DIY 18-ft.-High Robotic Exoskeleton 206
Hacx sends along a piece from PopSci that begins "Carlos Owens had handled all kinds of machines as an army mechanic, but he always dreamed of using those skills for one project: his own 'mecha,' a giant metal robot that could mirror the movements of its human pilot. Owens, 31, began building an 18-foot-tall, one-ton prototype at his home in Wasilla, Alaska, in 2004. Working without blueprints, he first built a full-scale model out of wood. Moving on to steel, he had to devise a hydraulics system that would provide precisely the right leverage and range of movement. He settled on a complex network of cables and hydraulic cylinders that can make the mecha raise its arms, bend its knees, and even do a sit-up. ... He foresees mechas having uses in the military and the construction industry, but acknowledges that right now they're best suited to entertainment. The first application he has in mind: mecha-vs.-mecha battles, demolition-derby style."
First thoughts... (Score:2)
...what could possibly go wrong with this thing??
But someone please please film this thing; I suspect when something blows out on it, it will indeed make for some awesome youtube footage.
Mecha Palin! (Score:5, Funny)
Wasila, Alaska? The killer app for this device is to put a set of high-heels on it and have it run as the GOP Veep candidate in 2012 - all puny mortals bow down before Mecha Palin, or be crushed!
Only the Obamabot can save us!
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Wasila, Alaska? The killer app for this device is to put a set of high-heels on it and have it run as the GOP Veep candidate in 2012 - all puny mortals bow down before Mecha Palin, or be crushed!
Nah, Giant Mecha Palin should run for Prez and her VP can be La Pequena Palin [youtube.com]
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I was figuring Gov Palin could take care of the mecha problem, since she could clearly see this from her house.
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Don't forget to put the lipstick on it....
Too big. (Score:5, Insightful)
The whole idea of mecha robots is plain wrong. It's not necessary to make an exoskeleton that big. In a military (or 'gaming') situation it'd just present a bigger target. All you need is a minimal amount of armour with enough power to augment picking up large amounts of weight, and possibly some system to dampen recoil if you're holding a projectile weapon.
(Oh dear. I'm actually arguing that mecha robots are a poor weapons system design on the internet. Is this what my life has become? Maybe I should go outside?)
Re:Too big. (Score:5, Funny)
Unfortunately, years arguing on the internet have left your muscles too weak to function.
You'd need some sort of mechanised exoskeleton before thinking about venturing outside.
On mecha, and exoskeletons (Score:5, Insightful)
People are approaching the idea of mecha ass-first.
These proposed engineers of mayhem mostly treat "BIG FUCKING ROBOT OH YEAH" as an end in itself. In any semi-realistic context mecha should be seen as something that naturally evolves into being as agile, versatile exoskeletons are made progressively more powerful; you have to work up to big with a design where everything else works superbly, you can't work from big down. Otherwise any advantage gained by size will be hugely offset by the sad fact that the thing moves like a turtle in molasses.
Mecha become reasonable when they can move and maneuver with the same agility as a human being -- think Eva, which can run, dodge and so on with considerable finesse. (Here's waiting for those carbon nanotube aerogel artificial muscles, by the way.) But since we can't even do that for a human-sized exoskeleton, any effort to build a mecha that's not severely dysfunctional is going to be impotent.
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There used to be plenty [wikipedia.org].
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And now there arn't [wikipedia.org].
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Human-agility is possible (Score:2)
Mecha become reasonable when they can move and maneuver with the same agility as a human being -- think Eva, which can run, dodge and so on with considerable finesse. (Here's waiting for those carbon nanotube aerogel artificial muscles, by the way.) But since we can't even do that for a human-sized exoskeleton, any effort to build a mecha that's not severely dysfunctional is going to be impotent.
The biggest limitation of the Alaskan mecha, is that it has no force-feedback. People who can't feel their own limbs, or the resistance of the ground and objects against them are *incredibly* clumsy. So are robots that try to move with no kinesthetic sense.
Sarcos corporation has developed Haptic Interfaces which give you force-feedback. The military has been working towards humanoid full-body haptic harnesses since the 1970's, actually with really good progress since the 80s.
Look at the example videos on
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Turns out that turtles will probably swim just fine in molasses. [umn.edu]
Re:Too big. (Score:4, Insightful)
They are actually a poor system.
You don't get decent speed or armor, you don't get awesome firepower like a 120mm cannon.
Basically, powered exoskeletons are not strong enough to withstand an RPG attack, aren't fast enough to dodge them, and aren't armed enough to deal with anything beyond a few AK-47 wielders.
How do we fix it? Easy. Make them pretty much immune to small arms fire. Make them faster. Adopt tactics to cover each other. Implement scanners and other intelligence devices so you know where the enemy is coming from and maybe where those IEDs are hidden.
Re:Too big. (Score:5, Funny)
Maybe we could have one with large treads on it so that it could cover large distances quickly, and strong plating and explosive armor so that it would be immune to all but the largest projectile. And why stop at one operator? It could be large enough to hold a small crew of people who could operate the machine as a team, and possibly provide some sort of situational awareness/intelligence function.
All you'd need then is a turret with a large cannon on it and you'd have the perfect military land robot.
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Well then try and get rid of the people. People are soft and squishy and they have parents and families that get upset when they don't come back.
Then you could make it even smaller, lighter, and cheaper.
Bad weapon, but useful for construction? (Score:2, Interesting)
I agree with you, in the context of a weapon. But consider how useful this could be for construction. The ability to lift large objects (like beams) into position could be quite useful.
A four-legged version might be more useful, however.
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You mean just like the Crysis suit ? ;-)
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The whole idea of mecha robots is plain wrong. It's not necessary to make an exoskeleton that big. In a military (or 'gaming') situation it'd just present a bigger target. All you need is a minimal amount of armour with enough power to augment picking up large amounts of weight, and possibly some system to dampen recoil if you're holding a projectile weapon.
The basic concept of the exo-skeleton is you get to be superman without having to be a kryptonian. You're as powerful as a tank, can blast things just by moving your arms, it's scifi fantasy.
Those trying to come up with a practical justification say it's the next advancement of the tank which is all about letting a human being go into combat with serious protection. But if you think about it, the only reason why tanks are manned is because automated systems aren't good enough to let them operate autonomousl
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The exo-skeletal combat suit will happen, just not in the way people want it to. Units like this would be of great use for land forces during occupation or high intensity situations where robots are not suited to be due to the mixed set of combatants and non-combatants that are common to urban warfare. Special Forces will most likely some day have breach and patrol squads of these for specialized purposes like breach and sweep missions or scout and intercept. While robots are good at killing, they'll likely never be suited for situations where death isn't the sole option. Mixed situations like this is where mobile suits like this would excel. I don't ever see the application of giant robot suits the size of cities mind you, but small combat suits that allow a man to get in and out of buildings without taking the roof off (or perhaps breaching the roof as an option?) would be a boon for the military (which is why they are developing them!)
But there's no need to put the person inside. You could operate them by remote and make them smaller, no need to fit the human form so they can be optimally shaped for the mission. That's the part that people keep overlooking, that the remote control or autonomous AI could get that good.
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Did you miss the part about construction? A large mecha like that could be used to easily lift and place large steel beams or concrete forms into place. Something that is done by cranes and guys climbing all over a structure trying to pull yank and maneuver a multi-ton beam into place. Imagine how easy it would be to dig a trench and then lay 36+ inch concrete pipe for drainage systems. Just grab a bucket and dig with both "hands". Would be much faster then a guy with a joystick. Then just let go of the buc
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Dude it's only 18HP, get all Tim-Taylor on it and drop in a chevy small-block or even get a Cat Diesel then you'd have something; maybe some accumulators near the control valves to shorten reaction times! An igniter and a acetylene injector in the exhaust stack would be cool for shooting fire-balls everything it punched or stomped something.
...video of a prototype (Score:5, Interesting)
Novody would want a battery powered exoskeleton with a 10 minutes charge.
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The video states at the end that the tethers are mostly for experimental safety purposes, and the unit can do without. You are right about the power density though, to operate something like this on the field you would need to change the PSU every few minutes with the current human technology level. Who knows, maybe the are experimenting with plutonium batteries over there. j/k
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Re:...video of a prototype (Score:5, Informative)
Lockheed Martin has been working on something vaguely similar, and while Ray's has that umbilicus, LM's is self powered.
http://www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php?topic=7306.0 [societyofrobots.com]
One of their versions was powered by a small generator that ran on jet fuel.
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Especially if it was piloted by a mentally unstable 14-year-old boy. [wikipedia.org]
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Isn't this the same guy from before? (Score:2)
That's been working on this since 2004 [engadget.com] and has likely been posting about here before?
Found some videos of it (Score:5, Informative)
Here's the designer talking about it [youtube.com]
And here's his website (under construction, but with some technical info) [neogentronyx.com]
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Holy shit, nobody mentioned the dual flamethrowers!
Demolition Derby? (Score:2)
mecha-vs.-mecha battles, demolition-derby style
Or Mechwarrior style (character inside robot), or OMF 2097 style (robot remotely controlled by character). Repair costs for those things can be pretty high, even for just getting a few scratches in the battle.
Red eyes!! (Score:4, Funny)
Creators Website (Score:2, Informative)
Dr. Miles Bennett Dyson (Score:2)
Not exactly a Cyberdyne Systems research object, but a good start :-) Give it a couple of hundred of revisions, and we have on our hands a human terminator with a neural net capable processor, hyperalloy endoskeleton that withstands molten steel exposure and can run at above 60mph for prolonged periods of time and lift objects five times its weight, a plasma fusion reactor for power source good for 200 years of continuous operation, and naturally a very perverse attitude towards all things human.
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Well, the amazing thing is that this is some hobbyist's project, not a multi-million dollar research project. The fact that it works at all, or even that it doesn't collapse under its own weight is enough for me to be impressed.
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A great day for (mad) science (Score:2, Informative)
Well, it's a great day for science! Not only we have this news item, but we have an illustration of it [girlgeniusonline.com] too!
I hope he's limited its movement range.. (Score:5, Funny)
If he hasn't built in any restrictions I predict a posthumous Darwin Award the moment the guy tries to absently scratch his nuts :-)
Doesn't make sense (Score:2)
Surely in this day of high speed wireless communications, it makes absolutely no sense for the person to be physically "inside" the "mecha", or on the same continent for that matter. Of course I'd hate to see one of these babies turned into a zombie...
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Of course I'd hate to see one of these babies turned into a zombie...
Redefining "war driving".
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Mechas make no damn sense!
There just cool, as is the idea of being inside one and controlling it.
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Wireless is hardly known for it's fast latency times;
I wasn't exactly referring to your everyday linksys router when I said wireless. I meant "without wires". I'm sure that the same technology that can allow someone in Nevada to fly a UAV and kill 'insurgents' in Paki^H^H^H^HAfghanistan in real time can be applied here. "Lag" should be less of an issue for a stable ground based robot than for something that flies through the air and shoots people. I can't imagine a 20 ton robot doing
Whassup? (Score:2)
Am I the only one thinking this guy has way too much space in his backyard, money lying around, and time on his hands?
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i'm thinking i need more spare time and space in my back yard.
i think he's got it right.
But things 18 feet tall aren't cute! (Score:2)
That's why my Colossal Tammy Tinkle Doll was such a failure.
Oh, you don't understand me.
We're finished!
*runs out of the room crying*
Captain? (Score:2)
Made of wood? (Score:2)
Like in Robot Carnival's "A Tale of Two Robots"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdOieEsk918 [youtube.com]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdqhD5NAv9w [youtube.com]
"I am Jonathan Jameson Volkeson the Third, no doubt the worlds most brilliant scientist. I will not let the course charted by my peerless intellect be stopped by you or anyone."
All it needs is a basket of A-bombs on the back (Score:4, Funny)
So how many... (Score:2)
... missile salvos can it survive?
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From flying giant robots? all you can throw at her~
Ob Meme (Score:3, Funny)
I for one... oh nevermind.
Cage match (Score:2)
We've got to get this thing together with this guy. [improbable.com]
Robot Jox and Robot Wars (Score:2)
I love mechs (Score:2)
but in all reality they wouldn't work structurally or practically.
Still, I love me a good robot fight.
Pleo? (Score:2)
I would like to see a pleo made out of one of these.
Right Place, Right Time, Right Thing... (Score:2)
Re:Damnit, that looks awesome. I want a video of i (Score:5, Informative)
This seems really familiar.
I'm pretty sure this is the same mech [youtube.com] a couple of years back. He's probably mad a little progress since then.
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Re:Damnit, that looks awesome. I want a video of i (Score:4, Funny)
He's probably mad a little progress since then.
Absolutely. He used to be a raving lunatic.
Another few years and he should be quite sane.
(ps: use commas, your sentences are hard to read)
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Where in his post would you place a comma to make it more readable? The only problem I see is the missing 'e' in 'made'.
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Talk about *whoosh* ...
"He's probably mad, a little progress since then."
Since Fred A is making a joke, and that the guy is probably at least a little 'mad' since you pretty much have to be to make a big metal robot on your own. You know, the stereotypical Mad Scientist [wikipedia.org] type.
Does this make sense now?
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This seems really familiar.
Yes it does [wikipedia.org]. What is it with all these monstrosities coming out of Wasilla lately? Is the pollution that bad over there? I say we pitch them against each other and see who wins?
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Re:Damnit, that looks awesome. I want a video of i (Score:4, Informative)
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This guy has been around for a long while, made plenty of wild claims, and demonstrated absolutely nothing.
I don't know the history of his project, maybe it's the same guy, maybe not, but any project of that scale that starts with "Working without blueprints" is headed straight for the wall IMO.
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I don't know the history of his project, maybe it's the same guy, maybe not, but any project of that scale that starts with "Working without blueprints" is headed straight for the wall IMO.
Well, I have to admit I don't think some of those connections are supported in SDS/2.
Not 18 feet... (Score:2)
Unless Carlos Owens and Theodore Agranat are 9-10 feet tall.
http://content.zdnet.com/2346-9595_22-11979-2.html [zdnet.com]
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umm...the shot was taken from a lowered perspective to be able to get the mecha and the people in the frame while still being close enough to discern who they are
similarly, i'm pretty sure this picture [michellefarnsworth.com] isn't definitive proof that the statue of liberty is only 15 ft tall
Re:Aliens! (Score:5, Interesting)
There have been some military projects, but the problem is that anything which can lift over a tonne one-handed requires a power supply too big to attach to the suit itself.
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Heh, well just get a really long power cord like in Evangelion!
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I did say "power", but what I was referring to was the systems meant to support the suit's hydraulics. It would be more like a hose.
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Well if you want to be able to go long distances you'd probably want all the hydraulics stuff self contained on the unit itself otherwise you're going to have to deal with some crazy pressures (or very large diameter hoses I suppose) and a lot of power to drive the fluid. I'm not a hydraulics expert but the company I do IT for design and manufacture dredgers that use hydraulics. Our normal dredgers would probably operate down to about 500 metres at most, not entirely sure, but we are designing a deep water
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Hydralic or electrical, you'd still have some sort of umbilical cord. Problems: it could trip over it, enemies could chop through it in a fight, distance from the tender would be limited and last - but not least - it would look uncool.
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Indeed it is uncool and impractical, and it is the only reason the mechs in Evangelion are kind of lame compared to Transformers, Gundam Wing, RahXephon, etc. But it is still an option if you keep the back well protected and for some reason need a crazy powerful mech ;) You'd think if you put a 1500HP tank engine and a few electric motors in it then you could have it being self powered though. I'm not a mech engineer so I don't know what kind of power they'd require to be useful :p
Re:Aliens! (Score:5, Informative)
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In Mecha anime/manga they usually make up some pseudosience as to why they're using walkers and not tanks and planes.
I always thought it was because of Japan's samurai tradition/mythos (like the US has a Wild West gun mythos).
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I always thought it was because of Japan's samurai tradition/mythos (like the US has a Wild West gun mythos).
Yup, there's the big fascination with the warrior who can defeat all odds if he's super-pissed off enough. The Japanese Army in WWII thought they could make up for their material inferiority as compared with the US and Soviet troops simply by fighting harder and showing more spirit. That can work to a degree against a numerically superior but less hardened foe, causing them to break before you do. But if they're just as hardcore, the outcome is inevitable defeat.
As to why the Japanese hero robot has to be g
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thought they could make up for their material inferiority as compared with the US ... troops simply by fighting harder and showing more spirit.
Never forget the usefulness of racial animus in motivating yourself to stay and fight.
Soviet troops
Huh? The Sovs had their hands full with Jerry, and didn't declare war on Japan until Aug. 8, 1945.
That can work to a degree against a numerically superior but less hardened foe, causing them to break before you do.
Like the poorly-led Chinese, most of whom really just w
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Soviet troops
Huh? The Sovs had their hands full with Jerry, and didn't declare war on Japan until Aug. 8, 1945.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_invasion_of_Manchuria [wikipedia.org]
* Khingan-Mukden Offensive Operation (August 9, 1945 - September 2, 1945)
* Harbin-Kirin Offensive Operation (August 9, 1945 - September 2, 1945)
* Sungari Offensive Operation (August 9, 1945 - September 2, 1945)
* South Sakhalin Army Group Offensive Operation (August 11, 1945 - August 25, 1945)
* Seisin Landing
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I admit there's something transfixing when looking at a humanoid robotic form laying waste to everything around it.
speaking as pioneer of the first human-robot marriage (and subsequent divorce), I can tell you that it gets old real fast
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Re:Aliens! (Score:4, Funny)
It's very difficult to evolve wheels, and the concrete floors/roads that make them so efficient.
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It's very difficult to evolve wheels, and the concrete floors/roads that make them so efficient.
There are lots of roundish animals that could have been a first step. But none of them will use rolling as a method of movement, presumably because of the difficulty of powering it from inside the sphere. A mass moving inside the sphere would be required. Possible but not as easy or efficient as mobile limbs (which is what they all use).
And of course biological wheels are apparently right out, a biological axis would be extremely complex to even envision (typically some kind of fluid would have to go back a
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You've never heard of the hoop snake [wikipedia.org] then?
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You've never heard of the hoop snake [wikipedia.org] then?
No, but it's a great story. I knew of the greek one (ouroboros) because I'm trying to brush up on my mythology. But I haven't gotten around to the modern mythology of the former colonies ;)
I suppose that all countries have such mythical creatures (we have the dahu [wikipedia.org]) but this type, especially using a snake, is a new one for me. It's very creative. And apparently the story started quite a while ago too.
Oddly enough I believe I read a novel where something like that was mentioned, but I can't recall what it was
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In Mecha anime/manga they usually make up some pseudosience as to why they're using walkers and not tanks and planes.
It's pseudoscience that human brains have an extremely well-refined intuitions on how to effectively control and use a humanoid structure?
Tanks are good for fighting, of course, but their human controllers don't "get" all the subtleties involved in making the most out of them.
It's true that bipedal walkers are hard to balance, but just the same, we have an "off-the-shelf" solution for it.
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Or they just turn into Planes... or half plane type things...
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"Loader-Lifter" implemented in real life (Score:3, Interesting)
By Sarcos corporation. This one is a bit smaller, and has no grippers yet, but the arms and legs function. IN fact, the arms and legs are *more* agile and human-like than in the Aliens movie!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nhj3Z9o6t0g [youtube.com]
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I've always wondered why no one has built a loader a la Aliens yet. Surely it wouldn't be beyond current tech and I'd imagine it would be amazingly useful (not least for fighting Alien queens!)
They did it was in the movie "Alien"; it would be really hand in a handful of extreme fringe cases. Most time when in those fringe cases a traditional forklift/jitney doesn't fit, they get a custom built automated solution rather than an alien-loader.