Magnets To Replace Bluetooth? 193
aceat64 writes "News.com is carrying a story that suggests magnets could eventually replace Bluetooth as a cheaper and more energy effiect wireless solution. The concept of magnetic induction isn't new, but Aura has managed to shrink the technology onto a single chip. The first device to be made using the technology is a wireless headset that will cost between $60 and $80."
Replace bluetooth? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Replace bluetooth? (Score:2)
Actually, it is hard to reach such a high value of
Bluetooth is second only to clocks on video recorders in this field.
Good GOD, man! (Score:5, Informative)
I keep waiting for a gas pump that "recognizes" my gasoline credit card device and waits for me to "fill it up."
Uh, hate to break it to you, but those have been around since the mid to late 90's, when Mobil introduced the SpeedPass. [speedpass.com] I've had one since long before I ever heard of Bluetooth. Now they are used at Exxon and Mobil stations all over the place. I think McDonald's even did testing a while back in California, IIRC, where people could pay for their drive-thru purchases via SpeedPass-- dunno if that's going to go national. When they launched it, it came in two varieties-- a small cylinder for your keyring that must be waved in front of a spot on the pump, and a transponder meant to be stuck inside your car's window that is "read" by an overhanging antenna when the car first pulls up to the pump (sort of like the E-Z Pass [ezpass.com] system some states have for toll roads). I think the stick-on transponder SpeedPass has been phased out, because I see no reference to it on the website.
Have a hard time getting a paper receipt, though. Keep getting a message saying "Your receipt is inside."
Where I live, gas pumps have been accepting credit cards right at the pump for at least 10 years, and have been printing their own receipts right at the pump as well. My SpeedPass account is even configured to assume I want a receipt when I gas up, so the pump just spits one out without asking when I'm done filling my tank.
I won't even tell you what I can do with my Macs running OS X and my Bluetooth phone, it may make your head explode. No flying cars yet, though.
I suggest you move to a state where people aren't too busy dating their relatives to embrace technological advances. By the way, the North won.
Comment removed (Score:5, Funny)
Re:YES! (Score:3, Funny)
You won''t be able to see much and the monitor mightn't last long, but for long range gimmi^H^H^H^H^H^Hemergency broadcasts it can't be beat LALL!
Re:YES! (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:YES! (Score:2, Funny)
ahh forget it
Re:YES! (Score:3, Funny)
Look at those groovy colors on my screen, man! Totally psychadelic!
Re:YES! (Score:2, Funny)
Re:YES! (Score:2)
Seems to be a good example of a disruptive technology [wordspy.com]
Re:YES! (Score:2)
Magnetic effects. (Score:2)
"This is your captain speaking. As you can see on the aisle TV screen, we're currently flying through a purple and green blob, and according to our compass we're spinning at approximately 90 revolutions per second."
Regards,
--
*Art
Induction (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Induction (Score:5, Informative)
Correct me if i'm wrong but dont most Radio transmission technologies use some form of magnetic induction in order to achieve their goal.
The point is using magnetic fields and mutual inductance rather than electromagnetic radiation to transfer information wirelessly.
Last i heard passing electricity through a coil produces a magnetic field.
More precisely, passing an alternating current through any conductor will produce a magnetic field. This magnetic field in turn will create a current in another conductor some distance away (the article sites four feet as the maximum distance) which can be used to observer the original signal.
It's an old concept, but since magnetic fields created by normal AC powers are pretty weak it's not really that useful. Apparently they've managed a very-high frequency (the effect is proportional to the change in current) alternating current in a chip small enough to make this possible.
Re:Induction (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Induction (Score:2)
Re:Induction (Score:4, Interesting)
Radio waves are referred to as "electro-magnetic radiation". There is no such thing as a magnetic component without an electrical component, or vice-versa. The two fields compliment eachother.
Another interesting thing mentioned in the article was that this magnetic field made a "bubble" that "stopped" at four feet. Magnetic field strength decays at the same rate as the electrical component. If you want a smaller "bubble" for wireless, just cut the power down. I don't see a difference here, unless they are just planning on running really low power as a general rule, and I suppose this would also explain the longer battery life they describe.
I'm really not seeing the difference here. The only thing the article mentions that really separates this from radio is the frequency, which they only vaguely described as "used by industrial and medical" applications. I'm going to guess this means either very high frequency or very low frequency. Very high frequency is far from efficient, and is already staked out well in the bandplan. If they're targetting very low frequency, (VLF) then there's no way they'll have the bandwidth necessary for video as the article suggests.
The article also said "interferance is not an issue". 640k of memory will be plenty, too. I normally don't slam on people, but this article just reeks of lack of forethought and research. It's only natural that any new technology niche has breathing room, until it becomes popular. I'm sure cell phone makers 10 yrs ago didn't expect to ever use even 30% of their allotted spectrum.
Answers. (Score:3, Informative)
2 - A cruise of the whitepapers indicates that the magnetic field strength is related to distance via 1/d^6, as opposed to radiated power, where it's relatd to 1/d^2. This means a much sharper dropoff in power... meaning the point beyond which there is a negligible power level is
Re:Answers. (Score:4, Informative)
There is no electrical field associated with a static magnetic field. Any change of position or intensity of the magnetic field will result in an electrical field and an electromagnetic wave (wavelength dependent upon rate of change). Any transmission of information implies changing the field in some way.
2 - A cruise of the whitepapers indicates that the magnetic field strength is related to distance via 1/d^6, as opposed to radiated power, where it's relatd to 1/d^2. This means a much sharper dropoff in power... meaning the point beyond which there is a negligible power level is much sharper.
1/d^6 is sharp drop, and I'm wondering what they're doing. 'Magnets' doesn't explain it. A magnet does inherently have a dipole field (which has a sharper dropoff than inverse-square drop of a monopole field), but 1/d^6 sounds like a higher order field than that, which is interesting. I assume from the article that they've been using magnetic inductors rather than electrical conductors to construct and detect this particular electromagnetic field, which is also interesting.
Re:Answers. (Score:2)
http://scienceworld.wolfram.com/physics/MagneticDi pole.html
Quadrapoles drop off even faster.
Put a couple magnets like this:
N----S
S----N
and you won't see much magnetic field at any big distances.
That's why refrigerator magnets feel funny too, and they're only strong for a few millimeters. That makes them safe on computer cases toNO CARRIER...
Re:Answers. (Score:2)
That's the one that's hanging me up. Wouldn't it then be possible to evesdrop on any communication from a good distance away by using conventional radio equipment?
The stated point of this technology seems to be low power c
Re:Induction (Score:2)
where the signal rolls off as 1/r^6 rather than
the usual 1/r^2. This means they concentrate their
transmit power in a small radius around the device
which makes it more power efficient.
They note in their technology brief that yes they
do have electric field generated too it's just
less penetrating so magnetic field is preferable
here since the goal is to save power.
13.xMHz RF, 204.8 kilobits/sec, audio (Score:2)
So no, this isn't Firewire, or quite even Bluetooth - it's Almost Appletalk, but very low power cordless. However, unlike Bluetooth with works
One small correction (Score:2)
Re:One small correction (Score:2)
Been around a long time (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Induction (Score:3, Informative)
did you RTFA?
CNet claims "Magnetic induction differs from Bluetooth and just about every other wireless technique now available, most of which use what's known as radio frequency, or RF, signals--bursts of electrical energy that waft out like ripples in a pond until they reach an antenna.
Magnetic fields also create waves, but the waves form a kind of bubble, which stops growing after f
Re:Induction (Score:3, Interesting)
The key to understanding how this thing works (and yes the technique is old) is getting to understand the difference between NEARFIELDS and FARFIELDS. The nearfield is the zone CLOSE to the antenna less than .
Re:Induction (Score:2)
13MHz, 1.25 m, 204kbps, Nyquist vs. Shannon (Score:3, Informative)
The data rate is 204.8 kilobits/sec - I can't tell if that's bidirectional or shared unidirectional like Ethernet? However, you're wrong about your use of Nyquist's formula - that tells you that your pulse sampling rate has to be twice the frequency of a continuous wavelength you're trying to send (so your data
Magnetic induction is not all that short range. (Score:3, Informative)
What's new is that they've goofed.
At any given frequency you can launch an electromagnetic wave by using:
- And electric dipole. (Essentially impossible at anything above DC due to the current from the moving charges.)
- A permanent magnet or a current loop (producing a virtual
Re:Magnetic induction is not all that short range. (Score:2)
Re:Magnetic induction is not all that short range. (Score:3, Informative)
Yep.
I did not know that dipole fields drop off with the cube of the distance until just now and still don't really fully understand it.
- Inverse square because the area the wave is spread out across is increasing with the square of the distance from the emitter, times:
- Inverse first power because as you get farther away from the dipole (a + and a - pole near each other) the two opposite electric charges or magnetic poles app
Can you hear me now? (Score:3, Funny)
Does anyone think about the environment? (Score:5, Funny)
Hrmm (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Hrmm (Score:2)
Bad news.... (Score:5, Funny)
Wow.. (Score:2, Informative)
The magnetic approach also consumes very little power when compared with notorious battery-draining RF techniques like Bluetooth. According to a description on the Aura Web site, Fonegear's headset can keep going for up to three months on a single AA battery, as opposed to only a number of hours for equipment outfitted with Bluetooth.
Re:Wow.. (Score:2, Interesting)
My bluetooth headseat lasts far more than 2 weeks on 2 AA batteries, and I use it for several hours every working day.
They obviously have a useful product if it can last three months on one battery, but saying "only a number of hours" for bluetooth equivalents would be like saying a DVD can store a whole movie but a CD can store "only a few seconds of video". Big marketing exaggeration, which makes me distrust them from the start.
Interesting, indeed! (Score:1)
What's the attraction? (Score:4, Funny)
Re:What's the attraction? (Score:2)
I'd laugh if it weren't for being bi-polar.
AT least it'll keep the loonies happy (Score:5, Funny)
D'you think it's coincidence that the company who came up with this is called Aura?
Eh? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Eh? (Score:1)
Re:Eh? (Score:2)
or read the newspaper with the adds for 'bluetooth headset' or heck, you might even check the local computer resellers webpages sometime.
Re:Eh? (Score:2, Informative)
Yes, I work in the telecom industry
Infomercials? (Score:3, Interesting)
no on-off or stand-by button? (Score:1, Insightful)
it'll automatically turn off when the battery runs out though, so you'll have to remember to change the battery.
Total hogwash... (Score:2, Insightful)
You can NOT get a varying magnetic field without also getting a varying electrical field. That is the way the physical universe works. If you can not vary the magnetic field... how are you going to send a signal from the transmitter to the receiver?
-DU-...etc...
Re:Total hogwash... (Score:2, Informative)
I assumed that they would just be modulating the magnetic field with the signal rather than modulating a carrier signal with a high frequency.
The description above is nothing like I heard in physics at school but it may be that lower frequency signals have a shorter range.
Re:Total hogwash... (Score:4, Informative)
It's vague, but I think this means it it using the "near field" instead of the propagating field. A transmitting antenna emits two fields: a propagating electromagnetic wave (i.e. light) whose intensity drops off like 1/r^2, and a nonpropagating electromagnetic field that drops off like 1/r^4 (which is why it's called the near field). It can carry a lot of power, but since it doesn't go anywhere it is usually ignored.
Re:What the Near Field is (Score:2)
-- magnetic fields in the radial direction that weaken as (1/r^2) and (1/r^3), where r is the distance from the source;
-- magnetic fields perpendicular to the radial direction that weaken as (1/r), (1/r^2) and (1/r^3), and
-- electric fields perpendicular to both of these that weaken as (1/r) and (1/r^2).
It turns out that the
Re:Total hogwash... (Score:2)
At least, that's what I got from the article.
holistic benefits (Score:2)
Re:holistic benefits (Score:2)
Microwave RF has little to no measurable effect on the body unless it's right at the natural oscillating frequency of water (about 2.4 GHz), and even then, the effects from such a miniscule amount of energy are minimal.
By contrast, magnetic fields have a very measurable effect on the body. Your blood is composed of
Re:holistic benefits (Score:3, Informative)
That's false. Red blood cells do not clump in the presense of magnetic fields.
There have been studies on t
Re:holistic benefits (Score:2)
Good post.
Child Labour? (Score:5, Funny)
quick, somebody stop these fiends!
Re:Child Labour? (Score:1)
Faraday (Score:5, Informative)
Gee, silly me, and I always thought Faraday [corrosion-doctors.org] developed "magnetic induction" and that it was in wide use. But, hey, it has turned out that, contrary to my own silly ideas, Gates actually invented the Internet and that BT invented the hyperlink, so I must be wrong on Faraday as well.
Inductor (Score:2)
I'm... (Score:3, Funny)
Other properties.. (Score:2)
"could eventually" (Score:4, Funny)
you get it, anything could eventually do anything.
(and bluetooth is not useless, obsolote tech. it's pretty useful, and if you're bitchin that you don't need a cellular then it really doesn't make much sense to bitch about not needing bluetooth fo r it)
Hmm... (Score:5, Funny)
Just a se
Magnets (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Magnets (Score:5, Informative)
There are different kinds of modes for electric and magnetic fields to work with. EM radiation is just one of them, but it is special in the way that it can cross arbitrary distances if properly focused. This works because a sinusoidally changing electric field generates similarly changing magnetic fields, which in turn generate similarly changing electric fields. In a way, the fields themselves are not traveling, but they build up new fields in succession, hence propagating the signal.
In every practical antenna, other modes of electric/magnetic fields are present besides the radiation component. However, the other modes disappear faster than the radiation, as they do not rebuild themselves. The inductive method relies on these other modes, using very different kinds of antenna which don't produce much of the radiation component.
In other news... (Score:1)
Replacing bluetooth? (Score:4, Funny)
"What, where?"
"Oh, sorry, you missed it."
Aura's Explanation of this Tech... (Score:4, Informative)
So I went to Aura's website for more info. Here's their blurb:
While the concepts behind magnetic induction communication have been around for decades, Aura's engineers are the first to develop and implement practical solutions capturing the benefits of this technology.
Conventional radio frequency (RF) wireless communication systems are optimal for sending large amounts of information and communicating over long distances. However, this consumes power, creates information security issues, and results in interference and "crowding" among devices. A good example is in the 2.4 GHz band where simultaneous operation of a cordless phone, WiFi network and Bluetooth headset is frequently not possible without severe degradation of Quality of Service. In sharp contrast, LibertyLink's magnetic communication operates in a "bubble" that envelops the personal space of each user and is - by the laws of physics - inherently private and secure. The result is an easier to use, lower-cost system that makes far more efficient use of power and bandwidth than conventional RF solutions. By selecting a technology that limits the range and bandwidth to only what the application requires, Aura achieves a very substantial savings in power with all of the simplicity advantages of LibertyLink: dedicated communication channels, no bandwidth sharing, complete frequency re-use between bubbles, worldwide regulatory flexibility, and reliable coexistence with WiFi, CDMA, TDMA. and GSM transmissions.
Still pretty vague -- how the hell do they handle interference issues in this "magnetic bubble"? Do they supply Faraday cages for your PC/monitor?
Re:Aura's Explanation of this Tech... (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Aura's Explanation of this Tech... (Score:2, Insightful)
An alternating current creates and EM field. The strength of the the two portions of the field related to the strength of the current, the configuration of the 'antennae' and the distance from the 'antennae'
To create a strong magnetic field, it seems one would have loops. The loops would create a strong magnetic field based on number, radius, and current. A electric field would
Re:Aura's Explanation of this Tech... (Score:2)
Yeah, it plugs straight into the wall socket -- no need for a power cord to recharge it!
Where's your imagination? ;)
Aw, Shit (Score:2)
Stupid technology...
-Waldo Jaquith
Van Eck Phreaking? (Score:2, Interesting)
Anyway, assuming that, does that mean we get a chip on a usb stick (say), that would allow Van Eck Phreaking to be done at home? I mean, if you can send useful amounts of data through this technology, it must be good enough to pick up clock signals and
Re:Van Eck Phreaking? (Score:2)
/me laughs like Kefka! Ueeeheeheehee! ;-)
Hey! (Score:2, Funny)
Please Correct Me If I'm Wrong... (Score:2)
It's nice to know this is new technology (not) (Score:4, Insightful)
Actually, I have to wear a hearing aid in one ear due to mid-ear damage, and I'm expecting before long to have an inductive loop for my cell phone that means handsfree use without any kind of additional earpiece. Apart from convincing people that I'm completely mad and talking to myself in the street, it should be a considerable improvement over bluetooth headsets, which, compared to either of my hearing aids, are heavy and have poor frequency response.
Re:It's nice to know this is new technology (not) (Score:2)
So no nothing new, in the same way the transistors did nothing really new. Except they did it while being really really small.
Of course I am just getting all kinds of funny images of what will happen with conflicting magnetic fields. But they are probably way to low in power to do
Of Course (Score:3, Insightful)
WELCOME! (Score:2)
Please stop this joke. It's no longer funny. (Score:2, Troll)
Re:Please stop this joke. It's no longer funny. (Score:2)
"Bubble"? (Score:2)
> form a kind of bubble, which stops growing after
> four feet, making them more secure than waves
> wafting endlessly in every direction, Cui said.
Doesn't anybody study physics any more?
Oh FFS, it's just spin.... (Score:2)
Betamax was better then VHS, but it's even deader than my favourite OS. So I'm still going not going to hold my breath.
Re:Oh FFS, it's just spin.... (Score:2)
UnixWare?
Physics Lesson 110... (Score:2)
GMSK-Modulated Magnetic Link (Score:2)
here [elecdesign.com] is a relevant article that explains the technology a little better.
Lawsuits? (Score:2)
Wow, that totaly dosn't make sense (Score:3, Insightful)
Now, I know there are some devices that use magnetic induction to 'charge' and then blast out information, like RFID. But the key here is the RF -- radio frequency (ID = identification, of course).
So it would make some sense if these guys said they wanted to carry power using Magnetic induction, rather then using power cables or batteries, but it doesn't make sense for them to say they want to replace 'blue tooth' with it, because blue tooth and all radios use Magnetic induction to communicate...
My guess, yet another reporter with absolutely no idea wft they're talking about.
Nuts & Volts June 2003 (Score:3, Informative)
One problem (that's easily fixed) with the magnetic system is that both transmitting and receiving coils have to be parallel. If they're at 90 degrees little or no signal gets through. The fix for it happens to be using 3 coils, each one 90 degrees from each other on the receiver. The transmitter only needs one, but no matter how that one is oriented one of the 3 coils in the receiver can pick it up. I haven't heard of any other chips, but the LibertyLink chip from Aura Communications can automatically select the coils on it's own.
Very short range, but it works for something like a wireless headset where range doesn't matter anyways.
Magnetic fields? (Score:4, Funny)
It's just a transformer guys (Score:3, Informative)
One coil creates a varying magnetic flux that induces a current in a matching coil -- and thus an electrical signal is passed through the ether.
Those who claim that it's no different to a radio link are almost right -- the only real difference is that with such a system there's no need to use a carrier wave (RF) -- the information can be dumped (raw) into the transmitting side of the coil and received by the other coil.
There's no rocket science here -- all that's happened is that some crowd has figured out that by using three coils instead of one, they can effectively adjust the direction of the strongest flux lobe to give the maximum transfer of energy.
Of course, the marketing droids would never simplify things by simply telling us it was a "clever transformer" because then they couldn't charge so much for it eh?
Re:I HATE THIS (Score:1, Offtopic)
Re:Ranges Bluetooth vs. MI (Score:2)
How many times have you seen Bluetooth devices used more than a few feet from the base? I've *never* actually seen anyone doing that in the "real world". Mostly it's people with Bluetooth phone headsets and the phone next to them on the table, on the dash of the car, or strapped to their waist. Ditto for wireless mice and keyboards that use Bluetooth.
-psy
Re:Explain? (Score:2)
Re:Magnetic field near your head? (Score:2)
The risk with cell phones isn't so much the fact that you're exposing yourself to radiation