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Biotech Hardware Science

Peer To Peer Meets Manufacturing 523

Crashmarik writes "Small times has an article detailing UCB advances in desktop manufacturing. They raise the possibility for effectively downloading physical objects through the net. We have allready seen the reaction "Property Holders" over downloading music, what is the likely upshot of being able to copy physical objects. More importantly what are the implications for our society as we move out of an age of scarcity to an age of plenty ?" Great article - the author of it also won The Foresight Institute's prize in communications for 2002.
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Peer To Peer Meets Manufacturing

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  • I wonder (Score:5, Funny)

    by mjmalone ( 677326 ) * on Monday July 28, 2003 @08:32AM (#6550095) Homepage
    How much they're gunna charge for the ink...
    • Mechanics dream (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Arbogast_II ( 583768 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @09:26AM (#6550534) Homepage
      I don't see this replacing manufactured goods in price. Where this process would be invaluable would be for mechanics, construction workers, etc. All sorts of things could be repaired with this. So many items go in the garbage, not because they are useless, but because they are in need of one minor, obscure part that is no longer in stock. Anyone who has done mechanical or construction work can appreciate the need to be able to duplicate one trivial part that cannot be purchased. I am thinking any auto mechanic would go nuts over such a machine.
  • by buro9 ( 633210 ) <david@buro9 . c om> on Monday July 28, 2003 @08:33AM (#6550107) Homepage
    Because this one will be slashdotted under minor load:

    July 25, 2003 - Imagine your kitchen blender conks out the day you're hosting a large cocktail party. You search an online catalog, decide on a model, and click the "buy" button. But instead of waiting three days for the appliance to be shipped to your door, a new kind of printer on your desk springs into action. Layer by layer, the miraculous machine squirts out various materials to form the chassis, the electronics, the motors - literally building the blender for you from the bottom up in a matter of hours.

    Call it desktop manufacturing. For gadget geeks in need of instant gratification, it's a miracle. For designers deep in the iterative prototyping process, it's a revolution in product development. And thanks to small tech, it's becoming a reality.

    University of California, Berkeley engineering professor John Canny [berkeley.edu] and his colleagues are building such a printer. They call the technology "polymer mechatronics" or, more simply, flexonics. The revolutionary approach to desktop manufacturing is enabled by recent advances in 3-D printers, organic electronics and polymer actuators.

    Three-dimensional printers are commonly used to make prototypes of new product designs. For example, a designer may load a digital design into a Fused Deposition Modeling machine [berkeley.edu]. The FDM then extrudes thin beads of ABS plastic in .01-inch layers, until you have a completed passive functional part or device. While the printers are dropping in price, the leap from producing passive to active devices is monumental. That's where organic electronics come into play.

    Organic electronics were born in the 1970s when researchers discovered that chemically doping organic polymers, or plastics, increases their electrical conductivity. Since then, researchers have worked to develop the most effective and inexpensive organic compounds that can be patterned on flexible substrates to create useful circuits. In the private sector, companies ranging from Bell Labs to IBM to UK startup Plastic Logic [plasticlogic.com] are also working to develop quality organic transistors that are fabricated far more cheaply than silicon circuits. Organic semiconductors will most likely first hit the market in the form of inexpensive radio-frequency identification (RFID) tags and flexible display screens.

    Canny's co-investigator in Berkeley's flexonics effort, Vivek Subramanian [berkeley.edu], is one of many researchers harnessing the microfluidic precision of inkjet printing technology to deposit organic semiconductors in desired patterns. The key ingredient in Subramanian's organic circuits is "liquid gold." Synthesized in his laboratory, liquid gold consists of gold nanocrystals that are only 20 atoms across and melt at 100 degrees Celsius, 10 times lower than normal.

    The gold nanocrystals are encapsulated in an organic shell of an alkanethiol (an organic molecule containing carbon, hydrogen and sulphur) and dissolved in ink. As the circuit is printed on plastic, paper or cloth using inkjet technology, the organic encapsulant is burned off, leaving the gold as a high-quality conductor.

    Combining Subramanian's circuit printing technology with a 3-D printer enables electronics to be embedded within the housing of the device being printed. The chassis and the electronics are fabricated as one single structure.

    The next step is to add the actuators that provide electromechanical capabilities to the devices - for instance, a mechanism that causes the blender's blades to spin when switched on. For this, Canny plans to fill inkjet cartridges with electroactive polymers that contract when zapped with a voltage, enabling components to flex in desired directions. Additionally, the polymers generate a voltage when compressed, so buttons and switches can also be embedde

    • And it [bbspot.com] was intended as a joke...

    • by da5idnetlimit.com ( 410908 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @09:27AM (#6550537) Journal
      Diamond Age, Neal Stephenson...

      They have those replicators (printers) connected to "feeds" (component reservoirs) and can get/create almost anything they want on the molecular level.

      AND the society of this age is a thriving nanotech/Private Community mix.

      AND diamond, coming from carbon (the most inexpensive stuff possible), is so common it's a natural construction base...

      Go read it, its a good book
  • The guy was trying to suck up a cake through a fiber optic cable ;-)

    Downloading physical objects through the net? Fishing net maybe, not the Internet.

    Today's fact is tomorrow's fiction.

    -
  • How long will it be with this system in place until you can download the most ungodly of things from adult entertainment sites? EEEEW!
  • by daveo0331 ( 469843 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @08:37AM (#6550140) Homepage Journal
    We'll all be complaining about the CIAA (Car Industry Association of America), CBAA (Coffee Brewers Association of America), BBAA (Beer Brewers Association of America) etc etc etc
  • by AllUsernamesAreGone ( 688381 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @08:37AM (#6550143)
    When we have desktop universal constructors, then I expect the manufacturing world will kick up a stink, but unless I misunderstand the article the printers it describes can only make certain sorts of devices - mainly those containing plastics and certain types of electronics and specific sorts of movement in them. Sure, this is going to cut into the manufacturing market for some things, but nothing like a real UC could do...
  • Why need money? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Creepy Crawler ( 680178 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @08:37AM (#6550144)
    The "Age of Plenty" will make (cough) intellectual property king, until we all realise that the resources have to come from somewhere.

    Intellectual Property will die out just the same, as once people learn that sharing is the better of the 2. Each item mapped gives inventors more power and leverage to work with, hence more goods. It'll turn this capitalistic country into a pure form of socialism, one where all needs are provided. Or at least, could be capitalistic with a socialism base floor.

    Still, fabs would have to be made and sold, and only a large fab could make smaller fabs. You also have the problem with Energy consumption. Fusors may be the only realistic way of capturing large amounts of energy.

    There will STILL be an economy, just the balance of power will be radically shifted.


    • I've spoken to alot of people including some on Slashdot who would prefer to commit suicide than live in a socialist society.

      Intellectual Property will die out just the same, as once people learn that sharing is the better of the 2. Each item mapped gives inventors more power and leverage to work with, hence more goods. It'll turn this capitalistic country into a pure form of socialism, one where all needs are provided. Or at least, could be capitalistic with a socialism base floor.


      This will never be
      • " in a world with no jobs and no work."

        The concept that the ability to duplicate infinitely physical objects would result in "no jobs and no work" is a fallacy at best. The ability do duplicate these physical objects would result in a massive loss of jobs for those in the manufacturing industry, no doubt. However, there would be a nearly equal if not greater than equal increase (eventually) in the need for knowledge and service workers. Even if you could create a new computer every time a new technolo


        • The concept that the ability to duplicate infinitely physical objects would result in "no jobs and no work" is a fallacy at best. The ability do duplicate these physical objects would result in a massive loss of jobs for those in the manufacturing industry, no doubt. However, there would be a nearly equal if not greater than equal increase (eventually) in the need for knowledge and service workers.

          Yeah from India where knowledge and service workers are cheaper than US workers at about the same quality d
      • Uh, WHY would people with no jobs and no work commit suicide ??

        In an "abundance" society, that would be the NORM. Hobbies would likely take the place of employment, and that's also where your innovations come from. The basic commodities would remain the same: food, base materials, power, and information.



        • Why do people want tax cuts instead of going for this socialist society you mention? I mean we can have universal healthcare right now, Howard Dean is pushing for a society just like you mention, with universal healthcare and providing the basic commodities. Whats stopping him? Well about half the country believes that NOTHING free is good, they believe that they should EARN everything in life, that there should be NO safetynet, no free entitlements, nothing.

          I'm a socialist, I think we should go for provi
    • It is not "socialable" or socialist to coerce people into careers and to give up resources in the name of sharing, I prefer call it Marxist.

      It is not capitalistic, but monopolistic, to controll resources (like information and invention) that are made a limited resource by the force of government and not by natural physical scarsity.

      Both Marxisim and federally backed monopolistic behavior are very bad. But free-will sharing, planning, and use of resources according to real natural limits without handing o
    • Re:Why need money? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by femto ( 459605 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @09:31AM (#6550581) Homepage
      > the resources have to come from somewhere.

      If the main resource is carbon, it is widely available. The trick will be to have the assembler 'mine' it's raw materials from its environment (plant matter, atmosphere, ...). Also, wastage will be pretty well zero, so a bare minimum of material will be required. Thirdly, having full control of the material being fabricated allows very strong structures to be built, opening the possibility of strong low density 'foam' type materials, using even smaller amounts of raw materials.

      one where all needs are provided

      The trick would be to figure out how to get the universal assembler to provide all the basic needs. Food, shelter, sanitation, water, energy source. Biggest problem would be that the supply of real estate is limited. It would be interesting to see where people's greed will be directed once most things have no monetary value. I suspect people will start to hoard real estate. Will we see a war when the landless manufacture weapons and attempt to stop landowners from hoarding land surplus to building a shelter on?

      Still, fabs would have to be made and sold, and only a large fab could make smaller fabs.

      This is not necessarily the case. Any self respecting 'universal assembler' will be able to make a copy of itself.

      There will STILL be an economy

      It depends on what you mean by an economy. Surely the (forgotten) purpose of the economy is to satisfy our needs? Once needs can be satisfied without an economy, why have one? With any luck, the economy will be replaced by community. We will then live FOR those around us. It might take a bit of adjustment, but I'm sure most will cope.

    • This would change nothing of the socioeconomic systems from within this change happened!

      You'd still have to buy raw materials, energy, designs, software, Repairs to your fabricator, newer versions of the fabricator that can make more elaborate products, etc...

      Maybe economies will be more centralized around this method of production...

      Maybe a lot of blender-assemblers will loose their jobs, but the overall system would still be the same... Think of when Automotive assembly lines went robotic... di
  • Patents will be dead (Score:5, Interesting)

    by argoff ( 142580 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @08:40AM (#6550169)
    As our society moved into the industrial revolution ... it meant unrealistic controlls over labor (slavery) had to go.

    As society is moving into the information age means unrealistic controlls over information (copyrights, and untangable patented things) half to go.

    And as our society moves into the "replicator" age. It means unrealistic controlls over invention and creation (patents) will half to go.

    IMHO.

    • by garcia ( 6573 ) * on Monday July 28, 2003 @08:52AM (#6550262)
      and why would people continue to invent things?

      Currently people create things (for the most part) to make a profit. If there is nothing to protect those profits (copyrights, patents, etc), what motivation is there to create something?

      Where will the money needed to fund the economy come from? Taxation on the purchase on materials needed to use the replicator?

      • Why would people bother to grow cotton without slaves? (get it)

      • by 955301 ( 209856 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @09:07AM (#6550349) Journal
        What motivation is there to create something, you say?

        For recognition perhaps, but probably for the same reasons that open source projects work. Because somebody needs the invention to solve a problem.

        You're confusing capitalism with innovation. People don't create things to make a profit. People create things to solve problems. Companies sell things to make a profit.

        If there were not companies and no profits, the need for new inventions would not go away. When there are no more problems to invent solutions to, human nature dictates that we'll make more problems to solve!
      • and why would people continue to invent things?

        Lots of reasons: To scratch a personal itch, because it is cool, because someone else wanted it and paid them for their time, because they got a grant, because they could, just because...
      • What motive is there to acquire large amounts of money if material objects are so abundant that they're free or nearly free? I know some things will still be scarce like energy and space (real estate), but desktop manufacturing is just one step.
      • by theLOUDroom ( 556455 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @09:41AM (#6550664)
        and why would people continue to invent things? Currently people create things (for the most part) to make a profit. If there is nothing to protect those profits (copyrights, patents, etc), what motivation is there to create something?

        Becuase it will make life easier, duh.

        Sheesh, it the patent system were to disappear tommorow, it's not as if people would suddenly stop inventing things.

        Problems exist, people invent things to solve those problems. I invent things all the time without patenting them. I invent them because the are useful to me, that's the incentive. Besides, people also do it just for fun.

        Where will the money needed to fund the economy come from? Taxation on the purchase on materials needed to use the replicator?

        There's so much wrong with this statement I don't even know where to start. Fund the economy? WTF?! Where does the money to fund all the beta-tape manufacturers come from? It doesn't. Nor should it. If everyone can get hot, fresh waffles from their household replicator, we won't really need waffle manfacturers anymore. What crazy idea makes you think we should keep giving them money?

        "The economy" would still exist, it would just be different. Different things would be traded. No funding necssary

        There seems to be a really weird idea floating around these days that just because you were able to make money with a certain business model, it's the rest of society's responsibility to preserve that situation. It makes me want to scream. (Think Sam Kinison) Should you be forced to buy horse feed just because, once upon a time, people rode horses? If course not the idea is ridiculous. If your business is obsolete, move on with the rest of society.
      • In fact, manufacturing technology would create a whole new pool of inventors, in my opinion. People who never spent a moment in their lives trying to "design" something will suddenly know that anything they can imagine and describe, they can build and have within a few minutes!

        Imagine how much faster development of ideas will happen. If someone is enthusiastic about an idea he's working on, he can prototype it twenty times before dinner until he gets it right.

        We'll have all kinds of new twists to existing
      • The thread asks what will happen when we move into an era of plenty. Since money is a way of rationing scarce items, then when you get rid of scarcity, perhaps you don't need money any more. The economic model becomes fundamentally different. As others have noted on this thread, OSS may be an example of this beginning to happen already.

        Now I don't actually agree with the premis that we're moving to an era of plenty. Things might get less scarce in the affluent west, but there will still be grinding poverty
      • Tell that to Leonardo, Edison, Einstein, and the countless other geniuses who had a dream about making things better and changed the world. Did they do it for profit? Well sure, to the extent that they had to eat and had other human needs.

        But the world of Microsoft type riDICKulous patents you are talking about doesn't serve to motivate innovation. It suffocates it.

    • "Half" to go? Try "have." It makes more sense. I know that the first defense against a grammar Nazi is "spelling isn't an indicator of intelligence" but without a valid excuse like voice dictation errors, using the WRONG WORD seems to be indicative of stupidity.
      • Errors like this are pardon parcel with someone having learned the language from speaking and not from reading. This is slashdot, after all, and we're not looking for people to post pullet surprise quality comments, but it is discouraging to see people make mistakes like using the wrong word. The original poster could of used a dictionary or thesaurus to avoid that mistake. For all intensive purposes your words are the only measure that others can use to judge your credibility. You loose credibility if
    • "As our society moved into the industrial revolution ... it meant unrealistic controlls over labor (slavery) had to go."

      Wow, I guess you must have missed that gigantic backlash against the dehumanizing qualities of industrialization, and the tendency to "wage slavery". Do the words Luddite, and Marxism mean anything to you?
  • by xtal ( 49134 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @08:41AM (#6550175)
    Desktop manufacturing is a long, long, long way off. You can do it with plastic bits, MAYBE circuit boards, but not much else. Technologies like these have revolutionized the manufacturing process - rapid mold prototyping for casting, and C&C machining of parts.

    The fact remains though that you're not going to get the strength of cast aluminum or forged metal without very expensive equipment - that's not pessimism, that's physics.
    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
      • by xtal ( 49134 )
        If you break down very strong materials down to the molecular level, you have the same elements present in everything. If a machine could be devised that accepted raw materials in the form elemental matter - a container for hydrogen, a container for iron, a container for gold, a container for silicon - and then arranged those elemental molecules in perfect replication of forged steel, or cold-rolled alumnimum you'd have the ability to create nearly anything.


        Unless we have free energy, the requirements fo
      • Umm, NO.

        Steel is mostly made from carbon and iron, with a few other metals included to form different alloys, like chrome steel. The reason steel is hard is that the forging process hardens it. This forging process requires a FORGE. And, a large part of the process is physical, and requires a large amount of force, thus large, powerful machinery.

        Basic physics.

        What you *could* create is a hard, nonmetallic, strong material made out of a plastic or a carbon compound. But you're limited to what can be creat
    • Since electronics (though I doubt we're talking about the latest Intel CPU!) and display screens can be made with this technology, along with simple buttons and actuators... I think I could come up with a short list of some fairly nifty items that *I'd* want, anyway.

      Throw the geeks of the world at the issue, and I'm pretty sure there WILL be a "Napster of Solid Objects" and a whole mess of trouble with governments and corporations trying to restrict the spread of certain types of plans.

      On the other hand,

    • The fact remains though that you're not going to get the strength of cast aluminum or forged metal without very expensive equipment - that's not pessimism, that's physics.

      Exactly.

      The blender example in the the article is ludicrous -- you might be able to microfabricate a new plastic lid for the blender pretty easily, but there will NEVER come a time where your HP MaterialJet will be able to manufacture a sufficient blade for your blender, let alone a motor.

      I've seen some of the cornstarch prototypes and
  • by m00nun1t ( 588082 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @08:43AM (#6550194) Homepage
    I already downloaded a piece of software from a site and as soon as I ran it a cupholder appeared from my PC!
  • Neat but overhyped (Score:5, Insightful)

    by bartlog ( 154332 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @08:44AM (#6550204)
    These are cool. You can build any *shape* you want. Too bad you're limited to one (or a few) specific materials chosen more for their useability in this process than for other useful properties. What do you do when you need a copper winding for a motor? Iron core for a transformer? Hardened steel for a bearing race?
    Basically, you can use these to make toys, mockups, and maybe most of the parts for certain items. But don't expect them to replace real manufacturing anytime soon.
    • Not necessarily
      Near the end of the article, they talk about how to make complex machines from simple substrates. They've already got designs and concepts for printing electromechanical devices (motors, moving parts) as well as substrates that give off an electrical change when compressed, which can act as a button.

      My thought is that the free software movement should act as proactively as possible to release plans for basic building blocks here, so the first company to design a printable motor can't get Int
  • by BJZQ8 ( 644168 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @08:45AM (#6550207) Homepage Journal
    Coming from a CNC background, I can tell you that a company would get seriously PO'ed if their CNC programs (instructions for machining parts) got posted on the web or P2P. I mean, some of the programs are rarely used, or used only once, but any company would defend those as "trade secrets." I can imagine that any sort of "desktop manufacturing" data that would allow you to duplicate something would be treated similarly.
  • Future Advances (Score:2, Interesting)

    by FluffyG ( 692458 )
    Is it just me or are more companies actually trying to create everything that was in the Sci-fi movies back in the day. Perhaps in my lifetime I could say "beam me up scotty" and actually go somewhere else in an instant.
    But who am i kidding.. We all were told we would have flying cars in the year 2000 right?

    Technology can never be produced as quick as ones imagination can manifest it....
  • Check out the announcement for Hardster [bbspot.com]... Just one week ago this was considered humor, now it is being proposed as a real idea. Coincidence? I think not. :^)
  • by Lord_Slepnir ( 585350 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @08:56AM (#6550275) Journal
    Let me be the first to announce the open-source Car project. I'm currently on version 0.2. We have the chasis mostly bug-free, with occasional glitches on an Interstate network. Seat-Belts are available on the nightly builds, but aren't supported yet. You'll still have to use a closed-source engine module, and we're not planning on adding it until version .5 when we have the chasis, firewall, and fuel system components some-what bug free. I've heard some people saying that they've been able to use the engine module from the Open-Source-Lawn-Mower project, but it will only work under light loads. For now, I have to get back to developing the lights module. BTW, we're looking for someone to design a module-hot-swaping system, similar to linux.
    • WARNING (Score:3, Funny)

      I just noticed on the Nightly build that one of the seatbelts hacks I put in will lock-up the steering wheel if you try to lean too far forward. I think the cause is an oil leak in one of the components. One of my testers reported a Red-windsheild of death after this happened on a Pennsylvania backroad.
  • by AtariAmarok ( 451306 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @08:57AM (#6550283)
    Oh great. Instead of the RIAA wondering about those songs on your hard disk, you'll have the NAM (National Association of Manufacturers) getting after you because you have 60 full-sized plastic Cadillacs downloaded from Repster in your back yard.
  • C:\buildColt.exe
    C:\buildDeagle.exe
    C:\buildAmmo.exe

    Clippy: It looks like you're going on a shooting spree. Would you like me to help?

  • I seem to recall reading about this concept in Neal Stephenson's The Diamond Age. Has it been used elsewhere in sci-fi?
  • will most likely be the water company. how else are you going to get the raw materials in bulk? they already have the network for liquid materials.

    someone wrote a story about this a long time ago, where the worst thing that could possibly happen to you was being cut off from the pipe that supplied raw materials. looks like its on the way.
  • I have been writing SF stories set in a future where nanotechnology is preceded by a manufacturing technology similar to these kinds of solid output printers. However my 'Omnifacture' (as the thing is called in the stories) uses a mix of technologies instead of taking a single 'printing' approach. These include micro-machines, laser sintered metals and vapor/plasma deposition.

    Although imaginary, the Omnifacture in my stories could possibly work in real life because it is based on current technologies. All
  • Age of plenty? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by dabadab ( 126782 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @09:16AM (#6550414)
    "More importantly what are the implications for our society as we move out of an age of scarcity to an age of plenty?"

    Why would it be the age of plenty? Probably it will be the "age of more-power-to-the-DIYers", but you will still need the raw materials (which are scarce) and the design (which is scarce, too). Of course, it has the potential to cut down on costs, but there are lots of things that has cut the costs of manufacturing but we still live in the age of scarcity - and frankly, I don't see how it could change anytime with any technological advance: people will always find something that is scarce.

  • Finally, "Stuff that matters" is true for once.
  • Is it my imagination, or is every technology with potential for abuse being labelled "Peer-to-Peer" these days? The label makes no sense for this technology.

    Yes, IRTFA.

  • Age of Plenty (Score:2, Insightful)

    by jandersen ( 462034 )
    Yeah, right, keep on dreaming mate.

    Was it Iain M Banks that introduced this term? Anyway, it doesn't look bloody likely anymore if you ask me. We are running out of environment to fuck up and rapidly.

    According to several articles recently in mags. like New Scientist (http://www.newscientist.com/) et al. things like fishstocks and other wild species are on the brink of plummeting and we are going to see species disappear in significant numbers in the near future. Go on, call me a tree hugger, but I think i
  • by crazyphilman ( 609923 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @09:26AM (#6550524) Journal
    This technology is going to be bought out and buried, just like hydrogen combustion engines in the mid-nineties. Big Business will never let this go through, ever. Watch and see: they'll wait until it's perfected before they buy it out, and they'll keep it in their own internal design studios forever after.

    This is an enabling technology, which permits ordinary people to create their own design, fabrication, and manufacturing shops -- it reduces the barrier to entry so that anyone can play in the product design game. We've already seen from the open source movement what motivated individuals can do without corporate support. Corporations, with their long product cycles, their relatively low rate of innovation, and their habit of producing products that are "just good enough", would get STOMPED in the market if everyone could start selling their own designs. Also, product designers and engineers wouldn't desire corporate jobs anymore -- they'd strike out on their own, and the corps would have a hell of a time finding talent, even in the third world (in our wired world, *anyone* would be able to start fielding their designs via the internet, so why would a cash-poor engineer in, say, Southeast Asia work for a corp?). These facts are not lost on manufacturing companies, ok?

    I think that one of two things are going to happen.

    Possibility number 1: the technology and all patents related to it are bought outright by a group of manufacturers, who limit it strictly to their own internal R+D offices. Of course, patents only last 17 years, right? So one would think that eventually, the tech would get out. Perhaps... Unless they manage to legislate increased patent protection, using this specific issue as a wedge ("Senator, this will destroy the whole economy! We have to do something, blah blah"). Result: the public doesn't get their hands on this for decades, if at all, and big business wins.

    2. A group of manufacturers act in collusion, purchasing the company that owns the patents, and they drive the price up so high that only industrial design firms can use the device. They use the patents to prevent cheap models from being made, and have the whole thing declared a trade secret to increase their protection beyond that offered by patents. Result: the device is never offered to the public, big business wins.

    It's a shame, but it's the way of the world.

    • by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 28, 2003 @09:31AM (#6550572)
      "This technology is going to be bought out and buried, just like hydrogen combustion engines in the mid-nineties."

      That is entirely an urban legend, like the 200 mpg carburetor. This did not happen: the grave is empty.

      "Big Business will never let this go through, ever."

      Not true either, since business can profit from such things if they actually exist

      "Corporations ... would get STOMPED in the market if everyone could start selling their own designs"

      It does not work this way. Look at music: people still prefer to download (legal or not) the products of the major record labels, even though "Self-designed" stuff is all over the place, often legally free.

      "Corporations, with their long product cycles, their relatively low rate of innovation,"

      Low rate? What do you mean?
    • by djh101010 ( 656795 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @10:49AM (#6551233) Homepage Journal
      "This technology is going to be bought out and buried, just like hydrogen combustion engines in the mid-nineties."

      Hydrogen combustion is a loss. You have to use energy to get the hydrogen in the first place, almost always by breaking water down by hydrolysis (high current through water - oxygen goes to one pole, hydrogen to the other). You're going to lose energy in the thermal inefficiencies of that process, you're going to lose some in leakage (H2 is a *very* small molecule), and then you still have the same inherent inefficiencies of an internal combustion engine that you have with any other fuel.

      All hydrogen does is to displace the energy use (and pollution) to a different place, it doesn't give you any extra, or free, energy. A more logical approach would be to pursue biofuels that can be burned in existing vehicles (biodiesel, or more alcohol in gasoline blends)...uses existing infrastructure (gas stations, tankers, etc), works in existing vehicles, and doesn't need the world to change several expensive things all at once to work.

      Hydrogen power might be appropriate for some things, but cars are not one of them. Too many things to change at once, to get it to be widely adopted.
      • Well, I agree with you on most of these points, but you can use hydrogen with existing rotary motors (they handle the higher heat better than piston engines do) and fuel injection. Hydrogen, then, is just another alternative fuel for internal combustion, fairly interchangeable with natural gas, LP gas, and propane, when you think about it. The difference is in the byproducts. Hydrogen produces steam and not much else. As far as the difficulties in storing it without leakage, you can line your tanks with a t
    • makes no sense (Score:3, Insightful)

      by geekoid ( 135745 )
      "...just like hydrogen combustion engines in the mid-nineties. "

      if this was true, and the egine was actually practical, what ever company who bought it would manufactures it. why? simple. money.

      You announce and pruduce engine, use your political power to force the end of the gasoline engine for rnviromental reasons.
      You own the Patent on anything to do with the only viable alernative. you would make a fortune. A petroleum company tat did this would have a huge increase in stock price, you would have no com
  • by donscarletti ( 569232 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @09:52AM (#6550758)
    Seven hundred years ago, before the printing press nothing was infinitly reproducible. This story sugests that we may soon be living in a society where everything is infinitly reproducible.

    When the printing press was born, together with gunpowder in weapons it brought about the distruction of fudal opression. It allowed new ideas to spread promoting revolution and eventually democracy, the availability of religeous texts lifted the oppressive and conservative warping of the bible propergated by the clergy of the day. The publishing of the classics in vast quantities allowed the commoners to become educated and eventually stand up for themselves.

    It was centuries later that it was decided that things printed on these presses should be copied, before then everything was for accidemic uses or was timless like the bible or classical plays or histories. Then someone found out a way to make money from this, create new laws to force royaties. Machinery started to be patented and builders were forced to not use new technology.

    Today we stand in a world where entire countries have incomes less than individuals, where the worlds most ecconomically prosperous country exports almost nothing phisical, except maybe old el-paso barito kits, coca-cola concentrate and the occasional calefornian orange. Where the holders of the "interlectual property" that they obtained though a little bit of tenacity or luck, or simply bought like an officer from victorian england buying his commision can dictate the price of the sale of their intangible chattles and the public must buy. Where streamlining, efficiency and outsourcing are the measure of good buisiness in an effort to have as few workers who will work for as little as possible so those who simply manage can take everything.

    Today the measure of a physical object is not what it is, it is what it represents. Western "worksmanship" is simply a swoosh slapped onto a shirt made for nearly nothing in a third world country, rather like the way a five hundred dollar program is arranged in dints upon the surface of a worthless disk. If you live in a western country, you already live in a world where the construction is nothing and the concept, or interlectual property is everything. This new manufacturing won't change anything.

  • Realware (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Nucleon500 ( 628631 ) <tcfelker@example.com> on Monday July 28, 2003 @10:30AM (#6551091) Homepage
    I wonder if anyone has read Realware, by Rudy Rucker. It's available on P2P.

    SPOILER ALERT!

    In the end, we all get allas, which can create anything (up to a certain size) by rearranging and transforming the atoms in the area, and depend on a big catalog of what to make. The allas can make others, so in a few weeks, everyone has one. The book shows what would happen with reasonable accuracy: intellectual property and real estate become the only valuable things. There are artists who sell cool T-shirt designs, and pirates who hang out by the door and make cheap imitations of them. All the manufacturing companies fail, but it doesn't really matter, because everyone has an alla.

    The book didn't mention the manufacturing companies attemps to survive, and I think it underestimated them. If the allas had been less user-friendly and not everyone had them, I'm sure the manufacturing companies could have made them illegal, and the short-sighted government would have let them. Obviously this wouldn't work; it's difficult to kill someone who has an alla, so it would be similar to P2P today: illegal but mostly unenforcable.

    SPOILER ALERT!

    Eventually, the men realize they can hurl huge blocks of TNT at each other, and the aliens and their god take the allas away at the behest of a few humans. Allas are too dangerous for one-dimensional time.

  • by panurge ( 573432 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @10:41AM (#6551175)
    This is already happening. When I was a child, few adults even had access to power tools. Now they are common and ridiculously cheap. If you really want a small CNC milling machine, you can get one from a dealer, buy an invertor, and run it from household current. MIG welding machines are mainstream kit you can buy from any tool shop. The entry level for mechanical fabrication has dropped enormously in the last twenty years, but far from the technology being suppressed by large manufacturers, it just gets cheaper. I see no obvious social forces that would prevent that trend continuing.

    Previous empires, like Rome and Byzantium, have tried to control everything from IP to the status of individuals, in an effort to protect the interests of the ruling classes. They all collapsed, but after hiccups progress continued.

    IP and the threat of IP litigation is in the end an attempt to buck the free market. It gets represented as free-market economics (protecting property is the basis of rule of law etc.) but in reality ALL IP is shared to a greater or lesser degree. It's increasingly hard to point to any genuine "invention" because more and more shared, non-IP education is needed to get to the point of inventing anything (and music is the same - just about all music is now derivative of earlier work.) Once upon a time the calendar and writing were protected secrets. Once upon a time you needed to be a skilled plumber to connect a faucet, now you can get a couple of tools and some simple compression fittings and do it easily and safely yourself. People have not stopped writing, telling the time and plumbing because these are no longer secret. Far from it. The moral seems to be that extending knowledge and power to the people benefits everybody in the long run. It may cause painful readjustment to people who have got very rich by getting into positions of power, but ultimately the world owes nobody a free lunch.

  • by Animats ( 122034 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @11:27AM (#6551551) Homepage
    What a stupid article.

    The article misses the whole point. This isn't a efficient way to make things you can make now. It's a way to make things you can't make now. Things with detailed microstructure. Things with moving parts and electronics inside.

    This is inherently a slow technology, because you have to build up thick objects layer by layer. But it produces objects that are more "organic", not in the hippie sense, but in the sense of having "internal organs." The first applications will probably be medical devices.

    What else? Photonics parts such as switching mirror arrays. Peristaltic pumps. Cell sorters. Sensing devices. Once it's clear what you can do with this approach, there will be new, interesting things to be made that way. But they'll be small, high-detail objects. You're not going to make an I-beam that way, even if you could.

    Almost all manufactured objects made in quantity (with the notable exception of wood products) are produced by some kind of "moulding" process. Casting, stamping, lithography, injection moulding, hydroforming, etc. are all "moulding" processes, where material is formed to match a master pattern. All these processes are fast and cheap. That's the great achievement of the first half of the twentieth century.

    Machining, by contrast, is slow and expensive. Almost nothing you buy in a store is carved out of a solid block of metal. Many things could be, but that's only done for the prototype. Volume products are made by moulding-type processes. There may be a bit of finish machining, but it started with a moulded blank that looked almost like the finished part.

    You can have a computer-controlled milling machine, and all the software to drive it, at home right now. I know two people who do. They don't use them for making routine household objects. It's too slow and too much trouble.

    If you want a sense of what one-off manufacturing is like today, download eMachineshop. [emachineshop.com] It's a free CAD program with a difference. After you design the part, use the Job->Material menu to specify the material, and use the Job->Price menu to get an estimate. Then use Order->Place Order to have one made. An automated machine shop in New Jersey will make one and send it to you. Most parts cost $100-$300 for the first one, and a small fraction of that for each additional copy.

  • by serutan ( 259622 ) <snoopdougNO@SPAMgeekazon.com> on Monday July 28, 2003 @11:32AM (#6551599) Homepage
    The whole idea of selling people a magic machine whose uses are barely known is new to our generation, but this isn't the first instance. We've already seen the publishing house in a box and the multimedia studio in a box. Now we're looking at the factory in a box.

    Of course the holders of certain government-granted rights (copyrights, patents) that are threatened by these new things will want to keep them inside the box. I think we are about to live through a Dark Age of legal repression and control that will make the DMCA look like a parking meter. But at some point it will become impossible to limit this technology to a small set of rights-restricted uses. At the other end of that tunnel is a world we can't even imagine.
  • Upshot (Score:3, Insightful)

    by schnitzi ( 243781 ) on Monday July 28, 2003 @10:33PM (#6556241) Homepage
    We have allready seen the reaction "Property Holders" over downloading music, what is the likely upshot of being able to copy physical objects[?]

    Interesting to think about, but in all likelihood, the fallout will not be as scary as the current RIAA witchhunt -- for two reasons.

    One, it's a lot easier for a layperson to design, say, a chair than to write a good song. There will be plenty of designs floating around for freeware versions of most household objects.

    Two, song swapping is easy because you can copy the original product very simply. Physical objects are far different in this regard -- there is no way in the foreseeable future to copy them, given the object itself. It's not like you can just snap a picture of your blender, feed it into your computer, and have it print one out for you. Designs will have to start from scratch, and as such, will typically end up rather different from the original.

    What scares me is the idea of people trading designs that are a far cry from being UL listed...

C'est magnifique, mais ce n'est pas l'Informatique. -- Bosquet [on seeing the IBM 4341]

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