AMD / Intel Hybrid Motherboard

batgirl writes "ECS has taken advantage of their recent merger with PC Chips and released an interesting take on motherboards. Using the highly portable SiS chipsets, they were able to create a motherboard that supports all kinds of processors across all platforms. The PF88 starts as an Intel socket 775 motherboard, but different expansion cards can be purchased to add support for everything from a Socket 939 Athlon64 to a Socket 479 Pentium-M. The price is right, and performance is as good as can be expected. But how many people would make use of this?"

Not me

[fuzzy12345]

I generally find that by the time upgrading the CPU is cost effective, a new motherboard makes sense as part of the package. YMMV

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[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Maybe

[JayDot]

But only if the Intel and AMD chips that provided the features I want were close to the same price. By the time that I needed a new proc, though, I would probably want a new mobo to take advantage of 6 months to a year of new development.

The article stated it well

[Gactaculon]

The article summarized this idea well by calling it "a solution without a problem". The whole thing is just so amazingly ill-considered that it's very hard to take it seriously. The only need I could see for something like this is if someone with a P4 needed PCI-E now, and _also_ knew that they wanted to go AMD later. Even then, would they put up with buying a $50 expansion board and running their expensive new processor on that hacked solution?? If PCChips/ECS want to be ambitious, why not endeavor to bring affordable SMP to the masses? Even if the server-classed chips required are expensive, many people must be put off by $300, server-oriented mainboards. This way, they could grab some serious attention in the high-end market and gain credibility. What they're doing now is only going to leave people scratching their heads...

Re:Not me; Oh but it is

[wondafucka]

I generally find that by the time upgrading the CPU is cost effective, a new motherboard makes sense as part of the package. YMMV
If this company has done it's job right, this should reduce the overall cost of the board. If vendors have to keep fewer types of boards around then they are buying fewer types, giving them a price break. By having one mainboard that is common to all daughterboards, the total cost of delivering the motherboard is cheaper (one hopes).
My two cents.

Re:Not me

[gbulmash]

I generally find that by the time upgrading the CPU is cost effective, a new motherboard makes sense as part of the package. YMMV

So much is built onto the mainboard now... USB, firewire, support for various forms of DDR, sound, LAN... These don't change as often as CPUs, but they change.

Of course, this is meant to be a budget board, or at least they're using budget chipsets. The best I can see is that it provides whitebox manufacturers more flexibility. Use whatever CPU is on hand.

- Greg

Cost Cutting

[x86eon]

It would be useful to PC manufactures who are looking to cut costs while still offering both AMD and Intel processors to their customers. Then they could order one huge lot of the same motherboard, therefore getting a greater bulk discount.

it would be more interesting if...

[unfunk]

...this board allowed you to use AMD and Intel CPUs at the same time...

Who Would Use: Schools

[sarge apone]

Upgradable, budget boards that will support a wide range of CPUs and memory would be useful in urban elementary and secondary schools where money for technology is limited, especially when administration considers 7-year old iMacs cutting-edge.

With Intel-based Windows/MacOSX dual-boot computers on their way to the masses, the ability to cheaply upgrade certain hardware to extend the life of these systems would be welcome. It would take years anyway for school officials to adapt (e.g., NYC Dept of Ed has a deal with Dell), but the future of the technology is interesting.

good for OEMs

[smash]

Worried about the competition between Intel/AMD leaving one of the product lines un-fashionable?

Buy bulk in motherboards that will support both.

No dead stock you can't shift anymore.

Regardless of the performance, the words "AMD" or "Intel" is enough to sell things to most of the Joe public...

smash.

Remember ALR?

[Anonymous Coward]

This reminds me of my old ALR 386. The processor was on a card, with the idea that you didn't need to replace the motherboard to upgrade, only the CPU card.

When I wanted to upgrade to a 486, the CPU card cost more than a new motherboard, CPU, and RAM.

There are two problems with the CPU card approach. The first is technical; new generations of processors are coupled with new generations of chip sets, and often, new RAM technology.

The second problem is economic; without a CPU card standard, you are locked into a specific vendor for upgrades. The vendor has no incentive to price the upgrade any less than just below replacement cost for the entire MB, CPU, and RAM package.

If this system had come out not too long ago, you'd be locked into PATA instead of SATA, slow RAM, and AGP instead of PCIe graphics. The CPU and MB should always be treated as a unit, and sufficient RAM should be purchased from the beginning, so memory upgrades should be fairly unusual. Graphics card, hard drive, and optical drive upgrades may make sense; not always, not for everyone, but often enough to consider.

Re:Same as...

[misleb]

Usually the "engine" of a computer includes the mainboard (and RAM). What are the chances that CPUs of the future will work with the same sockets/RAM that we currently have? No matter how modular they maek it, they won't support the Athlon 128 with a 2GHz FSB, or whatever. Even if the socket remains standard, there will be a faster front side bus or RAM type to support...

-matthew
 

Re:Same as...

[heson]

I like your analogy, becuase I think it compares so well. You put a new powerful engine in the bug, and can drive theoretically 100mph, but the bug isnt made for it, and you need a fat front splitter to be able to steer it above, say 60. What I mean is, new fast CPU in an old computer is a waste of good computrons. I think the idea of a modular MB could be good but for other reasons.

Re:Not me

[stienman]

I generally find that by the time upgrading the CPU is cost effective, a new motherboard makes sense as part of the package.

You are not their target market. In fact, as far as upgrading the CPU, no one is their target market.

You have three end users:
1) The individual who builds their own systems. If they upgrade, their old system is good enough to resell -but they aren't going to sell just the CPU card. Therefore the entire board, cpu card, and cpu are going to stay together after the original purchase.
2) The individual who buys their own system. If they upgrade, they aren't going to bother upgrading the cpu - especially since they originally purchased the computer because it was cheap. Another cheap computer is around the corner.
3) OEM system builder. This is the target market. These motherboard are not really good for upgrades. Upgrading the CPU made sense when the CPU was 1/3 of the cost of the system. That is only true now when you are buying a top of the line CPU, and if so you aren't going to accept the performance hit of this motherboard (which may only be 5%, but you're already paying hundreds of dollars more for a CPU that only gives 10% more performance than one that is *very* cheap).

The OEM builder has a few advantages with this mobo (though these aren't, in practise, all that great):
1) They can stock fewer/smaller components to support a wider range of system configurations.
2) They can pre-build more of the system - leave the cpu card, HD, and video card out. Add these components very quickly on demand.
3) If the CPU is bad on the final test removing the card and putting a new one in may be easier/faster than removing the heatsink, cpu, and replacing them on a regular motherboard.

The biggest downside is that this greatly impedes case airflow, and requires a special or modified case to be truly reliable.

-Adam