HP Escapes Customer Payouts in Printer-Bricking Lawsuit Settlement (arstechnica.com) 40
A United States District Court judge has approved a settlement between HP and customers who sued the company for firmware updates that prevented printers from working with non-HP ink cartridges.
The class-action lawsuit, filed in December 2020, alleged HP "wrongfully compels users" to buy only HP ink by issuing updates that block competitors' cartridges. Under the settlement, HP admits no wrongdoing and won't pay monetary damages to affected customers, though it will pay $5,000 each to the three plaintiffs and $725,000 in attorneys' fees.
HP has agreed to allow users of specific printer models impacted by the November 2020 update to decline firmware updates containing "Dynamic Security" features -- HP's term for technology that blocks cartridges using non-HP chips. The settlement applies only to 21 specific printer models, leaving numerous other HP printers subject to Dynamic Security restrictions. HP has previously paid millions in similar cases in Europe, Australia, and California related to printer bricking.
The class-action lawsuit, filed in December 2020, alleged HP "wrongfully compels users" to buy only HP ink by issuing updates that block competitors' cartridges. Under the settlement, HP admits no wrongdoing and won't pay monetary damages to affected customers, though it will pay $5,000 each to the three plaintiffs and $725,000 in attorneys' fees.
HP has agreed to allow users of specific printer models impacted by the November 2020 update to decline firmware updates containing "Dynamic Security" features -- HP's term for technology that blocks cartridges using non-HP chips. The settlement applies only to 21 specific printer models, leaving numerous other HP printers subject to Dynamic Security restrictions. HP has previously paid millions in similar cases in Europe, Australia, and California related to printer bricking.
Broken system (Score:5, Insightful)
This is precisely why the guillotine was invented.
some of the attorneys' fees covers HP ink used so (Score:4, Funny)
some of the attorneys' fees covers HP ink used so they get some rebate
Re:Broken system (Score:5, Funny)
$5,000 each to the three plaintiffs and $725,000 in attorneys' fees.
To be (marginally) fair, the attorneys did most of the work, but I do think that people negatively affected should be compensated somehow *and* usefully for their injury/inconvenience -- meaning more than, for example. just a discount coupon for HP ink.
This is precisely why the guillotine was invented.
Which, obviously, won't work with third-part blades ... :-)
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Which, obviously, won't work with third-part blades
Tou feckin' che!
Fuck lawyers even more than fuck HP.
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$5,000 each to the three plaintiffs and $725,000 in attorneys' fees.
To be (marginally) fair, the attorneys did most of the work, but I do think that people negatively affected should be compensated somehow *and* usefully for their injury/inconvenience -- meaning more than, for example. just a discount coupon for HP ink.
Is this legal? That is, can class members basically get nothing in exchange for giving up their future rights to sue? This seems like an easy case to appeal.
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The class is represented by the lawyers and the people who brought the suit. You aren't automatically part of a class suit until you register to be part of that class. If you got screwed and weren't involved or registered in this suit you haven't lost the right to sue. The three plaintiffs however have.
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You aren't automatically part of a class suit until you register to be part of that class.
This is false. The 5k paid to the plantiffs is not even compensation for damages it's "for the services they performed on behalf of the classes."
The class is generally pretty broad, and class settlements are usually opt-out not opt-in, as in you're automatically brought in: no need to "register". The Judge is supposed to reject a settlement if it is clearly not appropriate or in the interest of class members.
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'To be (marginally) fair, the attorneys did most of the work, '
Well, that is the nature of lawsuits in most (certainly our) legal systems. A quaint little distinction.
Re:Broken system (Score:4, Insightful)
Or really this is where we should have Congress and/or the FTC or CFPB (when it existed) to say legally "You can't pull this shit on people, not HP, not anyone. Customers can use whatever ink they want. Knockoffs exist? Oh I heard something about the worlds tiniest violin"
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[...]we should have Congress and/or the FTC or CFPB (when it existed) to say legally "You can't pull this shit on people [...]"
I have full confidence that the Congress is concerned about the ink problem, and will act quickly to issue appropriate measures: henceforward black ink will be referred to as "DEI ink".
Re:Broken system (Score:4, Insightful)
$725K for attorney's fees is quite low, actually. Over 5 years, that's 145K/year. It's barely enough money for 1 attorney's salary, nevermind the other costs required. Probably half an attorney at most and the rest went into fees and other stuff needed to run the office.
Chances are with such a low settlement (other than HP must unlock the firmware again), the attorney ran out of money and basically settled for cheap because they couldn't afford to litigate anymore.
Class actions are expensive, and you don't get paid unless you win, so any loss on a small firm basically means having to settle for less.
It's generally why there are firms more specialized in class actions like EKSM (of which AttorneyTom is someone you may recognize - he's a partner) which have the resources and ability to litigate all the way to the end.
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Let's consider this more carefully.
If the point of a lawsuit is to change behavior, then overwhelming legal fees are tolerable, so long as the behavior stays changed.
But if there is an intention to compensate victims for losses or damages, then letting legal fees absorb more than 50% of the award is, well, plain wrong.
One possible solution - Require that legal fees establish the overall award. For instance, set legal fees to 25% of the total award. In this 'HP ink' instance, that would make the award $2.5 m
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We inch ever closer to the day. [politico.com]
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We inch ever closer to the day. [politico.com]
Thanks for this. If I had mod points I'd pop you an informative. Rare to read one of the elite actually visiting reality a bit with one of their diatribes. This dude gets it. Too bad most of the rest of the uber-rich are convinced the only way forward is to pound down the middle class.
Re:Broken syste (Score:2)
Do other customers honestly lose their right to sue if they get nothing? I thought you could only legally give things up in exchange for consideration. What if you do not have one of the 21 printers, are you still barred from suing in the future?
On second thought, do not answer. I do not think I want to know.
Remember, they just put a guy in jail because he sabotaged his ex-employers equipment. The corporations, on the other hand, profit. Here again is the completely two tiered justice system. No wond
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How is this a class action? They ONLY made it right for 3 parties in the class, and they're paying those 3 a miniscule fraction of the settlement. What judge approved this?? They should be removed from the bench.
Excluding yourself? (Score:2)
What possible rational reason could any reasonable person have to not exclude themselves from this settlement?
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The primary reason would be to reserve the right to sue yourself, as opposed to being a member of the class. (At least I think that's right, IANAL.)
Class action suits are total bullshit, the only people who benefit are the plaintiff attorneys. The one I was most recently involved with paid 1/3 of the settlement to the plaintiff law firm, about $1.3m. And that's "reasonable and customary". So now you know why there are so many class action lawsuits, particularly against big tech. If you're the law firm
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The primary reason would be to reserve the right to sue yourself, as opposed to being a member of the class. (At least I think that's right, IANAL.)
Also my understanding, but also IANAL.
Class action suits are total bullshit, the only people who benefit are the plaintiff attorneys.
Not true, the defendant's attorneys get paid too. :-)
More seriously, I think the main purpose to class-action suits is to punish the defendant and the number of people in the class give that some weight, legally and financially. Unfortunately, that means the payout to those in the "class" are usually trivial -- X dollars / Y people = next to nothing.
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If the plaintiff lawyers got expenses plus reasonable fees, that would be one thing. But to get 1/3 of the award, that's not an incentive for 'advocacy', but an incentive to 'go for the lottery win.'
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And, as a previous poster already mentioned, the purpose isn't to get thousands of dollars for each member of the class, it's to punish
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I know that's the justification. But the -percentage awards to law firms- (as opposed to a 'cost plus' approach) is what I find truly objectionable.
Consider: There's a $4m settlement. The lawyers spent $200k (billable hours, etc). But they get 1/3, so $1.3m dollars. Why? (Those numbers are from a recent class action I was involved with. And I'm being -generous- with the $200k expenses figure, the lawyers actually documented only $50k, which they added to the $4m of "damages.") As another class actio
Crime pays (Score:5, Insightful)
They earned millions by anti-competitive practices over 5 years and all they need to pay now is 740k. They'll just write it off their tax bill and laugh.
How about Epson? (Score:3)
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Did you sue them? Why not? The legal system is one of specific complaints against specific entities. What about Epson? Nothing about Epson, not until *YOU* or someone else affected does something about Epson.
Its really ok (Score:5, Insightful)
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Never buy HP
Because good people don't buy from scumbags.
Re:Its really ok (Score:5, Interesting)
Knowing what I know about HP products, I will also never buy another one. It's a carcass of what was once a great company.
Brother laser printer for me. I had three HP printers and they all failed. No thanks.
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You must be young that you only associate the HP of the past as a "printer company."
Hint: They designed the first electronic scientific calculator. Steve Wozniak designed the Apple I while working there. Aligent is an HP spinoff. They were, indeed, once a great company.
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I wouldn't go that far. I mean just the other day they were having massive discounts on their HyperX product line. Not only that we also had a code for a 50EUR off the purchase. Not only that... they offered free shipping. Not only that... they never checked if the code was used more than once. I'm a perfectly happy HP customer getting their $120 mouse for $25, and their $150 headset for $30, and their $110 keyboard for $10. It was a pain putting through a separate order for each item bought though.
HP squared (Score:2)
Hate Payouts, Hate People
Stop Subsidizing (Score:3)
They don't make them like... (Score:2)
I get it about landfill waste but how long is an inkjet printer supposed to last, 5 years, 7 years, 10 years?
An aside, mine's 30 and is still used weekly. I'd was willing to/did pay Epson top dollar for their inks and cleaning sheets (epson.com) because I was so pleased with the printer's longevity, but they eventually stopped selling those. So I cross my fingers and buy long-expired NOS inks from eBay now.
Weasel Wiggle Room Gotcha (Score:2)
We see what you did there.
Just change the model numbers and rebrand it as a 2D-printer or something.
HP Bricks MFP M232-M237 Feb 9, 2025 (Score:1)