HTC's New Flagship Phone Has AI and a Second Screen, But No Headphone Jack (theverge.com) 205
An anonymous reader shares a report on The Verge: HTC is getting 2017 off to a flying start with an unseasonably early announcement of its next flagship phone: the U Ultra. This 5.7-inch device inaugurates a new U series of smartphones and is joined by a smaller and lesser U Play, which scales things down to 5.2 inches and a humbler camera and processor spec. HTC is touting a new Sense Companion, which is its take on the growing trend for putting AI assistants into phones, plus the addition of a second screen at the top of the U Ultra. As with Apple's latest iPhones, Lenovo's Moto Z, and the HTC Bolt, neither of HTC's new handsets has a headphone jack. The other big change on the outside is the U Ultra's second screen, which is a thin 2-inch strip residing to the right of the front-facing camera and immediately above the Super LCD 5 screen.
No headphone jack ... (Score:5, Informative)
... is a ploy to boost the hardware side with expensive Bluetooth alternatives.
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The headphones are on a rack right there with the phones.
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They probably can't guarantee it, but some people will buy the "official" whatever, even if there are better 3rd party brands available. They don't care if some of the extra money you spend goes elsewhere, as long as some of it comes to them and increases their profits.
I'm curious for how many people though no headphone jack is a big enough turn-off that customers will look away. Probably depends on the customer. For me, if I had two phones available with similar specs, but one was slightly thinner than
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I know that if there is a top grade phone with replaceable battery, micro-sd slot and headphone jack then I'm in. I'm still using a 2 year old S5 Active because it still meets my needs and I haven't seen anything I consider enough better to make me pay out 700-800 dollars.
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I look at the various new phones that come out, and they are all missing a feature I want, so I will keep using the phone I have until something better comes along.
My requirements are:
Everything else is negotiable. At least with Android, someone will sell me what I want.
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I replaced it with a Kyocera Duraforce XD. It's not the absolute latest-greatest but it's a ruggedized phone that has replacable battery, microsd slot, headphone jack. Screen is big. There is a smaller version of this phone from Kyocera.
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One of my sons had one and really liked it.
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and user replaceable batteries (justified by water resistance features very few people demanded, though I'm one of theach few who actually needed it).
This is flat wrong.
1) User-replaceable batteries do not make it impossible to make a phone water resistant. My Samsung Galaxy S5 is proof of this.
2) LOTS of people demanded this; so many, in fact, that Apple was finally forced to give in and make their latest iPhones water-resistant.
The only reasons to eliminate user-replaceable batteries are to save cost, an
Multiple reasons (Score:3)
The only reasons to eliminate user-replaceable batteries are to save cost, and maybe to profit from expensive battery-replacement services.
Those are legitimate reasons but they aren't the only ones. By making the batteries not user replaceable companies like Apple avoid a variety of problems. The most important consideration is that don't have to worry about poor quality batteries from third party vendors. This can cause all sorts of headaches including warranty claims, product image problems, counterfeit batteries, lawsuits, etc. Being able to maintain full control over the product should in principle result in a better or at least more c
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Re:No headphone jack ... (Score:5, Insightful)
Fuck dongles. Seriously, fuck needing a dongle to get a 0.01mm thinner phone with worse battery life.
They are particularly bad for headphones, because you tend to use headphones while moving around where as charging is done stationary. That means strain on the connector, and the headphone socket is fairly robust but the USB port is much more prone to damage.
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I have a lot of broken and worn headphone jacks that say different.
Having USB-C ports on portable devices is relatively new so time will tell. Given that the USB-C port is an evolution of the mini and micro USB port I suspect that the people behind this have it figured out. If not then expect USB-D ports or something else to replace them. Sure it sucks having to buy all new accessories when getting a new phone but I'm old enough to remember the days before USB became the charging standard. There were a
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Given that micro-USB is the flakiest jack I've ever dealt with, I'd be shocked if they finally figured it out. Each progressive iteration of USB has had more problems than the last, because the contacts are too small to be reliable.
What makes 1/8" mini plugs awesome is that the contact surface alone is about as thick as an entire USB-C connector. For something that's constantly being bumped, you can't beat large contact surfaces for reliability.
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and still no way to recharge the phone on the desktop at the office, and listen music at the same time while working, without an USB dock or another dongle, or crappy Bluetooth. And no, not every work environment let you install any kind on media player on your desktop computer.
Re:No headphone jack ... (Score:4, Insightful)
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Re:No headphone jack ... (Score:5, Insightful)
Must be a shitty ploy, my brand new HTC bolt came with wired headphones.
Pushing more expensive headphones might be a bonus short-term side effect, but the real victory here is the potential of closing the analog hole for mobile devices. I fully expect someone to introduce "end to end" DRM within a year or two which will require an authenticated and encrypted connection from the source (file or stream) through the mobile processor, to the headphones. Non-compliant headphones won't be able to authenticate with the host device and therefore won't be usable with certain DRM'd media.
Don't be surprised when Apple shows more "courage" and removes the analog audio connectors from their next lineup of desktops and laptops (if they haven't already). The desktop / laptop market will swiftly follow once people accept it on mobile.
Take a look at HDCP [wikipedia.org] for an example of how this has already been done elsewhere.
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I fully expect someone to introduce "end to end" DRM within a year or two which will require an authenticated and encrypted connection from the source (file or stream) through the mobile processor, to the headphones.
I'm not sure how this helps, it's not like people can't or won't strip the wires from a pair of headphones and wire them to the wires stripped from a microphone. A simpler solution that doesn't destroy the headphones and with only a minimal loss in quality is putting microphones in the ears of a foam head to wear the headphones.
They can't plug the analog hole.
Don't be surprised when Apple shows more "courage" and removes the analog audio connectors from their next lineup of desktops and laptops (if they haven't already). The desktop / laptop market will swiftly follow once people accept it on mobile.
If Apple does get rid of the analog audio ports I expect them to be replaced with the Lightning port or whatever they come up to replace it. This ge
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Is the analog hole even relevant? I think it's much more convenient for a pirate to use a digital hole (there are plenty) and rip bit-for-bit accurate recordings. Sure, they can fall back on analog if all the digital holes are closed up, but I don't see that happening anytime soon.
USB-C is analog too (Score:2)
I fully expect most USB-C headphones to be analog in fact, if this phone does support analog audio over USB-C.
I wonder if you can have a cable with USB-C on one end and jack on the other end.
Although if you have to use a powered USB hub just because you don't have separate plugs for power and audio, then your USB analog headphones are useless unless there's a DAC in the hub, or plugged into the hub. And if you use a PC to power the hub, then you plug either a DAC or digital headphones.. Then who the hell is
The end (Score:2)
I guess that marks the end of 8 years of HTC phones for me. Listening to music is one of my most common uses of my phone, and there's literally no way I'm changing over to headsets I also have to recharge.
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The margins on smartphones is crappy and the industry has already tried other gimmicks like changing physical dimensions, providing high resolution (even 3D), better cameras, Bluetooth remote control, adorable/utility cases, and shit like that.
Time to step away from the core competency and sell rechargeable accessories.
Hopefully, the batter life of airpods can be improved upon to increase sales along with some waterproofing, crap like that.
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Using the USB C spec does not necessarily push the idea of more expensive alternatives. Using USB C is less "evil" than Apple pushing the lightning connector because USB C includes [the possibility of] an analog audio signal without the need for an external DAC. This means that all that is required to use analog headphones is a USB C to 3.5mm adapter. This would not even fully be considered a "dongle" because it does not require any fancy electronics for functionality. In Host Audio Adapter mode, pins S
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Agreed but unlike Apple ones, you might buy one for $1 or something like that. Even order a bag of ten or more if you really want.
The dongle would more easily attach to the male jack than to the USB phone, so it ought to be like 3.5 to 6.35mm adapters on headphones : sometimes there's such a dongle attached on a headphones and you don't even know it's there unless you check there's one.
Computer-like example : the DVI-to-VGA adapters. I hate them less since figuring out screwing the VGA cable to the DVI-I ad
SD and battery (Score:5, Insightful)
Does it have an SD slot and a removable battery. If not, still a non buy.
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It has an SD slot!
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Please let me know what type of phone you are using. And how useful is it today?
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LG-VS985/ cyanogen mod.
Still good
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I'm using a Galaxy S5. Works great.
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I went from an S4 (I literally crushed it) to an S5 Active. Speed wise I really couldn't tell any difference in operation.
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Sony Ericsson W810, works fine to make calls on but the battery starts to go sour and it starts to have signs of falling apart - but it works.
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Is that still being developed?
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Does it have an SD slot and a removable battery. If not, still a non buy.
I just bought my wife a new Galaxy S5. IMHO it's the best phone ever made. Everything has gotten worse since. I hope it never goes out of production.
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I think the S5 is the perfect phone. They should just keep upgrading the logic board, I can't see why anything else needs to change.
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The battery needs to be pulled when this thing gets wet.
Not if, when.
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What? I've had perhaps a half dozen cell phones. Some with removable batteries, some not.
I never have had to pull a battery because I got the thing wet.
What in bog's name are you doing?
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He's playing in a bog.
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I've dropped one in a toilet a few years ago. Yanked the battery out, dried it as best I could and threw it in a gallon ziplock bag with some rice. Pulled it out a couple days later, replaced the battery and put it back together and it worked good as new. The new ones supposedly are water proof though so I guess you shouldn't need to do this for those.
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O-o
What happened to the rice!?
Re: SD and battery (Score:2, Insightful)
So when your internal li-ion battery degrades and considerably loses its ability to hold charge, you can carry it around *and* and extra battery pack! Or buy a new phone because the repair cost is so high it makes more economic sense. Yay! $$$$
Or if whatever reason you want control over your device and just want to completely pull the power quickly, you can try draining the charge over the next hour.
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And when the li-ion battery swells up you definitely want to change it. I have suffered from that in many cases. Shitty battery technology.
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I imagine a removable battery might have made the Note7 repairable.
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If you're paranoid or a criminal you really want to be able to pull the battery when "they" are tracking you.
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Aluminum foil doesn't work for this?
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An SD card may not be important for as many people anymore, but a removable battery could extend the life of a phone by several years. A removable battery easily adds $100 value to a phone IMO.
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My iPhone is 5.5 years old, never needed a new battery, still holds ~80% of it's original time. Most people don't keep their phone to the half life of the battery (~10 years).
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Most Android phones don't have a 10 year of even 3 year battery. My wife's LG isn't at 80% and it's less than a year old. If I wanted a phone with no headphone jack, no easily replaceable battery and no sd card slot I'd buy a fucking Apple.
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That's either defective stuff or defective design. A well designed LiPo based battery powered system simply should not fail in less than 3-5 years, those safeguards should be in the battery for both charging and discharging.
I would love an Android but it's absolutely a horrendous POS to deal with or interact with as an OS and the majority of manufacturers ignore all laws and regulations including the ones on warranty, usability, safety and copyright. Even large manufacturers like Samsung ship devices with t
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I know of several places that offer battery replacement services for phones. If a phone is old enough it needs this then it can be done, the phone would have to be worth it though. This service costs money and phones are cheap, so it would have to be a really nice phone to bother.
For those not wanting to go to the expense of a battery replacement there are battery extender cases for most popular phones. Again the phone must be valuable enough to bother.
What I find to be the best reason for not offering r
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Secure phone - here! [ebay.com].
And to fix the battery pack: https://www.youtube.com/watch?... [youtube.com]
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Nice Job HTC (Score:5, Insightful)
You'd think with their lacklustre performance over the last 5 years they'd play it safe rather than trying to pretend they are Apple.
Get this message through your thick skulls HTC: You are not Apple. Your customers are not Apple customers. The Android world is a very different place and you aren't in any position to cram user-unfriendly features down people's throats. You will fail if only because there is always some other Chinese company ready to give people what they want.
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I have a Samsung Galaxy S6, and I hate it. And it's not the UI tweaks, which are minor but generally actually pretty good. And the camera is astonishingly good. No the problem is that the battery life is so bad I have to keep it on Ultra-battery-saving mode unless I'm certain to have access to a charger later in the day. Reviews said battery life was "unimpressive", but what they should have said it was that it was disastrously bad.
Samsung's had to have known this would be a problem. So what does that t
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Interesting. My S4 started with a shit battery that couldn't get through a day of light use, and after a year I was carrying around a charger and a spare with me everywhere I went. I upgraded to the S7 after I broke my charging port, and that comes with a glued in battery. But the S7 actually gets me through 5+ hours of heavy use on a full charge. On light use, I can charge it nightly and not be worried about running out of juice.
Combine that with the wireless charging, and I've run it dead all of
Apple is the only company making money from phones (Score:2)
It's not a big surprise that other companies are trying to follow them.
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Apple and Google are in the best place. They control the software that runs on their hardware. Apple in particular owns an entire ecosystem with no competition. If you want to run iOS then you'll use an Apple phone. End of story. I haven't bought one (I use a Mac computer for video work and Linux for everything else) despite owning a Mac computer because no sd card or removable battery and now no headphone jack. If all the major Android manufacturers end up doing this nonsense then I'll have no reason
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I bought a HTC M9 almost a year ago, but I regret it. .- On/Off button on the side.
- Bloatware.
- Chewing through battery badly without being used - lose 10% in 2 to 3 hours.
Next phone will be something else - Maybe a CAT S60. Otherwise I'd fall back to the Ericsson R250s PRO that I recently installed fresh batteries in - stand by time is incredible on it.
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If you just want to talk on the phone a smartphone is the worst thing in the world to use.
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HTC built some of the Nexus devices for Google. They can make good phones, but seem to need help designing them.
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Are you ever going to shut up about this? Will you still be whining in 5 years when nobody makes phones with headphone jacks?
It's a fad. Five years is probably long enough for it to become standard again, when people realize that a cord is less of a pain to deal with than an additional device to charge or an additional adapter to carry.
I bet five years ago you were posting as AC, wondering when people will shut up already, 3D is here to stay.
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Headphone jacks will still be here in 5 years. One of the biggest selling items for iPhone 7 is a case that has a built in external battery pack with a 3.5mm headphone jack. So much for thin phones. People find a way to make stuff useful despite manufacturers trying to cripple it.
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People find a way to make stuff useful despite manufacturers trying to cripple it.
You think that perhaps Apple, et al., anticipated this?
I've heard all kinds of conspiracy theories about removing the headphone jack all with nefarious intent. What if a phone manufacturer wanted to make a cheap(er) and small(er) phone for the masses while those that didn't mind a larger phone with a headphone jack could just buy the case with them in it? It saves them engineering, marketing, logistics, etc. on making another phone model and every market is still served.
Perhaps the phone makers want to ke
2 screens really? (Score:3)
HTC Did It First (Score:2)
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2.5" headphone jack
So that's why those old phones were so bulky!
I'll be buying my first non-HTC smartphone (Score:2)
I'm just not convinced. No compelling new feature.
I wanted a removable battery, and that will be hard to find. If I cannot, then HTC is back on my plate.
The second display looks like their answer to the Galaxy Edge. Feh. It's up top, so I have to stretch a finger or thumb to touch it. Smart move there.
Multipoint audio? Yeah, I was dreaming of that. Actually, no.
Water resistance? Well, actually that is interesting. But I bet it doesn't save my phone from being laundered. A dip in the pool yes. Cold water cyc
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In terms of difficulty, it's far easier to make a sealed case water resistant than it is to make one that opens up and has a gasket to fill in the gaps around the openings. That means you're not likely to get both water resistance and a removable battery in the same phone. Not impossible, but as demand for removable batteries isn't super high, the cheapest and easiest way to do it is seal the whole thing up. Looking at the engineering that went into the S7's micro-SD card slot, I can see why they're going t
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No, I want a smartphone that lets me SSH into my servers, gives me GPS and maps to drive with, enough storage I don't have to move my pictures every week to the cloud, flexible apps to do things with, supports my work email and workflow apps, and has a removable battery so I'm not on the 2 year/1000 charge cycle treadmill for a new phone due to battery life, when the CPU and screen are still more than enough for me to be satisfied with.
It would be nice to have a dialer that doesn't take 18 seconds to initia
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Ghost commander and connect bot.
Sorry no X forwarding. No one has really made that work.
Re: I'll be buying my first non-HTC smartphone (Score:2)
Yeah. Been doing those for a while
Even the competition's execs must be fanboys (Score:2)
Obviously, if Apple does it, it must be the way to go!
More bad news (Score:2)
I hate to be the one to break this to you people. But there is no cassette drive [slashdot.org] either.
Nope, nope, nope (Score:2)
No jack, no buy, no thanks.
AI? You mean, AS, right? (Score:2)
Thanks, HTC!! (Score:2)
Has AI (Score:2)
Stop confusing hardware with software!
The smartphone has i.e. a camera. The operating system has something they call AI.
Re:Unfortunate. (Score:5, Insightful)
The biggest flaw in the concept of this approach is assuming that the consumer will go to the original supplier for future accessories. You'd think they'd learn that consumers will go to whoever is cheapest, or whoever offers the actual best solution, depending on the penchant of the consumer, and that the original supplier is not necessarily the default option. Unfortunately nearly every company that makes products with modules or consumables makes this mistake.
So instead of providing the simple, robust solution they run themselves in circles attempting to influence the market to benefit them only for all that effort to amount to nothing. Apple has historically been the only company that has managed to do this, but even then, there are plenty of users that will go third-party for accessories.
Faulty analysis (Score:2)
The biggest flaw in the concept of this approach is assuming that the consumer will go to the original supplier for future accessories.
They don't have to go to the vendor for every accessory. Even a fairly modest increase in accessory purchases can make it worthwhile. Furthermore they save money by not having to design and build that part of the phone so every phone is cheaper to make as a result.
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This is true only up to the point where some C*O recognizes the pattern and decides to build a device that meets people's needs without all the dongles. That's what is known as "disruptive innovation". And when that happens, suddenly the market shifts. That's how Apple got to where it is, and there's nothing stopping some other company from doing the same.
Re:Unfortunate. (Score:5, Interesting)
Because the engineering mantra of designing something that's the minimum needed to do the job properly has been supplanted with a long-term strategic goal to attempt to sell more things to consumers by selling them devices that don't do everything they need out of the box.
Is this feature reduction or future proofing? I have a laptop with a SD slot and HDMI port that I've never used, except to only prove to myself that they worked, and not likely to use in the future. It also has USB-3 and DisplayPort outputs which with inexpensive adapters I can use to attach an SD card reader or HDMI cable. If given the option now I'd much rather buy a replacement that lacks a SD reader and HDMI port so that I can have a laptop that is just that much smaller, lighter, and cheaper.
I've had an iPod Touch for years that has seen daily use, and is now going into semi-retirement with my acquisition of an iPhone. That iPod had it's headphone jack damaged about a year ago but after an initial transition period I didn't miss it. I could still dock it with my truck stereo for music. When at home I could stream my music to an AirPort Expess, put in in a dock by my stereo, or just listen to it through the internal speaker. This is how I intend to use my iPhone now. What allowed me to keep that iPod working for me for so long was the ability to get audio and video from the dock port. I didn't need all kinds of ports and plugs on the iPod itself, I just bought the cables as I needed them. These cables and adapters included a composite A/V cable, component A/V cable, USB "card reader" adapter, and the car stereo adapter I mentioned earlier. An iPod with all of those ports on the device itself would have been huge.
This is a bit different with a laptop due to the inherent proportions of the format. I do remember many many people essentially laughing at Apple for not putting an optical drive in their laptop. Now we have people laughing at them for not having a SD slot. In the past I hated having to need adapters because they were exceedingly large and expensive, or so I perceived them to be, and it seemed I could never find the one I needed when I needed it. What has changed is the technology, adapters are smaller and cheaper now, and with the growth in the internet I have access to many competing suppliers trying to get me what I want when I want it.
Another change, perhaps just as important, is my perception. I have come to realize that no matter what two devices I have before me that I wish to connect I will need an adapter. We might not perceive this as an adapter but as a cable but every cable is effectively an adapter. Instead of thinking of this as having to buy another damned adapter I think of it as having to get a cable I would have had to get anyway but now I don't have to have a dozen ports on a computer where I'll only use half of them.
A joke among my friends was that USB stood for "useless serial bus" since when it was introduced there was nothing to plug into it. Now it's replaced nearly everything and I'm liking it. I don't need a laptop with a serial port, Ethernet port, flash card reader, modem port, Firewire port, parallel port, and DVI port like my old one did. When I pack my laptop I also pack the cables I need with the USB adapters attached. I treat the USB adapter and cable as a single unit, if it isn't a single physical unit already. While USB isn't quite "universal" it's close enough that I only need a couple other kinds of ports to plug into everything I need to get my work done.
Another thing that has changed with time is the weight bearing ability of my knees. Having all those ports on the laptop means weight that I must carry even if I just want to have a laptop with me to do a bit of work at a deli while eating. I'll still pack my bag with my laptop but all those adapters can be left behind.
So, yes, they do intend for people to come back for the cable they need. Any more I find complaints that a device doesn't have the p
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Because the engineering mantra of designing something that's the minimum needed to do the job properly has been supplanted
Alternatively, given the available more flexible and general-purpose alternatives, the headphone jack is no longer required to do the job properly, so the mantra dictates that it should be removed.
I've spoken with mobile phone hardware engineers about the issue, and what they say is that there are very compelling reasons to remove the headphone jack. It takes a huge amount of space, particularly due to depth, and does so right in a crucial area where designers would prefer to put antennas. Being able to g
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Not as big a mistake as may seem at first glance. Think printer ink. That is what Apple Et. Al. are trying to do with cell phones - turn them into walled gardens where they are the gate-keepers and every toll exacted goes to their own pockets.
Go look up who the lobbyists are trying to influence. They are trying to remove any possibility of competition they can, by whatever means they can bring to bear. Telecoms have largely eliminated competition in the transport sector. The barriers to entry keep what limi
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Because it takes a lot of space.
With those notes 7 exploding because the battery was too tightly packed in. That extra empty space can be used to allow for that extra room.
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The AI, is it just another broken voice command interface? Can I ask it how much a ten inch by eight inch by twenty inch box of water would weigh and expect an answer that isn't just a butchered version of the question inserted into a google search.
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Can I ask it how much a ten inch by eight inch by twenty inch box of water would weigh and expect an answer that isn't just a butchered version of the question inserted into a google search.
That's the answer I'd give...
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Very soon my machine will have the logical thinking capability of a leprechaun on acid, combined with the sense of humour of a clockwork mouse.
I am planning an IPO in 2019. Invest now, while it still has credibility.
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Sent from my ASR33 using ASCII
With paper tape punch and reader, or does it have the accoustic coupler (that only fits a standard Bell desk telephone handset) 110-baud modem instead? xD
By the way where are you still getting rolls of paper for it? I'm down to using paper towels stolen from the dispensers at work. xD
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It looks like your technology will be able to replace the leaders of the engineering departments that are making stupid decisions such as removing commonly used ports from their flagship phones.
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The thing is complicated and takes up too much space.
It has nothing to do with that; TRS jacks/plugs are about as simple and foolproof as you can get, they've been around in one form or another for at least as long as the invention of the telephone exchange. The real reason they want to get rid of it is to attempt to close the 'analog hole' once and for all. So long as there is baseband analog audio available from a device, audio can be pirated. It's not quite as clean a copy as a direct digital copy, but it's good enough. Not having a headphone jack means it
DRM (Score:2)
They finally plugged the analog hole. You know DRM is going to work its way in.
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You can have your keystrokes monitored by a variety of methods, none of which require that your keyboard be wireless. Your fingerprint can be grabbed from a distance. Data from your PC can even be transmitted via audio to another and hopscotched to the one that is fully compromised and has access to its remote master.
Bluetooth is not the only vector. Hell, a Stingray is your real threat.