In New Benchmark Tests, AMD Challenges Both Intel And Nvidia (hothardware.com) 130
"AMD is unleashing an arsenal of products today," writes Slashdot reader MojoKid.
Hot Hardware writes: The Zen 2-based AMD Ryzen 3000 series is easily one of the most anticipated product launches in the PC space in recent memory. AMD has essentially promised to address virtually all of the perceived shortcomings of the original Zen-based Ryzen processors, with the Ryzen 3000 series, while continuing to aggressively challenge Intel on multiple fronts -- performance, power, price, you name it.
MojoKid summarizes their analysis: In the benchmarks, performance has been improved across the board. The AMD Ryzen 9 3900X and Ryzen 7 3700X offered superior single and multi-thread performance versus their second-gen counterparts, and better latency characteristics, that allowed them to occasionally overtake processors with more cores / threads in a few multi-threaded tests. On a couple of occasions, the 12-core / 24-thread Ryzen 9 3900X even outpaced the 16-core / 32-thread Threadripper 2950X. Performance versus Intel is more of a mixed bag, but the Ryzen 3000 series still looks strong. Single-thread performance is roughly on-par with Intel's Coffee Lake based Core i9-9900K, depending on the workload. Multi-threaded scaling is a dogfight strictly in terms of absolute performance, but because AMD offers more cores per dollar, the Ryzen 3000 series is the clear winner here.
Meanwhile, AMD's Radeon RX 5700 and Radeon RX 5700 XT Navi-powered graphics cards are set to take on NVIDIA's GeForce RTX offerings in the midrange
There's more details in the original submission, and PC World writes that AMD's Radeon RX 5700 and Radeon RX 5700 XT graphics cards "represent a fresh start and a bright future for AMD, brimming with technologies that have never been seen in GPUs before." But they're not the only site offering a detailed analysis.
Forbes tested the chips on five high-workload games (including World of Tanks and Shadow of the Tomb Raider) and shared their results: As usual, things are very title and resolution dependent, but in general, [AMD's] RX 5700 XT proved to be a slightly better option at 1080p with the RTX 2060 Super mostly matching it above this... However, the 2060 Super was cooler-running and much quieter than its AMD counterpart, plus I'd argue it's better-looking too... You also get the option of Ray Tracing and DLSS, but even discounting those, the Nvidia card is a slightly better buy overall.
But CNET argues that AMD's new graphics cards "are very quiet. They are bigger and do require more power than the RTX 2060...but the 2060 Super has increased power requirements as well."
TL:DR: There's a chip war going on.
Hot Hardware writes: The Zen 2-based AMD Ryzen 3000 series is easily one of the most anticipated product launches in the PC space in recent memory. AMD has essentially promised to address virtually all of the perceived shortcomings of the original Zen-based Ryzen processors, with the Ryzen 3000 series, while continuing to aggressively challenge Intel on multiple fronts -- performance, power, price, you name it.
MojoKid summarizes their analysis: In the benchmarks, performance has been improved across the board. The AMD Ryzen 9 3900X and Ryzen 7 3700X offered superior single and multi-thread performance versus their second-gen counterparts, and better latency characteristics, that allowed them to occasionally overtake processors with more cores / threads in a few multi-threaded tests. On a couple of occasions, the 12-core / 24-thread Ryzen 9 3900X even outpaced the 16-core / 32-thread Threadripper 2950X. Performance versus Intel is more of a mixed bag, but the Ryzen 3000 series still looks strong. Single-thread performance is roughly on-par with Intel's Coffee Lake based Core i9-9900K, depending on the workload. Multi-threaded scaling is a dogfight strictly in terms of absolute performance, but because AMD offers more cores per dollar, the Ryzen 3000 series is the clear winner here.
Meanwhile, AMD's Radeon RX 5700 and Radeon RX 5700 XT Navi-powered graphics cards are set to take on NVIDIA's GeForce RTX offerings in the midrange
There's more details in the original submission, and PC World writes that AMD's Radeon RX 5700 and Radeon RX 5700 XT graphics cards "represent a fresh start and a bright future for AMD, brimming with technologies that have never been seen in GPUs before." But they're not the only site offering a detailed analysis.
Forbes tested the chips on five high-workload games (including World of Tanks and Shadow of the Tomb Raider) and shared their results: As usual, things are very title and resolution dependent, but in general, [AMD's] RX 5700 XT proved to be a slightly better option at 1080p with the RTX 2060 Super mostly matching it above this... However, the 2060 Super was cooler-running and much quieter than its AMD counterpart, plus I'd argue it's better-looking too... You also get the option of Ray Tracing and DLSS, but even discounting those, the Nvidia card is a slightly better buy overall.
But CNET argues that AMD's new graphics cards "are very quiet. They are bigger and do require more power than the RTX 2060...but the 2060 Super has increased power requirements as well."
TL:DR: There's a chip war going on.
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And it begins... (Score:2, Insightful)
The obligatory fanboy posts..
I like that AMD is competing with both Intel & Nvidia. Does anyone thing NV would have releaed the Super cards otherwise?
Was this an advertainment infomercial... (Score:2)
...or an infotainment advermercial?
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Either way, it was unleashed on Slashdot!
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I refuse to read even the summary until they come out with the Blipvert version.
Intel is not a challenge. (Score:5, Informative)
I take issue with this "challenging Intel" bullshit because AMD has blown them away and left Intel in the dust. Run the benchmarks with all the software patches needed to keep Intel's chip secure (which means completely disabling hyper-threading) and you'll see that Intel is no match for AMD's chips.
Re: Intel is not a challenge. (Score:3, Funny)
AMD may be faster now, but they have a long way to go with compatibility. Sure, you can sort of get some software working, like Spectre, sometimes... but AMD systems still can't run any kind of Meltdown based code properly.
AMD is great for games, video maker, streamers, businesses and investors, but they are rather lackluster in performance when it comes to exploit writers.
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Even without the Spectre patches Intel are no match for AMD. At the same price point AMD trounces them. It's not even close for anything other than certain games.
The gap gets even bigger when you consider motherboards too.
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Must suck that Apple only ships Intel, right? Enjoy your meltdown magnet.
Will that remain true though? (Score:4, Informative)
Must suck that Apple only ships Intel, right?
In the last year or so it would be nice to have AMD as options (though some would probably still prefer Intel as a known quantity).
However Apple does ship a LOT of AMD chips - graphics cards. So you are not exactly right there.
I am kind of wondering if AMD might be not offered as a BTO option for the new Mac Pro...
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Given that Apple is unable to engineer even a phone charger, it's hardly a surprise that Apple engineers would be flummoxed by the challenge of offering an alternative CPU.
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Offering AMD would mean a whole new motherboard, with different power and cooling requirements. I can't see them doing it as an option. Maybe a complete switch, if AMD improves its mobile offerings a little.
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Well for just about every SI switching between Intel and AMD should be easy since the industry is built on standards. Except Apple isn't an SI, they have to be special and use custom form factors for everything. So they did it to themselves.
I imagine they probably also have some kind of exclusivity deal with Intel in order to guarantee shipments of chips too. So even if they could switch to AMD chips and boards without reworking anything they would still likely be locked in.
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For the next few years there is little to no no chance that Apple will offer AMD CPUs in their computers. The overriding reason is that there is no good way of putting high-speed ThunderBolt connections on them.
But, coming out in sometime in 2021, ThunderBolt 3 will form the underlying basis for USB 4, and will be offered royalty-free. So sometime after that AMD will presumably offer that, and Apple will be in a position to choose between AMD, Intel, and their own ARM implementation. At that point things sh
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May I remind that some of the vulnerabilities (meltdown/spectre) are exploitable via javascript? Now... think what could happen when you use your gaming PC to check your bank account online. Nobody needs to be targeting at _you_, but your data is part of a bigger package (cons of centralising the internet). Tell that to the (at least) 38 million clients of Adobe.
So, yeh, a little protection is always convenient. And if that protection comes at a big cost in one CPU manufacturer, you just go to the next who
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You do no one any favours by comparing AMD to Intel while gimping Intel.
On the contrary, I'm putting them on level footing by ensuring they are of comparable security. This also does everyone the favor of seeing how badly Intel compares when secured which influences the server industry significantly. Would you like to buy a product you thought was great only to find out it has shitty performance when secured?
The desktop market has thin profit margins meaning it's of little influence, while the server market is where the real profit is and therefore highly influential. It's a
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Would you like to buy a product you thought was great only to find out it has shitty performance when secured?
It has been working for MySQL for ages. And then people hire the devs for support to get it working better!
Because having all the features you would want for serious use is considered "overkill" even when it is free and installs in about the same disk space.
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You can't compare AMD and Intel for security on the server. AMD's encrypted RAM features are way ahead of anything that Intel offers.
Re: Intel makes zero sense at this point for purch (Score:1)
Your friend is a fanboy, who recently switched allegiance but is still a fanboy. You shouldn't be listening to anything he says because his decisions are based on emotion and marketing as opposed to fact and reason.
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Yes, you are right, my friend IS a fanboy. I however am not. I've built systems from the 6502 days. I've never been into fanboyism. I always select the best chip for the job and take into account multiple factors. That has meant I've built both Mostek, Motorola, Zilog, AMD and Intel systems.
The fact Intel can't even keep a hard core Intel fanboy happy is not good news for them though...
Personally I went socket AM4 for my last build, simply because for what I do it made way better sense. Intel really n
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That has meant I've built both Mostek, Motorola, Zilog, AMD and Intel systems.
Both?
If I had money to burn (Score:2)
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The thing that has prevented me from buying an AMD card has been the drivers. Everywhere I read the reviewers mention issues and I see it on /r/buildapc as well. Nvidia is still milking for money even with Super. And nobody's cards offer the performance bump I want over my 980ti for the price I want. So I guess I will just keep my card for now. I remember when the high end cards were $350, not over $1000. You can claim that chip making has gotten more expensive over the years, but in the same time frame CPU
Nope, card's just fine (Score:2)
I don't think there's anything wrong with the card. I'll probably end up putting it on ebay and going back
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There are a lot of hoops to jump through to make shit run right, but meh.
I'm not 100% sure how much of that is the weirdness of my GPU (Vega M GL, Windows 10), but my gaming rig (1080Ti, Windows 10) just... well, works.
My other AMD GPU is a really old mobile unit (one of the island series) which is running exclusively on Linux. Drivers there are also pretty annoying, but mostly because of the iGPU/dGPU mechanism (requires setting an environment variable for a process to use the dGPU libraries
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AMD's graphics and processor divisions seem to be completely separate (doesn't surprise me since the graphics BU was formerly ATI) and includes separate driver devs. Their drivers related to processors and chipsets are fine while the graphics drivers are god awful. Except in Linux, where their willingness to be relatively forthcoming about the arch means the open source drivers are quite good. If it wasn't for the whole signing thing then maybe we should just do open source windows drivers for them too.
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As for the OSS Linux drivers- I use them on my SI Radeon (laptop, hybrid GPU), and they are stable, and they work well- my complaint there is with the lack of userspace tooling to make it easy to select which GPU to use. Currently, you have to set an environment variable (DRI_PRIME) in order to select the discrete GPU, while the proprietary drivers (which
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I'm happy with them, for the most part, minus the lack of real userspace management tooling (and hence, the need to twiddle environment variables to select whether an app runs using the Intel or the AMD GPU)
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The catalyst package in general was just nicer to work with. The OSS methodology for switching between is clunky as hell, to put it kindly.
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The AMD fanboyism on this site is getting out of control.
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Performance and price are great, but AMD can't seem to match nVidia on stability.
That's the only contentious opinion in his post. Yet this site is flush with +5 insightful rips on how AMD is the second coming of Christ because it is almost within reach of nvidia.
SystemD fails boot in later versions than LTS (Score:3, Interesting)
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Why does that not surprise me. Fortunately I use a proven, reliable init system (sysIVinit), not that systemd crap.
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Why does that not surprise me. Fortunately I use a proven, reliable init system (sysIVinit), not that systemd crap.
Cool story. Your proven reliable system is immune simply because it doesn't take advantage of newer *kernel* features and therefore doesn't suffer from this *Linux kernel bug*.
Fuck off.
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"My favorite filesystem is unfit for purpose, so it's clearly the fault of the kernel!"
The retard has spoken.
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And who has written software that depends on a known kernel issue not happening? Seriously, get you head out of your behind...
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>"Why does that not surprise me. Fortunately I use a proven, reliable init system (sysIVinit), not that systemd crap."
There is zero evidence at this time that the issue is related to systemd. And it has nothing to do with number of cores, because Threadripper doesn't have the issue.
I researched it some and there doesn't appear to be any clear answer yet, only that older distro versions (yes, WITH systemd) are booting fine. It might be related the X570 chipset. It might be a bug in newer systemd. It m
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At home, my main computer is already AMD, but it is very old now. A Phenom II X6 1090T with Asus MB and fanless NVidia card. Has been rock solid and great for 8 years, running Mageia! About 4 years in I upgraded from spinning HD to SSD. I have always had a new CPU/MB about every 3 years, so going 8 years this last time is amazing.
I was already planning to upgrade this machine to a Zen 2 3700x, probably on an Asus X570-Pro. Now I realize I might have to wait a bit longer, still. I don't want an epic
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Actually, from recent reports (I've read it at heise.de), this is a known issue with the random number generator. It seems the bug only gets more visibility on the new Ryzen processors. systemd has indeed been patched, and the patch is in the new Debian version. Other distros may wait a while before releasing updates, so as to avoid having to update installation images.
Yes, it may be a bug needing a fix in the kernel, but still...
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+1 Informative
The problem with this type of bug is that if it is present in the boot media for the Linux installation, it makes installing impossible or very difficult. This is amplified by the fact that most people who get their hands on this chip probably are going to also have a new MB and chipset and will be performing fresh installs of the most recent distros. And updates won't help until the system is installed. So it requires the distro to create new installation images (which is a big deal for th
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Just move to sysIVinit for a while. You can still install with it with not a lot of effort. You can move back to systemd when their mess is fixed.
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> Complicating this issue further is that when trying Linux 5.0/5.1/5.2 kernels on Ubuntu 18.04 LTS, they all booted up fine! Hence it doesn't appear to simply be a kernel regression but either some kernel+systemd interaction issue happening just on AMD Ryzen 3000 series processors or some awkward thing happening with the X570 chipset.
Phoronix, SHUT THE F*** UP!
It's a bug alright - in the kernel. How long have you been following Linux? And you *still* haven't learnt the first rule of kernel maintenance?
I
I hate the all or nothing mentality (Score:1)
where people say products are either the best you can get, or they're complete useless shit.
Obviously, with AMD being on par on average, but being significantly cheaper, they're the best option and have been for a long time. The vast majority of consumers only fool themselves when they think it's sensible to pay 4x more to get another 14% performance with an Intel or NVidia.
so-called 'lauch day' is a complete failure (Score:1)
I'm in the bay area. I was really hoping to buy amd today, an x570 mobo and ryzen 5 or 7 in 3000 series.
no dice. cannot buy today.
I stood at frys at sunnyvale, almost walking distance from AMD hq.
a bunch of us asked the frys counter slave if they had the 3k series in. they had 3 mobos on the shelf (all expensive, no real selection) and when the rep came back after asking the main 'cage' guys, she said there were no cpu chips to be bought today.
central computers, also huge in the bay area, nothing to buy
Crybaby whiner cries, nobody cares. (Score:4, Insightful)
"Wah, I wanted it NOW! Why can't I have everything I want WHEN I EXPECT TO HAVE MY ENTITLEMENT IN HAND!? Shame on you AMD for making a grown bitch cry, I'll never stop crying now!" -Bitch
Re: Crybaby whiner cries, nobody cares. (Score:1)
Lol this is exactly how I read the above post.
Wahhhhhh I can't have it the day it released wahhhhhh.
Re:so-called 'lauch day' is a complete failure (Score:5, Interesting)
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Of course you might be lucky and the package will arrive without being bothered, but I would not rely on luck with several thousand dollars in play.
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>"Just buy it from NewEgg. It's a little retailer online https://www.newegg.com/amd-ryz [newegg.com]... [newegg.com]"
"OUT OF STOCK.
Sold and Shipped by Newegg"
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Speaking of NewEgg... has anyone else been getting inundated with NewEgg email spam, starting a few weeks ago?
It's seriously made me wonder if I should ever buy anything from them again.
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Yes, the frequency they send emails is going up a lot. They're also less useful deals too.
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I shop there and I don't get spammed at all. Maybe there is a setting?
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first of all, amd should be ashamed of picking a SUNDAY to launch chip sales. stupid beyond belief.
You think a shortage would have been better if they released on a day with more open shops and more customers? Did you use an old Pentium 100 to calculate that logic?
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I hear they're going on ebay for $200+ MSRP. AMD also had them on their own website earlier in the day when i checked, just not on amazon or newegg.
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sorry princess, maybe you should email AMD direct and they will rush one right out the door for your precious soul
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LOL this post is hilarious, like "what if an Apple user bought regular brands?" It sounds innocent, but a total shit-show follows.
You drive a BWM too, right?
When Newegg or MWave carry it, that means it is ready to be purchased. There is nothing special about purchasing on "launch day." You're not supposed to have run down to the store, you're merely supposed to start anticipating buying it soon now that stores can start ordering it.
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all that was 100% failure, today.
NewEgg sold out. Every Microcenter opened to long lines. Doesn't sound like "100% failure" to me.
Fry's sucks anyway.