Cable Boxes Are the 2nd Biggest Energy Users In Many Homes 394
SpzToid (869795) writes 224 million U.S. cable TV set-top boxes combined consume as much electricity as produced by four giant nuclear reactors, running around the clock. They have become the biggest single energy user in many homes, apart from air conditioning. Cheryl Williamsen, a Los Alamitos architect, has three of the boxes leased from her cable provider in her home, but she had no idea how much power they consumed until recently, when she saw a rating on the back for as much as 500 watts — about the same as a washing machine. A typical set-top cable box with a digital recorder can consume as much as 35 watts of power, costing about $8 a month for a typical Southern California consumer. And the devices use nearly as much power turned off as they do when they are turned on. The article outlines a voluntary industry agreement that should make a dent in this power consumption (it "calls for a power reduction in the range of 10% to 45% by 2017"), but makes the point that much larger gains are possible: "Energy experts say the boxes could be just as efficient as smartphones, laptop computers or other electronic devices that use a fraction of the power thanks to microprocessors and other technology that conserves electricity. Ideally, they say, these boxes could be put into a deep sleep mode when turned off, cutting consumption to a few watts. At that rate, a box could cost less than $1 a month for power, depending on how much it is used."
What if I get hungry? (Score:5, Funny)
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
If it doesn't involve lasers, flamethrowers or nuclear reactors, it's not a good was to toast a cheese sandwich.
Re:What if I get hungry? (Score:4, Funny)
If you've got a better way to toast a cheese sandwich while watching tv, I'd like to hear it.
If it doesn't involve lasers, flamethrowers or nuclear reactors, it's not a good was to toast a cheese sandwich.
Didn't you read the stub? Four nuclear reactors!
Re: (Score:3)
If you've got a better way to toast a cheese sandwich while watching tv, I'd like to hear it.
If it doesn't involve lasers, flamethrowers or nuclear reactors, it's not a good was to toast a cheese sandwich.
Didn't you read the stub? Four nuclear reactors!
Speaking of which, I think that means cable boxes are carbon neutral, since they are apparently powered by four giant nuclear reactors. So, I can finally stop buying carbon credits for my cable box carbon footprint! Hooray.
Why can't you plug into you TV anymore. (Score:5, Insightful)
I have basic cable so I can plug right into my TV. However with digital TV being common why arn't more TV's handling it so you don't need the cable box.
Re: (Score:2)
the signal is encrypted even for the broadcast channels so you need a cable box or cable card with adapter.
Re:Why can't you plug into you TV anymore. (Score:5, Insightful)
And of course, the cable industry HATES CableCard because they want you to rent a box, which is (apparently) why they made it hard for TV manufacturers to support it.
Re:Why can't you plug into you TV anymore. (Score:4, Informative)
time warner cable in NYC will rent the cable card and adapter for $2.50 a month compared to $10 or more for the cable box
Re: (Score:3)
Well, people want to record, so you can get plenty of DVRs that DO support CableCARD.
In fact, in Canada, where the cable providers run roughshod over their subscribers, they routinely use CableCARD boxes. But they're not supporting it so we don't get half the
Re: (Score:2)
Sure, I'll buy that. Obviously, that means there are tons of TVs that support "tru2way" CableCards these days, since it's been a standard for 6 years now.
Oh, wait...!
Re: (Score:3)
That sounds like a problem created by the cable industry itself. The idea that cable card is inferior is bullsh*t. This isn't new stuff. This is technology they control. 2-way cable has been around since the 70s.
If cable card isn't "good enough" it's because the industry actively sabotaged it.
Re:Why can't you plug into you TV anymore. (Score:5, Insightful)
The cable industry designed the CableCard standard themselves, so that's their own goddamn fault!
Bullshit.
It is the cable company's fault precisely because the cable company, not the user, is choosing which cable boxes to buy and the cable company (unlike the user) doesn't give a shit about user experience. If cable boxes / DVRs were sold retail instead of rented there would be competition and the manufacturers would be forced to get their shit together!
Re:Why can't you plug into you TV anymore. (Score:4, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3)
So what you're saying is that all these "smart TVs" that do have enough horsepower must support CableCard, right? Except they don't, so you're wrong.
Re: (Score:3)
So why aren't companies making cheap direct-to-consumer cable boxes that have coax and CableCARD in and HDMI out?
You mean like these people? [silicondust.com]
Re: (Score:3)
(BTW, I don't work there.)
Comcast has a special line for cablecard setup issues. 1 (877) 405-2298. It worked far better for me trying to get a cablecard set up than the normal #.
Re: (Score:2)
Plugging into TV works just fine ... (Score:3)
I have basic cable so I can plug right into my TV. However with digital TV being common why arn't more TV's handling it so you don't need the cable box.
My TV includes a digital tuner so I can plug my basic digital cable service directly into the TV using the coax cable coming out of the wall, no cable box necessary. These unencrypted channels include all the basic standard definition channels offered by my cable company not just the handful of local terrestrial broadcast channels.
I actually split the coax and have one output go directly into the TV and one into the cable box. The cable company's DVR only has two receivers, on rare occasions I have two s
Here's an idea... (Score:4, Insightful)
Got rid of Charter two years ago - now I have a ChannelMaster for OTA, and a couple of Roku boxes. Feels nice not spending that $90 a month.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Here's an idea... (Score:5, Informative)
Yes, I have a device to turn my antenna for better reception. It's called "my hand".
Americans are always looking for the technological fix. Does anyone really need TV's in every room including the guest bathroom? Just reduce your consumption and try living a little simpler.
TV in every room using 5 watts total (Score:4, Interesting)
I have a TV in every room, it's called my iPad. I watch Amazon Prime, Netflix, HBOGO, and Xfinity on it.
I have a 40 inch LCD TV in my den, but usually prefer the iPad.
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:3)
My antenna is in my attic, under the roof and still picks up every station broadcast in my area, even when connected to a three-output passive distribution block with three TVs attached.
I guess I'm even less attached to TV than GP. I don't have a DVR anymore. I did have a gbpvr box until analog TV went clear away, but it hasn't been used in years, and the PCs that I have hooked to two of the TVs are in hardware hibernate mode (RAM suspend to disk) most of the ti
Re: (Score:3)
there is no 500 W draw, that's a lie
Re: (Score:3)
There is no mention of the actual device model or any details for the 500 w cable box. I think it's a complete lie. 50 watts is pretty good for a modern digital cable box imo.
Re:Here's an idea... (Score:5, Funny)
Sorry....Any reason to use that link.
Re: (Score:3)
"Apparently, a lot of people are figuring it out, because 8% of US households got rid of cable last year, and the trend has not peaked yet."
While I've seen that number bandied around, it's hogwash, put nicely. Total pay TV subs declined about about 250k last year, on a base of 100 million. Households grew a bit, though, so if you adjust for that, you come up with about 500k households cut the cord, or about 0.5% of the base.
they get hot too (Score:5, Informative)
even when they are off. at least the older Scientific Atlanta ones did. time warner cable in NYC has new Cisco and Motorola ones that are a lot more efficient and don't get nearly as hot
Re:they get hot too (Score:4, Insightful)
Amen. The Scientific Atlanta cable TV boxes dissipate an unreasonable amount of heat, enough to significantly warm the room. The Scientific Atlanta DVR boxes dissipate more heat than their cable TV boxes. They take an excessively long time to boot and channel surfing is nearly impossible. Little wonder so many people cut the cord.
Re:they get hot too (Score:5, Insightful)
Deep sleep ... a few watts ... (Score:3)
If it consumes more than one Watt, it's nowhere near "deep sleep".
Re: (Score:2)
sure it is, doesn't matter if one or fifteen watts, won't matter at all compared to all else american household is using, it's a rounding error
and as I've stated elsewhere, the boxes don't pull 500 watts running, not even a third of that
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
it is rounding error, you are not an engineer. Average continuous power draw per citizen in the USA is over 1.4 KW, and your 35 watts gets divided by 2.6 for per capita consumption
Re:Deep sleep ... a few watts ... (Score:5, Funny)
That's one long day there, Butch. Do you live on Venus?
huh (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3)
don't worry, the article is false and architect is an idiot who knows nothing about electronics
Re: (Score:3)
don't worry, the article is false and nearly every architect is an idiot
That sums it up better
Re: (Score:2)
I did read the article, here is what we're complaining about:
Cheryl Williamsen, a Los Alamitos architect, has three of the boxes leased from her cable provider in her home, but she had no idea how much power they consumed until recently, when she saw a rating on the back for as much as 500 watts — about the same as a washing machine.
which is irrelevant rubbish, that box does not consume 500 watts
Re:Yup-article is BS (Score:5, Interesting)
i just checked the back of my Cisco PVR.
And it says it's rated for 500W.
Why on earth would it even *need* to be rated that high?
Someone clearly expected at some point it might need to draw that much power, I just can't figure out why. That seems really really high to me.
Re:What the 500 Watts draw rating means (Score:5, Informative)
Most of the boxes that have a 500 Watt listing on the box is the maximum combined power of the box with a television plugged into it. Those boxes generally go into standby when the TV is turned off.
This is the same way Light Dimmers are rated. A 600 Watt dimmer does not consume 600 Watts, but can handle a 600 Watt chandilier with 6 100 Watt bulbs.
Check the back of the box. Does it include a place to plug in the TV?
Re: (Score:3)
Technically, nowhere in the article did it say they consumed 500W. It said they were *rated* for 500W, which means the hardware within is capable of handling a 500W charge. I agree that even mentioning it in the article is just an attention grabbing tactic, but the point of that line is that the architect saw the very high rating which led them to investigate the actual usage, which turned out to be 35W (which is still high for something many people leave on 24/7 and are increasingly having multiple of in t
Re: (Score:2)
I'm very, very surprised that refrigerators aren't #2. Or possibly electric water heaters, in houses that have them.
They may well be. TFA doesn't say otherwise. You need to learn to look for weasel words: TFA only says that cable boxes are #2 in "many" homes. That could mean anything. 100 homes could count as "many" even though there are a million times that many homes in America.
Re: (Score:3)
No, 500 W on the backplate refers to the rating of the PSU, just like PC power supplies.
Then they do some adding up.
35 watts X 8760 hours a year X 224 million boxes equals 4 big nuke plants which is not just a lot of electricity generation required just so you can watch TV, but also to run your cable box while you sleep and it sits there heating up the air (and causing CO2 to spew out and kill your children when the climate really gets pissed at us)(I assume the nuke plants aren't really used for this elect
Re: (Score:3)
I have measured it myself. Two different models of boxen supplied by Verizon consume 35W -- constantly.
Re:huh (Score:4, Informative)
And the USA catches up with where Europe was a decade ago, all because GWB Jr. considered federally mandated energy efficiency standards as unAmerican.
Re: (Score:3)
I bet DVR boxes are even worse (Score:2)
I've got a couple of Comcast DVRs instead of cable boxes... with a Cable box, you should be able to power off when not in use, but with a DVR, this could be a bit trickier... I suppose it could do some smart scheduling where it turns itself off unless actively recording shows - keep a sub-section with scheduling info running so it knows to spin up a few minutes before recording a show...
Still, I should think that DVR boxes on a per-box basis would be a bigger issue than regular cable boxes.
As for most elect
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
The funny thing is that ever since Reagan and Thatcher launched a new form of right wing politics we live in an era where the "conservatives" are radicals who want to replace a working system with their utopian dream society, while the "socialists" or "liberals" are people who want to keep the tried and tested system with all or most of its government involvement in the economy.
Anyway, this particular problem could be solved in two ways:
1. Have the government determine standards and force companies to certi
Wonder if they'll improve the firmware (Score:3)
Seems you can't buy any form of digibox these days without some serious firmware bugs whether its just picture freezing , "buffering" remote control key presses until it can be bothered to process them, missed recordings for no apparent reason or just complete crashes requiring a hard reboot. Or if like me you were dumb enough to buy a Sagemcom box - then all of the above.
pure rubbish (Score:2)
rating on back is not power draw, you might get close to that during startup. normal draw is less than 140 watts, put it in standby and get 15 watts
I once worked in engineering group that also had couple of architects, we called them "farcitechs" and now you all know why
Re: (Score:2)
"normal draw is less than 140 watts, put it in standby and get 15 watts"
That's less than 500, but still an order of magnitude more than a set top box should need! IIRC power supply ratings on Apple TV and Roku box are both under 10 watts, real usage is probably 3-5. Add a WD green or similar hard drive (6-8W) and a couple of tuners and encoding ASICS and it still shouldn't break 20 watts at full load.
Re: (Score:2)
you are funny, the utter BS right before that was:
"Cheryl Williamsen, a Los Alamitos architect, has three of the boxes leased from her cable provider in her home, but she had no idea how much power they consumed until recently, when she saw a rating on the back for as much as 500 watts — about the same as a washing machine."
Re: (Score:2)
good idea, they would make excellent machine gun fodder for Columbia's armed forces
Re: (Score:2)
I think this is actually part of the problem. The cable box I use is probably close to 10 years old. And that's how long I've owned it. The actual date they started manufacturing the model could be close to 15 years old. In terms of technology, they are dinosaurs. There really isn't any reason for these boxes to use more than 5 watts, or maybe 10, but they are ancient designs. Just look at the size of them. The whole what they are doing could probably fit in an HDMI dongle, for
Re: (Score:2)
Well, a more neutral way of saying that would be if they allocate that savings ... maybe they don't perceive it as a waste. ;-)
These boxes have long outlived their usefulness (Score:2)
Useful is in the eye of the collector (Score:2)
If you think non-standardization is not useful, you're just on the wrong side of the line where money changes hands.
The entire industry is designed to keep out people who aren't paying, and to extract as much as possible (what the companies call a "fair share") from those who do.
You could look at it another way: Why should a single person with one TV pay as much as a family of 4 with as many TVs? A boarding house with 8 room mates, each with their own room and TV? Just be lucky they haven't decided to charg
Meanwhile, in the EU (Score:5, Interesting)
Apparently [wikipedia.org] EU policy requires that devices which are off or in standby use no more than 0.5 watts.
Whether it's actually enforced, I have no idea.
Re: (Score:2, Informative)
its actually enforced else you wont get the CE sticker on your product and your not allowed to sell it in europe.
a example my TV when in standby uses 0.2 and the digital converter is build in so no set top boxes needed.
but there is still the wording trick to get around it call it "deep sleep" etc. instead of standby
Re: (Score:3)
'tis true. And they do have to be energy efficient like that, or you get big old fines and told to do it right.
They made this mandatory a few years back when a similar article was kicking around complaining about the total power draw of all those tiny power chargers people leave plugged in, the old ones would just draw power all the time (you can tell - they get hot) and when you think how many everyone has, it adds up.
So the EU made legislation to fix it (and other standby power draws), as there was no rea
Not true (Score:5, Insightful)
Number one consumer of electric power: Air conditioning unit. THOUSANDS OF WATTS
Number two consumer of electric power: Refrigerator. HUNDREDS OF WATTS
Cable boxes don't come in number two and they don't consume 35 watts.
So if you're keeping track not only is not "number 2" (a dubious distinction) but its use of electric power is ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE below what's chewing up power. In fact, here in Arizona our A/C runs about 20 hours a day. That uses more power per day than the cable box uses in a year. I could ditch cable altogether (I have Comcast so it's a constant thought) and my power bill won't change by 1%.
How do I know? I use a http://www.amazon.com/P3-Inter... [amazon.com] kill-a-watt. The cable box draws less than 1 amp (12W) and that's while it's on and it's the big Motorola unit just like the picture in the original article.
Do you like facts and statistics and data upon which to base conclusions? You should get one of these kill-a-watts. They're awesome and they're quickto end stupid discussions that say you should unplug your cable box.
Off to unplug my wifi router. I hear it draws 0.5A.
E
Re:Not true (Score:5, Informative)
But not running continuosly.
Number two consumer of electric power: Refrigerator. HUNDREDS OF WATTS
But not running continuously, either.
Cable boxes don't come in number two and they don't consume 35 watts.
Actually, lousy designs will happily guzzle 35W of power while "off", and year-round, that's slightly over 300 kWh. That's a bit more than my refrigerator uses.
How do I know?
Your sample size is one. That doesn't give you any kind of statistical significance.
Re: (Score:2)
> not running continuously.
No, I mentioned the AC only runs 20 hours out of the day. That's how it is in Arizona.
Daytime high of 110F. Nighttime low of 78F. We like the bedroom around 72F, so
yes, it runs except when nobody's home but then it has a bit of catchup to do.
The fridge does not run continously, but it faces the same battle. All the heat it puts
out causes the AC to run more. So there's no magic way for the fridge not to run.
My sample size is indeed one and is of no statistical significance.
Re: (Score:3)
I'm fortunate enough to live in an area where the air is reasonably dry and the temperature drops off pretty quickly at sunset, so even if it's 100+ degrees during the day, I can ki
Re: (Score:2)
There is exactly zero excuse for using anything more than a trickle when no one is using it.
I would agree with this unless it has DVR capabilities. It has to be considered "in use" when it's recording a show
to watch later. A properly designed system should go to sleep during times when it's not actively recording a show
and have a low power watchdog schedule to wake it up at the appropriate time. If it's like a tivo and it randomly
records shows you "might" want to watch then this should be a setting you can disable to save electricity and
again, it should only be "on" when it has something to rec
Re: (Score:2)
Disingenuous Summary (Score:5, Insightful)
Which is it? 500 watts or 35 watts? This summary and title are completely ridiculous, I can think of plenty of other things that are using more power in my home than a cable box. Refrigerator, freezer, washer, dryer, hair blow dryer, desktop computer, television, central heating/air conditioning, range (if it's electric), power tools/garage, home theatre system, the list goes on and on.
The reason the "500 Watts!!!" is disingenuous, is because many cable boxes have a switched outlet that allow you to plug in a television set to the back of it. Back in the good ol' days, you could click on the cable box and the TV would turn on as well, if it was plugged into the back. That CRT might draw as much as 500 watts, so that's what it's rated for. With the advent of universal remotes, electronic controls in sets that forget the last power setting and the need for constant power to keep settings and "quick-on" for many sets, this is now an antiquated port that's just a hold over from the olden days of cable TV.
The STB might be the 2nd biggest energy user in many homes, but I wouldn't bet on *most* homes.
Re: (Score:2)
"A set-top cable box with a digital recorder can consume as much as 35 watts of power, costing about $8 a month for a typical Southern California consumer. The devices use nearly as much power turned off as they do when t
500 Watts for master/slave power relay, likely (Score:2, Insightful)
The 500W rating might have been for power passthrough (master/slave system) maybe?
My stereo can pass through power to e.g. a subwoofer, so only when I actually turn on the stereo the subwoofer is powered. The cable box could similarly have a power passhtrough for either the TV or the audio system, which is rated at 500 Watts.
Re: (Score:2)
How did she get these figures? (Score:4, Informative)
Just measured my old Scientific Atlanta box (that actually looks just like the ones in the article's pictures).
I get 8 Watts while running, 0.9 Watts in standby. It slightly peaks when I switch channels.
Re: (Score:2)
Is your Scientific Atlanta box a DVR? I have a feeling the real energy hogs are the DVR STB and not the basic boxes.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
The point of the article was that these boxes consume almost as much energy as a washing machine. That is definitely wrong. The article did not measure power consumption of either device. 500 watts is not how much current a DVR of any type consumes. I have a computer here at home that has 14 Xeon cores and a high-end graphics card. It doesn't even consume 500 watts, and yes, I measured it.
The article is a typical alarmist article with a misleading title.
Big energy consumers in homes: Electric dryers (1-2kw
F*cking odd units of measurement... (Score:5, Funny)
Literally everyone should know by now that the standard SI unit for power consumption is medium-sized town.
So, how many medium sized town do those cable boxes consume in total?
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
I just want to know what that is in elephants per football field.
Rating =/ Consumption (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
So what you are saying is you stopped reading the article after the 3rd paragraph. Wow. Way to stay informed.
Streaming devices (Score:2)
The world is rapidly moving away from the cable model... and the cable box itself is no exception. Therefore, the solution to this issue is pretty clear: transition away from big box cable endpoints to Roku or AppleTV endpoints. This moves customers into the future by shifting away from a DVR model to a streaming model, and it shifts away from insanely power-hungry boxes to devices which typically use about 1 to 3 watts at peak use.
(It's actually a simple solution to multiple problems. Unfortunately, the
Re: (Score:2)
This causes so many more problems though. The nature of cable/air broadcast is the broadcast part. The signal is sent one to many. More people watching does not create any extra load on the system.
With a network-based solution though, the more people the more load, and I highly doubt most internet providers would be able to keep up. They are already complaining about Netflix, and that still has a small share of the home media viewing market.
UVERSE (Score:2)
I figured the new, smaller u-verse box would be better on power, but the damn thing is quite warm to the touch, even when its "powered off" from the front panel when no one is watching TV.
I don't have the exact figure, but that heat is not getting created for free (especially in the summer when it has to be pumped outside by the AC).
I have taken to switching the power off at the power strip when I'm not watching. The only
DirecTV is a major problem, potential solution... (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Oh, and one last thing... How the fuck do some of your boxes have the "Energy Star" logo??? Is it because the boxes themselves are efficient & you choose not to implement those efficiencies?
Remember, the EnergyStar logo is pretty much meaningless. Heck, a few years ago a (fake) gasoline powered alarm clock [engadget.com] received the EnergyStar logo as part of an audit.
Re: (Score:2)
Remember, the EnergyStar logo is pretty much meaningless.
Oh no, it's not meaningless, it's just useless. It does have meaning, but it's meaning no one should care about.
500W is the switched outlet capacity (Score:4, Informative)
Us AV guys have known this for years. (Score:4, Informative)
Plop a "kill-a-watt" on your cable box and turn it on, note the power used. now hit the "off" button the remote. See how the power use did not drop. That is because "OFF" is simply blanking the screen and turning off the front led's and display.
It's why most pro AV installs will put the cable box if it's not a DVR type, on a power sequencer that the control processor will turn on and off with the system. The drawback is some of the newer cable boxes take forever to boot after power is restored.
Re:Us AV guys have known this for years. (Score:5, Informative)
Putting a cable box on the sequencer is a bad idea. Almost all STBs will lose all of their guide data, which can take hours to repopulate, in addition to taking forever to boot up. Occasionally they will even lose their subscription information if you are out of town/country for a few weeks. I wouldn't recommend it.
Math is hard. (Score:3)
A typical set-top cable box with a digital recorder can consume as much as 35 watts of power, costing about $8 a month for a typical Southern California consumer.
A "typical Southern California consumer" pays less than 20 cents per kWh.
35 Watts * 24 hours/day * 30 days/month = 25,200 Watt hours or 25 Kilowatt hours.
25 Kilowatts * $0.20/Kilowatt hour = $5.00
Power Strip Power Off (Score:2)
Connected to the them are a digital antennae for OTA, an ethernet connection for NetFlix, and a Linux pc for everything else.
Cable?
Satellite?
Are you kidding me?
Do people still pay for that crap?
Who are these people that stay beholden to the most despicable industry in America?
My linux pc goes to "sleep" when I'm not using it...
When I'm done with the rest of them, I power off the rest, then turn off
How does it compare to XBox/PS4? (Score:3)
Try asking a monopoly to improve thier product (Score:4, Funny)
Verizon screensaver vs. powered-off display HW (Score:3)
How ridiculous (Score:5, Informative)
Did anybody actually *think* before writing this article?
A cable box drawing "500 watts" would be cherry-red hot.
The rating of "500 watts" on the back is for cable boxes that have an accessory AC outlet, and the rating means that you can plug in a TV or whatnot rated at up to 500 watts. The cable box itself draws a whole lot less, like 15 watts, even less for the newer ones.
I use an IP phone so I need that supported (Score:3)
Any kind of sleeping router would need to respond to incoming calls.
Re: (Score:2)
the owners of the broadcast channels make the cable companies pay to rebroadcast those channels via cable
20 second delay? (Score:3)
try more like an 3-4 boot time some boxes are less and on cable about 20-30 mins to get guide data back. Also hope that the boxes don't need to update right after power on.