Ukraine Says 'Lax' and 'Careless' Russian Soldiers Entered the Most Nuclear Contaminated Area on the Planet (cnn.com) 220
"The sudden ear-piercing beep of a radiation meter fills the room," reports CNN, "as a Ukrainian soldier walks in.
"This is where Russian soldiers were living at the Chernobyl nuclear power plant, and radiation levels are now higher than normal." There's no visible presence of the source of the radioactive material in the room, but Ukrainian officials say it's coming from small particles and dust that the soldiers brought into the building. "They went to the Red Forest and brought radioactive material back with them on their shoes," soldier Ihor Ugolkov explains. "Other places are fine, but radiation increased here, because they were living here."
CNN was given exclusive access to the power plant for the first time since it came back into Ukrainian control. Officials at the plant explain the levels inside the room used by Russian soldiers are only slightly above what the World Nuclear Association describes as naturally occurring radiation. One-time contact would not be dangerous but continuous exposure would pose a health hazard.
"They went everywhere, and they also took some radioactive dust on them [when they left]," Ugolkov adds. It's an example of what Ukrainian officials say was the lax and careless behavior of Russian soldiers while they were in control of the site of the 1986 nuclear disaster. The area around Chernobyl, namely the Red Forest, is still the most nuclear contaminated area on the planet, with most of the radioactive particles present on the soil....
Russian soldiers held Chernobyl for a month and are thought to have been operating in contaminated areas most of the time.
Russian soldiers entered the Red Forest and dug trenches, Ukranian officials believe — and on the edge of the area CNN spotted a Russian military ration box "that exhibited radiation levels 50 times above naturally occurring values."
The 169 Ukraine National Guard soldiers, who guarded the facility, were locked in the plant's Cold War era underground nuclear bunker, crammed up in tight quarters without access to natural light, fresh air or communication with the outside world, according to the Ukrainian Interior Minister.
"They were kept here for 30 days without sufficient lighting and food. They were not allowed outside. On the last day they were taken away from here to an unknown direction," Denys Monastyrskyy says while standing inside the bunker.
The minister says he believes the men have been taken to Russia, via Belarus, as prisoners of war, but doesn't know for certain.
"This is where Russian soldiers were living at the Chernobyl nuclear power plant, and radiation levels are now higher than normal." There's no visible presence of the source of the radioactive material in the room, but Ukrainian officials say it's coming from small particles and dust that the soldiers brought into the building. "They went to the Red Forest and brought radioactive material back with them on their shoes," soldier Ihor Ugolkov explains. "Other places are fine, but radiation increased here, because they were living here."
CNN was given exclusive access to the power plant for the first time since it came back into Ukrainian control. Officials at the plant explain the levels inside the room used by Russian soldiers are only slightly above what the World Nuclear Association describes as naturally occurring radiation. One-time contact would not be dangerous but continuous exposure would pose a health hazard.
"They went everywhere, and they also took some radioactive dust on them [when they left]," Ugolkov adds. It's an example of what Ukrainian officials say was the lax and careless behavior of Russian soldiers while they were in control of the site of the 1986 nuclear disaster. The area around Chernobyl, namely the Red Forest, is still the most nuclear contaminated area on the planet, with most of the radioactive particles present on the soil....
Russian soldiers held Chernobyl for a month and are thought to have been operating in contaminated areas most of the time.
Russian soldiers entered the Red Forest and dug trenches, Ukranian officials believe — and on the edge of the area CNN spotted a Russian military ration box "that exhibited radiation levels 50 times above naturally occurring values."
The 169 Ukraine National Guard soldiers, who guarded the facility, were locked in the plant's Cold War era underground nuclear bunker, crammed up in tight quarters without access to natural light, fresh air or communication with the outside world, according to the Ukrainian Interior Minister.
"They were kept here for 30 days without sufficient lighting and food. They were not allowed outside. On the last day they were taken away from here to an unknown direction," Denys Monastyrskyy says while standing inside the bunker.
The minister says he believes the men have been taken to Russia, via Belarus, as prisoners of war, but doesn't know for certain.
Cue disinformation (Score:5, Interesting)
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
The whole article is "disinformation" in the sense that it fails to inform.
Where are the numbers? The whole story sounds like a beat-up. "slightly above naturally occurring" means what??
The radiation levels could be well below that in an airliner. Probably less than you'd get living in Colorado.
Re: (Score:3)
Step 2: We're in the age of the Internet; use a search engine.
And there's no single value for naturally occurring radiation: it's not a constant like gravity. So the value of naturally occurring radiation in a decomposing banana grove is markedly different than that of the single rotting banana on your kitchen counter -- but they're both "naturally occurring" (as the name implies). This story refers to additional
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:3)
They were in the Red Forest area, which is one of the spiciest places in the zone. I was there on a tour last summer and even on the edge of the area (near the Pripyat sign) things were getting pretty hot. Unfortunately it doesn't seem like I captured the actual level anywhere but it looks like it could be about 10 uSv/h.That would be about 100 more than typical background level if I did the math right. Not fatal but I sure as hell wouldn't want to spend a month living there.
And this is before they dug up t
Re: (Score:3)
Listen, Putinjugend, they were digging around making trenches, foxholes etc in some of the most toxic soil on earth, without protective gear. There's plenty of surveillance video of them doing it, as well as aftermath recordings too.
So stop being a worthless, valueless propaganda drone.
Re: (Score:2)
I’m waiting for this incident to be upheld by Russia as “proof” that Ukraine used a dirty bomb on Russians first as an excuse to use even more severe tactics like chemical weapons. The troops likely didn’t even know where they were or what they were doing when they dug their own graves in the Red Forest.
Plot twist: This IS the disinformation.
Re:Cue disinformation (Score:4, Interesting)
Ukraine: "We have stopped the Russian advance and are pushing them back."
Russia: "That is disinformation. We are winning this war--'special operation'."
Also Russia: "We are pulling back our troops from areas because they are 'winning' so much."
So if Ukraine says that Russian soldiers had contaminated themselves in the Chernobyl area , I am likely to believe that. If rumors are to believed, many Russian soldier had little advance notice that they were being deployed into combat. It is not a stretch of the imagination that they did not know to which areas of Ukraine they were deployed.
Re:Cue disinformation (Score:5, Insightful)
There is no reason from anyone logical to believe anything Russia says anymore. So many years of lying, so much propaganda, that it takes a special kind of stupid for anyone not immersed in Putin's bubble to believe any of it.
Re:Cue disinformation (Score:4, Insightful)
s/Putin/Trump/g
And, yet, we have the entire Republican party. I can't imagine it's much different in Russia. You'll find useful idiots - and autocrats willing to take advantage of them - in any country.
Re: (Score:2)
Both Ukrainians and Russians are going to turn this story to their advantage, I don't know how and I don't care, but one thing is certain, we won't get the whole truth for a while, if ever.
Seriously, I don't trust any information regarding this conflict. We are calling out Russian propaganda, for good reason, but it doesn't mean we are getting the truth either. Maybe, for once, the Chinese have better, less biased information than we (NATO members) do since they are mostly neutral while we are clearly sidin
Re: (Score:3)
Seriously, I don't trust any information regarding this conflict. We are calling out Russian propaganda, for good reason, but it doesn't mean we are getting the truth either. Maybe, for once, the Chinese have better, less biased information than we (NATO members) do since they are mostly neutral while we are clearly siding with Ukraine.
Nope, the Chinese definitely don't have less biased information. They're pretending to be neutral in the UN (in a terrible way but w/e) but at home they're positioning this as "the west's" fault for making poor russia feel sad.
POWs? (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
That's probably not the case, they'll want soldiers to trade for their own that have been captured when this is all over.
Re: (Score:3)
Maybe Putin feels he would not benefit from repatriating Russian POWs who'd report they were told lies to start a war and kill civilians, and their unit ran out of food and fuel as if their command structure was a joke.
Re: (Score:3)
And make for a far higher "death" tole from soldiers not coming back home? I doubt that as well, he already has far more causalities than he anticipated. I cant find any specific numbers on a casual google search but from what I've been reading in the news it seems like there's a pretty large number of captured Russian soldiers. That's just an impression I have though.
Putin fears his own people enough on this war that he's more or less hid most of it from them. A huge death toll would be hard to keep hidden
Re: POWs? (Score:2)
The Russians have literally been burying their soldiers at the side of roads in Ukraine. Some Russian POWs are saying they don't want to return home because they'll face the firing squad for being captured, and their families already consider them dead.
Re: (Score:3)
Ukraine and Russia have already done at least one prisoner swap [reuters.com].
Re: (Score:2)
Base his decisions upon what he has done in the past, in Syria, Georgia, etc.
Re: (Score:2)
Any more reporting on this story? (Score:2)
Very likely the Russian soldiers weren't told it was a contaminated, radioactive site. Even more likely most of them would have had little or no understanding of what that means, or been given any protective gear. We have seen now how Russian soldiers do what they are told, at least while an officer is watching.
I read somewhere (I think here) that some of the stored radioactive material has gone missing during the occupation. Anyone hear anymore on that?
Re: (Score:3)
How could anyone on the planet, let alone Russians, not know that Chernobyl is a contaminated site? Here I was thinking Russian didn't have quite so many illiterate peasants as they used to.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
The thing is, the state of the plant site itself is well-understood. The contamination is mapped out carefully. The Red Forest isn't mapped out anywhere near as well, and there's plenty of contaminated soil that's been sitting undisturbed, so digging will spread the contamination around.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
No. No, no, no, no, and no.
Russian schools do not teach that Chernobyl happened as any part of general education. They've never even heard of the accident.
And if somebody mentioned it to them, 25% chance they called the police or local party official to report that person for spreading foreign disinformation designed to make Russia look bad.
Read any of the interviews with the scientists who work on the site about their discussions with Russian soldiers. A few did listen... and dug new trenches a little
Re: (Score:3)
"You do know that the large areas of Chernobyl is still contaminated right? A little further from the building does not mean that soil is still not contaminated."
Yes, we know that. If it's true that the Russians are not taught about Chernobyl, and those that were told by the inhabitants of it decided to dig a bit further from the building to be safer, it simply shows that those digging had utterly no clue about radiation or Chernobyl.
Or, in to put it in another, simpler way "Woosh!"
Re: (Score:2)
How close would you have to get to Chernobyl before you realized it was Chernobyl?
Re: (Score:2)
Russian Commander: "No, that not containment dome! That large sports stadium! Where Glorious Russian Army holding enemy POWs!"
Re: (Score:2)
"Russia shall extend its rule to the Indian Ocean!" [wikipedia.org]
Re: (Score:2)
As long as you do not see the reactors - you probably indeed have no clue.
Just because you are in a kind of dead forest does not mean that much, as e.g. the recent meteor impact in Russia also flattened a huge areas from trees.
If the rumours are right, many Russian soldiers did not even know they are deployed in Ukraine.
Re: (Score:2)
What would you think if you saw a entire city simply abandoned in place like this?
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/ne... [dailymail.co.uk]
But as far as the wilderness around it (which is apparently thriving), clearly there's no visible indication. Obviously, you can't see or feel radioactive contamination.
Look, I'd guess the average Russian soldier is on the young and ignorant side, wasn't told what was really going on, and was highly encouraged to shut-the-fuck-up-and-do-what-you're-told, like grunts in just about any army. I
Re: (Score:3)
A few miles south of that, the road goes past the Chernobyl NPP site itself, complete wi
Re: (Score:2)
How could anyone on the planet, let alone Russians, not know that Chernobyl is a contaminated site? Here I was thinking Russian didn't have quite so many illiterate peasants as they used to.
Young Orcs who were assigned to Chernobyl were asked if they understood what the site was, what the danger was. They said they were told it was "critically import infrastructure" that they were to capture and protect. When asked if they knew about what happened in 1986, they had never even heard of it.
Orcs are not educated in things like recent history. Their education is limited to use of PEDs, cyber-crime, and if they're smart, chess. Never over-estimate the education of people who grew up under totalitar
Re: (Score:2)
How could anyone on the planet, let alone Russians, not know that Chernobyl is a contaminated site? Here I was thinking Russian didn't have quite so many illiterate peasants as they used to.
It's probably a combination of factors:
1) Russia doesn't want to leave a big hole in their front lines, so they're going to send soldiers into the exclusion zone. Once you're ordered in you don't have a lot of choice in the matter.
2) Since Russia doesn't really care about it's soldiers, nor did they expect them to encounter any resistance (and thus have to stay there a while), they didn't actually prepare the divisions that were going in there with any special equipment and training.
3) Once the force got bo
Re: (Score:3)
The disaster was 36 years ago; probably none of the troops are old enough to remember it. I'm sure they *heard* of it, but they likely had no idea just how dangerous digging in the Red Forest would be. It looks harmless enough.
I once saw a school group on the steps of the Lincoln Memorial, with their teacher trying to get them fired up about standing on the place where Martin Luther King gave his famous "I have a dream" speech. Yes, it was an important moment in US history, and yes, it was within living m
Re: (Score:2)
He just asked how the Russians did not know Chernobyl was contaimiined
He asked someone to prove a negative about what other people did not know. And how is he supposed to do that?
Or they just did not care if the died from radiation poisoning and went there anyway.
How do you know they did not care? You cannot possibly know what Russian soldier care about.
You guys swallow every story CNN puts out without question.
No one should automatically believe everything but on the other side, you have Russia who insists they are "winning" this war---er, "special operation" despite retreating--strategically reallocating their forces after only a month of fighting.
Re: (Score:2)
I do not know what is going on in Ukraine and neither do you.
Yet you are speculating.
It is not my problem or the US problem. We are making it our problem so more people can get rich off of war. Leftists used to be for peace but now CNN and the NYT has turned them into bloodthirsty warmongers. You were so scared of covid but apparently the risk of nuclear war is not a big deal
Considering you are using three different accounts, I hardly believe you are from the US and therefore a Russian bot.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: Any more reporting on this story? (Score:4, Insightful)
Don't forget, Tucker Carlson said on air he was cheering for Russia. Then changed his mind later when it seemed an unpopular idea. CNN isn't unbiased, but it's far closer to fair than Fox is, and Fox seems absolutely honest compared to OAN and the like.
The idea to disbelieve a news source without having any alternative source is disingenuous. Some would complain that the sky was red if CNN declared it was blue. At least on CNN the news is kept separate from the editorials.
Re: (Score:2)
What other side to the story? You guys have binary thinking. The reality is none of us know what the fuck is going on in Ukraine. We need to stay out europes problems. They created the problem by sending Putin billions in exchange for energy, so now they can fucking fix it.
You are aware that the US has also imported oil from Russia [eia.gov] therefore the US has helped create the problem.
Stop spending MY taxpayer money on killing people. You leftists are bloodthirsty because the media has convinced you the Russians are bad and the Ukrainians are good this week.
Ronald Reagan is rolling in his grave hearing how you defend Russia like that. I am pretty sure Reagan was not a leftist.
There are no sides here, just people getting rich selling war and the rest of us who are paying for it. Wake the fuck up.
One country invades another yet you claim there are "no sides here." I am pretty sure the citizens of Ukraine who have lost all their possessions are not getting rich by "selling war".
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
They created the problem by sending Putin billions in exchange for energy
How do you know that? Are you a european energy sector expert? Where did you read it?
Stop spending MY taxpayer money on killing people
How do yo know that? Where do you get your information about how the US spends it's tax dollars?
You leftists are bloodthirsty because the media has convinced you the Russians are bad and the Ukrainians are good this week.
And you've been convinced the leftists are bad and bloodthirsty, you just are afraid to say who convinced you of it.
Re: (Score:2)
Hey credit where credits due, I didn't expect we'd jump immediately to literal schoolyard arguments. Well played.
Re: (Score:2)
So, we were wrong to build boats back in WW1? Should have all stayed home on an island? This is a fundamental attack on liberal democracy by a fascist dictatorship (and liberal doesn't mean leftist, it means that they have a vote). What sort of moral high ground would the US ever have if we said "screw them, they're not Americans, we don't care"? Right now we have it great in the US, despite the naysayers at Fox who think it's the worst of times.
Re:Any more reporting on this story? (Score:4, Informative)
Yes, Russian solders raided sources from a lab in Chernobyl [livescience.com], but my strong suspicion (based on having been there) is that there are only check sources and really low level sources stored there. Nothing that would harm anyone from holding for a while.
The CNN article is mostly alarmist and clickbaity. The level at which we can detect radiation is far lower than the level at which it's harmful to humans.
However, what the Russians did is absolutely deplorable, reckless, and inexcusable. The Ukrainian operators told them exactly where they where and what they were dealing with. The soldiers will get what they deserve.
Re: (Score:3)
Strontium-90 is also a significant hazard (and is more bioavailable). There are also high levels of plutonium in the soil, making an alpha-emitter respiratory hazard.
Re: (Score:3)
Putting aside radioactivity, plutonium is extremely toxic. You need to take serious precautions doing anything with it, just because of toxicity.
Re: (Score:2)
However, all of the really radioactive fission products, with half lives of days, weeks, or months, have had the past 35 years to decay away, so all that is really left is Cs-137 with a 30.1 year half life.
And what about the Uranium, Plutonium and the fission products with much longer half lives? They are all still there.
Dumbass
Re: (Score:3)
Another one of these idiot armchair nuclear experts on slashdot. Last month, when the power went out, they were telling us it was no big deal. I wouldn't be surprised if you were one of them. They were quoting random IAEA people with no person knowledge of conditions at the site.
But now that the orcs are gone, people are doing interviews with the actual scientists working on the site, and they're saying, "the Ukrainians were primarily worried about keeping power to a water tank that cools old fuel rods. Ex
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
I am pretty sure Russian soldiers would know they are at Chernobyl. I know it is hard to believe but Russian soldiers carry smartphones which have things like maps and gps on them. You are consuming propaganda.
These cell phones have detailed maps of which areas of Chernobyl are still heavily contaminated? Where can I buy such a phone? Also the fact that you are admitting that Russian front line soldiers are carrying smartphones with GPS only underscores a level of incompetence. Surely no soldier would carry a device that could help Ukraine locate them? Oh, wait. They have. [thedailybeast.com]
Re: (Score:2)
The Russian soldiers have no smart phones. They are recruits, they got deprived from their phones thousands of km away from the combat zones.
Only americans are so stupid to let thier soldiers have smart phones in combat zones.
NY Times has a piece on this as well (Score:3)
Russian Blunders in Chernobyl: ‘They Came and Did Whatever They Wanted’ [nytimes.com]
In a particularly ill-advised action, a Russian soldier from a chemical, biological and nuclear protection unit picked up a source of cobalt-60 at one waste storage site with his bare hands, exposing himself to so much radiation in a few seconds that it went off the scales of a Geiger counter, Mr. Simyonov said. It was not clear what happened to the man, he said.
I can venture a guess....
Mr. Simyonov, the chief safety engineer, characterized the threat to halt diesel supplies for generators as “blackmail” to force the authorities in Belarus to resolve the problem. However it happened, the electricity was restored in time and the nuclear fuel never came close to overheating.
All in all, the trench digging and other dubious activities posed a far lower risk than the waste pool, and most of that to the Russian soldiers themselves, Mr. Simyonov said, adding wryly: “We invite them back to dig more trenches here, if they want.”
Re: (Score:2)
Maybe I should read the summary closer next time you big dummy.
Re: (Score:2)
In a particularly ill-advised action, a Russian soldier from a chemical, biological and nuclear protection unit picked up a source of cobalt-60 at one waste storage site with his bare hands, exposing himself to so much radiation in a few seconds that it went off the scales of a Geiger counter, Mr. Simyonov said.
OK, that would cause acute radiation sickness. We kept hearing reports of people with acute radiation sickness, and I was thinking "That doesn't make sense, even if they were digging in the red forest and ingesting Strontiium-90 from the mud, they're just giving themselves cancer, not anything acute."
Messing around with Cobalt-60 though is the number one cause of radiation sickness. Usually via dumb scrappers stealing medical equipment.
Re: (Score:2)
We kept hearing reports of people with acute radiation sickness, and I was thinking "That doesn't make sense, even if they were digging in the red forest and ingesting Strontiium-90 from the mud, they're just giving themselves cancer, not anything acute."
Living in a trench of contaminated soil, breathing in contaminated dust, ingesting said dust and dirt when eating for a month will lead to acute radiation sicknes. So much so that visible signs will show. Which is exactly why the Russian soldiers were rushe
Re: (Score:2)
I doubt it's actually radiation sickness. It's more likely just the toxic effects of some of the nastier decay products.
Re: (Score:2)
That's because you're an idiot and don't realize it was already widely reported that one young orc was showing off by moving a box of Cobalt-60 around with his bare hands.
I guess he forgot to say something macho while he was doing it, so the radiation sickness couldn't see him.
Re: (Score:2)
We're not talking about the idiot playing with cobalt 60 - we're talking about the other guys digging trenches in the Red Forest. The GP said:
I'd question whether there's anything radioactive enough in the Red Forest now to cause radiation sickness after a month of exposure. All the highly radioactive stuff has decayed, and your left with
Re: (Score:2)
The background radiation in "the Red Forest" is deadly over the course of a few days.
Or why actually do you think it is:
a) called the red forest
b) nothing is growing there - everything is dead, not even soil bacteria are exiting
???
Re: (Score:2)
It's called the red forest because of the colour of the pine trees after they died due to absorbing ionising radiation in the direct aftermath of the disaster. These trees were mostly bulldozed and buried under sand, and pine saplings were planted on top. It isn't dead any more. You can read about how it's turned into an involuntary wildlife refuge on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
That said, there's a lot of highly toxic stuff still in the dirt, even if the radiation isn't immediately leth
Re: (Score:2)
The big mistake is being credulous that you know what all the risks are, and that they're minor.
The public sources will only list inaccurate, safe-sounding amounts of the least dangerous stuff, for important security reasons. It should be, but apparently isn't, obvious that this is the case with all types of information about anything nuclear.
There is a bunch of stuff missing, too, but don't presume that we know exactly what is missing simply because we read articles that listed stuff that was missing.
Re: (Score:2)
Not only were the Russian soldiers completely inept at anything regarding the nuclear site (and from being soldiers as we've seen), they cut power to the location and wouldn't let fuel in for the backup generators to work. The Ukrainians resorted to stealing fuel from the Russians [bbc.com] to keep the electricity flowing.
Re: (Score:2)
Genuine question, what news sources do you trust?
Re: NY Times has a piece on this as well (Score:5, Informative)
Genuine question, what news sources do you trust?
They're just trolling. CNN, the New York Times, and the BBC are three of the most respected news organizations on the planet. Even The Washington Post, despite Bezos' interference, is highly regarded.
You will note the troll doesn't say anything about the veracity of the story, only that it appears in two different news organizations. Which is what would be expected if the Times produces the story and CNN then references it.
It's almost as if copying and pasting is unknown to the troll.
Re: (Score:3)
I agree but I was waiting for the inevitable "I don't trust any news sources man. That's how they control you." because even though "mainstream" news sources have serious problems the fact is alternative media has the same problems to an even worse degree.
Or maybe they have some actual examples that we can put under the same scrutiny that CNN is doing here. Would only be fair. With a username of "Misinformation" I expect better!
Re: (Score:2)
Same question, where do you inform your opinion of these events from? It's easy (and fun) to just bash CNN and the NYT but provide some counterexamples eh?
Re: (Score:3)
You really are responding to one of Slashdot's oldest and most well-known trolls. However, in the past year the troll has gotten far less clever but more shrill and antagonistic. We can only speculate what the cause is - some traumatic life event, possibly maladjustments to medication, perhaps the person supplies them methamphetamines has gotten arrested and this is what withdrawal symptoms look like.
My point is that you won't get an actual answer from whoever this is because their ultimate goal in pos
Re: (Score:3)
You really are responding to one of Slashdot's oldest and most well-known trolls.
Not sure if it is the same person it is at least 4 different accounts on this thread alone:
rswillergun [slashdot.org]
rsillvergun [slashdot.org]
rsilverguns [slashdot.org]
rslverguns [slashdot.org]
Somehow these accounts with slightly different names are all parroting the same point. I wonder what is happening here? Hmmmm.
Re: NY Times has a piece on this as well (Score:4, Informative)
Re: (Score:2)
You would be a lot more effective on that if you actually sourced accurate information counter to what you feel is the narrative instead of just barking about how stupid everyone you diagree with is. Why does the "counter-narrative" have to be so unhinged?
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
Drone footage (Score:5, Interesting)
Re: Drone footage (Score:4, Informative)
Re: (Score:2)
When did Ukraine stage an attack on Chernobyl? What are you talking about?
Re: (Score:2)
Putin invaded Ukraine.
Re: (Score:2)
The Puticorn is not being truthy with you, comrade.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FO... [twimg.com]
Anyone surprised? (Score:2)
When your "soldiers" film themselves committing crimes [twitter.com]*, should it be any surprise they don't don't care about tracking radiation all over the place?
WARNING: This is highly graphic. This is no joke. This is not a Rick roll. This is a Russian soldier who filmed himself committing the crime and bragging about it.
Re:Anyone surprised? (Score:5, Insightful)
A single reprehensible act by one Ukranian unit - taken against enemy combatants - cannot possibly be considered even remotely equivalent to the repeated, widespread atrocities apparently being systematically committed against civilians by the Russian Army as a whole.
Re:Anyone surprised? (Score:5, Insightful)
The escalation at all levels, and the violence, rapes and death, committed by all 'sides', is atrocious.
Go back to St. Petersburg, Ivan. The ONLY ones committing rapes are Russian soldiers and their Chechen allies. Not a single Ukrainian soldier or volunteer has committed any rapes. The ONLY violence is being committed by Russia's invasion of Ukraine and its deliberate destruction of towns and cities such as Bucha and Mariupol. The ONLY ones deliberately killing civilians is Russia as seen by the deliberate attack on civilians at the train station in Kramatorsk [cnn.com]. Russia even admitted they launched the missile [twitter.com] which killed the civilians, then tried to lie about it.
As far as killing those Russian soldiers, once you set out to murder civilians and rape children and women, you lose all protections. You are the criminal and should not escape punishment. With the hundreds of civilians murdered in Bucha [twitter.com], hundreds more in Borodianka and who knows how many thousands in Mariupol, a few dead Russian soldiers doesn't even register.
And we're pumping the region full of all kinds weapons that are being used, including in urban warfare, to fight against Russian soldiers and their weapons, which is predictably resulting in massive collateral damage including 1000s of innocent lives.
As mentioned above, Russia is deliberately targeting civlians so there will be 1000s of innocent lives lost. Had Russia not invaded Ukraine, none of this would be happening. But since Putin didn't want another propsering democratic country on his border, this is the result. All he has to do is withdraw every single Russia soldier from within Urkaine's borders, including Crimea, and stop supporting terrorists, and this will all be over. Until then, Russian soliders will keep targeting civilians and the soldiers in turn will keep getting killed [twitter.com]. ~19,000 and counting.
Re: (Score:3)
I was referring to all sides at all levels including leaders, media, military, militias, mercenaries, even comments on the internet, etc.
And not attributing rape to all of them.
The rest of your comment isn't going to help reduce any of the suffering. This is another awful war.
Stop with the deflecting. This is Russia's war. They're the ones attacking a foreign country. Had they not invaded Ukraine none of this would be happening. You can't deny it or make excuses. This falls squarely on Putin's shoulders.
As for final comment, stop the bullshit. You never denied anything I said which shows the evidence for criminal acts falls squarely on Russian soldiers. Now go get your bottle of vodka from uncle Vlad.
Re: (Score:2)
all 'sides'
Fuck you, not-see orc.
missing men, and Russians were digging "trenches" (Score:2)
Any russians here? (Score:5, Interesting)
Can anyone tell us what a 20 year old (born 2002) product of the Russian educational system would know about the 1986 soviet-caused Chernobyl disaster in particular, and danger of radiation in general?
/. "editor" strikes out again. (Score:3)
Uh, no. It's "nuclear contaminated", and is right there in the summary. I'll ber EditorDavid pronounces it "nukular", too.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
The melted reactor fuel mixed with everything that was dumped on it and everything that was around it and it become a lava-like paste (except more dangerous). It has cooled down, but the fuel is still there and it still randomly creates pockets where nuclear reaction restarts. Most important job of the employees in the reactor site is to monitor for these pockets and do necessary actions when they are spotted to prevent the problem from escalating worse. Workers on the site considered the scenario so bad th
Re: (Score:2)
Here is a virtual globe::
https://www.echalk.co.uk/Scien... [echalk.co.uk]
1. Search Chernobyl (hint, if you don't know where it is, search for Italy (the boot in Europe), it should be close enough)
2. Rotate the globe so you see to the other side of the globe
3. What do you see? Is it China?
Re: (Score:3)
You joke about that, but that's what the theory of "China Syndrome" is about. Ted Turner's late wife wrote a book and later a screenplay about this. This is why Three Mile Island was shutdown and why they never made reactors capable of terawatt generation. That actually could happen with a big enough reactor, but it would wipe out life on the surface well before it melted through the core and turned everything in its path to corium (radioactive fuel minteral).
Gravity does not work that way. Even in the wildest theoretical world where it could continue melting its way infinitely, it would reach the center of Earth's mass and stop moving [wikipedia.org].
It is, however, at least theoretically possible that a sufficiently large reactor located close enough to the water table could melt its way down until it reaches the water table (or worse, a water storage pool inside the plant itself, e.g. Chernobyl's "bubbler pool"), at which point you'd get a highly radioactive plume that woul
Re: (Score:2)
Gravity does not work that way.
Yes, people understand that, just like they understand that the antipodes of China are in the Southern Hemisphere. The name "China Syndrome" was supposed to be humorous.
Re:Just be thankful... (Score:4, Funny)
Three Mile Island was basically America's Chernobyl. The main difference is it was built with containment structures in place in case a disaster occurred.
The Russian plan was more nuanced. They determined that those additional containment measures are only needed in the event of a meltdown, and so when Chernobyl reactor 4 melted down, that's when they executed their plan to build a containment structure around it.
Re: (Score:3)
Three Mile Island was basically America's Chernobyl
Not even close. Chernobyl was a graphite reactor that was built in the 1950s. Its design was flawed from the minute it went on line. It was a disaster waiting to happen.
Three Mile Island was a modern reactor, as modern as something designed in the '60s could be. It was complete with modern safety systems and fail safes. It is also the most over blow "incident" in history. I won't use the term"disaster " because it wasn't.
The incident was cause by human error. The safety systems in place worked e
Re: Just be thankful... (Score:3)
Russia was aware of the problem with the graphite tipped control rod design before it was even built. They went with it anyways because it was cheap.
Re: (Score:3)
Belarus would have objected, as they wouldn't want to get fucked by Chernobyl and the Russians for a second time... (the Russians used cloud seeding to dump a radioactive cloud onto thousands of square miles of Belarus, so it wouldn't reach Moscow)
Anyway, on Windy [windy.com], there's a "Radiation" choice with the extra layers, and the meter near chernobyl has been steadily going between 400 and 500 nSv/hr for a long time.
Re: (Score:3)
Belarus would have objected
Of course the entire world would have objected, but I wonder why you think Belarus had any say in the matter.
Re:Just be thankful... (Score:4, Informative)
You can't cause a meltdown in reactors that have been cold for 22 years. And, prevailing winds would carry that shit north and east, e.g. into Belarus and Russia.
I guarantee that was not the objective. More likely the exclusion zone would be a nice corridor to head towards Kyiv through, as there wouldn't be any defensive emplacements built there due to the radiation hazard, and knowing that you are sending dipshit conscripts in that don't know where they are, or what the dangers are.
Re: (Score:2)
That's pretty deep down the conspiracy theory hole, mate.
Some would say that describes the USA. Maybe we're on information control 5.06.
"Some would say?" Who exactly? 5.06? You don't find that a remarkably precise number? Enough innuendo, present your evidence or gtfo.
Re: (Score:2)
a Russian soldier running from a drone, leading it back to his unit
Meanwhile, the other side is dying because they didn't know about something that should have been taught in history books
It was Russian soldiers getting contaminated at Chernobyl, Vlad.
That's one side. The V orcs and the Z orcs are the same side.