Is $699 Too Much For a 13.3-inch Android E-ink Reader? 195
Robotech_Master writes: GoodEReader editor Michael Kozlowski is running an Indiegogo crowdfunding campaign to sell a $699 13.3" Android e-ink tablet. The campaign seeks $42,000--enough to fund the 60-device minimum order set by the OEM. But is it really a good deal for that much money? As an early-adopter or business-class device, it very well might be.
Yes it's too much (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Yes it's too much (Score:5, Interesting)
I could build a decent PC for that and it will last me years, the Android reader will probably stop getting updates after a year or two and then become a paperweight
Wow, that completely misses the point of e-readers.
Anyway, me and my wife use e-ink (Kindle) readers for a few years now and love them, but she needs to read a lot of pdfs as well, so she uses a 9" tablet for those. She'd love it if she could have a big e-ink display and she'd gladly pay a premium, but $699 is a bit too much, we had actually discussed it a few months ago and she asked me if there was something up to $400. Of course she was thinking about 9-10", but still, $699 is a lot for a reader. I assume thought that this will get funded, since they are only asking for 60 people to sign up...
Re:Yes it's too much (Score:5, Interesting)
Wow, that completely misses the point of e-readers.
So does 13.3".
E-readers are replacement for paperback books. Small enough that you can keep one in your jacket pocket (or purse, if so inclined), and hold one-handed, even if not strong and healthy.
I have the first Nook-e-reader, which I didn't use as much as I could have, because it wasn't very ergonomic. My Palm (remember those?) saw a lot more book reading use. And so did books.
Re:Yes it's too much (Score:4, Insightful)
E-readers are replacement for paperback books.
That's a little myopic. E-readers could serve many purposes and there is definitely a market for more than just replacing paperbacks.
I'd love to be able to read all of my scientific papers on an e-ink display instead of printing (and carrying) reams of paper or having the weight, low battery life, and transmissive screens inherent in tablets and laptops. Many students would love to replace all of the textbooks that they lug around with a lightweight, battery-sipping e-reader. These uses would greatly benefit from a letter/A4 sized screen as they have fixed layouts.
Re: (Score:2)
I would also love to get a letter-sized e-reader for PDF datasheets.
Re: (Score:2)
Wow, that completely misses the point of e-readers.
So does 13.3".
Well, no, I wouldn't say that. It definitely is not a replacement of a regular e-reader, you just can't beat a 6" e-reader for convenience when reading e-books, but it is about the size of a printed page so it would be an excellent PDF reader and would fit your briefcase, messenger bag etc wherever a stack of A4 papers would go. So while I think a 9-10" device would be more convenient even as a PDF reader, I can see how a 13.3" would still be useful. As long as you get to keep your 6" $100 e-reader for when
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
I work in science, you insensitive clod.
The 13.3" diagonal on this thing puts it at the same size as journal page. I would love to have this to read journal articles as my current options are: print everything out (best for me, super wasteful), read them on a computer monitor, or squint a bit at a smallish backlit LCD tablet.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
13" sounds good to me! But what I want is 23".
Obviously not for $699 - this is supposed to be cheap technology!
Re: (Score:2)
Nice. I am not alone. I want 19 - 24" as I said above. I want to be able to split view in horizontal mode. I want a stand and a hard case - ruggedized is preferred. I don't want it to have fancy shit. I don't need WiFi with it but that's fine. I'd rather just hook it to USB and treat it like a dumb USB file share, mounted as an EXT4 file system. I don't need or want bluetooth. I don't need a cellular connection nor do I need a web browser but one might be cool if done right - then throw in WiFi of course. I
Re: (Score:2)
I'd like something in the 19" to 24" range. I want to be able to mount it on its side and have it backlit with variable lighting. I want it to sit on a stand both vertically and horizontally. I want to be able to put two texts side-by-side on it when it is in horizontal mode. I want it to set securely in its stand and be easy to take with me - with a hard case. I'm fully aware of the size it would be. I'm also cognizant of the weight factor. If someone wants to build them, let me know. I'll probably take te
Re: (Score:3)
I'd like a 12" mini laptop with a flippable display - normal on one side, eInk on the other.
Re: (Score:3)
I could have sworn someone announced a device that had e-ink display (outside - I think?) and a color display inside - like a clamshell laptop. I seem to recall that there was a second flap that opened and revealed an e-ink display when the device was closed. I just did a search and I'll be buggered if I can find it. :/ It might have only been a concept but I thought it was announced at the CES show back in the late 2000s.
Re: Yes it's too much (Score:2)
Wow, that completely misses the point of e-readers.
That certainly settles it, then; clearly no one would want a larger one. Ever.
Re: (Score:2)
I'm sure there are a few people who'd like a 0.2" e-reader.
But, like a 13.3" e-reader, the market may be too small to make it a viable (and thus actively supported) product.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
You can't have it both ways - either you use a smart operating system like Android and open yourself up to vulnerabilities as soon as the manufacturer stops supporting it, or you use something dumb(er) that'll last for a looooong time - like what's on the traditional Kindle devices.
As for PDFs... high-res, full-color backlit seems much more useful. It's not like tablets have problems with battery life these days.
Re: (Score:3)
That Sony model was mentioned in the second link. It can only display PDF, nothing else.
Re: (Score:2)
hvdh: It's perfect to datasheets though.
Kartu: Thank you for the link.
Re: (Score:2)
Re:Yes it's too much (Score:5, Insightful)
A better comparison would be the large format eReaders that Brother used to make. Maybe 8 years ago when epaper was brand new, Brother produced an A4 format device for business use. Cost about $500 as I recall. Probably only ever sold in Japan.
So based on the fact that that device was cheaper 8 years ago and failed in the market place, I'd say this is overpriced. The low volume is probably the reason why.
Re: (Score:2)
"The Brother SV-100B will land in Japan on June 1st, priced at $1,450"
What you recall isn't always a fact.
http://www.slashgear.com/broth... [slashgear.com]
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Good find. They must have slashed the price because I remember considering one for about 50,000 yen.
Re:Yes it's too much (Score:4, Interesting)
Android reader will probably stop getting updates after a year or two and then become a paperweight
That's funny because Slashdot is advocating staying with a 7 year old operating system and forgoing updates on very desktop PCs you are talking about.
So why does your Android device suddenly stop working if you don't install an update again?
Re: (Score:2)
So why does your Android device suddenly stop working if you don't install an update again?
You may have a well known security problem which is only fixed in newer versions.
Re:Yes it's too much (Score:4, Insightful)
Oh noes, someone will get at my books!
Speaking of aren't those same people not running windows 10 also not running windows update?
Quite frankly the security concerns for a device calling itself an e-reader are somewhat overblown.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
with an e-ink display
Which is inherently limiting.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Then don't install it with the Play Store to begin with. Tada! (Seriously, I wouldn't want it - somebody else might but I'd not want it in there nor would I want any of the Google Play Services.) Why have 'em? It's an e-ink device. 'Snot like I'm gonna game on it.
Re: (Score:3)
What does Betteridge's law of headlines say . . . ?
But is it 3D printed, and can you buy it with Bitcoins, and is it MDsolar powered, or powered by nukes . . . ?
Correlation is not causation!
I have been reading Slashdot too long.
Re: (Score:2)
"I have been reading Slashdot too long."
In Soviet Russia Slashdot reads you for too long!
Re: (Score:2)
And I miss the hot grits. .. or was it Natalie Portman? Btw, can I subscribe to someone's newsletter.
Re: (Score:2)
In Soviet Russia a naked and petrified Natalie Portman pours hot grits down YOU!
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Stop eating fiber you idiot! You're the reason I keep losing my internet connec54#@%$#@A~_NO CARRIER
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
But: ... 2h? ... so reading stuff at the beach is out of the question.
It does not run Android.
It has no eInk display, so reading stuff at the beach is out of question.
Its battery lasts
Android 4? Really? (Score:2)
You lost me at Android 4.04. Ice Cream Sandwich was released in 2011.
Best,
Re: (Score:2)
And what functionality is it missing for an e-reader?
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
It's an e-reader.
You aren't going to be loading apps on it, you're going to be loading documents like .pdfs or .epubs.
If you want something that can run apps, buy a tablet!
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
What functionality is it missing?
Um....security updates? Bug fixes? Someone else mentioned access to Google Play...etc.
There's no way I'd buy a NEW device running a 5 year old Android...even if it was 1/2 or 1/3 of the price discussed.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
It's going to be open-source, and letting people who buy it upgrade to a later version of Android is explicitly given as a reason for that on the Indiegogo page.
In any event, for the kinds of simple e-reading tasks the device is meant for, 4.0.4 should still run pretty much any e-reading app on the market. With only 4 GB of internal storage and a slow-updating e-ink screen, it's not really meant to be a media tablet.
Yes way too much (Score:3)
For that price I can pick up 12 Fire tablets and just rotate between them when the batteries go.
Re: (Score:2)
No color (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: No color (Score:2)
Came here to say exactly the same thing. I would buy it in a heartbeat if it was color. Even crappy 4096 colors color. And I am definitely NOT one of those fat-wallet early adopters. I have just been waiting for exactly this, in color, for years.
I don't read paperbacks. I read scientific papers. So the large screen would be a godsend. Also, a lot of technical books have many diagrams that you really need at least some color, a large screen, and decent resolution to interpret correctly. It would be such a lu
Re: (Score:2)
Hm.... My favourite way to read scientific literature is on a first gen iPad mini, preferably with my feet up on something. I generally read portrait, full page width, but if it's something with lots of sub-subscripts I might go landscape.
Too much? (Score:5, Interesting)
It could be argued that $700 might be too little for a small production run unless they've found a way to really, really cut corners. I suspect they'll have to take an existing 13.3" tablet design (with all the case tooling, logic boards, etc already available) and just change out the display with no other hardware modifications and more or less no requirement for software QA. If that's the strategy, then the fact that it ships with Android 4.0.4 would imply it's several generations old hardware... In which case, $700 actually might be ridiculously overpriced on the buyer side of the equation.
Re: Too much? (Score:2)
Hell YES it's too much (Score:2)
For $700 I could buy 3 full-featured Android tablets and have money left over for a cheap not-so-full-featured tablet.
Seriously, $700 for an e-reader? If you're going to buy one of these, spend that money on an MRI instead to find out what kind of brain injury you have.
Re: (Score:2)
There you have it, nobody needs anything more than a smaller, heavy, power hungry color Android tablet.
WAY too much (Score:2)
Niche Product (Score:2)
As this is such a niche product - I certainly have no interest in it - I guess the price is okay for whoever really needs such a device.
I am still content with my old Kobo touch. The battery life is still okay and it is in great condition considering I take it to work with me every day. If it broke I would almost certainly replace it with a newer Kobo model as I have got such great value from my current one.
large eink screens (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
Paper-sized paper to read and write on (Score:2)
I would think one obvious application for tablet-like computers is to be able to write on hundreds of virtual sheets and recall them, be it notes, essays, whatever. Most people have spent one or two decades in school doing just that on paper. It's fairly ridiculous to sit there with so many gigahertzes and gigabytes, but unable to just take a pen and write because there's no paper sheet around and then, what to do with the paper? can't put it in /home/$user/Documents, email it to yourself, save it to a NAS,
Yes (Score:3)
It's a shame e-reader development suffered death by tablet. Paperback sized ones are extremely cheap but seldom work as readers for anything else. I got myself a a Samsung Galaxy Pro 8 inch in order to read technical and medical books, but I know an e-ink version would be lighter, with more battery time and easier on the eyes.
OEM hardware is step 1: they will fail. (Score:2)
Just because you get hardware from an OEM doesn't mean it's ready for production. Most likely the software on it, well, sucks, and needs to be brought to a level of functionality that people accept.
95% of the time the OEM will just build the OS and see if it works. It's up to you, the vendor, to ensure that the OS and whatever else there is works the way it's supposed to. That includes updating, performance, power management, UI, drivers, correct build options, etc. You have to test to make sure that everyt
Specialty items ... (Score:2)
Personally I wouldn't, but I understand why people would pay a steep price for such a device (having spent nearly $200 on a 6.8" device myself). While most tablets are fine for most readers, e-Ink is better at handling most lighting conditions while e-readers tend to place much more emphasis on battery life. Things like the screen refresh rate does present a major drawback. Yet the inability to scroll through a page effectively is a big part of the reason why certain people are demanding a larger screen.
Holy overpriced batman! (Score:2)
If you want a large E-reader buy a used Kindle DX. they work great and are massively cheaper.
Re: (Score:2)
In 2009, new, the DX was $240 for 9.7 inches. With a few additional features, I wouldn't pay more than $300 for a large screen.
More space than I need, plays audio, has 3g if you're into that. The page turn is slower than I'd like, but 7 years of tech research should pay for that. I'm keeping mine till I break it.
It struggles with complex PDFs, but that's just code. Only 2 had problems. Image only or magazine layout display fine.
Re: (Score:2)
Complex PDF's can be fixed. I use linux PDF tools to strip out the useless background images on a lot of gaming PDF's so that my DX views them nicely. Side effect, those Gaming PDF's now are 1/3rd the size with all the useless art gone.
It's a Flex campaign (Score:4, Interesting)
That means that the lister will get the money even if it doesn't hit its funding goals. Shouldn't that be incompatible with the video's statement that they need to hit a certain minimum order quanity?
I would love to own a 13" eink reader, but this has scam written all over it.
Its not like you don't have a choice (Score:2)
and are forced to purchase it. So what if someone wan's to pay $1000 for that tablet.
Limited Market (Score:3)
For text only books, I find a regular 5/6" Kindle works fine and is comfortable to use for hours. I can set the font size to whatever I find easy to read.
For books with graphics or color, I use a 10" Android tablet. The battery life is good enough for a couple of days use.
I don't see how this product could fill more than a small niche. There are other tablets that you can draw on. How many people need a device that has such a large screen but only renders in gray scale with no color?
Re: (Score:2)
Not with those specs. (Score:2)
Needs to be color and higher PPI. If I'm going to carry a device dedicated to a single purpose, it needs to blow my multi-purpose devices out of the water. My 10.5" tablet has an OLED display at 287 ppi. Color content looks amazing. It's like I'm holding a [slightly small] printed magazine. The text is sharp and crisp, the photos rich and vibrant. For plain text, I use white text on a black background which looks great on an OLED display. Because of the way OLED works, this greatly reduces the amount
$699 too much? (Score:2)
Waaay too expensive for what it is.
At that price it would definitely need to be color E-Ink before I seriously considered it, but even then I'd still think it was priced at a premium.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
How fast do you need the ink on your documents to move?
Re: (Score:3)
The 12" iPad Pro starts at $799ish, so the question basically boils down to "Do you want an iPad Pro sized e-Ink display for $100 less than the iPad Pro?"
As the other people pointed out, ongoing support will likely be a problem, both in terms of warranty replacement (with only about 60 in existence) and software updates.
Personally, I *DO* want a reader this size and I'm considering getting this one. For $699 I'd kind of like a color display, but it looks like all of the eink triton displays on the market h
Re: Yes (Score:2, Insightful)
When Chinese companies are making e-ink Android tablets for a fifth of that, yes. It's ridiculous. People need to stop pretending e-ink is a premium product - it doesn't cost that much to manufacture, and it's inferior in every way except battery life and contrast. Eventually these companies are going to conclude nobody wants e-ink instead of concluding there's a market at smaller margins, and that'll be the end of e-ink.
Re: Yes (Score:5, Interesting)
Exactly. What get me is why isn't there more e ink being used?
I have been waiting for an link GPS device for years. GPS mapping and guidance can deal with the lags of updating GPS positions, e ink has high contrast works great outdoors, and vastly increases battery life which is essential in a mobile electronic map.
a 5-6 " eink android tablet with built in GPS and go for broke and put a solar panel on the back. You could hike for days without needing replacement batteries or a dedicated charging system.
instead we have massive color displays that suck down batteries like there is no tomorrow.on tiny screens that can't give you a good overview of the area.
Re: (Score:2)
An eInk display that updates every few seconds will not save you any power. These things only save power when you only turn the page every minute or two.
Re: (Score:2)
Debian on a Kobo by default has a clock that counts in seconds on the X desktop, so one refresh per second, but it still lasts a few days on a charge. That's nowhere near as long as if the screen had not been refreshing every second of course, but the power cost of each refresh is not huge.
Re: (Score:2)
So then... it would be useless for a GPS ;)
Re: Yes (Score:4, Insightful)
That's a lot of work to replace a paper map and compass.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
They might not tell YOU where you are, but they sure can tell me where I am if I've just been hiking around. Besides, just turn on your phone for a few minutes and get the lat and long from it if you want to be lazy about it.
Re: (Score:3)
They certainly do if you're properly equipped and know what you're doing with them. Yes, yes you can put me into an unknown area with just a map and a compass and I will shortly tell you where I am. I can then give you an estimate as to how long it will take me to reach the destination, plot a route, follow that route, and check to make sure that I am on that route. I can probably even accomplish this after dark but that will slow me down a bit.
A map does, when it's a decent map, tell you many things - incl
Re: (Score:2)
They won't tell you where you are if you're an idiot, that is correct.
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
instead we have massive color displays that suck down batteries like there is no tomorrow...
Ah, but that pretty looking color display looks great on the showroom floor, especially when placed next to an e-ink reader for contrast. Check out the tablets next time you're in a Best Buy.
Re: (Score:2)
Licensing issues.
Annoying as fuck.
They want "high value products" instead of making a killing as millions of really cheap low end tablets flood the global market.
Re: (Score:2)
It's too bad really, if they put it at a more realistic pricing, it would have already taken over the display world for variou
Re: (Score:2)
Actually, contrast sucks compared to amoled.
Re: (Score:3)
What is the difference between reflected light?
Re: (Score:2)
Three.
Re: (Score:2)
Refracted light?
Backlight?
Self illumination?
Quantum Superposition?
A Chihuahua-Mart?
Your mom?
Bananas?
Your sentence really kind of needs to be completed or some people will be lost, and others will go places you never imagined.
Re: (Score:2)
Hmm... I refreshed the thread. I half-way expected them to reply with something like, "If you don't know, I'm not telling you. You're too stupid to understand."
No, I really was expecting that. In short, as near as I can tell, they mostly spouted gibberish, shit in their pants, and then donned their Burger King crown and sat there looking proud as if they'd accomplished greatness.
Re: (Score:2)