VIA Announces Lead-Free Motherboard

linuxprox writes "VIA announced today that their AS-1210 motherboard will be the world's first lead-free motherboard. 'The transition to 'green' manufacturing for VIA has been very smooth and we have been able to ship lead-free processors and chipsets since the end of last year,' said Richard Brown, Vice President of Marketing, VIA Technologies, Inc. 'The AS-1210 clearly demonstrates the technology leadership of VIA and Yamashita in being the first to market with a lead-free motherboard that meets the requirements of the international market.'"

Graphite...

[Thinkit4]

...is in pencils--a form of carbon. Won't get that past here.

Lead-Free Mobo's

[Carlos Silva]

Of course i didn't RTFA but .. are they too expensive? I fail to see the consumer advantage on this kind of thing.. maybe they'll do some kind of special ad campaign.. Marketing guys just love to be able to say thing like "We're environment friendly" :-)

Correct.

[DAldredge]

Just like how coal plants release more radition and heavy metals into the environment that nuclear plants. But which ones to the 'enviros' target the most, the nuke plants because it gets them more press.

Re:I had no idea this was a problem

[Anonymous Coward]

Mobos don't just suddenly dematerialise when you're through with them. Instead they sit in land fills and get rained on and leech lead into the groundwater.

Thanks EU!

[taped2thedesk]

Interesting to see a company that is succeeding with lead-free... They are requiring the phase-out of lead-free components by 2006, and now a lot of companies are scrambling to change their product designs and processes to make this possible. I haven't heard of much success in this area.

I think electronic components have a blanket exemption for now, but this exemption is coming up for review soon. Just to be safe, most companies (including mine, which is part of an exempted industry) are trying to come up with lead-free products.

Not sure how much of an effect this will have... I remember reading that on average, electric components are less than 1% lead. In addition, the substitutes being explored to replace lead solder (silver and antimony) may actually cause more groundwater pollution, because they are more soluble. Doesn't seem like it's much more than a feel-good measure.

Re:Earth Day..

[NivenHuH]

Well, obviously, it's not putting lead out into the environment when you trash your old MOBO.. I guess it doesn't help that there are still other harmful materials in PCB's, but, every little bit counts. You have to work your way around one problem before you can focus on the next..

Re:How much before?

[sugar and acid]

Lead is on of the problems in many landfill sites with contamination of ground water, and also increasing the cost of reuse of the land after the dump has stopped operating, as inevitable some lead has found its way there, the old common culprit being car batteries and the like.

Computers and other electrical goods are a lesser but probably more common concern these days as it makes up a large volume of waste, I think most people know to dispose of car batteries and other things with large amounts of lead and other heavy metals properly now or at least the shop that changed it does and the high concentration of lead makes extraction and recycling practical.

Re:Correct.

[Shurhaian]

Except that A) nuclear plants don't release massive amounts of heavy metals and greenhouse gases(not nearly so much as coal, for sure) and B) the fact that the waste can be(well, is) concentrated makes it easier to deal with than the same waste being vented into the atmosphere.

Lead Free is nice but...

[irrelative83]

there are more important issues regarding PCs and the evironment. Why don't PC manufacturers make computers that use less power? Nvidia's new graphic card needs a 450 watt power supply - so what if the mobo is lead free? The thing still draws enough power to burn twice as much oil as needed.

props

[IggDawg]

It's cool that they're getting into the push for lead-free electronics. It's certainly not easy or cheap to validate lead-free components. I work in acoustic micro imaging, so I look at the insides of ICs, MEMS, and other electronics all day. we get a lot of work from companies doing moisture sensitivity level testing for lead vs. lead free parts. The lead free parts have to go through a hotter solder reflow profile, so any moisture will cause even more damage. The insides of most of the parts look like someone set a bomb off. it takes them a long while and many iterations before they can pull it off right.

So, props to them for getting with it.

disclaimer - I don't work for these guys, nor do I buy their products. I'm just a concerned scientist :P.

Nice quotes...

[Cryptnotic]

However, it's too bad reasonable voices like these are being ignored. And organizations like Greenpeace, PETA, the Sierra Club are being taken over by crazies. The Sierra Club in particular used to be a club for hunters and outdoorsmen, but has turned into an eco-nazi propaganda organization.

I agree that DDT and nuclear power would do quite a lot of good for the world, by the way.

Re:Some Quotes...

[NivenHuH]

While I don't believe in the Greenpeace's message, I do believe that we, as humans, need to do what we can to lessen our impact on our environment. If we can find 'green'-alternative ways to fuel our power plants, then we should, reguardless of how much $$ it might cost to develop the technology. It's kinda the same idea as taxing the rich.. If our country gave you the means to become rich, then you should have to pay out a little more in taxes.. If our environment gave you the means to build a product, then you should at least do what you need to do to preserve our environment.. Unfortunately, with most businesses, it's not about ethic; it's about profit.

How to desolder the capacitors?

[Ark42]

Without lead, am I going to be able to desolder the exploding tawain capacitors in order to replace them with good ones, or do I just have to buy a new computer every 6 months now?

(note to mods: if you still havn't heard of the capacitor problem, go google about it before modding)

Re:Lead-Free Mobo's

[Chilliwilli]

I believe it's called Corporate Responsibility, it's been suggested that as corporations power and reach overtakes that of most governments they will need to take on the governments responsibilities to sustain a health market place. You can look at it from another point of view if we all die or get fat or whatever) who's going to be around to buy mobo/burgers/stuff's then?

Re:PC has met motherboards

[0racle]

Miniscule traces perhaps, but miniscule traces from hundreds of thousands of components is a whole hell of a lot. Besides, I'm sure the plants that produces these parts are a lot cleaner, environmentally.

So quit your whining, cleaner components are good, whether your talking traces or massive amounts. For everything that happens there's always someone whining about it.

Re:PC has met motherboards

[Shakrai]

political correctness has met the IT sector once again. For gosh sakes, what's the problem? I don't plan to eat my motherboard - you might argue "it's thrown away one day", but some miniscule trace of lead found in the solder isn't going to hurt anything - more goes into the environment when i lose a sinker fishing than when I throw away a dozen motherboards.

There's a reason why my State banned the sale of lead sinkers [outdoorcentral.com]. For gosh sakes, what's the problem with trying to be more environmentality friendly? If VIA can sell a lead-free motherboard that works well at a decent price and make a profit while doing so why is this political correctness? It's being a good corporate citizen. Why is this a bad thing?

Re:Some Quotes...

[Brandybuck]

We should definitely lessen our impact on our environment. The first step is to abandon this "green" religion that's been pushed on it. It prevents any sort of rational thought on the matter.

The green way is to recycle aluminum cans, which involves significant energy and chemical expenditure for the recycling. The old fashioned way, before the greenies took over, was to use returnable bottles. It was called "conservation". People didn't waste resources simply because it was wasteful. Nowadays we can waste as much as we want so long as we separate our waste into the proper waste containers first.

Re:Earth Day..

[NivenHuH]

Interesting.. I can completely see where you're coming from, as society today seems to be about 'consuming', which in turn boosts our economy.. which gives $$ to producers to influnce consumers into consuming even more.. A perpetual problem really..

While I don't see the conservation movement returning (well, unless we run into a problem of a shortage or we overflow ourselves with unrecyclable wastes), I do see working towards 'green' solutions as a compromise for conservation.

It would be nice to buy one MOBO, and use it for years, however not only would this be unfeasable for the manufacturer (.. they have to make $$ of the next-latest & greatest), but it's unfeasable for technology in general.. If we didn't have faster and faster machines, then we wouldn't be able to accomplish the problems we've solved with bigger and badder machines.. and if we didn't purchase the next-generation technologies in each product cycle, there would be no reason for technology to increase..

It's sad, but it's reality.. =/

Re:Some Quotes...

[LS]

Moderators, yes, you should mod this guy down. It has no relevance to the story.

How long did you have to scrape around to find these quotes. Sure, there are scientific and logical fallicies made by the environmental community, as well as all groups. But I bet you could come up with a list literally 10,000 times as long of SCIENTIFICALLY validated evidence of environmental damage done by irresponsible or ignorant humans.

LS

Re:Correct.

[nomadic]

To continue your analogy you can have all your cyanide in one place where it is easy to control and prevent others from getting or you can spread it all over every surface in your house. Which form would you rather have?

Well my analogy already showed how cyanide in the ocean isn't dangerous because it's so dilute, so you don't need to extend the analogy at all. And it falls apart at the point you're trying to make because it's extremely difficult to store it safely, unlike cyanide.

There are several general responses to this assertion. The first is that we can just put it in a large, specially-made storage facility like Yuca mountain. Unfortunately not only is that still dangerous (and the danger is compounded by having so much of the material in one place), it's also very expensive and these things WILL fill up. We already have way too much waste now that we can't get rid of, so it boggles the mind how so many people here are arguing that we should increase the amount of waste a hundredfold by opening up many, many new plants.

Another common solution brought up is to dump it into ocean trenches and let the earth's convective system draw it down and out of harms way. It's an interesting idea, but you can't just drop it at the ocean's surface over a trench and assume it will fall right where it needs to go. And the depths involved pose serious challenges to large scale movement of the waste down to the right place. Plus it is somewhat risky to just toss this stuff down there and assume it won't come back out until it's not radioactive anymore.

I know it's geek chic to assume everyone against increased nuclear use is against it "just because they see the word nuclear", but it's just not true. I think nuclear plants can operate safely (with intense government oversight and regulation--no, this is not something that you want "the market to decide"), but I don't think it's a smart idea to put more into operation until we figure out something to do with the waste that's more clueful than sticking it in a hole in the ground.

Re:Earth Day..

[Sylver Dragon]

You know, if people didn't go out and by new mobos every six months because they're substituting for diminished manhoods, then they wouldn't be trashing their old mobos every six months. This race to get the biggest and fasted CPU and GPU on the block is much more dangerous than the lead in a mobo that's being used past its planned obsolescence date.

I think this just depends on what you do with the old mobo. Perhaps I am alone in this, but I rarely throw away working electronics. I can usually either find some use for them, or find someone who wants them. My last computer was given to my girlfriend who doesn't feel the need to upgrade as often as I do. I have given coutless parts to friends and family, because I had replaced them, and they could use them. About the only thing I have considered throwing away is my old 486, which I haven't been able to find a good home for. I haven't brought myself to do it yet, mostly because I am a pack-rat, that and the fact that it was still working perfectly the last time I fired it up (though I did put newer hard drive in it, to get it there). Even that, I would rather give to someone who will use it than put it in a land-fill. I've considered a school, but I think its too old for even them.
I guess my point is, it isn't the upgrade cycle that is causing the problem, its the idiots who throw out perfectly good hardware. Sure, it won't run the latest games well, but it might do well for someone's over-glorified typewriter.

Re:Green means....

[SideshowBob]

What in the hell? Green does NOT mean living in a thatched hut eating berries. If 6 billion people reverted to hunter/gatherer the planet would be stripped bare in less than a year. No green wants that.

For F's Sake people, use your brains and quit spouting propaganda at each other.

Green means finding a technological solution to the fossil fuel problem (finite supply, source of pollutants). There is absolutely no reason to think that a hydrogen powered SUV is in any way a step backwards.

Green means putting solar on your roof and becoming energy self sufficient. Maybe even sell surplus back to the grid. (yes I am aware of the pollutants that solar manufacturing potentially represents, however a) its localized and controllable, b) advances over time will lead to reductions in the pollutants, as scale of economy increases)

Green means finding a technology solution to feeding our children without destroying the land that we grow it on (or perhaps you think that the Dust Bowl was good for our moral fiber?) The answer here is not patented genetically modified foods, which can't be seeded from the previous year's crop and require exorbitant licensing fees to biotech companies.

Green means encouraging/funding zero population growth (i.e. replacement births). Yes this is "family planning". In most nations of the world family planning means just that, planning how many children to conceive - or rather how many NOT to conceive. But to bass ackward U.S. conservatives all they see is 'abortion' when they hear family planning. Sheesh.

Green means smart progress, yet people like you spout your bullsh*t anytime you are confronted by the idea that change can be good. No no! Protect my comfortable status quo! Never mind that even if we did nothing, eventually it will be changed for us by the laws of physics!

Sorry for the rant, mods do with me what you will..

Re:Lead-Free Mobo's

[dustmite]

No such thing as self-regulating "corporate responsibility". "Corporate responsibility" comes from a big (government) stick. The sudden move to lead-free is forced onto manufacturers by new regulations (EU regulations IIRC). You don't honestly think corporations came up with this all by themselves do you? Sure, I can picture it now, in a board meeting: "hey, let's raise our manufacturing costs by voluntarily reducing some of the polluntants in our products". Uh, riiiight. Now, back to the real world. Here is roughly the order of things: (1) companies make products that pollute, (2) government passes new regulations, (3) companies protest until they're forced to accept regulations, (4) companies produce product with fewer pollutants, (5) PR department puts a "we care for the environment" spin on the company's (forced) compliance, and issues press releases that give the impression the move was voluntary. Name ten real-world examples where companies moved directly to step 4 voluntarily. Heck, name one.

Admittedly if products start really killing large sectors of the populace, then some companies are sure to start making voluntary moves. But I'm willing to bet that government regulation WILL appear long before the voluntary self-regulation even in that case.

Re:PC has met motherboards

[GigsVT]

CRT there's a kilogram or so, used to shield the user from xrays.

Yeah, but that's mixed in the glass, and isn't going anywhere for the next several millenia or more. In several hundred million years when that glass gets subducted under the mantle and remelts, I doubt humans will be around to worry.

Re:PC has met motherboards

[DebianRcksLindowsLie]

Go ask anyone who's got a child who's eaten lead-based paint and is now sick forever if lead is safe. This is a GOOD thing. If we kept our components forever no one would care, but people in countries like China are disposing of all that US waste - and killing themselves by doing so. It's deplorable. I'll be looking into this.

Re:Some Quotes...

[Anonymous Coward]

It took about 47 seconds on google.

It may not be 100% relevant to this story, but it is revelent to some of the theams behind this story and also is revelent to the post that I responded to.

Actually, given that there is no analysis or thought at all in your post, and that anyone could have found those quotes in "47 seconds on Google", I have to ask what the value of your post is at all?

Are you really trying to suggest that environmentalist groups are worse than, say, the coal-burning plants which they fight? Even if both sides were in just it for the money, which side causes cancer?

It's just amazing how some people think that any little flaw in the other guy's argument, or even the _suggestion_ of a flaw in the other guy's argument, makes it okay to ignore the gaping holes in their own point of view ("pointing out the sliver in anothers' eye while ignoring the log in their own"?)

Re:PC has met motherboards

[aardvarkjoe]

printf ("Jorkapp is a Programmer");

Stick to programming. Your physics isn't all that hot. ;)

Re:Some Quotes...

[m.koch]

It took about 47 seconds on google.

I don't believe you. Whithin 47 seconds you just had time to find a compilation of quotes and to copy & paste it. Without checking, without reasoning, without thinking.
Regarding your posting history, you can do better than that.

Re:Nice quotes...

[Anonymous Coward]

However, it's too bad reasonable voices like these are being ignored. And organizations like Greenpeace, PETA, the Sierra Club are being taken over by crazies. The Sierra Club in particular used to be a club for hunters and outdoorsmen, but has turned into an eco-nazi propaganda organization.

How is this insightful? It's just namecalling which got modded up by sympathetic admins.

Worse than that, it's actually propaganda itself. PETA and Greenpeace were always full of "crazies" by most people's standards. :) Therein the propaganda: "If only they'd go back to the way they were", spoken as if this guy knew "how it used to be" and has good cause to believe that things have gotten worse. He doesn't.

And of course the Sierra Club still does plenty of "outdoorsman" stuff. Hell, it's half travel agency [sierraclub.org]. But I guess if you're far enough to the right, everyone looks like a "left-wing nutcase".

Re:My source.

[m.koch]

Now fucking appoligize.

For what? You did just like I said. Besides, do you think that copying from a google search with the keywords extreme, quotes, environmentalists is a deliberate and constructive way to contribute to a discussion?

Re:PC has met motherboards

[scdeimos]

Ok, that begs the question: how many parents are feeding lead-based paint to their children?

Seriously, though, people aren't generally in direct contact with the lead contained in their motherboards, cards, hard disks, etc. The problem is supposed to occur at disposal time when it is alleged that lead and other heavy metals leach out of the refuse and in to the water table, and hence into the local water supply/food chain. With recycling companies breaking-up computers and other electronic devices into their constituent materials and reselling "raw" materials this should become less and less of an issue.

I'm not convinced of the lead problem myself. There isn't anything in this world today where everyone says it's good for you and nobody is saying it will kill you - just look at diets and mobile phones. One well-known atmospheric scientist who is a big proponent of global warming at the moment was pushing the coming of an ice age in the 1960's and 70's. His excuse? He was "wrong" back then. So, who's right and who can you believe?

If you were to look at this from an anti-Lead-Free point of view, one could wonder whether Lead-Free petrol has benefited the environment or not, since Lead-Free petrol has caused increases in SO2 emissions which cause H2SO4 acid rain and decimation of forests in Sweden and Norway as well as damage to old and ancient structures in France, Italy and Greece.

EU & DOD mandate for future

[mabhatter654]

both the EU and US DOD have lead free mandates comming up very quickly. I know 3 years ago when I worked at an electronics contract manufacture it was starting to be a hot topic in the press. It's a huge achivement to finally see a lead free commercial product of any type! All of the lead free alternatives dramatically reduce the solderability of parts...everything takes tighter manfacturing controls. It's a manufacturing productivity and quality nightmare. Not to mention purchasing getting passives [resistors, capacitors, & connectors] that are also tinned with lead free solder!

good job!

Re:PC has met motherboards

[Grab]

Correctly rated as "troll". But to enlighten you...

One mobo is not a big problem. But the zillions of circuit boards thrown away every year, when they're all taken together, *are* a problem. It's the same as smokeless zones - one campfire is not a problem, but an entire city with coal fires screws up the air.

You don't plan eating your mobo, but wherever they're shipped to (usually China) for "recycling", this shit dissolves out of the piles of boards and seeps into the water supplies. So people over there are *literally* eating and drinking the metals out of your mobo. Life expectancy in those areas is pretty damn short, due to poisoning from lead, cadmium, arsenic and other nasties.

Grab.

Re:PC has met motherboards

[HokieJP]

There isn't anything in this world today where everyone says it's good for you and nobody is saying it will kill you - just look at diets and mobile phones.

Yeah, but there are many things that everyone says are bad for you, and no one thinks are good. Lead is one.

With recycling companies breaking-up computers and other electronic devices into their constituent materials and reselling "raw" materials this should become less and less of an issue.

BTW, How many computer recycling companies are accepting computers from your area? Maybe I'm just uninformed, but I haven't heard of any that would take my old computer parts.