Paris, The City Of Wi-Fi? 221
TheMatt writes "An article at the IHT describes an effort to make Paris one big Wi-Fi hotspot. The project, with partners like RATP and Cisco, if approved, will place two or three antennae outside each of the 372 Metro stations in Paris and link them through an existing fiber network that runs through the subway tunnels.
The current pilot project is centered along the route of Bus No. 38. You can sign up for access to the pilot which is free until June 30."
WiFi legal in France? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:WiFi legal in France? (Score:4, Funny)
yep. (Score:2, Informative)
http://www.3g.co.uk/PR/Feb2003/4849.htm
Re:WiFi legal in France? (Score:1)
Re:WiFi legal in France? (Score:2)
Maybe Slashdot isn't the best forum though.
Redumdant yes. Falamebait no, because this is the truth and a very serious problem in Pairs.
Good plan but doesn't show scalability of wifi. (Score:1)
Re:Good plan but doesn't show scalability of wifi. (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Good plan but doesn't show scalability of wifi. (Score:5, Informative)
Also, just as in the U.S., the long distance rail has loads of fiber running alongside it.
All of this adds up to make france a VERY well connected country. Almost Anything you could possibly need will be found on the internet in France.
Re:Good plan but doesn't show scalability of wifi. (Score:1, Funny)
Re:Good plan but doesn't show scalability of wifi. (Score:2)
Are they still charging local calls by the minute? All the internet infrastructure in the World won't do anything if it costs an arm and a leg to use it.
Re:Good plan but doesn't show scalability of wifi. (Score:2)
At the time, a local unlimited telephone service in California for people above a certain income would have been around $14 per month. For people with less income, the service would have been much cheaper.
Bottom line, the combined s
That would be excellent... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:That would be excellent... (Score:1)
Oop, just posted a reply with similar sentiment, correcting an unembedded link.
"Allo?"
"Allo!"
"I would like to geet a roouum."
"un 'roouum'? Que est un 'roouum'?"
"Ah said roouum, you know a place where you can go and sit?"
"Ah, un 'room', alors, pardon m'seuir![NO CARRIER]
Re:That would be excellent... (Score:2)
one bright side (Score:5, Funny)
It's right <a href="http://www.tour-eiffel.fr/teiffel/uk/
"><b
Re:one bright side (Score:3, Interesting)
stupid extrans... grrr
Re:one bright side (Score:1)
It's right here [tour-eiffel.fr]
Yeah, but do you think service will stay up during one of the notorious french labor strikes?
Re:one bright side (Score:2)
Pilot? (Score:5, Funny)
*That* should give the Cisco engineers something to work for...
Re:Pilot? (Score:3, Funny)
Hmmm...who was it that said that Detroit was the Paris of the midwest?
Re:Pilot? (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Pilot? (Score:1)
doubts (Score:5, Insightful)
- people of paris : why would they subsribe to such service ? They likely have a home in paris, with internet access a lot cheaper, more reliable and more secure.
- visiting bussinessmen : why would they subsrcibe either ? Most hotels have access for a reasonable fee, and are not subscription based.
Additionally, I seriously wouldn't want to sit with my portable open on a bench near a subway entrance in autumn/winter when it gets dark after 19:00. Subway stations are not exactly known for their safety, and walking around with a 2000Euro piece of electronics is asking for trouble.
Additionally, i consider it silly to first sit in the subway for 15 minutes wit haportable and no connection, and then finally getting out in the open where you have to sit again to connect. Wouldn't it be much better to put the base stations INSIDE the trains ?
Call me stupid, but my guess is that they'd better focus on appartment buildings : place a wifi hotspot on top of it, and you've got you whole building connected for low fee and without having to rewire the damd thing.
Re:doubts (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:doubts (Score:4, Insightful)
Not always. There needs to be enough demand for your service
The American telecom industry built a hell of alot of infrastructure, and many of those companies went out of business because there was no demand for their service.
How many groundbreaking wireless companies have gone out of business in the last couple decades?
Personally, I have little desire to pay $30 a month to carry a WIFI computer around with me all of the time. The best thing about computers is that you can get away from them.
Re:doubts (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:doubts (Score:4, Interesting)
$29.95/month + I think $5 or $10 for modem rental, total about $40/month. Reasonable, if only 28.8.
Oh, now you have to buy the modem for $300 upfront, well shit that's a high but it's a 1 time charge. This is the deal when I signed up. I loved my Ricochet access, most often working a 1/2 day at the coffee shop near the train, eat lunch, take train in to the office for the other 1/2. Some of my most productive coding was in that coffee shop. 28.8 was more then resonable for email and "work related" web surfing, and in a way it was a plus because it kept me from even trying to play games over it.
Ricochet was great, the network was expanding, they had a huge deal cut with MCI/Worldcom (yah, but at the time this sounded good) to expand the network and upgrade it. When I signed up they promised speeds of 128k for the next modem versions (with "substantial" rebate for current modems) or 64k with existing modems.
The new 128k service rolls out, for like $80/month. They never mentioned a more then double price hike for the new service when they signed me up... Oh yah, and if I want anything more then 28.8 I'll need to upgrade, my $300 less then a year old modem that was going to 64k on the new network now wasn't. We'll give you a $100 rebate off a new $300-500 modem for having the eariler one, but we'll still charge you $80/month to use it.
"Thankfully" I still had my modem, speed, and price that I liked (28.8 was fine at $30/month). But no new such modems or accounts were offered. If anyone new wanted Ricochet, they needed to shell out huge cash for the 128k "service" which still had much less coverage then the 28.8.
They were bankrupt within a year.
Just as they went bankrupt (same month) they decide to "renew" my annual subscription for another $300 charge to my Wellsfargo credit card. Never mind that A) the service didn't exist anymore, B) I had canceled it, and C) that credit card account itself had been CANCELED over a YEAR previous. Wellsfargo still let them put a charge on it without question. They said I could "clearly dispute it and it would be no problem", but later said I had to first personally try to resolve it with the vender.
To this day I still get a creditor of the month trying to get me to pay that now $500 "dept" that Wellsfargo allowed to be placed by a bankrupt company onto a credit card acount that had been canceled for over a year.
Fuck Ricochet and Fuck Wellsfargo. Long live WiFi!!!!
Re:doubts (Score:2)
Again, long live WiFi!
Re:doubts (Score:2)
Also, you should send their collections department a copy of your final bill, and give them the company's phone number: generally, when you try and push some of the work back onto them, they will rather resolve it than actually do anything.
Re:doubts (Score:2)
You raise two questions in one sentence.
First, the billing needs to be very convenient. I shouldn't have to sign up before planning a trip to Paris, and then cancel afterwards, or deal with stupid minimum contracts. The bill should be attached some regular bill, the way GSM roaming charges your phone.
Secondly, the question is what the device you carry can replace. A really good electronic map,
Re:doubts (Score:3, Interesting)
I was looking from my perspective: Living in/near San Francisco for 8 years, I couldn't see this service being very useful to me. Sure, access to resturant reviews would be nice, but whenever I'm out with my friends, we can come up with plenty of recomendations without the aid of a computer. And I can pick up a free paper and flip to the resturant review section.
In the short term, I do not see many tourists using this service. For all their
Re:doubts (Score:3, Insightful)
Yes, but do you know if the restaurant you want can accommodate you? What if you get to pick a few restaurants, and tell your device to reserve a table for six at the restaurants you selected (in some priority) automatically? What if you get to download today's menu while your friend drives you all there? What if you can order your food en route?
For
Re:doubts (Score:2)
I would totally pay $30 a month to have my PDA/Cellphone/Camera have access to the net all the time.
As the previous poster said, it's not about laptops, they're for old men anyway.
Re:doubts (Score:2)
Mark my words, this little project will stifle competition, it will be mismanaged, and it will have no accounti
Re:doubts (Score:2)
Re:doubts (Score:4, Informative)
There are at least 10 million people who live and work circa 50km from the Eiffel Tower. If they can spend their 3-4 daily travel hours surfing the net or IRC-ing their f3ll0ws, then they'll find it easier.
hotspots ARE NOT FOR TRAINS (Score:2, Informative)
Bussiness subsrcibers (Score:2, Interesting)
http://www.nycwireless.net/
This is exactly what I was looking for as I'm going to Paris next week. There are lots of people wandering around the middle of town with laptops, sitting in the park with laptops. Of course you wouldn't be sitting outside with one in winter - however I don't really think that's the period they'd
Re:doubts (Score:2, Insightful)
On the other hand, UMTS technology could do that, and much more, but since it's so expensive and nothing is ready yet, there is an opportunity for an other technology to
Re:doubts (Score:1)
Sure, people of Paris have a house somewhere... with an average transportation time of 45mn! (and that's for the lucky people). You don't just go home when you want to check your email in Paris.
Also, I thought the next big thing was supposed to be PDAs. Sure there is GPRS, but with prices by the kb, I'd rather pay a (low) monthly fee and stay connected as much as I want to.
The thing is, putting a
Re:doubts (Score:2)
This is a greate acomplishment of Mairie de Paris, who has allready taken some other rrevolutionary (at leas or the french people) steps in the direction of a more modern city - better cleaning of the streets
Re:doubts (Score:2)
Re:doubts (Score:2)
You would walk around any US city at night because you have Tom Ridge and your guns protecting you? East St. Louis? Gary? You're braver than me.
-B
Re:doubts (Score:2)
Sorry, cheap shot.
How Much? (Score:4, Interesting)
-A.M.
First ones free kid.... (Score:3, Interesting)
MAybe if they went with 1$
Re:First ones free kid.... (Score:2)
Also, many Starbucks stores are in strip malls with their backs to residential neighborhoods... it'd be a nice way to save $10/month if you happened to live within 1,000 feet or so.
What I don't understand is why their prepaid service plan [t-mobile.com] ($50/300 minutes=$0.17/minute) costs more than their "pay-as-you-go" service plan ($0.10/minute). Am I missing somet
Re:First ones free kid.... (Score:2)
I live on Long Island, where there are many Starbucks around. Of all the ones I've been to, I could barely stand 5 feet outside of the store and get a connection. 1,000 feet definitely wouldn't make it. They're not trying to get a whole area, just their store.
Re:First ones free kid.... (Score:2)
JOhn
hmmmm, .10$ a minute (Score:2)
Wi-fi pilot launched at Paris Gare du Nord (Score:2, Informative)
The WiFi pilot at the Gare du Nord uses prepaid cards. The cheapest card costs 5 euros and provides 20 minutes of access [europemedia.net] (about US$5.65).
And the rest are pretty damn cheap (Score:2)
Wow, is it enough bandwidth? (Score:4, Insightful)
I don't think that 802.11 can handle more than a handful of users before it is swamped. I imagine that the city will be subdivided somehow so that broadcast traffic from one machine isn't repeated to every node in the city.
Re:Wow, is it enough bandwidth? (Score:2)
Does 802.11(b or g) enough bandwidth to handle that many people? Not that everyone has a WiFi connection, but when you provide ubiquitious access, the applications will be created that utilize it.
I don't think that 802.11 can handle more than a handful of users before it is swamped. I imagine that the city will be subdivided somehow so that broadcast traffic from one machine isn't repeated to every node in the city.
Well, at the IETF meetings (3 times a year), a Hilton hotel is normally wi-fi'ed
Re:Wow, is it enough bandwidth? (Score:3, Informative)
Uhh... (Score:2, Funny)
call it beer net. (Score:2)
France and encyption? (Score:4, Interesting)
Does that apply to wireless as well?
Anyone have more on this?
Re:France and encyption? (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:France and encyption? (Score:5, Informative)
Being connected all the time? (Score:2, Insightful)
I mean, don't even corporate execs need to get away from the World Wide Web a few minutes in the day, and just zone out while on the subway, or riding the bus?
Just because we can do it, doesn't mean it is a good idea. If Paris suffers a spike in crazy CEOs, then I say we call the trial a failure.
Re:Being connected all the time? (Score:1)
I love being connected, accessible, and everything else that goes with being online. My home is wireless, and my work is about to be. I see no need to unplug. Heck, I take my laptop with me on vaca
Re:Being connected all the time? (Score:1)
I think the problems people point out about being too connected stem from having to respond to urgent emails and the like. There's an easy solution...just don't respond until you want to. There's no difference between putting off getting the email and putting of r
Re:Being connected all the time? (Score:2)
Just because you have a connection doesn't mean you have to be using it actively. Computers are nice because they have a, what's the word for it? Oh yeah, OFF button.
Re:Being connected all the time? (Score:2)
My cellphone's always talking to a tower at some basic level... never creeps me out. Course I always turn my phone off when I get on an Interstate, and then I pull out the calculator and figure out how long I have to wait before turning it back on before they can't say I was speeding. Ironic that my cell has a calculator in it that I can't use cause I need the phone to be off. Oh well, my knees grip the wheel close enough, and the da
not always connected. (Score:2)
The naked ones are sane?
sign ups? (Score:2)
Re:sign ups? (Score:2)
ObJoke (Score:1, Redundant)
Not total coverage (Score:3, Interesting)
Now, if they mounted transmitters on each wireless tower or minitower or microtower, you'd have 100% coverage of the city.
Nevertheless, it is a good idea.
French wi-fi? (Score:1)
How would wifi really be used in an RATP station (Score:5, Interesting)
Just thinking about my work I've done in Paris.. there are many times the stations are simply swamped with people. Laptop wifi is just out of the question. Far too many people and no real area to sit down. Besides, you only have minutes in a subway stop before your train comes. Even with Hibernate, my W2K box takes a while to be ready for use.
That really only leaves handheld devices, like a trusty ole iPaq. But.. with anyone with an iPaq (or laptop for that matter) probably also carries a mobile telephone - probably with bluetooth.
So in the 5 minutes you've got in the subway station, why not just go to street-level, turn on your PDA, and connect via GPRS. The iPaq with bluetooth is fantastic for downloading and running a quick scan on your email.
Plus if you really want to sit down and check your mail or surf, then zip off to a Brasserie for a coffee too.
Gare du nord now has WiFi.. I spend many hours sitting there waiting for my trains. Hey that's a great idea - wire up the trains themselves with WiFi. A Thalys or TGV with WiFi access would rock.
Largest Wi-Fi antenna EVER. (Score:5, Funny)
The hard part is finding enough French people to eat the chips.
Re:Largest Wi-Fi antenna EVER. (Score:2)
Often I'd go to a corner store or a kiosk to buy a bag of potato chips, but NO! All they had was pringles, candy and a bunch of small canned herbal drinks like "Redbull". Personally, I thought the "sexual vitality" drinks that came with a condom were very amusing.
I ate more pringles during my 3 weeks in Europe then in the last 3 years in America!
Kettle chips... mmmm...
WiFi Icon = FRANCE (Score:5, Funny)
free wifi cities (Score:4, Interesting)
Here in State College, PA I usually eat at a locally owned coffee and bagel shop called Irvings or a large regional grocery chain called Wegmans. Both places offer free wifi, the local Starbucks doesn't even offer wifi and if it did you would need to pay ~$6/hr.. If two places are of equal quality, but one offers free access, where would you go?
It's a RAPT? (Score:1)
Missing poll option... (Score:1)
Gendarme! Gendarme! I'l n'ces pa a la Orinoco Gold carte de la searchimande!
2.4gHz?? Moi? Non, regardes CowboyNeal!Disclaimer - I have no idea what any of that means.
Ha Ha Ha (Score:2)
Re:Ha Ha Ha (Score:1)
Re:Ha Ha Ha (Score:3, Funny)
In French you would say
Moquez vous de nous tant que vous voulez, mais au moins nous on a une connection WiFi pour nos ordinateurs.
Sorry I didn't understand the last sentence !
Wi-Fi IN the Metro (Score:5, Interesting)
I live in Paris (I'm not french, my work sent me here), and I have to travel the full length of Line 1 each day. The trip from Chateau de Vincennes to La Defense each day is 45 minutes to an hour, and if I could make my laptop work for that time, that would cut my workday by nearly the same amount as my travel time. I've been waiting for them to do the same thing with the mobile phones. Right now, the phones work in some tunnels, and not in others.
It's true that all the cables and fiber run through the metro tunnels, that makes it easy to hook up any building with fiber, because nothing is very far from a a Metro station. Both Cable Internet and DSL here in Paris is available everywhere.
Re:Wi-Fi IN the Metro (Score:1)
Could you comment on how useable this would really be to you? Assuming you start at the beginning of the line you would have a seat, but how quickly does the train fill up and would you feel safe sitting there surfing the net and doing your work during rush hour?
Would you be concerned
Re:Wi-Fi IN the Metro (Score:4, Informative)
I would feel completely safe on line 1. It is all open between the cars. There are indeed some lines where I would feel uncomfortable with anything expensive, but Line 1 is really safe.
I wouldn't be too concenered with Corporate espionage really. I would obviously save anything really sensitive for when I arrived at the office, however, it is important to remember that there are always people reading over your shoulder. They aren't necesarily spying.. They are just bored.
So, in conclusion, yes, it's pretty safe, and it would work for me, but on other lines, (2 and 7 for example), I would be much more reluctant to try to do much real work.
Not the first city-wide 802.11 network, by far (Score:4, Informative)
From the bus38 link.. (Score:1)
Who did their translation, Babelfish?
I was trying to come up with (Score:3, Funny)
I'm willing to bet if enough
Tallinn already has something similar (Score:4, Interesting)
Slow down (Score:2, Funny)
I would think (Score:2)
Viva WiFi! (Score:3, Funny)
On Fridays substitute coffee with cheap red wine.
Wardriving in France (Score:1, Redundant)
The French are good at warsurrendering, though.
Atlanta receiving something similar (Score:4, Informative)
Their old site mentioned possibly rolling out in other cities, as well; unfortunately, the new site is less than informative.
Re:Hrm (Score:1, Offtopic)
Re:Hrm (Score:1, Troll)
Re:Hrm (Score:2)
It seems that overwhelming majority of my most-used software is from outside the USA.
Re:Hrm (Score:1, Offtopic)
Re:Hrm (Score:1, Offtopic)
Re:Preemptive strike (Score:1)
You forgot to mention that they play the accordion. Or is that covered by 'terrorism'?
Re:Who cares.. (Score:2)
Judging by the respect accorded to American war memorials in France, it seems that the French remember the cause of their sacrifice rather better than you do.
What should piss you off is that you've reached your age without realising the difference between fre