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Wireless Networking Hardware

Bluetooth Shipments Exceed 1M per Week 252

Posted by CmdrTaco from the they're-everywhere dept.
An anonymous reader writes "Just when you think that Bluetooth is dead... The Bluetooth SIG releases a press story that quotes some pretty impressive figures - over 1M Bluetooth enabled devices have been shipped within a week. Bluetooth wireless technology has been quietly making progress over the past year and can now be found in an impressive array of consumer products, from mobile phones and headsets to PDAs, PCs, MP3 players and even automobiles. The technology has reached critical mass, with several books on how to write your own applications with the technology, including Java for those of you who want to create your own Bluetooth apps for your SonyEricsson P900"
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Bluetooth Shipments Exceed 1M per Week More

Bluetooth Shipments Exceed 1M per Week

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  • What's next...? (Score:4, Funny)

    by RyuuzakiTetsuya ( 195424 ) <.taiki. .at. .cox.net.> on Thursday November 06, 2003 @05:36PM (#7412011)
    BSD people start claiming that boat loads of BSD products are flying off the shelve? *looks at apple.com* Never mind. :)

  • Interesting. (Score:4, Funny)

    by Ikeya ( 7401 ) <dave@NosPAm.kuck.net> on Thursday November 06, 2003 @05:38PM (#7412026) Homepage
    Perhaps this is the beginning of the end of the "beginning of the end of bluetooth" statements?

    • Well, perhaps it's a beginning of the end of the beginning of the end... but I'm sure we'll be laughing at "BLUETOOTH IS DEAD!" for months to come.

      Meanwhile, I'll just keep using it.

    • Perhaps this is the beginning of the end of the "beginning of the end of bluetooth" statements?

      Dunno, I'm just a honest, hardworking undertaker.

      Bring out your wirelesses! Bring out your wirelesses!
    • ...to be on your cellphone, on your computer, in your blender, in your food processor, and any other battery-powered self-pleasure device of your choice.

      Go BlueTooth!
    • Would a dying standard be releasing a new specification version? Don't think so [palminfocenter.com].

      The naysayers can eat their statements. Wifi wasn't cheap and took a while to take hold. Same case with bluetooth.
      The Palm Tungsten 3 does not include a wifi chip but a bluetooth one. Because a wifi chip takes up more power. For portable devices, bluetooth will become de facto in the coming year.
    • Bluetooth has never been 'dying' - I really don't know why /. keeps posting this FUD. It's certainly very popular here in UK and is great for transferring files from Phone -> Phone or Phone -> Laptop.
      • What's wrong is that /. is mainly a U.S. thing.

        The Bluetooth market looks a whole lot different in Canada and the U.S. We have four major cell carriers in Canada, and there are about two Bluetooth phone models available in the country. The largest carrier doesn't have any at all. To start using Bluetooth on my phone, I'd have to ditch my cellular provider.

        Cost is still a huge issue. I can get a cellular phone for about C$50. But if I want a Bluetooth phone, it's about C$500. So I better have a good use fo

  • Technology takes time (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Drakonian ( 518722 ) on Thursday November 06, 2003 @05:38PM (#7412028) Homepage
    New technologies take time to get established. Obvious but true. Think of how long it took for video rental stores to get a DVD section.
    • > New technologies take time to get established. Obvious but true. Think of how long it took for video rental stores to get a DVD section.
      There's a difference: DVD's work.

      • Funny this story appears just as I was synching all of my contact info between my cellphone, laptop, and desktop. Just one handy use of bluetooth.

        Wireless headsets rock.

        You haven't lived until you've spent an afternoon reducing stellar spectra and having the results published immediately on the web- while sitting in the middle of a endangered oak savannah. Cell phone coverage is almost complete over North America. A Bluetooth connection on an internet capable phone make a use wherever-the-fuck you want wi

    • New technologies take time to get established ...if at all.

      Bluetooth will fail because there are, and always have been, better and cheaper alternatives. It fails in price/performance even compared to 10+ yr old technology:

      Low speed, short range: 39KHz IR or 433MHz AM (dirt cheap)
      High speed, short range: IRDA (also dirt cheap)
      High speed, long range: 802.11a/b/g (not dirt cheap but bluetooth can't match the performance)

      Can somebody tell me exactly where bluetooth's niche is?

      • Re:Technology takes time (Score:4, Insightful)

        by Tony Hoyle ( 11698 ) <tmh@nodomain.org> on Thursday November 06, 2003 @06:01PM (#7412264) Homepage
        Blootooth, fail?

        When's the last time you went into a phone shop? - *every single device* is bluetooth enabled.

        Some of the the new ones aren't IRDA enabled (IRDA requires a line of sight link, doesn't work in all lighting conditions and is damned slow anyway).

        AM? *cough* when's the last time you saw an AM enabled phone?
        • When's the last time you went into a phone shop? - *every single device* is bluetooth enabled.

          Years ago... I have dozens of computers but no interest in carrying a cell phone or PDA everywhere I go. So I'll take your word that phones have bluetooth, but will people use it?

          AM? *cough* when's the last time you saw an AM enabled phone?

          Never. But right now my keyboard and mouse are talking to my computer over 433MHz AM. So does the clicker for my garage door opener, and so does the remote control for my

        • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

          by account_deleted ( 4530225 )
          Comment removed based on user account deletion
          • I can't say I've seen it that bad, but for the providers where I am, bluetooth is only found on the upper 25% of the phones they sell. The more expensive and full featured ones.

            I don't have a cell phone and have just about no desire to have people talking at me whenever I'm out. I do not like the regular phone unless there is no alternative.

            But, the prospect of using the cellular data network to get access on my PDA does interest me. I understand that the phones with bluetooth allow you on your laptop
            • There was a company (cant remember who) that made a PCMCIA based GSM phone a while back. We're only now getting to the point where you can integrate the phone onto one chip, I think sometime next year TI are planning to release a complete system on a chip with something 30 external passive components that should enable someone to fit in a Compact flash form factor.
        • Well I would n't say every single mobile device is Bluetooth enabled. One million units per week is n't even that large a number considering, around 450 million mobile phones will be sold this year. So if all of that one million are phones, that's just over 11% of phones have bluetooth.

          The reason some phones don't have IrDA is because Bluetooth is the new IrDA, i.e. not a "killer" feature (at the moment) but useful if you need it. Where Bluetooth and IrDA differ is Bluetooth is much more complicated and e
          • Blutooth is not the new IRDA, it is way beyond it because of the absent line-of-sight requirement which radically increases the number of applications. This is why bluetooth headphones exist.

            Bluetooth isn't significantly more complicated to implement now, there is an issue which you have missed and that is the power drain which remains relatively high (and higher even than IRDA).

      • Re:Technology takes time (Score:5, Insightful)

        by wishus ( 174405 ) * on Thursday November 06, 2003 @06:06PM (#7412295) Journal
        Can somebody tell me exactly where bluetooth's niche is?

        High speed, short range, low power use, no line of sight?

        Also, if you are thinking about 802.11x as a wireless ethernet cable, think of BlueTooth as a wireless USB cable. They've got different purposes.

      • Bluetooth will fail because [...]

        Low speed, short range: 39KHz IR or 433MHz AM
        High speed, short range: IRDA
        High speed, long range: 802.11a/b/g

        Can somebody tell me exactly where bluetooth's niche is?

        From 50,000 feet many technologies look the same, so your bullet points don't really matter.

        VHS beat Beta for secondary reasons, even though Beta was the better technology.

        When the Amiga and the Atari ST came out to challenge the Mac, they looked alike from 50,000 feet (but short term, the ST won

      • Re:Technology takes time (Score:4, Insightful)

        by HardCase ( 14757 ) on Thursday November 06, 2003 @06:27PM (#7412447)
        Can somebody tell me exactly where bluetooth's niche is?


        Extremely low power requirements when compared to 802.11. Just the thing for battery powered devices, which, coincidentally, is where Bluetooth is employed.


        -h-

        • Can somebody tell me exactly where bluetooth's niche is?802.11 is also overkill for many uses. While you would want to connect your computer to a LAN with 802.11, having all your keyboard traffic go into the same broadcast range would be jamming too much chatter into the airwaves.

          A better analogy is comparing USB to Ethernet. While you want your peripherals to use USB, you use the Cat-5 for your networking.

          And, as has been mentioned several times, BlueTooth also has the low power advantage.

      • Well, let's see.... none of the options you list are all that useful for connecting my phone to my pda or laptop (IRDA? Sure, if I want to juggle keeping things lined up. Of course, then no free hands to actually use anything.....)

        Bluetooth won't be dead until there is something out there that has a possibility of replacing it. And none of the options you list is there.....

  • RIP BT (Score:4, Interesting)

    by GlassUser ( 190787 ) <{ten.resussalg} {ta} {todhsals}> on Thursday November 06, 2003 @05:38PM (#7412029) Homepage Journal
    I posted this on another forum, but I think it works here:

    He's right. Bluetooth works very well in a very few, very limited situations, but for the most part it's useless. I think that's mostly due to OEM support than anything else. Not a single one of the phones I want support it, and the add-on adapters (that regularly fall off and get lost) cost way too much (Nextel quoted me US$170 for a little bluetooth dongle that I'd probably lose any way). It's not even being used for what it was made. BT, contrary to the claims of random discount hardware mfgrs is not for home networking.

    If anyone wants me to use bluetooth, they need to give me at least some of what I want. Here's where you can start:
    Decent keyboard that works with most things
    I like the look of the MS keyboard, but it's the old square design and I need the split "ergo" style - unless I limit my typing to an hour or so a day and wear a wrist brace. A nifty add-on would be something that remembers a connection to multiple devices so I can flip a switch and have it cycle between my desktop, laptop/tablet, pda, and phone
    Same for a mouse
    Working on Pocket PC/Windows Mobile/whatever is kinda expected (but isn't supported at this time at all).
    A reasonably inexpensive phone with BT
    Weren't these chips supposed to cost like $5? Why am I nearly doubling the cost of a US$200 phone to get it? This is garbage. Filth. I'd be happy with a phone that did nothing but dial in and out, with BT (interfacing with a headset, pda dialer, etc would be nice - eg to the point where I don't even need an onboard address book - if I do have one, I want to be able to sync it with the PIM of my choice, like outlook). Or give me an overkill device like the Mot MPx200. I'm willing to pay a lot more for the extra functionality. My biggest gripe about phones right now is that they charge me out the boot for lots of irrelevant "features" that are only usable on the phone - my Mot i90c can store like 500 names, addresses, dates, tasks, and all that, but they don't exist outside the phone.
    ditch this master/slave crap
    I want a mesh, not locking one device to one host until I want to go through the hassle of retraining another one. I want my PDA, phone, and console to be able to grab my headset as needed. I want to be able to hear system events and dictate speech to my tablet on the bus, get a small beep when the phone (in my pocket) rings, maybe an onscreen notification of who it is, and tap a button on my headset to answer if I want.
    • AT&T's mlife service has bluetooth enabled phones that start at $50. Cingular has them as well.

      I think Verizon is the *only* carrier who doesn't carry at least one BT phone here in the states.
    • A reasonably inexpensive phone with BT

      Is free cheap enough?

      http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000 0AGRYX/qid=1068159128/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_1/002-810734 9-0711235?v=glance&s=wireless&n=507846
    • here's a nifty list of some amazing designs

      http://www.nokia.com/nokia/0,8764,3455,00.html

    • Re:RIP BT (Score:5, Insightful)

      by infiniti99 ( 219973 ) <justin@affinix.com> on Thursday November 06, 2003 @06:03PM (#7412277) Homepage
      Bluetooth keyboards and mice are new, give it some time and we will have more designs to choose from, I'm sure.

      For a good and inexpensive bluetooth phone, get a Nokia 6310i. B&W display, long battery life, no frills, but has the stuff you actually want, like bluetooth and GPRS.

      Bluetooth device pairing is necessary for security. There are some functions that don't require pairing for convenience sake, such as sending business cards, and there was an earlier /. story about how this can be abused. I can imagine it would be much worse if pranksters could use your phone for dialing out!

      I do agree that most bluetooth devices are much too expensive. I think this is mostly an issue with sales and not the cost of making the chips. Remember when USB was a premium?

      I think Bluetooth's saving factor will be Apple. Recently they have started embedding the support into their computers, and even created a wireless mouse. I've seen their software interface, and it is very easy to use. Don't you love it how Apple always steps in and says, "Dammit people, you do it like this!" and it becomes a huge success? :)

    • !(RIP BT) (Score:5, Insightful)

      by int2str ( 619733 ) * on Thursday November 06, 2003 @06:10PM (#7412334)
      > Working on Pocket PC/Windows Mobile/whatever is kinda expected

      I am working on a implementation for a major PocketPC manufacturer. It will come, trust me.

      > A reasonably inexpensive phone with BT

      My wife and I just got not one, but two Ericsson T616 (with BT) for FREE. Look around the offers are out there.

      > Weren't these chips supposed to cost like $5?

      Yes, and they are starting to! If you go to csr.com right now you (end user) can buy a CSR bluecore module for $14 a piece (that's for 5). Put in a discount for large orders and you're probably pretty darn close to $5...

      > Why am I nearly doubling the cost of a US$200 phone to get it?

      You are not. No idea where you get that number from...

      > I'd be happy with a phone that did nothing but dial in and out, with BT (interfacing with a headset, pda dialer, etc would be nice - eg to the point where I don't even need an onboard address book - if I do have one, I want to be able to sync it with the PIM of my choice, like outlook).

      You can do ALL of these RIGHT NOW with a HP iPaq and a Bluetooth enabled phone (like the T616, T68i, Nokia 3650+++).

      So before you declare Bluetooth RIP, some research would have been nice :).

      Bluetooth can be really fun. Ask my wife. She's beaming Ringtones like crazy, synching her address book with outlook and surfing the net on her notebook.

      Cheers,
      Andre
    • There's an appriciable number of phones supporting Bluetooth available. Most of the more affordable phones are not available to Nextel customers unfortunately. Ericsson/Sony-Ericsson, Siemens, and Nokia all have several BT equipped phones. I have a R520m I bought on eBay for about $60. It supports more contacts than I have friends, has a calendar that synchs with iCal, both a HSCSD and GPRS modem, and has a pretty nice antenna.

      The Nokia 6310i as I understand it is pretty comparable to the R520 and would pr
    • Nextel quoted me US$170 for a little bluetooth dongle that I'd probably lose any way)

      There lies your problem. It looks like you are in the US. You can blame Qualcomm for the lack of Bluetooth enabled CDMA phones. They have so far refused to bring out a chipset that supports it (They may have recently announced one). If you were to go with Nokia or Sony Ericsson over GSM then you would have plenty of choices (The T610 being my favorite).

      I personally use BT for syncing my phone to my mac which works perfec

      • What does Qualcomm have to do with anything? My carrier is nextel, my phone is motorola. When I was looking at Nokias, I couldn't find one either. I lost a $70 bluetooth dongle because it wouldn't stay on the phone. From everything I've seen, BT is garbage.
    • I'd say a lot of its problems have to do with that fact that (at least in windows) it has the worst drivers I've dealt with since the early win95 days.

      I have two USB Bluetooth dongles. The first one blows chunks on its own. I plug it in and >50% of the time...nothing. I ran the thing thru a USB analyzer at work (I do USB for a living...) and there's no activity at all. I also checked the USB-IF list and lo-and-behold it's not even USB logo certified. Great. Got the 2nd one from a friend (an iogear
    • I use bluetooth on my T68i to control XMMS on my Linux box, and it works fine. I can control the volume, skip in the playlist, turn random on/off; pretty much all you need.

      The T68 and P800 (AFAIK) support a rather simple "API" where you can use AT commands to prompt for user input. It is very easy to display yes/no, lists and simple search dialogs. You can also listen on the keypresses, so maintaining state in an app shouldn't be much of a problem. Great hack value :-)

  • So what if "Bluetooth enabled" devices are selling? I've *never* seen anybody using Bluetooth in real life. Hell, I don't know anybody who even knows what in the hell it is. There are also billions of televisions that have shipped with the V-chip. I don't know of anyone who's ever used it.
    • Too bad you can't see me right now. Currently syncing my SonyEricsson T610 with my Mac. Been using it since I first received it. Oh, and a USB Bluetooth thingie cost about $50. In Sweden, with hellish VAT. If you were offered $170 for something similar, the seller was on drugs.
    • So what if "Bluetooth enabled" devices are selling? I've *never* seen anybody using Bluetooth in real life. Hell, I don't know anybody who even knows what in the hell it is.

      Well, considering that the last five Macintoshes I purchased (including this sweet dual G5), have Bluetooth built in, I would say that a significant number of folks have the functionality. The question now is are they going to use it? I know I do for phone synching and small file transfers. Bluetooth file transfer in OS X is super e
    • I use bluetooth to connect my PDA to my mobile phone while I'm on the move to read my emails, check my account, take a look at the train schedules.... Quite often I use my PDA and bluetooth GPS for navigation, hiking .... I like my bluetooth headset verymuch and I always synch my mobile phone and PDA to my computer at home or at work using bluetooth. Now, let alone that part of my job is to develope kinematic sensors to monitor the physical activities of patients and no surprise that these sensors talk to e

    • Re:They're selling... so what? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by SuperCal ( 549671 ) on Thursday November 06, 2003 @06:03PM (#7412278) Homepage
      I think the problem is you just don't know. I use my PDA and laptop with bluetooth cell phone everyday, but because my cell phone stays in my pocket you couldn't tell.

    • well (Score:2)

      by asv108 ( 141455 ) *
      I've seen wireless headsets all over the place. Toyota even has a Bluetooth enabled prius.
    • Thats because you must live in the US. The US must be the most technologically backward country when it comes to mobile phones. And mobiles (limited power) is where bluetooth does its best.
    • If you were using OS X, you would want Bluetooth in your phone... Believe me.

      Windows XP... $399
      Good cellphone... $300
      Another good cellphone, after you lost your last one at the bar... $300
      Re-entering all your phone numbers... Impossible...

      Automagic syncing of your addressbook with iSync and Bluetooth... Priceless...

    • People in the UK seem to like Bluetooth for "bluejacking" [theregister.co.uk]:

      bluejacking is the art of anonymously sending messages to users of other Bluetooth devices who have switched on the technology and made their handset "visible" to potential bluejackers. Since Bluetooth-enabled phones, PDAs and laptops can search for other devices within their short range, bluejackers in crowded transport hubs, pubs or any other public place can easily send messages without being detected.

  • A challenge? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by millette ( 56354 ) <robin@@@millette...info> on Thursday November 06, 2003 @05:42PM (#7412067) Homepage Journal
    "Even critics would be hard-pressed to name any other wireless communications technology that managed to achieve the volumes and diversity of deployment of Bluetooth in just six years."
    Michael Wall, industry analyst, Frost & Sullivan.

    Anybody feels like taking this challenge?

    • 802.11? (Score:3, Interesting)

      by freeweed ( 309734 )
      Sure. I'll be a stickler and volunteer 802.11.

      Damn near everywhere I go I see this stuff for sale, and pretty soon every home router will have it by default.

      I have yet to see a Bluetooth device anywhere for sale, or in use by anyone I know. Everyone mentions cellphones, but um.. I thought they already WERE wireless devices. I guess whatever features BT adds don't ring my bell. I've played with 802.11 on iPaqs, but have yet to see a PDA with BT on it, which is about the only use I can think for this stuff.
      • I can fix 802.11 to at least 2000, when it was in a friend's PowerBook. Also, Palm has a couple of BT capable PDAs.
        • Slashdot had its first story on BT in April of 1998.

          802.11 has been in the works since 1990, but was nothing more than paper until 1997:

          Seven years later (1997), the group approved IEEE 802.11 as the world's first WLAN standard with data rates of 1 and 2 Mbps. In 1999 the working group approved two extensions to 802.11 - 802.11a and b.

          From random googling [fedcirc.gov].

      • I have yet to see a Bluetooth device anywhere for sale, or in use by anyone I know. Everyone mentions cellphones, but um.. I thought they already WERE wireless devices. I guess whatever features BT adds don't ring my bell. I've played with 802.11 on iPaqs, but have yet to see a PDA with BT on it, which is about the only use I can think for this stuff. Sorry, wireless mice and keyboards are a hassle to use IMHO - batteries, the extra cost, etc - and it's not like a wired keyboard that never moves makes one b
        • those who have used BT really like it, those who haven't either have no opinion or don't think it's worth it. Draw your own conclusion from that.

          My conclusion would be that it's impossible to have a positive opinion about something until you've really used it. Or rather, if someone thinks something is a good idea, they've probably gone and tried/used it. Kinda like everything else in the world.

          Yeah, the cynical side of life :)

          Good point about the presentation side of things though, those IR/RF mice/RC c
      • He mentioned breadth of adoption. Wifi is wonderful, but it's use is limited to computer type devices (e.g. PC's, PDA's). Whereas BT is popping up everywhere, if you don't see it, you aren't looking. Wireless keyboards and mice, cell phones, pda's, headsets, printers, camcorders, digital cameras. You might think that wireless kb/mice are not worthwhile, but I know a significant number of people (esp laptop users) who would absolutely disagree.

        BTW, 802.11 has been around forever. The current 11mbps st
      • My guess is that Bluetooth device shipments even exceeds the number of 802.11 device shipments already. Consider all the Cell phones and PDAs that have bluetooth now. That's millions of devices right there. Now, how many cell phones and PDA's have 802.11? Not that many...

        We're also going to start seeing massive bluetooth shipments when PCs come ready with it to connect their keyboards and mice.
      • Well maybe its not caught on in the US but in europe its everywhere.

        I have 7 bluetooth devices in this room and an access point/print server next door.

        All the recent ipaqs have it built in.
        All the higher end mobile phones have it built in.
        Powerbooks, G4s G5s etc have it as an option.
        Lots of PC laptops have it as an option.
        MS, Apple and Logitech are selling keyboards and mice.
        OS X has had native support since 10.2.
        Native Windows support will roll out with XP SP2.
        There are hundreds of bluetooth USB, PCMCIA,

      • There seems to be a real disparity of distribution here. Half the posters are saying they've never seen a BT device, let alone used one, where as others ( and myself ) can't turn around in the office or the local coffee house without tripping over one ( or its wireless signature ).

        Perhaps the problem with Bluetooth market penetration ( apart from the fact that unless someone is using an external dongle you can't tell if they're using it... ) is that its only being rolled out in, I dunno, more technically

        • I live in New York City, and while there's two places within thirty seconds of my front door that have WiFi access, I've never seen or heard of Bluetooth being used.

          Tim

  • Not any surprise (Score:2, Interesting)

    by plj ( 673710 )
    I have a 12" Apple PBook with internal BT. I can wake it anywhere I'm moving with it, and then just connect to the net with my Nokia 3650 via "USB Bluetooth Modem" - without taking the phone off of my pocket. And MS BT mouse is rather nice piece of hardware, too.

    All this just works, without tweaking (except what comes to Nokia's nonexistent Mac support). Tell any good reason why wouldn't it be popular?

  • You can thnk Apple for this (Score:5, Insightful)

    by oscast ( 653817 ) on Thursday November 06, 2003 @05:45PM (#7412110) Homepage
    Funny... Bluetooth was considered totally dead only a short while ago... then Apple started integrating it into their products... pushing the technology very hard, and now, suddenly we get this news a short while after. Anyone who says that Apple doesn't influence technology trends is either blind or ignorant.
    • It's not just Apple. The last five or six PC mobos I bought have bt capabilbites built into them. However none of them are being used. So the fact that bt is being sold in large quantities probably doesn't reflect the number of people actually using the tech. Just the number of OEMs pushing it.

    • I don't think so (Score:4, Insightful)

      by binaryDigit ( 557647 ) on Thursday November 06, 2003 @06:15PM (#7412368)
      then Apple started integrating it into their products... pushing the technology very hard

      First let me start by saying that my primary computer at home is a PowerBook and I own more Mac's than most small third world countries. But I have to say that your statement is waaaay off base. I personally use BT myself (I have another post that details what) and it's absolutely phones (and headsets), pda's, and keyboard/mice that are driving BT sales. Now as far as pc's go (generic pc as in personal computers, not PC's as in Wintel), Apple is ahead of the curve, but it's not their adoption that's pushing sales, it's all these other devices. Apple is just smart enough to jump on board earlier than other manufacturers (as usual). So I'll give Apple all the credit in the world for being forwrad thinking, but they are NOT driving BT.
      • it's not [Apple's] adoption that's pushing sales, it's all these other devices.

        You are correct. What i was getting at was that nobody was making these devices until Apple supported the technology. Every PC OEM looked at BT with disdain, thus causing few if any hardware developers to make products that leverage the tchnology. Then, Apple decided to support it, more products were created, then PC OEMs followed suit.

        You might say that Apple is the answer to the age old chicken and egg comparison. Developers
        • You are correct. What i was getting at was that nobody was making these devices until Apple supported the technology

          Once again, I disagree. The current majority of the BT devices are used to support cell phones and pda's. KB/mice are very recent, and M$ had their BT enabled kb/mouse around the same time as Apple did (not sure who was precisely first, but they were close enough to call it even). In this case, I think Apple is helping to row a lot more than the Wintel world, but they didn't help push th
          • "Once again, I disagree. The current majority of the BT devices are used to support cell phones and pda's. KB/mice are very recent, and M$ had their BT enabled kb/mouse around the same time as Apple did (not sure who was precisely first, but they were close enough to call it even" These devices only came after Apple created support for them in the operating system. When Apple and Microsoft created their own Bluetooth devices is irrelivant. What I'm getting at is the fact that Apple was the first major com
      • I totally agree with you that apple is not pushing BT as a whole, but in the mac market they are helping to push the idea of BT. These new systems are lowering the barrier for entry of BT devices into a Mac users world. You already have the ability to use the device you just need to go out and buy one. Contrast this to having to out and buy the device AND a way to sync the data with your home computer. They are silently building up a ready market of people who can immediatly buy and use BT devices making th
    • Anyone who says that Apple doesn't influence technology trends is either blind or ignorant.

      Lucky for you, noone really says that. They just say Apple sucks.

    • Re:You can thnk Apple for this (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Sycraft-fu ( 314770 ) on Thursday November 06, 2003 @08:14PM (#7413238)
      Ahh yes, the favourite logical falacy around here. I'll repeat again: Correlation does NOT imply causation. This applies to everything.

      Now while Apple's adoption helps Bluetooth, I would say it is far less influential than the PDAs and cells getting it, since they seem to be the most popular use for it.

      It would be like saying Apple is driving gigabit ethernet. I mean, they stuck it in their towers and now its getting popular so it MUST be Aple's doing right? Wrong. Back when Apple introduced GigE in their towers many of the Mac people I know were all excited and babbled on about using it at home and at work. That dried up real quick when they found out that a 4 port switch would run them $1000 for a crappy brand. They stayed at 100mbit, and many still are there.

      However all that while our university was busily buying gig stuff to upgrade the network, as were many others. It allowed moving the core and other highspeed links from ATM back to ethernet. This paved the way for layer-3 switching on the whole campus. Now all switch level links are being upgraded.

      Well, funny thing, all this buying of expensive gig technology (as well as other places such as servers) drove the cost down. Now instead of being $300 for a gig ccard and $1000 for a small switch at consumer prices it's $25 for a cheapie gig card and $130 for an 8 port switch. So now we are seeing more intrest in the consumer market. The gig chips are cheap enough that most SI's are now using them (since there isn't a significant cost savings over 10/100) and the switches are cheap enough that they are a viable option if you want the speed. Given a bit more time, it'll be to the point where it's the same price more or less.

      Well, it WASN'T Apple that drove it to that point. Had Apple integrated gig and large networks uttely ignored it, it would be a dead or dying technology. They simply aren't a big enough market to drive a technology like that.

      Same for Firewire. Firewire was NOT a success because it was an Apple product, it was a success because it is an excellent high speed bus that the audio and video industry jumped on. The fact that it's in Macs didn't make it successful (though it was a fact) the fact that it's in Sony cameras and MOTU audio interfaces and so on did.

      Apple DOES influence technology, of course, just as most large tech firms do. They are not the be-all, end-all, however, or the massive trend setter that the fanboys seem to think. When they adopt a technology it helps it, as any company adopting a technology helps it, but it does NOT make or break it.

  • Bluetooth is spreading (Score:5, Interesting)

    by ElGuapoGolf ( 600734 ) on Thursday November 06, 2003 @05:48PM (#7412139) Homepage

    I'm sure I'm going to see a lot of "I've never seen anyone using bluetooth, so who cares" type comments, but this misses the larger point.

    Bluetooth *is* spreading. You can buy cars now that are bluetooth enabled. And trust me, it'd be nice to have your calls come over your speakers and have your voice picked up by a mic in a car. This is the kind of stuff that makes people *want* this technology.

    Most PDAs come with bluetooth. The idea of being able to pick up a palm, hit a button and check my email while my phone is sitting in my bag or coat is pretty cool. No more cables to fumble with or IR ports to line up. This is the kind of stuff that makes geeks want this technology.

    And that's what's cool about bluetooth, IMO. It has geek appeal, and regular people can see the value in it too.

    • Bluetooth *is* spreading.

      Damn, that sounds scary. This was an ill named technology, especially for it to be catching on at a time of such concern about the spread of disease. Maybe some product placement would help their image. Hey, I bet the band Anthrax could use some new wireless equipment! :)

  • There have been a few bluetooth success stories now, and it's in-arguable that it's a pretty cool technology.

    As an example the Parrot CK3000 car kit is an excellent bit of kit. Simple to install which makes up for the fact it's a bit more expensive than most generic car kits. But once it's in, it's simply amazing. It's high quality (it can be, it's a premium item), quite slick (call your phone by name and It'll answer!)

    But others like the Jabra headsets (neat looking, not too expensive and great for te
  • Is Bluetooth Dead? [slashdot.org]

    Posted by CmdrTaco on Wednesday October 15, @04:28PM
    from the stopgap-on-the-way-to-wireless-networking dept.

    An anonymous reader writes "According to the EETimes, Bluetooth is dead [eetimes.com]. From the article: "In a few short years, many will look back on Bluetooth as a lesson on marketing gone awry". So what do ya'll think? Does he have a point, or is Bluetooth not quite dead yet?"

  • Bluetooth is dead Long Live Bluetooth (Score:3, Funny)

    by NorwBlue ( 711956 ) on Thursday November 06, 2003 @05:52PM (#7412184)
    I enter my office, press ONE button and everything in my phone gets backuped via Bluetooth . I sit in my car and when the phone rings in my backpocket, I press answer on my bluetooth speakerphone thingy and just talk. When i want to call mum while driving I press the green button on my bluetooth speakerphone thingy and say "mum". When my girlfriends siemens s55 is full of pictures she took with her camera she downloads some of them to me and can take more pictures. When i had coffee at a local place i saw two guys trying to transmit a file from one to the other(IrDa) i scanned the neighborhood and transmitted a nice picture of my girlfriend(No, not the face) to one of them. Never talked to them though*grin* Last week when my isp refused to deliver a connection to my adsl, I even used my phone/gprs to do banking(http). And no i did NOT use WAP or that silly little phone keyboard. I connected my PC via Bluetooth via phone/gprs to the net, a bit slow but I did manage to pay my bills on time. So, personally I'm hooked. Can You spot the lie by the way...... okey, You got me that part of having a girlfriend was a lie, but the rest just work. Neat eh..... Sorry about typos, I guess the tought about a girlfriend distracted me a bit....

  • The problem is compatibility (Score:3, Informative)

    by The_K4 ( 627653 ) on Thursday November 06, 2003 @05:56PM (#7412210)
    I have a PDA/Cellphone (I added a SDIO Bluetooth card). Now the card doesn't support the headset profile so I can't use a bluetooth head set. It supports the dial-up profile, but only to talk to a phone, so my laptop can't use the pda cell phone as a modem. The PDA doesn't support a mouse so that won't work even though the card supports it, the keyboard doesn't work (i'm not sure why). My laptop and PDA can talk and sync via the BT (which is nice), but the connection sharing doesn't so I can't use my laptop's lan connection to surf via the PDA. The idea of bluetooth is great, but there's a bunch of compatibility issues. There's all these "profiles" that arn't always compatable.

  • BlueTooth Rocks! (Score:5, Interesting)

    by binaryDigit ( 557647 ) on Thursday November 06, 2003 @05:56PM (#7412218)
    I have a SE T616 phone, a Clie NZ90 and a BT dongle on my PC and PowerBook (I also have a DCR-PC120BT Sony DV camcorder with BT, but I haven't actually found a good use for it's BT support). I sync both the T616 and NZ90 via BT with my PC (WinXP and Outlook). I use the T616 as a BT modem on both the Clie and the PowerBook.

    For syncing BT is great because I don't have to have a bunch of usb cables spider webbing out to my devices. My phone stays on my belt and the pda just sits where ever it's most convenient. I just press sync in outlook for the phone, or tap sync on the Clie and they just start syncing. Nice. No more having to plug cables in and remember to unplug to actually use the device.

    Using the phone as a modem via BT is also great since I usually do this "out in the field", where if I had to drag my phone out of my pocket (where it usually is when I'm out and about) and have a cable running from it to either the Clie or PB, then that would suck. This way it stays where ever I have it (pocket, bag, backpack, maybe even not on me, but close by). It's very nice being able to just whip out the Clie and start surfing instantly.

    Now all that said, getting all this wonder and joy to work was a pain in the butt to say the least. Support for USB dongles is sketchy even under XP (OSX is better, but still requires tweaking). And having two different things trying to sync on the desktop can confuse the heck out of the software. But when it's all sorted out, its great.

    So I would say, you aint really a nerd unless everything you buy from this point on has BT built in. If you are poo pooing it, take a look first, once you start using it, you aint ever gonna go back.
  • Just because devices are shipping with bluetooth support does mean anyone will actually use it (hello powerbook).

    -Eyston
    • (hello powerbook)

      Bluetooth works great on my powerbook. Connected to my BT keyboard mouse and printer and phone I have exactly ONE cord coming out of my notebook when I am at work or at home and have full connectivity.

      You should look around, there are a lot bluetooth devices out there that "just work" with the powerbook.

  • I am very annoyed that Nokia still doesnt have blue tooth in any small form factor phone that I can buy in the US (let alone at AT&T Wireless). Just that huge monster 3650 and 2 expensive/overlt functional Sony Erricssons. I just want to synch a small phone wih my laptop too much to ask for? I dont want mMode, I dont want a camera, I just want 3 ounces of practicatlity and NO WIRES...

    Winton

    • Get a Nokia 6310i (Score:3, Interesting)

      by sjbe ( 173966 )
      I am very annoyed that Nokia still doesnt have blue tooth in any small form factor phone that I can buy in the US (let alone at AT&T Wireless).

      I have Nokia's 6310i and use AT&T Wireless. There are smaller phones, but it's pretty compact, doesn't have a lot of stupid & unnecessary bells & whistles (like a color screen, camera, etc) and has great battery life and reception. I'm pretty happy with it. It's slicker than heck to dial wirelessly.

      Only real problem is that Nokia's software for
      • Sweet thanks for the info - no why doesn't it come up on ATT under Blue Tooth phones :) On my way to go shopping :) Thank you again!

        Winton
      • For us Mac Heads with their shiny new Powerbooks, here's a LONG discussion of iSync and 6310i.

        http://canikickit.org/archives/gadgets/000074.sh tm l

        I just spent 10 minutes on the phone to ATT WS, and they arent sure if they stock em any more...

        Winton

  • The chips have fallen below a price where they're cheap enough to put into everything except the ultra low cost price bracket. Whether or not it's actually useful is a different matter and will be told by it actually being around in the next 5 years.

  • Yeah (Score:2)

    by pbox ( 146337 )
    Along the same (head)lines:

    Ballpoint pen shipments exceed 1 billion per week.
  • It's just suffering from gingivitis and other oral nasties that come with a competitive marketplace.
  • Bluetooth isn't really adding a lot to our lives at this stage, it's more of a replacement for infrared links and hotsync cables.

    Of course once TVs VCRs etc.. start supporting it then we'll see the true advantage of it. Programming your VCR from a PDA, turning the oven off with your laptop and so on.

  • Bluetooth audio (Score:5, Interesting)

    by digitaleus ( 654331 ) on Thursday November 06, 2003 @06:58PM (#7412681) Homepage
    Something I'd be keen to see is digital audio over bluetooth. My living room has a stereo with a sizeable list of stuff plugged into it - but the list is hardly extraordinary.
    • External CD Player
    • PC
    • DVD
    • VCR
    • Turntables
    • (radio built into the amp)
    The result? A clutter of tables and periodic fiddling behind the back of my stereo to change cables (not enough inputs).

    It would be nice if all of the sound devices could connect to the amp, and the amp would give me a little LCD menu of the devices. And when someone brings over their latest sound toy, the amp would pick it up and add it to the menu. No cables, no hassles.

  • Its still a useless, slow, range-limited application specific technology that does nothing of substance other then syncing your addressbook with your PC on specific models or using it to send messages around a conference table during a meeting.

    Every PC I have ever had contains an ISA slot, does that mean I use it? No, not really. Sure, its old technology but the idea holds, presence does equate to penetration.

    Useless useless useless.
  • Not really that hard to get that number with every APPLE device and a handfull of variant big named companies with bluetooth enabled phones, keyboards, and mice. But whether or not people use those features in their phones or other devices that have bluetooth is another question. I thought bluetooth would be awesome. But the bandwidth is too low to do anything great with it.
  • I don't mind having bluetooth in a device... in fact, I would prefer to have it... but I don't want to exclude wifi in order to obtain bluetooth.

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