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Cloud Data Storage Apple Hardware

Apple Wants To Store Your History In the Cloud 99

Posted by samzenpus from the putting-ideas-in-thin-air dept.
bizwriter writes "Most online backup is about keeping the latest and greatest version of what resides on a device, whether a PC, tablet, or smartphone. Three recent patent filings suggest that Apple has a super version of backup on its mind. Someone would be able to go into an application (like iTunes or the App Store), find what material was available at a previous time, and recover any or all of what once was there without having to use a separate recovery program."
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Apple Wants To Store Your History In the Cloud More

Apple Wants To Store Your History In the Cloud

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  • Different from Dropbox? (Score:3)

    by david_thornley ( 598059 ) on Sunday April 17, 2011 @02:24PM (#35849598)

    I figure that any information I send to the cloud is at danger of being accessed by anybody at any time, unless I've encrypted it myself. The Apple idea could be really effective, but I'd never trust it with sensitive data, any more than I'd trust Dropbox.

    • Dropbox also stores history. As does stuff like Volume Shadow Copy, though obviously it's not in "the cloud. I don't really mind putting stuff in Dropbox. I have one "sensitive" file on it, which is encrypted.

    • Re:Different from Dropbox? (Score:5, Informative)

      by BasilBrush ( 643681 ) on Sunday April 17, 2011 @04:10PM (#35850268)

      Completely different from Dropbox, in that it doesn't have anything to do with the cloud. The article is nonsense, the patent quotes say nothing about the cloud. They very clearly relate to the local document versioning system that Apple is putting in in the next version on OSX (Lion), and has already announced.

      http://www.apple.com/macosx/lion/ [apple.com]

      • If the patents are about being able to recover previous versions of files, or previously deleted files, then it seems like they're getting a patent on what GoBack did years ago.

    • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

      by alostpacket ( 1972110 )
      Nonsense, Apple clearly invented the cloud. And backup. And turtlenecks.

  • Just Google your name.. With some fake credentials you can run a plate

  • So it's just Time Machine in the cloud? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Gavin Scott ( 15916 ) on Sunday April 17, 2011 @02:27PM (#35849630)

    Well duh, Time Machine already does this for local or NAS storage, so any extension of this into the "cloud" would obviously include the same functionality.

    Inflammatory summary is inflammatory.

    G.

    • And considering services like Mozy, Carbonite and DropBox already do versioning (preserving overwritten or deleted files), this isn't really a story.

      • And considering services like Mozy, Carbonite and DropBox already do versioning (preserving overwritten or deleted files), this isn't really a story.

        Except the small details there is no monthly fee, it is a tightly integrated aspect of the OS's user-interface, and you don't have to do anything other than turn your OSX Lion-installed Mac on, I'd say it's exactly the same thing...

    • So "in the cloud" now is the cool word for remote backups and storage?

      • So "in the cloud" now is the cool word for remote backups and storage?

        Yes, just like "remote" was the cool word off-site, but has now become an accepted term.

      • So "in the cloud" now is the cool word for remote backups and storage?

        In the same way that 'truck' is the new cool word for 'car' when discussing shipping of cargo.

  • Cool patents, bro. (Score:4, Interesting)

    by fuzzyfuzzyfungus ( 1223518 ) on Sunday April 17, 2011 @02:33PM (#35849672) Journal
    I know that "in the cloud" is the hip thing these days; but I'm a bit fuzzy on how this differs in any patentable way from versioning file systems that go back at least as far as VMS, and almost any network backup product that provides differential backups(which is virtually all of them).

    Even more specifically, precisely this sort of 'network-accessed version/time view' of documents is what pretty much any IDE does when you point it at a supported revision control system. Complete history of your project, all in 'app', delivered locally or over the network, or clustered, or what have you. Similar, albeit expensive and somewhat niche, stuff can be had for word processing among legal types.

    Now, from a user experience perspective, more power to Apple if they can bring the benefits of a revision control model to other applications in a way intuitive enough for people who wouldn't know a revision control system if it bit them. That is the sort of thing that they are good at, and the sort of thing that they can charge a premium for.

    Patent worthy, though? Srsly?

    • Re: (Score:3)

      by mcgrew ( 92797 ) *

      "In the cloud" really just means letting someone else be responsible for your data. Of course, the people pushing "the cloud" are (surprise) data hosting companies.

      Patent worthy? Hell, no.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by dkf ( 304284 )

        "In the cloud" really just means letting someone else be responsible for your data.

        There's a bit more to it than that; you also let them run the servers (or even services) that access the data. Of course, it does leave me wondering how much care Apple will take when it comes to privacy laws (EU law is fairly strict in this area, though if the data is encrypted before export those laws are probably satisfied — IANAL of course). I don't expect to figure that out from a patent application.

        Remember: there's very little technical innovation in The Cloud; it's virtually all stuff that was

    • IF this is talking about versioning coming in OSX Lion, then I'd say it is different because it is giving average home users and enterprise-like level tool they may find handy without all the enterprise tool fuss and administration.

      And if it is talking about the upcoming Versioning in Lion, then no, they won't charge a premium for it...I'll guess about a one-time $129 upgrade.

  • Not new and totally obvious, so I fully expect them to get their patents :(
  • Unless the sync is optional, or it allows the user to use a key separate from the credentials that requires a re-sync if you lose it (like Firefox Sync) where the provider can't tell what you store on their servers (encrypted/decrypted locally), it'll bar me from buying Apple products ever again.
    • Why would it be mandatory? Mobile Me is opt in (purchase), even time machine is opt-in. Hell, even owning the machine is opt-in. Itunes sharing is opt-in. Where's this mandatory idea come from? Nevar

  • More than that (Score:3)

    by mr100percent ( 57156 ) on Sunday April 17, 2011 @02:48PM (#35849778) Homepage Journal

    It's far more than that, Apple is rumored to be developing a sort of cloud user-space, where you can login on anyone's Mac as a Guest and it will pull all your apps, documents, and preferences from the App Store and iDisk cloud. There's even talk of a Net-booting cloud [slashdot.org].

  • Wait... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Locke2005 ( 849178 ) on Sunday April 17, 2011 @02:54PM (#35849824)
    So first, any normal business practice becomes patentable if you add the words "on a computer" to it. Now this: anything you do on a computer (e.g. backup) becomes patentable if you and the words "in the cloud" to it??? WTF is wrong with our patent system?

    • Re:Wait... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by fuzzyfuzzyfungus ( 1223518 ) on Sunday April 17, 2011 @03:08PM (#35849926) Journal
      Here's a drinking game that will(briefly, before it kills you) make you feel better about the state of the software/business method patent system:

      1. When you see a bullshit 'on the internet' or 'in the cloud' patent, ask yourself "Could I have done exactly the same thing over a leased line somewhere between 1970 and 1985, if I'd had a checkbook big enough for IBM?".

      2. If yes, take a shot.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by gig ( 78408 )

        So what you're saying is we either have to train the 99.999% of humanity who can't do that to do that plus freeze the state of the world's technology in 1985, or we have to invent some new solutions that enable an Apple Store customer to do that with no training on their 2011 systems with every various kind of data they store? I like the latter.

        In Apple's solution the user does not even have to Save a document, let alone check it in or out. They don't even have to Open it, the app makes it appear it is alwa

      • Could I have done exactly the same thing over a leased line somewhere between 1970 and 1985

        That's not the right question. The test you need is: "Did anyone think of doing this over a leased line before now?" If no one thought of doing it before, and it's a nontrivial invention, it's most certainly patentable.

        In this case, remote version history has plenty of examples of people thinking of this a long time ago: AMANDA just off the top of my head. I haven't read the patent to see if they claim something narrower that people hadn't thought of before.

    • Just like the word digital. Insert it into anything and if you're a corporation you can get laws passed if you cry enough.

    • WTF is wrong with our patent system?

      Everything.

    • So first, any normal business practice becomes patentable if you add the words "on a computer" to it. Now this: anything you do on a computer (e.g. backup) becomes patentable if you and the words "in the cloud" to it??? WTF is wrong with our patent system?

      It prevents patents from being overly broad. In other words, that innovation you came up with on your mechanical record player won't cause Diamond to have to license your idea when they release their new digital music player.

      It's fun to rag on the patent system and all, but it's actually better this way.

      • It's fun to rag on the patent system and all, but it's actually better this way.

        I don't think it is. See, if Diamond do come up with some idea that was already invented for mechanical record players, then they shouldn't be able to patent it again "digitally".

        There already is a provision in place to prevent licensing forever: patents expire after 20 years.

        It would be a lot better for everyone if (expired) patents were interpreted more broadly. Ideally though there shouldn't be any patents at all (i

        • I don't think it is. See, if Diamond do come up with some idea that was already invented for mechanical record players, then they shouldn't be able to patent it again "digitally".

          That's how you get an overly broad patent. If you can't patent it, it's because the other guy has it. Now you're licensing it from him.

    • Re:Wait... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by gig ( 78408 ) on Sunday April 17, 2011 @06:32PM (#35851074)

      Apple is not a patent troll. They have sued over patents only a few times even though they've been widely copied. They obviously have to patent this before they ship to protect themselves against patent trolls.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Agripa ( 139780 )

      So first, any normal business practice becomes patentable if you add the words "on a computer" to it.

      Sure. Just like how substituting a transistor for a tube in a circuit allowed the circuit to be patented again. The cathode follower became the emitter follower, the common grid became the common base, and the common cathode became the common emitter.

      * Warning: This post contains sarcasm which may cause cancer, birth defects, or reproductive harm in California. *

  • How about a subversion (or equivalent) version control system that stores encrypted files to the cloud? That way you could retrieve any version of a file or even files that you had deleted at some point.

  • find what material was available at a previous time, and recover any or all of what once was there without having to use a separate recovery program

    I bet teachers will request / demand access to catch people whom commit academic dishonesty, then doctor the assignment or paper up to foil simple search detection.

    For example, if someone stole my line above, and then claimed this as their own writing:

    "In the I-enabled internet future, teachers will request or demand access to catch people whom commit academic dishonesty, then doctor the assignment or paper up to prevent simple search detection."

    Because I added and changed a couple words, the copier would probably not be caught. But if the professor had access to the earlier version and googled for it, they'd find my original post, and see how pitifully little work I did to doctor up the copy.

    I suppo

    • If a teacher knows their students the way they should, no special software is needed to detect when they are plagiarizing works.

  • iTunes needs some work, first (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward

    I like how Apple is thinking big, yet missing obvious and practical "backup" issues. Ask anyone who has gotten a new i-device, or had to wipe one: there is no way in iTunes to figure out what all you've bought previously without attempting to download it again. Maybe when you click that "Buy" button, it pops up and says you already bought it, and you re-download it for free. But maybe you clicked on the wrong version of the app thinking it was the one you'd already paid for, and welp, you just bought it.

    • I thought the pop-up comes up before the buy it screen.... regardless, the issue your describing is not existent. All of the apps you have installed are sync into your iTunes. You don't have to do any redownloading. Just plug iphone into iTunes, it'll sync, then click restore, (wait,) select if you want to restore your profile or start clean, it restores everything you had including your Apps, or if you went with a clean slate it will install every app you have in your iTunes. I have apps I bought on my Ori

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by tlhIngan ( 30335 )

      I like how Apple is thinking big, yet missing obvious and practical "backup" issues. Ask anyone who has gotten a new i-device, or had to wipe one: there is no way in iTunes to figure out what all you've bought previously without attempting to download it again. Maybe when you click that "Buy" button, it pops up and says you already bought it, and you re-download it for free. But maybe you clicked on the wrong version of the app thinking it was the one you'd already paid for, and welp, you just bought it. St

  • I'm sorry, this is a new idea? Really?

    Talk about a fucking slow news day.

    • Re:And this is a new idea how? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by gig ( 78408 ) on Sunday April 17, 2011 @07:00PM (#35851234)

      They didn't claim to invent the cloud or versioning. They claim to have an invention that uses the cloud and versioning in a new way, enabling even a non-technical consumer to apply it to all of their documents without training. No, nobody has done that before.

      Steam engine also did not claim to have invented steam.

  • and taking that iPhone to canada can cost you UP TO 10K a gig and $20+ a gig in the us.

  • If the advertisers asked you to send them your life (pictures, friend lists, schedule...) so they could better sell you stuff you'd refuse. But if they say here, store your stuff on our servers (in the cloud) for free! (where free means we can spy on you to sell you stuff) then we all go for it without a second thought.

  • Currently they suck at retireving information.... (Score:3)

    by westyvw ( 653833 ) on Monday April 18, 2011 @12:37AM (#35852650)

    And yet Apple does not have an easy method to show me what I purchased in the Ap-store for my phone? Or an easy way to just reload all purchased apps if my iPhone gets restored? Or make iTunes not suck so hard?
    I wouldn't trust these bozo's to make it easy to get to any information I entrusted them with.

    • Your purchase history is accessible via iTunes for mac or PC. Not via your itunes for iOS. But, then again the chase.app and esurance.app also only offer limited information over their iOS app. How much info go your banking and insurance companies offer you via an iOS app? All your apps will be restore during your first sync, which is started automatically as the last step in a restore. Get a mac. iTunes is pretty good for mac. I do agree it's not that it just doesn't translate well to windows. The design c

  • Apple wants to store apple customers' history in the cloud. I'll have nothing to do wit apple products, thanks.

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