DIY LCD Backlight Repair 222
Bill Nye (not the science guy) writes to tell us that InventGeek has an interesting article on do it yourself LCD backlight repair. From the overview: "Those of us that have used LCD monitors for a while know that over time the backlight starts to dim and will eventually completely fail. Leaving you with some electronic scrap that you could sell on eBay for 35 bucks or so. Well for less than $20.00 and about a half hour of your time you can replace the backlight and rejuvenate that monitor to as good as new condition."
Cool! (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Cool! (Score:2, Informative)
http://cgi.ebay.com/Silicon-Graphics-1600SW-LCD-Fl at-Panel-HDTV-34-units_W0QQitemZ7569824865QQcatego ryZ21517QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem#ebay photohosting [ebay.com]
I happen to own one of these myself, and not only are they easy to repair, but their resale value is still outstanding.
Re:Cool! (Score:3, Informative)
Laptop Screens (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Laptop Screens (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Laptop Screens (Score:3, Informative)
heres how it went..
day 1. order replacement CCFL from ebay. luckily one seller had it in the original housing meant for my laptop screen. for 50$ + next day shipping - 65$.
day 3. put in new CCFL after an HOUR of painfully slow and arduous task. removing all the foil tape in once piece. saving and identifying the millions of screws. reapp
Re:Laptop Screens (Score:2)
Re:Laptop Screens (Score:3)
Yes (Score:5, Informative)
I also wrote up a journal entry when I fixed my dad's laptop, but I can't find it. (Note to self, do better job with titles)
I was nervous the first time I replaced a laptop inverter - but it was cake. The best place I found to buy the hp inverter I needed was ebay.
Re:Laptop Screens (Score:3, Informative)
If you google around you generally find alternative replacement lights for little money, compared to the 'official' stuff. Always worth to check for that.
Be sure to invest some time to try and find a servicemanual, that could save you a lot of headscratching. Laptops are a tad more complicated to dismantle AND put back together than bix boxes, everything is crammed in tiny spaces, lots and lots of screws, sometimes you have to go in in a particular step-by-s
Re:Laptop Screens (Score:2)
Fry's electronics (Score:5, Informative)
$20 + Hidden Costs (Score:5, Funny)
Wait... complicated instructions that can lead to brain damage and cancer if done improperly, given to me by a guy who can't be bothered to fix your->you're mistakes? Somehow I don't think I'll be trying this fix any time soon.
Re:$20 + Hidden Costs (Score:4, Funny)
Re:$20 + Hidden Costs (Score:5, Funny)
Re:$20 + Hidden Costs (Score:4, Funny)
I think he's speaking with the voice of experience. "Do as I say and not as I just did." kind of thing.
Re:$20 + Hidden Costs (Score:2)
Re:$20 + Hidden Costs (Score:3, Insightful)
It's illegal to throw your old tubes out (Score:3, Interesting)
Unless you like mercury in your food and drinking water, it's best to dispose of these items properly.
Re:$20 + Hidden Costs (Score:2)
That's if you were actually asking.
Classic Slashdot link (Score:3, Insightful)
A barely legible article that contains the absolute minimum information about a potentially lethal operation involving jillions of volts of capacitance and using power tools to cut almost-but-not-quite into one of the most toxic substances around, which, not at all incidentally, we are advised to just "dispose" of when we're done with it. Gee, I wonder what the author did with his? Tossed it in the garbage, or throw it into the sewer?
Frankly I'd rather that we just linked to bomb making instructions, as it would probably result in fewer acute injuries and chronic health problems.
Re:Classic Slashdot link (Score:5, Informative)
The key trick with this jazz is to find the part number and buy a new one. Much quicker.
Even better (Score:2)
Re:Classic Slashdot link (Score:5, Insightful)
There is really nothing dangerous in them, LCD's cathodes don't use more than 1kv, and unlike CRT's, there is no significant capacitor that will remain charged when the monitor is turned off. Obviously there would be some risk if you actually worked on the inverter while it was on, which isn't even dangerous if you are careful.
And if you're that worried about the safety of cutting into a cold cathode, you could always use a shop vac to improvise a fume extraction system, in case you screw it up. Or you could order a harder to find cold cathode that does not have the covering mentioned, or salvage one from a scanner.
If you take a few minor precautions this operation is not really dangerous at all. Don't complain about how stupid this author is when you don't understand how LCD backlights work or basic safety proceedings.
PSU (Score:2)
Re:Classic Slashdot link (Score:2)
Re:Classic Slashdot link (Score:4, Funny)
Sounds like somebody wishes he was the one who made that comment first. Too late. The comment is out. He's already talked about all the jillions of volts of capacitance that live inside your monitor. You're going to have to talk about something else. Personally, I would have gone for the ultra-dangerous kabillion watt lightening vortex thats in the back of 'em.
There is really nothing dangerous in them, LCD's cathodes don't use more than 1kv, and unlike CRT's, there is no significant capacitor that will remain charged when the monitor is turned off.
Well, yeah, obviously. There's clearly no danger from the cathodes. Their capacitors are all tame. Its the doghodes you have to worry about. Their capacitors are easily excitable, and you have to wake them up just right or they end up escaping from your monitor. Those things'll live in your walls for years while slowly eroding the foundation of your house. The only way to get 'em then is highly toxic, massive bug bombs.
Obviously there would be some risk if you actually worked on the inverter while it was on, which isn't even dangerous if you are careful.
You've never worked with an inverter while its on, have you? It can totally suck you into a temporal vortex if you even look at it while its on. I would never even consider it except under the most dire circumstances.
And if you're that worried about the safety of cutting into a cold cathode, you could always use a shop vac to improvise a fume extraction system, in case you screw it up.
Too risky. You could get sucked up by the vac, and then how would you get out? You wouldn't. Then what good will the monitor be to you?
Or you could order a harder to find cold cathode that does not have the covering mentioned, or salvage one from a scanner.
Okay, that's just nonsense. Everybody knows that all a scanner can do is make people's heads explode. [imdb.com]
Re:Classic Slashdot link (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Classic Slashdot link (Score:2)
If this didn't happen, there'd be far too many low quality geeks.
Re:Classic Slashdot link (Score:2)
Mercury is more of a problem if it is a) in an
Re:Classic Slashdot link (Score:2)
I think it gets to be a serious problem if you are breathing in the vapour over a long time.
In my case, I got hold of some sul
Re:Classic Slashdot link (Score:3, Funny)
You sure have.
Re:Classic Slashdot link (Score:3, Informative)
How old? (Score:3, Insightful)
They do dim with age though, which isn't a problem for me, I try to reduce the brightness anyway.
Re:How old? (Score:2)
Re:How old? (Score:5, Funny)
Once.
Re:How old? (Score:2)
Anyhoo, it is quite easy to get replacement bulbs of the right size and shape. No need to use purple case modder bulbs.
Half-life - not the game - Re:How old? (Score:2)
A little more info for laptop owners... (Score:4, Informative)
Here's a little more info that laptop users might find useful and I stress "might". http://iantha.vectorstar.net/ccfl.html#replace [vectorstar.net]
gasmonso http://religiousfreaks.com/ [religiousfreaks.com]Re:A little more info for laptop owners... (Score:2)
It'd be cooler... (Score:4, Interesting)
What about a sun hatch? (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:What about a sun hatch? (Score:2)
What is this... (Score:3, Interesting)
Of course, that doesn't mean that it is a great idea to replace a $300 overhead projector with a $3k digital one, but the digital projector a
Re:What is this... (Score:3, Informative)
Problem is that they sucked. You couldn't get an OH projector bright enough. Even an el-cheapo $1K standard projector blows the crap out of those things.
Re:What is this... (Score:2)
most use either the ohp or a laptop and data projector (a few of the rooms also have desktops availible connected to the projectors and some lecuturs use theese when availible and an ohp when not) for ready made slides highlighting things on them occasionally as they talk (which you CAN do in powerpoint btw) but if they wan't to do something thats not aready covered in their slides (say to clarify a poin
Re:What is this... (Score:2)
CCFL Bulbs are cheap! (Score:5, Informative)
Potential Darwin Award winner alert (Score:4, Funny)
Sounds like fun! I also heard the best way to tell if a wire is live is to lick your finger and touch it. Don't forget to stand on one leg while you do it though! Otherwise you might get hurt.
Using low grade lamps as a replacement? (Score:5, Informative)
First the mercury is pretty much a non-issue, it only escapes if you break the lamp and the ammount is miniscule anyway. As long as you are in a well ventilated area don't worry at all.
Second the manufacturer fits high-performance cold cathode lamps, subsituting hobby grade lamps is going to give you terrible colour rendering (I've seen cheap lamps that were more pink than white), and also the light output will be _considerably_ lower.
And last if you use the original inverter you are going to be overdriving the new lamp horribly. So the colour will suffer and the life will be affected (plus the lamps will run very hot indeed).
These are not at all like incandesent lamps, the inverters are tuned to the lamp parameters and cheaper/different lamps are likely to not match the inverter very well at all.
Not that dangerous (Score:5, Insightful)
The answer of course is that most of these hazards are serious for people who are exposed to them continuously as a result of work or environment (e.g. asbestos, radon.) Occasional exposure to a small amount of mercury is unlikely to do you a lot of harm; it might even kill a bacterial infection you didn't know you had. Working continuously in an environment containing detectable levels of mercury vapour could be very bad indeed.
Re:Not that dangerous (Score:2)
Probably because they know what they are doing, and take the necessary precautions. I don't think either of those things apply to random Slashdotters trying this, do you?
Re:Not that dangerous (Score:2)
Hee hee. You've never hung out with physicists, have you? Have you ever seen what happens when someone who's spent four years studying GR and Quantum Mechanics tries to play engineer?
Worst. Safety. Protocol. Ever. Just among the things I remember from my time in an atomic physics lab -- exposed 220V, shorts-n-sandals (as opposed to OSHA required long pants and steel-toed boots), random high-power lasers setting fire to
Re:Not that dangerous (Score:5, Interesting)
Mercury and Asbestos hysteria is far out of proportion to the risk.
This page on mercury
http://www.theodoregray.com/PeriodicTable/Elements /080/index.s7.html [theodoregray.com]
(scroll down) shows a guy sitting (floating) in a vat of it. My high school chemistry teacher used to demo mercury by putting a little puddle in each childs hand.
Mad as a hatter.. (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Mad as a hatter.. (Score:2, Interesting)
One time at the high school I went to, a kid blew into a manometer and shot elemental mercury all over, they actually called hazmat and evacuated the building while they cleaned it up.
Such a waste caused by ignorance.
Re:Not that dangerous (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Not that dangerous (Score:2, Informative)
You Know What You Were Thinking... (Score:2)
Bill! Bill! Bill! Bill! Bill Nye the Science Guy.
[I know you can hear this song in your head]
Re:You Know What You Were Thinking... (Score:2, Insightful)
science rules
For less than $20... (Score:2)
"Those of us that have used LCD monitors for a while know that over time the backlight starts to dim and will eventually completely fail. Leaving you with some electronic scrap that you could sell on eBay for 35 bucks or so. Well for less than $20.00 and about a half hour of your time you can replace the backlight and rejuvenate that monitor to as good as new condition."
...I'll give you a grammar lesson. Let's start with run-on sentences:
Those of us that have used LCD monitors for a while know that,
Ahem, about that "mercury" (Score:5, Interesting)
Sheesh!
Required disclaimer: When breaking fluorescent tubes, do so in an area with some ventilation. Do not huff the tube. Do not lick the insides of the tube.
Re:Ahem, about that "mercury" (Score:2)
andy
Yes, a waste (Score:2)
Re:Ahem, about that "mercury" (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Ahem, about that "mercury" (Score:3, Funny)
(joke for UK residents)
Interesting article - but not very detailed (Score:3, Informative)
Or a ramp of cheaper white LED:s may also do the trick.
Re:Interesting article - but not very detailed (Score:2)
DIY (Score:2, Interesting)
Best was a laptop, one of the first with a plasma screen given to me by my sisters boyfriend who had one on loan from the manufacturer ( begins with tosh.... ). He'd dropped it in the airport, his own stupid fault. he was throwing it out ( or hiding the evidence depending on your point of view
Two hours later and 10 bits of wire and a lot of fiddly soldering, I owned of th
Re:DIY (Score:2)
Especially "that one", if you know what I mean
Another use if the backlight goes... (Score:5, Informative)
(I did it; it actually works quite well. I'm using it as my TV.)
Ugh (Score:4, Insightful)
Mandatory obsolescence (Score:3)
Shady business practice not letting you fix things.
Maybe with a law ?
Alternate source for lamps and inverters.. (Score:2)
A 30 second search turns up this lamp+inverter.
http://www.mpja.com/productview.asp?product=14840+ LA [mpja.com]
Search a bit longer to find one the right size :)
Damn (Score:2, Funny)
It is kinda funny that two articles involving DIYs on LCDs came out within one week of eachother.
Laughable.. (Score:5, Informative)
I have been doing this sort of thing now since something like 1998 with relative ease. The only hassle has been scrounging up the cold cathode tubes that are large enough to cover the screens like the originals. Some will note that these have been conspicuously absent from the after-market parts shelves up until a couple years ago when it became fashionable to "light up" your box with colored lights. You quite literally had to know how to find them prior to this because they did not want them to be found. Any technician worth his salt knew that if you could replace the tube (and it wasn't hard at all to do), you could revive a computer or screen and make some money rather than having the user tossing this item into the landfills and spending whopping amounts of cash on "new models". (Yea, thats an accusation about the major OEM players; NEC, Toshiba and Sanyo; IMO)
As for the brightness issue... If you've replaced the tube and it's still dim, it's nothing more than the capacitors failing on your DC to AC converter boards. The caps are rated so close to tolarance in manufacture that with heat buildup and time, they fail prematurely. I've successfully pulled the boards and replaced the caps to bring them back to life assuming the transistors and IC have not failed. The brightness issue is nothing more than deviating the PWM (pulse width modulation) of the AC out to the tube. This change in PWM changes the resonance for the tube's circuit and hence it's brightness level is related to the PWM circuit efficiency. When the caps become leaky and dry, the circuit can no longer approach its normal or calculated PWM value or resonance, and hence your screen no longer can get as bright as it used to. Color temperature changed screens are the same issue. The cc tube is just more sensative to the current PWM and is lighting up in a particular color temperature; usually a brown or reddish hue.
Theoretically these LCD screens can last for many, many years if you want to simply replace these tubes and fix their circuits when they fail. Based on past history and my direct attempts to get these cc tubes and parts from several OEM's directly; replacing the entire LCD screen as a complete part; at a hefty price I might add; is generally your ONLY choice. More often than not, the replacement LCD panel cost more than the whole monitor did new!!!
I expect however that replacing the cc tubes as a standard repair will not be available because the folks manufacturing the LCD screens seem to control the access and if there is limited or no access to the parts, you only have access to "NEW" screens... or obviously new monitors!
Your market... you decide!!
Cheers;
hair-dryer (Score:2, Interesting)
but then i discovered something: when i turned up the heating, the lcd started to work again (it stood on a desk right over the radiator).
because i didn't want to make a sauna of my room i used a hair dryer to warm the disply up (that used to take 5-10 minutes). i continued to use that display for over a year
sinc
Been there done that (Score:3, Informative)
My friend got slightly the wrong tube length, so the two ends are a bit dark. There's a coupel fingerprints inside the LCD now, and someone's eyelash. If you end up seriously tearing the thing apart liek we did, get some latex gloves or somethign to help with the fingerprints, and try not to shed during the operation.
How to tell if it's the inverter or the tube? (Score:2)
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:2, Funny)
Mourner 2: Yea, but he saved a bundle on that LCD repair right before he passed on!
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:3, Funny)
In another 10 years, I expect that they will call out the HAZMAT team for any reported spills of dihydrogen monoxide. They are already starting to treat lead like it was some horribly toxic material.
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:2)
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:3, Informative)
In another 10 years, I expect that they will call out the HAZMAT team for any reported spills of dihydrogen monoxide.
Actually, mercury thermometers are illegal to sell in my state. I remember a program to get people to turn in their mercury thermometers similar to police department programs to dispose of handguns.
Minnesota Session Laws - 2001
Legislative history and Authors
CHAPTER 47-H.F.No. 274
An act relating to the environ
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:3, Informative)
Mercury medical thermometers contain ~50X as much mercury as typical mercury/fluourescent lamps and a toxicologically significant dose is over 50X more than a thermometer. One would have to sniff hundreds of freshly broken lamps to get mercury poisoning symptoms from that alone. People should not lose sleep about the compact-fluourescent or similar tubes in their home/apartment/workplace/etc. unless thousands of them routinely shatter at once whenever ventilation breaks down.
Comment removed (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:5, Informative)
Still, if you can get $35 for a piece of junk go for it.
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:2)
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:5, Informative)
The type of mercury used in fluorescents is the inorganic kind, which is a hell of a lot less dangerous than organic mercury. Inorganic mercury will be filtered out of your blood and come out in your urine, just like most toxins, but organic mercury is small enough to find it's way into your body fats and stay there for good. Organic mercury is usually what you find in fish.
Mercury Vapor [osha.gov]
NIOSH/OSHA Mercury Vapor Health Guideline [osha.gov]
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:2)
I thought mercury was an element? (Hg?) It's not like hydrocarbons where you can have long chains and short chains. An atom is an atom, no matter if you find it in nature or in industry, and it does not vary in size from one atom of mercury to another. Maybe you are thinking of some compounds that include mercury? (being a metal, I'd expect mercury combines quite readily with oxygen)
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Mercury Vapor (Score:2)
Re:uhm, yeah (Score:5, Informative)
some years since THAT was available) and with generic lamps from third-party
suppliers.
Firstly, remember the lighting uniformity is HARD TO ENSURE. For the thinnest
displays (like modern Powerbooks) it's unlikely you can even FIND a source for the
lamp (2mm tubes are common, the available units are usually 4mm or the wrong length
or both), and if you do find it, getting the foam/mylar/backplate sandwiched
after replacement is going to be a chore. Expect a splotchy result.
The most recent display I had any good luck with was one of the Powerbook 500 series
(about 1995 vintage). That required a little work with a Dremel tool to fit the
available lamp (which was about 5mm too long), and took a bit of care during
disassembly. The plastic display bezel got brittle with age by the time
the unit was both out of warranty and failing to light up.
The 'supported' solution is to ship the unit to the manufacturer for
rebuild. Presumably, they DO have the right parts and a lot of patience.
My advice: pay the $400 (or whatever).
There's a lot less toxin in the lamp than in your last filling. More worrisome is the
wiring to the tube, which wants about 2000V to start. The wires are funny, rubbery
things, possibly a hightech silicone.
One very useful tool was a spare power supply; if your backlight was on a connector,
you can test it on known-good power that way, and an inverter replacement is a LOT
easier than lamp rebuild.
Re:uhm, yeah (Score:3, Informative)
Re:uhm, yeah (Score:4, Insightful)
Looking at the text you quoted, I don't see anything terribly "bad" about the instructions.
If you're referring to his spelling, it's fairly clear you are smart enough to have figured out what he was saying, so why judge whether to follow the instructions based on spelling instead of based on your understanding of the instructions?
The primary purpose of instructions are to convey the steps and procedures for accomplishing some task. Spelling and grammar are definitely useful in writing clear instructions, but they are not so critical that a few mistakes necessarily render the whole thing useless (unless the mistakes happen to be "well placed", which none of the examples you've given are).
Laptop displays don't use lamps (Score:2)
I've had to take my powerbook LCD apart a few times (I left it outside in -40 temperatures... not a good idea... it now has flaky internal connections and requires 'shims' to maintain those connections.) Anyway, if you need a new display, just
Re:Bill Nye? Bleh! Go Beakman! (Score:2)