Walk-thru Fog Screen 333
fluor2 writes "Ever wanted a screen floating in air? Two scientists, Ismo Rakkolainen and Karri Palovuori, both from Tampere University of Technology, Finland have come up with an idea. It is called the Walk-thru Fog Screen. The fog screen, consisting of 'fog' that is blown down from top, and the protective laminar airflow creates a thin and crisp surface, pretty undisturbed by the air in the rest of the room, making it ideal for projector usage. People can walk right through this screen of fog. Their next idea is to use the fog as a touch-screen, making it even more accessible." For a screen one can walk through, the image quality is better than I'd have thought.
hmmm (Score:5, Funny)
S
Re:hmmm (Score:5, Funny)
Re:hmmm (Score:2)
Hmm
Rus
Re:hmmm (Score:3, Funny)
Umm, no, it would make snow.
Re:hmmm (Score:2, Funny)
Re:hmmm (Score:2, Funny)
Re:hmmm (Score:3, Funny)
Not Smoke, Fog... (Score:5, Informative)
It's not smoke, it's fog. The difference is that it's not going to hang around after it leaves the laminar airflow, because it's opaque vaporized stuff (fog), not particles suspended in air (smoke). There are lots of materials that one can use to create non-persistent fog that isn't water vapor, much like the fog used in nightclubs. It'll just dissipate when it gets out of the laminar airflow.
Virg
Great.. now I'd like to (Score:5, Funny)
-
Re:Great.. now I'd like to (Score:4, Funny)
Seaquest DSV (Score:4, Interesting)
Will we see giant submarines in the future that go into space and...
Err, sorry. Got sidetracked.
This is cool. In a 1996 sorta way.
Re:Seaquest DSV (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Seaquest DSV (Score:4, Funny)
Don't you mean Sirius Cybernetics cOrporation?
Re:Seaquest DSV (Score:5, Funny)
Video/mpeg confusions! (Score:2)
Just because it's computer video doesn't mean it's mpeg!
Alas I can't transcode it to mpeg either.
Re:Video/mpeg confusions! (Score:2)
Unfortunately it's when you see the video that you realise that the technology has, shall we say, some way to go before we'll all be using it in dull business meetings.
Rich.
The foggers! (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Video/mpeg confusions! (Score:2)
mplayer for linux works well with both formats...
( gmplayer )
--ken
Re:Video/mpeg confusions! (Score:2, Informative)
It's an interesting experiment anyways.
Re:Video/mpeg confusions! (Score:2, Insightful)
When creating video clips like this, what is so HARD about using an open, well established standard that everyone (including the few % not running M$ media player) can use?
Btw, This is the first wmv I can't play at first attempt in mplayer under Linux. A file called 'wmv9dmod.dll' seems to be missing - can't find it on my Windows 98 installation either...
To be at least a bit on topic, this tec
Open-standards video (Score:5, Informative)
Quite a lot, as it happens. The main hassle being that there aren't any well established open standards that provide decent compression rates. At least, if there are then I'd be grateful for people enlightening me
I had to put video up on my site - I chose MPEG 1 at first because everyone could view it, but eventually the file sizes started getting huge and I had to switch to something else. ISO MP4 can't be played by MS WMP, Divx and what have you can't be played without installing additional software on client machines...what to pick?
In the end, I chose .wmv for a while. Seemed to give the best picture quality/file size trade-off. However, since then I've bought myself a Powerbook so all future things will be Quicktime.
Honestly - if anyone knows a format that can be played on out-of-the-box Windows, OS X and common Linux distros without the installation of any extra software, I'd love to hear about it.
Cheers,
Ian
Re:Open-standards video (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Open-standards video (Score:3, Informative)
That was my point - none of the choices available fit the bill. Original poster asked what was hard about putting up standards-compliant video, and my answer is that there's no one file format that plays on all clients and still produces a decent file size/performance trade-off. I've just picked the easiest one for me to work with and stuck with that.
What was wrong with divx
Re:Open-standards video (Score:2)
A bit of an outsider is Realplayer. Since it A runs on all major OSes, it doesn't have an OS to leverage users into accepting it as the default and C its player is hat
Re:Open-standards video (Score:3, Interesting)
$ mplayer -vc help | grep wmv
ffwmv1 ffmpeg working FFmpeg M$ WMV1/WMV7 [wmv1]
ffwmv2 ffmpeg problems FFmpeg M$ WMV2/WMV8 [wmv2]
wmv8 dshow working Windows Media Video 8 [wmv8ds32.ax]
wmv7 dshow working Windows Media Video 7 [wmvds32.ax]
wmv9dmo dmo working Windows Media Video 9 DMO [wmv9dmod.dll]
wmvdmo dmo working Windows Media Video DMO [wmvdmod.dll]
"WMP can't play quicktime, everyone hates the quicktime player, and it's hardly supported anywhere!"
$ mp
DivX is the only acceptable format (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Open-standards video (Score:4, Interesting)
While I don't have an answer to that, I know of an answer that requires a similar amount of work for all those platforms: RealPlayer. Yes, it can be annoying. But it works. I happily use RP on windows and linux, and I'm pretty sure even my old PowerBook 5300 could handle it (just to prove it to myself I'll try it tonight).
No, I don't work for Real. Yes, I work with Real products. Yes, I like 'em. Yes, I'm a geek. And yes, I have a life.
Johnny (Score:3, Funny)
repost.... (Score:2, Informative)
My god slashdot!! Can't you keep your stories straight?? If not SEARCH GOOGLE!! [google.com]. That's how I found it again.
Re:repost.... (Score:3, Insightful)
However the story was new to me. So I am not too upset.
--ken
Re:repost.... (Score:3, Funny)
RTFA (Score:4, Insightful)
Now go flame the guys posting dupes of a new Mozilla release.
It would make for a great cinema effect (Score:5, Interesting)
I am not really sure what display use it has in the "real world" but it would make a great cinematic effect.
Also you could scare folks in amusement park rides making them think they are about to crash into stuff.
You could also hide behind it and spy on people maybe...
Who knows...
--ken
Re:It would make for a great cinema effect (Score:5, Interesting)
In the real world, fog screens tend to make terrible pileups on the highways where the crashes aren't so pretend.
As far as amusement parks, good luck trying to keep a laminar airflow while a high velocity vehicle whizes by. And forget outdoors, the breeze would carry your image away, that's if you could even see it in the sunlight. Probably more useful in a haunted house ride...life-like ghosts, and cool the airflow and you also get the chill down the back of your neck too.
Re:It would make for a great cinema effect (Score:5, Funny)
Yeah you could also put signs before the ride saying "this ride is safe using smokescreens", but during the ride they actually crash really really hard into stuff.
Heck with amusement parks... (Score:2)
On the other hand, that might not be so great. The last thing I want is for my mom or boss to materialize right in front of my computer screen while I'm in the middle of enjoying some really good... er, browsing Slashdot.
Uuh-oh (Score:5, Insightful)
Does anyone else find it find it very disturbing that the first application they suggest is advertising?
Jason
ProfQuotes [profquotes.com]
Re:Uuh-oh (Score:2)
And what would you rather.... instore advertising/pushy sales people getting increasingly obnoxious and garish to catch your eye and get your attention, or something cool and geeky like this?
Re:Uuh-oh (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Uuh-oh (Score:2)
leafblowers (Score:4, Funny)
Advertising... (Score:2)
Re:Uuh-oh (Score:2)
Anyway there is indeed probably no immidiate hightech use for this. I imagined something like a screen in an operating room to give the surgeon information, but without blocking movement like a normal screen would. You know put the screen over the chest if the surgeon is working on the head, bu
Mimes are evil (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Mimes are evil (Score:2)
FYI: We (Finns) don't have the history of being harassed by beggar-mimes in our streets. Interestingly, mimestry(sp?) is considered a difficult kind of art performance. The few selected ones I've seen have actually been pretty damn good.
Judging by the common jokes about outdoor park mimes tailing people and making everyone feel miserable, they must be all too frequent a phenomenon in U.S.
Spinal Tap flashback (Score:2)
I say (Score:4, Funny)
This is going to confuse the crap out of Batman (Score:4, Funny)
Woo (Score:3, Funny)
Rus
Ars story (Score:4, Informative)
Cubed for Outdoor Concerts! (Score:4, Funny)
Based on the "mist tents" seen at Lollapalalaala(TM), you'll trip balls walking thru the 50 foot cube of cooling fog filled with visuals that _may_ have something to do with the music!
Seriously, this is a great idea and I expect we'll see something based on this which gets the audience inside the thing at entertainment venues in the future. I also would like to say I'm glad to see it looking so good in the demo pics.
Jonah Hex
Could this be used to create 'real' holograms? (Score:2, Insightful)
I can already see a lot of applications for this. Bring out the mimejuice! And crack some ice!
Re:Could this be used to create 'real' holograms? (Score:3, Insightful)
For now probably only very simple shapes would be possible, like say a pyramid. Then again maybe with multiple projectors you can create the illusion of something being inside the fog?
Then again you can bet your ass that the engineers at places like
Great for firearms training (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Great for firearms training (Score:5, Insightful)
This technology would be very useful for extremely realistic firearms training. Think FPS with real guns ...
Sure! This vapor+projector equipment must be way-way cheaper than cardboard used today..
Re:Great for firearms training (Score:2)
He didn't say cheap, he said realistic--which is rarely cheap.
The parent is right--that IS an extremely good fit for this technology.
Re:Great for firearms training (Score:4, Informative)
There are systems in use today that are used to train police (and others) in live-fire simulations. A string of photoelectric sensors line the top/bottom and sides of the screen, allowing the system to identify the impact point.
However, the system typically uses a thin plastic screen for projection of the video image, which deteriorates after use. This system would be a good replacement for it, although I don't know how long it would take to break-even on the costs.
In Dallas, you can see and use one:
http://www.dfwgun.com/InteractiveSystem.htm [dfwgun.com]
and you can find more info about the system at:
http://www.ais-sim.com/PRISim/overview.html [ais-sim.com]
Re:Great for firearms training (Score:2, Funny)
Realistic firearms training?
"Oops! Sorry, I didn't know you were behind that screen."
It needs work, IMHO. (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:It needs work, IMHO. (Score:2)
Then only use the upper half of the "screen" and your images will look great
No holographs for you (Score:3, Informative)
Re:No holographs for you (Score:3, Interesting)
Now, I will let my imagination run wild and try to address the problems you mentioned. Even though I am no engineer, perhaps something resembling my ideas might be possible. First, holding the fog in its 'pr
Re:No holographs for you (Score:2)
Stack multiple displays after each other and you have real 3D.
Of course, the resolution in z axis is poor, but anyway...
Re:No holographs for you (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:No holographs for you (Score:2)
What part of the world do you come from??
Ugh. (Score:4, Insightful)
Great, just what the human race needs. Another way to display advertisements. I do my best to ignore them, but if I have to walk through an ad, it's going to be hard not to see it.
Done (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Done (Score:2)
Could you be a bit more specific? I couldn't easily find any info on such a thing on the site. According to the other reply, they use water, so it's not so much of a walk-through screen.
Both definitely have their applications (with water you can probably make larger screens and use them outdoors more easily), but they are distinctly different.
Done in Vegas 7 years ago too... (Score:5, Interesting)
It has also been done in Vegas 8 years ago at the MGM Grand Hotel's EFX show (now defunct):
I was one of the designers of a MIDI Show Control-to-Allen-Bradley PLC controller specifically designed for this show. The EFX show used dozens of them. These boxes in turn were controlled by Amigas! [show-control.com] by Richmod Sound Design's [show-control.com] software.
The fog wall in the show was huge, and they would project a scene onto the fog while the actors and props would be moved into place. Then the fog would dissipate and the projected 'scene' would come to life.
--jeffy++
Possible Use for it! (Score:2, Funny)
Oh, wait, I think this might have been done before
Re:Possible Use for it! (Score:2)
Oh, wait, I think this might have been done before
And they would've gotten away with it if it weren't for those blasted kids.
Just like Seaquest (Score:2, Redundant)
Re:Just like Seaquest (Score:2)
Re:Just like Seaquest (Score:2)
No Fog (Score:2, Funny)
Then I can realize my dream, Brittney Spears backup dancer. And after the show... she leads me by the hand to her dressing room... errrrm
I mean to play Quake 10, yeah, thats it. Quake.
Re:No Fog (Score:4, Funny)
That's easily solved: www.goatse.cx
Watch that picture for a few hours straight, and I'm sure that image will be implanted into your brain until your lifetime is over.
Been done before. (Score:2)
Ah, I've got it! (Score:4, Funny)
Dupe (Score:2)
Environmental issues (Score:2)
Companion Security Breach (Score:2)
Doesn't Disney do something similar.... (Score:2)
Ya know, I think.... (Score:3, Funny)
Inspired by Last Starfighter? (Score:2, Informative)
In The Last Starfighter [sciflicks.com], Alex Rogan's mentor "Grig" described the technology used for displaying their heads up display.
Basically he said it was produced by projecting images onto a field of xeon gas. (Or something along those lines. Anyone care to refresh my memory?)
Seems to me like these guys got their inspiration from the movies. :)
My newest peripheral: (Score:5, Funny)
Two sided display? (Score:3, Interesting)
Hope They Are Looking for Outdoor Markets (Score:3, Interesting)
Major old technology (Score:3, Informative)
Disenyland already has this (Score:4, Interesting)
(Some days it works really well, some days it doesn't.)
Not really new (Score:3, Informative)
The entire structure, thus, was totally covered in fog - and they used both lasers and video projectors to color and animate the surface.
And anyway... what, nobody ever thought of shineing a video or slide projector (or laser) at fog before. Geezesus.
Wile E. Coyote uses (Score:3, Funny)
One of our favorite uses: an image that people can walk through which looks just like a solid brick wall... exactly six inches in front of a real brick wall. Get your webcams ready.
First-hand experiences (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:porn? (Score:5, Funny)
i saw it at siggraph last week (Score:5, Informative)
as for noise - i don't recall it being noisy... it may not have made any noise at all. then again, the siggraph emerging technologies space is pretty noisy itself, so it may have made some sound that i didn't notice.
Re:i saw it at siggraph last week (Score:5, Interesting)
Anyway, it was impressive until I saw what they were showing. All that achievement and technology, and they were showing a Doraemon anime. I think it was a pirate VCD because there were illegible subtitles on the bottom of the screen. The resolution was pretty low. It would have been much better off with a production specifically designed for the medium.
Re:i saw it at siggraph last week (Score:5, Interesting)
Also at the same show and more interesting imho:
The most important thing there was a High Dynamic Range display. They placed an LCD in front of a rear-projection display and the combined modulation results in a contrast range of 70000:1. This allows much more realistic images. The images I saw looked like a good slide projector, but could be better in a darker room. There was some registration problems, but they say they are working on using bright white LED's behind the LCD, resulting in a flat screen that is as sharp as an LCD. PS: they patented the idea, which for this I think is ok as long as they actually manufacture an open device, they were a little hesitant to say this, though the current driver is just a dual-headed graphics card and it seems hard to believe you could do much better than that.
Also interesting was a rear-projection globe. It was maybe 6' in diameter and translucent white. This used a single rear projector in the base, reflected off a cone-shaped mirror inside at the top, to project on all sides. They had software showing images of the earth, other planets, continental plate drift. The brightness was suprisingly uniform and the fact that there was a black hole at the north pole was not a problem. A trackball let you spin the globe and the image moves very solidly, indicating the geometry is pretty accurate and they matched it with their image warping software (probably a hardware renderer using texture maps to distort the image correctly). Biggest problem is the room is going to have to be really dark for it to look good.
There was also a demo of those "project on a flat surface" keyboards, and it really works. You can learn to type on it correctly in only a few minutes of practice. Biggest problem I see is that the alignment with the flat surface is critical, the phone manufacturers are going to have to come up with clever folding stands to stand the phone/pda at exactly the right angle. Also it seems obvious to me that the projected image could change, not just to different keyboards, but be used as a display. It requires distortion of the display much like that globe, but even a PDA could do that now.
Re:OMG (Score:4, Funny)
This is cool technology! Although, I'd think you'd want to keep it away from wall and wooden areas to prevent the growth of mold and mildew.
Re:OMG (Score:3, Insightful)
Two posts in one article and I already used my sig, now what...?
Re:Seen it before (Score:5, Interesting)
Yes it was. It's simply someone that yet again took an idea from Science Fiction and made it reality.
Kinda like thise silly Sattelites, lasers and rockets to the moon
It's just that it seems that science is catching up to Science Fiction alot faster these days.