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Handhelds Hardware

Hiptop/Sidekick Sequel Unleashed 143

Posted by simoniker from the danger-will-robinson dept.
powerline22 writes "After years of waiting, the second Hiptop (or Sidekick, depending on the carrier) has been unveiled to the public. After the terrible hardware reliability of the first version, the second one, manufactured by Sharp, looks a lot better, with longer battery life, built-in camera, more buttons, better radio, new software features and more. Also, according to T-Mobile, sync is going to finally be here real soon now. There are reviews at CNet, over at PCMag, and at MSNBC." We recently covered leaked Hiptop II photos.
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Hiptop/Sidekick Sequel Unleashed More

Hiptop/Sidekick Sequel Unleashed

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  • No Sync (Score:3, Interesting)

    by GeekFu ( 166509 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @10:41PM (#9885606)
    But still no (real) sync yet. Enough said. Get with the program, Danger.

    • Re:No Sync (Score:3, Informative)

      by powerline22 ( 515356 )
      Dude, its not Danger's fault. Several other carriers, such as Suncom already offer it. T-Mobile's been waitin for awhile to finally do this, and have gotten quite a bit of grief for not doing it sooner. All it requires is opening some ports up on their server. there is both a Windows solution by Intellisync, and a mac solution by Mark/Space.

    • Re:No Sync (Score:4, Informative)

      by jimmcq ( 88033 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @10:53PM (#9885676) Journal
      But still no (real) sync yet.

      The Sidekick II will include InteliSync. See the top feature listed at http://www.danger.com/consumers_hiptop2.php [danger.com].

      It will also be available for the original Sidekick around the same time.
      • Yes, but they've been promising this for literally years now. Don't hold your breath.
        • They've been promising to develop it, but they haven't actually said it's been developed like they have this time. Coming soon is different from listing it as part of the features of the device.
          • Not only have they been saying they would develop it since 2002, they already have developed it, and T-mobile has refused to put it on their network for quite some time. It is deployed on several other hiptop providers' networks (Cable & Wireless and Edge, if I remember right) and works just fine.

            Like another poster said-- this has been promised and re-promised and re-re-promised so many times and then held back so many different ways that I wouldn't count on sync until users are confirming it works f

    • Re:No Sync (Score:1, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      But if you haven't bought one yet, you could just as easily get a Handspring Treo 600. Not only can you sync it, but you can sync it with as many PCs as you want, and even use it as a backup dialup modem for your laptop in case of emergency. Hurray for GPRS :-)

  • Good luck getting your data out (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @10:44PM (#9885631)
    For years their synchronization solution has been vaporware. It exists, but it hasn't been released. They keep saying "any month now"...

    If you buy one of these things, start learning now how to write a screen scraper. It's the only way to get your data if your phone ever breaks.

    I'm wishing the next Treos will just get a browser as nice as the SK's. Then they will be a great solution.
    • actually, someone did write a screen scraper for windows. Sadly, it's no longer supported, and t-mobile tweaked the page slightly so that it no longer works.
    • Your data is stored on your sim and on the tmobile desktop interface. As well, you have free handset replacements for defects that *you* didn't cause for an entire year. All you have to do is take the sim out and then pop it in the replacement hiptop and you're good to go. All your data will be there. I admit that I've been through several hiptops in the last 2 years, some by my fault and some by the fault of the manufacturer, but I've NEVER lost my data.
      • Your data is not in your sim. Your data (your email, address book, web bookmarks) is on Danger's servers and, while you can easily move it from one Hiptop to another, YOU CAN'T GET IT OUT OF THE SIDEKICK.

        Now I have a RSI on my right thump from pressing that stupid wheel and I want to move all my saved email to a laptop AND I CAN"T DO IT.
        • Are you kidding me? Have you used the desktop interface at all? If you're referring to your tmail account, it can't be accessed from a laptop anyway (other than via Desktop Interface) so no matter what you're forced to forward those emails to another account if you want them outside of the DI or your hiptop. This email was never intended to be multi-purpose all use pop3. You also can configure up to three other accounts (I prefer to use IMAP) that, even if you use pop3, will leave messages on the server

    • Here's the Address scraper I wrote in Perl last year when I switched to a Treo 600: http://randomfoo.net/code/Sidekick/hiptop.pl [randomfoo.net]

      It's ugly and I'm not really supporting it (only needed it once, right?), but it works so I've GPL'd it and thrown it out there.

  • Bluetooth? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by TheHonestTruth ( 759975 )
    No? kthnxbye.

    Seriously, I'm still using my t68i as a BT modem with T-Mobile's unlimited GPRS and I won't switch till there is a decent BT phone/PDA combo (treo 610 pleaseohpleaseohplease, maybe the new iPaq 6315).

    The t68i's interface is dog slow though.

    -truth

    • Re:Bluetooth? (Score:4, Interesting)

      by jewps ( 800552 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @11:23PM (#9885826)
      Over the years, SE released many firmware revisions that addresses these issues, mainly speed and reception. Even to date, the t68i has the best battery life and the best bluetooth implementation, except for the new SE's of course.
      (now i'm getting off topic)

      The hiptop2 looks great tho, finally they addressed some of the issues the original hiptop had. Mainly size imo. Some say danger should allow you to sync directly with your PC but what many don't know is that part of the hiptop's advantages is that the calendar, phonebook, and a few other things are sync'd up as soon as you login. You can managae your phone over the web via danger's server. It's really neat once you play around with one.

      One thing i like to point out is that pcmag's review said you can't connect to a vpn however there is a pretty good SSH client available for the original hiptop. With that client, you can do whatever you want. (ie: irssi for irc, icq in text mode, manage your servers, etc..) Also, t-mobile and fido (canada's hiptop provider) have special unlimited GPRS plans for the phone.

      Overall, it's a great toy and a great phone to have in your collection (if you're into that sort of thing)
      I've used almost 99% of all GSM phones over the past two years yet the hiptop remains one of my favorite phone for a few reasons (look above). Sure you can ssh with a p900, treo600 and those SPV/xda phones but those costs over 1k CDN.

      (and again, this is just my opinion) :)
      • I searched for firmware upgrade info and I couldn't find much. Mostly it was people saying that they had to take it into a store to do and it didn't fix anything. I'd love to do this, so do you know the easiest way to upgrade? Thanks for the info.

        -truth

      • You can managae your phone over the web via danger's server.

        True, all your PIM data is stored on the network so you don't lose it all if your handset dies.

        Problem is, the Address Book in the web interface has no export feature (currently; perhaps there will be an upgrade concurrent with the Hiptop2 launch). That makes it pretty useless for syncing data that originates on your handset onto your computer.

    • Had a T68i for a while and found it so so.
      A few months ago I upgraded to a Nokia 6820 and I think it's definitely the best phone I've had.
      The reception is pretty good, GPRS works well (I bought a Bluetooth Ipaq 4155, and I'm thrilled with that too), the keyboard is real enough, and I love the speakerphone feature. I don't have much trouble with interface lag either.
      The only thing I'm disappointed with is that the builtin email app is pretty lame. It doesn't just synch via IMAP like you would expect, it do

  • Sharp is exactly a touchstone of quality... (Score:5, Informative)

    by lingqi ( 577227 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @10:49PM (#9885649) Journal
    Let's see:

    My Sharp phone (DoCoMo SH251i) died within 3 monthes of me recieving it. Exchange for new one. died again within 1 week. Exchanged new one - still kicking but the battery life has become quite questionable.

    My Sharp Electronic Dictionary: keys become non-responsive after about 6 monthes; the hinges are almost gone, and the letters SHARP has been falling off one by one, first to read SHAP, and then SHP - I think if it gets to SH in a few weeks I will write "IT" beside it.

    As a comparison my NEC phone had never had *any* problems including my stupid action of plugging it (100V device) into a 220V socket. My Seiko dictionary is holding up quite well with about double the usage recieved on the Sharp, etc.

    Just some ancidotal evidence...

  • I just don't get it.. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Powertrip ( 702807 ) * on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @10:49PM (#9885651) Homepage Journal
    I guess I just don't understand the target market for such a device. It's quasi-push email support isn't really corporate-ready (The inablility to directly connect to POP or IMAP servers stinks IMO, what do you do if you want to use it on another carrier down the road?).

    Besides, this thing looks HUGE to me, not exactly a svelte device to slide in your pocket or clip to your belt.
    Ok, so maybee it is a cheap Treo or Blackberry, but if you are buying a device for robust email access and PDA functionality, then the extra money spent would be well worth it, wouldn't it?

    Even as a gaming machine, the Nokia N-Gage would blow this thing away... not to mention the QD.

    Maybee i'm too old.... :)

    • Re:I just don't get it.. (Score:5, Insightful)

      by powerline22 ( 515356 ) <thecapitaliztNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @11:11PM (#9885760) Homepage
      Who's it designed for?

      Me. I'm a kid in high school without any need to access my 'corporate email'. I can, and will IM people wherever. The biggest thing, however, is the web browsing ability. I found my way to a party at this girl's house that i didnt know the address of, only her name. so i did a whitepages search, used mobile mapquest to get there.

      Of course, on the way there, I remembered that I was at her house once fixing her dad's computer, and put her address in my cell phone. I could've scrolled to her name, clicked 'map this location' from the address book.

      The Treo 300 is a good compeditor, and has some advantages over the Sidekick, such as thousands of apps. however, it doesnt have the backend proxy which compresses and reformats webpages so its a lot faster.

      Gaming? I don't care for it. It sucks up battery life. If I want gaming, i'll get a GameBoy. More apps on a platform that was designed for gaming.
      • I found my way to a party at this girl's house that i didnt know the address of, only her name. so i did a whitepages search, used mobile mapquest to get there.

        Did they scream GEEKS and bang the door in your face when you showed up.. "Gadget"

        but i guss this can make stalking OH so much easier


        Suchetha
    • I guess I just don't understand the target market for such a device.

      It's called a "hiphop" and you don't see the target market?? Hello? McFly?
    • Wow, you really dont get it. :)

      It's a full thumbboard, has ssh support, color, 640x480 camera, supports multiple IM clients, better range, better battery life, louder ringtones, and is 25% thinner than the old hiptop. (sidekick).

      I have friends who own the older models, great network devices, and good phones. I love how the scroll wheel blinks colors on the ringtones. No scroll wheel on the new one, but it should blink colors also...

      Too bad ATTWS/Cingular doesn't have it and no unlocked models, this devic
      • No scroll wheel on the new one

        Not true... the scroll wheel is still there, in the same position to the right of the screen. It's been made smaller though, and hopefully more comfortable to use (the wide-ridged plastic wheel on the current models can make clicking somewhat painful).

    • Re:I just don't get it.. (Score:5, Interesting)

      by quixotal ( 132989 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @11:18PM (#9885799)
      This product is huge in the deaf community. It hits the sweet spot with the price and features. My mother is deaf and she has one along with all her friends and co-workers.

      It is true that the quality on the SK has been terrible. My mother is on her third or fourth one.
    • I use it for POP and IMAP email every day. It can even read attachments! It has a much better web browser than the blackberry that does a great job of rendering regular web sites in nice readable fonts. It even has an SSH and telnet client for crying out loud!
    • Hafta agree with you....and the other thing I can't figure out is how this is any different (or more advanced) than the 6600 [nokia.com] or the 9500 [nokia.com]...both seem to have almost the same features....
    • Some of my friends had hiptops and I seriously considered getting one. They seemed really cool, and the ability to ssh and irc from almost anywhere would be nice. Amazon seemed to have some good deals, though you were required to sign up for a T-Mobile service plan. And this was the kicker. The plans apparently start at $30/month and go up if you want voice calls too. Since there are a number of free wireless hotspots in our community, I decided to get a Zaurus with a wireless card. It comes with a Li
    • I use it at work, home and school.
      Since only management gets color blackberries, this is a cheaper alternative (Amazon had it for $50 if you signed up for a year)
      Also, all Instant Messaging conversations are logged at work. Same goes for email.
      Inside and outside the house - friends can always IM me, send e-mail,etc. Movie times, restaurant finder, directions, web browsing,etc. - all useful stuff.
      In school I use it as a dictionary and an encyclopedia.

    • It's quasi-push email support isn't really corporate-ready
      The "built-in" email box (@tmail.com) receives email instantly when one comes in -- that's the "push" box. If you need your email with no latency, just forward it to that box. That's what I do for my work email.

      The inablility to directly connect to POP or IMAP servers stinks IMO
      You *can* connect to both POP and IMAP servers.

      what do you do if you want to use it on another carrier down the road?
      You'd be screwed, but then that's true of a

    • The inablility to directly connect to POP or IMAP servers stinks IMO

      How exactly would you do that? There needs to be a GPRS-to-TCP/IP bridge somewhere, and with the Hiptop/Sidekick product line it's always Danger. The Hiptop mail client does support POP and limited IMAP connectivity over the Danger bridge.

      if you are buying a device for robust email access and PDA functionality

      I'd imagine most people don't buy a Hiptop for those reasons; otherwise they'd just get a Treo or Blackberry. Always-on web

  • Treo! (Score:1)

    by artlu ( 265391 )
    I recently switched to a Treo as I need net 24/7 in order to trade Stocks [groupshares.com]. So, i picked up a treo, and i love the thing. Sadly, I wish i would've waited for the bluetooth model, which is coming out in December (i think). Then it will be ebay time for this puppy.

  • I want this doodad for one reason: (Score:3, Interesting)

    by zaren ( 204877 ) <fishrocket@gmail.com> on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @10:52PM (#9885666) Journal
    to serve as a portable terminal. (I seem to recall this as a feature in the original model, but I can't find that listed on their site - and I'm on dialup, so I'm not scrounging through their flash hoohah to find it.) If I had something that small that would let me check my email or hop on irc anywhere, anytime, I'd be a happy geek :)
    • A Blackberry can do this too (via SSH), though it's a somewhat expensive option. The newer models (J2ME ones) can use Idokorro Mobile SSH (as long as you have a BES with MDS), and the older ones can use AvidTelnet-SSH. Personally, I'd rather have a Blackberry with great battery life and the best portable email implementation I've seen, rather than a device that seems to be designed more for portable web browsing than email or phone use, even if the former does cost a little more. But that's just me, and
    • I use the terminal on my Sidekick. It rules so far, but there is a gotcha. If you type anything in, it takes about 3-5 seconds to echo. You can type things into a box and have it send all at once, but its a bit of a hassle. still really cool and ultra-useful if you're a sysadmin. restarting a server remotely in the middle of a movie is ultra-cool
      • With one catch that if you push too much data (in 2 years I've become one hell of a thumb typer) you can crash the radio. Sitting there waiting for it to reconnect/recover can get a little bit annoying at times, especially when it happens over and over again. I realize that by using line entry mode you have this problem much less often, but line entry mode completely disables the use of control and meta. I am really hoping that this is resolved with the new device.
    • You got it. You can download/install a Telnet/SSH client for just $9.99
    • Comment removed based on user account deletion

  • Side Kick? (Score:3, Funny)

    by Timesprout ( 579035 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @10:52PM (#9885669)
    Looking at the size of the thing I'm thinking sidekick means you need a bring a buddy everwhere to lug it around for you.

  • Too Connected? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Jaden42 ( 466735 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @10:54PM (#9885685)
    Is there such a thing as too connected? This is just a personal opinion of course, but sometimes I wonder if we are driving ourselves out of our own privacy and personal sanity by making ourselves always available all the time, no matter where we are. If I require a device which always tells me where I am supposed to be when, what kind of life am I leading?

    I work for a company which produces software used by hospitals, and I am required to be available 24x7x365 in case something goes wrong. They pay me well for what I do and I enjoy the work, but I've spent the last 3 years in the "most connected" job of my life and sometimes I feel like I can't escape.

    What ever happen to returning a phone call or an email the next day?

    • Re:Too Connected? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by FunWithHeadlines ( 644929 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @11:10PM (#9885752) Homepage
      Absolutely true. I once had a programming job for a company running a 24x7 operation with offices around the world. Believe me, I got sick of getting midnight phone calls from Singapore because something had gone wrong with the app and users were clamoring for access. Once I left that job, I have never again had that level of forced connectiveness, and brother, you have no idea how relieved I have been ever since.

      There are, of course, people who need to be on-call at all times, and I don't argue that point. But I see far too many middle managers tethered to their email 24 hours a day. Sorry PHB, but if you cannot do your job during normal working hours, you are not working efficiently. And yes, I say this as someone who leaves his cell phone back in the office when I go out for lunch, who doesn't even bother bringing it to the movie theater, who doesn't check work email from home in most cases. Guess what? I get my work done just fine, and am plenty responsive when I need to be. I'm not in a 24x7 operation, and nobody's life depends on me, so it's cool.

      Either manage your time or your time will manage you.

      • Or, if you're like me, you're just desperate for a call, from ANYONE, even though it's probably just mom...

      • Re:Too Connected? (Score:3, Interesting)

        by geekoid ( 135745 )
        "Sorry PHB, but if you cannot do your job during normal working hours, you are not working efficiently"

        That is a little niave. You can be working perfectly efficient, but then some decide the your 'only' working 8 hours a day! the nerve. So they give you more work, Now your working 10 hours, then 12.
        If they work with a work a holic, then there boss expects them to be one as well.
        Now, PHBs do a lot of stupid things, but sometimes our schedule is controlled by others.

        "I get my work done just fine..." that g
      • You are assuming that everybody works jobs with finite units of work to do. Try living the life of a CEO where if you work 16 hours a day instead of 8, your company makes 10% larger gains for the year.

        Time spent innovating is never wasted time, well, if you know what you're doing most of the time.
    • Is there such a thing as too connected? This is just a personal opinion of course, but sometimes I wonder if we are driving ourselves out of our own privacy and personal sanity by making ourselves always available all the time, no matter where we are. If I require a device which always tells me where I am supposed to be when, what kind of life am I leading? I work for a company which produces software used by hospitals, and I am required to be available 24x7x365 in case something goes wrong. They pay me we
    • There's no such thing as "too connected." There *is* such a thing as "too willing to answer your connections."

      The question of making yourself available is not a question of connectivity. Just because you carry a Treo or Sidekick or PocketPC Phone or whatever doesn't mean you are forced to answer emails now, today, tomorrow, or ever. Or that you have to pick up the phone. Or that you don't disable the ringer completely. Or that you even leave it on.

      However... you can still be uber-connected, for your

  • Sidekick 2 .. no software, so what's the big deal? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by martinbogo ( 468553 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @10:55PM (#9885690) Homepage Journal
    The sidekick, mark 1, suffers from having a fantastic java based architecture.. and -zip- all for software.

    In fact, at first all the ringtones you could want were free. A few months later, the SAME ringtones cost anywhere from $.99-->1.99!

    One of the most useful applications, an ssh client/terminal was also free.. and now costs $4.99.

    The carriers are afraid to deploy software, especially T-Mobile. Software updates are few and far between.

    Things I would have liked to have seen on the sidekick2? Oh, simple things like an SD memory slot, on-device synchronization of contact information, bluetooth (it's funky to hold and have a conversation with)... oh .. and if not a touch screen at -least- a less awkward way to dial numbers.

    Oh well. Danger has yet another cute device, but if all we get is a digital camera out of it? what's the point.

    Nice going, Danger. Try again. Maybe the design team will do ACTUAL MARKET RESEARCH next time, and get it right when the sidekick gets cubed.

    As for now, the existing device should probably be crushed .. and cubed.

    -feh-

    • Ummmm, probably the biggest complaints users had were: Poor quality, size, non-integrated low-res camera, lack of speakerphone. To me it looks like they listened.

      Having a memory slot is contrary to the thin-client, sync-to-the-network sort of architecture... and is really not too neccessary when the only files you're going to be offloading is pictures, and you can just mail them to your regular email account or pull them off the desktop interface.

      Go ahead and complain about paying $5, once, for an appl

    • The sidekick, mark 1, suffers from having a fantastic java based architecture.. and -zip- all for software.

      Unfortunately, the Hiptop Java architecture does not (as of the last press release I saw about it) conform to J2ME specifications, making it more than trivial to port existing Java mobile apps onto the platform.

      Danger does support a development community for the Hiptop (free to join, but an NDA agreement is required), but carriers like T-Mobile have been slow to offer the output of that community to

  • Danger creepy (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @11:03PM (#9885721)
    Danger seems like a very creepy company. They immediately snapped up the first viable online discussion forum devoted to the Sidekick, and have controlled it almost from day one. They apparently control many of the other Sidekick related sites and photo blogs by giving free stuff to the compliant site owners and nothing to the naughty ones. I've heard about ops in #hiptop even bragging about getting stuff from Danger. Basically legal bribes, if you ask me. If you watch their behavior it seems to be what you would expect from a company where lawyers make most of the decisions. Any company that would build a platform where an upgrade means free applications are removed from the device, has a very disturbing set of ethics. I could go on but it's not worth that much time. Danger creeps me out.
    • yea uuuhhh... no.

      Those apps were taken off of the Color Sidekick because they didnt have the licenses for them. Danger snapped up the first online forum devoted because they wanted an already active community so they could spread the word. People bitch about that phone all the time on that forum. people have gone on huge rants on various things, so I dont think that Danger is really trying to control all the things said about their phones.
    • The people who get free stuff from Danger are friends of the guy who mods hiptop.com. He, by the way, doesn't get paid to mod those forums. His payment is by way of goodies sent to him and the satisfaction of.. well actually it seems to me to be an extremely nerve wrecking task. He occasionally distributes them to his friends in #hiptop when he has no need for them. All in all, I think that's much more noble than, say, selling them on ebay and profiting on the gifts.
    • Danger seems like a very creepy company.

      The Woz [danger.com] sits on their advisory board. How creepy can they be?
    • Creepy?

      I'm friends with a bunch of the Danger employees. They aren't creepy, and they aren't run by lawyers. Many of them are ex-Apple, ex-WebTV, etc... It's a pretty typical Silicon Valley start-up.

      Wouldn't you rather have them trying to integrate the 3rd party sites than attack them?

  • OK, let's see... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by absurdist ( 758409 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @11:09PM (#9885746)

    No Bluetooth.

    No sync.

    No world standard GSM.

    No storage slot.

    But we DO get yet another new, hip, happening crappy camera. Just once, I wish someone in the pda/phone/mobile attachment would get it right. It's not about how hip the damned thing is. It's about how functional it is. If Danger (or Handspring, or Sharp, or whoever) could get it right, I'd only have to carry one device on my belt instead of three. Please, God, Treo 610. And none too soon.

    • If you want a P910a, buy one. For teenagers who can't afford a cell phone that costs as much as a computer, the Hiptop looks pretty good.
    • personally, i agree with your motives for this point, but you're way off. we're some of the only people who know the difference between a real email device and a "quasi-push email" device (as mentioned earlier). we're also the only people who really understand how we'd like this thing to sync, and what interoperability it should have.

      the gadget market has not been founded on functionality, but yet on the cool factor. most GPS devices are so useless it's scary, but they sell like hotcakes because it's a

    • I disagree (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Benley ( 102665 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @11:43PM (#9885912) Journal
      Sorry, but I think you don't get it. I have had a hiptop for 1.5 years now, and I really like it. This _IS_ the most functional pda/cell device out there. Perhaps bluetooth would be nice, but I don't really care - it would be of no use for syncing, because the device is already connected to the internet. You will sync with danger's servers, not with your device.

      Sync is finally coming. This is one hundred percent T-Mobile's fault, not Danger's. There have been several sync solutions ready to ship for quite some time now. The only holdup is T-Mobile.

      Last I heard, the new hiptops have triband GSM. Is that not standard enough?

      As for the storage slot, all I can think of to do with it (that would be actually useful in any capacity) would be to store mp3s, which I don't care about. I have an ipod for that.

      The camera? I truly couldn't care less. Maybe the new hiptop will have a usable camera. If so, great... Whatever.

      The hiptop has a very very good user interface, it has a very good OS (I am slightly biased because I know some of the people who wrote it). It sets out to do certain things, and it does them very well.

      You are right: it is not about how hip it is, it is about how functional it is. Danger makes it extremely functional, and T-Mobile is annoyingly pushing it as a hip toy for teenagers. To me (and the dozen or so other users in my nerd-universe), it is a highly useful tool in our daily lives. You don't realise how useful it is to have an always-on internet link on your cellphone until you get it. It becomes hard to live without.
      • Sorry, but I think you don't get it. I have had a hiptop for 1.5 years now, and I really like it. This _IS_ the most functional pda/cell device out there. Perhaps bluetooth would be nice, but I don't really care - it would be of no use for syncing, because the device is already connected to the internet. You will sync with danger's servers, not with your device....Sync is finally coming. This is one hundred percent T-Mobile's fault, not Danger's. There have been several sync solutions ready to ship for quit

        • to use the camera function and not get billed for data transfer

          Another minor (or major, depending on perspective) point - tmobile's data plans are unlimited data so it doesn't matter. Ringtones, voice memos, etc - they all come over the internet. (or via the usb cable - which is where bluetooth would come in)

          I agree that there are some very cool features that could come along with bluetooth. Proximity screen locking sounds really cool. Surfing via powerbook via bt cellphone also sounds cool, albeit

          • Another minor (or major, depending on perspective) point - tmobile's data plans are unlimited data so it doesn't matter. Ringtones, voice memos, etc - they all come over the internet. (or via the usb cable - which is where bluetooth would come in)

            See, my service provider tries to rape me for $0.50 per 'picture' transfer - thats camera pictures alone, regardless of rez - but the unlimited data of T-Mobile makes that moot; I see your point.

            It's all rather surprising, considering Woz is on the board, stil

        • Bluetooth used to be a dealbreaker for me too, but then I got my sidekick almost totally by accident when I ditched AT&T Wireless. A friend of mine worked for T-Mobile at the time and simply gave me one that he had laying around. I had a T68i, and so I gave up all the Bluetooth functionality you pointed out for better IM (keyboard makes a world of difference) and the web browser. Not once have I wished for my T68i back. It doesn't mean one of us "gets it" and the other does not, it just means that the

  • A distinguished choice (Score:4, Funny)

    by BortQ ( 468164 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @11:17PM (#9885790) Homepage Journal
    I prefer a midget as my sidekick. They are both helpful and entertaining.
  • I could of -sworn- there was a mention of it having an ssh client last time it was posted on slashdot. But no mention of ssh on the hiptop page? What happened? I wanted to buy one so I could ssh into my network from anywhere. ;-;

  • Better off buying an N-gage... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by ronfar623 ( 784908 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @11:22PM (#9885819)
    Using a Symbian series 60 device (3650, 7650, N-Gage, etc...), would probably provide a lot more flexibility. That coupled with the fact that you can buy an original N-gage for around $100 factory reconditioned, IMHO, makes the Sidekick pretty damn unattractive. I had seriously considered buying one before settling on my first smartphone (Nokia 3650), and I'm glad I didn't waste the money.

    My N-gage, however (original, not the QD, which is basically a more expensive downgrade) is just about the best money I've ever spent. MP3/AAC player, FM radio, USB interface lets you mount your memory expansion card like a pen drive, full featured web browsers, IM clients for any network, IRC, telnet/SSH, ebook readers, interactive maps, tons and tons of games (Symbian, Java, and N-gage, all way more playable with the nice directional pad), and that's just to name a few. It's my electronic Swiss Army-Knife. 'Course you do look like a complete jackass talking into it edgewise...

  • Upgrades? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Kevin Burtch ( 13372 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @11:25PM (#9885834)

    Anyone know if they plan to offer upgrade discounts to existing sidekick customers?

    I'd love to get my hands on the new one, but I'm not going to fork over another $300 for the thing!
    Heck, my 1st gen is only a year old (well, newer... I'm on my 3rd replacement) and I bought it right after it came out!

    Yeah, the promises are getting old... the OLD ONE was supposed to get all of the software updates the NEW ONE has... that's pretty sleazy and they WILL lose a lot of customers because of it.

    There's a huge following for this device, and they've been beating on the walls waiting for some of these updates that they (we) were told a year ago would be out shortly.

    These folk won't be too happy if they find out they've been lied to for this long and have to repurchase what they originally were sold.

    • Re:Upgrades? (Score:3, Informative)

      by hawaiian717 ( 559933 )
      MSNBC seems to think so.

      And there's good news for current T-Mobile Sidekick customers: You will get a chance be one of the first to upgrade to the new device at a special price.

      http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5592481/ [msn.com]

    • Existing T-Mobile users who have been with the company for a year are typically eligible for the "new customer" discount when they upgrade their phones. I'm fairly sure this is what they will apply to new customers although I don't have hard fact to back that up. I did buy a nokia long before my first year contract with T-Mobile ended and I received the new customer rebate deal. That should be a good indicator.
    • What makes you say that the old ones won't get software updates?
  • A friend of mine has the original sidekick and I am always utterly jealous of it.

    I mean, how great is it that I could be sitting at Denny's drinking coffee and doing a crossword and I could pull out my phone, hop on the 'net and find the answer to that really tricky clue.

    I've used the original on several occassions and it's not too big, actually it's pretty much the perfect size for a phone.

    The only drawbacks I see are explaining to people that "yes, it's a phone." and the awkwardness of dialing. Oth
  • After the terrible hardware reliability of the first version, the second one, manufactured by Sharp, looks a lot better, with longer battery life, built-in camera, more buttons, better radio, new software features and more.

    Their hardware wasn't reliable so they solved the problem by adding a built-in camera and more buttons. I'm really tired so I'll leave it to someone else to reply with an appropriate joke.

  • treo vs side kick (Score:5, Informative)

    by jford235 ( 677581 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @11:43PM (#9885910)
    this guy [blog-city.com] has a pretty good side by side comparison of a Treo 600 and 1st gen side kick.
    • this guys blog is now dead, or near to it.
      to paraphrase:

      "the blog is dead, we have killed the blog"

      mirror anyone?

      hmmmmmmmm..... thinking about that misquote for a sec, if we slashdotted god, would it be possible to mirror him/her/it? Just imagine it, a whole backup RAID universe because everyone on slashdot began praying at once......

      yeah, anyway, anyone want to set up a mirror please?

  • sink (Score:2, Funny)

    by simonharvey ( 605068 )
    looks a lot better, with longer battery life, built-in camera, more buttons, better radio, new software features

    Yeah, Yeah, my grandmother's camera has that stuff, but what about the kitchen sink?

  • Speed (Score:2)

    by weston ( 16146 )
    So... T-Mobile's speed is still limited to 56k with latency that makes one wish for the responsiveness of dialup. 14k dialup. I really like the idea of having an ssh client with me all the time, but not one that reminds me of a 300 baud modem.

    Any hints about when they might at least bump up to 2.5 G speeds, like the 100+k and reasonably responsive CDMA data connections have?

  • Hopefully the rumors about the non-replaceable battery are untrue.

    The FCC link with some info (manual, pics, etc) is here... https://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/oet/cf/eas/reports/ ViewExhibitReport.cfm?mode=Exhibits&RequestTimeout =500&calledFromFrame=N&application_id=219429&fcc_i d='P5J-ONISH' [fcc.gov]
    • the tremendously successful, market-defining, cultural icon iPod? that one? the one that makes the covers of mainstream news mags (not tech mags)? the one that every other digital music player targets as the thing to beat? that iPod? yeah, i hope these guys didn't repeat any of their mistakes.

  • The gaping hole in the sidekick's functionality. (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Myself ( 57572 ) on Thursday August 05, 2004 @01:53AM (#9886356) Journal
    May I rant for a moment? Thank you.

    The way I see it, phones now have 3 main functions. First is placing and receiving voice phone calls, which my Nextel handset does quite handly. It has a vibrate motor and a headset jack, both essential for me. Second is acting as a modem, supplying my laptop with a pipe to the internet. The hardware is great at this, but the unlimited plan is an arm and a leg. The fact that my current phone can act as an RS232 modem without any drivers is great, I just wish USB support were better. The third function is "Everything else", all the fun toys that the Japanese enjoy for years before American providers make a big deal out of. Cameras and web browsers in the
    phone, voice recorders and reasonable calculators and games and all that. This category is where my Nextel sucks donkey parts. The java environment is miniscule, the screen is bad, the web browser is prehistoric and easily confused.

    The Hiptop/Sidekick turns this completely upside down. The little sucker was made to be third-category toy, with a great keyboard and screen, plenty of cool software, and an environment to make more. All it needs is a camera. It also appears adequate for voice calling, despite awkward earpiece placement. Where T-mobile drops the ball is that they don't allow the Sidekick to also act as a tethered modem. I'd have one tomorrow if it could replace my Nextel's functionality, but it can't.

    The obvious argument is something along the lines of "well, the browser in the phone can only eat so much data per day, so that's why the unlimited data plan is so cheap. If it ran tethered, they wouldn't make any money on data." Okay, but as far as I know, T-mobile does offer the same data plan on other handsets, which do pass it out the serial port and act as modems.

    The Sidekick has a USB port and IrDA hardware. It's poised to be the best, most useful handset in all 3 categories, if only T-mobile would support its use as such. Any ideas why they won't?
  • No iSync? No Upgrade! For purely political reasons, the fine people at Mark/Space have had to sit on their "Missing Sync for hiptop" [markspace.com] solution which worked in beta because t-mobile decided not to do PIM Sync [markspace.com]... so.. I'll keep mine going as long as I can, but.. it'll be a treo next time, probably.
  • I have one of the first gens, and ill let the slahdot crowd know the problems I see.

    1.) If you enter a non digital coverage area, bend over and take cause the phone becomes a paper weight due to the inability to cross over to nalog circuit.
    2.) If you out of coverage area and you powerycle the phone (it is just randomly shuts off mine has been doing that) when you power back on all your pim data is gone!
    3.) Phone breaks you are SOL to get your data without going on the T-Movile webstie to look it up. (What
    • The hiptop is a well-designed device. It is a TERRIBLY built device (generation 1, anyway). I've been through four, myself. If you're under warranty (it sounds like you're not, since you've had it for more than a year), call them up and get a replacement. You may have to go through a couple of them. Fortunately, I finally got a non-flaky one (color, too, when my original was b/w!) and am very happy with it.
  • Niice. For a sidekick, all we need are two shift keys :) It's been a loooong time. (I know this is obscure, but it's geeky)
  • I didn't notice anything mentioning if they had solved the terrible FM interference problem in the current model. I've got version 1 of this, and the interference is horrible. I drive a pickup truck, and there's no place far enough away that I can put the device where it doesn't screw up the radio.
  • I wonder how long until Lindsay Lohan gets one? She uses a tricked out "old version" currently.

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