is that a lot of very expensive audio gear does absolutely fuck all for the quality of the sound. It's just that people expect it to improve the sound so they mistakenly perceive that it does. Some idiots even go so far as to pay $500 to replace the audio knobs on their equipment. That's $500 per knob. A blind test would eliminate that bias.
  • by flajann ( 658201 ) <fred.mitchell@ g m x .de> on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:26PM (#12969443) Homepage Journal
    I dunno, my time is too valuable to bother doing the upgrade myself. Better just to buy the high-end at 10x the price and save 100x in the cost of my time.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:30PM (#12969460)
    That is the first real 'Audiophile' tweaks article I have ever seen. It actually detailed real changes you can make to improve the sound of your equipment.

    The only reason people purchase expensive interconnects etc is because those components are very easy to change. NOT because they have a significant effect on the fidelity of reproduction.

    To really improve the sound you have to improve power supply, decoupling caps etc, but even though the components are very cheap, it's a lot harder than buying a $500 interconnect cable.

    I hope to see more articles like this in the future!
  • 5.1 cheapo (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Solder Fumes ( 797270 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:30PM (#12969464)
    I grabbed one of those $35 "5.1 surround sound" speaker systems from Wal-Mart. They only accept a stereo input, and just kind of mix in the surrounds, center, and sub. So I popped it open and ran the numbers on the chips inside, locating the 6-channel volume control IC. I discovered that if I ran an audio signal directly to the inputs on the chip, it bypassed the stereo upmix. A few wires and drilled holes later, I had actual surround sound for my computer. Not gonna say it's the greatest sounding setup ever, but it was cheap.
  • by JKR ( 198165 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:32PM (#12969467)
    This article is basically an advert for LC Audio (whose own stuff doesn't look anything special - look at the ringing on the scope trace of their wunderkind clock oscillator), mixed in with the usual audiophile crap (where's the blind A/B comparison?) with a healthy dose of stupidity; anyone advocating replacing safety-rated components on the mains side with unrated "audiophile" grade parts deserves to be sued by the first idiot who burns his house to the ground. The mains is a hostile environment, those components are designed to fail open-circuit for a REASON!

    Jon.
    • by Dun Malg ( 230075 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @01:00PM (#12969577) Homepage
      anyone advocating replacing safety-rated components on the mains side with unrated "audiophile" grade parts deserves to be sued by the first idiot who burns his house to the ground.

      No, any idiot who burns his house to the ground like that gets what's coming to him. There's no liability (nor should there be) in the sharing of stupid ideas. Liability lies with the implementation. Allow me to share my recipe for sewing needle salad:

      1 cup shredded carrots
      10 leaves iceberg lettuce, chopped
      1 pound sewing needles (or thumbtacks, if needles are out of season)

      mix well, serve cold

      I eagerly await the first spurious lawsuit.
  • by venicebeach ( 702856 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:35PM (#12969479) Homepage Journal
    Man, this is racy stuff. When I read the first line:

    When those of us who are into "gadget porn" look at the latest state-of-the-art home entertainment gear

    I didn't know what he was talking about until I got a little further:

    Taking the modification yet further, you can also replace both of the X-rated capacitors

  • Finally... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Transcendent ( 204992 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:37PM (#12969481)
    ...now I know the purpose of my EE degree.

    It seems simple enough. Basically you're replacing components with ones that are better with no major rewiring of the circuitry. Diodes with faster switching times, add noise reducing capacitors, gold terminals instead of nickel or tin, replace the op-amps to get better slew rates and less distortion... etc. All this is pretty much what the more expensive models would have done anyway.

    This is a good general reference for those who aren't afraid of electronics. But, I strongly warn against it for anyone who really doesn't know what they're doing (especially the ones who can't solder). These components are simple enough, and swapping identical devices shouldn't be too hard, but going from schematic to PCB is very challenging if you're not used to it.

    On a side note... Favorite quote: "Plug it in and turn it on. No sparks or smoke? Terrific!"
  • by autopr0n ( 534291 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @12:47PM (#12969518) Homepage Journal
    My $35 DVD player has a digital (coaxial) output, and my PS2 has an digital (optical) output (but, the laser is blown and it can't play disks with even the smallest scratches). Why mess with the electronics inside when you can get the audio data right off the disk into your system?
    • Where do you pipe the digital output to? At some point in your system, you've got a DAC. It's highly likely that the DAC in whatever you've plugged in the digital output isn't a good one.
    • Sony was replacing/repairing all PS2's that go belly up with a "Disc Read Error" on all discs. They did it for me. I only had to pay shipping. Give their 800 number a ring, just tell them what's going on and see if they'll offer it to you.
  • by Anonymous Coward

    High end audiophiles will squak. Meridian's G98 [meridian-audio.com] costs $6k (review [avrev.com]), the Lexicon RT20 [lexicon.com] is $5k, an Ayre [ayre.com] costs $6k, and the Arcam FMJ 29 [arcam.co.uk] (highly rated starting end of high end) will set you back $3k. The top reference player, Meridan 808, will set you back $20k.

    The Denon 2910 [denon.com] (about $600) (review [audioholics.com]) is the beginning of better quality players. The article being discussed does exactly what a lot of the higher end players do -- swap out cheap parts for better ones. For those who don't think it makes a differ

  • But can he tell me how to build a filter to add distortion so it sounds like the "sweet, sweet" sound of a $20,000 tube amplifier?
  • Dumb question (Score:4, Interesting)

    by MeanMF ( 631837 ) * on Saturday July 02, 2005 @01:10PM (#12969631) Homepage
    Don't most people hook their DVD players up to their receivers using either an optical or a coaxial digital cable? Why would changing anything in the dvd player make any kind of difference in the sound quality if all the player is doing is passing along a digital bitstream to the receiver?
  • by gvc ( 167165 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @01:46PM (#12969776)
    Audiophiles believe in paranormal phenomena that cannot be verified by any scientific process.

    So this guy's player sounded better after he replaced the caps, resistors, power supply? He could tell by listening to it? With how much - a day - interval between the two auditions?

    One of two things happened - he made no discernible difference and only imagines he improved the equipment. Or he made it much, much worse, and likes the distortions he introduced.

    Correctly functioning players - even the cheapest - have such low noise, low distortion, and flat frequency response within the human audio spectrum that nobody has yet been able to demonstrate - in double-blind level-matched synchronized A/B comparisons - that they can tell the difference.

    If you want to improve your stereo performance, concentrate on the "I/O" devices - speakers, monitors, and microphones. They introduce many orders of magnitude more color than the electronic components.
    • by shirai ( 42309 ) * on Saturday July 02, 2005 @04:54PM (#12970608) Homepage
      Oh come on now. This is such carp that it deserves to be refuted. I can't believe nobody has. Some of your main points are valid but you back it up by saying correctly functioning players all sound the same?

      Sure some people induce voodoo into the audiophile world but that doesn't mean there aren't any real world differences. I would bet you that YOU could tell the differences between two CD players (assuming one was very good and one was merely decent) in a GOOD system setup.

      All CD players do not sound the same! I repeat. All CD players do not sound the same. And you don't have to be an audiophile to know it.

      They will sound the same in a piece of SH*T system. I repeat. They will sound the same in a piece of SH*T system.

      I can put my dad and my mom in front of my stereo system and they can tell the difference. They are the first ones to complain that they wouldn't be able to hear a difference so why waste money. Then all of a sudden they are talking about how clear it sounds. Girlfriend was the same.

      I could put them up against two decent CD players (one a Marantz Special Edition and one a Toshiba DVD player) and swap them with very good CD players (a Creek CD player or any CD player with my external DAC1), and they could tell the difference on otherwise equal equipment.

      Frequency response all equal? Give me a break. There is NO deep bass coming out of the Toshiba DVD and the Marantz (which I had high hopes for) has no clarity. This isn't the kind where you have to strain so hard to hear the differences.

      I don't think I can tell the difference between any pair of decent audio cables but I can hear the differences in the CD players. I would never confidently be able to A/B audio cables. I will A/B anybody on my CD players anytime.

      Although I can't say for sure that is absolutely frequency response as it might be some other artificat that reduces the bass response. I'm not an audio scientific expert (though pretty well versed) but perhaps it is a bad harmonic that makes the bass appear weaker. Whatever. I HEAR a difference.

      Also, frequency response isn't the be all end all. It measures one specific very controlled setup. The Marantz lacks crispness though it can very well not be frequency response. It could be something else. My DAC has a re-timing crystal that removes jitter. Again. I'm not going to try and explain the differences. Merely that there are differences.

      The point is this. You CAN hear differences. ANYBODY can hear differences not just the audiophile elite. I was as skeptical as anybody on first blush. In fact, I always thought all CD players sounded the same until I was demo'd a good system.

      But only in a good sytem. And people have A/B'd difference successfully in the past. It is a myth that people can't A/B differences for a lot of components. People have. I would suggest a CD player is one of the easier things to A/B differences on (in a decent system).

      In regards to a good system, small differences can make or break it. For example:

      (a) If I push my Paradigm Reference Studio/60 speakers anywhere near the back wall (like 95% of people have it set up) the image falls flat and I probably would have a hard time hearing the difference.

      (b) I recently re-organized my bedroom so that the bed is now in front of the speakers. Unfortunately, while this config is nicer for me layout-wise, the imaging now sucks due to the bed's intrusion on the signal. I might have a hard time hearing the differences now.

      I would agree that you, the reader right now, couldn't hear the difference in your system, as it is now. But in a properly controlled good system, I would be shocked (shocked!) that you couldn't hear the difference between a decent CD player and a lousy one.

      p.s. I'm the first one to call bull-carp on the guys at Best Buy. The guy was trying to convince me that the digital HDMI/DVI converter from monster was WAY BETTER than the Acoustic Research (I think) one. I would have bet $10,000 against that he could see the difference in A/B testing unless one was defective. It's DIGITAL!
      • I can put my dad and my mom in front of my stereo system and they can tell the difference. They are the first ones to complain that they wouldn't be able to hear a difference so why waste money. Then all of a sudden they are talking about how clear it sounds. Girlfriend was the same.

        Yes, but did they actually care?
  • What's the point of upgrading the current generation of dvd player when it can't output HDTV anyway. These things will be gone and forgotten in two years.
  • 1) For something as subjective as viewing paintings and sculpture, I find it interesting that everyone here is trying to bash people for trying to increase the quality of sound in their stereo. One reason may just be a generational problem where modifications were much more apparent in equipment 30-50 years ago. 2) I also find it funny that everyone is bashing the audiophiles when only a few stories below is about a guy who memorized >80k digits of PI (far less useful than modifiying stereo gear). Jus
    • 1) Do you see people trying to increase their quality of viewing paintings and sculpture in the same way? Visuophiles wearing special "monster glasses", or spraying pure nitrogen in the air between them and the picture so the refractive index is constant? No, because such activities are obviously crazy.

      2) This is /., we don't need an excuse to be geeky, or mind people who are. What we do hate is lies and pretentiousness. The guy who memorised pi never pretended it was anything other than "hey, I'm good at r

      • No, but around here we DO see people trying to squeeze another 2 fps from their video card, because THEY can see the difference between 68 and 70 fps with their "golden eyes".

  • And then... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by mindstormpt ( 728974 )
    In the end, get another brand-new player and someone to help you double-blind test it. And please, broadcast it live on the net.
  • Unworthy of IEEE (Score:2, Interesting)

    This is not an engineering hack, this is the same trap all the tweako audio magazines fall into. Sure it sounds better after he spend a hundred bucks and a few hours of his time... show me the measurements and I'll believe it wasn't an emotionally influenced subjective improvement.
  • Whither the IEEE? (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Ashtead ( 654610 )
    "Gadget porn" indeed. Gives the sleazy-ish connotations and all, and the readings on me troll-o-meter go to the middle of the scale. Gets me right into debunking mood. There is a number of correct statements, but the overall impression is pseudo-science, and subjective impressions of "better sound".

    The starting premise, that manufacturers use the least expensive components they can get away with is no big news. This has been considered good engineering just about forever: use those parts that are good e

  • by flieghund ( 31725 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @03:13PM (#12970171) Homepage
    ...wasn't TFA itself but its link to the Troubleshooting and Repair of Small Household Appliances and Power Tools [drexel.edu] FAQ. Good stuff there.
  • It's 90% crap (Score:5, Interesting)

    by djpenguin808 ( 896946 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @04:11PM (#12970419)
    Well, as a trained audio engineer, I have to say this article is interesting, but mostly garbage.

    Screwing around with the power supply is just stupid, a decent Tripp-lite conditioner or a UPS would handle line noise much better, simpler, and more safely..

    Replacing the op-amps with better ones is probably the best tip in the whole article, and the only thing that is likely to have a serious impact on the sound. Replacing caps and other components in the signal path will have some effect.

    The jacks have to be the dumbest thing I have ever heard.

    All this 'gold-plated, super oxy-free' stuff is pure hokum. Sure, the cables might conceivably make a difference when you're using an Apogee converter to run audio from your RME Hammerfall through your $50K amp to your $250K mastering monitors.

    But on a consumer-level system with unbalanced jacks? Please.

    Unbalanced cable can only be run for 3 feet without serious risk of RFI and EMI corrupting the signal. You can run balanced cable 1000 feet before you face similar risks.

    Pro recording and audio environments use almost entirely balnced gear, because it provides the signal quality necessary for major recording projects. For cable, it's plain old Mogami or Belkin. We break out the fancy-looking gold-braided super cable when we get a cranky performer who insists that our gear is simply not capturing his muse, because he always delivers perfect performances. Slap those into the mic chain, and watch them listen to the playbacks, nod knowingly, and say "Yeah...it sounds right now"

    Nothing has acutally changed, but it sure makes some people feel better, and the same thing is at work in the audiophile arena.

    Sure, different compositions of metals have different abilities to conduct signal, but once you get to a certain level of qaulity (which all basic cables meet), it doesn't matter too much.

    • Re:It's 90% crap (Score:3, Interesting)

      by the arbiter ( 696473 )
      Oh, thank you, thank you, thank you. I was a musician and recording engineer for most of my professional life before switching to IT a couple of years ago, and I have found the myths surrounding cable and sound quality to be...well, just incredible. Really, the amount of bullshit is staggering. Noel Lee from Monster Cable has mades hundreds of millions of dollars off of the human need for one-upmanship and the abysmal ignorance of the audiophile crowd. It's horrifying, it really is.

      I'd add one cable to
  • by krunk4ever ( 856261 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @04:26PM (#12970484) Homepage
    when the warranty expires for a gadget, an average joe would be like, "shoot, i need to be more careful now". when the warranty expires for a gadget, a geek would be like, "sweet! i get to take it apart now!"
  • Audiophile ... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by fforw ( 116415 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @05:35PM (#12970770) Homepage
    audiophile, n:
    Someone who listens to the equipment instead of the music.
  • by Ancient_Hacker ( 751168 ) on Saturday July 02, 2005 @10:04PM (#12971831)
    Yep, and you can get more mileage out of your car by taping cow-magnets to the fuel line. This article is laughably ludicrous. Let me elucidate the high points:
    • Making the power supply filter capacitors "20% bigger" is a silly idea, for MANY reasons:
      • Most electrolytics come with a -20% to +100% tolerance. Because of their construction, it's hard for the manufacturers to get them much closer than that.
      • Plus in any well-designed power supply the capacitors are intentionally chosen a bit oversize to handle 50Hz or low line voltage situations.
      • Electrolytics have a steep cap versus temperature curve. The engineers know this and specify 40% bigger caps to handle the times you use your CD player in Alaska.
      • The filter caps are isolated from the audio circuits by a voltahge regulator chip, which provides about 60 to 90 db of isolation. There's just NO WAY one can notice the effects of a 20% change in capacitance, when the effects are mulffled by a factor of a million to a billion.
      • The original filter caps have to be very specially chosen for compatibility with the high frequencies and ripple currents. Is it likely the average joe tweaker is going to choose something that approaches what the actual power supply designer chose? Not likely.
    • Replacing the power supply diodes with "faster" ones is a waste of time and money. Any noise the old diodes generate (if any) is many decades above thre audio range. Plus the CD player has to pass FCC emission limits, so they can't be too noisy to begin with. Skip this mod.
    • Changing op-amps is really ridiculous. Op amps are always used with huge amounts of negative feedback, which reduces their individual quirks and distortion by a huge factor. I've worked with dozens of op-amps, and have never found one that's not capable of handling your typical audio. A typical 30 cent op-amp already has about 0.001% distortion, thousands of times lower than a golden-eared indivuidual can discern. Skip this step too.
    • Tapping into the DAC outputs is a REALLY bad idea. Apparently this guy hasnt a clue about Nyquist limits and sampling rates. You HAVE to filter the output of the DAC's, as they're intrinsically rife with sampling-rate related harmonics and aliasing. Those op-amps are there for a reason!. Don't even think of doing this.
    • Putting caulking on the crystal is wet-your-pants funny! There's absolutely no need for this. Crystals are designed to resonate at one frequency. They're totally insensitive, by factos of a billion or more, to any other vibrationary frequency. As an example, there are very precise aerospace radios, with dozens of crystals, none of them caulk-damped, used for life-critical navigation and landing systems, and they work just fine for decades of constant use in vibraty, shaky old prop planes. Put the rope caulk around your windows, not on your crystals.
    • If you like the look of gold-plated jacks, install them. There will be absolutely no discernible difference in the sound, but they look neater.
    Sorry to rain onthis guys parade, but IMHO there should be at least a token nod towards reality.
    • Replacing the power supply diodes with "faster" ones is a waste of time and money. Any noise the old diodes generate (if any) is many decades above thre audio range. Plus the CD player has to pass FCC emission limits, so they can't be too noisy to begin with. Skip this mod.

      I at first thought this might be fixing a real problem and making a relatively expensive solution (fast diodes) for it. 1N400X rectifiers doing 50/60Hz power rectification CAN produce some low-level switching garbage (modulated at a 60

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