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New Mexico Nuclear Accident Ranks Among the Costliest In US History (latimes.com) 320

mdsolar quotes a report from Los Angeles Times: When a drum containing radioactive waste blew up in an underground nuclear dump in New Mexico two years ago, the Energy Department rushed to quell concerns in the Carlsbad desert community and quickly reported progress on resuming operations. The early federal statements gave no hint that the blast had caused massive long-term damage to the dump, a facility crucial to the nuclear weapons cleanup program that spans the nation, or that it would jeopardize the Energy Department's credibility in dealing with the tricky problem of radioactive waste. But the explosion ranks among the costliest nuclear accidents in U.S. history, according to a Times analysis. The long-term cost of the mishap could top $2 billion, an amount roughly in the range of the cleanup after the 1979 partial meltdown at the Three Mile Island nuclear power plant in Pennsylvania. The Feb. 14, 2014, accident is also complicating cleanup programs at about a dozen current and former nuclear weapons sites across the U.S. Thousands of tons of radioactive waste that were headed for the dump are backed up in Idaho, Washington, New Mexico and elsewhere, state officials said in interviews. "The direct cost of the cleanup is now $640 million, based on a contract modification made last month with Nuclear Waste Partnership that increased the cost from $1.3 billion to nearly $2 billion," reports Los Angeles Times. "The cost-plus contract leaves open the possibility of even higher costs as repairs continue. And it does not include the complete replacement of the contaminated ventilation system or any future costs of operating the mine longer than originally planned."
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New Mexico Nuclear Accident Ranks Among the Costliest In US History

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  • by justcauseisjustthat ( 1150803 ) on Monday August 22, 2016 @10:37PM (#52753179)
    Maybe they should just let these go to town on the cleanup?
    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/09/140909093659.htm [sciencedaily.com]
    • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 23, 2016 @08:37AM (#52754891)

      Those bacteria don't do any actual cleaning. They just help contain. The bacteria are able to consume molecules that contain nuclear elements and change the molecular structure of the radioactive waste. This change ends up preventing the waste from being dissolved in ground water, and thus preventing it from spreading around in ground water. So basically, they are able to absorb leaking waste.

      Life is a chemical process. There is no life that can break down matter at the sub-atomic level. Except Godzilla!

  • Fuck mdsolar (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward

    Just when I thought we might be done with mdsolar spam, this article shows up. He's a biased and intellectually dishonest submitter who will do anything to try to make nuclear energy appear awful. Can we ban mdsolar from submitting more stories and spamming the queue?

    • I don't think that this submission was particularly biased. Nuclear technology does get lots of subventions by the state, some of them in the form that the state takes over if there is an accident like this.

      I've seen lots of MS spam lately, that's far more unpleasant to read.

      • Re: (Score:2, Troll)

        by ravenshrike ( 808508 )

        The only reason that there is so much subvention is because certain people would fucking whine to high heaven if they switched to the nuke plants that could properly eat the majority of the truly problematic waste and use it as part of the fuel cycle.

        • Why would that be the case? Are they illuminati who want to destroy humanity or something?

          • Because they think that the plutonium produced(and mostly consumed if those reactors are allowed to keep working instead of being shut down to harvest it) will spontaneously get up and walk away.

            • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

              by tlambert ( 566799 )

              Because they think that the plutonium produced(and mostly consumed if those reactors are allowed to keep working instead of being shut down to harvest it) will spontaneously get up and walk away.

              Specifically it's to keep countries like North Korea and Pakistan from getting nuclear weapons.

              Oopsie. Looks like that worked out, didn't it...

              The U.S. is the only major nuclear power that doesn't reprocess spent fuel; Russia does, Japan does, France does, Great Britain did, and, until Germany recently decided to no longer be a nuclear power, they had France process their for them. Thank Jimmy Carter for the executive order; we have a nice, shiny new reprocessing plant that's been mothballed.

              • I still have never figured out how North Korea would somehow spontaneously get plutonium created at a breeder reactor in Tennessee. I guess the argument is "well if we spend billions and billions of dollars to prototype and refine the design until it actually works, then all of a sudden they have one too without all the pesky engineering and construction costs?

                It's not a fucking MP3 - it can't be copied perfectly with zero cost.

            • No, it's because reactors which recycle used fuel efficiently cost more to run. We can produce new fuel from freshly-mined uranium cheaper than we can breed and refine uranium and plutonium fuel rods. We don't even run plutonium fuel rods in reactors, usually, so there's all kinds of risk in using plutonium fuel and all kinds of costs in getting to a point where we can even attempt it.

              Burning the fuel out completely is expensive.

        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by sjames ( 1099 )

          There's a lot of truth there. At least some of what is to be stored is perfectly good plutonium that could/should be loaded into a reactor and produce electricity for years but instead we're spending millions to throw it away. It makes about as much sense as building a facility to bury gasoline.

      • I don't think that this submission was particularly biased. Nuclear technology does get lots of subventions by the state, some of them in the form that the state takes over if there is an accident like this.

        I've seen lots of MS spam lately, that's far more unpleasant to read.

        This isn't handouts from the state, this is nuclear weapons waste. This is the government cleaning up after itself. It's got nothing to do with subsidies.

      • They didn't even hype it as *the* costliest; they put it in with three-mile island. 1979, $1 billion over 12 years, three-mile island. In 1979, that'd be inflation to $3.26 billion 2014; in 1991, that'd inflate to $1.74 billion 2014. You're looking at an average in the range of $2.5 billion; counting from straight 1985, it's still $2.2 billion.

        In other words: this disaster has cost less than three-mile island. Amortized over the decade it'll cost, it's actually not so bad; there are 171 million tax

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        Yeah, except that this story has absolutely nothing to do with nuclear power generation. All of this waste, and this waste disposal site, is designed for material coming from the manufacture of nuclear weapons, and the output of the DoE national laboratories.

        So the FUD is implicit - anything that is bad about any nuclear technology at all, mdsolar will post just because people will automatically relate it to nuclear power. I still don't know why he thinks that nuclear is such a threat to his dream of sol

    • I agree, we need more nuclear stories [bloomberg.com].
  • by TimSSG ( 1068536 ) on Monday August 22, 2016 @10:45PM (#52753217)
    From the link "The problem was traced to material — actual kitty litter — used to blot up liquids in sealed drums. Lab officials had decided to substitute an organic material for a mineral one." Tim S.
    • by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 22, 2016 @11:26PM (#52753359)

      Speaking as an engineer, the number of headaches caused by people tasked with implementation making "equivalent" substitutions are outrageous. Some bean counter second guesses a line item somewhere, the inventory isn't on-hand to fulfill a customer need so the people who suffer negative consequences if the job isn't out the door decide to improvise.

      Maybe the purchasing agent couldn't buy the specified cat litter because it was back-ordered. It doesn't really matter. When you have unqualified individuals making deviations from the prescribed procedure: that is a management failure.

      • by Bryan Ischo ( 893 ) * on Tuesday August 23, 2016 @12:15AM (#52753479) Homepage

        Designing a system easy enough to be catastrophically broken by a single seemingly harmless substitution is a big problem too.

        I have no problem with nuclear power but fragile processes are not good for anyone.

        • by Sarten-X ( 1102295 ) on Tuesday August 23, 2016 @12:32AM (#52753511) Homepage

          The system itself worked correctly, as the containment system properly contained the leak. The problem is that the "seemingly harmless" substitution wouldn't have appeared harmless to an engineer who knew what was going on, but the person who made the substitution didn't understand the requirements for the part he was substituting.

          When I worked on government computers, I often saw similar problems. The developers would specify certain hardware requirements, but over the life of a program, as equipment went obsolete, other people would make substitutions based on the specs of the old part. After a few years, the same software was running on high-end components, at only about 1% utilization. Nobody ever wanted to be the guy who made the system less capable, even though the lower-end hardware would have cost far less.

          • Re: (Score:2, Troll)

            by mdsolar ( 1045926 )
            So, how many more mistakes before there is a release into the environment?
            • So, how many more mistakes before there is a release into the environment?

              What would you suggest they do? Build a giant solar death ray in the 1950s instead?

            • How often...does the EPA inspect these sites?
              Inspector: "Hey, this badge lets me go thru this door!"
              Engineer: "And this badge will tell you that you are going to die as soon as you do. Have a nice day." (Runs away!)

          • The system itself worked correctly, as the containment system properly contained the leak.

            o.0 A huge chunk of the storage facility is contaminated because a supposedly stable drum exploded - no, the system emphatically did not work correctly. It was never supposed to blow up in the first place.

            • by serviscope_minor ( 664417 ) on Tuesday August 23, 2016 @03:21AM (#52753953) Journal

              It's nested fail safes. The drum was never supposed to blow. But we knew that and if "never supposed to" meant "never" then you could just stack the drums on the surface. The point of digging it into a salt mine was that if the drum did happen to blow, it would be contained. It did and it was.

              It's like the difference between TMI and Chernobyl. TMI was built with nested failsafes. In fact the design assumed that the core would melt down and was designed to dilute the core to noncriticality, then spread out the molten stuff to cool it so it would not break out of the containment. That happened and that's why there was almost no external contamination.

          • by bluefoxlucid ( 723572 ) on Tuesday August 23, 2016 @09:02AM (#52755047) Homepage Journal

            A multi-cat household can be hard on even the toughest kitty litter; so when your litterbox needs a change, go for the Nuclear Option. Containment 100% silica-based kitty litter can handle even the toughest jobs, whether you're managing a two-cat household or a nuclear waste disposal site.

            Containment 100% silica-based kitty litter: don't let your waste go nuclear.

        • by sjames ( 1099 )

          No, the problem is a management that guesses that a substitution might be harmless. There is no way to design around that other than just saying anyone who makes an unauthorized substitution will lose a finger at least.

          In this case, it shouldn't have been that hard to guess that organic matter wouldn't make a good substitution for inorganic clay.

        • Try substituting ethanol for methanol in your whiskey. They're both alcohol...

    • The really interesting question is who made the substitution and why. There is a lot of pressure to use COTS (commercial off the shelf) products to save money. Was this a case where the commercial products had the same or very similar names but were completely different? Was this someone trying to save money but not doing a proper review? Was it simply a blunder: accidentally ordering the wrong product?

      Should certified "nuclear clean up absorbent powder" rather than kitty litter have been used in the fir

  • by millertym ( 1946872 ) on Monday August 22, 2016 @10:48PM (#52753225)

    Nuclear energy is the crazy hot girlfriend of energy. She may be nice, kind, and wonderful for days, months, or years - maybe decades. But someday, somehow, she's going to go berserk on you. 100% chance. And cleaning up the mess at that point will leave you with a very long term scar.

    • only if you mistreat or neglect her, otherwise she is far more stable and certainly environmentally cleaner than just about any other option currently available.
      • Also she looks great in a short skirt. I might be thinking of someone else.
      • by NotInHere ( 3654617 ) on Monday August 22, 2016 @10:59PM (#52753269)

        You get an economic benefit from mistreating and neglecting her. If she freaks out, you don't have to pay for the outcome, the federals do. Just look at japan, where tepco now got money from the government to clean up the fukushima mess. And in this case, the feds have to pay as well.

        So if there is no consequence to fear, why shouldn't you mistreat and neglect her?

        • by Anonymous Coward on Monday August 22, 2016 @11:01PM (#52753275)
          still far safer, cleaner, more efficient and better than coal, gas, wind, solar etc etc.
          • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

            by Procrasti ( 459372 )

            > still far safer, cleaner, more efficient and better than coal, gas, wind, solar etc etc.

            This got voted -1, but statistically, nuclear actually does cause the lowest number of deaths per MWh energy produced.

            http://www.nextbigfuture.com/2... [nextbigfuture.com]

            There really is nothing safer than nuclear, and the facts back this up. Still, when did /. moderation ever have anything to do with reality?

            • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Tuesday August 23, 2016 @04:00AM (#52754041) Homepage Journal

              Deaths per MWh is a really bad metric though. It ignores the vast economic damage, the loss of valuable land, the social ramifications of losing whole towns and communities. The people who were evacuated from the area around Fukushima may still be alive, but their lives were blighted by what happened and they are still struggling to get compensation for what they have lost.

              Even once cleaned up, those towns and communities won't just magically appear again. A lot of people moved away permanently, found new jobs. After years of decay and unrepaired earthquake damage many of the buildings need to be torn down and replaced, but the insurance money and compensation payouts have already been spent elsewhere setting up new homes and businesses. That's why many of the residents are pushing for the full value of their homes and property - if TEPCO can argue that repairs are cheaper, they will be left with largely worthless buildings that no-one wants in a place with no economic prospects.

              • In economies, you expand population until you end up with the haves and the have-nots. 40% of the American workforce turns over every year, and there are job postings everywhere; the 5% unemployed have 6 months of unemployment insurance before they run out, and our unemployment system thus relies on some of that 40% turn-over ending up unemployed as someone else snaps up their job and escapes the jaws of economic death.

                A nuclear accident wobbles your economy for sure. Some source of production is gone,

            • This got voted -1, but statistically, nuclear actually does cause the lowest number of deaths per MWh energy produced.

              Because nuclear leaves waste that persists for thousands of years, you don't get to determine how many deaths nuclear power causes for thousands of years. You can only determine how many it's caused so far. There's plenty of time for inadequate waste management practices to kill more people.

        • Fukishima suffered from a design flaw not neglect. They simply did not understand the true scale that a large tsunami could reach.
          • They simply did not understand the true scale that a large tsunami could reach

            Seriously? The Japanese with what looks to an outsider like ridiculous amounts of infrastructure to deal with tsunamis didn't understand?

            It's been mentioned frequently elsewhere that the initial design would have dealt with it but to save costs it was done in a different way.

          • There was no design flaw in the reactor itself, it was not designed to be suddenly deluged nor should it have been...It was improperly built in a location where it could be hit by a tsunami. But this was not a nuclear specific error, as many towns were also built where they could be hit by a tsunami. The latter was truly tragic as many lives were lost, many homes destroy. That is the real disaster that few care to talk about.
        • Masataka Shimizu, president and CEO of TEPCO, is now an executive director at Fuji Oil.

          Coincidence?

    • Nuclear energy is the crazy hot girlfriend of energy. She may be nice, kind, and wonderful for days, months, or years - maybe decades. But someday, somehow, she's going to go berserk on you. 100% chance.

      She wouldn't have gone off on you, if you hadn't also been porking Coal, Oil, Solar, and now that bitch Wind!

    • by debrain ( 29228 )

      > Nuclear energy is the crazy hot girlfriend of energy. She may be nice, kind, and wonderful for days, months, or years - maybe decades. But someday, somehow, she's going to go berserk on you. 100% chance. And cleaning up the mess at that point will leave you with a very long term scar.

      Coal is the dysfunctional fat chick that'll take anyone for a ride, but eventually comes knocking on your door pregnant and tagging along a few babies, named Katrina, Sandy, Ike, .... Keep banging coal and whatever life y

    • by MachineShedFred ( 621896 ) on Tuesday August 23, 2016 @09:12AM (#52755173) Journal

      Yeah, except nowhere in this article is anything about nuclear power actually mentioned. This article, and storage facility, are for the waste coming from nuclear weapons production and research.

      I guess that's "nuclear energy" in a way, but commercial nuclear energy generation has vastly different waste outputs, with completely different handling procedures. For example, you usually don't have liquid radioactive waste [wikipedia.org] that needs blotting up and stored in barrels, because you haven't dissolved the nuclear material in nitric acid in order to extract the remaining plutonium and uranium from all the other crap you don't want.

  • It's a damn good thing that Harry Reid and Obama was able to stop an investment in containing things like this - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org] - or so I am told.

    Me? I think it was stupid to stop it.

    • by dbIII ( 701233 )
      Apparently Yucca Mountain is too wet for vitrified waste.
      A far better location would be a bit west of that in California.
    • It was stupid to stop Yucca. But don't confuse cold war waste with spent fuel. Spent fuel is quite easy to safely store, nothing like the challenges posed by the nasty chemicals produced for defense, improperly stored from the start with no management plan. Solid spent fuel is quite inert by comparison.
  • Apples to Oranges (Score:5, Informative)

    by atomicalgebra ( 4566883 ) on Monday August 22, 2016 @11:22PM (#52753345)
    It should be noted that the waste was from nuclear weapons production not nuclear power. It is disingenuous to compare them because they are not the same.
    • It should be noted that the waste was from nuclear weapons production not nuclear power.

      That makes it hard to spot the News for Nerds angle. If it was power generation we could assume that someone used the electricity to charge a Tesla or run a computer mining bitcoin.

    • Unless you do reprocessing.
      Then you produce the exact same waste as in nuclear weapons programs.

  • No outside contamination and a badly written cost plus contract.

    If that's as bad as it gets, it's pretty damn good.

  • How did anyone even notice that there had been a nuclear accident in New Mexico? It already looks like Fallout 3. I'm pretty sure there are already feral ghouls and radscorpions there.

    But anyway, any excuse to play this:

    https://youtu.be/GFfaR3I--zI [youtu.be]

  • If only we had a place to put the waste [wikipedia.org]. Something that wasn't closed because of politics [nytimes.com].
  • by Solandri ( 704621 ) on Tuesday August 23, 2016 @12:27AM (#52753503)

    The long-term cost of the mishap could top $2 billion, an amount roughly in the range of the cleanup after the 1979 partial meltdown at the Three Mile Island nuclear power plant in Pennsylvania.

    Three Mile Island has been operating since 1974 generating on average 6645 GWh of electricity each year (yes it's still operating). At the U.S. average of 11.5 cents/kWh, that's $764.2 million/yr worth of electricity. Over it's 42 year history, that would be $32.1 billion worth of electricity generated by the plant.

    So the $2 billion to clean up the partial meltdown of TMI reactor #2 amounted to an extra 11.5 * 2 / 32.1 = 0.72 cents per kWh.

    Now consider that TMI was the only major commercial nuclear accident in U.S. history, and nuclear power in the U.S. has generated 24,196,167 GWh between 1971-2015 [nei.org]. Then the $2 billion cost to clean up TMI works out to just 0.0083 cents per kWh.

    Now consider that mdsolar's favored solar receives a subsidy of 96.8 cents per kWh [ncpa.org]. Or in other words, per unit of energy generated, the subsidy for solar is 11,711x more expensive than cleaning up TMI was.

    • by kelv ( 305876 ) on Tuesday August 23, 2016 @01:50AM (#52753713)

      Can you honestly put your hand on your heart and say the true decommissioning costs of these nuclear plants are built into the prices today? I don't think anyone can. We have properly decommissioned and cleaned up so few nuclear plants that all of the cost estimates I see have a massive risk of cost overruns associated with them. The unfortunate feature of such a long-lived asset and then waste stream is that it's very hard to price in the true cost and the community end up wearing the risk if these are miscalculated. I don't claim malice or conspiracy, just that pricing long term costs is really, really hard.

      • Can you honestly put your hand on your heart and say the true decommissioning costs of these solar plants are built into the prices today?

        Yes nuke plants have a lot of nasty radioactive materials but solar panels and electronics have a lot of nasty materials of their own that most people ignore.

        • Can you honestly put your hand on your heart and say the true decommissioning costs of these solar plants are built into the prices today?

          Of new ones? Yes. Modern panels are required to be recyclable. But even of old ones, it's not anywhere near as big a deal as it is to decommission a nuclear plant. It's not the same ballpark. It ain't even the same motherfuckin' sport.

          Yes nuke plants have a lot of nasty radioactive materials but solar panels and electronics have a lot of nasty materials of their own that most people ignore.

          Not a lot. A small amount. A tiny, minuscule amount compared to nuclear waste. Nice FUD though, troll.

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      That's a bad comparison, not comparing like-for-like. Solar is still developing rapidly and the subsidies are falling away, so a fairer comparison would be with the money invested in developing nuclear from the early days. It's difficult to do because a lot of that investment was for military purposes, but it's still a very significant amount of money.

      In any case, what really matters is the economics of the two options today. Nuclear is vastly more expensive than renewables in Europe, maybe someone else has

    • To be fair, nuke also received massive subsidies in the git-go . In addition, it needs a lot more, esp on gen 4 reactors.
  • So the amount of radioactive material is comparable to amounts commonly *lost* due to carelessness in the early 20th century (see "Radium Lost and Found" by Burbidge Taft), and we've freaked out and spent $2 billion on it even though the contaminated area was inherently limited. Isn't the lesson here that government is grossly inefficient and irrational reactions need to be kept in check?
  • "When a drum containing radioactive waste blew up..."

    I about dropped my jaw when I read that. "What!?" I said to myself. Then poking around, I found that it was the Kitty Litter accident as I call it. The drum did not "blow up" in the sense of explosion, either chemical or criticality, but the kitty litter used expanded and burst the container. Ok, that was pretty stupid (the kitty litter).

    What exceeds "Dumb as a box of rocks with all the smart rocks thrown out" followed that trying to clean it up.

  • They make it sound like there was some sort of big explosion. There wasn't. One drum ruptured, and leaked some radioactive material.

    The material wasn't high level, and only trace amounts made it through the facility.

    Someone's looking for a lucrative payout.

  • What we invested into O's solar project: http://m.washingtontimes.com/n... [washingtontimes.com]
    • What we invested into O's solar project: http://m.washingtontimes.com/n [washingtontimes.com]...

      Solyndra was an obvious scam and Obama should be taken to task for funding it. But the other solar investments paid out, which proves the point that solar isn't bad. Corporatism is.

  • We missed you mdsolar. Was your summer break good? Slashdot just wasn't the same without your alarmist contributions.

  • Need safe reliable rockets and just blast the waste into the sun rather than leaving it here on Earth to waste taxpayers money....

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