Tesla Model S: 0-60 In 4.5 Seconds 426
thecarchik writes "We already know a lot about the all-electric 2012 Tesla Model S sedan — but at a press event ahead of tonight's exclusive VIP event at the former Toyota NUMMI facility in Fremont, California, Tesla CEO Elon Musk announced Tesla was making a faster Model S for those with a sporty side. Cutting the brisk 0-60 time of the standard Model S from 5.6 second to under 4.5 seconds, the sportier version features the same 85 kilowatt-hour, 300 miles-per-charge battery pack found in the 2012 Model S Signature series. 'That's quicker than a [Porsche] 911 [Carrera],' joked Musk. 'Not bad for an electric luxury sedan.' But if you thought 300 miles was the maximum range a Tesla Model S could do, you'd be wrong."
Re:How about a Model T? (Score:3, Insightful)
Impossible thanks to regulations:
1. emission standards (euro V or whatever) 2. safety standards (abs, esp, airbags, etc). you can't even put a car the market without those.
Try to comply with all on this list http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/import/fmvss/index.html [nhtsa.gov] and it will cost you a fortune.
Re:Wait for Top Gear (Score:5, Insightful)
I remember all the claims Tesla motors made about the original sports car. Top Gear UK tested it and most of the performance claims turned out ot be less than 1/2. It was utter junk. I would like to see Top Gear (who I trust) test this new Tesla (who I no longer trust).
I love Top Gear, but you have to be pretty dumb to believe a review of an electric car done by someone who has on numerous occasions said he doesn't like them.
Re:How about a Model T? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:How about a Model T? (Score:5, Insightful)
You clearly don't understand this is a luxury sedan and not an everyman car.
How many years or decades was it from the introduction of the auto to the availability of the Model T? The price you quote for the Model T in 1925 is relatively accurate but the car had been in production for SEVENTEEN years by that time and its price of $850 in 1909 would be equivalent to about $22000 today
Do you seriously think the availability of a low-cost EV will take the same length of time?
Re:The imporant question (Score:5, Insightful)
The Tesla Roadster has an expected battery life of 7 years, and you can pre-order a new one for $12,000 (it'll be delivered in 7 years).
No doubt the prices for new batteries will have gone down by 7 years from now, and the Model S has a swappable battery (for those who don't want to wait for it to charge).
Yes, this is an expensive car. But it's half the price of their previous car, and their next one is supposedly going to be cheaper again.
Re:How about a Model T? (Score:5, Insightful)
Thanks for the link but you'll get a better comparison if you use the Model T's price of $850 in 1909, instead of the cost after being in production for 17 years.
Re:How about a Model T? (Score:5, Insightful)
The Chinese have them. In fact, Daimler sued a Chinese car maker in 2006 for making a copy-cat Smart car with an electric engine and battery. And the Chinese had already been using electric cars for real since the mid 90ies. - Not that anybody cared or noticed back in the stagnated [wordpress.com] (that is, not developing) countries.
The key is to understand, that electric cars have no market as luxury items unless and until they have been established as cars for everyday users. Before that, there just won't be the infrastructure it takes to make proper use of them. But in order to get to this point, they need a price point that makes it possible for people to use them as single-purpose vehicles, alongside the traditional ones. (E.g. getting one person and a suitcase to work and back)
$3000-4000 for a light-weight two-person car with limited range (80km/50miles) and speed (below 80km/h or 50mph) is entirely possible to achieve. Weight, range, acceleration and speed are the main determinants of the size of the battery (and its weight!), which determines the price of the battery and thus the price of an electric car. Such a car could actually have reasonable charging times (One tenth the total capacity means one tenth the time to charge) and such a car could do some 90% of the driving for a lot of people. But because of the limited performance nobody is going to bother buying such a car unless it's really cheap. (Meaning: unless it has a price that makes it reasonable to buy without being an eco-freak.)
But then again, you don't get to pay gas prices of $8/gal (as in Europe) until you realize that the USA will collapse if it continues to pretend that cheap oil is only a matter of military power.
Re:How about a Model T? (Score:4, Insightful)
The Ford T has no air conditioner, seat belt, airbags, computer assisted direction and engine or sophisticated electronic gadget. The Ford T was essentially a golf cart, and 3000$ is about right for a modern electric gold cart. If you want a revolution, peoples will have to change what they are expecting from a automobile. We can't no longer afford a 'living room' on wheel. The automobile need to return to its minimalist roots and focus on getting us from point A to point B with the less power possible.
Clearly we think we can.
What I'm tired of seeing are people with big vehicles of their own choosing (not out of necessity) who are weeping about gas prices. We Americans still have some of the cheapest gas in the world even though prices have doubled since 2004 (when I bought my first car and started really paying attention). But we expect to be able to buy a big SUV or minivan as soon as we have our first kids. Or lift our pickups and put mud tires on them. If we have had $5 gasoline, what prevents us from having $6 or $8 gas before it's time to get a new car?
Re:Wait for Top Gear (Score:4, Insightful)
When the batteries are depleted, Tesla says even the 300-mile range Model S will be able to recharge from empty to full in under an hour thanks to its new direct current external charger. The 90 kilowatt units will be installed by Tesla at suitable rest-stop locations or hotels alongside arterial freeways such as I-5 between Canada and Mexico.
Wow, I'll be able to recharge in under an hour every 300 miles, so long as I find the 'suitable' location where electricity will probably be priced at $1 a kWh because they know that I have no alternative other than to pay the price or pay for a tow.
I'll stick to my Civic, thanks, which can travel about twice as far, fill up in two minutes and do so at any gas station we pass.
Re:Wait for Top Gear (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:How about a Model T? (Score:5, Insightful)
Until now, most of the car companies have been blocking the path of a mass-market EV that could compete. Chevron managed to scoop the NiMH patents and their subsidiary Cobasys won't accept any orders for car-sized batteries below 10k units. If you're going to travel above 25 mph, you can't be considered a low-speed vehicle anymore and you suddenly have to meet a lot of additional requirements for safety.
And, yes, US attitudes against small, odd vehicles that can't do the 1/4 mile in 15 secs and cheap gas is a big factor.
Re:320 miles (Score:3, Insightful)
Actually, in 32 MPH stop-and-go traffic, you'd probably get more like 400+ miles range ... Stop and start causes loss of efficiency ...
Right.... so a loss in efficiency causes the range to increase. Not to mention Tesla has consistently exaggerated the range of their vehicles. Not to mention headlights, heater, ac all subtract from range. Even then I really don't see how a $50,000 electric sports car is really the solution to anyone's energy crisis. Sure it will make rich California businessmen feel better about their carbon footprint, and thank god... wouldn't want them to feel guilty or anything. I don't have anything against Tesla specifically, I just don't like seeing a car ad on a news website, and then hear people cooing over it like a newborn baby as though it is the solution to the worlds woes rather than just an expensive and wasteful toy for rich people.
Re:How about a Model T? (Score:2, Insightful)
Brilliant!
I had a crazy uncle that used to wear a buttplug all the time, so that just in case he got gang raped by a bunch of guys it wouldn't hurt.
Like I said tho, he was crazy.
Let's just pretend to forget that most countries in europe are crowded as fuck and cheap gas or not people ain't gonna be building anywhere NEW because there ain't nowhere new to build baby.
Re:320 miles (Score:5, Insightful)
Expensive and useless toy for rich people like ... the first cars, the first motor boats and the first airplanes. Give it a few years. We'll all be driving electric cars soon enough.