Windows Home Server Corrupts Files 459
crustymonkey points out a ComputerWorld article which says that "Microsoft Corp. has warned Windows Home Server users not to edit files stored on their backup systems with several of its programs, including Vista Photo Gallery and Office's OneNote and Outlook, as well as files generated by popular finance software such as Quicken and QuickBooks."
Crustymonkey asks Don't back up your files to Windows Home Server, as recommended by Microsoft themselves? I'm not exactly sure what the point is in having a home server if you can't back up files on it."
Obvious Answer (Score:5, Insightful)
Profit
Curious... (Score:5, Insightful)
Isn't part of the point of a backup that you DON'T edit the backup media?
I can look at this two ways... MS didn't test this enough because it didn't occur to them someone might do something so ridiculous...
OR...
Not only did MS create the misfeature that is editing backups, but they screwed it up too...
Am I still feeling charitable from the holiays? Hmm...
To be fair (Score:1, Insightful)
You should restore a backed-up file before editing it.
Sensationalist Headlines? Not this time... (Score:5, Insightful)
But for the first time ever, slashdot's title isn't sensationalist. Microsoft simply states, yeah, for no apparent reason, files are getting corrupt using our operating system.
Jeebus F'n H Chroist! You had one job to do, and you screwed it up royally.
It's one thing when some obscure feature doesn't work correctly. It's another thing when a fundamental operation of your software hasn't worked for A YEAR since it came out.
IT'S AN OPERATING SYSTEM. Your job is to interface the hardware with the user and software.
*sigh* Bring on the "my linux-distro of choice doesn't do that, that makes me right all along" comments.
Re:What happened to the Best Free Games Story? (Score:1, Insightful)
Point (Score:2, Insightful)
It's to show another failure at Microsoft in their core markets, while they pursue TV, Magazines, Video Games, etc.
Put your trust in Microsoft, because they're gonna kill off every other competitor anywayRe:One wonders...... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:A Good DVD Writer For Most People (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Never mind 'Home' Server... (Score:2, Insightful)
This is not efficient on WAN or LAN links because WAN/LAN links use network-access-driven methods, commands the operating system provides to send data to or receive from another networked computer. If there is a remote
So your KB link isn't quite as suprising or damning as you were hoping it would be..
Why is everything across the network "special?" (Score:5, Insightful)
MS-DOS and Windows users seem to take it for granted that a file that is across the network is accessed via different APIs, different user interfaces, and has generally different properties from files that are stored locally. In the MS-DOS days they were always mumbling about The Redirector. Why does a file need to be REdirected across the network? Why isn't it just directed, the way it would be directed to a disk volume or a floppy or what have you?
It isn't so long ago that most Windows programs couldn't even reference cross-network files in a straightforward way in a file open dialog. You first had to assign a "drive letter" and "map a network drive." (And, of course, all references to that file would break if you ever assigned the remote directory to a different drive letter).
And when they finally got around to fixing it in the OS, it only fixed it for new programs that were written to some new API. Existing programs, even things like Visual C++ utilities, continued to go through the mapping tapdance, because apparently the existing OS file dialog routines weren't updated to do things the new way.
The assumption that files across the network are totally differents sorts of thing from local files appeared to be so ingrained in the Windows culture that Windows people don't even understand why it is a criticism of Windows to mention this. They think it has to be that way, because, well, they're across the network. As if there were some physical property of 100-base-T cables that made them intrinsically different from SATA cables.
Re:Never mind 'Home' Server... (Score:3, Insightful)
In the *nix world, it is common that one can sit down at *any* machine in the network, log on and one's desktop/files, etc are just the same (assuming the same OS). This has never been true in the MS world. MS requires you to have *your computer* and to always use *your computer* if you want to have any semblance of a familiar desktop/files. Even with server stored profiles, the files are copied to the local machine and copied back again at the end of the session. This is a wildly inefficient method -- really a hack layered on to achieve the semblance of providing a real floating profile. If the profile is large, the copying can take a long time or be impossible (because of lack of disk space).
In fact, for most Windows users, the idea that one can sit down at another machine and access one's files, just the same as if one were logged into one's primary machine is totally alien. It is amazing how much MS has trained people to accept poor features.
Re:One wonders...... (Score:2, Insightful)
Boy, if that's the case and Microsoft was screwed by their own unpublished APIs, how can you argue against karma?
Re:One wonders...... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:One wonders...... (Score:2, Insightful)
Also, the backup part is a simple "click and shoot". Just install the client and your machines can be backed-up and restored in the easiest and way imaginable.
Yes, there's a zillion great open source projects out there which can do everything WHS does.
No, there's not one project (that I know of) that can do everything WHS does.
Feel free to jump in the gap.
Re:Why is everything across the network "special?" (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:One wonders...... (Score:2, Insightful)
It is situations like this... (Score:5, Insightful)
Which do well to explain the reason why, when a $1000 PC is faster than a $1,000,000 mainframe, that businesses still buy the mainframe. And then they stock the washrooms with single-ply toilet paper to cut costs.
Microsoft has made a lot of noise about being "Enterprise class" software, and having "Reliable" servers, but when things like this happen, it just goes to show that Microsoft won't ever be able to touch big iron:
The next time I hear anyone use the term "enterprise class" and Microsoft in the same sentence, I'm simply going to refer them to this bug. Totally unacceptable - even for a gaming OS.
Re:Why is everything across the network "special?" (Score:5, Insightful)
I can't speak for MS-DOS (are there any MS-DOS users left?), in Windows you don't use a different API for a network files. Any differences are taken care of far below the application level.
different user interfaces,
Really? On my Windows machine, networked files show up in Windows Explorer just like local files. If anything, it's not different *enough*-- i.e. it would be nice to have a mark in the icon to tell me if a file is on a network drive, especially when I'm on unreliable wifi networks.
It isn't so long ago that most Windows programs couldn't even reference cross-network files in a straightforward way in a file open dialog. You first had to assign a "drive letter" and "map a network drive."
You never *had* to do that. Well, ok, maybe pre-95 versions of Windows. But Windows 95 would work just fine if you typed \\network\path into an Open dialog. I did that just a couple years ago at a hospital I was working at with some ancient machines still in use.
Of course you have the option to map a drive letter if you want, and there may be some buggy applications that didn't work unless they had a drive letter to work with, but you can't blame Microsoft for buggy third party apps.
The assumption that files across the network are totally differents sorts of thing from local files appeared to be so ingrained in the Windows culture that Windows people don't even understand why it is a criticism of Windows to mention this.
Maybe they just think you're crazy for "criticizing" Windows for something you basically made-up.
I'm not a huge Microsoft fan, but most of your post is just plain wrong. I know this is Slashdot and thus you were +5 Insightful, but please make some effort to at least be a little accurate next time you post. Let's reduce the amount of bullcrap here, not increase it.
Re:One wonders...... (Score:5, Insightful)
The original parent comment was about something (an alternative) "point and click easy" like the WHS. Do you really expect someone who relies on the "I click enough buttons and it works so it must be right" model instead of the "i set it up correctly so it must work" model to actually know about things like VNC, SSH tunnels or a router?
I don't mean to dog you and I'm definately not trying to troll you, but we really are dealing with people doing things they really have no idea/clue about. I would probably suggest that they have no business doing it without investing a little more time and effort in learning something about it but they read the side of a box and think it is a good idea. Making them learn something isn't my call though, Microsoft seems to be good at making idiots feel smart. Hang around some of the novice windows users who think they are smart, you will see exactly what I'm talking about when one of them explains to you the difference between a BCC and CC when dealing with email and then tells you he found out because of a popup in office and vista or some shit like that. When you realize their first computer was a windows 95 or 98 box almost 10 years ago and they are just finding this out, you will understand their needs a little more.
If you don't know anyone like that, start doing repair work for random people. Put an add in the paper or something and do a couple dozen repairs out of your house. Or I can give you a number of other examples of the types of people we/you are dealing with (point and clickers). Most of them are fresh too. Like just recently, a customer who thought his CDROM was broke because he knocked his tower off the desktop and it wouldn't close all the way. So he decided to remove it, take it apart and oil the motors and gears and after putting it back in, when he started the computer up, it said "insert system disk". 9:30 at night, I get the call explaining every thing to me and attempted to trouble shoot is over the phone, I had him reconfirm the connections for the IDE cables on both the HD and CDROM. Then I had him disconnect the CDROM, Sure enough, the HD worked and the computer loaded. 10:15pm, I get another call from the same customer, it is doing it again. How am I supposed to know he plugged the CDROM that he tore apart and we determined was causing the problem back in after I hung up. 35 minutes of checking bios settings, rechecking the cables and troubleshooting later, he suggest putting a the XP system CD in the computer and starting it with that in it. I asked if he had another CDROM because last I worked on his system, he only had one. He told me he fixed the CDROM that we determined was causing the exact same problem an hour ago and put it back in. He refused to associate the same problem with the same device. And then when I told him the CDROM was bad, unplug it and see what happens, He insisted that he had fixed it (he took the CDROM apart again) and the door closed all the way now so nothing was wrong with it.
Finally, I got his wife on the phone and told her the story as I told you, she said if it is doing the same thing, then if I unplug the CDROM, the computer will start. I said that was the plan but I couldn't get her husband to try it because he claims he "fixed the CDROM" and "nothing was wrong with it because he fixed it. So she ended up unplugging the CDROM and sure enough, it worked sans the CDROM. She brought it in the next day, we swapped the drive out and all has been fine since. I asked her to make sure he didn't call me for support late at night again unless he was going to listen to what I had to say.
Re:One wonders...... (Score:3, Insightful)
There's plenty of reasons to run a home server. Backing up your laptop without having to remember to plug in some external drive is one. Having a real htpc setup is another. People have lots of data, and a home server is the way to manage that. However there aren't any good home server tools for it.
Maybe I should make one in my copious free time. Of course I have said Linux could blow me. [robotmonkeys.net]
Re:Yes, profit. Mod parent up. (Score:3, Insightful)
And it was free. As in speech and beer.
Oh, yeah. And it works.
Re:English, mofo... do you speak it? (Score:3, Insightful)
Well, the copying to the backup should be automatic, but yes, this is exactly what should happen.
It seems that you don't quite grasp the idea of a backup, the general plan is that you work on working files, and these are duplicated at some point in time to a separate location. The only time you should ever even look at the backup set is when recovering files (or testing your recovery process), and you should NEVER be editing backups, because then your backup is not a backup any longer but a working set!
Re:What happened to the Best Free Games Story? (Score:3, Insightful)
You didn't read the page you quoted, did you?
Re:English, mofo... do you speak it? (Score:2, Insightful)
You do not have a right to kill. (Score:1, Insightful)
Careful what you say. You don't have a right to "kill." You have a right to stop somebody from inflicting immediate severe harm on yourself or another, with up to lethal force. Your goal must be to stop an immediate, severe threat, not to kill the perpetrator. Your right stops as soon as you've stopped the threat, and you don't have a right to decide whether the perpetrator survives afterwards; if he lives, he lives.