Stories
Slash Boxes
Comments
Search

News for nerds, stuff that matters

Slashdot Log In

Log In

Create Account  |  Retrieve Password

Electrically Conductive Plastic Polymer

Posted by ScuttleMonkey on Wed Mar 28, 2007 01:07 PM
from the shock-resistance dept.
Hardware Technology
AustinSlacker writes to mention Fox news is reporting that a Dutch researcher is announcing a breakthrough in plastics. A new way of rebuilding plastics could allow them to conduct electricity just as well as the silicon wafers currently used in electronic gadgets. "Prins discovered that in plastics, the movement of electric charges was mainly hindered by the shape of the polymer, the chain-like molecular structure [that is] the basis of each kind of plastic. Prins extended the work of a German group that had reshaped a polymer to form a ladder-like structures. By bombarding the specially developed plastic with electrons from a particle accelerator, she was able to study rapid electrical reactions and demonstrate the new plastic's ability to conduct electricity much better than regular plastic and as well as silicon chips."
+ -
story

Related Stories

[+] The Birth of Semiconductor 2.0 89 comments
Roland Piquepaille writes "According to several articles in the press, an Austrian company has opened a new chip printing factory. But there is a twist. The chips produced by this factory, dubbed Semiconductor 2.0 by the company, will be organic semiconductors, and will be produced by inkjet printers. According to the company, the new factory will be able to produce 40,000 square meters of semiconductors per year, mainly for the biotech, clean tech, and defense industries."
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.

Electrically Conductive Plastic Polymer 50 Comments More /

 Full
 Abbreviated
 Hidden
More
Loading... please wait.

  • let me know when copper is an insulator. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by swschrad (312009) on Wednesday March 28 2007, @01:13PM (#18518225) Homepage Journal
    conductive plastic actually has some uses, but being a larger molecule than molecular silicon or germanium, doesn't make it look like the next New Chip Substrate.

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by friedman101 (618627)
      A bigger barrier to entry might be that this conducting plastic cannot function as a semiconductor. Lots of materials conduct electricity, lots insulate, few can do both.
      • While it's used to make semi-conductors, silicon on its own can't conduct at normal (human) working temperatures. Due to its negative temperature coefficient of resistance it will be able to effectively conduct at temperatures over roughly 1200C, but not at room temperature. You need to highly purify and dope the silicon in order to get it to produce semi-conductors that function at 'normal' working temperatures (which I don't think include 4 digit temperatures ;-) ). So maybe depending on what they do t
        • we already have tunnelling effects in present transistors in ICs, and this is being exploited. you get a long plastic molecule doped up for semiconduction, assuming the material is suitable for it, assuming the regions don't migrate under the ion bombardment, and it's bound to be leaky as a soaker hose in the garden.

          not ideal for controlling electron flow.

      • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

        by DRAGONWEEZEL (125809)
        Except that you can layer plastics easily, create meshes like cloth, and for instance your horizontil strands could be electrical while your vertical fibers could be of a non conducting polymer, like POLYESTER or something.
    • Maybe not for next desktop CPU, but simpler circuits don't really need the smallest possible transistors. It might have other charasteristics that make it worthwhile. And don't forget plastic, wearable solar cells might become a reality with this, too.

      PS: Just be careful not to get electrocuted by your t-shirt (don't worry, I don't see a market for solar-powered underwear).

      • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

        by d0rp (888607)

        PS: Just be careful not to get electrocuted by your t-shirt (don't worry, I don't see a market for solar-powered underwear).
        What about solar-powered swimsuits?

        • What about solar-powered swimsuits?


          Is that your carbon offset or are you just happy to see me?

        • What about solar-powered swimsuits?
          With a propellor it would be cool! But it's very dangerous if you put it on backwards, and you see a beautiful lady; you might suddenly hear a chopping sound.

  • The real benefit is things renewed potential for things like sensors, and smart clothing.

    Maybe it will make short but wide networks possible, who knows.

    I think mostly though, that it could be used to replace the small electronic devices that get used everyday that you don't think of from a techies perspective. Automotive pieces certain types of switches, small controllers, toys, medical devices, spoilage detectors for food/ food processing etc. These would be the key industries I can think of off the bat

  • As conductive as silicon? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by kmac06 (608921) on Wednesday March 28 2007, @01:22PM (#18518347)
    Silicon is not a good conductor. The advantage it can be doped to make it as good of a conductor as necessary (which also allows you to make transistors out of it). I doubt this plastic can be doped...

    Also, why not run a test current through it to measure the conductivity instead of using an accelerator?

    • Also, why not run a test current through it to measure the conductivity instead of using an accelerator?

      Because it's less fun?

    • duh (Score:5, Funny)

      by Bill, Shooter of Bul (629286) on Wednesday March 28 2007, @01:43PM (#18518637) Journal
      If you had a choice between using a particle accelerator or a power supply, which would you use?

      I hope to convince my office to move to the grounds of fermi lab, so I can have the choice as well.

      Just have to remember to switch to conventional power supply before they start the experiments with anti matter.
    • ... why not run a test current through it to measure the conductivity instead of using an accelerator?

      She did.

      But hooking up molecule-sized test prods to an ohmmeter was a pain.

      So she used a particle accelerator to inject the electrons. (TFA doesn't say what else she used to measure the current.)

      I've contemplated using scanning electron beams for electrical measurements. Say: a low-energy electron beam for the negative supply, a high-energy one (creating more secondary electrons than injected electrons) f

  • Computer of the future is near (Score:5, Funny)

    by Jtheletter (686279) on Wednesday March 28 2007, @01:25PM (#18518389)
    Ok, so in the last couple years or so we've seen the devlopment of: 1) electrically conductive plastics 2) transparent (when off) OLED-based displays, 3) transparent plastic-based circuits, 4) clear plastic-based batteries, 5) multitouch input capability, and 6) light-based data transfer methods and holographic data storage.

    Within 10 years I hope to see all of these technologies combined into a geek fantasy device: a clear plastic tablet computer about the size of a pad of paper. Not to mention the hojillion other applications that suddenly become possible when you can embed a complete computer with I/O in a transparent medium: HUDs for glasses, store windows that are also dynamic advertising surfaces, image processing and data overlay on windshields (e.g. thermal or IR image data to augment the scene in poor visibility), etc.
    I especially like the plastic battery concept since in theory you could make certain structural elements also function as you battery so there is no need for a bulky power source attached to the device, this would work well for the glasses display - the frames themselves could be the battery and/or processor. Although we'd definitely want to make sure there aren't any exploding battery incidents like with recent laptops.

    • Re:Computer of the future is near (Score:5, Funny)

      by stratjakt (596332) on Wednesday March 28 2007, @01:29PM (#18518475) Journal
      Within 10 years I hope to see all of these technologies combined into a geek fantasy device: a clear plastic tablet computer about the size of a pad of paper.

      Speak for yourself.

      My fantasy device allows me to seduce any supermodel of my choosing, has rocket engines so it can fly, and 20 dollar bills come out the exhaust. It is also made of solid space gold (its not heavy) and the horn plays dixie and it sounds AWESOME!

      That or an iPod.
    • Within 10 years I hope to see all of these technologies combined into a geek fantasy device

      I'm personally not acknowledging any future until suicide booths and underwear commercials beamed directly in my dreams.
      • Are the suicide booths for the folks upset after having crufty Y front adverts subliminally beamed into their head overnight?

    • image processing and data overlay on windshields (e.g. thermal or IR image data to augment the scene in poor visibility)

      So the future of computing will be just like The Knight 4000 from Knight Rider 2000 [wikipedia.org]?

      Let me be the first to say: Too cool.

      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        by peragrin (659227)
        You do realize mercedes and BMW are already testing that tech. http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/print/3043 [ieee.org]

        new Mercedes have a short range radar built into the cruise control. So if you come up behind a car moving slower than yourself it taps the brakes to slow you down to the speed of a car in front of you. it's not perfect if the vechicle is moving to slow or not moving you will sill hit it, but it does work say comingup on someone doing 50 while your doing 70.

        In the 1970's Mercedes where one of the first co
      • "...store windows that are also dynamic advertising surfaces"
        Sounds wonderful *koff*koff*

        I don't see why it wouldn't be. Right now store windows are *already* used for advertising, except that it involves printing new displays constantly on paper mediums and using tons of ink as well. It uses a lot of resources and generates a lot of waste that can't really be reused by the store. Sure, a video display will use energy so there's still enviromental costs involved at some level but the savings to the st

  • Original release (Score:3, Insightful)

    by mattr (78516) <mattr@t[ ]body.com ['ele' in gap]> on Wednesday March 28 2007, @01:26PM (#18518421) Homepage Journal
    Waging the good fight against dumbed-down science and research by press release, your masked hero finds.. this.

    Mobile phones can soon survive being dropped [www.nwo.nl]

    Good because you cannot get a patent after publication? Or bad because.. oh phooey. This might be by the same person.

    * In unrelated news is anyone going to be at ETC2007 [iastate.edu]? Neal Stephenson talk and a new hires cave called C6 by Iowa State! Someone video the thing!

    • The "this" link was slartibartifast. Here [bioinfo.pl] it is. plastic wire research. Anyway I don't know why the PR has to say phones will survive being dropped.. just put rubber in them! Jeez.
    • Oooh sweet!! Do you have to be a student? I'm only a hop skip and jump away from isu!
      • My folks just got me a video ipod. I think I can feel the hard drive trying to precess when I play video while walking. It scares me. Also very dangerous, as it messes with your peripheral vision.

  • Neat! (Score:3, Interesting)

    by drewzhrodague (606182) <drew AT zhrodague DOT net> on Wednesday March 28 2007, @01:27PM (#18518437) Homepage Journal
    That's neat! How long until we can print circuits with something like an ink-jet?

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by eheldreth (751767)
      Xerox PARC has had that tech for years now(since like 2002 or 2003) and a company named T-Ink is working with major company's producing everything from fisher price play sets to McDonald's place mats and even inflatable radios.' Click on the partners tab: T-Ink [t-ink.com]

  • Possible use in solar cells? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday March 28 2007, @01:29PM (#18518473)
    If this type of plastic can be a conductive substance similar to silicon and costs less to produce, then this could be a huge advantage to those advocating the use of solar power. Currently one of the largest costs in creating solar cells is the high price for silicon which is used in them. The use of a cheap plastic polymer with properties similar to silicon might make solar cells much more reasonable to purchase for a lot of people.
    • Polymer solar cells have already been made, there are some efficiency issues but they are incredibly cheap. The problem with them is that they disintegrate very quickly. As far as I understood, this was the real problem with conducting polymers of all sorts (the thiophenes, etc.) as far as I know. Anyone know the current status of this?

      • Polymer solar cells have already been made, there are some efficiency issues but they are incredibly cheap. The problem with them is that they disintegrate very quickly. As far as I understood, this was the real problem with conducting polymers of all sorts (the thiophenes, etc.) as far as I know. Anyone know the current status of this?

        There's been a little progress -- within the last year somebody announced that he developed a polymer solar cell that might be able to last 5 years in the field. I don't

  • http://www.docinthemachine.com/ [docinthemachine.com] reported in January on the development of a product called Electriplast that is a resin based electrically conductive plastic- and that is commercially available. I believe it has potential in the medical device market as well as consumer electronics. You can read more about the product at : http://docinthemachine.com/2007/01/08/electriplast / [docinthemachine.com] "Electriplast is a highly conductive recipe that can be molded into virtually any shape or dimension associated with the range of p
    • from conductive plastic, and NASA had it for whatever on earth for in the 60s.

      merely conductive plastic is easy to do, dump a bunch of carbon into the vat. somebody probably came up with it in the lab in the 30s or 40s, took it panting to their supervisor, who promptly said, "so what the hell can I do with conductive.... plastic insulation? Perkins, you need to take Friday off."
  • If it is only partially conductive, the ESD (Electro-Static Discharge) properties would get my attention (safe discharge paths for cheap). And if it could shield the circuits from emissions and susceptibility, it would be a winner in my book.

  • Oh good (Score:3, Insightful)

    by ObligatoryUserName (126027) on Wednesday March 28 2007, @02:07PM (#18518969) Journal
    I don't think we had enough uses for oil yet.

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by ductonius (705942)
      Strong, flexible plastics replaced metal for many products because plastic is much cheaper to produce. I would wager that conductive plastics would actually decrease the use of oil by generally reducing the amount of resources it takes to produce an electronic product.

      The amount of fuel unused in mining and refining of aluminum and copper would probably cover the increased use of natural gas by electronic manufacturers.

      We may think of oil as expensive, but plastic is still cheaper than metal and has a small
  • Insert snide male chauvinist remarks here. For extra points mention plastic and conductivity.
    By the way, she's not bad looking at all, picture (and phone number!) here: http://www.tudelft.nl/live/pagina.jsp?id=40a4cfdf- 683e-4db7-9675-c5c57399329c&la [tudelft.nl]
  • News flash: silicon isn't a conductor -- it's a semiconductor. Conductive polymers already exist. This is comparable to announcing that the latest Camaro is faster than a Model T, or that a new digital computing device can perform a million floating-point operations per second.

  • So I get the sensation that just like everywhere else on Slashdot, a lot of people are out of their depth when it comes to this topic. For some background, might I suggest reading about the work of the three men who shared the Nobel Prize in Chemistry in 2000 for their work in conductive polymers [nobelprize.org]. These materials are incredible in a myriad of ways, but require a nontrivial understanding of materials to really get it.
  • Electrically conductive polymer leads to muscle-type plastic strads, which OBVIOUSLY in turn leads to the development of Battlemechs. So, when can I place my order for a Jenner, or maybe a nice big Battlemaster?
  • Does that mean chips are going to get just as shabby as everything else we've invented in glass, and turned into cheapo plastic versions?

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by apocalysque (538221)
      actually, polymers are inherently more flexible than other plastics. this may actually make some products more durable. think of it this way: glass = silicon, rubber = polymer. which one breaks easier?

      this misses the point entirely though, the main advantage is that the manufacturing process would be theoretically less expensive. much of the cost and difficulty with silicon chips today is involved with the manufacture/conditioning of the silicon wafers. plastics are very cheap these days.
    • The bad news is that future electronics will be even flimsier than they currently are

      actually, this would make them more durable. if I'm reading this correctly, you could practically bend a motherboard in half and it would still work fine.

      though i tend to see the components on a board break (or break off) more often than the board itself, so it may be a moot point.
        • Motherboards are not made of polymers or silicon. They're made of PCB which is made from substrate

          make the PCB out of a flexible substrate and electrically conductive polymer, rather than a rigid substrate and copper (or whatever metal(s) they're using).

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Anonymous Coward
        Why dont you take a look at how silicon wafers for microchip production, and how solar panels are produced, and just how environmentally hostile it is.

        Or just bloviate with your 8th grade knowledge of science.

        Carbon and Oxygen are everywhere too! Why all the crying about CO2 in the atmostphere?
        • But your point is that it's not the silicon itself that's unfriendly, it's the manufacturing process. It's one thing to change the transistor material, and quite another to eliminate the need for photolithography.

          I don't know if that's quite the point the GP was making, but it's certainly a sensible one.
    • by measuring the microwave absorption ... This avoided the need to use electrodes. Such electrodes often disrupt the measurement.

      According to This [www.nwo.nl] article they avoided standard meters to gain better measurements.

All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective owners. Comments are owned by the Poster. The Rest © 1997-2009 Geeknet, Inc.