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Displays Handhelds Hardware

Cell Phone with Built-in Projector 137

karvind writes "Siemens researchers have developed a cell phone featuring a built-in projector system. A laboratory model was presented at CeBIT 2005 in Hanover. The system makes it possible to project a complete keypad or display onto a surface. With a special pen, users can write on the virtual keypad and operate the phone's functions. Other projection keyboard concepts can be found here and here"
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Cell Phone with Built-in Projector

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  • by VJTod ( 563763 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @10:42AM (#12060003)
    I want a 1280x1024 projector. They're just projecting a keyboard.
  • hard to type (Score:5, Insightful)

    by alatesystems ( 51331 ) <chris&chrisbenard,net> on Sunday March 27, 2005 @10:44AM (#12060014) Homepage Journal
    Anyone who has ever used these type of keyboards knows you need a completely steady surface, it needs to be semi-dark so you can see the keyboard, and it hurts the hell out of your fingers to type on a non-giving surface.

    None of these aspects are well-suited for portable typing. I want a SELMA hologram for my portable electronics interaction.
    • Re:hard to type (Score:3, Interesting)

      by zenneth ( 767572 )
      All they'd need to do would be to incorporate some type of thin glove with specially-padded fingertips to get around the hard-surfaced keyboard.

      But imagine laying in bed and have your phone ring and project the Caller-ID info onto your wall or ceiling so you would/wouldn't have to get out of bed.

      That'd be sweet.
      • by Anonymous Coward
        But imagine laying in bed and have your phone ring and project the Caller-ID info onto your wall or ceiling so you would/wouldn't have to get out of bed.

        I just press the silence button.
      • Paris Hilton could have used one of those in her sex video.

        Too little too late, unfortunately.
    • Re:hard to type (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      I want a SELMA hologram for my portable electronics interaction.
      Holy crap, +5 obscure reference.

      That was a good show, too. Wonder what happened to it.
      • Time Trax was extremely awesome. I don't know what happened to it; I even emailed the sci-fi channel asking to buy dvd's or vhs or anything they have. I would love to have any versions I could find. Sci-Fi never responded, of course.

        I found episodes on Gnutella, but they were all in German.

        If there's 2 things Germans are good at, it's pirating digital content and making cars.

        (In case you're wondering what I'm talking about, I'm replying to an AC; lower your threshold to see it.)
        • You emailed the wrong people, Time Trax was in syndacation, sci-fi probably doesn't own it (unless I'm wrong and they bought it later).
      • So, do you project her [thesimpsons.com] in full 5'9" size? Does the projecter belch Laramie smoke to make the virtual experience more real? There are unshaven bikini-clad images available, too.
    • Depends on your use, I figure. Does it already hurt after writing 2-3 mails? (if so, maybe you shouldn't hit the keyboard as hard, it's not a wife :) ).

    • Re:hard to type (Score:2, Interesting)

      by hgavin ( 259102 )
      I tried out the Canesta projection keyboard at the Symbian expo in London two years ago. The keyboard was projected using a laser, and was perfectly visible in the artificial light of the exhibition hall. The keyboard generally worked well, and was linked bia Bluetooth to a Sony Ericsson P800.

      The real drawback of these devices in my opinion is the lack of tactile feedback - until the character appears on the screen you don't know whether you've hit the key correctly. It's fine for hunt-and-peck typing,
    • Re:hard to type (Score:1, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Project onto a rubber mouse pad.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 27, 2005 @10:46AM (#12060023)
    How far does this thing project? Can I set it up across the room and have giant keyboard that I can jump around on, like in Big?
  • too clunky... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by kebes ( 861706 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @10:49AM (#12060030) Journal
    TFA claims:
    "At first glance, the mobile phone looks exactly like a conventional cell phone."

    ...but I disagree. It looks big and clunky. Frankly I don't think this feature is worth the added bulk, cost, complexity, and battery-usage. This will remain a gimmick until it can be integrated seemlessly into current cellphones, and more importantly, until the interface is actually smooth and efficient.
    • by Anonymous Coward
      TFA claims: "At first glance, the mobile phone looks exactly like a conventional cell phone."

      ...but I disagree. It looks big and clunky


      TFA didn't say what era the conventional cell phone was from...
    • With the exception of enough technical advances
      along this line to enable very very small cell
      phones, what is the point?

      Unless it is the precursor to a cell phone/PDA
      with a projected viewing screen and keyboard?

      Exactly how much more unsafe will it be to use
      your cell phone while driving, with the keypad
      (, or display & keyboard) projected up onto
      the interior of the windshield?
    • Re:too clunky... (Score:3, Insightful)

      by danila ( 69889 )
      I am amazed at your studpidity, kebes. What you are saying is essentially "the feature is useless and will remain a gimmick until it works perfectly". May be you were not aware of it, but all new technologies go through these stages. First DVD players were bulky, expensive and there were no DVDs to play on them. First mobile phones, for fuck's sake, weighted several kilos and were carried around in a briefcase. Of course this is a prototype - have you seen any phones with projectors before? Of course, it is
      • For the record, my comment was mostly pointing out the hyperbole of the article. It was the article that was incorrectly implying that the technology was mature, not the company showing off its prototype, and I was taking issue with their analysis.

        Furthermore, not all features are created equal. Some are so new and innovative that consumers are worth sacrificing something (like paying money, spending time, carrying something heavey, etc.). Other features are not worth much, and are only accepted once they
  • by Anonymous Coward
    This has got to be the stupidest cell phone idea of the year!

    So you'd have to hold the rather klungy cellphone still near a suitable surface and plug the projected keyboard with a thick bluetooth pen? Why not just use morse code by panging your head agaist the wall?

    Bluetooth foldable keyboard is a much better choice.
    • A bluetooth foldable keyboard is still another item to carry around. I'm not going to wear one of those scott e-vests unless I get a job infiltrating buildings or something, because they make you look like a moron. Also, you don't hold it up. You can usually find desks near walls. Put it on the desk. If not that, then a TV dinner table or something.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 27, 2005 @10:52AM (#12060044)
    In this concept [canesta.com] a virtual touch typist demonstrates he can type directly on a laser-projected keyboard, but this newer concept [physorg.com] indicates that a special pad and pen are required. What happened? This was hot a couple years ago...
    • I wish they took off. Interesting point though: If you're a touch typist, you don't really need the whole outline; Just two dots to know where the "home row" is.
    • Surely the whole point of touch-typing is that you can do it without looking at the keyboard, by feel.

      So a projector shouldn't be needed at all. And worse still, there's no feel, so no way to judge where the 'keys' would be. So how can you 'touch-type' with this?

  • Awesome (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Rolling_Go ( 859757 ) <holycrapbatman@hotmail.com> on Sunday March 27, 2005 @10:55AM (#12060056)
    Wait, no, my bad.

    Also what do you really need a projected keyboard on your cell phone for? Is it really that time consuming to put in a new contact with your keypad, or are people writing 20 page business reports and stuff on them? I'm getting too old for this shit.
    • "are people writing 20 page business reports and stuff on them"

      No, but they are browsing the web more and more on them, and if cellphones keep shrinking to the size of an earring or something, we're going to need SOMEWAY to input to them.

    • Obviously there is no use (yet) for this in a cell phone. The time it would take you to find a flat surface and get the pen ready would be too long - it's easier to just punch in the letters on your keypad. I maybe could see this maybe having an impact on PDAs or something which requires more typing, but the miniature wireless keyboards for PDAs are cheap, portable, and you get to strike an actual key, so I don't think there's a really a good reason to use this system.

      If you RTFA though, you'd see that

  • mobile? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by orson_of_fort_worth ( 871181 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @10:57AM (#12060060)
    Very nice technology and all but it requires the user to be stationary, kind of defeating the purpose of a mobile phone.
    • Not entirely... you could still potentially use this technology on the bus, or even (though I hope not) while driving, but I get your point.

      You might find it easier to think of this as conceptually equivalent to a laptop -- it's mobile in that you can move it around easily, not that you can literally run around while using it.

      • Yes, one wonders how much functionality (and size and weight) will keep being added to PDAs & cell phones until somebody realizes they've just reinvented the laptop.
    • *sigh*

      Perhaps you can just turn the projector around and it will project everything to the windshield...
  • Wrong direction (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward
    If they are going to build a projector into a cell phone, then it needs to display the screen on the wall, not a keyboard on a desk. I've long wondered why no one has integrated a projector into a laptop.
  • Looks to be... (Score:2, Insightful)

    by justforaday ( 560408 )
    Looks to be yet another solution in search of a problem...Don't get me wrong, I'm sure something useful will evolve out of this tech at some point..
  • Cell Phone bloat! (Score:3, Insightful)

    by bogaboga ( 793279 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @11:00AM (#12060077)
    What I observe is what I call cell phone bloat. Much as I'd like to send my photo to my loved ones once a while, I resent the idea that these gadgets are no longer produced in their simplest terms as it once used to be.

    Here in Canada, major Telcos charge exorbitantly just for the previledge of being able to send and/or view video. These are features that users do not use that much. How many of you send photos via their cell phones on a regular basis?

    Now one sees projectors...next will be God knows what...! Maybe it's because I am in Canada and being charged unfairly. What is the experience of others?

    • Bla bla bla

      I want it all - and I want it in one device. There's nothing negative about using my phone as an mp3-player, camera, notes-taker, email client, games system, web client etc. It's only good.

      Yes I work for a cell phone manufacturer.
    • Well, the projectors obviously won't be using their network(it's all local), so it's safe to say that they won't be chargin you much for it. Now, they could always charge you when you buy the phone, but it's a one time charge and a)phone prices are to a certain extent set by the manufacturer(though you can always jack them up) and b) Most telcos use neat feature laden phones to sucker people in to long term shitty contracts so they tend to price them cheap if you are getting a contract(and way too fucking
    • a) no tech's cheap at first.
      b) ppl who complain about "too many features" (features they're not forced to use, or even own) are the actual bloat. I like the features on my phone. Without mobile net access, I couldn't use my mobile telnet client to restart services on my servers whilst I'm away from a connection... but mostly, without the camera, I would have had nothing to take those pics 'n vid clips of my gf stripped, blindfolded, 'n tied down... there's no way ANYONE in my position could argue against mo
  • Just when you thought drivers with cellphones couldn't get any worse, someone gives them a stylus to manage with. Wonderful. Now they'll have to drive dangerously with their knees while distracted, instead of with one hand.

    Do cell phones really need this much capability? I remember seeing PDA phones a couple years ago. This almost seems like a cosmetic technology-advancement. Something for the sole purpose of wowing people into buying things they don't really need (and odds are, won't use).

    • Do cell phones really need this much capability? I remember seeing PDA phones a couple years ago. This almost seems like a cosmetic technology-advancement. Something for the sole purpose of wowing people into buying things they don't really need (and odds are, won't use).

      I have a Sidekick II; the screen flips open, and underneath is a QWERTY keyboard (as I mentioned, like, three threads up). When I drove, I still never talked on it, I'd just let it go to voice mail. If I got a text message, I'd still wa

  • A virtual keyboard is pretty nifty, but how far has speech recognition progressed?

    My Nokia 6600 has rudimentary speech recognition software for setting the phone modes and probably (haven't tried it) for selecting the person who you want to call, but it's not working so well that I would trust it yet.

    It's been years since I tried speech recognition on computer and I wouldn't want to prepare an entire document that way, but dictating short text message or e-mail could work. "Phone. Text message to Eve. B

    • A virtual keyboard is pretty nifty, but how far has speech recognition progressed?
      Until we reach Star Trekkish levels of speech recognition -- well, holodeck levels, anyway[0] -- I'll stick to QWERTY. (Yes, even on my phone. <3 my SKII.)

      [0] As opposed to "tea, earl grey, hot".
      • As opposed to "tea, earl grey, hot".

        Yeah, what's the point of that? It'll just deliver a cupful of liquid that is almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea. (Or it'll just get it completely wrong and connect you with El Tigré Hutt.)

        • Great questions of our time:

          Why doesn't the computer know he always drinks Earl Grey? It knows he doesn't take lemon, doesn't it?

          Why does he have to ask for the tea to be hot? Earl Grey is correctly served hot. It knows to serve it in a tea-cup, doesn't it?
          • Maybe he can't figure out how to work the speed dial feature? (Pointy-Headed Boss) Or maybe by the Protocol of Antaries, all Clippyware was outlawed. (Notice how the EMH has to be told the nature of the medical emergency? He's programmed against saying anything like "You seem to have a phaser burn to the chest, would you like me to patch that?")
    • It makes a lot more sense to do the voice recognition on a central server, since the device is already designed with transferring audio to a remote location in mind.
  • New excuse (Score:5, Funny)

    by Solder Fumes ( 797270 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @11:08AM (#12060111)
    If I project this onto my lap, maybe I'll get fewer odd looks on the airplane.
  • Yeah, right (Score:4, Funny)

    by roman_mir ( 125474 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @11:11AM (#12060123) Homepage Journal
    First thought: ta da ta da ta da ta da ta da ta da ta da ta da - Batmaaaaaan. Communicate with symbols projected into the sky.

    Second though: wow, I will have to walk around with two suitcases full of batteries.

    no dice.

  • by drinkypoo ( 153816 ) <drink@hyperlogos.org> on Sunday March 27, 2005 @11:14AM (#12060137) Homepage Journal
    This is so very close. I want a color projector at minimum 640x480 resolution that I can project on a wall, and a laser projector that will draw a keyboard for me. I want this stuff in a phone, which can be the size of a PDA, and which should have a decent screen on it as well. Provided there is a decent system for writing programs for the phone, that's the convergence device I'll pay for. (Got to have a camera and mp3 player too.) Granted it'll probably be the size of a small palmtop but I want to have all of these devices in one so I don't have to carry around a bunch of stuff. Really I think they could make it not much larger than an iPod as long as it used flash storage.
  • http://www.overclockersclub.com/?read=7328384

    Laser keyboards should be able to take up less room though they're probably a bit delicate yet.

    they could be made much smaller than they current keyboard applications.
  • The phone in TFA is way too bulky to be an acceptable portable device, so I assume its merely a prototype.
    Manufacturers clearly realise that the phone in its current size is a device people find comfortable carrying around. This is the device that will end up converging with all the other gadgets that we geeks like to carry around these days.
    Personally, I can't wait for the summer day when I don't have to wear a multi-pocket combat jacket with something stuffed in every pocket - camera, phone, PDA, MP3 pl
    • Yep, but there's just one problem with an all-in-one device - namely, it's an all-in-one device.

      I want a specific telephony feature set. I do not want others.

      I want a specific camera. The one bundled on my specific phone will be a joke.

      I want a specific media player, and I want it to do exactly specific things.

      I want a specific feature set on my PDA. In fact, I don't want a PDA - I want a small PC.

      I want specific interfaces on that PDA.

      I want specific software on my PDA.

      I want a useful display on my
  • by cliffski ( 65094 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @11:51AM (#12060295) Homepage
    can't 'researchers' come up with something useful? That trevor bayliss guy who invented the clockwork radio, now THAT is inventing. These are just lab-monekys churning out cool trinkets for rich kids. Arent there things to invent that satisfy a real need amongst consumers who arent tech-obsessed rich kids?
  • by AtariAmarok ( 451306 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @11:52AM (#12060307)
    Like many cell phones, the phone itself is badly designed to make it difficult to do basic things like enter phone numbers. Something that should be a "no-brainer" like having a standard right-angle array of the phone numbers is lost on them. Why have the 7 key located way above the left key so you have to look at the keys in order to figure out where they are? (The Nokia N- Gage is one of the worst examples of this: it is like the intentionally went out of their way to make it useless as a phone).

    Maybe the projection system could make up for this by projecting a standard number button array so it can be used. However, it would be a lot simpler if they used a standard number array on the phone itself.

    • Cell phones don't necessarily have to have convenient keypads for number entry because they have a built-in phone directory. The design considerations for mobile usability are different to those of a desk phone.
      If the user wants to phone someone using a cell phone, they typically search for a contact by name rather than enter the number using the keypad.
      • "If the user wants to phone someone using a cell phone, they typically search for a contact by name rather than enter the number using the keypad"

        But even then, they have to enter the numbers on by the silly "Stylish, but not very functional" keypad to get them into the phone contact list in the first place! Unless they connect their phones to something else, like a computer, to enter their numbers. Few users do that. Also, I use my cell phone just by dialing the number, and most others I know do this too

  • Tangible Tools (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Doc Ruby ( 173196 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @11:56AM (#12060321) Homepage Journal
    Most of our motor skills require a tool to be really skillful. Because tools react to our actions, and our minds require feedback to interact with things. This projector requires a pen, which looks superfluous, but which will certainly help accuracy and counter the frustration of pushing fingers against an actually blank, flat, smoot surface like a tabletop. But it's kinda big, and has only limited gestures: press and stroke. How about a thin rubber sheet, maybe 0.1mmx10x10cm, with a textured pattern, that the phone projects onto? A video sensor next to the projector (with the phone standing upright, rather than that huge swivel projector) watches the fingertips, like existing projection keyboards. Our fingers will work the surface a lot more nimbly when it reacts. A later generation can cover the sheet with rubberized piezo actuators, or stacked MEMs, for a truly interactive surface. The sheet could be rolled up into the side of a hollow stylus used for more precise pointing when necessary. Make it cheap enough to replace several times a year, and the whole thing starts looking like a real tool, instead of a picture of a tool.

    As long as I'm writing SF, how about the MEMs sheet un/rolling itself from the stylus? And including sensors, rather than a video sensor? Or the phone with a fiberoptic jack for projecting the interface image through the sheet itself? Somebody gimme a budget!
    • The reason the thin rubber sheet would be useless is because the whole purpose of this is to project a keyboard where there is none, without needing additional things.

      If you're carrying around a thin rubber sheet, you might as well use one of those thin rubber rollable keyboards.

      • But "nothing" is inadequate. Those thin rubber keyboards aren't 0.1mm thick, because they're complicated. They're transportable, like an old KayPro luggable PC, not mobile, like a phone. The sheet I'm talking about would be carried in the phone, so there's no extra load. And would be much more useable, as I mentioned. Just like the stylus for smartphones, where you can use your unadorned fingertip for many operations, the sheet would be useful when doing anything more interactive than selecting from a few l
        • (glad to be posting buried deep in a comment thread because this is either brilliant or crazy...)

          But "nothing" is inadequate.

          You're thinking about this problem -- and "nothing" -- in a very 20th century way. I agree that, as things stand now -- with virtual keyboards working as one-way projection systems, splashing visible light on a surface, you're right, you will only get visible feedback and it won't really feel usable. But do you think your finger has to touch a rubber button to feel like it's t
          • Your cerebral cortex has to be triggered by a familiar signal to associate with the learned motor skill for skillful interaction. So when we get neural input, we'll eventually get there. Meanwhile, we're just at the horizon of monkeys sending neural output to devices. I thought demanding a little rollable plastic mat was an SF demand. Wake me when we get the neural inputs, and I'll be happy to show you my dreams.
            • Wake me when we get the neural inputs, and I'll be happy to show you my dreams.

              Now you're thinking like an open-sourcer. Which, frankly, is a shame. Or didn't you know that you were able to convert "dreams" like these into things called patents?

              You, with all your ideas, thinking of your dreams as just dreams when you could be credited as the person responsible for the idea of _______. Those dreams, Doc Ruby, should be developed. By you. Even if the technology isn't there today. When you see where w
              • I dunno if I'm an "Open Sourcer" - I've always sold a "do not distribute" license to all the apps I've sold. More like "Open Sourcerer". But I do believe that patenting "ideas" is abhorrent, anticompetitive, restricts free speech etc. I believe in copyrighting the expressions (and reasonable facsimiles) of ideas, and patenting machines - working devices or prototype models. I have so many ideas that I believe in sharing them as much as possible. Strategically competitive ones I keep to myself; any others I
                • I suppose my choice of words could have made it seem like I was saying that the only thing to do was to patent. Thank you for bringing up the issue of prior art. My point was simply that if you have the idea, you should not let it remain a "dream" but do something with it. You can find the idea of patenting "ideas" is abhorrent, anticompetitive, restricts free speech etc But that is the reality of how things are right now in 2005...

                  I was all cagey when I brought up Jonas Salk earlier. My apologies. L
  • I love the idea of this, and if it was implimented well and extended, you could end up with a device which could transcend the limitations of screen size. Unfortunately, as an ex-owner of a Siemens SL45, which was a pioneering MP3 player phone, I can categorically say Siemens is not a company which will support early adopters of their technology. The phone was fragile and unstable, and their support was arrogant and tardy, Pity, it seemed like a great idea, just like this one...
  • Sometimes I wonder how such "research" projects manage to get funded? ;-) The projection device is not even any technological breakthrough. I don't get it.
  • by 93 Escort Wagon ( 326346 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @01:14PM (#12060693)
    ... like Verizon will want this disabled - for your own protection of course!

    To use this virtual interface, you'll need to subscribe to Verizon's easy-write(TM) service. It's only $4.99 a month!
  • by __aaclcg7560 ( 824291 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @02:00PM (#12060922)
    If your cell phone can project a game of Minesweeper onto the bathroom wall...

    PHB: Why are you spending so much time in the bathroom?

    Peon: Uh... none of your business.

    PHB: Why were you tapping on the stall walls for?

    Peon: If you were stuck up like me, you're be tapping the walls too.

    PHB: Why did you yell "You bastard!" when I walked by?

    Peon: Hey! Can't a guy take a difficult dump around her?

    PHB: Not in this company!
  • They merely licensed this technology from a US company.

  • So, now I can write the same number of text messages in half the time before the battery runs out? Honestly, these things are called cell phones and this is what they should do - enable you to talk on them for extended periods of time without having to worry about your battery running out. All these additional features added lately are sure cute but in the end only equate to shorter battery life...
  • I stand corrected (Score:3, Informative)

    by flowerp ( 512865 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @02:48PM (#12061159)
    It is an Israeli company who invented the virtual
    keyboard.

    http://www.globes.co.il/DocsEn/did=875104.htm

  • by multiplexo ( 27356 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @04:25PM (#12061666) Journal
    projectors, who's going to use that? But a death ray! That would be cool! Of course I also want to be the only person allowed to have a cell phone with a built in death ray because the rest of you can't be trusted.

  • It would be neat if something like this is integrated into a PDA so we could read ebooks (or anything else you would use your PDA for) on a larger screen. It would also be neat to take it a step further - project the text directly onto your retina. I know there has been some experimenting with this idea before, but there was nothing small enough to fit on a cell phone or PDA.
  • ...from the fact that cell phones fail miserably at their one actual purpose; vocal communication. I'd like to see providers supply users with a product that fufills it's primary objective before gluing things like cameras, qwertys... or now... lasers... onto it. The slogan "Can you hear me now?" sums up the entire industry in a nutshell (though why a company would choose to spend millions associating themselves with phrase usually spoken in desparation while using the device they sell is beyond me). Give m

  • by Rui del-Negro ( 531098 ) on Sunday March 27, 2005 @09:26PM (#12063089) Homepage
    If you have to use a special pen... what's the point of having a keyboard? I mean, why doesn't it just do handwriting recognition? The whole point of having a keyboard is being able to type with all (or most of) your fingers. If you're limited to using the "special pen", it's slower than typing with your thumbs (assuming you have two of those).

    Unless they can make the virtual keyboard work reliably with people's fingers, I doubt this will be very successful.

    RMN
    ~~~
  • When I read the headline the first time, I read "Cell Phone with Built-in Pocket Protector" and thought, "Wow, that's a pretty cool idea." Cell phones are actually what I do for a living, so I'm always eager to hear about new "features." This projector, however, doesn't really excite me. But, a built-in pocket protector -- now THAT would be cool.
  • ....we'll be finding people's cell phones in crashed escape pods with messages on the project like, "Help me Obi Wan Konobi....you're my only hope."

Someday somebody has got to decide whether the typewriter is the machine, or the person who operates it.

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