General Motors Installs the First of 40,000 New EV Chargers (arstechnica.com) 127
An anonymous reader quotes a report from Ars Technica: Electric vehicle drivers in Marshfield, Wisconsin, and Owosso, Michigan, are the first to benefit from General Motors' Dealer Community Charging Program. These deployments of new level 2 (AC) chargers are the first in a planned rollout of 40,000 new plug-in points, which GM says will nearly double the number of public charging stations in the US and Canada. GM announced the program in October 2021 and since then has had almost 1,000 of its Chevrolet dealerships sign on to the initiative, which is designed to increase charger access in underserved, rural, and urban locations. GM will supply dealerships with up to 10 19.2 kW chargers to be installed around the communities they serve, and the chargers are available to any EV driver, not just those who drive electric models from GM.
Wheeler's Chevrolet in Wisconsin was the first dealership to sign on to the initiative and has installed chargers in two parks, a library, and a sports complex, among other locations in Marshfield. "We're excited to be the first dealership in the nation to have these chargers," said Mary Jo Wheeler-Schueller, owner of Wheelers Chevrolet GMC. "This will help put Marshfield on the map in terms of EV leadership. This is a great stop for commuters to check out our community and see all that Marshfield has to offer." Young Cadillac Chevrolet in Michigan followed and installed its first charger at a health care center in Owosso. GM says that the next installations should take place in Delaware, Georgia, Illinois, Indiana, Kansas, Ohio, and Washington in the coming months. Separately, GM has another program that, together with EVgo, is in the midst of installing 5,250 DC fast chargers by 2025, including 2,000 fast chargers at Pilot and Flying J travel centers.
Wheeler's Chevrolet in Wisconsin was the first dealership to sign on to the initiative and has installed chargers in two parks, a library, and a sports complex, among other locations in Marshfield. "We're excited to be the first dealership in the nation to have these chargers," said Mary Jo Wheeler-Schueller, owner of Wheelers Chevrolet GMC. "This will help put Marshfield on the map in terms of EV leadership. This is a great stop for commuters to check out our community and see all that Marshfield has to offer." Young Cadillac Chevrolet in Michigan followed and installed its first charger at a health care center in Owosso. GM says that the next installations should take place in Delaware, Georgia, Illinois, Indiana, Kansas, Ohio, and Washington in the coming months. Separately, GM has another program that, together with EVgo, is in the midst of installing 5,250 DC fast chargers by 2025, including 2,000 fast chargers at Pilot and Flying J travel centers.
Chargers are nice and all ... (Score:5, Interesting)
Hey, I'm all for whatever expands the charging networks .... but L2 chargers are slow. Hours to get any meaningful range. And worse yet, that means hours hanging around a car dealership ... quite possibly the least useful place on Earth for me.
Adding DCFC - even pay-for DCFC - would be so much better. 100+ miles of range in less than 10 minutes with today's Superchargers -- would be even better with a 350kW+ setup.
DCFCs are what matter... Level 2's are great for home, and maybe the movie theater. This is like GM bringing a knife to a gun fight.
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You...understand...why they might put a slow charger at a dealership...right?
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Be a great way to sell internal combustion engine cars.
Re:Chargers are nice and all ... (Score:5, Informative)
but L2 chargers are slow. Hours to get any meaningful range. And worse yet, that means hours hanging around a car dealership ... quite possibly the least useful place on Earth for me.
These are not necessarily being installed at dealerships. TFA mentions installations at "two parks, a library, and a sports complex, .... health care center"
There are places where you would might park for an hour and add a meaningful amount of charge. If they are 19kW and the cars can charge at this rate, that's close to 80 miles of charge added per hour.
This is GM realizing that they made a mistake years ago when they did not follow Tesla's lead and install chargers: GM's CEO thought that installing chargers was someone else's job. This article from 2018, referring to GM's stance in 2016 [greencarreports.com]:
"The company said firmly two years ago it had no intention of spending money on a charging network, a stance that distinguished GM from BMW, Nissan, and Volkswagen, not to mention Tesla."
Re:Chargers are nice and all ... (Score:4, Insightful)
It's a nice-to-have chargers in the community, but typically folks go to places like a park or library within a few miles of their home. I don't think this moves the needle in any meaningful way (aside from a press release, of course.). The emphasis should be on home charging *where possible*, DC fast charging for trips, and public access L2 charging at overnight locations where folks cannot charge at home.
I'd much rather see them invest in 120V outlets (or better yet - 208/240V outlets) on light poles at street parking in urban areas. That would help for a good portion of the urban use cases.
Between that, and meaningfully equipping large commercial parking lots, it could really help.
All for more charging locations, certainly... but ground shaking this isn't. Especially when some nozzle blocks the charger. Had exactly that yesterday at our local supermarket. Again, not a terribly useful charging location, but still was a jerk move to block it with a diesel whatever.
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Not everyone has a charger at home. It can be difficult for people living in apartments. If you can get 80 miles in an hour, that may be good enough to keep the car charged.
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That's precisely why I said:
"The emphasis should be on home charging *where possible*, DC fast charging for trips, and public access L2 charging at overnight locations where folks cannot charge at home.
I'd much rather see them invest in 120V outlets (or better yet - 208/240V outlets) on light poles at street parking in urban areas. That would help for a good portion of the urban use cases."
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Not everyone has a charger at home.
It's precisely those who can't charge at home who need faster charging than this.
LOGIC FAIL.
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No, it's yours that failed.
Outside of an emergency at a time when someone has run their battery all the way down, nobody needs fast charging. We spend hours with our cars parked in one spot most days. Just trickle charge it.
If you don't have a charger at home, park at a charger and walk to the gym, go do your shopping, visit the library, go to the park. Most people aren't driving 500 miles a week. For your day-to-day life, there's no need for rapid charging.
Yes, emergencies when you're already low on charge
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No, you don't.
There are plenty of places where a car is parked for hours at a time. I can point out to the parking lot outside a business park where most of the vehicles there are parked 10+ hours. That's a perfect opportunity to charge.
Fast charging is limited to when you're road tripping - and modern fast chargers are fast enough to stop, take a break and while on break, your car charges while you stop to smell the roses and
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Fast charging is obnoxious to use - and the faster it is, the more obnoxious it is. Fast charger spaces are not parking spots, they're charging spaces. That means once you have the charge, you must move to make room for someone else (and many pay spots charge parking fees if you stay too long). A charger that lets me go from 20% to 80% in 15 minutes is hard to use - I plug in, and I have to be back in 15 minutes. Maybe that's a run to 7-11 or something, but there's little you can do. A fast charger that takes an hour, at least then you can accomplish something.
I have the easy solution for you:
Wait by your car for the 15 minute "obnoxious" charge. You can do it, I believe in you.
Drive to a parking spot at 7-11 or something, and then spend 45 minutes doing... something.
There, you have a charged car in one hour.
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Just wanted to say, my fellow 30k-UID'er, that you absolutely nailed it. Exactly right. This is why I don't think parks or libraries are the right place for these L2 chargers. How much time do you spend in the library? An hour or two at most? What we need are longer-term parking spots. Like you said, apartment lots or business lots or whatever. A place where the vehicle can charge while at rest during the workday or overnight.
Save the fast charging for road trips - let overnight charging be the way t
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(I'll break it down for the entitled idiots: If you're renting an apartment...you absolutely, do not, need to be buying a new car.)
Oh look, found someone who knows fuck-all about cars giving car advice. The TCO of a used car can be nearly as high as a new one in this market, and the opportunity cost of dealing with breakdowns on a higher mileage vehicle can be significant. Or even just of owning one, you know prospective employers will go out to the lot and look at your car to determine your social status right?
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Not only that, but since the majority of car purchases are financed (even used ones, though it's only 53%) the TCO is by far the number that matters most.
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I bought and '06 in 2011 for $19k.
In 2011 there wasn't a massive vehicle shortage, so that's irrelevant to what the equation looks like today.
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Where do you live? Do they salt the roads there? Turns out to be pretty important to the long-term survival of a used car.
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Because renting means someone is poor???
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If things go as planned, in not too many years, the decision won't be up to the consumer. There will only be electrics available.
And people in apartments still won't have any way to charge them.
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Nobody said it did, Mr. Straw Man. But older cars will disappear over time, and become less reliable before they do. That's why you don't see a lot of 50 year old cars on the road these days.
And the people who will bear the brunt of the declining reliability are the people who can least afford it. An executive who can afford a Tesla as a birthday present for their 16 year old can afford to be late for work, or even miss a day. The minimum wage drone flipping burgers is likely to be suddenly unemployed, with
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The alternative for many isn't "spend hundreds to repair the car (and do so again and again and again because it's a worn out piece of junk, and actually end up spending more in the long run)" or "go into debt to buy a new car." the alternative is "get a more reliable car or not be able to hold down a job and end up homeless."
I realize that you, being an entitled lefty moonbat, have never held down a job, and couldn't if you tried, but normal people do.
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Well...ya know...maybe they should have factored that into their buying decision.
I think that's sort of the point. They have not bought an EV because it would not be practical, but if there is a place to charge close to where they live, then it becomes practical and they can buy an EV.
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It's a nice-to-have chargers in the community, but typically folks go to places like a park or library within a few miles of their home.
And yet, it's almost as if people can make multiple stops when out for the day. Or go days without filling up/charging.
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One of our favorite benefits is at home charging so the car i ready to go each day. This means never having to go somewhere to "fill up" in the morning before our commute to work because one of us forgot. It seems like a little thing at first but my wife tends to run late and that extra detour to the gas station on the way to work sometimes leads to a much longer commute time.
There is also the potential of "vampire" draw adding up over a few days. Features like Sentry Mode and Cabin Overheat Protection
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Personally I think hybrids (maybe PHEVs) are probably the better choice for people that cannot charge at home.
Which.... is why OP was advocating for solutions to make EVs just as viable for apartment dwellers.
This whole article is about making charging more ubiquitously available.
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Classic
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This is GM realizing that they made a mistake years ago when they did not follow Tesla's lead and install chargers
This is GM realizing they can make a relatively "cheap" token gesture, to get regulators off their back. They're not going out of their way to install the best chargers they could...
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Only if your average driving speed is quite slow. It's more like 60-65 miles charge added per hour
My Model 3 will run at less than 250Wh/mile as long as I keep it at no more than 70mph. So, 19/.25 = 76, which is close to 80mph.
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Understanding fail.
a) these aren't at dealers. They are supplied to dealers to install in the community.
b) no one uses L2 fast chargers on location to fill up like they do at a gas stop. They use it to trickle charge their vehicles while they are off doing activities that take far longer than 10minutes. The concept itself is widely successful in Europe where I can charge my car while I'm at work, I can charge my car while I'm playing tennis, I can charge my car while watching the latest blockbuster, I can
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Quite the opposite. I never think about it. That's the benefit of having a car that is always full. Bonus points that the charging spots are right next to the disabled spots, so with the 10 seconds it takes me to plug the car in (which I do automatically without giving it a thought) I'm very likely still inside faster than you are.
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But, you're having to think about this all day, every day...that's the part that would be a PITA to me.
When I park my car, I jump out without another thought and go inside while
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But, you're having to think about this all day, every day...that's the part that would be a PITA to me.
That sounds like your own personal neuroses are the problem, not the charging. Normally, people don't think about this all day. They just think about it when they park. Think about when you park. There are certain considerations that vary based on the parking spot. It may be on a slope, so you cut your wheels and set your parking brake. It may be a metered spot, so you have to deal with the meter. Do you think about those things all day? Maybe you actually do. Most people don't. They just take care of them
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We do need more fast chargers. But we also need a shedload more L2 chargers in places where people commonly spend enough time that they would be useful. L2 chargers in office parking lots, for example, could make EVs feasible for people with no off-street parking, and at minimal cost.
What do I need to use one ? (Score:3)
From what I have seen of chargers you need to register and download some app to your 'phone. Why can I just not pay with a credit card as I do at a petrol station ?
Re:What do I need to use one ? (Score:5, Insightful)
Real charging networks (to date, Tesla's Superchargers, and EVgo) let you just plug in and it charges to your card on file. One time registration of the VIN and your charge card on their website, and from then on - just plug in and go. It's really a thing of beauty.
Re:What do I need to use one ? (Score:4, Insightful)
It doesn't just save you the step of swiping a keycard, it also makes something wireless (NFC) into something wired. In my country, The Netherlands, there's a charging network that also lets you just plug in (Fastned). Combined with the fact that they virtually always have 4-8 level 1 chargers, not just one or two, my navigation almost always follows their charging network.
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In Europe the chargers are required to accept card payments. You can register online if you want to, although not all cars support communicating the VIN to the charger. Either way, you can be sure that if you roll up to any random charger, it will take your card payment regardless of if you pre-registered.
That's also a GDPR issue because they can't force you to hand over lots of your data just to make a single payment, which is one of the reasons why some of them wanted you to create an account. No email ad
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In Europe the chargers are required to accept card payments.
Most certainly not.
I doubt there is any country where it is possible to force a vendor and or customer to conduct a payment in something different than legal tender.
No idea about the VIN, why would a charging station need the VIN of the car? How would it even obtain it, and what would it do with it?
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The rule in the EU is that card payments must be accepted, same as they must offer a CCS or chademo connector.
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There is no rule in the EU that anyone needs to accept card payments for anything.
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Sounds like a really nifty automated way for tracking your movements and travel.
Geez, who thought this was a great idea?
I don't want to register my car just to "fill up"...
Do these places not take cash too?
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"Sounds like a really nifty automated way for tracking your movements and travel."
While true, the same thing happens every time you use your card at a gas pump.
if privacy is your driver, you could prepay cash at the pump (most don't), but be aware that nearly every police car in the country now uses automated license plate readers that pick up your tags and submit your location and time to a database, unrelated to whether you're stopped. Don't forget your phone is electronically pulsing Here I Am periodica
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I often pay in cash for gas. Many place I go, isn't pre-pay either....they trust you.
I don't believe they do down here in the New Orleans area, but I'll have to check on that.
I rarely see cops out doing 'traffic stuff'....
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What, are we living in 1999 where you get your credit card number stolen by a skimmer.
I live in the UK - we have had chip & PIN for years, stops that sort of thing.
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I live in the UK - we have had chip & PIN for years, stops that sort of thing.
Yes, that's why you can pay for petrol at the pump in the UK.... oh wait! You can't.
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This sounds like a ready made new info source for the surveillance state.
I had no idea this was the "norm" for the EV's out there....having to register to refuel.
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Mostly you can. Or at least you can if you have a chip and pin card. You might not be able to if you have a standard card, i.e. one that could easily be a cloned card. So, it might be a problem if you are using an American card in the UK. I used to have the same problem in reverse in the US -- the pumps would ask for your zip code before accepting a card at the pump which, of course, I didn't have as the card was registered in the UK. Don't know if that has changed.
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Mostly you can. Or at least you can if you have a chip and pin card.
That's not my experience on my trips to the UK. I don't think I have seen a pay at the pump option since the '80s, when they were widespread for a very short time and removed very quickly (too much fraud).
I am not saying that pay-at-the-pump doesn't exist in the UK, just that, in my (albeit limited) experience, it's not widespread.
This has nothing to do with the card (I have a chip-and-pin card): I simply haven't seen anywhere to insert a card.
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We have chip and pin here in the USA, too. Whenever I pay for stuff with my chip card, I am prompted for the PIN. I can sometimes bypass it, but then it asks me for the zip.
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I live in the UK too and while you can use contactless at the counter, if you want to pay at the pump then I've never seen one that didn't require you to insert your card and enter your PIN.
I'm not entirely sure why it is, but it might be because you can't pre-authorize a charge via contactless. Normally you enter your PIN before starting to refuel, and it authorizes a charge of up to £150 or whatever limit they set, and then when you are finished it sends the actual amount to be billed to your
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Re: What do I need to use one ? (Score:1)
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You can complain about this kind of thing if you like, but the bitter truth you’ll have to face up to is that the vast majority of people prefer the convenience of paying with cards / devices for lots of their transactions, and don’t worry as much as you do about spying. I hope it makes you feel special to be part of the tiny minority who do think this is an issue.
Re: What do I need to use one ? (Score:1)
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Well, for someone who thinks this is a really big deal, and has relevant knowledge and experience, you've done a pretty terrible job of convincing most people to share your concerns. I think your concerns are a lot weirder than my hopes. But hey ho, it's fine for us to disagree on this.
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I wonder who thought it was a good idea to use unsecured credit to buy things you can afford, while at the same time the retailers get hosed and the banks get to skim a couple of percent of the purchase price for the privilege of using your own money.
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You use the term "unsecured" like it's a bad thing. Speaking for myself, I prefer my lines of credit to be unsecured, where I have the choice!
Anyhow, you carry on being angry about the banks etc being involved in transactions and charging money for it, and I'll carry on happily using my credit cards via Apple Pay and relishing walking around outside the house able to buy what I want, quickly, easily and securely, without carrying a wallet. And you can think me a fool, and I can think you a fool.
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If you're going to pay it off every month, then why are you using credit?
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Don't know about US credit cards, but in the UK, there's an interest free period of about 56 days and if you pay off in full before that, it's cost you nothing, and you get to have the points etc from the transaction.
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The only bad part about unsecured credit is it has significantly higher interest rates.
If you're going to pay it off every month, then why are you using credit?
Because they loan me money for free, which means the money in my bank account stays there earning me interest. Then I pay it off on payday. Also let's not forget online purchases, and convenience. Lastly the card I use gives me a small amount of cash back on everything I buy. Usually amounts to about $5-10 a month.
I admit the system sucks, but since I can't change it, I might as will make it work to my benefit.
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The other big benefit of credit cards in the UK is consumer protection. First level, call the credit card company if a merchant fails to fulfil; second level, you can use the law to get your money back ("Section 75"). So we always make big purchases on a credit card when we can, for this protection
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Usually they calculate interest from the balance on a specific day or the lowest balance over the month. As for all the "perks" from credit cards, all of them are a small percentage of what they skim off the top and generally meaningless.
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You should check your bank's rules.
Usually they calculate interest from the balance on a specific day or the lowest balance over the month. As for all the "perks" from credit cards, all of them are a small percentage of what they skim off the top and generally meaningless.
I know my banks rules quite well thank you.
Given the choice of getting a small percentage back as a perk, or getting nothing, I will take the small percentage every time.
If you have ever read the credit card agreement you sign as a vendor, you are actually precluded from offering any kind of a "Cash discount" (Was a few years ago I read it, may have changed.) Also your points don't address convenience, online purchases, or try to rent a vehicle without a creditcard.
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That's a wrong statement.
When automobiles came out over a century ago, they were high tech for their day. Then, and now, you don't need to be an auto mechanic to know how to drive to get where you are going.
When electric cars are standard, most people will not know much about how they work other than "fill 'er up" with electricity, and drive on.
You don't need to know about a cpu, alu, dram, or anything else inside the computer in order to browse the web or read email.
You don't need to know the physics and
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If you tell me I need a phone and a CC to charge on the road for all charger networks, then they can all go pound sand.
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I'd be fine with an electric car that met my needs. Something that is reasonably powered (350HP), lightweight (around 2700lbs) sports car and it would match my my current ICE vehicle.
I'm in the same boat. Please let me know when you find such an EV...hopefully at least in the ballpark price of a corvette (or less, since it is a smaller car).
"2023 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 1LT Coupe RWD - $66,000, 2 seats, EPA max range 352 miles, Cost to Fill the Tank $65"
"Tesla Model 3 Performance AWD - $63,000, sea
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Tesla Model 3 looks like and is a family car...I don't want a family car.
I want something that not only is a sports car, but looks like one too.
I've never owned a car wit
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Tesla Model 3 looks like and is a family car...
OK so you're looking to make a fashion statement, I can understand that. The Tesla also does not go vroooom vrooom, it just goes.
Let's see a 2022 Vette has approx 15 gallon tank. According to your figures...that's about $4.33/gallon?!?!
It's not my figures, it's EPA. Also the 2022 Vette specs say the tank is 18.5 gallons so that works out to be $3.51/gallon.
I think I saw it's about $2.70 here....
Your area is one of the cheaper gas price areas but even so that's
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Well if you want to own one high tech piece of modern life then you shouldn't shun another piece of high tech modern times.
Can I interest you in a horse and cart?
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Been paying for gas with my phone for many years. Safe, secure, easy.
Right up to the moment your phone dies or is stolen. Then everything you use is locked and you have access to nothing. In fact, you can't even call anyone to tell them your phone's been stolen.
Single point of failure. What a concept.
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Right up to the moment you forget your wallet at home or its stolen. Your wallet is a single point of failure.
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Right up to the moment you forget your wallet at home or its stolen. Your wallet is a single point of failure.
I don't bring my wallet with me. I carry cash. If I need a card I bring it with me.
As an aside, I stopped at BK after work because I was really late getting home. The guy in front of me wanted to use a coupon on his phone and the system wasn't registering it. He did politely complain but the manager explained she had no control over the web site. He left and I walked up and handed the cashier a paper coupon then used my card. He did eventually come back after he restarted his phone, but by that time my o
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Because at the plug there is no credit card terminal?
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From what I have seen of chargers you need to register and download some app to your 'phone. Why can I just not pay with a credit card as I do at a petrol station ?
B cuz all Da Kewl Kids use APPS !
Mmkay, then 39999 to go I guess (Score:3)
I hope they don't change their mind after a few months like some person saying that 640 ought to be enough for everyone.
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Always doing it the hard way (Score:2)
I suppose it would be too much to expect them to strike a deal with Tesla to use their charger network.
Even worse to actually use a common connector. This is like Ethernet vs. Token Ring all over again. Betamax vs. VHS.
But the "leaders" won't hear of it.
Re:Always doing it the hard way (Score:4, Informative)
This is like Ethernet vs. Token Ring all over again. Betamax vs. VHS.
Lightning vs USB-C.
(ducking and running)
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Let's sing together... (Score:2)
Take one down, connect to the mains
39,999 EV chargers to install
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40,000 EV chargers to install Take one down, connect to the mains 39,999 EV chargers to install .....
Waiting for the senseless vandalism to start on these EV chargers in...3..2..1
Why not combined grid level storage and Chargers (Score:2)
How to destroy your credibility 101 (Score:2)
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We need synthesized hydrocarbon fuels.
Do the math and show how your synthesized fuels are better than petroleum.
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Do you seriously think using solar power to make synthetic hydrocarbon fuel, and then using that hydrocarbon fuel to charge an EV battery is more energy efficient than solar power directly charging EV batteries?
Re:Where is the electricity coming from? (Score:4, Informative)
Have people considered how much dirt has to be dug up to produce all those windmills and solar PV panels?
There's an entire field called life-cycle analysis [wikipedia.org] that studies question like this. Wind and solar end up being far more efficient and better for the environment than any fossil fuel. So yes, people have considered it.
We can use the fuels in the internal combustion engines we have now.
That ends up being a really bad idea, because car engines are incredibly inefficient [wikipedia.org]. As much as 80% of the energy in the fuel ends up being wasted and not used to move the car. Electric cars are far more efficient, in addition to being much simpler and easier to manufacture and requiring a lot less maintenance. Their total cost of ownership is already lower than conventional cars and dropping quickly.
Synthetic fuels have their place, but it's only in applications that are hard to electrify like airplanes. Electric cars are already better than conventional ones in almost every way. They're cleaner, quieter, more efficient, better for the environment, easier to care for. They have better performance, if that's something you care about. Range is no longer an issue. Cost is quickly disappearing as an issue. Convenience of charging is already a big advantage for anyone who can charge at home, and for everyone else the situation is improving quickly.
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One other area where fuels have their place: portable heat.
Yes, turning combustion into work is an inherently inefficient process. When you say 80% of the energy in the fuel is wasted, well, it's getting thrown away as waste heat. But when heat is what you want, fuel can be efficient.
Electricity is great for doing useful work, but resistive heating is wasteful -- you're throwing away wonderful, usable, zero-entropy electricity by just turning it into max-entropy heat. In moderately cold weather, electric ca
Re:Where is the electricity coming from? (Score:5, Informative)
1. Generally speaking, yes many have asked this question, many times, including just about every thread on this topic.
2. Yes, coal produces more than just CO2. But you get the sulfur, mercury, and radioactive gasses with oil refineries as well. Remember ultra-low sulfur diesel? That just means that they're removing it at the refinery.
3. Methane leakage from NG powerplants is minimal compared to the extra CO2 from coal, global warming wise.
4. There's a reason why we say "even if". The ultimate goal is to charge EVs using green energy as well, which we're also installing on a fairly rapid basis.
5. Yes, it means that dirt needs to be dug up to produce the materials for windmills and PV panels. It's still orders of magnitude less dirt that needs to be dug up for coal and even natural gas power.
6. Given that I read about a new US cobalt mine getting ready to open up, yes, it'll be at least partially in the USA. Jobs and all that, and at least we know that in the USA environmental conditions will be paid attention to.
7. Stopping exporting rare earth magnets would only slow down EV production. For example, most Tesla motors don't have any. Their extra-extended long range motor is the only one with them, so they're hardly critical.
I won't disagree that we can make synthetic hydrocarbon fuels. I WILL point out however, that doing so requires energy, which means that we'd still need solar panels, windmills, and probably a crap-ton of farmland dedicated to it.
EVs are actually the most realistic and practical solution, by my understanding. What it won't be is "overnight" or "easy". Lots of infrastructure changes necessary.
Still, your concerns:
Long distance - superchargers work. Actually take the breaks while driving that you're supposed to.
Extreme weather - stay home or where you're at. Like you should be doing so anyways.
"Occasional forgotten charge" - a lot less of a deal if there are chargers at your work, at various other places you can stop for a bit, like malls, theaters, restaurants, etc... Plus, 300 mile range EVs can generally survive through a single forgotten nightly charge just fine.
That said, emergency and construction vehicles would probably be hybrids more frequently.
I actually have some sympathies for "international entanglements" though I'll point out that the USA is one of the LEAST entangled countries going. Ask Germany about Russian natural gas, for example. They thought that by tying themselves economically to Russia, that they could keep Russia from doing anything stupid(like invading Ukraine again), due to threats of sanctions and such. On the other hand, they made themselves so dependent upon natural gas from Russia that Russia figured the opposite - that Germany wouldn't dare sanction heavily due to their dependence upon Russian NG.
Or, TLDR: Shit gets complicated, and there are good and bad points to this. Getting off of Fossil fuels would be a net positive on the entanglement issue, anyways. You can live with old EV batteries for a while, NG shortages you see that winter...
Re: (Score:2)
"Abundant" can mean different things. I don't think there would be the excess you're thinking of.
1. Regional variations in power production mean less when you have a national transmission grid that can move the power across the country if necessary.
2. Balancing different types of green energy can be a thing. More wind up north, for example, where power is more necessary in the winter for heating, more solar down south where it's used more for AC in the daytime.
3. More storage period - maybe even buildi
Re:Where is the electricity coming from? (Score:5, Insightful)
Wait, you’re worried about nasty stuff being released into the atmosphere from the power plants that create the electricity that charges EVs, and you think it would be better to use nuclear to create synthetic hydrocarbons that would then be incompletely combusted in ICE vehicles creating nasty stuff that gets released into the atmosphere, but this time at head level for little kids in urban centres as opposed to well above head level via sophisticated scrubbers far away from urban centres?
You cannot honestly expect us to believe that you truly think the danger of pollutants would be lower from a move to synthetics than a move to EVs. You’re too smart to think such a stupid thing, surely?
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Have people stopped to ask where the electricity is coming from to charge all these EVs?
Yes they have. Ad nauseum. But regardless of how many times it is pointed out to you that the singular worst case scenario for where this fuel electricity comes from is still far better than burning fuel in a vehicle some morons on the internet still keep raising talking points.
At this point you're not even worth debunking anymore. If you want that just go and read the reply to the 1000s upon 1000s who came before you. Now you should just get insulted as the wilfully ignorant dolt you are.
Re: (Score:2)