ZFS, the Last Word in File Systems?

guigouz writes "Sun is carrying a feature story about its new ZFS File System - ZFS, the dynamic new file system in Sun's Solaris 10 Operating System (Solaris OS), will make you forget everything you thought you knew about file systems. ZFS will be available on all Solaris 10 OS-supported platforms, and all existing applications will run with it. Moreover, ZFS complements Sun's storage management portfolio, including the Sun StorEdge QFS software, which is ideal for sharing business data."

billion billion?

[michael path]

From the article:

Unlimited scalability
As the world's first 128-bit file system, ZFS offers 16 billion billion times the capacity of 32- or 64-bit systems.

Microsoft immediately countered by saying WinFS [microsoft.com] will now support "twelveteen million billion times" as much storage as Sun's ZFS, and is "a bazillion times" more secure.

When reached for comment, Sun CEO Scott McNealy [sun.com] replied "neener neener". Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer [microsoft.com] responded by putting gum in Sun President Jonathan Schwartz [sun.com]'s hair.

Out of letters.

[Kenja]

Of course ZFS is the last word in file systems. I mean, what can come after zed?

Re:Out of letters.

[Anonymous Coward]

Easy: ß

Re:Hmf.

[grub]

To store static routes for a lot of IPv6 addresses? :)

Re:Out of letters.

[Saint Stephen]

[fs, natch

Re:not alphabetically

[laird]

Nah, the ultimate filesystem has to be xyzzyfs! Your data magically appears... :-)

Re:Out of letters.

[Goodbyte]

The next file-system will be developed swedish bikini waxers to make it possiblie to call it åfs.

Why don't they just describe the capacity in

[wiredog]

Sagans?

Re:rearchitected

[sheriff_p]

Sadly Google returns no hits for rearchistrated

You just got to love the headline...

[Chainsaw]

"ZFS, the Last Word in File Systems?"

The last word in file systems is "systems". And stop asking file systems these questions, you fool.

Re:Open source

[i621148]

so does that mean it could be available in Fedora Core III?

If it's the last word

[kick_in_the_eye]

If it's the last word, why are we even talking about it?

That's a lot of storage

[Gentoo Fan]

But of course you'll still have to have your boot image within the first 1024 cylinders.

Oh wow!

[Wakko Warner]

Does this mean the absolutely awful Disksuite/Solaris Volume Manager is finally, mercifully, dead, too?

I'll do a dance of utter joy if so. Disksuite is 10 pounds of shit in a 5 pound bag.

- A.P.

Son of Jor-El

[Duke Machesne]

Kneel Before Zod!

And this new billion billion ZFS will cost...

[neuro.slug]

One HUNDRED BILLION DOLLARS!
puts pinky in mouth

-- n

Re:The thing about that..

[robslimo]

I've been working on a file system (inspired by an old Signetics memory device) that's likely to *really* be the last word. It's still in alpha because I'm having trouble verifying its functionality, but it seems to work very well so far.

I call it WOFS.

Apparently...

[qtone42]

... ZFS will also make you forget everything you knew about English grammar.

"We've rethought everything and rearchitected it," says Jeff Bonwick

Rearchitected? WTF? Howsaboot "Redesigned?"

I'm still wrapping my brain around "adaptive endian-ness" as well.

--QTone

Re:billion billion?

[backslashdot]

a file systems for trillions of billions bytes of data?

What's it for?

Installing Windows ?

Re:Open source

[CrkHead]

It looks like Microsoft may have its new WinFS after all...

Re:billion billion?

[TedCheshireAcad]

16 billion billion times!!

pinky in corner of mouth.

Re:rearchitected

[miike]

Soon it will show one hit!

Re:billion billion?

[HerculesMO]

Given the fact there are an infinite amount of numbers, any murmur from your mouth or any written gibberish can be conveyed to a number.

For example, 'sassdfadef' is a number I think is a 2 with one thousand 3s after it. It's really moot :)

Re:fileless systems

[gorbachev]

Something like:

SELECT * FROM storage WHERE path = '/home/gorbachev/.cshrc' :)

crash every 5 minutes?

[Anonymous Coward]

"In fact, Solaris Kernel engineers Bill Moore and Matt Ahrens have subjected ZFS to more than a million forced, violent crashes in the course of their testing."

Damn! These guys are even worse programmers than I am! :)

Re:billion billion?

[hackwrench]

In fact, this page is just one big number.

Re:Unlimited scalability

[szo]

How did you check it? Count up to it and then add one and see if you could? Just asking.

Thanks

Szo

Forgot

[TheFlyingGoat]

I was going to respond to the article, but I forgot everything I know about file systems.

The final file system, XXXfs

[www.sorehands.com]

Though it before xyzzyfs, it is the last because it automatically generates and collects porn. Most geeks would never get past it.

Re:Two things...

[InadequateCamel]

I especially liked:
"Neither architecture pays a byte-swapping tax due to Sun's patent-pending "adaptive endian-ness" technology"

Adaptive endian-ness? What a stupid thing to include in a press release...there has to be a better way to say that.

Just announced by Sun:
"ANMF, our new file system (Ambiguous Nomenclature FS) will be filled with file cataloguing technology stuff that allows faster-ish operations that result in application goodness".

There already is an HFS as well.

[tepples]

Then why didn't IBM call its improved HFS "HFS Plus"? No wait, that would collide with Apple's HFS and HFS Plus, used in Mac OS.

It would appear that there can be only twenty-six distinct file systems. Then Microsoft went and innovated NTFS with Four-Letter-Word File System Technology, which actually was just a copy of IBM's HPFS, the first to introduce File System Named After a Competitor [hp.com] Technology.

Re:Unlimited scalability

[sabinm]

But the last time I checked, 16 billion billion is still less than infinity

So what you're saying is that they offer absolutely no storage capacity at all. Taken from the absolute authority of all knowledge in the universe I quote:

"Universe, The

Some information to help you live in it.

1. Area: infinite.

2. Imports: none.

It is impossible to import things into an infinite area, there being no outside to import things from.

3. Exports: none.

See Imports.

4. Population: none.

It is known that there are an infinite number of worlds, simply because there is an infinite amount of space for them to be in. However, not every one of them is inhabited. Therefore, there must be a finite number of inhabited worlds. Any finite number divided by infinity is as near to nothing as makes no odds, so the average population of all the planets in the Universe can be said to be zero. From this it follows that the population of the whole Universe is zero, and that any people you may meet from time to time are merely the products of a deranged imagination.

emphasis added

http://hhgproject.org/entries/universe.html/ [hhgproject.org]

Extrapolate that to storage.
Or to you for that matter.

Last Word?

[tedgyz]

It's a 128-bit filesystem, so doesn't that make it the last 8 words?

Re:Hmf.

[Gentoo Fan]

Yes, I do understand exponentials, just not thinking terribly fast today. I forget the kilo/mega/tera scale... I think I'll just refer to the size as Wowzerbytes.

Re:billion billion?

[sgant]

Do you?

Oh...um...just checked your web site...um...I guess you do.

Re:billion billion?

[uberpeon]

Dang it, my "+1 Rimshot" moderation option isn't available.... :)

Re:billion billion?

[Shadowlion]

Even including all the world's porn.

I dunno, man. I've got a lot of porn...

Technically....

[jolyonr]

The last word in file systems is "systems".

Thank you.

Re:billion billion?

[ArsonSmith]

Six point ohh times ten to the eighteenth.

Yer right doesn't roll the way a billion billion does.

Boil the oceans, eh?

[Hukui]

Logically, the next question is if ZFS' 128 bits is enough. According to Bonwick, it has to be. "Populating 128-bit file systems would exceed the quantum limits of earth-based storage. You couldn't fill a 128-bit storage pool without boiling the oceans."

Well...I never really like the oceans anyways. They were always so wet.

Bill Gates just called....

[da5idnetlimit.com]

Says he needs a new wallet...

If Bill Gates had a nickel for every time Windows crashed... ..oh wait, he does.

Re:billion billion?

[So_Belecta]

Even easier, picture the population of China divided out, one per 1m^2, in a giant grid 1km x 1km, then turn it into a skyscraper with 1000 floors, each 3m to a total of 3km, with a layer of people on each floor. A truly massive number, but not un visualisable by any stretch of the imagination. Quite small, really, when you think about it, 6 of these skyscrapers could fit in an 6km square area.

Re:Open source

[Anonymous Coward]

Dunno, but I just finished implementing XFS, and now I have to work double time because my pointy haired boss will ask me where I put YFS, and why it isn't before ZFS, as should be...

Gibi kibi mebi fibi

[snol]

Speaking of numbers no one can pronounce....

Re:billion billion?

[Just Some Guy]

Our filesystem goes to eleven.

Re:Two things...

[Roadkills-R-Us]

Is it just me, or is the post surprisingly bereft of unique details?

Neither. I mean, it's you, but it's not just you.

The details are there; you just can't remember them:

ZFS, the dynamic new file system in Sun's Solaris 10 Operating System (Solaris OS), will make you forget everything you thought you knew about file systems.

Re:billion billion?

[simcop2387]

the physicist says there are 1000 bytes in a kilobyte
and the computer scientist says there are 1024 meters in a kilometer

Re:billion billion?

[escher]

There's a big difference between visualizing the space containing a billion elements and visualizing the elements themselves.

That's a very good point. I use the millimeter=1000 technique to try to get some kind of grip on large numbers of items and large distances.

I've used it to try to grasp the large distances of space. It's still very difficult but I can get to Mars (and sometimes Jupiter) before my brain craps out. Once I was able to comprehend the size of the solar system out to Pluto but that only lasted a fraction of a second. (T'was really cool, though.)

Re:billion billion?

[harrkev]

About the size of my student loan...

Re:billion billion?

[harrkev]

Perhaps, but then you have to start adding restrooms, chars, elevators, etc. Soon, the whole thing gets out of hand.

And, unless you put male and female chinese on different floors, soon you will have a lot more than a billion ;)

Re:Unlimited scalability

[UserGoogol]

To reply to most people who replied to you:

Yes, there are several errors in that population zero bit, which are almost certainly intentional. In order to properly play around with infinity, one must follow the rules of Calculus. But as Douglas Adams wisely knew, Calculus is not funny, and all jokes in the field are at best derivative. Thusly, it was integral to his success as a writer to stick to Algebra.

Re:billion billion?

[Anonymous Coward]

How many pennies does it take to fill the Library of Congress, if you first remove all the material related to Volkswagen Beetles and replace it with maps showing the size of Rhode Island? And would those pennies weigh more than an asteroid capable of creating a 1 km crater in North Korea?

Re:Another quote to cherish

[eclectro]

Given that k = 1.38x10^-16 erg/Kelvin, and that the ambient temperature of the universe is 3.2K, an ideal computer running at 3.2K would consume 4.4x10^-16 ergs every time it set or cleared a bit

ok-ok, I get that. But can it play ogg???

Re:billion billion?

[Ghostx13]

Lemme guess, you usually do this after getting high right? ;-)

Re:billion billion?

[Trolling4Dollars]

People SHOULD have a clue about a quintillion in this day and age. I'll bet that there was a time when a million was out of the mental grasp of most of the population. It's the 21st century and humanity needs to progress as a whole to bigger and better things.