The World's First Offshore Floating Wind-Solar Pilot Goes Online (electrek.co) 43
China's government-owned utility State Power Investment Corporation (SPIC) has launched the world's first commercial offshore floating solar that's paired with an offshore wind turbine. Electrek reports: SPIC is one of five major electrical utility companies in China, and the world's largest photovoltaic power generation enterprise. The pilot is located off the coast of Haiyang, a city in Shandong, eastern China. The project uses Norway-based Ocean Sun's patented floating solar power technology. The two solar floaters (see the photo above) have an installed capacity of 0.5 megawatts peak. They're connected to a transformer on a SPIC-owned wind turbine and then a subsea cable runs from the wind turbine to the power grid. If the pilot is successful, the plan is to build a 20 MW floating wind-solar farm in 2023 using Ocean Sun's technology.
Nice (Score:2, Funny)
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How is this moderated down? I found the comment funny as hell. I guess it is lost on people that SPIC stands for State Power Investment Corporation. The play on words was a very humorous coincidence.
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What racism?
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What racism?
This game is tired. I don't play it. Maybe someone else might.
Not to Worry (Score:2)
Re:Nice (Score:5, Interesting)
I don't see the point of putting solar panels out at sea.
There are problems with salt, storms, seagull poop, and the difficulty of transporting maintenance workers.
I can't see any benefit over a land-based solar installation other than the cost of the land, which is rarely a significant factor.
Neither TFA nor Ocean Sun's website explains any benefit of floating panels.
It is a tiny project (500 kW for a few hours/day), so perhaps it is a PR/marketing stunt.
Re:Nice (Score:5, Interesting)
You may have a shortage of land in the area, and if you're building wind turbines at a sea location anyway, then you've already got the grid connectivity there, so that part isn't going to cost you any extra (so long as you over-provisioned a bit, anyway). If, as in this case, you're buying ready-made floating solar units, then you just have to tow them into place, anchor and and hook them up, and you presumably have more flexibility in terms of adding or moving the floating modules, compared to a fixed land-based installation.
How those pros stack up against the various cons you mentioned is hard to say. Presumably they're being deployed in an area with typically calm seas, and maybe the seagulls will all get taken out by the wind turbines before they can poop on the solar panels, idk.
Re:Nice (Score:4, Informative)
Seagulls tend not to hang around offshore wind farms. Aside from the danger presented by the blades, they are built far offshore and away from easy sources of food. They aren't good to nest on either, lacking much protection from the elements. The turbines are too high and exposed to constant winds, and the solar panels are too low and subject to occasional flooding by the sea.
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Seagulls are not an issue. It is more an issue with storms and salt rime. Even modest storms will spray a lot of salt water that if not washed off quickly will form a salt crust. I'm not talking cms thick, but more a film. That will impair efficiency for sure. And if it is not washed off regularly if actually could built up. Also salt water is incredibly corrosive to most metals exposed in air. So if any metals become exposed it could be a problem. And then there are the problems with large storms that can
Re: Nice (Score:2)
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The manufacturer rates them for up to 13m waves. They don't mention salt, but it seems like there are only really two scenarios there. Either the panels get regularly washed by sea water, so the salt doesn't have an opportunity to dry out and accumulate, or they don't and the amount of salt build up is limited anyway. The panels will get rained on periodically, regardless of what the sea is like.
I'm sure it does affect performance, but as long as they still produce enough energy to cover their cost during t
Re:Nice (Score:5, Interesting)
Yeah, transport is one of the big advantages of doing anything offshore. On land you're limited by max road and rail transport sizes. Offshore you have no such limits, and can move truly massive structures straight from where they're built in the port.
Also, offshore has the potential for this [twitter.com] down the road.
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Another advantage is that the panels lay on a membrane on the ocean surface, so they stay cooler.
The cooler temperature boosts efficiency and extends the lifetime of the panels.
Re:Nice (Score:5, Insightful)
It avoids NIMBYs. While it's obviously a pilot project, if it demonstrates that the technology is viable then it means that the same infrastructure needed to connect wind turbines to the grid can be used with attached solar panels.
Once a company has a licence to build an offshore windfarm, they might as well exploit it as much as possible. As long as the cost of these floating panels doesn't exceed the lifetime return on the energy generated, of course they are going to do it.
Re:Nice (Score:4, Funny)
I have a modest proposal for NIMBYs who oppose any on-shore renewables:
Cut off their electricity supply.
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Me too.
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We might as well put nuclear reactors out there
NuScale plans to deploy floating SMRs [neutronbytes.com]
Russian floating nuclear power station [wikipedia.org]
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The problems are not problems.
No idea why you think salt water would be a problem.
On top of that: you have the reflection of the sun from the sea water, which will give a nice boost.
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probably (Score:1)
Re:probably (Score:4, Interesting)
Glass doesn't corrode. Everything else is just an engineering problem to keep the water out of it, something which we've been doing for many decades. There are marine standards that cover corrosion.
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Re:probably (Score:5, Insightful)
Ask any sailor: The sea is merciless and ruthless, It throws up waves and super-waves.
Ask any sailor if they sail on the sea, and they will say yes because engineers know what sailors know and solve problems to keep equipment at sea afloat and operational.
If you're asking someone to build anything (anything at all, not talking about solar PV, but any power source, or even just a house) which doesn't require some form of routine inspection or maintenance then don't. There's no such thing. And floating offshore doesn't preclude our ability to maintain and operate something. We do after all have your aforementioned sailors to help us get out there.
Hypothetically (Score:2)
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Most engineers know shit about the area they work in unless they actually ever went out and worked in it. But they don't. Almost all of them only ever work in an office. We had a gas analyzer shed designed for us by a company in Texas that was supposed to be rated for arctic temperatures. The first time it hit -30C it fucked up (and we weren't even in the arctic, but did get temperatures as low as -45 to -50C... without windchill factored in... and then there was wind). We had to rebuild parts that were scr
Re: probably (Score:2)
Remember one project where technical people of our customer we
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Most engineers know shit about the area they work in unless they actually ever went out and worked in it.
Absolutely agree, which is why different engineers are chosen to work on equipment out at sea compared to on land. I don't go to a pediatrist to get brain surgery either simply because they both have medical degrees.
The sea is a well understood environment and we have been building infrastructure and equipment that withstands it for literally centuries. We're not inventing fusion power here.
But they don't. Almost all of them only ever work in an office. We had a gas analyzer shed designed for us by a company in Texas that was supposed to be rated for arctic temperatures. The first time it hit -30C it fucked up (and we weren't even in the arctic, but did get temperatures as low as -45 to -50C... without windchill factored in... and then there was wind). We had to rebuild parts that were screwed and add additional heaters. That delayed us, and is just one example. There
Being outside isn't the solution to having the wrong person working on it. Just because someone steps out from their d
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We do testing of enclosures and the like for equipment intended to be far inland, and this includes testing against salt exposures. Also for devices in residential areas that may be underground, you gotta deal with being submerged in water with all sorts of weird chemicals in it like fertilizers or road runoff. Dealing with the environment is a major requirement for any industrial equipment that needs to be outside, no matter where you put it, it's not just a problem for sailors.
Objection/criticism #3 (Score:1)
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Communist is a bastardization of socialism, so is fascism. Socialism is everyone is equal. Communist is some people are more equal than others.
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Fascism is diametrically opposite of socialism. Though as you go progressively further left or right you eventually meet up at the "Dear Leader controls everything" spot. The best spot for freedom is neither left nor right, but right there in the center where it takes constant tweaking to keep it from veering off.
Pave Lake Powell and Lake Mead with floating solar (Score:5, Interesting)
This can be a triple-win if done right!
You cut down on evaporation of water from the surface of the lakes. The West badly needs all the water it can get.
You generate solar power, partly or completely replacing the loss of hydropower from low water flows due to drought.
You generate more hydropower with the water you've saved.
Heck, if you make the solar cells slightly lighter in color, you can maybe trade some efficiency for a net cooling of the lakes and even less evaporation.
The only downside is that boat traffic will be restricted in the areas where the solar cells are.
This is something we really need to do. Evaporation losses from these lakes amount to multiple cities worth of water per year.
--PeterM
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https://www.pbs.org/newshour/s... [pbs.org]
although the co-located opportunity for pumped hydro storage at those huge dams is a nice bonus
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You cut down on evaporation of water from the surface of the lakes.
Where I live, EPA rules limit how much shade is thrown on bodies of water because it affects sea life.
How much material and labor will this take? (Score:1)
I read about these projects and just shake my head at the nonsense of it all. Have they done the math on how much labor and materials this takes for the energy they get back? This is out at sea but not all nations have the luxury of access to the sea for energy, how will they get their energy?
Nuclear fission. That is where they will get their energy.
Someone actually did the math on the land and materials this will take. The guy wrote papers and did lectures on his results. Here's one example of his wor
Don't Be Fooled (Score:1)
What an acronym (Score:2)
Are Hispanics allowed to work there?!