Brother Denies Bricking Printers Using Third-Party Ink (arstechnica.com) 59
Brother has rejected claims that its firmware updates intentionally disable printer functionality when third-party cartridges are installed. The controversy emerged after a YouTube video by Louis Rossman, which has garnered over 160,000 views, alleged the company had joined competitors in anti-consumer practices. The allegations stem from online reports, including a 2022 Reddit post claiming firmware update W1.56 disabled automatic color registration on a Brother MFC-3750 using non-Brother toner, rendering it "effectively non-functional."
In a statement to Ars Technica, Brother explicitly denied these accusations: "Please be assured that Brother firmware updates do not block the use of third-party ink in our machines." The company said it recommends genuine supplies for "optimal performance" and performs a "Brother Genuine check" during troubleshooting, which may have caused "misunderstanding."
In a statement to Ars Technica, Brother explicitly denied these accusations: "Please be assured that Brother firmware updates do not block the use of third-party ink in our machines." The company said it recommends genuine supplies for "optimal performance" and performs a "Brother Genuine check" during troubleshooting, which may have caused "misunderstanding."
experience? (Score:2)
I'm sure a fair number of slashdot readers have Brother printers. Anyone actually experience Brother printers refusing to use 3rd party ink?
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have one that reports toner low all the time with 3rd party ink
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To be fair that could be the generic toner manufacturer screwing up something on the little smart interface. But I doubt Brother makes it easy for them to figure it out in the first place.
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Toner, or ink?
There's a bit of difference, you know.
Re:experience? (Score:5, Interesting)
And, if you trace back from the report which created all this brouhaha, it links to sources three years old (on Reddit no less, FWIW). Where are all the other complaints over the past three years? And Tom's Hardware ignorantly said it was due to "recent firmware updates." Just attention seekers crying about the sky falling.
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Cartridge, ink, toner, all words that are interchangeable. Unless you are pedantic.
So, same question, Have you had a Brother printer reject 3rd party toner? Probably not.
We all had an empirical answer the first time we read about it.
Re:experience? (Score:5, Funny)
Don't be pedantic, go ahead and put diesel in your gas tank.
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Or ink in his laser printer. I'd pay to watch that.
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You are a fucking genius, no?
https://www.utilitysmarts.com/... [utilitysmarts.com]
Just like a diesel nozzle won't fit in a gasoline tank, those inkjet cartridges won't fit in a laser printer (or the other way around). So again, your point is moot unless you are being a pedantic asshole.
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You are a fucking genius, no?
https://www.utilitysmarts.com/... [utilitysmarts.com]
Just like a diesel nozzle won't fit in a gasoline tank, those inkjet cartridges won't fit in a laser printer (or the other way around). So again, your point is moot unless you are being a pedantic asshole.
Why would you be stopped by that? If first party ability to fit two pieces together stopped anyone from doing anything we wouldn't have after market ink at all. You absolute can get diesel into a gasoline tank, just use some creativity.
Incidentally I had an ink refill system for a printer a long while back which involved drilling holes in the top of the ink tank and filling them with a syringe. Put some effort in man.
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Putting diesel in your gas tank isn't an example of one being pedantic. Having to put every paperclip facing the same direction in a stack of papers, is.
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Pedantic is pointing out that putting all the paperclips in the same order is more akin to obsessive compulsive disorder, rather than pedanticism, which is a tendency to point out nearly trivial information in a precise manner.
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Well laser toner is closer to a dry powder than inkjet wet ink. I dont know that I would call it interchangeable. The inkjet cartridges have print heads often part of the components where laser works differently. Its more common for injet assholes to restrict their overpriced cartridges than the laser products. Shit the old HP Laserjet 4 or IBM 4019 are still a decent machine that lasts and lasts.
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Well, yes, but you're not explaining things everyone doesn't know. Nor did anyone misunderstand what the poster meant when he said "ink".
After years of fighting a losing battle for greater semantic precision in the face of the uncaring masses, I've come to think of a newly of a newly minted word like a nice new wood chisel. You put it in the common lexical toolbox thinking, "This'll come in handy some day." And when the day comes when you need to cut a mortise and tenon, you open the toolbox and find tha
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Its more common for injet assholes to restrict their overpriced cartridges than the laser products
I believe that's because the Inkjet carts typically had a printhead integrated into the cart making the consumable an electronic module requiring intelligence, And laser cartridges were just a dumb bin of toner with a purely mechanical system for applying toner to a roller. Much easier/more justifiable without creating extra costs for an electrically connected module the printer already has to communicate
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Cartridge, ink, toner....
Cartridge - A container that fits into something else.
ink - A liquid with extreme color
toner - a dark powder that sticks to everything especially when heated
Words have meaning. Being pedantic is what every person that comes to slashdot, comes to do their bestest at.
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See the title of this article.
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Exactly, the title says Brother released a statement about ink and Brother's statement talks about ink. What was your point again?
msauve's point was that complaint against Brother is about toner and Brother didn't mention toner in it's press release, which from the summary is true. That's a classic corporate and political misdirection that very commonly used. Someone makes a complaint against you (or asks a question you don't want to answer), then you respond with a different but related topic to make yo
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The three are not all interchangeable. Putting 3rd party liquid ink through a printer that runs on dry toner would definitely ruin the printer; just as much as a printer that takes wet ink can't run on Dry toner, LOL.
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Just attention seekers crying about the sky falling.
Or somebody that sold Brother stock short.
Re:experience? (Score:5, Interesting)
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My experience has always been that while HP or Canon make computer equipment, Brother makes office equipment. It's a different philosophy, and far more consumer friendly.
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Re: experience? (Score:2)
I have 2 and yeah, they're great. If Brother is actually doing this, it's a massive shot in the foot; took off the whole leg.
The great thing about Brother is they haven't enshittified their product.
So far.
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I do but we don't print that much, even being several years old it's still on its original toner cartridge - so no third party shit.
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I'm sure a fair number of slashdot readers have Brother printers. Anyone actually experience Brother printers refusing to use 3rd party ink?
I have two older Brother color laser printers that work just fine with 3rd party toner. Which is why I bought them. I will not be updating the firmware.
I also have an HP4200 that does not work with aftermarket toner. I don't know if it's DRM or just bad cartridges. I tried several different brands.
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Anecdotal evidence in my CDW-3170HL (color laser printer, about 12 years old - unfortunately not manufactured anymore because it's a very good one): no. I have been using third-party toner sets in it for years without any problems.
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I own a Brother color laser printer using third party toner. It's working just fine. The article claiming otherwise by Rossman is false.
Glad to hear it's not intentional (Score:2, Flamebait)
Then again I've never had to actually deal with sourcing parts since that's always just been done for me by local IT so maybe that's the
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They are positioned as business printers, shops don't put them with the consumer stuff. Consumers want crap like "photo enhancement" that pushes them towards being exploited.
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I don't understand why you would buy any other printer besides a brother unless ...
I've had an HP Color LaserJet MFP M477fdw [hp.com] since July 2017 and it works great. I considered the Brother 9330CDW [brother-usa.com] that a friend has but it wouldn't fit in the space I have for it. I'm using high-yield HP toner cartridges and haven't had any problems. If I were to get an Inkjet printer, I'd probably consider one of those EcoTank models from Epson, that another friend has.
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We bought an HP LaserJet 1100 in 2001. The only reason we aren't still using it is because it came apart. All plastics failed. the thing just crumbled apart. But man it was a fantastic printer.
Sure, parallel port only. But the thing even had PostScript (IIRC). Or maybe it wasn't PostScript but something similar - i remember it had FONTS and you could cat a text file with commands and have it print in different fonts (ok, yes, my LX-810 already did that in the 80s, but 2001 was the era when we were dumbing d
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I was upset when I read the article saying they block third party ink. So I am happy to at least hear this refutation. But I wonder....
1. Was the accusation simply false?
2. Did maybe something else go wrong and Rossman assumed it was the firmware update?
3. Maybe the firmware update DID block the third party ink, but it was accidental, and due to the third party having done something wrong that wasn't a problem before.
4. Maybe the update intentionally blocked the specific third party ink that was on the ma
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I have a newer Brother HL-L2390DW, and I can confirm that they have taken measures to prevent the use of 3rd party ink. They just are not as good at blocking it yet. (and while I was dealing with issues, they admitted they block 3rd party ink) It was a game for me to get ink other than their really expensive stuff to work.
Again, they are not as good, and now they are getting heat about it appear to be back pedaling on enforcing only their ink.
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I do volunteer "IT Stuff" for a community center near my home. This includes helping high school age kids through CompTIA A+ certification. There's even a grant to pay for exams for a few kids every year, which is honestly a big deal since the exams themselves are very expensive. I also do a Help Clinic a couple times a month that is primarily geared toward cleaning off malware, doing data transfers and counseling people interested in buying something new.
HP has absolutely staggering mindshare in relation t
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No kickbacks needed. Anything that provides a profitable revenue stream for the manufacturer does so for the retailer, as well.
I expect there's a difference in marketing approaches, as well.
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There are better printers out there than Brother. Oki, for example. HP is not one of those better ones though.
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Modded flamebait, really? Come on mods you can do better. Most of you on slashdot regularly promote Brother around here and decry HP, Lexmark, Epson for their shady practices. Now we know that folks are mistaken about Brother locking out third-party toner we can go on with life.
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Still it doesn't explain why brother printers aren't the dominant ones in the consumer space.
Ever heard of marketing? I could count the number of times I've seen a Brother advert on a double amputee's fingers. Despite HP's decades of efforts they still have a brand name in the consumer space.
"Intentionally" (Score:2)
Brother has rejected claims that its firmware updates intentionally disable printer functionality when third-party cartridges are installed.
Mistakes happen. No one bats 1,000 ... or so we've heard.
My experience with 3rd party ink has been poor (Score:2)
More than once I have tried 3rd party ink in an Epson printer. In no time at all the print heads get clogged and I can't get them cleared no matter how many times I run the clean cycle. So the "cheap ink" ends up costing me more in the end.
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Not my experience. Our 1430W printed and printed and printed for almost 10 years with bulk ink from bottles (i had a continuous ink system). We'd be printing 2-3 A3+ pages, photo quality every day.
Heads finally died catastrophically.
We recently replaced it with a newer model with the EcoTank system (basically a factory continuous ink system). It's much faster too. The ink is reasonably priced but of course, bulk ink is much cheaper. We'll see what sort of ink we'll be installing after the factory bottles ru
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The article is about TONER, not ink.
Laser printers, not inkjet printers.
Hold your horses (Score:5, Interesting)
Tried 3rd party - itâ(TM)s awful (Score:2)
I am sure there are good vendors, and then a whole bunch of baddies who sell the bare minimum quality-wise. I just donâ(TM)t have the time or inclination to figure it out. I pay the Brother âtax.â(TM)
But you know what? I have been very satisfied with my Brother laser printer and I also have a few other pieces of Brother kit. They seem to know what business they are in. I donâ(TM)t mind spending for retail toner. I donâ(TM)t print that much, so my cartridges last a year or so.
HP,
Spoiling the party (Score:4, Funny)
But the other article spurred so many indignation comments. Where are those people supposed to direct their outrage now?
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There will be a new issue tomorrow. You know there will. And it will be just as stupid and incorrect. It that won't matter at all, because for outrage monkeys, it's not about the subject matter, it's about being outraged. If you put them in total isolation from all possible negative things, they'd be outraged that there's nothing to be outraged over.
It's an addiction, like any other.
I learned my lesson on third-party toner (Score:3)
Was having problems on my laserjet. Talked to the printer guy in my friend group. He asked if I was using third-party toner. I said yes. He told me to try the proper toner. I did, and the printer was back to solid-black areas actually being solid black. Turns out most of your third-party and reman cartridges are using generic toner that doesn't meet any specific requirements, and that toner-based printers are designed around the specific properties of the toner the manufacturer chose to use. Anything that doesn't meet those properties will at best make your prints look terrible.
It sucks having to pay $50 to $100 more per toner cartridge, but I tend to use expensive paper, so the added toner cost is the least of my concern.
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That matches what 2 different printer repair guys told me.
I tried a set of 3rd party toner cartridges in my Brother all-in-1. They worked fine, color quality was good. I notice, though, the link to the 3rd party cartridges I got on Amazon no longer works. If Brother continues to allow 3rd party toner cartridges, I'll be OK buying either OEM or 3rd party.
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I mean, if it looks fine to you, use it. I'm all for saving money if it works. Just something to keep in mind if your printouts look bad and you need something to try. In my case, the bad toner cartridge ended up costing me more money in the long run because I got about 50 pages out of a $100 cartridge. I think I would have rather burned a hundred dollar bill, because at least I could have recorded it and posted it online for likes and subscribes.
Only a few reports, years old (Score:3)
Ars went into more details but it appears it was a few reports made a few years ago on Reddit is the source. While the news article that reported it first seemed to imply it was something happening.
The truth is simple - surely on a 3 year old printer, there has to be more than 3 reports of this happening. I mean, YouTube is usually full of people demonstrating things like this the moment it happens. So there's got to be more than a few reports of it, especially in the few days since the article.
Unless it happens to be a printer Brother only sold 3 of, you'd think there would be way more reports of things like this happening. Even when HP did their firmware lockdown there were plenty of reports of it happening when it happened. Especially since the reproduction steps are trivial - update firmware, and see if your third party cartridge stops working.
Happy on Third Party (Score:2)
I actually would buy Brother toner but a set of four is over $300 and I have this set [amzn.to] on Subscribe & Save for $42.50 every six months.
Seriously, 1/8th the cost. I'm on my second Brother color laser - the last one went for about eight years and owed me nothing.
I suspect their business plan is to let the home users be totally free and assume businesses will buy the premium carts after their IT guy bought all Brother printers because he had a good experience at home.
Nobody gets rolled, everybody is happy.
40+ years in this business (Score:1)
Statement doesn't address the allegations? (Score:2)
"Please be assured that Brother firmware updates do not block the use of third-party ink in our machines."
That was never the claim. It appears people were claiming that an automatically obtained firmware update seemed to result in degradation to print quality on 3rd party toner cartridges, And color registration would no longer function.
"Updates do not blocking the use of third-party ink" appears to be rejecting a rather different argument from some of the claims which people were making.
They could have