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Tesla To Expand Its US Supercharger Network To Other EVs In Late 2022 (techcrunch.com) 65

Posted by BeauHD from the sharing-is-caring dept.
Tesla plans to begin opening its Supercharger network to other electric vehicles by the end of the year, according to a White House memo that shared the automaker's plans. TechCrunch reports: The U.S. government said in April that it needs to increase its own network of about 1,100 charging stations a hundred-fold to meet coming demand. Tesla's plans call for expanding capacity at its Gigafactory in Buffalo, New York, where more than 1,600 employees produce Supercharging stations and solar panels, the memo said. "Later this year, Tesla will begin production of new Supercharger equipment that will enable non-Tesla EV drivers in North America to use Tesla Superchargers," according to the memo.

The expansion -- and exposure to customers of other EVs brands -- could help Tesla capture more revenue and attention as automakers begin launching new EVs over the next couple of years. The memo did not mention how much money Tesla will invest in adding stations to its fast-charging network, but said that the EV maker is ramping up production of "power electronics components that convert alternating current to direct current, charging cabinets, posts and cables."
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Tesla To Expand Its US Supercharger Network To Other EVs In Late 2022 More

Tesla To Expand Its US Supercharger Network To Other EVs In Late 2022

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  • Has the ice melted? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by AlanObject ( 3603453 ) on Friday July 08, 2022 @10:07PM (#62686604)

    It would seem the ice-hard Biden policy of "Tesla simply does not exist" seems to have thawed somewhat. I realize that Biden has close ties to unions but trying to pretend that GM is the EV leader was just dumb.

    Still, it is good to see other BEVs other than Tesla coming into the market and from the looks of it all of them are quite good. And the demand is there.

    Anyway, I hope the relationship improved and will continue to do so. I'm a fanboi of Elon Musk but there is no denying he is a PR nightmare.

    • I don't really get that either. UAW is so corrupt that even AFL-CIO, who has been caught embezzling funds and taking bribes from employers, has denounced the UAW. I'd ask how Biden doesn't know this, but it's more likely willful ignorance.

    • This has 0% to do with Biden or the US Government though?

      Tesla has been testing the idea of adding CCS charging to their supercharger network for some time in Europe, and this is not the first time doing it in the US has been discussed.

      I think Tesla is just seeing the business opportunity or letting other drivers buy electricity from them.
      =Smidge=

      • Right -- Musk has talked about this for a long time.

        But my remark was not about that -- it was about the Biden administration acting like Tesla actually exists. The weren't doing that not too long ago.

    • what "relationship"? the white house only wrote a memo about what a company is doing, and mainly the Biden administration has been hampering green energy by throttling fossil too soon. Right now everything we build takes 80 percent fossil fuel. Making that expensive and hard is stupid, but that's what Biden administration has done.

      No plan, no competence, no long term vision.

  • Should have been required from day 0 (Score:4, Insightful)

    by burtosis ( 1124179 ) on Friday July 08, 2022 @10:21PM (#62686644)
    These are software defined power supplies. Outside of the connector being a different shape, needing an adapter, there is nothing about Tesla supercharging stations that is unique to Teslas as compared to other fast DC charging such that they can’t be rapid charged as well. In fact, it was simply an over the air update when musk caved [electrek.co] to Europe’s pressure of requiring any charger to work with any device including EVs. After all, at least with chemical fuel you could claim some proprietary mix to only sell to one brand of car, but with electrons, they are all identical.

    • Not necessarily. Try taking a toaster from the US and using it in a UK socket with only pass through wiring. Sure, you'll toast your bread, but that might not be all that you end up toasting.

      EVs have a similar consideration. In addition to physical compatibility, you need to make sure that the power negotiation is compatible between both the car and the charger. Generally this isn't an issue, but it can be.

      https://electrek.co/2021/10/22... [electrek.co]

      Either way, it doesn't come down to electrons just being electrons.

      • What part of the sentence "Outside of the connector being a different shape, needing an adapter" didn't you understand/read? The OP already mentioned this.

        • You should ask yourself the same question, since OP mentions shape but says nothing about voltage or other electrical conversion.

          • You should ask yourself the same question, since OP mentions shape but says nothing about voltage or other electrical conversion.

            I guess you don’t understand what a software defined power supply is, on an IT news site Lmafo.

    • Tesla was able to open their European charging network to third parties because they use the same IEC Type-2 and CCS-2 connectors as other EV manufacturers. But it came with a catch - older Supercharger stations that used a Type-2 connector could only be used as slow level-2 AC chargers by non-Tesla EVs because they didn't support the fast charge protocol or pin aggregation method that Tesla developed before the advent of CCS.

      In North America, almost all of the Supercharger stations use a Tesla connector t

      • Re:Should have been required from day 0 (Score:5, Interesting)

        by radoni ( 267396 ) on Saturday July 09, 2022 @01:24AM (#62686876)

        I wish it were an adoption of the European charging network standards and plug types. If anything could push 3ph power into common use in North America consumer space this would have been it! Also, the N. American standards requirement to have a crackhead's bounty of copper wire at the charging bollard is a frequent target for theft. The Euro way is better that you bring your own cable and so there's less inherent temptation to damage and disable charging points. I'm not dreaming this up - I have traveled 150,000mi all-electric since 2016 - sometimes a planned recharging session does not go at all as planned. Tesla opening their Supercharger network to other brands could have been an opportunity to move the market to unify with Euro standards and cause a demand for 3ph power in consumer (home) space. Home charging in N. America is crippled to 11kW (60A OCPD for 48A @ 240VAC single phase) and that just is not enough for all the power you can collect from the sun at a typical home, and if you have a few guests over that want to recharge it's a juggling game to pick who gets to plug in and when. Definitely bitter about our shitty power infrastructure in USA... even though I'm not connected to utility power and could arbitrarily install 3-phase power that would be a disadvantage without support from manufacturers of EVs here - 208VAC @ 48A max because there's no support on N. America sold Tesla vehicles for 3ph power.

        • Re: (Score:3)

          by Baki ( 72515 )

          I just came home from a road trip, 2000km, through north-western europe with a new tesla model 3.
          I left 95% charged from home. The std. wall charger delivers up to 11kW (from solar panels).
          22kW is usually not possible here, because of the electricity company restrictions, except at very high costs.

          I only used tesla superchargers during the trip.
          I forgot my type-2 cable, but there would not have been much reason for other networks in this case:
          All superchargers were almost empty or at most half full, and ava

        • The standard electrical service in this part of the US is 200 A @ 240 V, not 60 A. My stove alone is rated at 11.2 Kw.

          Going to three phase would require ripping out the main service, then you have the choice of going to a three phase 208/ 120v system or an industrial 480V system with another 120V step down transformer for all the existing motors.

          The house down the street that has a big shop has a 400 A service, so if you want a bigger service you can certainly get it. The three phase line runs right by hi

          • You wouldn’t even need three phase power unless you had large equipment, say motors over 10hp, using it. Anything less and you just buy an inverter or use one of the old school rotary converters. So for example, guy I know has a Bridgeport mill in his home shop and it needs three phase power. But iirc the motor is only 3hp and he picked up a used rotary converter cheap.

        • I have three-phase 120V/240V (delta) at the pole and I opted to use split-phase power (tie off the wild leg) when I upgraded the service. The lack of three-phase charging for automobiles is what finally pushed me over. There just wasn't enough benefit versus the higher equipment and installation costs.

          I totally agree that it would benefit North America to switch from a SAE J1772 Type-1 connector to a SAE J3068 Type-2 connector. And a "bring your own cable" public charging model could really help drive th

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      Initially Tesla used their own proprietary connector, so first they had to retrofit all the chargers with a CCS cable after the EU forced them to fit CCS to the cars.

      The communication protocol used by CCS was different to the Tesla one so there needed to be some software updates too.

      Even now you need a Tesla account to use their chargers. The EU is going to make that go away as well. You should be able to pay the charger using a debit/credit card, just like petrol pumps. No account or app needed. It's not c

      • Re:Should have been required from day 0 (Score:4, Informative)

        by tlhIngan ( 30335 ) <[ten.frow] [ta] [todhsals]> on Saturday July 09, 2022 @06:59AM (#62687204)

        Initially Tesla used their own proprietary connector, so first they had to retrofit all the chargers with a CCS cable after the EU forced them to fit CCS to the cars.

        The communication protocol used by CCS was different to the Tesla one so there needed to be some software updates too.

        Even now you need a Tesla account to use their chargers. The EU is going to make that go away as well. You should be able to pay the charger using a debit/credit card, just like petrol pumps. No account or app needed. It's not clear how Tesla will retrofit card readers to its chargers.

        That's in the EU.

        In North America, Teslas still ship using the proprietary Tesla power connector. And Tesla Superchargers only have the proprietary connector.

        Given the growth of EVs in North America, many of which are using CCS (even the Nissan Leaf is going CCS), Tesla is starting to be an odd one out, because public charging stations are starting to be CCS only, and they're popping up quite quickly. It's close to the point where the Superchargers are becoming relics if Tesla doesn't adapt.

        That's the problem Tesla is having. And it's because of the explosive growth of EVs. I mean, back when Musk wasn't a billionaire out to screw everyone over (in more ways than one, it turns out), Teslas made complete sense because the Supercharger network was a huge deal. These days, it's starting to be a lot different.

        EV charging is in two parts - AC and DC. AC charging is basically plugging it into the wall - the "Charger" is actually just a fancy switch - it has the capability to regulate how much power is drawn by the EV (making it great if you want to charge "for free" using a solar PV array - some chargers have a PV sensor that lets you measure how much power the array is generating, and restrict your charging to "free" so you don't draw grid power). as well as circuit breakers to handle overrcurrent cases. Or in stranger electrical systems, monitor for ground faults to prevent the EV from becoming electrified (not so much in North America where our electrical network is grounded at multiple points, but in Europe, where the EV charger might not be carrying house ground). The charging in this case is controlled purely by the EV itself - it has your universal single and sometimes three phase AC input and charges the battery directly.

        DC fast chargers put the charging circuits outside the space constrained EV and are as an earlier poster put it, a software controlled power supply. Here the EV computer talks to the charger to regulate the power - how many volts it can take maximum, how much current etc.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

          It's interesting that they don't seem to have been able to build a CCS to Tesla adapter.

          • There are adapters for the AC only Type1 CCS chargers have been out for ages but Tesla combining AC + DC pins introduces problems with the CCS standard which requires active handling. The AC+DC CCS to Tesla adapters only came out the last year and anything that plugs into a Tesla charger would need to handle the possibility of either an AC or DC supply.

        • Some vehicles integrate AC chargers. Some do not. Some which do not integrate one come bundled with an external AC to DC charger. Some do not.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by tlhIngan ( 30335 )

            Some vehicles integrate AC chargers. Some do not. Some which do not integrate one come bundled with an external AC to DC charger. Some do not.

            All vehicles come with an AC charger onboard. They come with a SAE J1772 (in North America) connector which is the AC connector. You plug it into a "charger" which is really a fancy switch - it controls power to the car in case it needs to disconnect during say, a fault condition. (This is because the chassis of the car is connected to ground - if there's a fault caus

    • Outside of the connector being a different shape, needing an adapter, there is nothing about Tesla supercharging stations that is unique to Teslas

      You're ignoring time. Tesla's superchargers were incredibly unique and significantly higher powered than any of the competition at the time of their release. Sure CCS has caught up (and overtaken) now and the rest is just software and connector, but it most definitely wasn't the case at the time the supercharger was developed.

      • So your argument is because there were no other vehicles that could use it on initial deployment, it couldn’t be done because it’s too hard? Not doing something is extremely easy, not so hard it can’t be done - I dare you to make less sense. You wouldn’t even need a standard, just a law saying that charging could not be brand restricted and with no other brands it’s trivial. Everyone knew EVs would be requiring lots of power to quickly charge, that is one of the leading ar

        • Tesla was building chargers before there was a standard, yo.

          Now that there's a standard, and it's not Tesla's, it makes sense for Tesla to start shifting to the standard.

  • It sounds like the Biden administration is willing to accept ideas and help even from people who don't kiss their asses. It's a good sign about his leadership.

    • It sounds like the Biden administration is willing to accept ideas and help even from people who don't kiss their asses. It's a good sign about his leadership.

      He really did screw up royally with the GM/EV/Union nonsense at the same time as Warren went from being a very effective government official to looking stupid accusing Musk of not paying his taxes. Let's hope he can get onto a rational path wrt EVs and this is a start.

    • What does Biden have to do with this article? Musk thinks Biden admins are incompetents for choking fossil fuel when the only way to build out a massive green infrastructure is to use fossil fuel in near term, after all 80 percent of our energy comes from it. To knock that down to even 75 percent would take ten times the projects (done with mostly energy from fossil fuel) the Biden administration has done thus far. They don't have any coherent plan for getting us off fossil.

      In fact the green projects und

  • Are charging stations so specialized that only highly trained government employees can run them?
    • Tesla proved that private companies can provide this infrastructure on its own, but the government can't have that; they have to falsely justify their huge footprint.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Agripa ( 139780 )

      Are charging stations so specialized that only highly trained government employees can run them?

      Imagine the cleanup required with an untrained person spills a few watt-hours of electrons all over the pavement.

      • When will the government start providing home plugging services to prevent these kinds of accidents? I need to vacuum my carpet!

  • There are places across the country that are shuttering off Tesla superchargers because the land owners were promised rent on the things.

    And they're not getting paid as contracted.

  • And it's going well. I've charged my non-Tesla EV at supercharger stations a couple of times now. It's the same CCS connector, so that was easy for them to open it up. They tend to have more chargers at each location than the other companies do, so it's more of a sure thing to be able to find one, not have to wait for it to be available. Usually there is food and/or shopping nearby, even out in the countryside.

  • Trailer it behind your EV...when you need a charge, crank it up. LOL

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