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Hardware Entertainment

Home Theater Keyboards? 273

Meeper writes "I've been commissioned to build a Home Theater Computer system, but there is a distinct lack of keyboards that are suitable. The keyboard needs to be equipped with Bluetooth connectivity, compact, and include a built-in mouse or touchpad. The keyboard will be used on couches, so a solution such as the Logitech diNovo Media Desktop is unsuitable due to the normal freestanding mouse. Have any Slashdot readers used a keyboard which fufills my requirements?" Or, on the other hand, what best-compromise solutions have you come up with for melding ease of use with sufficient control?
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Home Theater Keyboards?

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  • by Raindance ( 680694 ) * <johnsonmxNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Saturday May 22, 2004 @09:59PM (#9227553) Homepage Journal
    Depending on what I want to do with my HTPC, I access it wirelessly through either RDC or VNC with the tiny iBook I normally keep sleeping under the couch.

    Absolute control, and it's smaller than most wireless keyboards. The only real downsides are price (if you wouldn't buy a tiny laptop anyway) and that establishing control takes about 2-3 seconds.

    RD
    • by svanstrom ( 734343 ) <tony@svanstrom.org> on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:19PM (#9227638) Homepage
      Add a cellphone and Salling Clicker [mac.com] to that, and you've got both a "complete" solution, as well as one that's small and always available; and no "2-3 seconds" for "establishing control".
  • Monkey (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:01PM (#9227561)
    Get a trained monkey. You know you want to.
  • RDP (Score:2, Informative)

    by dylanm ( 159359 )
    I use Windows remote desktop (RDP) on my laptop to access my media box...
  • Gyration (Score:5, Informative)

    by Alowishus ( 34824 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:03PM (#9227570) Homepage
    Gyration [gyration.com] has the best solutions I've found. Their mouse can be waved in the air to move the pointer, and they have a compact keyboard + mouse set that's intended for HTPC type solutions. It's not cheap stuff, but it looks nice and works well.
    • Re:Gyration (Score:5, Insightful)

      by sydlexic ( 563791 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:15PM (#9227623)
      I have one of these sitting next to me. I purchased it for my HTPC home theater. First, it does have excellent range. The keyboard is small which is nice for infrequent use, but a pain for anything else. The mouse takes some getting used to, but the 'gyroscopic' air waving thingy is cool. BUT. And there's always a but. I've had two of the RF receivers die on me. Gyration has been good about replacing them, but I'm dead in the water until the new one arrives. The syptoms are usually that the mouse "stops working". What's happened is the receiver no longer wants to talk to the mouse and won't re-learn the connection. I'm in this situation again tonight: the mouse isn't working and 30 minutes of poking and it's not coming back. Time to call tech support.

      Anyway. Aside from this and the price, it's a decent setup for HTPC.
      • Re:Gyration (Score:2, Informative)

        by Anonymous Coward
        I'm also using this for my HTPC. But I have a full sized keyboard (which most of the time sits under the couch). It's probably better than the mini keyboard, but it's not very good if you're a speed typist!

        The price was around $90 at Staples I believe
        • Intellect Airkey (Score:5, Informative)

          by andy landy ( 306369 ) <aplandells&hotmail,com> on Sunday May 23, 2004 @05:08AM (#9228697) Homepage

          I use one of these [uk.com] . The intellect AirKey is a small form-factor keyboard with built-in mouse that functions over infra-red. Infra-red really is a fine compromise, because I need to be in IR range to use the TV remote anyway!

          The mouse-pad thingy is quite neat, it's small and can be driven from your sofa. It's a bit tricky to get used to at first, but it's really worth it once you get used to it.

          My only advice is don't install the system with it, use a proper keyboard and mouse. This thing is fine as a PC remote control, but you probably don't want to set one up with it!

          If the above still hasn't sold you, it's a very cheap option and most importantly it's black!

    • Re:Gyration (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Relifram ( 607656 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:45PM (#9227737)
      Gyration is CRAP! I seem to recall posting this before, but here goes:

      I have the unfortunate pleasure of having about 20 of keyboard/mouse units at work. In the year that we've had them I've had to send back a full half of them for warranty work. We have two problems repeatedly: The keyboards simply stop working (everything looks ok, but no transmission) and the batteries in the mice refuse to hold a charge longer than about 20 minutes after about 2 months of use. (yea, we do the whole drain 'em till their dead before recharging them)

      Just my $.02
      • Re:Gyration (Score:5, Informative)

        by Doppler00 ( 534739 ) on Sunday May 23, 2004 @01:33AM (#9228156) Homepage Journal
        drain 'em till their dead before recharging them
        This is only good for Nickel Cadium batteries, which are seldom used anymore.

        Most manuals for devices using NiMH and Lithium Ion say the batteries last longer if you keep them charged up (topped off). Otherwise, the deep charge/discharge cycles put a lot of wear on the batteries.
        • Touchy NiMH issues (Score:3, Insightful)

          by cgenman ( 325138 )
          Most manuals for devices using NiMH and Lithium Ion say the batteries last longer if you keep them charged up (topped off). Otherwise, the deep charge/discharge cycles put a lot of wear on the batteries.

          Just for clarity's sake, the "best" way to keep NiMH batteries alive is to keep using them. Charge them up, let them sit, use them a bit, then re-charge after a month or so. If you leave a NiMH battery totally drained, you will hurt the battery... and NiMH batteries drain themselves over time. However,
          • by Cecil ( 37810 ) on Sunday May 23, 2004 @04:14AM (#9228583) Homepage
            However, if you leave it charging, you will kill the battery.

            Depends on the charger.

            Only the most brain-dead of chargers will keep charging until you take the batteries out, at least if they're designed for use with NiMH.

            Marginally more intelligent chargers automatically work on a timer that assumes the battery is fully drained, give it a full charge, then stop. These are partially where the 'You should drain all the way before recharging' myth comes from, at least in relation to NiMH.

            If you really want to keep your batteries in good condition though, you want to look into a microprocessor-based smart charger, which actually checks the voltage level of the battery to determine when it's topped off. The nicest ones even detect the type of battery based on its charge response curve.

            There is no alternative if you want to treat your batteries properly.

            Note that none of this applies for Li-Ion, which will readily catch on fire if charged improperly. Li-Ions are always supplied with their own charger, which is without exception a smart charger.
    • Re:Gyration (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Jeff DeMaagd ( 2015 )
      I've read several good reviews of Gyration on AV Science forums. Gyration isn't too badly priced when compared to the Logitech Bluetooth stuff, I could have sworn I saw the keyboard + mouse combo for $99 at Best Buy today.

      I wanted to buy it but I'm more in the market for a Bluetooth combo kit rather than some proprietary RF. Part of the reason is I have a laptop which has an available bluetooth reciever that goes into the frame, so I don't have to worry about breaking a USB dongle or anything like that.
    • Re:Gyration (Score:4, Informative)

      by vondo ( 303621 ) * on Saturday May 22, 2004 @11:08PM (#9227792)
      We've had a couple of these at work too, and they also stopped working (probably the original model).

      In addition, I've never found that I can get decent control from one of these like with a mouse, trackball, or touchpad. (But I haven't practiced as much either.) Coarse clicking can be pretty quick, but fine clicking (like a text link) takes a bit of patience to get the cursor right where you want it.

      Definitely try it before you plunk down $100 for it.

    • My friend has one of these so he can mouse around on his ridiculously large projection TV when his Xbox is in Linux.

      It's quite easy to get used to the mouse in the air movements. The movement is smooth and natural.

      And the best part is that you can put it down and use it like a normal mouse, too.

      I can't speak for the overall quality of the product, but he's had his for a few years and it still works fine.
  • LiteOn Airboard (Score:3, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:03PM (#9227572)
    http://www.digitalconnection.com/Products/keyboard /sk7100.asp
    • I've got one of these too and it works pretty well. The cool thing about an infrared one is that you can learn the keypresses with a regular remote. I have my Sony RM-VL900 programmed with all of the various arrow keys, etc, to control MythTV so I really don't need to use the keyboard itself that much.
  • Try a PDA? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by BlightThePower ( 663950 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:04PM (#9227575)
    Its not quite what you are asking for, but I've good results in that area using an iPAQ and writing my own little apps to allow the functionality I require. It can also double-up as a universal remote control for parts of the system that aren't necessarily under computer control. If its a dedicated home theater system I would have thought this would make more sense actually; an PDA is a smaller, handier size and it would be a pain to have the cat hit "CTRL-ALT-DEL" on a keyboard half way through a feature.
  • A regular wireless keyboard, and one of the wireless Gyroscopic mice. With a little practice, you can operate the mouse mid-air well enough for desktop work/demos. I wouldn't want to use it that way for FPS gaming, but they typically have a ball or optical unit as well. We've got a setup like that at work (Logitech on both), and it is fantastic... as long as you remember to drop the mouse in the charger at the end of the night.
  • Control Will Work (Score:4, Informative)

    by Dozix007 ( 690662 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:06PM (#9227582)
    A simple control, or PocketPC (if you can afford it) should suffice. Check out some Linux projects that feature Tivo and Media system like projects. If you can't get control configs to work out well, try a VNC client with a PocketPC, a bit expensive, but great control.
  • Quit yer whinin'... (Score:4, Informative)

    by TWX ( 665546 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:07PM (#9227588)
    Bluetooth is not required for a home theatre keyboard. I used a Keytronic wireless IR keyboard with built in glidepoint trackpad for some time. I ended up replacing it with a smaller keyboard (no numeric keypad, integrated arrows at the bottom right) with a built on joystick-style mouse controller. They were both PS/2 and had IR receivers that went at the front of the room.

    There are a few RF solutions, but none that have all of the features that *I* would like, and Infared works well enough if the receiver is placed well that there's no need for much more than that.
    • IR may work with strategic receiver placement, but not particularily well. Bluetooth owns it in every aspect except for cost. Better battery life. Better range. Much better range actually. You can literally leave your home and you'll still be in range, while with IR if you move to the other side of the room or someone walks in front of you you're hooped! Optical mice, believe it or not, work quite well on a wide range of surfaces. If I were the gent who started this thread I'd try an ordinary optical
      • by TWX ( 665546 )
        My living room is twelve feet wide and eighteen feet across. Ir project my image on one of the twelve foot walls. The IR receiver is up front under the screen on top of the shelf that holds the Laserdiscs and center channel. It works very well. The keyboard has to be pointed somewhere in the direction of the front of the room, but none-too-specific, and it's not exactly a challenge to keep objects out of the line of view, even with the projector sitting on a small table in the center of the room. It wo
  • KSI Keyboards (Score:4, Informative)

    by cmeans ( 81143 ) * <chris.a.meansNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:08PM (#9227597) Journal
    I use an IR keyboard with a trackball from KSI Keyboards [ksikeyboards.com]. I don't recall where I bought it on the net, but it cost around $100 or so (as I recall).

    It performed reasonably well while I used it, but it's not been in use for a year or two now...simply because I spend all my PC time on my laptop instead of through the PC connected to the TV.

    It was great for Midtown Madness [microsoft.com] on my 42" screen though!

    • I was about to post the KSI stuff until I saw this (and didn't want to be redundant). These units are *BY FAR* the easiest and most flexible solutions for a PC in the living room.

      While the keyboard and touchpad/touchstick combo units aren't exactly the best for FPS games, they will get the job done. Just don't expect too much. Wanna play Q3 or UT? Go to your "real" 'puter and wax some punk's behind.

      I've used these off-and-on in my work environment, and I love them. From my own experience, they're fai
  • I just use a normal remote. But then again all I do is normal STB type stuff. No surfing or anything that would need a keyboard. I've seen wireless trackball keyboards, but nothing I'd want to use.
  • by tji ( 74570 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:10PM (#9227606)
    My goal with my HTPC was to integrate it into my home theater as much as possible. That means using all of the components from a basic infrared remote.

    My MyHD HDTV PCI receiver card came with an IR receiver, so that was not a problem. There are many remote control options for the various DVD player packages.

    An app like Girder [girder.nl] can combine many applications and PC control functions for IR control.

    For the things that I cannot do via remote, VNC from my laptop lets me have full control. Or, a basic wireless keyboard/mouse are handy in rare occasions.
    • by aardwolf204 ( 630780 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @11:59PM (#9227933)
      I also use Girder and an ATI Remote Wonder [ati.com] for my HTPC setup. The ATI remote came bundled with a Radeon 7500 All In Wonder [hothardware.com] and they work flawlessly together. The MyHTPC [myhtpc.net] software also works wonders. There is an ATI Remote Wonder plugin [myhtpc.net] available for MyHTPC too.

      As for the keyboard and mouse, I use a Logitech cordless mouse and keyboard [logitech.com] which does the job nicely. I keep the mouse on the coffee table and the keyboard in one of the drawers. The only tricky part is keeping the RF receiver on the computer far enough away from the components in your home theater as the cord on the unit is not very long.

      I also have a 4 port USB hub running to a spot under the couch that allows me to quickly connect or disconnect things like USB Thumb Drives or USB Gamepads. I use the gamepads for many of the games on the system like GTA Vice City and MAME. Specifically I like the Gravis Gamepad Pro [gravis.com] (BB $15, Nice mapping software), the Nyko AirFlo PC [nyko.com] (BB $20, Dual Analog sticks, Air Flow technology), and if you can find it the GF USB Control Pad (BB $10, Dual Analog sticks). All of the gamepads work well with Girder and the games I use them for. Sometimes it is nice to have 3 or 4 different gamepads for N64 Emulators because it is easier to know which gamepad you are configuring. Before I had 4 Gravis Gamepad Pro's which was a pain because I had to label them 1 - 4 but windows would not allow me to change their names.

      Of course VNC is a must but aside from that if you get your bindings tight in girder you can do almost anything with MyHTPC and a good remote.
    • It's funny that you should mention Girder. I'm a programmer. I've contributed to MythTV and to HylaFAX. I grok C, perl, and PHP. I can read/write C++ Java. I can read a few others without breaking too much of a sweat. I'm working on my own code, and do web dev and net admin at work. I'm no slouch when it comes to computing.

      However, Girder was what pushed me over the edge and off of Windows for good. I have a remote control and an irMan. I wanted the power button on the remote to act as a toggle (ie: if mo

  • by WyrdOne ( 96731 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:11PM (#9227608)
    I use the "FreeBoard model No. GL3001" (Also marked as an "iFree")

    It's a USB attached unit that uses RF wireless (900Mhz I think). Has built in Trackball and mappable mutli-function buttons. I can control my HTPC from two rooms over if necessary. And runs on standard AAA batteries.

    I bought it a year or so ago from Directron.com
    • I also use the 'iFree' and it gets the job done pretty well. I don't get the range that the previous poster claims but it works fine from the couch (8-10 feet) Batteries don't last as long as the Scorpius keyboard I used previously. Had to replace that one as my 2.5 year old daughter tends to beat the crap out of these when she gets her hands on them, which is frequently. Couldn't find a replacement Scorpius at the time so I bought the iFree instead.

      Some more thoughts:
      Get one with a trackball. The joy
  • Well, Infinium Labs [infiniumlabs.com] had one demoed at E3 for their console. I'm not sure if it works on a regular PC.

    There's the which is nice (RF versus Infrared is always better). It has a built in thumbilina (thumb mouse). [google.com.ph]

    Beyond that...Remote desktop via a Tablet PC works...

  • by Punboy ( 737239 ) *
    http://www.directron.com/rf250.html http://www.directron.com/rf25key.html These both use RF... not necessarily bluetooth but they would do the job.
  • by UncleRage ( 515550 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:14PM (#9227617)
    As a couple folks below have mentioned, Gyration makes some nice products. I'm building a similar device right now and have opted for the Gyration Media Center Remote and Keyboard combo: Take a look here: http://www.gyration.com/mcrsuite.htm

    Good luck mate, and make a few bucks. =)

  • My htpc uses a simple ir receiver with a universal remote I picked up from my local sony store. Cost me about 50$ and an afternoon of my time. I use a program called girder to map my remote buttons, and depending on what I want to do I just switch the remote to say, vcr mode to take care of settings that wouldn't fit on the first "page" of keys. I know it's no good for typing, but it's an htpc so that's not a prevalent issue I hope. I'm able to map all the keyboard keys and shortcuts I need to operate t
  • by bersl2 ( 689221 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:14PM (#9227619) Journal
    Don't get me wrong, I'm all for Bluetooth. But I haven't seen anything outside of Logitech's diNovo that uses Bluetooth.

    Is IR really not good enough?
  • Security? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by pherris ( 314792 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:22PM (#9227650) Homepage Journal
    How secure are bluetooth keyboards? Is it possible to somehow sniff and read the connection? I suspect it's dumb question but the idea of a RF keyboard makes me little nervous. I guess I'm too old school.
    • I'm sure someone would find a way, but since bluetooth only works when the two devices are about 10-meters or so maximum, the person would have to be inside your house(if you live in one) or pretty close on the outside. I don't know about you, but I'd look pretty stupid standing outside trying to sniff your connection. If you do catch someone trying I suppose you could call the cops then an have him arrested for being on your property.
    • by GeorgeH ( 5469 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @11:27PM (#9227842) Homepage Journal
      What are you typing into a home theater pc that you are afraid might get out?

      Play CPE-1704-TKS^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H Friends. "Christ, I almost had it play the launch code for the nukes!"
  • I'm currently sitting in my home theatre typing this on my MS wireless keyboard (PS2). I have the receiver placed near the screen, with wires reaching to the computer in the next room. I use a standard wireless mouse on the wooden arm of the couch (purchased with this in mind).

    It works great - well enough to play FPS games in here.
  • Are there any translator utilities that can convert your typical videogame control-pad style "joystick" into being treaded as a mouse?
  • I don't know how easy it would be to find one today, but if you don't mind the added IR receiver, I happen to like my 'Surf Board' for keyboard stuff. The label on the back records it as an SK-7100, and there is support for the multimedia keys on this board for Linux, as well as Windows.

    I have also used what I will call a wrist board with my laptop, as well as a couple of desktop systems, and I think it would work well as a remote for a pc based home theatre system. It is burried somewhere in storage right
  • by bcombee ( 5301 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:30PM (#9227677) Homepage
    If you can compromise on Bluetooth, I'd recommend the keyboard/touchpad combo from Wireless Computing [wirelesscomputing.com]. These are designed for long-range wireless, like conference rooms and auditoriums (100'), but do very well in closer situations also.
  • MouseKeys? (Score:5, Informative)

    by Galvatron ( 115029 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:31PM (#9227686)
    If this is being controlled with Windows, there's the Accessiblity setting "MouseKeys" that lets you control the cursor with the num-pad. I assume Linux must have something similar.
  • Here [avsforum.com] is a recent summary of keyboard-and-mouse-in-one units for HTPCs. I can summarize it for you in a few sentences, though: None of the Bluetooth keyboards are suitable for home theater use (too big or no integrated trackball). The few otherwise usable HTPC keyboards use either IR or a proprietary RF scheme, both of which have either range or line-of-sight limitations
  • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:32PM (#9227688)
    The scenario:

    A small dark room in the lower level of a house (read: "parent's basement").

    An lcd screen on the wall hooked up to a Slackware box.

    A replica Captain's Chair from the USS Enterprise (for obvious reasons only a single chair is needed).

    The computer is voice activated and responds to the name, "Sulu".

    Act 1:
    Me: "Mr. Sulu, set course for http://www.slashdot.org."

    Computer: "Aye, captain".

    Me: "Engage!"

    I'm seriously drooling just thinking about it. That, my friends, would truly be living.

    "Warp speed!," my fellow slashdotter!
  • by anser ( 224618 ) * on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:34PM (#9227701) Homepage
    If you are using the HTPC to play DVD's and media files like many people, PowerDVD makes a nice little remote that you can use to run all the necessary player functions.

    What I do is put that remote up in the viewing area, and a real keyboard/mouse/LCD panel in the back of the room attached to the HTPC. The monitor is actually slaved to my Mitsubishi X400 projector, which gets the primary XGA feed from the Radeon card.

    This lets me play "maximum projectionist" from the back of the room when needed (I like to make trailer reels from Apple.com for example), but watch media from the couch with just a remote like the good old days.
  • by The Vulture ( 248871 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:39PM (#9227717) Homepage
    It doesn't have Bluetooth (it uses IR instead), but this is the keyboard I use with my HTPC (MythTV):
    Parex Wireless Multimedia Keyboard w/ Intellipoint Mouse [softwareandstuff.com]

    According to the website, they're sold out, but it might be available somewhere else. It works great (across the room for me, although my living room isn't that large), and it doesn't conflict with the Hauppauge IR receiver either (though it definitely will conflict with an irman, and maybe others, so be forewarned). It doesn't require direct line of sight, it will work on up to a 70 degree angle (if I remember the manufacturer's specs correctly). And, it was only $20 at the time.

    Otherwise, I've heard that the Gyration products are great, but again, they're not Bluetooth, they're RF.

    -- Joe
  • Bluetooth? (Score:3, Informative)

    by elmegil ( 12001 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:40PM (#9227718) Homepage Journal
    The keyboard needs to be equipped with Bluetooth connectivity,

    Why? My HT PC uses a NiceTracker ACK-573 [directron.com] keyboard. It's an infrared PS/2 keyboard. Works just fine (with one exception I'll get to momentarily), and has the added bonus that I can program my Universal Remote from it, and use the remote for most functions that don't require me to actually be entering text. Since I run MythTV [mythtv.org], I rarely need to enter text, and it saves me having to doink with LIRC.

    The one exception to working fine is that the thing eats batteries, even when it's not in use. The solution was pretty simple: run to Radio Shack, get a pushbutton switch, drill a hole in the case and install the switch on the battery terminal. Voila, on-off capability that saves the battery.

  • by rednox ( 243124 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:43PM (#9227727) Homepage

    All that we use to control our HTPC is a Logitech MX 700 wireless mouse [bit-tech.net]. With the HTPC app that we use, SageTV [www.sage.tv], everything is accessible from a mouse-driven interface. We don't use that computer for email or games requiring a keyboard. My only complaint about the mouse is that its range is only about 10 feet.

    The only thing that we can't do with the mouse is turn on the TV and the stereo. I am planning on programming one of the extra buttons on the mouse to do this. I'm planning on using it to launch a macro via the software program Girder [girder.nl] that will send all of the appropriate IR commands out of the USB-UIRT [usbuirt.com] IR blaster/receiver to turn on all the devices and switch their inputs accordingly. That should solve the only problem we have, which is explaining to babysitters how to use the TV.

  • My solution (Score:5, Insightful)

    by vondo ( 303621 ) * on Saturday May 22, 2004 @10:54PM (#9227761)
    I wanted to do this too. I settled on a Logitech RF keyboard and a RF trackball. The trackball isn't integrated, but it sits nicely on a knee or arm of the couch. These aren't bluetooth, but maybe by now they are (mine are several years old).

    Another benefit for me is that the PC hooked to the HT system is my main PC, so the keyboard moves easily between the desk and the couch; they trackball and a wireless mouse are both hooked up via USB and I just grab whatever one I want.

  • by ikewillis ( 586793 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @11:04PM (#9227783) Homepage
    What are you doing that can't just as easily be accomplished with an XBox and wireless controller? It would seem to me that trying to use a computer is the fallacy of your approach. Having built two computer systems to attach to my projector and having significant frustration with both of them, I wholeheartedly recommend an XBox for what you are attempting to accomplish.
  • Check [uni-halle.de] this [t3.co.uk] out.

    While the manufacturer's page [fujitsu-siemens.com] doesn't mention it at all, the keyboard and trackpad of this little powerhouse are detachable and use Bluethooth. I'm sure you need more than a laptop can provide as an HTPC, but maybe you can get one of the keyboards as a spare part.

    I assume it has batteries that need to be charged, and I don't know how that would happen without the laptop to chrage it.
  • Oh - that's easy (Score:3, Informative)

    by Etrigan_696 ( 192479 ) on Saturday May 22, 2004 @11:25PM (#9227838)
    Just give up on the mouse/touchpad idea and go with an integrated trackball. I just love trackballs. After destroying my right shoulder in a work injury, I can no longer use a mouse - causes my shoulder to swell and ache like a mofo. I fell in love with trackballs.
    a google search for:
    keyboard "integrated trackball" bluetooth
    returned about a bazillion hits.
  • I don't know about any of you, but the last thing I'd want as a remote for my home theater is a friggin keyboard.

    Get him a PDA with bluetooth. There should be some software that'll control all that needs controlling. And if he really needs a keyboard then he can use the on screen keyboard, or just use graffiti or whatever that particular PDA has.
  • Link here [digitalconnection.com]. I don't think you would actually want to buy it from there though, apparently they farked with its hardware themselves, and I am not sure exactly why. Finding a place to actually buy it from is left as an exercise to the reader.

    I used to use one of these a few years ago. It is infrared, but that doesn't really matter that much, it would go about 30 feet, and had a wide angle. The "mouse" is some weird joystick thing that looks more like a plastic nipple than anything, and takes some getting

  • I bought a Logitech bluetooth keyboard and mouse, and while they work great 15 feet away on my couch, they are simply too big and bulky to be practical. They are basically gathering dust. I now control everything on my HTPC via the wonderful MX-500 remote [remotecentral.com]. I originally intended to play some games on my HTPC+HDTV but it's just too hard to play decently on a couch with a keyboard on your lap. Nowadays I mainly use the box for mp3's, video (TV episodes and the like), and emulators using Xbox controllers.
  • I love my setup! (Score:4, Informative)

    by neuroking ( 204934 ) on Sunday May 23, 2004 @12:22AM (#9227999)
    Howdy! I do reviews for Design Technica and had a similar issue when setting up my htpc. I settled on two separate methods.

    For most regular use, i have a Logitech DiNovo keyboard and mouse (I know, I read your post, not in the air mouse) and it ahs BY FAR the best range of any wireless option I tried (Logitech MX, Logitech regular, MS wireless, MS BT, Gyration, and a couple other no namers). On top of it, I don't need to put it away, sicne it practically looks like a work of art instead of a dorky keyboard. Also, the programmable keypad makes for a slightly bulky but funky remote.

    For more HT based stuff, I use a Remote Wonder that came wiht my Radeon 9800 AIW Pro. Good range and all, but mousing with it is horribly impractical for anything more than a quick click every few minutes.

    You can try the Gyration mouse, which I thought gave good distance (but the keyboards absolutely suck - bad enough that I returned it one week later and ate the restocking fee), but I found it semi awkward and completely useless for games.

    I have this all setup about 12 ft from the TV. I was worried about interference (Wifi AP, cordless phones, 2 wireless console controllers, 2 wireless PC controllers in a multiunit building), but so far, everything is great.
    • Regarding your comment about the ATI Remote Wonder, I just got the new model (voucher came with my Radeon 9600 AIW). The mouse control is much improved, and the button feel is better too. It's still not as good as a real mouse, but it's a lot better than it used to be.
  • by BP9 ( 516511 ) on Sunday May 23, 2004 @12:23AM (#9228006)
    http://www.qtronix.com/ScorpLI.html [qtronix.com]

    I have one of these and am very happy with it. I don't use the mouse much but it works fine. Its small enough to sit reasonably unobtrusively in my living room (with the IR repeated via Xantech IR repeaters down to where the equipment is racked).

    Only issue I've had is it sends lengthy IR codes when you use the mouse that were crashing an IRTrans [irtrans.de] infrared decoder/receiver -- the guy that makes them has a fix in the works though.

    I saw these at Comdex a couple of years ago (from a taiwanese company), then recently set up a MythTV box and found a guy in the UK selling them on ebay. I looked a bit in the US but lost patience trying to find a distributor and ended up ordering from the UK guy for about $80 including shipping.

  • what i use... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by ophix ( 680455 ) on Sunday May 23, 2004 @12:31AM (#9228026) Homepage
    i use a wireless microsoft natural keyboard and an ati all in wonder remote.

    the ati is as good of a mouse as i need, and i rarely have to use the keyboard but when i do, it is handy.

    i dont see how bluetooth is needed, any wireless kb should work as long as it is comfy for you to use.

    another option for the mouse is a gyration (i think that is how it is spelled). they are pretty slick, let you wave your hand through the air to move the mouse. i would get the ati remote as well though, then you have a nice remote to control the playback functionality and a basic mouse, and the gyration for any advanced stuff you want to do.
  • Easy (Score:3, Interesting)

    by iamdrscience ( 541136 ) on Sunday May 23, 2004 @12:47AM (#9228063) Homepage
    Nintendo Powerglove. Yes, it does work under linux (link [boutell.com])

    ...is anyone surprised?
    • Re:Easy (Score:3, Funny)

      by neuroking ( 204934 )
      Surprised that something from the early 80's works on Linux? Yes. I thought they only had drivers for 1970's hardware. ;)
  • there's a program called maxivista that allows you to have one computer act as a secondary display for another computer, although that may leave you using the HTPC as an extended display for the laptop... Hmm, Never used it but I saw it demoed on TechTV
  • I've used one for a couple years now. I found it open box at CompUSA one day and tried it out. I promptly replaced my Logitech setup with it. It is a single unit with a pointing stick in the top right corner and, the best part for me, is it's RF instead of IR. I know a lot of people here say IR is fine, but I NEVER have line of sight to my HTPC from my couch because it is around the corner from me. This keyboard has been the best $20 I've ever spent on a PC. You can find them on the web at multiple pl
  • I have a Philips DVX8000 home theater PC which includes a remote control and a keyboard. Both are infra-red. The keyboard includes an integrated mouse, kind of like a joystick on the upper right which you can operate with your thumb.

    Things work reasonably well except for the fact that the keyboard is infrared which causes problems trying to use it in your lap.

    I think these keyboards are the same as those used in the earlier web TV boxes.

    The keyboard is limited, i.e. no numeric pad, to keep it small and
  • by SirFlakey ( 237855 ) on Sunday May 23, 2004 @02:45AM (#9228360) Homepage
    I am not convinced that adding a full size or even a compact keyboard to a home theater system is a great idea

    Depending on your funds, it may be much smarter to investigate the use of a wireless pocket PC or similar device used in conjunction with automation software like girder to control your system. The upshot of this is that you can display information about the current media elements on the your control device. A truly smart remote control and with 802.11 the range would exceed your typical TV to sofa distance as well.
  • Listen man, if you want todosomething really serious, a place like Slashdot is the last place to look for advice you can count on. This place is like reading the WEekly World News. HOwever, it is entertaining.
  • I find that, since I sit on the right-hand side of the couch which has a decently wide-yet-soft-and-rounded arm, a nice thick and stiff hardbound book (I use the "Black And Decker Complete Guide to Home Repair") with a simple cheap soft mousepad works great with my Logitech wireless optical mouse.

    Those with some sort of RSI may need to adjust, but it doesn't bother me at all.
  • by fishdan ( 569872 ) * on Sunday May 23, 2004 @07:30AM (#9228947) Homepage Journal
    I use Palm VNC [btinternet.com] to make my Tungsten C Palm [palmone.com] be the remote control for my Media Center [mythtv.org]

    Pros: It's SO DAMN COOL
    Cons: the 900mhz phone screws up my wireless. I solved this by getting rid of my land line and going all cellular,

    I also use PalmVNC at work to manage a large variety of machine, although only mac, windows and RH9 (damn I'm gonna miss you RH9). It's quite convenient to haev my palm with me and be able to read logs while in the bathroom. Ok, I know that's a bad pun, but I really DO read the log files from my servers on PalmVNC when I'm in the crapper. And it's not as bad as going to the bathroom to play solitaire with your Palm.

  • I have installed several Mac Based Home Theater Computers for clients. Typically I just use a PowerBook G4 as the main interface and maybe a a Roku Media Player.

    Usually I just use a gyration mouse and keyboard - they make these in Bluetooth now.

    In the past I have used one of the Grandtec MiniVic Flexible Keyboards [grandtec.com] it coutour fits really nicely to most arms on leather chairs and kind of looks like a built in.

    Take into account there are several USB 1.1 / 2.0 Hubs that are wireless.

    I also get my clients to
  • Take another look (Score:2, Informative)

    by jimberini ( 444533 )
    My $0.02 is to buy the Logitech DiNovo. I understand the desire for an integrated Mouse, but I have yet to find one that works well. I run a demo environment similar to what it sounds like you are building, and have have tried A BUNCH of wireless keyboards/mouses. I have had nothing but problems until I purchased the DiNovo. All of the IR and all the other RF solutions would drop keys on the keyboard, or more annoyingly, the mouse would be uncontrollable. I have a whole drawer of wireless KB/Mice that
  • by SteveX ( 5640 ) * on Sunday May 23, 2004 @07:56AM (#9228993) Homepage
    I use the Logitech cordless keyboard (it seems to have the smallest footprint), and a standard Microsoft optical cordless mouse. The optical cordless mouse works great on the arm of the couch.

    And, one you get to know your way around the software you're using, you usually don't need the mouse anyway.

  • Does the cool sounding name enlarge your organ? It sure isn't any more useful for wireless keyboards than the proprietary RF or IR versions that came before the bluetooth circlejerk.
  • http://www.superpen.com/
  • The separate mouse is OK. I spend my evenings on the couch, with the notebook in my lap and the (optical) mouse on the couch, just where my hand naturally comes to rest. It's much more comfortable than any track(ball|point|pad) or whatever.

    Other than a real mouse, the only I found usable was a clip-on "Ballpoint" mouse sold a long time ago with Toshiba laptops. I don't think they exist anymore. And they didn't have a scroll wheel of course.

    Go with a standard wireless optical mouse!
  • Ruwido [ruwido.com] has brilliantly designed keyboards, remotes and mice for the wireless iving-room use

    Their "Amadeus" RC is reported (by them) to have 70.000 RC's preprogrammed

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