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Hardware

Transmeta Powered High-End Portable? 226

Posted by timothy from the believe-it-when-it's-in-your-pocket dept.
NETHED writes: "CNet is running a story on the oQo (Very flash heavy) ultra portable computer. 'Along with Windows XP, it will come with a 5800 Crusoe processor from Transmeta, a 10GB hard drive, 256MB of memory, connection ports for FireWire and USB (universal serial bus), and wireless networking connections through either WiFi or Bluetooth.' Sounds like a winner, considering they want it to cost LESS than 1000USD. Now, only if this didn't sound like vaporware."
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Transmeta Powered High-End Portable? More

Transmeta Powered High-End Portable?

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  • Hopefully the speed of the site (Score:4, Funny)

    by llamalicious ( 448215 ) on Tuesday April 16, 2002 @01:07PM (#3352090) Journal
    isn't indicative of the speed of their computers.
    doh! can you feel the slashdotting...?
  • This device sounds pretty cool. However, I think Transmeta is going to have a hard time penetrating the corporate market which seems to be where the profits are. Big corporations are so pro-Intel, it makes it tough for the AMDs and Transmetas of the world.

    • Re:Intel Dominance (Score:5, Insightful)

      by cpfeifer ( 20941 ) on Tuesday April 16, 2002 @01:32PM (#3352355) Homepage
      Big corporations are so pro-Intel
      <best Bill Lumbergh voice>
      Ah, uhm, I'm going to have to, ah, disagree with you there Bob.
      </best Bill Lumbergh voice>

      IT departments of "big corporations" don't know an AMD from an Intel from a MC68K (trust me on this one). More importantly, they don't care. All they can differentiate is OEMs: Dell, Compaq, Toshiba, etc. The OEM is the entity that provides all of the post sales service/support for the machines, so large IT crews are more interested in this than the processor.

      If "alternative" processor manufacturers want to make inroads into "big corporations" they are going to have to start buddying up to the OEM's that supply PCs to them and get their chips inside those putty boxes.
      • Exactly, I do the PC buying for our division here at the Univeristy of Northern Iowa, and I'm loyal to Dell, not Intel. If Dell shipped an Optiplex series PC with an Athlon, I'd be all over it, though I'd prefer it didn't use a Via chipset if possible...

        I've got a custom Duron at home, and my work machine is a Micron PIII, but I like Dell's tools and support, and the Optiplex series are very easy cases to work on when you've got several hundred to support.
        • I'll agree with you about the cases, but it would be even easier if they opened from the front, like a book, rather than from the back. Being able to work on a machine without pulling it away from the wall would be quite a bit more convenient than they have it right now.

      • If "alternative" processor manufacturers want to make inroads into "big corporations" they are going to have to start buddying up to the OEM's that supply PCs to them and get their chips inside those putty boxes.

        This is a good point. On the desktop side of the game, the chip manufacturers certainly need to team up with OEMs to sell their wares. I do think though, that there is definitely a stigma towards AMD.

        On the server side of the equation, if a company is using x86 server hardward, it seems like a foregone conclusion to go Intel. Aside from the fact that AMD again cannot get the OEM partners, they have been late to the MP game. People in corporate IT are not going to buy AMD for critical server machines. It just isn't happening.
    • Big corporations are so pro-Intel, it makes it tough for the AMDs and Transmetas

      Not necessarily. All of our new screamers are AMD, and we'll be spending most of the 400k/y we would be spending on Suns and HPs buying ourself roughly 18x the compute power (speed/money(distance/time/money=distance/time/tim e=distance, I guess), absolute speed advantage is about 2:1), and they'll probably all be AMDs (hurry up with the Hammer!).

  • needs more storage... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by mikey504 ( 464225 )
    OK, so it doesn't really *need* it, but why not?

    Is the storage solid state? (I can't get the article right now). If not, it seems like they could double the storage without impacting the price. Maybe these are "old" specs?

    • Or maybe it's using the same ultra-small hard drive as the iPod, which comes in a max of 10GB right now. The thing is only 3"x5"x.9" so this seems likely.
    • Considering it's got a USB port you could even add this [thinkgeek.com]- even though it's a bit pricey.

      Hell if you got the cash to lay down on this you can add the above and have it play your media while the 'PC' can work on downloading stuff or something.

      I think the combo would be cool, even cooler if you got a deal of like 10 of the above and just hooked them all up.

  • This + MMORPGs (Score:4, Interesting)

    by RollingThunder ( 88952 ) on Tuesday April 16, 2002 @01:08PM (#3352106)
    This could have a very interesting effect on MMORPG players. Why ever disconnect (unless your internet access fees are exorbitant)? Just pull it from your station at home, play on the bus/carpool to work, and then stash it in your drawer, checking frequently that your macros are still working properly.

    I know I'd find it incredibly usefuly in WW2Online, for those moments I notice a weakness in the front, and just five minutes of game time could make a difference!
    • If you have to take a car/bus to work, you're probably to far from your WiFi base station to stay connected.

      • Mmm... high gain directional antennas... Or perhaps 3G wireless? (Or 2G if you have too much money)
      • Not if your cell is bluetooth enabled, though.

        Always running though the cell would suck, though, and you can't change connectivity and stay online on the games... ah well.
        • Yes bit transfer speeds over mobile phones (or cell phone - US translation) aren't good enough for games in general.
          • Is it the bandwidth or the latency, though? Not having a bluetooth cell myself to play with, I don't know where they bottleneck and how.

            I do know, however, that MMORPG designers have been aiming for a long time to make sure that 56k modems will be suitable for their games. It's something that's hampering WW2OL, in fact, because that bandwidth limit means that only 64 players can be visible at any one time.

            If the bandwidth is comparable to a 56k analog modem, it should still be possible to play these games, but I sure wouldn't try Counterstrike over it. ;)

            • Re:This + MMORPGs (Score:3, Informative)

              by Fencepost ( 107992 )
              With PCS/cellular dialup-style connections in the US, bandwidth is limited to ~9.6 kbps or ~13.3 kbps (not 14.4), depending on the underlying network. These connections simply pull from a pool of voice minutes, so they can be quite cheap on a per-minute basis for heavy users.

              With GPRS connections, bandwidth is much higher but so is cost - the US providers with high-bandwidth solutions seem to be around $40/month for up to 10 MB of traffic during the month. That's not megabytes per second, that's megabytes per month. If you can afford to play MMORPGs over those connections, you probably won't be doing it on the bus because you're probably independently wealthy.

              CDPD ("I'm not dead yet!") is still around, but maxes out at 19.2 Kbps.

              In a few areas Ricochet may yet come back, and that's about the only option for this in the US.

  • But you know that's it's probably too good to be true. Most things like that are.
  • ...connection ports for FireWire and USB (universal serial bus), and wireless networking connections through...

    i dunno, is it just me?...but i would think anyone who would be reading this summary on slashdot already knows what USB stands for...

  • transmeta powered? (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday April 16, 2002 @01:09PM (#3352115)
    What the heck is transmeta? Liquid? Gas? Have fun with your gadget, but I'll stick with my *electricity* powered portable thank you. And don't complain to me if you can't buy a transmeta refill canister at CompUSA. I never saw any.
    • Transmeta is a processor that trades speed for efficiency (great for laptops when battery life is everything).

    • I'm not usually one to nitpick over grammar, but I have to admit this bothers me too. The verb "to power" is evolving towards "to be a major integral part of". The first time I noticed this was "powered by Apache". IIRC, I went off on this, perhaps even on /.. "It's powered by electricity doofus, and that's powered mostly by coal in much of Virginia, and coal is mined by sweaty guys from West Virginia, so I'm going to put 'powered by sweaty guys from West Virginia' on my website".

      So, what would be a concise alternative to "powered" in these situations? perhaps "iamipo" for Is A Major Integral Part Of. Slashdot. Iamipoed by Apache. Apache Iamipoes Slashdot. I iamipo, he iamipoes, you iamipo (yes I realize "to be" is irregular, but there is no good reason to introduce another irregular verb. If anything, the Ebonic use of "to be" should become the sanctioned usage to make English more learnable for the rest of the world). How's that?

  • Two different docking stations will also be released with the device. One will allow the PC to be used like a desktop. A second will look like a notebook with a 14-inch screen. However, except for an extra battery and a CD or DVD drive, it will be empty.

    Sounds to me like the second is just a battery and DVD drive - I assume it also has a regular keyboard, and a larger screen, and therefore won't be so "empty" as implied.

  • The question is:
    Does linux install on it easily? For most distros, 10GB HDD and 256MB RAM is kick-ass. Add a wireless card and the sick battery life that machine should get, and I'm looking at a perfect take-everywhere client machine. As long as you have a server somewhere that's holding all your big files, this machine is the perfect portable.

  • The text from cnet (Score:2, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward


    Start-up shrinks PC to palm size
    By Michael Kanellos
    Staff Writer, CNET News.com
    April 16, 2002, 9:45 AM PT

    First there was the pocket calculator. Then there was the pocket organizer. And if start-up OQO gets its way, the next big thing will be the pocket PC.

    The Seattle-based company is showing off a full-fledged "ultra personal" computer this week at Microsoft's WinHEC 2002 conference. The computer is slightly thicker but roughly the same size as handhelds currently coming out from Palm or Hewlett-Packard.

    The major difference is that the OQO device, which will come out in the second half of the year for around $1,000, is a complete Windows XP computer. Along with Windows, it will come with a 5800 Crusoe processor from Transmeta, a 10GB hard drive, 256MB of memory, connection ports for FireWire and USB (universal serial bus), and wireless networking connections through either WiFi or Bluetooth.

    The screen measures just four inches in diameter, roughly the same size as those on a Palm, but the company will also sell docking stations so that it can be used like a normal desktop or laptop. The device measures 3 inches by 5 inches, is 0.9-inches thick and weighs about half a pound.

    "We see this as 'This is your only computer,'" said Colin Hunter, executive vice president of OQO. "It isn't a PDA (personal digital assistant). With this device you can dock it in and it is your PC."

    The hardware market is notoriously harsh on start-ups. Other companies, including a Taiwanese manufacturer called Saint Song, have also tried to promote miniature PCs before. OQO executives and partners, however, say that current market circumstances have opened opportunities for super-small devices.

    The technological foundation to make robust, miniature computers finally exists, for example. The OQO uses the same tiny hard drive from Toshiba that Apple Computer incorporates into the latest iPod. The company also worked with Micron to ensure that memory could be packed into the device as densely as possible.

    A lot of the design work at OQO, which was founded by engineers who worked on Apple's Titanium PowerBook went toward reducing the size of the power supply and the overall integration of the components, Hunter said.

    Another factor at play supporting handhelds is that consumers and corporate America have become acclimated to portability. The explosive growth, until recently, of handheld devices and cell phones established the market for portable devices.

    Once the infrastructure for wireless networking is established, ultra-portable PCs will become more popular than PDAs because they can do more, said Dave Ditzel, chief technology officer of Transmeta. Plus, it also gets rid of the data synchronization problem because everything moves to one device.

    "You can do full Web browsing with Internet Explorer. You can't do that on a PDA," he said. The Crusoe processor inside the OQO, he noted, runs at 800MHz and contains 512KB of cache, a data reservoir for quick data access. Current handheld processors max out at 206MHz and have much smaller caches.

    The OQO is actually the first of a wave of computers with nontraditional designs. The device weighs 250 grams, about half a pound, but there are other computers coming out that will weigh 800 grams. PC manufacturers will also begin to show off tablets that can convert into notebooks, Ditzel said.

    "This is a smaller form factor than Microsoft envisioned," he said. "There is a trend toward everything getting smaller."

    Despite the faster chip, the batteries on the OQO run about 9.5 hours, Ditzel and Hunter said. Although the Crusoe processor runs on fairly low amounts of energy, the small screen size helps enormously.

    Two different docking stations will also be released with the device. One will allow the PC to be used like a desktop. A second will look like a notebook with a 14-inch screen. However, except for an extra battery and a CD or DVD drive, it will be empty. The OQO will slide into a slot.

    The first version of the OQO measures 0.9-inches thick, but thinner versions will follow, Hunter added.

    • Re:The text from cnet (Score:4, Insightful)

      by The Mainframe ( 573877 ) <bennettprescottNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Tuesday April 16, 2002 @01:18PM (#3352205) Homepage Journal
      "We see this as 'This is your only computer,'" said Colin Hunter, executive vice president of OQO. "It isn't a PDA (personal digital assistant). With this device you can dock it in and it is your PC."

      I don't see this as my only computer... I just see it as taking up where handhelds leave off. Anyone remember the Apple Newton? That's what I want in a handheld. A fully functional computer with great battery life. I'm not looking for a desktop replacement ("portable desktop" might be more accurate) since I need a desktop for a lot of what I do. I'm not looking for a Palm/WinCE device, since I want more features than they offer. I'm looking for an instant-on, compact, take-anywhere, digital notebook. I'm out to replace pens and paper.
      • AMEN! COULDN'T have said it better myself

        (Still using a Sharp Mobilon Tripad as portable desktop, but would LOVE one of these)

      • while it certainly was/is not a pc replacement, the newton was very cool. osx on an ipod like device with that gigawire stuff connecting the juice and display device would be quite nice. Hello apple! oh yah, steve didn't like the newton, but woulda bought palm!?

    • Re:The text from cnet (Score:5, Funny)

      by Eccles ( 932 ) on Tuesday April 16, 2002 @02:03PM (#3352639) Journal
      The screen measures just four inches in diameter

      [Boggled look] The screen is round?
  • Not ever 6 minutes before the site was /.ed.

    I've often wondered about the costs of /. to a site are. We have to remember that bandwidth DOES cost money at most server farms. If a server farm is hosting a site that was /.ed, and other accounts are affected (other than the one that was targeted by /.), what happens?

    just my 2cents
    • Most server farms own bandwidth far in excess of what they'll ever use. Check out www.rackspace.com... they say they use something like 13% of their available bandwidth. It's not bandwidth that slashdot eats as much a CPU cycles... it takes a lot to process 10,000 requests.

      • Re:/. effect (Score:2, Informative)

        by larry bagina ( 561269 )
        A friend of mine had a site that was slashdotted. His bandwidth got saturated, which limited the number of incoming requests, and the cpu hit (although he was on business-class cable, so he didn't have the bandwidth racksace might have).

        His real problem was that his apache logs ballooned and the system became unresponsive (from the excessive IO transfer and possibly a kernel panic). After rebooting, his web server disk was so full of errors, he had to go to backup.
    • Hopefully we'll be able to counter the effect soon. The tech is there [mozilla.org], it just needs to happen
    • The hardware market is notoriously harsh on start-ups.

      Apparently the bandwidth market is too!

  • Diameter? (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward
    "The screen measures just four inches in diameter"

    How is diameter useful in describing a rectangular screen? Did I learn a different defintion of diameter from everyone else, or is this just very poor writing? I know it can be used for shapes other than circles, but I don't think this use is right.

    I hate these putzes who get to write reviews of cool stuff but really have no writing or tech credentials (I submit to you those 2 clowns on zdnet, josh taylor or john something, 2 retards to do piss-poor reviews on cool, new products)

    • OK, the guy almost certainly meant "four inches diagonally". He screwed up. Somebody should have caught it, but the spell checker passed it so it got missed. It's not so much poor writing as it is poor editing, and it's not all that bad. Move on with your life.

      (BTW, "definition")

  • ... Something similar? (Score:1, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward
    The Fujitsu P-Series:
    Transmeta 5800
    256M ram
    20Gig drive
    Available with optional builtin wireless
    Builtin firewire, ethernet, modem, usb, s-video out and optical digital audi out
    builtin (removable) DVD drive / burner
    3.5 pounds...
    Runs Linux...

  • Windows XP (Score:1, Troll)

    by 56ker ( 566853 )
    "it will come with a 5800 Crusoe processor from Transmeta, a 10GB hard drive, 256MB of memory, connection ports for FireWire and USB (universal serial bus), and wireless networking connections through either WiFi or Bluetooth.'"

    Sheesh - you need all that just to run XP? ;o)
  • Seems this company thinks the recent paradigm shift in informational technology flow has resulted in a groupthink that points to a
    wireless device with a pricepoint below $1k.

    Why is it that the heavier the use of buzzwords by a site directly correlates to a heavier use of Flash? I bet I could get grant money to study that!

  • 10G? (Score:1, Flamebait)

    by garcia ( 6573 )
    Under $1000 maybe. I don't consider this so much of "vaporware" though.

    I just can't see why you would try to hop into a market that has already shunned you several times before w/a device that seems so weak.

    256 is nice but the 10G is just too small these days. I have a 10G drive in my desktop that I have to keep under control (I have a 20G just for music) I could not imagine having to lug around a laptop that had so little space.

    What do I know though, right?
    • It's small(hehe the desktop I type this from is only a couple years old and it's hdd is 8GB) because it is physically small, aka it's a pccard sized hdd, the same one as the new model ipod's. Since the new iPod's cost $500 and this is a full fledged pc with 256MB ram, a fast cpu and all the other things that a PC implies for under $1000 I'd say it's probably a good deal.

    • Re:10G? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by geoffeg ( 15786 ) <(geoffeg) (at) (sloth.org)> on Tuesday April 16, 2002 @01:47PM (#3352495) Homepage
      Well, I'm sure they wanted to put a larger hard drive in the unit but since they are using the small hard drive from Toshiba (the one that comes in the iPod) I don't think they had much of a choice what with only 5 and 10 gig versions.

      Regardless, this thing seems pretty well connected. With that connectivity, why not store your mp3's on an external drive/system? Then you can just stream your music via samba or http or something to the device? You could probably have a small (1 gig or so) "cache" of your favorite songs at the time. I'd love to have an mp3 player with a built in 802.11[a|b] card. My home and my workplace have wireless internet access so I'd just need an hour or so of music for the commute and such.

      Looks like a pretty cool device but I'd want to see if the small screen is crisp enough to read and browse the web with.

      Geoffeg
  • Despite this thing sounding like ware de la vapor, imagine the possibilities. All you need is a monitor, a plug, mouse and keyboard and you have your desktop. Need to demo on client's site? No need to checkout a laptop from the corp and forget to change the previous person's nudie pic on the background. Need to download e-mail? Wireless phone right there, or plug in at any internet cafe (hey, they just have to buy $250 for the aux. equipment, not a $2000 machine). Don't have sync problems, can turn it into a laptop, etc. But, you lose it, you're screwed. Also, great technology if you're into the digital soldier concept - only 1 lb for 9.5 hours, and enough processing power to do all the targeting, recon, etc. stuff our boys do.

  • WTF? (Score:4, Funny)

    by Wakko Warner ( 324 ) on Tuesday April 16, 2002 @01:28PM (#3352318) Homepage Journal
    "The screen measures just four inches in diameter"

    Um, so is oQo introducing the hot new 1940s-style-television round-screen craze to the market, too?

    - A.P.
    • They seem to be shooting for PDA capabilities when it's not docked, and desktop capabilities when it is. As a PDA, you're likely to have it closer to your face than you would a desktop screen.

      Still, it looks an awful lot like the next generation of the Newton to me.

  • Stock Motherboard? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by mac123 ( 25118 ) on Tuesday April 16, 2002 @01:29PM (#3352322)
    Sounds remarkably like the machine I'm typing from now:

    http://www.fujitsupc.com/www/products_notebooks.sh tml?products/notebooks/p2000

    With less hard disk and no CDRW/DVD

    • I was looking at the Fujitsu P-series a while back... it looks like a very cool device. However, I was concerned about DVD movie playback on the Curusoe processor. In your experience, does it have the power to properly decode the MPEG2 from a DVD movie entirely through software? And would doing that kill the battery? My goal is to find a small/lightweight (and preferably cheap) notebook that I can use to watch movies on flights in addition to checking emails/writing docs, etc. Craig
  • This looks kewl and all, but why are ppl trying to get PC functionality from a Handheld device...Handhelds are good at things like keeping appointments, names, reading short E-Mails, Reading E-Books, Math, and generally doing simple tasks...

    And why XP? There are no real handheld apps built for it.

    Some ppl in the handheld industry are trying too much...

    Granted, Bluetooth will be a nice feature once it becomes standard...but that's not what they've done here...

    Lets see...I can buy a decent Palm for Real Notebook [powernotebooks.com] for less than $1000 total. Now, you might argue that the notebook is cumbersome...this might be so, but then you get a 13 inch screen as opposed to a 4 inch screen...

    Handhelds are a tool, they are not a replacement for a Notebook/Desktop...those solutions work very nicely for their intended purpose.

    • Re:Why??? (Score:3, Insightful)

      by NanoGator ( 522640 )
      The concept is still interesting. From what I gathered from the article, what they want this thing to do is make this your 'one computer'. So when you're at home, dock it and a big screen monitor and keyboard and mouse are all up and running. When you go somewhere, undock it and take it with you.

      I find this concept interesting. I have both a desktop and a laptop, and to tell you the truth I'm a little sick of trying to keep everything sync'd. There are some apps where the laptop excels for it's mobility, and then there's my desktop which is just a better layout for woking in.

      Coming from the point of view of 'All you need is this device' instead of using a PDA as an accessory to my computer, I'd say it's a pretty cool idea.

      As for XP, I remember a while back they announed some sort of interface for XP that was geared for Television. The idea was that the buttons had to be big and tuned to the app that it was running. Presumably, this type of interface would also facilitate using Windows XP in lower resolution modes, including that of a PDA. If that's the case, then this device may take advantage of that functionality.

      As for the apps, I think you have a good point. Existing apps may behave kind of funny on it. I'm curious if they'll have to wedge IE into the smaller form factor, of if they have some other trick up their sleeve.

      • Re:Why??? (Score:3, Insightful)

        by OneFix ( 18661 )
        I'm not saying the concept isn't interesting, but I don't think the concept works in the long-run.

        I personally like the idea that I have all of my information on 2 or 3 different physical devices. It makes crashes and hardware failures less catastophic...(if I drop my palm pilot, I don't lose all of my financial information)

        Which brings me to another point, some things I keep on my desktop I don't want/need on a Handheld.

        As for the idea of the 4inch screen, I have to belive that they are limited to current consumer grade LCD technology which limits a 4 inch screen to no larger than ~400x400 which, for this OS would be awkward at best...

        Anyone who has tried to use a 640x480 screen resolution recently knows the pain involved in using any resolution under 800x600 (and in some cases 1024x768).

        I don't think that this is a very modular design...and for most ppl, that is a big benefit of having a desktop... Now, looking at the thickness of the unit, I'ld also have to belive that the notebook dock would be thicker than most notebooks. Which brings me to an interesting point...Even though it's supposed to be light, the thing looks damned thick for a handheld.

        Notebooks did this for a while, but they all kinda died...there are some residual things like port replicators that came out of it, but the idea of a notebook that docks to form a complete desktop kinda died. One reason is that the combined cost was more expensive than buying 2 seperate units and the fact that notebooks kind of matured into the equivalent of a desktop.
  • http://slashdot.org/~rho/journal/5872
  • I totally submitted this story hours ago...and it got rejected. Slashdots editors are phuqed.

    It's a good thing I save all my /. subs at my web site [andrewkrause.org].

    (This is not grousing, this is a legitimate bitch - there's a difference).
    • Well, thank God you save your submissions. Maybe you can ask the refs for an instant replay call.

      BTW, I noticed your plan:

      Before I leave civilian life in August, I am going to launch my own competitive endeavour to counter /.'s totalitarian control of the media. Basically, it will consist of a /. like site where people can submit stories, and others can then comment on them. However, the placement and popularity of a topic will be up to the readership, as every viewer will get to either vote yeah or neigh to a particular piece or comment, allowing the readership to determine the popularity of a storey

      Not to belabor the obvious, but have you looked at k5 [kuro5hin.org]? Scoop might be a good basis for you.

      "Totalitarian control of the media", though? Maybe you need to get out more. AOL/Time-Warner/God Inc. might have some "totalitarian control", but the people who read Slashdot are just a bunch of riff-raff goofing around to impress ourselves. It's like a cable-access channel, without the production values -- Wayne and Garth on a budget.

  • Sweet! (Score:1)

    by jbum ( 121617 )
    Coolness. Now just add a real monitor and an external CD-ROM drive and a full-sized slot for my Radeon 8500 so I can play Max Payne oh yeah, and an actual keyboard and this'll be one sweeet box!!

  • I see from the article that it's an 800mhz processor, but does anyone know how it compares in performance to other 800mhz processors? Yes, I did the requisite Google search but didn't come up with any hard data.

    It sounds like a great litte box at a great price, but if it sucks to write/compile code on, it's little more than a shiny toy.
    • This reminds me of this Charm-IT wearable [charmed.com], but for my purposes, I like the OQO better (I'm not swimming in spare cash).
    • I hate to say this to all you Linus-junkies, but the Crusoe processor runs SIGNIFICANTLY slower than a similar Intel or AMD processor.

      For instance, check this out [pcmag.com]. The Crusoe laptop does SIGNIFICANTLY worse than the other "ultra-portables". The hyped "larger cache" is an absolute necessity for the Transmeta processors; they rely on the larger cache to do stuff like "code morphing", because Crusoe is naturally a 128-bit proc, and all these apps are 32-bit, kinda like an emulation mode. That's really why the larger cache is necessary.

      I would imageine, however, that a Linux distro with all software compiled on a crusoe would run a lot faster than Windows XP.

      • You're failing to consider one line from the article:

        Part of this low score may occur because the Winstone benchmark test does not repeat tasks, which minimizes the opportunities for the Code Morphing technology to have an effect.

        Regardless of how SIGNIFICANT the difference under speed testing programs, the difference might be less SIGNIFICANT under normal use. Just a little SIGNIFICANT point you left out.

      • Re:Crusoe benchmark comparisons? (Score:4, Informative)

        by evanbd ( 210358 ) on Tuesday April 16, 2002 @05:30PM (#3354249)
        Crusoe comments...

        As somebody using a Toshiba Libretto L1, with a 600MHz crusoe chip in it, I think I can offer some insight.. basically, the 600MHz crusoe is similar to 450MHz PII. So... yeah, it's slow. But the speed is fine. I'm currently running Debian with Mozilla + KDE as my main apps. But then, I only really do basic web browsing, etc on it.

        Also, you can't compile for the Crusoe. it spends a lot of memory on code morphing caches (16MB of main memory), and looks to all the world like an x86 chip. And it's very much an emulation mode... only thing is, you can't get out of it. Which Transmeta sees as a good thing, 'cause they can change the underlying chip without anyone noticing from one rev to the next... the 5800 could have a different ISA from the 5600, if they wanted. They haven't said, so I assume it doesn't, but still...
        • the 5800 could have a different ISA from the 5600, if they wanted. They haven't said, so I assume it doesn't, but still...

          It is different, but not hugely different. If you read their white pages they discuss a few of the differences.

  • Speaking of Vapor... (Score:1, Redundant)

    by Mignon ( 34109 )
    I don't know about the product, but we turned the site [oqo.com] into vapor.

  • link and text of Transmeta's release (Score:3, Informative)

    by fiendo ( 217830 ) on Tuesday April 16, 2002 @01:47PM (#3352499)
    To alleviate DoS effect:

    http://www.transmeta.com/about/press/special_pre ss / qo_16apr02.html

    "Seattle, Washington - April 16, 2002 - OQO (pronounced "oh-q-oh"), today at Microsoft's WinHEC Conference, announced the world's first ultra-personal computer, representing a new PC category that could transform personal computing the same way the cell phone has revolutionized telecommunications.

    OQO's first product is a highly functional and versatile handheld wireless computer that easily becomes a notebook or desktop PC. Measuring just 4.9 x 2.9 x 0.9 [inches] and weighing less than nine ounces, OQO's PC is a full-function computer running Microsoft Windows XP Professional and incorporating up to a 1GHz Crusoe TM5800 processor from Transmeta Corporation (NASDAQ:TMTA); four inch, super bright VGA color LCD; Synaptics touchscreen; 256MB onboard RAM; 10GB+ hard drive; 1394 FireWire, USB, audio, OQO-link connectors; and 802.11b and Bluetooth wireless networking.

    "We're impressed with the direction that OQO is showing in developing its ultra-mobile, ultra-connected Windows XP-based PC," said Jim Allchin, group vice president of the Platforms Group at Microsoft Corp." These types of small-form-factor PCs, with their ability to deliver the power and richness of Windows any time and anywhere, will enable exciting new user experiences and opportunities."

    "The OQO device represents an exciting new mobile computing platform that delivers full desktop applications in a handheld form factor," said Tim Bajarin, computer industry analyst and president, Creative Strategies, Inc. "It clearly breaks new ground and opens the door to a new category in mobile personal computing."

    As a standalone device, OQO's ultra-personal computer slips easily into a shirt pocket. When inserted into an OQO-designed enclosure, it becomes a notebook PC. When placed in a cradle with a standard screen and keyboard, it becomes a desktop PC. This modular design allows for ease of use and convenience when traveling, whether to and from the office, across the country, or around the world.

    "Modular computers have been identified as one of the most desirable form factors by Giga's IT audience every time we have surveyed for it," said Rob Enderle, research fellow for Giga Information Group. "This is one concept that actually could transform the technology industry and ensure a more steady revenue stream preceded by unprecedented--and potentially incredible--growth."

    "After years of designing Apple and IBM laptops, the OQO team felt the time had come for the next step--but a revolutionary one--of the full-featured, wireless PC." said Jory Bell, president and CEO, OQO. "We wanted an ultra-personal computer that you always carry, but that was still powerful enough to be your only PC. We sought a device that incorporates wireless access as a central idea to the whole mobile experience. Moreover, we tried to instantiate something that would make people optimistic about the future."

    "Crusoe is a catalyst for innovative, small, cool and quiet computing for emerging wireless platforms," said David Ditzel, vice-chairman and chief technology officer, Transmeta Corporation. "Until Crusoe, no one imagined that you could run Windows XP on a computer weighing less than nine ounces."

    The first OQO PCs are expected to be commercially available from leading consumer electronics manufacturers in the second half of 2002.

    OQO was founded in 1999 and is based San Francisco. The company includes executives, engineers and designers with exceptional credentials, including key positions at Apple Computer (Powerbook Design), Caltech Jet Propulsion Laboratory, IBM Almaden Research, the Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT), Oracle Corporation and Transmeta Corporation."
  • if you look at the specs on this computer (at OQO.com)

    it says "- media player mode with enough memory for 1000 songs or three feature length movies"

    All I gotta say is I hope the MPAA/RIAA dont get ahold of this quote and secondly you can only fit 3 movies (I thought DIVX took care of that)
  • What is the point of the oQo if it doesn't have a good graphics chipset? It will only be useful for web browsing and word processing. I'd rather get a decent notebook with a Radeon 7500 Mobility. It wouldn't be much bigger than the oQo.
  • It's not vaporware -- you just won't see it until about 6 months after it is no longer relevant.
  • "Hey! Imagine a Beowulf cluster of these!"

    *SMACK*(thud)
  • I can't imagine being able to use Windows (or any desktop OS for that matter) on a screen that small. I think 10" would be the absolute minimum in pure ergonimcal terms. What would be usuable would be the Sharp PDA interface running on top of Linux with the ability to switch to KDE or GNOME when plugged into a docking station.
    • I think 10" would be the absolute minimum in pure ergonimcal terms.

      I've been using a Toshiba Libretto 70 with a 6.5" screen for about 4 years, and it's just usable. You don't really want to have more than one window on screen at once, you can't write code where you need to see more than about 20 lines at a time (but that's a good thing :-). The big advantage of this little machine over a desktop replacement notebook is that it's quite reasonable to have it with you *all* the time.

      I wish somebody was making a machine like the Libretto these days. My 70 only takes 32 Meg of RAM, and that's just not enough any more. The closest I've seen with a usable screen and keyboard are the new Fujitsu P Series [fujitsu.ca] machines, but they are noticeably bigger than the Libretto (and way bigger than the oQo).
      • Check out Dynamism [dynamism.com]. They import all the cool Asian subnotes we can't get here.

        This includes the Libretto L3, a 10" LCD, 600mhz-Crusue version of your own notebook. It's slightly bigger, but I think there are some other subnotes on this site that approach the size of the original Toshibas.

        • This includes the Libretto L3, a 10" LCD, 600mhz-Crusue version of your own notebook. It's slightly bigger, but I think there are some other subnotes on this site that approach the size of the original Toshibas.

          If anyone knows of any, I've love to know what they are. I've got a couple of Libretto 50CTs, and while they're great little machines, they're starting to show their age. I'd love one of the last of the classic Librettos (the ff1100v, for example), but they were never available outside of Japan, and the importer I was planning to get one from went bust. Sadly the new Librettos are just too big to be useful. The whole point of the old models was that they were small enough to fit in a pocket. The new one doesn't meet that criterion, and hence for my purposes, it's essentially useless.

          • I'd love one of the last of the classic Librettos

            There's quite a good market for used Librettos on Ebay. I don't know if I've ever seen an 1100 there, but there are lots of 70's and 100's.

            The L3 seems overpriced and underpowered, compared to the Fujitsu machines. If I want to get something that big, it won't be from Toshiba.
  • If apple was taking a shot at the handheld market today, I would expect the hardware to be something like this (without WinXP of course.)

    Great job, Transmeta! Now it is time to turn vapour into reality!

  • The real bottleneck to shrinking computers are no longer really the actual chips and disks. These are getting smaller and lighter and more energy efficient (well, at least the first two anyway).

    What has not been effectively shrunk yet is the areas of human interface. The input (mouse and keyboard) and output (computer screen)

    On the input size, cameras and microphones are shrinking, so these may be useful. On the output side, I know there are small screens out there, but to get real work done, you often need a big screen area.
    • While this is true, there are alot of devices on the market and coming to market that are designed to alleviate this problem. My own experimenting with a Twiddler showed that I was not ready to give up my nice open keyboard layout.

      This seems to be a good idea, as they plan on providing "enclosures" and "cradles" to turn the CPU unit into a notebook, PC, or PDA. However, it will ether run on notebook components, which generally sacrifice speed for low power consumption, or PC components which would suck the batteries dry in seconds. Notebook HDD's are where you notice the greatest amount of slowness.

      So here's the rub: You get this new doo-maflaggie with it's big ol' 10 GB HD, and now you can take your information with you. But how much of that HD are you lugging WinXP on?? 1 GB. Office adds 500MB, etc... So out of that 10 GB perhaps 6GB is actually available for data and 4GB is programs. (Sad but true)

      More to the point, why lug an entire computer?? Wireless accesss might be nice, but where? I can plop it into my cradle at work and have a full fledged PC, but why not have the PC there and just plug in my data?? I can put it in a notebook enclosure, but then why not just have a notebook. On and on and on....

      The real answer is not computers that can be lugged everywhere, no matter how small they become, but data that can be mobile. 7 years with the web and still no easy way to synch bookmarks between your work computer and home computer. Idiotic ain't it??

      Jason Maggard

  • 9.5 Hr Battery Life! .... Hardly (Score:5, Informative)

    by LuxuryYacht ( 229372 ) on Tuesday April 16, 2002 @02:18PM (#3352797) Homepage
    "Despite the faster chip, the batteries on the OQO run about 9.5 hours, Ditzel and Hunter said. Although the Crusoe processor runs on fairly low amounts of energy, the small screen size helps enormously."

    Power consumption of a 4" LCD CCFL is around 1W, which is the same for any 4" - 15" single lamp LCD panel. The small screen size does not help any with the reduction of power consumtion. Power consumtion for this device will about the same as any Crusoe powered laptop since memory and the hard drive will still draw the same amount of power. This unit will only see a 9.5 hour battery life if the CCFL is off and the hardrive is powered down with the processor running at under 20% with not many accesses to memory.

  • Make it the size of Mobilepro 7xx family and now we have something to talk about as far as a "desktop replacement."

    Better yet. Make a lower-end one that has less ram, flash storage instead of a HD and configure processor to emulate a StrongArm. (IIRC, one of the strengths of the Crusoe is that it can emulate other architectures, although I may be wrong.)

    Give the user the option of either PalmOS 5.0 or PPC 3.0. Drop the price a bit so that it is competitive with HP Jornada 720. Give the slightly larger form factor of the Mobilepro size (keyboard / screen), it then becomes a viable alternative for a lot of people to a full-blown laptop.

    Advantages compared to Palm-sized PDAs:
    better keyboard / screen usability

    Advantages compared to laptop:
    instant on
    longer battery life
    smaller overall size / less weight
    lower cost

    Sure you wouldn't be able to carry it in your shirt / pants pocket, but so what? Like I'm going to carry anything that cost me over a couple hundred dollars in my shirt pocket. Put it in your briefcase, shoulder bag, whatever.

    I'd buy one.

  • sort of like the ibm metapad (Score:3, Informative)

    by pangloss ( 25315 ) on Tuesday April 16, 2002 @02:35PM (#3352952) Journal
    Strikingly similar in concept.

  • okay, enlighten me (Score:2, Insightful)

    by TheBishop ( 88677 )
    • Windows XP
    • 5800 Crusoe processor
    • 10GB hard drive
    • 256MB of memory
    • connection ports for FireWire and USB
    Which of those make this a "high end" portable? Hell, you can get iBooks with better specs than that. It must be the price that makes it 'high-end'.

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