"According to current calculations, the cost of the motherboard should be somewhere around 990 EUR. The complete device will cost about 150 EUR more, depending on prices and availability of N900 spare parts."
Holy cow, freedom (at least partial freedom) comes at a seriously hefty price. That's five times the cost of a half-decent Samsung Galaxy (S4 or S4 Mini, not network-locked), where I'm from.
And for 1GHz, 1Gb RAM, 0.5Gb storage. That's not even close to the spec of the above Samsung.
Pay five times the cost, get less back, and the possibility of component shortage making repair/replacement impossible.
How do this stack up against the $9 CHIP project, etc. with its processor? I can build a GSM "phone" with Wifi, SD, touchscreen etc. from Arduino shields for way, way, way less than this costs on top of that.
I mean, for God's sake, they've bothered to put IrDA and FM radio on it!
Niche doesn't even begin to cover it. When you're more expensive than Apple, and can't do anywhere near as much, you know that you're onto a loser.
Yes the cost is expensive but I like the concept. Still have my free runner and N900. Now I can upgrade still have a form factor, keyboard and screen I like. On a larger 2nd run costs can drop and others can pick up the same idea. BTW I have known web servers to running on the free runner ( only as demo concepts)
Compare to the Specs on the OnePlus One. And that makes it three times the price of a phone with much better specs, even if it isn't 100% open. The Neo900 is a phone for Tin Foil Hat wearers and unwashed grey beards living in mom's basement. And if you are that paranoid, you probably aren't going to have any phone.
But... the main communications chip still has a closed source firmware. So, actually.. what's changed? Sure, you can turn the radio off but that kinda defeats the point of having a phone.
If it's sufficiently isolated from the rest of the hardware (so that it can't snoop on RAM or anything like that, so it can't override any firewall, and so that when the OS says it's off it's off), that's good enough for me. If the modem can't access any data I don't want it to have in the first place, then I don't have to worry about what it's doing with it.
"According to current calculations, the cost of the motherboard should be somewhere around 990 EUR. The cost should go down as more people place pre-orders. The complete device will cost about 150 EUR more, depending on prices and availability of N900 spare parts."
Holy cow, freedom (at least partial freedom) comes at a seriously hefty price. That's five times the cost of a half-decent Samsung Galaxy (S4 or S4 Mini, not network-locked), where I'm from.
That's what it costs when you are unable to mass produce. The cost estimate is based on the production of 500 devices only which in turn was based on the number of donations over 100 EUR. The Neo900 is as close to freedom and privacy as you're going to get at this moment in time. If you're comparing this to a Samsung Galaxy then it looks like you don't understand the reasons for why the Neo900 is being built.
And for 1GHz, 1Gb RAM, 0.5Gb storage. That's not even close to the spec of the above Samsung.
You are incorrect on the 0.5GB storage. The Neo900 will be at least as feature complete as the N900. This means that it will have at least 32GB eMMC storage plus mircoSD expansion. Otherwise it will have 64GB if they are able to source the part. The 512MB refers to the SoC's NAND (double that of the original N900).
Pay five times the cost, get less back, and the possibility of component shortage making repair/replacement impossible.
The cost estimation page (which you appear to have read) indicates that they have considered failure rate and will be sourcing additional components to account for repair/replacement. This contributes to the overall cost of the device.
How do this stack up against the $9 CHIP project, etc. with its processor? I can build a GSM "phone" with Wifi, SD, touchscreen etc. from Arduino shields for way, way, way less than this costs on top of that.
I'd love to see you do that. I'll be the first in line to purchase one.
I mean, for God's sake, they've bothered to put IrDA and FM radio on it!
These are available on the original N900 and I still find them incredibly useful. To remove these would be a regression.
Niche doesn't even begin to cover it. When you're more expensive than Apple, and can't do anywhere near as much, you know that you're onto a loser.
Can't do nearly as much? Are you serious? I'm still using my N900 from 2009 because they is no other mobile phone available that what the N900 can do. Basically it's a full Linux computer in your pocket with a hardware keyboard and stylus for precision. I even have it dual booting with Debian.
Go and buy an Apple if you feel it's appropriate to compare it to one but please stop spreading misinformation on stuff that you are not interested in.
It's no wonder I rarely visit Slashdot these days posts such as yours get modded +5 Insightful.
0.5Gb storage? It's rather 64.5 Gb - read more carefully.
Of course you can build a "phone" from Arduino shields or other stuff like that. That will be great learning experience and really fun thing to do - I guarantee! But it won't be more than a toy - the aspect of power management alone is a hard topic and you can't expect your phone toy to behave reasonably well there.
This project is not for you, I get it. However, from other point of view, Apple devices can't do anywhere near as much as devices like Neo
0.5Gb internal storage. The Galaxy phone I point at can put a microSD in too - it's not quite the same as saying that it's got that as primary internal storage. And that Galaxy has 1Gb internal storage. My point is that YOU pay for the microSD. The device INCLUDE the internal storage in the price. And you get less with this device, for more cost.
And again, my point is cost. If you can get off-the-shelf components to do something similar for VASTLY reduced prices, then you have to wonder what you're pa
No, read carefully and don't spread false info! There's 64GB of *internal* eMMC, plus 0.5GB of internal NAND (mostly for N900 compatibility), AND additional external microSD memory.
If you say that Neo900 "doesn't do anything special" compared to any Android phone, you surely just don't understand what this fuzz is all about. Almost any Android phone out there is hardly comparable to a openness level of devices like Neo Freerunner, GTA04 or Neo900. The best you can get from Android devices is Replicant or so
A quick Google just now shows that just about any Samsung device from the Galaxy Fit to the Ace to the main phones has ALREADY had some distro retro-fitted to it. Android IS Linux, it's just that the interface isn't Gnome or KDE and the application format isn't ELF binary but Dalvik etc.
It's just an ARM device. As such, running a mainstream distro on a Galaxy device is probably orders of magnitude EASIER than pissing about trying to build a board that fits in
Yes, of course, you can fight your own device to just make it behave in the way you want it to. However, you can also get a device that's *made* to behave in the way you want it to.
I've had my share of working on various OS ports for mobile devices. It's never ending cat-and-mouse play. I've had enough.
Talent does what it can.
Genius does what it must.
You do what you get paid to do.
Cost (Score:5, Insightful)
"According to current calculations, the cost of the motherboard should be somewhere around 990 EUR. The complete device will cost about 150 EUR more, depending on prices and availability of N900 spare parts."
Holy cow, freedom (at least partial freedom) comes at a seriously hefty price. That's five times the cost of a half-decent Samsung Galaxy (S4 or S4 Mini, not network-locked), where I'm from.
And for 1GHz, 1Gb RAM, 0.5Gb storage. That's not even close to the spec of the above Samsung.
Pay five times the cost, get less back, and the possibility of component shortage making repair/replacement impossible.
How do this stack up against the $9 CHIP project, etc. with its processor? I can build a GSM "phone" with Wifi, SD, touchscreen etc. from Arduino shields for way, way, way less than this costs on top of that.
I mean, for God's sake, they've bothered to put IrDA and FM radio on it!
Niche doesn't even begin to cover it. When you're more expensive than Apple, and can't do anywhere near as much, you know that you're onto a loser.
Re: Cost (Score:2)
Re: (Score:1)
Compare to the Specs on the OnePlus One. And that makes it three times the price of a phone with much better specs, even if it isn't 100% open. The Neo900 is a phone for Tin Foil Hat wearers and unwashed grey beards living in mom's basement. And if you are that paranoid, you probably aren't going to have any phone.
Re: (Score:3)
But... the main communications chip still has a closed source firmware. So, actually.. what's changed? Sure, you can turn the radio off but that kinda defeats the point of having a phone.
Re: (Score:1)
The point is that the modem chip, even when on, has no access to the phone's memory. It's an external device.
Re: (Score:2)
Much like any GSM development board, then.
So what's "free" about it besides an output pin to push the GSM chip into reset mode?
Re: (Score:3)
If it's sufficiently isolated from the rest of the hardware (so that it can't snoop on RAM or anything like that, so it can't override any firewall, and so that when the OS says it's off it's off), that's good enough for me. If the modem can't access any data I don't want it to have in the first place, then I don't have to worry about what it's doing with it.
Re: (Score:2)
See also: http://neo900.org/stuff/ohsw20... [neo900.org]
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Re: (Score:2)
FAQ page. Store was dead in seconds of the Slashdot posting.
Re: (Score:3)
P.S. Your link clearly says "DOWN PAYMENT". That means not full payment for the device.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Down-payment.
Re:Cost (Score:4, Informative)
That's what it costs when you are unable to mass produce. The cost estimate is based on the production of 500 devices only which in turn was based on the number of donations over 100 EUR. The Neo900 is as close to freedom and privacy as you're going to get at this moment in time. If you're comparing this to a Samsung Galaxy then it looks like you don't understand the reasons for why the Neo900 is being built.
You are incorrect on the 0.5GB storage. The Neo900 will be at least as feature complete as the N900. This means that it will have at least 32GB eMMC storage plus mircoSD expansion. Otherwise it will have 64GB if they are able to source the part. The 512MB refers to the SoC's NAND (double that of the original N900).
The cost estimation page (which you appear to have read) indicates that they have considered failure rate and will be sourcing additional components to account for repair/replacement. This contributes to the overall cost of the device.
I'd love to see you do that. I'll be the first in line to purchase one.
These are available on the original N900 and I still find them incredibly useful. To remove these would be a regression.
Can't do nearly as much? Are you serious? I'm still using my N900 from 2009 because they is no other mobile phone available that what the N900 can do. Basically it's a full Linux computer in your pocket with a hardware keyboard and stylus for precision. I even have it dual booting with Debian.
Go and buy an Apple if you feel it's appropriate to compare it to one but please stop spreading misinformation on stuff that you are not interested in.
It's no wonder I rarely visit Slashdot these days posts such as yours get modded +5 Insightful.
Re: (Score:2)
0.5Gb storage? It's rather 64.5 Gb - read more carefully.
Of course you can build a "phone" from Arduino shields or other stuff like that. That will be great learning experience and really fun thing to do - I guarantee! But it won't be more than a toy - the aspect of power management alone is a hard topic and you can't expect your phone toy to behave reasonably well there.
This project is not for you, I get it. However, from other point of view, Apple devices can't do anywhere near as much as devices like Neo
Re: (Score:1)
0.5Gb internal storage. The Galaxy phone I point at can put a microSD in too - it's not quite the same as saying that it's got that as primary internal storage. And that Galaxy has 1Gb internal storage. My point is that YOU pay for the microSD. The device INCLUDE the internal storage in the price. And you get less with this device, for more cost.
And again, my point is cost. If you can get off-the-shelf components to do something similar for VASTLY reduced prices, then you have to wonder what you're pa
Re: (Score:2)
No, read carefully and don't spread false info! There's 64GB of *internal* eMMC, plus 0.5GB of internal NAND (mostly for N900 compatibility), AND additional external microSD memory.
If you say that Neo900 "doesn't do anything special" compared to any Android phone, you surely just don't understand what this fuzz is all about. Almost any Android phone out there is hardly comparable to a openness level of devices like Neo Freerunner, GTA04 or Neo900. The best you can get from Android devices is Replicant or so
Re: (Score:2)
Erm.... yes?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPjrRNlTmPU
A quick Google just now shows that just about any Samsung device from the Galaxy Fit to the Ace to the main phones has ALREADY had some distro retro-fitted to it. Android IS Linux, it's just that the interface isn't Gnome or KDE and the application format isn't ELF binary but Dalvik etc.
It's just an ARM device. As such, running a mainstream distro on a Galaxy device is probably orders of magnitude EASIER than pissing about trying to build a board that fits in
Re: (Score:2)
>it would be much harder work
Yes, of course, you can fight your own device to just make it behave in the way you want it to.
However, you can also get a device that's *made* to behave in the way you want it to.
I've had my share of working on various OS ports for mobile devices. It's never ending cat-and-mouse play. I've had enough.