From Bicycles To Washing Machines: Sweden To Give Tax Breaks For Repairs (mnn.com) 146
jenningsthecat writes: The Swedish government is putting its money where its mouth is when it comes to encouraging the repair of stuff that would otherwise be thrown away, according to both The Guardian and Fast Company. The country's Social Democrat and Green party coalition have submitted proposals to Parliament that would reduce the value-added-tax (VAT) on bicycle, clothing, and shoe repairs from 25% to 12%. Also proposed is an income tax deduction equalling half the labor cost of repairing household appliances. According to The Guardian, "the incentives are part of a shift in government focus from reducing carbon emissions produced domestically to reducing emissions tied to goods produced elsewhere." Per Bolund, Sweden's Minister for Financial Markets and Consumer Affairs, said the policy also tied in with international trends around reduced consumption and crafts, such as the "maker movement" and the sharing economy, both of which have strong followings in Sweden. The VAT cut may create more jobs for immigrants as it could spur the creation of a new home-repairs service industry. Also, from a science standpoint, the incentives could help cut the cost of carbon emissions on the planet as it should in theory reduce emissions linked to consumption. "I believe there is a shift in view in Sweden at the moment. There is an increased knowledge that we need to make our things last longer in order to reduce materials' consumption," Bolund said. The Guardian's report concludes: "The proposals will be presented in parliament as part of the government's budget proposals and if voted through in December will become law from January 1, 2017."
It's the cost of the labor, stupid (Score:4, Insightful)
I doubt this will be a compelling incentive if the cost of repair labor in Sweden is comparable to that in the United States. People don't repair things because (a) many are deliberately designed not to be easily reparable and (b) the labor cost of the "experts" is disproportionate to the value of having it repaired. Shaving a little bit off the sales tax of the bill is not going to offset the disproportionate cost of the alleged expertise.
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Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid (Score:4, Insightful)
Somebody is making that extra money, but so many times it's not the person doing the actual work.
Go to Craigslist and hire someone direct. Or go to nextdoor.com and ask your neighbors for a recommendation. If someone does a good job, give them a good review on Yelp. Spread the word.
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Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid (Score:4, Insightful)
That is, of course, if you have the skill needed to perform the actual work
For most repairs, no skill is needed. Just go to Youtube, type in the product you are repairing, and a short description of what the problem is, and you will get a dozen videos showing exactly how to fix it.
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I've been practicing this for about the last ten years. Seems to be working well for me and I now rarely buy anything new unless I am lazy. FWIW, I built my house and remodeled another.
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AC didn't say that they didn't have inspections and also didn't say they didn't subcontract any of the work.
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Enjoy your building code violations!
There are two kinds of building code violations, relevant and irrelevant. An example of an irrelevant kind is not having at least two electrical outlets on a wall that's 8'1" long. An example of a relevant kind is using 2x2 instead of 2x4. Sadly, we used to build houses with 2x6 wall framing, and not this little candy-ass smooth-milled lumber that's under the stated size either, but rough-hewn timbers cut with a sawblade and then assembled. That's why so many of those houses are all moldy now; they actually
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And you don't need two outlets on an 8'1" wall....you need an outlet at least 12' (measuring baseboard length, i.e. skipping doors) and on any wall greater than 24".
This is a local code thing. Because after the NEC you still have local bullshit to deal with. Some of it makes sense and some of it is just there so that they can slap you with a fine of some kind if they want to. If a wall is longer than 8' then you need two outlets in it. Whee! I'm all in favor of things like seismic codes but the building codes are just stupid anyway. For example, all wire must be sheathed specifically in PVC, which releases dioxin when it burns. Or how about people being allowed to inst
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That's a basic intelligence test for repair and preventing warranty fraud, actually. Far too many people go to YouTube and see how to fix something, then actually try to do it, without realizing they don't have the proper tools (no, a butter knife is NOT a screwdriver), or even skill/dexterity to repair (use a tool to lift the flap on the connector - do not rip the cable out or you may tea
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For many things thrown away, no repair is even necessary. We're in a throw away culture, with perfectly good items tossed away just because it's not fashionable anymore. I think it's a good idea that at least one country has decided to try and make a change.
Yeah... (Score:2)
Like that fixing that hidden iPhone 7 headphone jack problem. [slashdot.org]
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Don't forget to do the calculation of whether it's worth it: if a repair takes you two hours, think about how you could spend those two hours instead. That includes thinking about how much two hours of your own labor are worth relative to the cost of hiring someone else.
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Don't forget to do the calculation of whether it's worth it: if a repair takes you two hours, think about how you could spend those two hours instead. That includes thinking about how much two hours of your own labor are worth relative to the cost of hiring someone else.
If it's only two hours, it's a pretty easy decision. Spending two hours of my life on repairing something will make me a better person. Not only am I reducing my footprint upon the planet but I'm also becoming better at repairing things. It becomes a more difficult decision when it's going to take a couple of days, at which point the job begins to actually impact your life and require that other parts of it be reorganized if you want to get it done in a timely fashion.
I do a lot of fixing of stuff. Much of
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Well, if it makes you feel better about yourself, good for you. But don't kid yourself: you don't really stick to that most of the time. If you repaired and maintained your home and your car the way people used to, you wouldn't have any time for anything else.
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But don't kid yourself: you don't really stick to that most of the time. If you repaired and maintained your home and your car the way people used to, you wouldn't have any time for anything else.
Well, first off, most homes and cars don't need to be "maintained... the way people used to" because of advances in both design/materials and tools for maintenance. For example, most people used to have lots of wood trim on exteriors of houses (if not complete wood siding) that needed to be repainted on a regular basis to avoid rot. Nowadays, few homes are built with materials that need that level of maintenance. Moreover, paint quality has improved significantly over the years, so a good paint job can p
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Well, if it makes you feel better about yourself, good for you. But don't kid yourself: you don't really stick to that most of the time.
I do when it's reasonably convenient to do so. Many devices are now prohibitively difficult to repair. Sometimes I still try, and fail for one reason or another, at least learning something in the process. If it's out of warranty and it's broken and it costs too much to have someone else do it, I've got nothing to lose.
If you repaired and maintained your home and your car the way people used to, you wouldn't have any time for anything else.
I do everything vaguely within my skillset. That means all of the plumbing that's not underground (by which I mean the pump, I don't have a crane for pump fishing) and all of the electrical,
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For most repairs, no skill is needed. Just go to Youtube, type in the product you are repairing, and a short description of what the problem is, and you will get a dozen videos showing exactly how to fix it.
I would disagree with this. For anything beyond the most basic repairs, you'll probably encounter various "bumps" along the way in trying to replicate what someone on Youtube does, or realize that they skipped a few essential explanations about things (often basic stuff that anyone familiar with that type of repair would know already), etc.
I agree that Youtube is a great resource for this sort of stuff, but it's like saying, "Baking bread doesn't require any skill. Just watch a Youtube video." Except y
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The ideal is to give a tax break to companies making goods, so they can make them repairable. However, here in the US, a lot of companies pay $0 in texas, so it may not work, but in civilized countries that actually enforce tax codes, this would be a useful thing.
Re: It's the cost of the labor, stupid (Score:1)
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and the parts are usually a rip off. it's like $500 or $600 for a dish washer. if it breaks then most times the part is like $400 plus the labor plus waiting weeks for delivery where you might as well just buy a new one.
only time it's cheaper is with phones and tablets where it's like $100 to have apple fix your screen or $193 for Samsung to fix a screen on a Note.
American washers are easily repairable (Score:2)
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I had a lawnmower for 25 years, I went to buy another, with a straight face, they said no matter what I bought it would not last that long, lucky to get 5 or 10 years. There is one way to guarantee repairs, force warranties up, way up. Forget the bullshit 30 day warranty lets, start at a decade. It will completely alter design and serviceability for the better.
This has happened in the car market (Score:2)
Seven year warranties are reasonably common for cars, reflecting the fact that reliability has increased massively. Applying this to other industries would be interesting; in cars I get the impression that it was the Koreans who broke ranks on the issue and used this to overcome people's suspicion of this new source. There's an interpretation of British law that suggests a six year warranty is now part of the package, but it's not being enforced as such.
The problem of course is that for the poor, the extra
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I had a lawnmower for 25 years, I went to buy another, with a straight face, they said no matter what I bought it would not last that long, lucky to get 5 or 10 years.
They lied like dogs. Buy a Honda. You will have to replace carburetor parts periodically if you buy pump gas for it, though. That's the ethanol's fault. It happens to carbureted cars, too, especially if you don't drive them enough. The ethanol is aggressively hygroscopic, and draws moisture into the carburetor. It also eats the fuel lines.
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You can still buy quality lawnmowers. Just buy a good brand, like a Honda, and then properly maintain it. There's a reason some mowers cost $150 and some cost $800.
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I really dislike the savings as an income tax deduction. Not only is the savings deferred for up to a year, but the only way you'll ever receive it is by meticulously documenting everything. This savings is tacked-onto the process, in other words, instead of being an integral part of it. I don't believe that can succeed long term.
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With poverty level cheap foreign labor it is often cheaper for the end user to replace rather than repair.
An example for consumer electronics:
It takes me 3-4 hours to repair a cracked solder joint on a wave soldered board with disassembly and reassembly of the unit. This would be actual repair charge on top of charge for labor done to identify what and where the problem is. Assuming a mean shop labor charge of $65 an hour (cheap rate these days) that would come to $195.00 to $260.00 before
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The best solution is of course to simply lower taxes and let the market and people themselves figure out where to put their money but well - can't have that, it's a regulated socialist shit-hole after-all.
Regulated socialist shit-hole is better than unregulated US-style capitalism where private corporations are more powerful than the government and can do whatever they want. After all, the market is free, so you are free to choose any internet service provider serving your area:
1. Cable company A - $100/month for 10mbps and 100GB data cap.
2. Telephone company B - $100/month for 10mbps and 100GB data cap.
You are completely free to choose from any of those options. Or maybe you have to choose one from the list
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The market gave me my first alternative in my apartment.
10 mbps uncapped already back in year 2000 for only $23.4 / month. By "Bredbandsbolaget" and ethernet, but it was very unusual and this was the first place in the nation.
The copper telephone network has been made by the government / their telephone company, that offered various DSL services. I'm not hooked up there but that would be another alternative.
By now there's also the cellular network of course. I don't know how many network constructionists we
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build the infrastructure in the way of digging down the cables and then let others offer their services on them. I guess that also solve the issue with people in rural areas not being connected otherwise.
This is what my country is doing. If you do not want to build the infrastructure, the government will and then you can lease it along with your competitors. Without the government doing this, a lot of people would not have access to high speed internet (because it wouldbe too expensive for a single provider to do and the providers may decide against building the infrastructure together and sharing the costs). This also allows smaller companies (or new ones) to better compete with the large ones because they
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That would require reading the entire summary, which would make it harder to be snooty about them dumb furriners.
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I really dislike the savings as an income tax deduction. Not only is the savings deferred for up to a year, but the only way you'll ever receive it is by meticulously documenting everything. This savings is tacked-onto the process, in other words, instead of being an integral part of it. I don't believe that can succeed long term.
Now Assange has got more to worry about. (Score:2, Funny)
The USofA can't have other nations doing something serious to reduce consumption. This will give the US govt solid reason to invade and conquer Sweden.
If Assange gets extradited to Sweden.........
On the other hand, it's a reduction in taxes, it'll give the GOP a stroke trying to figure out whether to support this or not.
On the gripping hand, Sweden has a fairly robust welfare structure, and that's SOCIALISM!
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Fortunately, Sweden cares very little about what the GOP thinks, of this I can assure you.
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I didn't say "US", now, did I? No, I did not. I said "GOP".
I'm sorry you don't understand that these are two different things.
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Just come and liberate us.
The government is the enemy. Gogo.
Donald Trump. Are you listening? It's either you or Putin. Someone got to save us.
/ Johan Krüger Haglert
Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?! (Score:1)
Sweden?!?!
Tax cut?!?!?
To encourage job growth?!?!
"Progressive" heads explode!
Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?! (Score:5, Insightful)
Until you figure out that the tax cut is not to corporations and the rich, but to regular people, and alt-right heads explodes instead.
Re: Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?! (Score:2)
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http://www.nbcnews.com/health/... [nbcnews.com]
http://www.iflscience.com/heal... [iflscience.com]
http://www.livescience.com/547... [livescience.com]
Propylene glycol, a chemical found in e-liquids, can irritate the eyes and airways, Siegel said. Early studies have also revealed that when propylene glycol or glycerin are heated and vaporized, they can degrade into formaldehyde and acetaldehyde, he said. Both of these chemicals are considered carcinogens, although it's not yet clear how repeated exposure to them may cause cancer, he said.
does not require much looking..
Does not require much looking...
Does not require much comprehension, either.
I know English is hard, but try and look up the difference between will and can and will and may.
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Second article says there isn't much evidence... which is why I was asking in the first place
Third article says some stuff about possible heart and respiratory issues, nothing about cancer
Do you f'n read?? You just wasted my time, thanks. Even worse, you are spreading misinformation.
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"My box mod is made from Reardon metal!"
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"My box mod is made from Reardon metal!"
I expect that quite soon, as regulatory capture and cronyism kills off small single-proprietor businesses and the few large 'connected' (tobacco co,s, mostly) manufacturers jack up prices for cheap (but legal!) junk as typically happens, that many people will just be paying somebodies' kid brother for one of the rigs he puts together out of used laptop batteries in his basement while he's smoking blunts.
Which would you prefer happen to be in the luggage on your or your family's next flight because TSA misse
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Tax cuts benefit those who pay more taxes - the rich. A family that exists just above the poverty line is not going to get anything back when they have their washing machine repaired. But a wealthy individual would get a significant amount back - hardly fair.
A better solution would be to increase the "environmental" tax and apply the additional tax revenue to pay for recycling and other environmental programs. Now everyone benefits equally. And by raising the price of appliances, the government would
Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?! (Score:5, Informative)
I'd really like to see what factual basis you're employing for this argument, because I'm not seeing one. In fact, I come to exactly the opposite conclusion, maybe because (a) I live in Sweden, (b) I know what a washing machine costs here, and (c) I can do simple maths.
Washing machine X costs the same regardless of your income. (Yes, if you make more, you can buy a more expensive machine, in which case it's a different machine.)
If I make 100000 SEK a year and spend 10000 of it on that washing machine, that's 10% of my income. If I spend 5000 to repair it, that's 5%. If I get back 2500 of that on my taxes, that's 2.5%.
If I make 200000 SEK a year and spend 10000 of it on a washing machine, that's 5% of my income. If I spend 5000 to repair it, that's 2.5%. If I get back 2500 of that on my taxes, that's 1.25%.
So, if anything, the tax cut actually benefits low-income folks *more* than it does the wealthy since it returns a greater proportion of their income. What's your evidence to the contrary, other than grand pronouncements?
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It's well established that sales taxes are regressive. That's why Texas has no income tax, but a whopping 8.05% sales tax.
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Sales taxes normally exempt food items for that reason -- so the poor can eat without being taxed. One can of course get more selective and put extra tax on luxury items. Sales taxes can be as progressive or regressive as you design them to be.
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Connecticut has a luxury tax on clothing costing over $1000. Several states exempt certain items like coats. But in general most states tax all clothing. Pennsylvania is the only state with a sub 4% income tax rate that exempts any clothing.
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Sales taxes normally exempt food items for that reason -- so the poor can eat without being taxed. One can of course get more selective and put extra tax on luxury items. Sales taxes can be as progressive or regressive as you design them to be.
Sales taxes are always regressive in every case that I have seen, but politicians and special interest groups can create the illusion that this isn't the case.
In typical cases, the sales taxes still apply to a lot of the infrastructure, tools, supplies, and so forth that is needed to produce the product and transport it to the store where the customer will buy it. Given the complex logistics chains of the modern word, there is typically a lot of places where sales tax is being added. VAT taxes the worst k
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Except a tax break for repairs will disproportionately benefit the people at the lower end of the scale. Think it over.
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Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?! (Score:5, Informative)
Sweden?!?! Tax cut?!?!?
Sweden has high taxes by American standards, but by many measures they are otherwise even more capitalist than America. Their post office is privatized, as is a big fraction of their educational system. It is very easy to start a business, and while regulations are strict, they are also streamlined and the bureaucracy is fast and efficient. Sweden ranks 8th out of 185 countries on the Ease of doing business index [wikipedia.org]. America is only one notch higher.
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It is very easy to start a business, and while regulations are strict, they are also streamlined and the bureaucracy is fast and efficient.
+1, Funny. You obviously don't live here, or know anyone who runs a small business here.
Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?! (Score:5, Insightful)
High tax rate but also high return on value to citizens. The US has a very low tax rate but also a very low return back to citizens. What pisses off people is when they pay taxes but get very little to show for it (except a gargantuan military).
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Sweden has high taxes by American standards, but by many measures they are otherwise even more capitalist than America. Their post office is privatized, as is a big fraction of their educational system.
What a coincidence. Our post office is privatized, as is a big fraction of our educational system. And then there's the influence of school administrators' unions, which are not to be confused with educators' unions as they are not the same thing and they are typically in direct conflict over where the money should be spent. Educators' unions want to spend money on education, and on reasonable salaries for educators. The admins' unions want gross administrative salaries that detract from education, and fuck
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as long as you hand over 2/3 of all your profits to the state , runing an business is not that hard Sweden. Maktintressen an living as an small business is bloddy hard , growing is even harder. And if you start an small business and cash out you are looking at 2/3 tax on the cash out.
Running a small business is hard anywhere.
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Sweden?!?!
Tax cut?!?!?
To encourage job growth?!?!
"Progressive" heads explode!
It's not really a tax cut - they will still spend the money just tax something else.
What it really is is political regulation of the choice of the people from spending their money on something else than a new bathroom, someone to clean their home or bicycle tube repair into doing one of those things instead because the taxation are different on the different choices.
By taxing something else more and this lower you just just as well see it as them spending tax money on repairing stuff people didn't thought w
Compatible with EU rules? (Score:1)
I wonder if EU commission will let that happen without complaining it violates EU's crazy free market rules
In the sick brain of EU leaders, a VAT incentive can be considered an unfair hidden state help for some actors. On the other hand, who could stand against such a green measure?
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I wonder if EU commission will let that happen without complaining it violates EU's crazy free market rules
That depends on how it is implemented. If there is a requirement that the repairperson is local to Sweden, then that would violate EU rules, and can, and should be, banned. But if a Swede can drive to Finland or Denmark to have the repair done, and still get the tax break, then it should be okay.
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Re:Compatible with EU rules? (Score:5, Informative)
Good thinking (Score:2, Insightful)
Before rescuing the planet from carbon emissions the Swedes might want to rescue their country first:
SWEDEN IN CHAOS: Number of ‘no-go zones’ INCREASED as police lose control over violence [express.co.uk]
Sweden turns on migrants amid rise in violence and sex attacks [express.co.uk]
Sweden on the BRINK: Malmö in flames as vengeful thugs set cars alight [express.co.uk]
Yeah, don't worry about this (Score:3, Insightful)
The immigrants set lots of cars on fire all the time.
Where I live towards the end of August more or less all the windows in the area center had been smashed and two weeks ago a car was lit on fire on "my" parking loot, someone had to set the youth center and music and dancing activity center on fire as-well as the children facility of the primary care center.
We also have all the immigrants in Malmö who use a in debt / criminal / social low-life "guardian" as owner of their car to not pay any taxes, ins
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No, it was a municipal car they had set on fire on this parking lot, three nearby cars where damaged though possibly including a black persons family van because he stood there when the fire department arrived and later moved it.
I have no car.
I've had a car parked here though and at-least one tire was cut though, I don't remember if it was multiple ones. Also my bike stolen possibly by a neighbor because the note was taken down in this stair-way only.
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Hej Johan,
You can actually rent a flat in Malmö? Or do you mean "rent" as in "pay SEK 250 a year to be on a waiting list for ten years"? The latter is why I bought a flat in Stockholm...
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I don't live in Malmö I live in Örebro.
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Mitt fel. Förlåt mig.
Örebro? Känner du en kille vid namnet Jerry Gray? En klasskompis.
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First You complain about every problem being the immigrants fauld and then You complain about "the situation and actions of and in my life is someone else's fault"-trash.
That is the logic applied by the racist Sweden Democrats when they try to portray Sweden as the worst country in the world because of immigration.
Sweden has a problem with poor and marginalised suburbs, just like all European countries do. But it is really nothing compared to other countries in the EU or the US. Sweden has seen a steady dec
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The immigrants..
(yada yada...)
...But supposedly it's a good joke and if you're not in then you're a racist fascist anti-democrat.>
(yada yada)
No, it's not a joke. It's not a joke that millions of immigrants are blamed worldwide if one commits a crime somewhere in the world but hundreds of crimes by racist, fascist anti-democrats are too common to be news anywhere. How many people know about the 64 arson attacks on refugee centres in Sweden [qz.com] and numerous similar attacks in Germany, Denmark and daily incidents of violence against immigrants [skynews.com.au] in Ireland, the UK and elsewhere? How many know of the Afghan refugee driven to [yahoo.com]
Re: Good thinking (Score:1, Insightful)
As someone from Sweden I don't know if I should laugh or cry every time articles like these are brought up.
It's cherry picking at best. Crime in Sweden is going down by all objective, measurable standards. Sure, we have problems like anyone else but this is just crazy.
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What did you expect from the Express?—makes the Metro look like an actual newspaper.
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Get lost... Stop propagating the lies that everything is fine...
https://www.bra.se/bra/bra-in-... [www.bra.se]
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Probably worth noting that to compare crime rates reported, you have to use a similar method of counting. In every country something like a murder-robbery will be counted at least twice, once under the homicide category and once under property crimes. Sweden's rates are inflated by a system in which the same crime can be categorized more ways.
So simply adding up all "reporting offenses" confounds two factors: the rate of underlying social disorder and the practices of the reporting system.
If you want to co
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One non-current year of slight rise, not adjusted per-capita, is quite the meaningless statistical cherry-picking. I have no idea whether crime is on the rise in Sweden (I'm American so I don't care), but it's easy to see that your link does not provide reasonable support for your claim.
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Before rescuing the planet from carbon emissions the Swedes might want to rescue their country first:
SWEDEN IN CHAOS: Number of âno-go zonesâ(TM) INCREASED as police lose control over violence
Sweden turns on migrants amid rise in violence and sex attacks
Sweden on the BRINK: Malmà in flames as vengeful thugs set cars alight
Those who are working towards effectively abolishing national sovereignty and erecting a structure for central global governance know that great changes only occur at times of great turmoil, war, famine, financial/currency system collapses, and anarchy/chaos.
There are some disturbing societal/cultural/political parallels to pre-WW2 Germany occurring in the US. The EU is on fire. Nationalism and populism is on the rise in many powerful nations around the world. The global financial markets are in dangerous t
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You linked to the Express. But I'm willing to bet that you thought you were linking to a news site.
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Except that the sources quoted are all the "Daily Express", a sensationalist rag.
Sure the Swedes have their problems, but less than those in many other European countries and the USA
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Why is this considered a Troll? I'm so sick that telling the truth is banned from mainstream media. I live in a village with only a few hundred Muslims on a total population of 2300. From the attempted coup in Turkey until now, their have been way too many riots. A total of 43 cars were burned. Can you imagine this amount of cars in a small village? That's about 1 out of 12 cars were totally destroyed because of political problems in Turkey. 3 restaurants were destroyed, one was completely burned down inclu
Comment removed (Score:4, Insightful)
Wow... (Score:2)
25% VAT in Sweden - wow... I guess that helps fund those "free" social services Sweden is famous for.
Paul Hawken has a better idea (Score:2)
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