Testing an Orange SPV 'Smartphone' 237
theolein writes "The register has an article discussing the first major phone company's implementation -Orange SPV- of MS Smartphone as well as a common user's experiences with it. More or less confirms what quite a few expected."
I don't like Orange (Score:1, Funny)
Re:I don't like Orange (Score:1, Offtopic)
Sporange (Score:5, Funny)
Silver, purple, and month remain intractable problems for poets.
But if you're rapping about cellphones, you have far more serious problems. Like an income.
Re:Sporange (Score:2)
The poet, he laments: "Not a word rhymes with month,"
"Not tho," says the lisper, "I thought of one onthe!"
So what's the best implementation? (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:So what's the best implementation? (Score:2, Informative)
When the flip is closed, it is a tri-band mobile phone, with real keys and one touch access to the Palm address book.
With the flip open, you get the Palm 3.5 OS, and access to all the desktop connectivity and 3rd party programs available for Palm.
Downsides: A bit bulky and heavy, wider than most phones, thicker than most PDA's. Grayscale screen, small for PDAs (but this also makes for great battery life). A little cludgy to surf the web with, but it can easily get you the movie listings and such.
Kyocera Smartphones (Score:2)
Unlike every other "smartphone" I've seen, phone functionality is not sacrificed. Phone/PDA integration is excellent.
Yes, websurfing is a bit kludgy, but better than mose WinCE devices - They're STILL forcing people to pan left/right???? EudoraWeb (text-only) flattens everything vertically (a la Lynx), and the third-party image capable browsers (such as Handspring Blazer) also do the same flattening.
As far as WAP browsing - For mobile-specific sites, the 6035 is a dream for WAP. Big screen, you can tap on links with the stylus, and enter text into forms using Graffiti.
Don't forget PQAs - Probably my 10-15 PQAs are the most often used apps on my 6035.
Upcoming 7135 adds a color screen, clamshell (a la StarTAC) design that is smaller overall, MP3 capability, an SDIO port, 16M RAM, PalmOS 4.1, with only a small sacrifice in battery life. (4-5 days instead of 5-6 days with the phone portion on. With phone off, it can go a month or two at least. Most phone-only devices like my Kyo 2035a only do 3-4 days phone standby.) The 7135 is due out Any Month Now - It's in advanced beta testing with Verizon. Sprint customers will have to wait longer.
www.smartphonesource.com is an excellent user discussion board for the 6035/7135.
The upcoming Samsung I500 should be nice too - Very similar to the 7135. Slightly smaller and quite a bit faster (66 MHz as opposed to 33, but who needs more than 33 with PalmOS unless you're running a GameBoy emulator?), but no expandability.
Series 60. (Score:2)
The 3650 [nokia.com], which internaly is a triband 7650 with an added MMC memory-expansion port, will be released early 2003, and are in my opinion the best approach for smartphones yet. Ofcourse, some ppl will argue that the Sony Ericson P800 [sonyericsson.com] is a better aproach, but in my opinion, it's a souped up PDA with phone functionality, not a true smartphone.
Reviews of the nokia 7650 here [my-symbian.com], and previews of the Nokia 3650 [infosync.no] and the Sony Ericsson P800 [infosync.no].
Re:So what's the best implementation? (Score:2)
The Nokia 3650 [infosync.no] will have everything the 7650 has, as well as being triband AND having an MMC memory expansion port.
Re:So what's the best implementation? (Score:2)
Watch the salesman sqirm! (Score:4, Informative)
Fortunately I decided against getting one when the salesman tried to make me believe it was normal for a mobile phone to take 60 seconds to start up and log on to the network!
My overall impressions of the device was that it was incredibly slow, not slow as in running Doze 98 on a P75, but slow as in Doze XP on a 286. It was also incredibly heavy and long for a mobile phone.
I can't see Orange shifting many. Me, I'm waiting for the SonyEricsson P800.
Re:Watch the salesman sqirm! (Score:4, Informative)
Sadly, it pretty much is with GSM/GPRS-based phones. However, good ones will maintain the connection once established so that you usually don't have to wait. Newer, better wireless technologies should fix that.
Re:Watch the salesman sqirm! (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Watch the salesman sqirm! (Score:2)
Re:Watch the salesman sqirm! (Score:2)
Re:Watch the salesman sqirm! (Score:2)
On my T-Mobile GSM phone that takes just a few seconds. Maybe 3 or 4.
Re:Watch the salesman sqirm! (Score:2)
In Windows, connect-times vary. I blame this on general DUN suckage, though.
Re:Watch the salesman sqirm! (Score:3, Informative)
Um, no. My Nokia 3390 has never taken longer than three seconds to connect to the network (T-Mobile).
Once More the Monopolist at Work! (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Once More the Monopolist at Work! (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Once More the Monopolist at Work! (Score:2)
Re:Once More the Monopolist at Work! (Score:2)
Re:Once More the Monopolist at Work! (Score:3, Insightful)
Regarding the $600 fee to have the app signed with a Microsoft cert: this is perfectly reasonable and probably even cheap, considering that the coder writing the app is buying Microsoft's good name, so to speak. This is a shitty compromise, and it is definitely not what Microsoft would want, but Orange has made it hard.
MS has worked this way for over 10 years. (Score:5, Insightful)
History has shown that as long as MS can limp along until the third major release of any given product, it has a much better than even chance of squishing the competition. Where are Go Computing and Netscape today? They were leaders/innovators and now they essentially don't exist--killed off because MS stepped up the FUD machine (like with the Win3.1 based PenWindows 10 years ago) and/or taking a loss financially (taking IE off the extra-cost "plus pack" and giving it away in the Win95 install CDs, selling XBboxes for less than they cost to make, etc).
MS will be at the height of desperation if they start giving away the Smartphone OS to the phone makers (if they can get away with it--I think they'd acually pay phone makers to use Smartphone if the US DOJ lets them). There is little MS won't stoop to do if they really want a piece of the action in a given market--especially considering the scads of cash they are sitting on right now. If Smartphone isn't killed off quickly, look for MS to do something that drastic.
It'll happen in other markets that MS plays in too. Remember MS only makes money off its OS and Office licenses--it uses that money and influence to leverage other products. Watch for it--MS might find Linux becoming more of a threat than it is comfortable with in the corporate server and workstation space. Biggest reason? Huge up-front costs in purchasing licenses (look at Content Management Server [microsoft.com] - US$43,000 per processor!? OS NOT included? Holy Crap! Think I'll just use Slashcode, Scoop, OpenACS etc to manage my site). Solution? MS can use bags of cash to set up their own leasing program a la GE capital to spread out the big $ hurt, or otherwise accelerate their move towards selling their "software as a service". It'll be ammunition against the argument that Linux has a lower implementation costs. Anything to make it easier to "invest" in Microsoft rather than any competition.
If it all goes "right", MS will have it made--from the cellphone up to the big racks of servers, consumers and businesses will just get a monthly bill from Bill for anywhere from $100 or so up to thousands for corporations--just like the electric bill. Then Bill takes care (and control) of your gagets and computers to make sure all the ugrades and bugfixes are done, and that you aren't using any pesky little "non-authorised" apps and files. And the rest of us will have the honor and privlege to turn said devices on and "use as directed".
Re:MS has worked this way for over 10 years. (Score:2)
I'd be laughing my ass off when (when, not if) GE Capital & co. will start offering this with Linux.
Too funny (Score:3, Funny)
That review really was just as bad as everyone expected. I was waiting for the guy to say it blue screened on him.
Well, actually... (OT) (Score:1, Offtopic)
His phone Blue Screened. *rimshot*
Unsigned Code (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Unsigned Code (Score:4, Interesting)
In this case there will no doubt be some way to crack this protection - either somebody will get a signing certificate, or find a hole in the implementaion on the phone (gotta be a buffer overflow in there somewhere).
The end result is that the phone will run viruses just fine, but NOT legitimate software.
Re:Unsigned Code (Score:4, Insightful)
J.
Re:Unsigned Code (Score:2)
On the other hand, the fact that the devices cannot even be told to run unsigned code makes life *really* hard for developers to test their code
Re:Unsigned Code (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Unsigned Code (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Unsigned Code (Score:2)
Good God, I never thought of that! (Score:2)
Holy Shit, Batman, that's true! Who would ever let Outlook have access to a pay by the minute service?! Sign me out!
In the future, your 802.11M$ smartphone connects to any and all local computers with 802.11M$ running. Can you imagine a Beowolf Cluster of "I Love You" placing calls to XXX-hot-grits?
Thanks for the warning. It's best to never ever alow anything M$ near a phone. Signed code, you make me laugh, AC. Must be a test bed for Paladium like Hotmail was a collector of Passports. SirCam didn't need any stinking passport or signature!
OK, I lied. I have thought it would be a really bad idea to have an M$ phone. Funny they don't just promote voice over IP isn't it?
Re:Unsigned Code (Score:2)
sounds awful (Score:5, Funny)
Besides... who wants some script kiddie hacking into their phone and delivering an Outlook virus?
I can see it now...
"If you'd like to make a call, please hang up and try agai... Fatal Exception 0F in module mscphone.dll"
Re:sounds awful (Score:2)
"I see you are trying to call your Mother, would you like me to help you?"
yep, try this Outlook killer (Score:2)
Besides... who wants some script kiddie hacking into their phone and delivering an Outlook virus? ;-) I can see it now... "If you'd like to make a call, please hang up and try agai... Fatal Exception 0F in module mscphone.dll"
What you should worry about is a smart virus. One that listens to the microphone to capture your voice, and plays it back on $5.00/minute phone sex calls at 2AM. IEEEE! It makes SirCam look like child's play and we can be sure that this buggy version of Outlook that can't place a phone call will have even more holes than the big one.
Go MicroSoft! Away, that is.
Re:yep, try this Outlook killer (Score:2)
I don't know what you do around your computer, but I can guarantee that nobody is interested in paying $5.00/minute to hear what happens around my computer. Unfortunately.
oh my, you missed it. (Score:2)
You get to pay $5.00/minute for phone sex when you get the bill for calls your phone made at 2AM with your voice. That's on top of whatever connect fee you get to pay for cell phone service. See how you might not want Outlook and clippy working your phone?
Re:oh my, you missed it. (Score:2)
sorry (Score:2)
Re:sounds awful (Score:2)
If it's not a Wintel PC, only the foolish "partner" with Microsoft. Heck, even on Wintel, only the foolish "partner" with Microsoft.
5 years from now when fuelcells are powering handhelds and chips have more than twice the current density, MAYBE a phone can actually be a phone AND run MS Windows. In the mean time, get a PDA with Bluetooth and one of those Erickson phones with Bluetooth. A phone should be a phone and a PDA a PDA. IMHO.
LoB
Re:sounds awful (Score:2)
The fact is that they've had over 5 years at this and still only have around 25% marketshare and lost loads of money still. If they tried to provide a product that filled the customers needs instead of building a product to protect Windows, they might have something. Instead, they keep hitting people over the head with their hammer saying, YOU WILL LIKE THIS, YOU WILL LIKE THIS.
Maybe the Linux crowd is better at porting than the Windows crowd. Look at the Sharp Zaurus. It's been out for less than 8 months and there are hundreds( and maybe into the thousands ) of apps that have been ported or created for it. In two years, it'll be interesting to see what Linux/Qtopia is doing since vendors are allowed to use it how they see fit to solve problems.
That's the difference between a closed system that's designed to protect a monopoly and an open one that's designed to solve problems.
IMHO, WinCE failed because Microsoft designed the screen layout wrong and the OS was/is unstable. Now they've changed the screen format but the OS is still Windows under the hood.
LoB
Re:sounds awful (Score:2)
Check the return rates. (Score:5, Informative)
I was thinking of upgrading - It would be cool to have a camera or the ability to run my own applications on my phone. Despite the cool new products available, I have decided not to buy for at least 6 more months because all of the phones currently available are even less reliable than my t68 (which is only just tolerable).
According to Orange, there are problems with all the new generation of Camera / Organiser phones. Aparantly, the worst offender is the new Nokia camera phone - that had a more than 90% return rate due to hardware faults. I am sure this MS phone could be worse! My Ericsson T68 had to be swaped 4 times this year - I'm astonished that anything could be worse!
As all the mobile phone companies seem to be rushing out new models in time for xmas - it seems the idea of waiting untill the product is right has been completely forgotten.
By the way, if you ARE thinking of upgrading - a heavy user on Orange can usually blag a free handset. Rather than go through the upgrades line, go to the disconnection line and tell them you want to end your contract with orange because O2 or Vodaphone has offered your chouice of handset as a joining incentive.
Orange will usually offer you a decent handset for free as an incentive to keep you to another year's contract. A heavy user should never have to pay for upgrades!
Re:Check the return rates. (Score:2, Insightful)
Bullshit. If any product had a 90% return rate, especially the Nokia 7650 which is based on the new Series 60 platform, it would be front page news on every telecoms publication. Got some references, or were you just pulling that bit out of your ass?
Captain Scarlet (Score:1)
http://www.cloudster.com/Sets&Vehicles/SPV/SPVTop. htm [cloudster.com]
And would'nt these be a little bit go use as phones too?
Heh, I suppose they are models, tho...
smart phone? (Score:5, Funny)
put it back in the oven (Score:5, Interesting)
This is a phone that has shipped before it's finished. Microsoft see their Smartphone OS as a way of stopping Symbian getting a hold of a platform that they don't yet control and for this reason they've rushed it out.
Everything he says and I've heard from other points to this. It's actually nice to see M$ so scared that they're using their clout to scare companies into making bad moves like an early release of something so flawed. If they keep that up it will be all the more easy to watch the monopoly meltdown. not that I want to see them fail completely, but some real competition (read: some real reasons for quality user focused software) would be nice.
Re:put it back in the oven (Score:2, Insightful)
You say that now, but in five years, Microsoft will be on Smartphone 3.0 -- the version that actually works -- and Symbian will be on that F-word-company web site.
Re:put it back in the oven (Score:2)
MS couldn't get any of the established phone companies to use their OS so they had to go out and find/pay someone to build a "Smart"phone. Too bad for that companies employees and shareholders. The reason I say this is because MS makes no money on anything which doesn't leverage their PC OS on the PC. They are all losers.
LoB
Reasons why Sendo dropped their smartphone? (Score:5, Interesting)
Also, have you noticed that most of the problems that the guy found in the MS smartphone DID NOT occur in symbian based phones (the SE T800, Nokia 7xxx (don't remember the model name))
At the beginning, I thought MS's smartphone is an excellent idea, but then again, heavy, buggy, slow, horrible UI cannot be possibilly good for something that they have been designing for so damn long.
Re:Reasons why Sendo dropped their smartphone? (Score:2)
Sendo was certainly planned to be MS's big partner in the UK. Now they've jumped ship to Symbian.
Are there any other companies apart from Orange producing an MS phone for the European market?
Best wishes,
Mike.
version 3 (Score:1, Redundant)
Guinea Pigs/Bug Testors (Score:4, Interesting)
Java-based phones similarly stupid (Score:3, Insightful)
For some reason, companies seem to think that they have a right to control the phone you paid for. Think of it as "Palladium Light" and a bad sign of things to come.
Your best bet: don't waste time or money on such phones. If it comes with such features, don't use them. If customers send a signal now that they want control of the digital devices they paid for, maybe this insanity can be nipped in the bud.
(And if you know of any end-user programmable Java phones, please let me know.)
Treo Phones (Score:5, Insightful)
What I was wondering, though, is whether there are any phone form-factor Java-based phones that allow end-user programming.
Re:Treo Phones (Score:2, Informative)
Most even if you have to pay for the abilty to download software OTA you can send it via IR, cable form your computer (Nokia 7650 does this) or Bluetooth.
you can download apps onto an i90c (Score:3, Informative)
the motorolla i90c [motorola.com] is.
it's a nextel [nextel.com] phone.
-eek
Re:Java-based phones similarly stupid (Score:5, Informative)
You are confusing the phone capabilities with network capabilites.
Yell at your moronic telco, not at the phone companies.
I've used a Motorola i85s here in Australia as a Java "JVM" despite it not being able to be connected to the mobile network due to incompatibilities and lack of a SIM card. I've used a Siemens, an N7650, 6310 and 7210 all downloading applications via OTA and Infrared.
Clearly you need to do some research before your particular rant, as you are quite wrong.
Re:Java-based phones similarly stupid (Score:2)
Clearly, you are making some unwarranted assumptions: Australia is not the whole world. Still, it's good to hear that in Australia (and presumably Europe), end user programmability seems to be more widely available.
However, there are very few Java-based phones available in the US yet, and phones are usually significantly modified for the US market and often even tied to a single service provider.
When I talked to the major wireless providers in our area, they all told me that they do not permit end user programmability.
Of the Java phones you mention, only the 7210 is nominally available in the US. It seems not to work with Verizon, but it does apparently work with T-Mobile. But even T-Mobile doesn't offer it for sale.
Re:Java-based phones similarly stupid (Score:2)
I wasn't the one basing my arguments on a fallacious assumption. You then turn around and claim that because it doesn't work in your environment then the whole idea is dumb. Well, the whole idea may be dumb, but that's not the reason.
I agree 100% that it doesn't work for you. And guess what, the USA isn't the whole world, and there are plenty of Europeans and Asians using handsets that are user programmable.
As for the USA, the Motorola i85s is an end-user programmable phone, (and i think there are a few other Motorola phones like the i90c).
If you can't program them, that's a problem with the vendor of the phone, and the service provider, not with the underlying handset.
Cheers,
-- jon
Re:Java-based phones similarly stupid (Score:2)
Huh? Why would I be asking for recommendations on Java-programmable phones if I thought the idea was dumb? I think Java-programmable phones would be great. Too bad nobody has yet identified one that's supported by a US provider.
If you can't program them, that's a problem with the vendor of the phone, and the service provider, not with the underlying handset.
Indeed. And it's the cell service providers that make this hard in the US. It's the attitude of the cellular companies that is the obstacle, not the handsets themselves. A programmable handset is no good if nobody supports it.
Re:Java-based phones similarly stupid (Score:2)
Probably the representatives of the major wireless providers that you talked to were clueless.
In the U.S., you can choose from the LG 5350, Motorola A388/i85s/i55sr/i50sx/i80s/i90c/i95cl/T720, Nokia 9290 Communicator, RIM BlackBerry 5810/6710, Samsung SPH-A500/SPH-N400, Sanyo 4900, Sanyo 5300, and lots more that will soon be available if they're not already.
Re:Java-based phones similarly stupid (Score:2)
Now, if you could point to some Java-enabled phones, their end-user programming information, and a US cellular service that supports it, that would be great; only one or two of those alone aren't really interesting since you need all three.
In fact, I think in the long run, end-user Java programmable will make it even in the US, but so far, the only ones I have seen have been crippled (well, except for PalmOS and Symbian based PDA/phone combos that happen to run Java as well).
Re:Java-based phones similarly stupid (Score:3, Informative)
What ones have you seen? As I said, I've never seen a Java-based phone that prevents developers from loading their own apps.
You can get the LG 5350, Samsung SPH-A500, Samsung SPH-N400, Sanyo 4900, and Sanyo 5300 through Sprint PCS. There's a developer program at developer.sprintpcs.com [sprintpcs.com].
You can get the Motorola i85s, i50sx, i55sr, i80s, i90c, and i95cl through Nextel. There are developer programs from Nextel [nextel.com] and Motorola [motorola.com].
You can get the RIM BlackBerry 5810 from AT&T Wireless [attwireless.com] and T-Mobile [t-mobile.com]. RIM has a developer's site [blackberry.net] with an SDK and simulator.
Java-based phones NOT similarly stupid (Score:3, Informative)
I've never encountered a Java-based phone that didn't allow people to install their own apps for free.
Here are some Java-based phones that I know allow developers to install their own apps:
Re:Java-based phones similarly stupid (Score:2)
Which means that you do pay for it: agreeing to an extended contract is your payment.
treo (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Treo (Score:2, Informative)
Kyocera 6035 (Score:2)
That said, they're one of the only viable PDA/phone combos I've seen, and come close to being the best. The best I've encountered so far is the Kyocera 6035.
So far, I love my Kyocera - It is clearly designed as a phone first and not a PDA. I can dial the phone with a nice, big, easy to dial numeric keypad just like a normal cellphone without even opening up the flip of the phone. (The keypad is on the face of the flip, as opposed to being under the flip as in the Treos.
The Treo is probably a bit better of a PDA, at least for now. Color screen, more recent PalmOS, faster CPU. The 6035 is admittedly aging, but as a phone, none of the other smartphones can beat it. PDA/phone integration is also excellent.
The upcoming Kyo 7135 is going to be VERY nice. Color screen, OS 4.1, SDIO expansion slot, 16M RAM, MP3 capability, and 1xRTT (2.5G) data capability - Lack of 1xRTT is probably the 6035's biggest shortcoming these days, although on a PDA circuit-switched 14.4 data (2G data, which the 6035 does have) does pretty well.
he didn't mention the size of the fan (Score:2, Funny)
Heh - Philips fisio 820 is almost as bad.. (Score:5, Informative)
feature laden pda/phones.. liking it less and less (Score:5, Interesting)
having grainy little pictures on 2 inch screens is just unbearable for any kind of useful application.
The only reason I can think of to put a camera on a phone and email, is to get evidence when you get
in a car crash. It's useless to view on PDA and horrible to be subjected to on a decent computer
screen. Video is just a lame gimmick. Now, sound would seem to be promising.. but given I'm fairly
used to decent quality of sound from cheapo discmans and ok quality from the current
generation of mp3 players, listening to AM/FM quality mp3 on my phone gets less and less
appealing. The only real use I've got out of wireless web at this point is checking short email
messages, and checking movie times for a particular theatre if I overran on time and need
to catch the next showing. It's simply too unpleasant to do too much websurfing on a phone
simply because of the dimensions of the screen.
Don't even get me started on web surfing on your phone savages the battery life.. And if you really
feel the need to drool over porn on the 2" screen, I'd recommend putting yourself out of your misery.
so my new list is down to:
1. smaller dimension (anything bigger than my 270 will be junked, in fact, I wish it was 30% smaller)
2. better sound quality for the phone
3. longer battery life
everything else would be treated like the damn hairclip help in office.. I'll ignore it until
it gets in my way. once it does, it's gone.
Given the average
everything including cleaning the kitchen sink and run a solar power fusion generator. But I'm
starting to wonder now that if we actually did get everything we wished for in a PDA, would we end up
regretting it.. it's time to realize why the early Palm succeeded and the old Newton failed.
simplicity, usability at a price we're willing to pay..
Re:feature laden pda/phones.. liking it less and l (Score:2)
2. better sound quality for the phone
3. longer battery life
Your first wish completely removes and is converse to the second and third.
You cannot have longer battery life if you make the battery smaller. Same with sound quality, to be better would require more space in the unit.
People want everything, it isn't going to happen. You cannot have it all right now, you have to pick pros/cons and compromise, especially when it comes to battery technology as it is right now and will be for the near future.
-- iCEBaLM
Bzzt, wrong (Score:2)
Also, as time goes on and more people are using cellphones, providers will have to put up more towers. The side effect of this is that you'll be closer to the tower you're using on average, which allows the phone to transmit at a lower power.
b) If more space is needed to make the phone sound better, then why are there plenty of smaller phones than the current smartphones that have better sound quality? It's primarily a matter of proper design planning, not of the phone's physical size. Yes, it's easier to get better quality out of a larger device, but it's still pretty easy to get good sound quality out of a small device (Like a StarTAC or those Motorola micro-phones)
Some design decisions in form factor may increase volume while reducing the size perception of the phone to the user - Witness clamshell-style flip phones. Many of these are thicker, but are seen as smaller because the other two dimensions are smaller. (Motorola's micro-phone - I think it's one of the v-series phones is a good example of this. Thicker than a StarTAC, but overall smaller)
rubbish (Score:4, Interesting)
What can I say? The reviewer is correct, even the simplest task (i.e. making a call) is next to impossible and fraught with frustration.
Wait for Symbian, only a sucker would pay for one of these.
In order to secure the market... (Score:5, Interesting)
Note: I just set up a doctor on a Treo phone and everything works great. Even syncing to a Mac.
Oh - I forgot... (Score:2)
the sad truth of it all (Score:3, Interesting)
this is actually quite sad. a once decent company has sunk to making devices that behave poorly. how much cash do you think they sunk into this? i'm sure it was a bundle. it really is a loss to the world, of course, today, m$ views that as a gain. oh well.
think i'll find a miamiLuG and get a party together. . . . .
The Economist on Nokia vs. Microsoft (Score:3, Informative)
Very insightful article, happily one of their free ones. Microsoft is in for a tough fight. They've gotten little licensing from major players, and are using alternate, less effective channels to gain a foothold.
Re:The Economist on Nokia vs. Microsoft (Score:2, Interesting)
Try
http://economist.com/printedition/displayS
Their cover story is also related, and is as usual, excellent.
http://economist.com/printedition/displayStory.
Again, if either of these don't work, make sure there are no spaces when you paste into the browser.
So it doesn't whistle... (Score:5, Funny)
"What's green, hangs on the wall, and whistles?"
"I give up."
"A red herring."
"But it isn't green."
"So? There's a law says you couldn't paint it green?"
"But it doesn't hang on the wall."
"Well, you could hang it on a wall, couldn't you?"
"But--it doesn't whistle."
"Nu, so it doesn't whistle."
What takes pictures, browses the web, and makes telephone calls?
Hard not to be biased (Score:4, Interesting)
Now the issues with the slow refresh and the delay between the shutter sound and the actual image capture, that would be extremely
annoying, and it doesn't sound like a software update is going to fix the serious lack of processing power.
But how does a product like this even get released? Is it the post-dot-com-bust competition, the "business at the speed of thought" mentality that is responsible for pushing out a product that can't even be a good phone first, and secondly has all these garbage features tacked on? Being a visionary is one thing, and there's a place for that (show us at Comdex or whatever) but delivering on the vision is completely another.
I'm stumped as to how this thing made it out the door. Is it the market researchers? Did they ever put one of these phones in someone's hands? Or did they ask questions like "What would you like in a phone" and then screw up the consumer vision by sacrificing the most fundamental (and implicitly necessary) features?
And does rushing this SPV phone out the door REALLY help them compete against Symbian?
bad picture. (Score:2)
Umm no, that looks like any shitty quality 640x480 picture and it's just soooo M$ of you to blame the user. There is no focus in the background either. The overall balance/contrast failed and the sky is whited out. The color saturation is poor too, just look at those white cheeks. It looks like they bought the cheapest camera they could get and failed to help it out by using the computer that runs the phone. What on earth is that phone thinking about between the shutter noise and the actual image capture if it's not correcting all of the above faults? Is it generating a thumbnail for Bill?
The camera's poor image quality is the least of your problems with this puppy. Can you imagine what an Outlook virus could do to your phone bill?
Re:Hard not to be biased (Score:2)
Microsoft intends to take over the joint and believe they have the muscle to do so.
delay between the shutter sound and the actual image capture
That's almost as bad as getting a reply from a ping with the network cable disconnected! The culture that allows such to exist, much less get out the door, does a lot of them. Some of them will be subtle and deadly.
Re:Hard not to be biased (Score:2)
Now the 640x480 shots off my Sony camcorder look like ass. There are noticable jaggies and the S/N ratio is awful. Bright lighting helps with the S/N ratio, but it's a generally inferior image. The video looks great because you don't need the same level of quality for motion as for stills.
Hard to say if the phone could turn out a decent image or not. Sounds like the guy had an axe to grind with Microsoft (but who doesn't). Maybe he took some pictures that had sharp focus and picked one of the bad ones to display and rant about.
Shouldn't use Windows anyway (Score:3, Informative)
Symbian for mobile devices on the other hand does protect memory using the hardware and as far as I can tell Symbian is not open to such great abuses as Windows.
Symiab also operates faster than Windows as it does not have the huge amount of over engineering that Windows has.
Re:Shouldn't use Windows anyway (Score:2)
Windows CE does prevent processes writing each others' memory, though I think reading may be permitted.
Regardless of memory protection, though, the low levels of telephony are generally handled by a separate processor with a separate memory area. That should provide even better protection.
Another Microsoft phone? (Score:2)
I saw one at Fry's and laughed at it for a moment. I thought about buying one just for fun, but when I actually went back specifically looking for it several months later, the phone and any trace of it was gone.
Oh well.
MS home phone. (Score:2)
Don't knock it just because it's Microsoft - While the overall majority of their products (especially software) are shit, they have some good products, esp. in the hardware arena. (Look at their input devices - MS does make great mice and joysticks)
This might've been a different unit, but the one my friend had had no fancy graphical LCD or anything, it was just a plain cordless phone with a few extra buttons and a base station that could hook up to the computer.
i.e. it didn't have some bastard version of Windows shoehorned into it.
Most of MS's hardware products are pretty good as long as they don't include Windows in any way, shape, or form. As soon as Windows (PC version or CE) gets embedded, it's a whole different story...
it's all about Imode in France (Score:2)
Bouyges Telecom just licensed i-mode technology and released it in France last month, with phones that work (think several years of development in Japan) and a dozen of perfectly running applications (viamichelin, etc). I think Orange rushed the development and release of this alternative, non-working technology in order to have something to compete with for Christmas.
Typical Register article (Score:3, Informative)
Of course you can't see everything on a web page, the screen is only 176x220 resolution; but if you visit pages optimised for mobile devices (and there are a lot of them) then there's no problem.
The phone hasn't crashed for me yet. I've had it for two weeks and use it quite a lot. I guess YMMV, but others I've talked to have had similar crash-free experiences. It crashes about as much as any other new unpatched phone, such as the T68m (which you'll remember received a whole load of bugfixes before it worked well).
I had no problems in using the camera - I don't know what this 'ten presses to take a picture' nonsense is. Plus, the camera quality is significantly better or at least as good as any other mobile camera out now; a simple comparison of photos, e.g. SPV vs. GX-10 will show this. And sheesh, it's only supposed to be a mobile camera, not a professional one!
As for lag, yes, there is some. Certainly not '30 second lag times', I don't think I've ever had any more than 5 second lag. Most of the time it is on the scale of 1-2 seconds.
There's a lot of talk about, 'Oh, I'll just wait until the Sony Ericsson P800 comes out'. Well, you can wait if you like, it's only been delayed for several months now. Plus, the P800 will cost at least £200 more than the SPV, so what use is there in comparing two products whose prices differ so greatly? (The SPV costs from free - with contract - to £100 for upgrade).
Instead of basing your opinion on a single review, I suggest that you check out this forum about the Smartphone: http://modaco.com/smartphone/viewforum.php?f=2. The reports aren't all positive, by any means. The phone seems to provoke a love-hate relationship, but there are a lot of people who love the phone. Compared to my old Sony J70 phone, the SPV is incredibly better and lightyears ahead of my old Visor Deluxe PDA.
Bugger! Stuck with 1400 Smartphones! (Score:2)
With reviews like this the thiefs can use them only as paperweights!
Re:The same company? err the new story? (Score:2)
if so i would guess.... no?
Re:The same company? err the new story? (Score:2)
But my guess would still be no.
Re:YES! Isn't this weird??? (Score:2, Informative)
Apple Telecommunications is a telecommunications company in Australia. They were named Apple to emphasize they are competing against Orange. Apple Computers has scared Apple Telecommunications into changing their name to Green.......
Re:YES! Isn't this weird??? (Score:2)