Windows 10 Haters: Try Linux On Kaby Lake Chips With Dell's New XPS 13 (pcworld.com) 234
Attention Linux enthusiasts. Your OS of your choice can finally work on laptops with Intel's Kaby Lake chips. Dell is releasing three new models of slick XPS 13 Developer Edition that will be available with Ubuntu OS and 7th Generation Core processors in the U.S. and Canada starting on Oct. 10, reports PCWorld. From the article:Prices for XPS 13 DE will start at $949. Dell also announced the XPS 13 model with Kaby Lake and Windows 10, which will ship on Oct. 4 starting at $799. Dell didn't share details on what version of Ubuntu desktop OS will be preloaded. It officially supports Ubuntu 14.04 in existing laptops, but could pre-load version 16.04 on the new XPS 13 DE. Dell has remained committed to Linux while major PC vendors shift to Windows 10 on PCs. Intel made a major commitment to supporting Windows 10 with its new Kaby Lake chips but hasn't talked much about Linux support. XPS 13 DE is perhaps the sexiest and thinnest Linux laptop available, with an edge-to-edge screen being a stand-out feature. It is the latest in Dell's Project Sputnik line of laptops, and it is targeted at computer enthusiasts who want a Windows or Mac alternative. A knock against Linux is that the OS has lagged behind Windows on driver development and on supporting the latest technologies like USB-C ports, 4K screens, and Thunderbolt. Project Sputnik started four years ago as an effort between Dell and the open-source community to bridge that gap, and since then, the resulting laptops have achieved cult status among Linux enthusiasts. A Dell XPS 13 with a Core i5 chip will have a full HD screen, 8GB of RAM, and a 128GB SSD. Another configuration will have a 3200 x 1800-pixel screen, Core i5, and a 256GB SSD. A fully loaded model will have a Core i7 chip, a 512GB SSD, 16GB of RAM, and a 3200 x 1800-pixel screen.
What if I am an Ubuntu hater, too? (Score:4, Funny)
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Well, obviously:
Ubuntu Haters: Try Windows 10 On Kaby Lake Chips With Dell's New XPS 13
Yours truely,
Microsoft
Re: What if I am an Ubuntu hater, too? (Score:5, Interesting)
Ubuntu has a very handy five year LTS snapshot release style that RH has refused to match for their desktop product, which is only support for something like 18 months. They also have extended the dpkg system with PPAs which (last time I checked) Debian did not support out of the box.
Appreciating all of that and being a fan of Mir or the Unity desktop are two entirely different things. Just use a derivative like Xubuntu or Kubuntu instead. Problem solved. All of the advantages of Ubuntu (and by extension Debian) with few of the disadvantages.
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Appreciating all of that and being a fan of Mir or the Unity desktop are two entirely different things. Just use a derivative like Xubuntu or Kubuntu instead.
Or one of the many flavors of Mint.
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I hate the dumbed down ubuntu. Let's get these kids today to have to set up CLI before they can configure their GUI.
I'm pissed off they took hand cranks from car engines.
It's silly to demand that people return to 1985 to do basic computing. There are altogether too many uses of computers to demand that everyone start there.
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Like those Unix-like environments where the prompt isn't set are so much more useful!
And when you use up arrow / down arrow to get the command line history, it should display garbage characters instead of actually working, so that users are forced to learn how to set their terminal character map or whatever it is.
And when you run graphical emacs (because the notepad clones are for dummies and none should be installed out of the box), it should be set so that home/end keys bring you to the beginning or end o
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Fedora is a very upstream distribution, and also does very little modification to the bundled software. They also contribute more back upstream then any other distribution does. Finally, The changes that happen in Fedora set the stage for Linux in general - the Fedora team does things first (PulseAudio, Network Manager, GNOME, systemd) and every one else follows.
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Fedora is a very upstream distribution, and also does very little modification to the bundled software.
Like Debian, Gentoo or Arch? Maybe I'm misinformed but I thought Ubuntu was the only one well known for that sort of thing.
They also contribute more back upstream then any other distribution does. Finally, The changes that happen in Fedora set the stage for Linux in general - the Fedora team does things first (PulseAudio, Network Manager, GNOME, systemd) and every one else follows.
And that's a positive, is it?
I don't mean to start a religious war here... at least, not on Poettering. I mean with systemd, whatever, there are some valid arguments on both sides there. But GNOME is some kind of bizarre BSDM experiment or something. They've managed to show less respect for their users than Microsoft. Removing as many user choices as possible has long been an expl
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Almost no one is following with GNOME 3; instead, they abandoned it and created MATE and Cinnamon and Unity, or they switched to Xfce or LXDE or KDE.
Fedora/RH seems to do some useful infrastructural stuff, but DEs they're terrible at. Why they keep pushing GNOME is a mystery; it's a terrible DE.
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MATE and Xfce are moving to GTK3, however slowly. /etc/fstab entries with UUID by clicking around. Which is very helpful, although explaining what's a fstab UUID entry to your mother-in-law or auntie is left as an exercise for the reader.
gnome-disks is commonly included, it allows to add
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MATE and Xfce are moving to GTK3, however slowly.
MATE is a fork of Gnome2, which uses Gtk2, so it makes sense that they'd want to move to a newer and still-maintained toolkit. However it may or may not happen; Gtk3 is notorious for bad maintenance, as it's developed and maintained by the Gnome3 devs, and basically they do whatever they want with it, without any regard whatsoever for other projects using it, backwards compatibility, or anything. LXDE ended up converting from Gtk to Qt for this and other re
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Can't I get one with Fedora?
If I get SteamOS, does that count as non-Ubuntu? Particularly since this is the one Linux that would property utilize all the firepower of Kaby Lake
Ubuntu is a poor choice to demo. (Score:3, Interesting)
Try Korora Linux instead.
Debian/Ubuntu slow, Fedora/Centos Fast.
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I have experienced more failures with Ubuntu than I have with Centos / Fedora.
Fedora works well out of the box even if some versions weren't the most polished. With Ubuntu I spent too many hours getting drivers to work for damn near everything.
Stupid 16:9 (Score:3, Insightful)
3200 x 1800 is still 16:9, which is shortscreen bullshit. Fuck that. Why can't they give us a good 4:3 screen, the way good screens are supposed to be?
It's depressing, the only laptops with decent screens now seem to be Microsoft's Surface line and some Panasonic Toughbook models.
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16:9 isn't so bad.
It at least can display 4:3 content, if the resolution is high enough.
A 4:3 display trying to display widescreen 16:9 on the other hand, often results in crushed vertical resolution because it has to scale the horizontal to fit the smaller screen.
What I want to see, is screen resolutions that are better than a stupid assed TV panel. We had higher screen resolutions on CRTs in the 90s than we do today.
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For 4:3 there were 1600x1200 screens. What I want is something in the 5:4 ratio, like 2500x2000
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A 1920x1920 desktop monitor exists, although highly priced. (from Eizo, monitor brand specialized in four-figure prices)
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No Surface model has ever had a 4:3 aspect ratio. First 2 generations were 16:9 and subsequent have been 3:2. Only two current models of Toughbook do, both are 1024x768. Yuck. I haven't seen that resolution, let alone a desire for it, in a new machine/display in over a decade.
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Yes, I know the Surface is 3:2, which is pretty close to 4:3.
Now, come to think about it... there are other tablet PCs with 4:3 or 3:2 screens. For example, the Teclast X98 and Onda V919 lines use a 9.7" QXGA (2048x1536), while Xiaomi's MiPad line uses a 7.9" at QXGA. Add kb+m and they're sorta-almost complete PCs.
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And a hercules Graphics Card [wikipedia.org], the way green-phosphored monochrome computer screens are supposed to be!
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Problem solved!
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I agree it's a bit bad, but 3200x1800 is a very decent resolution. If you use 200% scaling (which I believe sums up what Cinnamon, Ubuntu, Gnome can do with HiDPI) then you get a shiny 1600x900 equivalent, which gives decent room for stuff. If you have to use software which really doesn't work with the scaling, use physical 1600x900 resolution instead.
To paraphrase someone's sig
Slashdot logic : 1440x900 is better than 1600x900
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16:10 and 16:9 are so similar that you can't love one and hate the other.
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I can, and I do.
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How do you feel about 16:10?
16:10 is the one true aspect ratio! To me, it's the ideal tradeoff for everything I want to use a monitor for. 4:3 is too narrow for IDEs, 16:9 not tall enough, both 4:3 and 16:9 videos (and games!) look fine on a 16:10 monitor. Can't be beat!
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Comment removed (Score:3, Informative)
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A hater is one who hates. Reasoning doesn't play into it.
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I as well as many other slashdotters have legitimate substantiated grievances with the business practices and technical decisions made by Microsoft. Quit trying to marginalize dissent in the ranks of your advertising audience.
So wait, are you the Judean People's Front or the People's Front of Judea?
I can't not read that as "Baby Kale" (Score:2)
which means...yum, delicious baby kale chips.
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Kale is a trash crop. I can't wait for the fad to die. Then again, it'll likely be replaced with something equally as obnoxious and awful. Remember flaxseed? Remember quinoa? Remember acai? These are some bad member berries.
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Acai isn't bad, but it's not good either. The wave of popularity it rode was entirely manufactured and undeserved. The marketing push was obnoxious.
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Quinoa had a disgusting rise in popularity recently. Not sure what caused the fad. Did some quack claim it was a "super food"?
Mint Linux Cinnamon 64 bit. (Score:2)
And Windows 10, unlike mint linux, sucked from day one by not even having drivers for the network card of a perfectly brand new motherboard, gave me several blue screens with the wonderful QR code smiley during the 2 weeks, screwed up the drivers so the HTC vive froze, untill I screamed so loud at windows support that they sneakily exported 369.09 Nvidia drivers trough the C
Advertising? (Score:3, Interesting)
Aren't articles like this supposed to have a brown title bar, or something? I'm confoozed.
Unicode haters: try Slashdot! (Score:2)
"Your OS of your choice can finally work on laptops with Intelâ(TM)s Kaby Lake chips."
*sigh*
What's The Difference Between The Two? (Score:2)
What makes the difference between the XPS DE and the regular XPS, aside from the OS? Why wouldn't I want to order the cheaper model and just ditch Windows in favor of my favorite distro?
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Thanks! That's the answer I was hoping for.
> Also you don't have to pell off all those Windows stickers that are present on the other laptops. Just wish they had changed the keyboard to get rid of the Windows meta key but a sticker fixed that.
I do that, too! Here's my current setup [dropbox.com]. Ne'er an OEM sticker to be found aside from the important ones on the bottom of the chassis, though I still need a sticker for the meta key and something to cover the Dell logo.
It's a decidedly middle-of-the-road Inspiron; I
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You don't have to be a Windows 10 hater... (Score:2)
the title (Score:2)
The title made me immediately think: "so that you stop hating win10 by comparison". Somehow it doesnt sound like a recommendation to me.
so if you have to hate windows 10... (Score:3)
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Step 1.) Embrace - "Now you can run bash in windows!!"
Step 2.) Extend - "But why would you want to with powershell!!"
Step 3 is left as an exercise in learning history to any read under, say, 25 years old.
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Shame it appears to be US only (Score:3)
Bottom line is Dell are a PIA to deal with but have a first class product, way nicer that the Apple MBA it replaced.
128GB SSD to small for the basic system (Score:2)
128GB SSD to small for the basic system.
Also no ati or nvidia video in any system.
Ubuntu is *a* Linux distro, not Linux (Score:2)
>"Attention Linux enthusiasts. Your OS of your choice can finally work on laptops with Intel's Kaby Lake chips.[...] available with Ubuntu OS"
Being a Linux enthusiast doesn't mean being an Ubuntu enthusiast.... despite Canonical's hopes/thoughts/dreams.
But it is still meaningful, if Ubuntu will work, then so will Mageia, Fedora, SuSe, Mint, whatever.
$200 more? (Score:2)
Why is the Linux version $200 more than the Windows 10 version? This is seriously just taking the piss.
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Re:The more hated windows 10 is (Score:5, Insightful)
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If their shovelware was better written, it would work in WINE, and then they could still have it preinstalled. Maybe even easier to preinstall it, since a WINE prefix can be straight up copied between machines without having to use disk imaging software.
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If their shovelware was better written, it would work in WINE, and then they could still have it preinstalled. Maybe even easier to preinstall it, since a WINE prefix can be straight up copied between machines without having to use disk imaging software.
Who the hell wants that shit on their computer? For me, not having it on the computer is just icing on the cake. Saves me the trouble of uninstalling it.
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uninstalling would be equally easy. just delete the prefix folder and make a new one.
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Personally, I don't care. Why would I use the stock Ubuntu (or any distro really) image that comes pre-loaded on a computer anyway? If I were to buy one of these computers, the first thing I'd do with it is wipe out the HD and install my own preferred Linux distro image on it, just like I already do when I get a computer that has Windows on it. (Actually, with Windows I'll usually relegate it to a small partition just in case I need it to run some stupid Windows-only software. There'd be no need for tha
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Personally, I don't care. Why would I use the stock Ubuntu (or any distro really) image that comes pre-loaded on a computer anyway? If I were to buy one of these computers, the first thing I'd do with it is wipe out the HD and install my own preferred Linux distro image on it,
Well, I'd do the same, since I've been into Ubuntu Mate for the last year. But in the context of the conversation, for certain, I wouldn't want a pre-installed Linux machine with suckware on it.
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Yeah, but still, how many people actually would buy a Linux PC like this, and then just leave on whatever version of Linux was pre-loaded, instead of loading their own? Maybe in some hypothetical future where regular non-techie people are buying Linux PCs and using Linux, and Linux has a significant marketshare, but in today's world I just don't see it.
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The shovelware is all crapware; on a Linux system, there's just no need for any of it.
They could pre-install it, but it'd be rather pointless because there's much better free stuff available in a standard Linux distro.
What companies like Dell could do is make a special Ubuntu version with the crapware running on WINE, and its Free counterparts not installed by default, so that they can get money from the shovelware vendors, and simultaneously not have to pay Microsoft any license fees for Windows. Then the
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I doubt they pay $150 to Dell to have their $20 software builtin.
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Re: The more hated windows 10 is (Score:2)
Dell is notorious for having 2 different products with the same model name. If one sound chip is $.03 cheaper they replace it. Same with mixing LAN, storage, video etc. It sucks bad downloading drivers for executives as you can have +30 drivers all different for each same model all with their own quirks.
The Linux model probably has the same parts and is tested for compability with drivers. You know it will work well basically which is a plus
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LAN and sound drivers are better on Linux then on windows. WLAN is more windows based for the wrapper based ones. But any ways the linux distros ship with way more drivers then windows.
It's the touch pad / web cam / other laptop stuff that is iffy in Linux.
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The problem here is that the Linux version is 150$ more expensive. So basically, you pay more to have a free OS. Sound logical.
No it isn't. The prices are different because the specs are different. Windows 10 costs extra. Ubuntu is free. Nothing to see here.
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The problem here is that the Linux version is 150$ more expensive. So basically, you pay more to have a free OS. Sound logical.
You make the mistake of assuming that linux users are linux users because they are cheap. At least for mysself and the others I know that use Linux, we use it because it works better, is more secure, and we like it. I just like Unix and it's linux flavor. That's why my computers are either OSX or Linux. 150 is well worth it to me.
Re:The more hated windows 10 is (Score:5, Informative)
The problem here is that the Linux version is 150$ more expensive. So basically, you pay more to have a free OS. Sound logical.
You make the mistake of assuming that linux users are linux users because they are cheap. At least for mysself and the others I know that use Linux, we use it because it works better, is more secure, and we like it. I just like Unix and it's linux flavor. That's why my computers are either OSX or Linux. 150 is well worth it to me.
While I agree with you. The parent post is wrong. The $799 laptop with Windows has an i3, 4GB memory, 128 GB SSD. The Ubuntu version has an i5, 8GB memory, 256 GB SSD. Looking on Dell's website, the Windows version is $100 more with the same specs.
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While I agree with you. The parent post is wrong. The $799 laptop with Windows has an i3, 4GB memory, 128 GB SSD. The Ubuntu version has an i5, 8GB memory, 256 GB SSD. Looking on Dell's website, the Windows version is $100 more with the same specs.
800 bucks for an i3 and those specs?? Yikes!
Re:The more hated windows 10 is (Score:4, Interesting)
If the $150 really worries you then XPS is probably the wrong range of machines to look at, there are plenty of cheaper options out there.
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Unless things have changed, WiFi on a decent laptop is usually implemented as a removable miniPCIe card. You can get any card you want on Ebay for $20 or less; I usually use some Intel card, I forget the model number now.
Of course, I'm the kind of person who buys a business-class (Latitude) laptop on Ebay that's a few years old, off-lease, and installs his own OS on it. I never have trouble getting the hardware to work on Dell Latitudes, except maybe video stuff if I'm doing stuff like using a docking sta
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I still think an extra $150 on a high spec machine was worth it to not worrying about if they provide a solution that works. I get paid more that $38/hr so in the case of the cheap HP I would have been better off paying an extra $150.
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Unless things have changed, WiFi on a decent laptop is usually implemented as a removable miniPCIe card. You can get any card you want on Ebay for $20 or less; I usually use some Intel card, I forget the model number now.
Will that work here? The last time I tried to swap out the WiFi card in a Dell laptop (fairly recent, but not an XPS) for another one from the same manufacturer (Intel) it refused to boot with the BIOS citing a problem with the WiFi card's serial number.
I like the look of this XPS 13 DE, but I wouldn't care to buy any laptop with that degree of hardware lock-down.
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I have heard of some laptops having BIOS locks on WiFi cards, so that only certain ones (from the laptop maker of course, for more $$$) will work. What kind of laptop was this; was it a consumer model or a business model? I try to always buy business-class equipment for this reason; they don't seem to do this stuff nearly as much.
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I think it was an Inspiron. Almost certainly one of the consumer lines. It had a smooth underside with no ventilation holes or visible screws, no removable battery, and few ports. (One needs to remove the rubber feet to open the case.) I don't have it with me to check the exact model.
Re:The more hated windows 10 is (Score:4, Interesting)
the better for linux. So, lets all hate win 10 a bit.
That's not difficult, after all why would I want to run malware [wikipedia.org]
From the first sentence of the Wiki for those who are in denial or can't be bothered clicking on the link.
"Malware, short for malicious software, is any software used to disrupt computer operations, gather sensitive information, gain access to private computer systems, or display unwanted advertising."
Sound familiar? Of course, most people will say "But I don't have anything to hide" - Sad really, they have been in the water too long and now it's started to get hot. I hope they enjoy their gold plated chains.
Oh I almost forgot Linux also works on Skylake systems as well.
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the better for linux. So, lets all hate win 10 a bit.
Does hating win 10 a lot count?
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You could get an external GPU. No, it won't be portable, but it'll work.
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Can't you just buy the Windows 10 model and put whatever Linux you want on it? Or do they lock that down now?
That's what I was wondering. Am I paying a $150 premium just for Dell "support" on the pre-installed Ubuntu (which I wouldn't even keep)?
I would assume all these "great driver contributions" would have been open source as well and available to other distros -- especially Ubuntu-based distros like Mint.
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As for using the Windows version, yes, you could make it work, but you may have to download extra drivers, and there is another consideration with the hardware you should be concerned with more than that, and that is battery life. Just because something is supported, doesn't mean it plays well with it. I've seen systems lose only a small fraction of runtime while others lost more than half.
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But unless you actually want Windows 10 why not just get the Linux version if they offer it? Unless there is some unexpected discount, Windows 10 costs extra (I think $100 extra, but I could be wrong).
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Re: Newer intel chips support sucks in linux (Score:2)
If this is certified to run Linux you can bet the drivers will be included on the system which is why it is $150 more than the win 10 version.
The other distros will get the drivers soon too as Intel is Foss friendly. Problem is the users want a solid distribution so the kernel and software maybe slightly older
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Try using a mainstream distribution then? Steam works perfect from Ubuntu (which is the Valve supported distribution) and Fedora.
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How on Earth do you somehow believe that Mint is not a mainstream distribution?
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Because Steam and Runescape (people still play that?) failed to install on it? I have the same problem with VMware Workstation.
Ubuntu and RedHat are pretty much the main stream, which is a sad commentary of several sorts.
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