Finnish IT Retailer Reveals Most Returned Products 108
jones_supa writes: The largest computer gear retailer in Finland, Verkkokauppa.com, has unveiled top 20 lists of most returned and most serviced equipment in 2015 (Google translation). To offer an alternative to Black Friday, the company is going with a theme called "Sustainable Christmas". They want to guide shoppers to make good choices, as product returns always create extra burden for the distribution chain. Is there anything that catches your eye in the lists, or something else that you would like to warn about?
Re: I am sorry (Score:5, Funny)
It's a bit like a verkkokauppa.
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But closer to "juouluokuoukuo" according to this European to American translator [funtranslations.com].
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> Or, instead of doing all of that, you could accept that English is the language of the Internet. However, some people just like to do things the hard way...
That could be an alternative, of course.
The problem is that English brings its own problems into the game.
If one knows English (like I humbly like to think of myself), it is more or less equivalent to use English or invest in having proper translation.
Just to make it clearer:
1. Some people (like my son) require that I avoid English for a plethora of
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"Forewarned is forearmed" sounds like a very un-english to my ears, because it doesn't have any superfluous articles like "the", "a" or "an".
The thing about English is that it has survived 1500 years of mangling by our nasty foreign tongues, mostly by bending itself to accommodate different ways of using the language. I doubt that Mandarin will be able to do that in this century.
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For Mandarin, you will have to bend your tongue to it, being a tonal language and all that.
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The thing about English is that it has survived 1500 years of mangling by our nasty foreign tongues, mostly by bending itself to accommodate different ways of using the language.
Survived the mangling, yes, but it became, well, mangled.
Any other constructed language that survives the process of actually being used by billions of people would become mangled as well. Perhaps a little less mangled, or perhaps a little more. I would put a little more faith in another 50 years of English evolving than I would in constructing a better language with the goal of 3 billion people using it in the same time frame. Only a little more faith though.
I find it likely we create universal translators within the next 30 years that makes translation between
Re:I am sorry (Score:5, Insightful)
Since the beginning of the Internet, English has become the fastest growing human language on Earth, ever.
There are now many times more speakers of English as a second language-- ESL speakers-- as there are those native born to speaking English. Even more to the point, there are more business and technical exchanges between ESL speakers than there are similar exchanges where all parties are native English speakers. Like it or not, English became today's "Lingua Franca" about a decade ago. Please try to keep up :-)
English is better suited to this role than any other native language. It is itself a mongrel language where most core concepts have multiple synonyms drawn from different ancient roots. And the pathway to adding new concepts from foreign languages remains wide open. "Namaste", the use of "fail" in constructions such as "he fails it", "samizdat" distributions, and hundreds more words absorbed from foreign root languages have changed English so much that a Professor of English of a hundred years ago would have difficulty understanding its daily use on blogs and forums, and would have vast difficulty in making his comments intelligible to others without first studying the new English.
English rules, but not because it is inherently better for global communications than any other language. English rules because it is so fantastically flexible that you can totally mangle all its rules of syntax and bring in any number of foreign words and still deliver a semantically valid message. English rules because its "rules" carry no more weight than mere suggestions. So you can mangle it in all kinds of ways, and still deliver something meaningful.
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Re:I am sorry, truly sorry (Score:2)
It sounds like your ability to express yourself in your native language is much better than your ability to express yourself in English. That seems reasonable. Perhaps as you learn how to express yourself well in English your prejudice against the English language will decrease. And make no mistake: you are clearly prejudiced in this matter since you are judging English's semantic carrying capacity before you even know how to use its flexible syntax to deliver your meanings in a satisfactory way.
Hint: Engl
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Sorry for ruining your bubble but English is like AC said, a sloppy language that is only spoken in most of the internet because it is the language of the country that dominates the world. Right now I'm having trouble expressing this idea to you in English, because my native language is so much more logical and structured, to a point that any conversion is difficult to do without losing most of the meaning.
^ Nailed it.
(as in, I couldn't find any meaning in that).
Curious as to what your mother tongue is, and how many languages you speak, that it makes English so difficult, as it is (as mentioned above) a very forgiving language.
English reminds me of HTML - even half mangled, most web browsers can manage to deliver the message.
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Well, a simpler example: Imagine me writing as someone using PNG format. For me using English is like being forced to convert to JPEG format, you lost information in the process. Or maybe you are simply being sarcastic in a very stupid and arrogant way as is common among north-americans, who knows.
Actually, I'm Australian, although I did live in America for a while.
American English/Aussie English both have their differences to the Queens english (And even though us Aussies generally could care less about the queen, all she is to us is a public holiday once a year, really) Us Aussies still know we don't speak "Proper" English, and we're OK with that.
It's strange to me however that I find Australians seem to have very little problem with accents and "dialects" - american, english, irish, south americ
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It sounds very English to me. Most of the words are Germanic in origin, except arm, whose Middle English etymology in this usage comes from Old French/Latin.
I would argue English's articles are not superfluous, since English has lost its noun declension beyond the genitive.
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But I still don't understand what a joulukouku is.
Literally: Christmashook
But "Joulukuu" is literally Christmas "moon". In finnish month names end with -kuu ie. moon, meaning month. Both having same ethymological origin, see explanation here [etymonline.com].
Joulu is finnish possibly from Swedish "Jul" meaning same thing ie. Christmas, but there are multiple explanations where Jul originally came from, see this [google.com].
Extension cable Return - did not reach my toilet? (Score:1)
How the fuck do you achieve near 50% return rate on a USB extension cable ?
Seen a statistic that claimed, over 30% of clothes bought online are returned as well. "Color not as expected.." - Go calibrate your monitor, FFS. The rest of us be paying the costs for this (near incredible) waste.
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That cable is three times longer than the standard allows. I imagine it just doesn't work very well.
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The good active USB extenders work well, they are basically one port passive hubs. The cheapo ones are just a problem waiting to happen.
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Here is the product in question: Fuj:tech 10 m aktiivinen USB-jatkokaapeli [verkkokauppa.com]
So from a technical standpoint it seems to indeed be a passive 1-port USB hub. Such solution probably improves the signal quality, but I believe that a true active cable would have an external power supply as well.
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So from a technical standpoint it seems to indeed be a passive 1-port USB hub. Such solution probably improves the signal quality, but I believe that a true active cable would have an external power supply as well.
A 1-port hub uses little power itself, so if you're plugging into a USB2 port (or an even more powerful one... my Gigabyte motherboard has 6A USB2 ports) there's really no need for external power.
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Yes, but a long cable can introduce power losses.
Yes, that's why you need the hub. They could put a boost converter in there to kick up the voltage if they're worried about that.
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how does your inner circle feel now (Score:4, Funny)
Too bad you specifically asked one of those guys for a solution because *I* do have one.
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..as no-one else is being nice - if you have a working cable?, logically, just need a working A-A extension - the10m previously mentioned is this:
http://www.delock.com/produkte/F_164_USB-2-0-Verlaengerung_82446/merkmale.html
no shill, works fine - dunno about non-European availabity tho..
In saying that, fairly sure I have a few different brand extensions, never had a problem with any till now, maybe just lucky - I think what may be your specific problem, you are trying to use 'non-Active', or dumb extender?
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Well, I can't because last time I needed to do this, I just used a cheap crap hub (cheapest-on-ebay style) I had lying around. I bought it to feed power to and be a hub for my Pi, and then it turned out to be too crap to do that job. It was fine to bring keyboard, mouse, and an optical drive out to my desk from my closet, though.
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The cable is fine, it's the software and/or hardware not being capable of coping with the added latency. I use an active USB repeater cable of the same length without issue for a keyboard and mouse. However, I've seen products that cannot cope with the latency such as digital whiteboards and flatbed scanners.
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I unfortunately bought a shorter version a while back and the connector at one end (that is basically 1 port hub) is badly designed and came apart after about 10 plugin/pull out cycles..
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came after about 10 plugin/pull out cycles..
that's what she said
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Re: Extension cable Return - did not reach my toil (Score:2)
At my old retail job A/A extenders usually got returned because they thought it was a regular usb cable
Re:Extension cable Return - did not reach my toile (Score:5, Funny)
Color not as expected.
Ordered white/gold dress, received blue/back one...
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No. The problem is that you screwed with the defaults. If you did that on a Mac you would have the same problem for the same reason.
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It's all a numbers game (Score:1)
Some of those figures reveal a low sample rate, would be nice to see how many actual units were returned as well.
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Yeah. Percentages are pretty meaningless without a "total number"
I remember a while back that there were at least fire people *in panick* in my company because in one store the profit margin on one product group "went into the cellar". They *just* looked at the profit margin percentage that popped up in a list and went havoc. Havoc enough to escalate it to *me* (the software developer) to see if that "could be right".
I just had to look at the revenue / volume columns right next to the percentage to see what
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Some of those figures reveal a low sample rate, would be nice to see how many actual units were returned as well.
Yeah, 20.00% tells me that most likely only 5 or 10 units were sold. Too small a sample size to tell us much of anything.
I Process Retail Returns Daily (Score:5, Interesting)
The list is no surprise. Their top returns can be classified into 3 categories:
1) Tablet cases/covers. Oftentimes they explicitly claim to fit the iPads, and also other 10.1/7" tablets, but end up too loose and the tablet slips out, and of course the straps aren't adjustable. Few people bring their tablet into the store to check, and it's likely a present and still in a box.
2) Devices which utilize radio waves. Interference by walls/furniture, and other devices, cause reception to vary widely. The overloaded 2.4GHz spectrum is making this gradually worse. For wireless audio, people have little tolerance for the signal cutting out. Remember 'antennagate'? A poor wifi antenna can make a tablet (or unlocked phone) hard to use.
3) Sticks of RAM. I was kinda surprised by this, although thinking back to how many unused sticks of RAM I own that my mobos just won't work with for various reasons, it shouldn't be too surprising. Some people likely get SODIMMs instead of DIMMs and vice versa, or the wrong speed, or the wrong DDR tech.
In brick and mortar, top electronics returns are phone chargers with the wrong plug (Lightning instead of micro-usb or vice versa), and $5 headphones whose wires snap after bending them twice. Tablets are next, followed by Wifi speakers. God, the tablets; the cheap ones are cheap enough to be unusable, but are expensive enough to warrant returning, so the return rate is ~75% on some of them. Printers were very frequently returned because the manufacturer tried to save 50cents by not including a USB-B cable; customers would complain it had no cable, and for some reason they don't have a dozen laying around their house like I do. Only including a black ink cartridge and no color (or vice versa) was another frequently given reason. If people weren't able to rip the packaging open and try it on, I imagine many smartphone cases would be returned; apparently noone knows what phone they have, and have to try to put the case on in order to figure out if it'll fit. At best, they know they have an iPhone, or 'a Samsung', but most often, it's e.g. 'a Verizon'. Most amusing return award: an HDMI cable returned for 'not working with a 3d signal' despite the packaging explicitly saying it did. Surprisingly, (small) TVs were almost never returned, I guess they really do encourage passivity.
The usual suspects (Score:2)
It's always the same brands too. The fall into two categories:
1. Crap brands who bought the name of a previously respected company, e.g. Polaroid. If people buy a "Logik" brand device they don't expect much, but if they buy Polaroid and it's terrible they will return it. Plus the Polaroid name usually costs more.
2. Expensive brands that don't live up to expectations. Apple refurbs are a good example. You might save 50 Euros but people still expect it to be perfect.
Re: The usual suspects (Score:2)
Dont buy wireless audio stuff or you'll be sad. My PX22s could be sturdier...but performance wise they are awesome
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Crap brands who bought the name of a previously respected company, e.g. Polaroid
Interestingly, the "Polaroid" camera listed there (the Polaroid 300 / Polaroid PIC-300) is actually just a *Fujifilm* Instax Mini 7 camera. That's right- the only camera Polaroid now sell that uses anything like the traditional Polaroid film technology is actually one made by Fujifilm (who licensed the patents from Polaroid)!
The current owners of the Polaroid brand *do* appear to be treating the instant photography line with a little more respect than the previous owners (who cancelled the original Polaro
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They sell Polaroid batteries in Poundland, and they are shit. They don't last long and they leak. The name has been ruined.
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So not only does Apple flaunt the EU directive to standardize on micro-USB for phone charges, it shifts the cost of their non-compliance onto retail stores (and thus the rest of us) which have to deal with the returns?
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Re: I Process Retail Returns Daily (Score:2)
Bought 320gb of patriot ram for work recently..80 sticks, none bad. Maybe they checked them since bulk..but they have good heat spreaders too. Great ram for a similar price
remote-controlled panzer... (Score:3, Funny)
Number 11 on the top list of returned refurbished products is a "remote-controlled rechargeable Panzer III". Well, I guess once you have flattened your neighbour's home, there is not much use left for having your own Panzer. Wonder how often that one has already been sold and returned again.
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Well, the PzKpfw III wasn't all that great a tank. They probably traded them in for Vs. (Tigers were even deadlier, but they were slow and lacked cross-country ability).
Close the loop (Score:2)
1. Put an immediate message out that "We have our best people working feverishly on the issue."
2. Force my engineering and channel sales experts to conference call each and every customer until they learn enough about the issue to fix the reason the product was returned.
3. Perhaps the products are not defective (such as RAM) but that the purchase process does not identify the correct RAM needed. I'd have my software team
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If I were a manufacturer with a 20% return rate on my products, I'd do the following:
1. Put an immediate message out that "We have our best people working feverishly on the issue."
2. Force my engineering and channel sales experts to conference call each and every customer until they learn enough about the issue to fix the reason the product was returned.
3. Perhaps the products are not defective (such as RAM) but that the purchase process does not identify the correct RAM needed. I'd have my software team write code to detect the correct RAM needed (for example).
4. I'd tie the design team's bonus structure directly to return rates.
5. Lastly, I'd also close the loop with distributors - any product where return rates started to climb would be pulled.
(When you are getting a 20% return rate, you're not making profit anyway.)
You forget:
0. Check the sales numbers. If the product is sold only five times, there's nothing to worry yet about the return rate, but marketing should get their act together.
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Oh, that's easy to get around. BigStoreSupply sells the tablet to BigStore under cost, so BigStore can sell it at a technical markup. BigStoreSupply is legally a different company, in a different state. BigStore can say 'See, here's our receipts, we bought it for $22.50 and sold it for $29!' because BigStoreSupply is technically not the same corporation as BigStore.
State: "Well, how much did BigStoreSupply pay for it?" BigStore: "Oh, I have no idea. You'd have to ask them." BigStoreSupply: "We're not in you
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STILL MADE MONEY (as required by state law here which prohibits 'loss leaders'.. a minimum of 3%-6% markup required)
Maybe the solution to your problem is to move to a state that isn't so tyrannical.
Re: Close the loop (Score:1)
I've read about tyranny my friend, and prohibiting loss leaders is not it.
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When you are getting a 20% return rate, you're not making profit anyway
How can you make that kind of blanket statement? It totally depends on the profit margin and the cost of restocking. If you get 98% profit on $200 items that cost $3 to restock, who cares about 20% return rate.
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It all depends on how much you charge for shipping&handling. Some of the lesser reputable TV shops pretty much live by their "100% return" guarantee, which is quite sustainable with a 20+ bucks shipping&handling fee that you don't get refunded.
Re: Close the loop (Score:2)
Said company only operates in half this context. A RAM mfg isnt going to make that tool...the burden is on MS. It would piss off investors/be a waste
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The profit on an iPhone 5s is estimated to be over 90%, I believe.
It makes that list as one of the most returned products, but only because of insane margins.
As such, the monetary value alone is not useful or even indicative in judging whether something is "cheap and throwaway" tech, or a poorly-made expensive product that contributes to all kinds of waste.
Amazon basically haven't made profit, but their impact on the distribution chain, environmental considerations because they exist etc. is phenomenal.
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The "profit" from an iPhone is not 90%. The materials cost may only be 10% but the rest of the revenue has to pay for R&D, Marketing, etc. A significant amount of work goes into iOS and there is no revenue from that.
I'm not saying that Apple isn't raking it in (their cash reserves are enough to dispel that) but people basing their profit estimates off of an iFixit tear-down are completely ignoring the bulk of Apples operations.
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The "profit" from an iPhone is not 90%. The materials cost may only be 10% but the rest of the revenue has to pay for R&D, Marketing, etc. A significant amount of work goes into iOS and there is no revenue from that. I'm not saying that Apple isn't raking it in (their cash reserves are enough to dispel that) but people basing their profit estimates off of an iFixit tear-down are completely ignoring the bulk of Apples operations.
Additionally, that profit is Apple only. I can safely say that, selling iPads and Apple computers as a retailer is not very profitable at all. After free shipping (which we have to offer to stay competitive) we lose money on many iPad sales (especially if we ship a reliable method like FedEx or UPS instead of USPS) unless they're buying the accessories and/or AppleCare. Computers, off of a $2000 Mac, after free shipping, we're lucky to make $75, gross profit, so they're a bit better.
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Not to mention the handwaving costs.
R&D isn't that expensive when the cost is spread over the huge number of sales. Unlike many other operations, Apple can pretty much count on even a clunker selling enough to pay back the R&D costs at $1 per unit.
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Why bother with Q&A?
If it works, great.
If it doesn't work, the customer pretty much gave you a 4+ weeks interest-free loan.
Oh holy god, no, hahahahah (Score:2)
They forgot average Slashdotter's rate of returned date invitations:
108%*
* Percent exceeds 100 due to frequent double responses of "No. God no."
WD Black the 3rd most broken item (Score:2)
Seems like WD Black hard drives have some quality issues.
This entire article "seems" a lot... (Score:2)
It seems legit, it seems like there are huge returns, it seems relevant...
But without actual sales numbers we don't know if an item with a 50% return rate is one out of two sold, or five out of ten or fifty out of a hundred...
As for WD Black drives...
They are slightly pricier - and they come with a 5-year warranty. Most other WD drives come with a 2- or 3-year warranty.
Which gives those WD Black drives more time to start "acting suspiciously".
So the customer is incentivised to send it back and most likely g
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What strikes me as far more interesting is that people bother with retailers when it comes to WD RMA. WD has maybe the most hassle-free RMA service in the industry, the last thing I'd want to go through with them is the usual "take it to the retailer, wait 4-6 weeks for replacement" spiel.
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You should realise that Finland is not the United States, and you just do not send products back to manufacturers here in socialist Finland. The retailers are the ones who handle returns and warranty claims and everything.
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That used to be expected in the U.S. as well. Take it back to the store, show that it doesn't work and a receipt to show when you bought it. Leave with a new one.
Really, it makes sense. The store is the one that has a business relationship with the manufacturer. You bought the item from the store.
If the brick and mortar stores in the U.S. hadn't stopped doing that, they might stand a chance against online retailers.
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If you can return it to the retailer for a full refund the next day, and get another brand new one, why would you bother with a warranty return of any kind? 4-6 week replacement time at a retailer sounds quite illegal. It's a return of DOA and a new purchase, not a repair at the retail shop.
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Not really. Seagate used to have the best - for $10 you not only get an advanced shipment drive, but you also get a label to return the old one - which I always used because $10 is less than half what return shipping is. A
Return statistics from a french webshop (Score:2)
Available every 6 monthes : http://www.hardware.fr/article... [hardware.fr]
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item 16: "21.57% Apple iPhone 5s 32 GB Black (Unlocked, Factory corrected), ME435."
Maybe they want iPhone 6 instead.
Re: No Surprise (Score:2)
Kids arent so big on perspective